Brian Grazer: Academy Award Winner Brian Grazer on Success, Creativity, and Greatness | E186

Summary

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In Search of Excellence — Episode 186

Brian Grazer: Academy Award Winner Brian Grazer on Success, Creativity, and Greatness

Host: Randall Kaplan
Guest: Brian Grazer
Release Date: May 5, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode features legendary Hollywood producer Brian Grazer in a deep, candid, and often humorous conversation about his remarkable career, the nature of persistence and rejection, the real job of a producer, his philosophy on creativity and relationships, lessons learned from failure and success, and his candid stories of working with icons like Tom Hanks, Ron Howard, Eminem, and more. Brian opens up about the setbacks, doubts, and decisions that shaped his life, giving listeners a behind-the-scenes look at the mindset and habits required to achieve true excellence in the entertainment industry.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Power of Persistence and Rejection

(00:07, 12:38, 12:50)

• The “word no is only a temporary point of view.” Grazer recounts shopping the script for Splash for seven years and being rejected 500 times, emphasizing the importance of resilience—what people hear (the “mermaid movie”) isn’t always what the creator cares about (for Brian, it was a love story).
• Quote:

  “The lesson is the word no is only a temporary point of view. The other lesson is what people are hearing is probably not what you care about the most.” — Brian Grazer (00:15, 12:50)

2. Mentorship and Early Breaks

(02:00–07:24)

• The life-changing meeting with Hollywood kingpin Lou Wasserman, who challenged Brian to never approach power without something of value—symbolized by giving him a pencil and legal pad.
  • Quote:

    “Put the pencil to the paper and it will have greater value than it did as separate parts.” — Lou Wasserman, as recounted by Brian Grazer (02:34)

• This sparked Brian’s initiative to write and protect his own ideas, leading to his first sold scripts and a pivotal mentorship with DeAnne Barkley, head of NBC.

3. What a Producer Really Does & The Primacy of Ideas

(08:17–10:03)

• Successful producing is about owning and evangelizing intellectual property, not just leveraging relationships.
  • Quote:

    “Relationships are secondary. The primary thing is you have to own something… You can't rely upon trying to get… a free ride… You want to believe in what you're doing.” — Brian Grazer (08:29)

• Authentic projects stem from personal experiences—trauma, success, or volcanic moments in others’ lives.

4. Partnerships and Recognizing Talent

(11:17–11:54)

• Recounts how he approached Ron Howard (then known as Richie Cunningham from Happy Days) and trusted his potential as a director long before his Oscar wins.

5. Hip Hop, Curiosity, and Culture Shift

(14:38–16:17)

• Grazer’s intentional practice of meeting new people led him to Old Dirty Bastard and the culture of hip hop at a time when many dismissed it.
  • Quote:

    “He is the voice of the street. He is the voice that all kids are listening to right now. Adults didn’t know what he was talking about… but I thought, I have to learn what this language means.” — Brian Grazer (14:38)

• Despite industry skepticism, Brian believed hip hop would become a cultural mainstay, helping birth films that gave the genre mainstream dignity.

6. Working with Stars — Bonds and Boundaries

(16:17–17:48)

• Grazer discusses his relationships with stars like Eminem, Tom Hanks, Meg Ryan, and others—many remain private, respectful, and appreciative, but public friendship is rare.
  • Quote:

    “He worked as hard as any professional I’ve ever worked with… He was a good dad, great dad. He’s so talented. He won an Oscar. But he doesn’t talk to a lot of people.” — Brian Grazer on Eminem (16:48)

• Candidly shares how he launched careers (Johnny Depp, Mark Wahlberg) and maintains positive relationships with actors decades later.

7. The Oscars — Triumphs and Embarrassments

(21:19–24:05)

• Brian recounts the thrilling (and mortifying) moments of Oscar night—expecting to win for Apollo 13, only to misread the moment and have to sit down before a massive audience.
  • Memorable Moment:

    “Sidney Poitier… I got up to go on stage, and then I had to sit down… One studio chairman goes: ‘loser.’” — Brian Grazer (21:49)

  • Jim Lovell’s compassionate perspective recalibrated Grazer’s disappointment (“I never made it to the moon either.”).
• Winning for A Beautiful Mind: Brian describes the out-of-body experience and nerves of receiving Hollywood’s highest honor.

8. On Preparation and the Myth of Being “Unscripted”

(26:12–26:52)

• Extreme preparation is foundational, but Brian prefers to “know something so well that it feels improvisational.”
  • Quote:

    “I don’t practice before I do something because I like knowing something so well that it feels improvisational.” — Brian Grazer (26:28)

9. “Fill in the Blank to Excellence” — Rapid-Fire Insights

(27:17–29:19)

• Biggest lesson: “Act immediately.” (27:22)
• Professional goal: “Strive for greatness all the time.” (27:29)
• Biggest fear: “Embarrassment.” (27:37)
• Regret: “Not doing a couple business deals I wished I would have done.” (27:41)
• On box office bombs: Brian shares how small subjects can limit success, even with quality execution.
• On the craziest career moments: Funding movies himself led to both exhilarating and humbling experiences, like an 800-seat opening night with only seven people.

10. Creative Process and Philosophy

(35:38–36:28)

• Graham values kindness, imperfection, and living “a life unedited” while being protective and truthful.
  • Quote:

    “I try to live a life unedited, for the most part, protective of people, but unedited. Truthful to my own truth, my own soul. I believe in soul. I believe there’s something greater than ourselves. And I believe in a global collective consciousness.” — Brian Grazer (35:59)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Rejection:

  “The word no is only a temporary point of view.” (12:50)

• On Ownership:

  “The primary thing is you have to own something… represented in word form that you can evangelize and has value.” (08:29)

• On Hip Hop:

  “He is the voice that all kids are listening to right now… I have to learn what this language means.” (14:38)

• On Oscars Disappointment:

  “Jim Lovell reaches... grabs my wrist and said, ‘I never made it to the moon either.’” (22:06)

• On Preparation:

  “I like knowing something so well that it feels improvisational.” (26:28)

• On Legacy:

  “I think I’m kind... I believe in soul. I believe there’s something greater than ourselves.” (35:59)

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Important Timestamps

• 00:07 – The lesson of being rejected 500 times (Splash)
• 02:34 – Lou Wasserman’s mentorship and the lesson of bringing value
• 08:29 – What a producer really does; primacy of intellectual property
• 11:17 – Meeting Ron Howard; recognizing early potential
• 14:38 – Meeting Old Dirty Bastard; recognizing hip hop’s cultural impact
• 21:19-24:05 – Oscar night stories: Apollo 13 loss, A Beautiful Mind win, and run-ins with Harvey Weinstein
• 26:28 – Extreme preparation and feeling improvisational
• 27:22-29:19 – Rapid-fire lessons on success, regrets, and fears
• 35:59 – Philosophy on creativity, kindness, and authenticity

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Tone and Style

Brian Grazer is open, fast-talking, self-deprecating, and reflective; Kaplan is probing, friendly, and admiringly detail-oriented. The atmosphere is informal but rich with wisdom, candid recollections, and laughter.

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Summary

If you want the real story behind Hollywood success, Brian Grazer’s episode is a treasure trove—filled with lessons on resilience, creative ownership, humility, and extreme preparation. From Lou Wasserman’s cryptic advice, through early hustle and rejection, to launching the careers of industry giants and weathering box office flops and Oscar heartbreaks, Grazer’s journey is a masterclass in the pursuit of excellence, delivered with warmth, honesty, and humor.

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Transcript

[Brian Grazer]

Welcome to In Search of Excellence. You're going to be watching a spectacular show. Stay tuned.

[Podcast Host]

What's the lesson to everybody out there who you're rejected hundreds of times. Yeah. And you kept going. It took seven years to make that movie.

[Brian Grazer]

The lesson is the word no is only a temporary point of view. The other lesson is what people are hearing is probably not what you care about the most. Relationships are secondary. They should always be secondary. The primary thing is you have to own an idea, a script, ip. You need to have intellectual property. It can be a book, it can be an outline, it could be anything. An original idea that is represented in word form that you can evangelize and has value.

[Podcast Host]

Foreign. Welcome to In Search of Excellence. My guest today is Brian Grazer. Brian is an Academy Award winning producer who's produced 130 feature films including 8 Mile, the Da Vinci Code, how the Grinch stole Christmas, Apollo 13 and a beautiful Mind, for which he won the Oscar for best picture. Brian has also produced 45 TV shows including Empire, 24, Arrested Development, Friday Night Lights and Parenthood. His productions have been nominated for 47 Oscars. He has nine wins, 296 Emmy nominations with 63 wins, 71 Golden Globe nominations with 11 wins. And he's also won two Grammys. Collectively, his films and TV series have grossed over $15 billion worldwide. Brian is also the author of the awesome number one New York Times bestselling book, A Curious Mind. Brian, thanks for being here. Welcome to In Search of Excellence.

[Brian Grazer]

Wow. Thanks for the introduction.

[Podcast Host]

We talk about mentorship and how important mentors are in our lives.

[Brian Grazer]

Yes. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

And you wrote a letter to Lou Wasserman.

[Brian Grazer]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Who at the time was basically the king of Hollywood. Probably the most important person in the city unequivocally, for decades.

[Brian Grazer]

Decades. And with government.

[Podcast Host]

And with government. Right. I mean, when President Clinton would come to town, they'd play golf at Hillcrest with Casey and you know, he was

[Brian Grazer]

just, he knew, was his closest friend.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. And so tell us about that meeting which was life changing for you and about the, the notepad and then the, the legal tablet.

[Brian Grazer]

Okay. Of course.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Brian Grazer]

So basically with these letters I'd send out to assistants to meet their bosses, every single person said yes, everyone, anytime. I, I mean all these five minute meetings that I asked for, they all said yes. Then it came to Lou Wasserman, who was literally, as you said, the king of the industry, was the patriarch of all of media business. And he eventually said yes because I really was. Yeah, I was very persistent and I met his assistant out in the parking lot and said, come on. I was just meeting like. Anyway, I meet him. So I go up to the tower at Universal. The top floor, where the penthouse is, where Lou Wasserman's office would be, is in the tower on the 15th floor. So I get off the elevator, the 15th floor. Of course, the first time in my life was the 15th floor. And I'm standing there and I'm waiting to meet with Mr. Wasserman. People are staring at me because they know I'm like, you know, kind of a punk. And he comes out, he's a tall man, comes out and I walk towards him, towards him, towards his office to go in. And he threw his hands up in the air like, don't go any further. You're not. He basically said, you're not going in. And I said, okay. And I stood there kind of frozen. And now all the assistants are looking at me like, what's going on? And I'm very hypersensitive to what is happening around me as well. And he comes out and he has a legal tablet and a pen, actually a pencil, 2H pencil. He said, put these items in your hand. And he said, I do. I put the pencil and the pad in my hand. And he says, put the pencil to the paper and it will have greater value than it did as separate parts. Now get out of here. And I head to the elevator. You know, I'm pretty embarrassed that I've thrown out, but I do have the pencil and the paper, the pad. And I, in the elevator, I thought, oh, he was actually saying something to me. He was actually saying, don't go see people like me unless you have something of value. Come to me when you got something of value. And so I started, I became a writer. Cause I couldn't buy books. I didn't have the money to buy a book or treatments or scripts or anything like that. So I started writing them myself. I started manufacturing ideas out of my own imagination and writing at least a page on them. And I do at the time, because I wasn't in the writer's guild, I do a registered mail to myself, which means it was kind of protected by the postal seal. Okay, if you don't open it. So I had a whole chest full of these that I wrote. And then I sold two of them to the most powerful woman in show business. Her name was Deann Barkley. And DeAnne Barkley ran all of NBC. And I had a meeting with this DeAnne Barkley in her New Orleans style office. It was Very, very cool. It was at the time where people didn't really have custom offices other than John Callie. And her office was a white wooden plank floor I remember really well. And she lived on Tiger Tail, your street. And I was pitching these two projects to her. Behind her was also a New Orleans style birdcage, white wicker birdcage with a bird in it. And the bird's chirping away on this little. Perched on a little stick, a little hanging on him. And I pitch it and she's laughing. She loves these projects so much. She loves them. She goes, I'll do them, they're great like that. And she had a face that would light up, could get very animated. She's all lit up and there's a thump behind her. And the thump was the bird. It died. It just like had a heart attack or something and just died. And I said, I think your bird might have died. And she turned around, she goes like that. And I thought, oh shit, she's going to start crying and if she cries she'll forget that she bought my projects. So I'm staring at her while she's. And all of a sudden she turned it into laughter, started laughing hysterically. She did smoke pot all day long too. I mean she was a very smart person, but she didn't smoke pot. I didn't know that. And she starts laughing and she said, this is a good omen. And I said great. And she said, I'm going to be your mentor, I'm buying the projects, I'm your mentor, I'm going to help you place the projects at one of the major studios. And she picked someone named Alan Shane, who president of Warner Brothers Television. And I made a deal at Warner Brothers Television for my two projects. And so then I had a little office and my two projects and some money and it was a very, it was a break in my career. Huge.

[Sponsor/Advertiser]

I hope you're enjoying this video so far. But before we jump back in, I want to know if you've ever thought about what you need to do to reach the next level of success in your life. Over the last 25 years, I've been an advisor to more than 50 companies. I've invested nearly a hundred, including Google, Lift and Seagate. And I also co founded a company that today is worth More than 50, $15 billion. I've been incredibly blessed in my journey and at this stage of my life. I want to give back. I want to share the lessons I've learned so you can reach incredible success way faster than I did. In my own journey, I've learned that having the right mentor is a massive advantage to achieving our goals. I'm hugely passionate about mentoring others, and I'm looking for a few hungry entrepreneurs who are excited to take action on their journey to incredible future success. So if that's you, I've got an opportunity. In the description of this video, there's a link where you can apply to work with me. All you need to do is answer a few simple questions, and if you're a good fit, my team will reach out so we can build a game plan together. All right, now let's get back to the video.

[Podcast Host]

You're one of the most successful producers of all time. I think people want to know, what does a producer actually do, number one, and number two, how important relationships are to being a successful producer.

[Brian Grazer]

Okay, Relationships are secondary. They should always be secondary. The primary thing is you have to own something. As Lou Wasserman said, you have to own an idea, a script, iPad. You need to have intellectual property. It could be a book, it can be an outline, it could be anything. An original idea, an idea that is represented in word form, that you can evangelize and has value through your ability to evangelize. Now, if it's so well written and people read it, they go, it's so well written, you don't need to evangelize. Generates its own momentum. Without evangelizing, then that can happen too. But you have to have that thing. You have to. You can't rely upon trying to get. Having a friend relationship like, you know, kind of lock you in for a free ride. It's happened, but it's not.

[Podcast Host]

It's not.

[Brian Grazer]

It doesn't have any integrity. You want to believe in what you're doing. So therefore, if you believe what you're doing, you can evangelize it. And to the best extent. My projects that worked were all built out of my soul, out of my experiences, out of my trauma or my success or my ability to experience someone else's success or a moment in someone else's life that becomes volcanic in some way.

[Sponsor/Advertiser]

I hope you're enjoying this video so far, but before we jump back in, I want to know if you've ever thought about what you need to do to reach the next level of success in your life. Over the last 25 years, I've been an advisor to more than 50 companies. I've invested nearly a hundred, including Google, Lift, and Seagate. And I also co founded a company that today is worth more than $15 billion. I've been incredibly blessed in my journey and at this stage in my life. I want to give back. I want to share the lessons I've learned so you can reach incredible success success way faster than I did in my own journey. I've learned that having the right mentor is a massive advantage to achieving our goals. I'm hugely passionate about mentoring others. I'm looking for a few hungry entrepreneurs who are excited to take action on their journey to incredible future success. So if that's you, I've got an opportunity. In the description of this video, there's a link where you can apply to work with me. All you need to do is answer a few simple questions, and if you're a good fit, my team will reach out so we can build a game plan together. All right, now let's get back to the video.

[Podcast Host]

Another big break is you now have a deal at paramount. You're making 100 grand a year, by the way, which is in today's dollar is $500,000 a year for those people who. Who don't know. And then you see Ron Howard walking on a cast walkway. Yeah. What happened next?

[Brian Grazer]

Then I continue the practice of meeting new people. I look out and I see Ron Howard out of my window. And I yell, ron, Ron.

[Sponsor/Advertiser]

And.

[Brian Grazer]

And he got scared because he's shy and he ran around a corner and eluded me. And then I called his assistant. I'm the guy that yelled out the window. I'm a real producer. Then Ron Howard said he'd meet with me, and he came to my office and he was just the actor on Happy Days. And he had this aura of goodness about him, just something great. And I thought, I am going to believe in this guy. So without a lot of evidence, I believed in this guy would be an Oscar winning director someday. And he became it.

[Podcast Host]

Another big break was Night Shift.

[Brian Grazer]

Yes.

[Podcast Host]

So you wrote this movie, Night Shift. It was a comedy. It did well. And then your next big hit came from an idea you had when you were 25 years old driving down PCH. Yeah. And there was a woman, a very interesting woman that was very pretty, the prettiest woman at USC named Maggie Bailey, who. And you were doing something called Zuma beach at the time. And somehow seven years later, Splash happens.

[Brian Grazer]

Right.

[Podcast Host]

Which was huge. Which was turned down 500 times. Yeah. And everyone thought, you are absolutely nuts to be shopping that mermaid.

[Brian Grazer]

They would avoid me. They would. They go, here comes that guy with the mermaid idea.

[Podcast Host]

And so no one wanted to make it. But what's the lesson to everybody out there? Who you're rejected hundreds of times. Yeah. And you kept going. It took seven years to make that movie.

[Brian Grazer]

The lesson is no. The word no is only a temporary point of view. The other lesson is what you're saying. What people are hearing is probably not what you care about the most. So people were hearing a mermaid, but I was really making a love story about a person played by Tom Hanks, that had everything really, but love. So it's a person that has this one disability, and the disability is his inability to have love. That's all I wanted to do. And that's what the Nutty professor was. I mean, in a weird way, that's why he was funny. The Nutty professor with Eddie Murphy, when he's fat. I made sure that he was a winner. He was really good at what he does. He was charming, he was funny. He made Jada Pinkett laugh. Everything was good. Except he was obese. And so all he had to do was conquer that one thing that was destroying his opportunities. Yeah. So people are not hearing what you are believing. And so you have to be able to communicate that. I'm doing my answers quickly now. So.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, I'm from Detroit. When I was younger, we had fake IDs. Today you have fake IDs. And kids go to. They put in. You know, there's 50 people. They get them from China. The barcodes work everywhere except Las Vegas. Yeah, they get into clubs. So we were uncool kids. We drive to Detroit. We go to eight Mile to get liquor. Eight Mile is one of my famous, most favorite movies of all time. I mean, I'm from Detroit, and when I go there, I mean, I drive by, you know, big sign, and I always put it on my Instagram account. So talk to us briefly, because we're getting toward the end of the show about Old Dirty Bastard. And you know, how that movie came about.

[Brian Grazer]

I knew nothing about hip hop, but I still have the discipline of meeting one new person every week. I overhear this crazy motherfucker named Old Dirty Bastard. This is like 25 years ago. He's talking to Howard Stern on the radio. I'm in a car, I listen, and I think he's insane, but he's saying something. So I thought, I'm gonna meet that guy. I meet him the next day in front of his studio, which he wouldn't let me into. I had to stay on the sidewalk and. Cause everything was a la carte. If I wanted to go in the studio, that was something. You know, it was always some kind of trade I realize when I'm talking to this guy, Old Dirty Bastard, that he is the voice of the street. He is the voice that all kids are listening to right now. Adults didn't know what he was talking about. I didn't know what he was talking about. But 18 year olds to 18 to 25, they knew. They knew what he was talking about. And I thought, I have to learn what this language means. So there's Old Dirty Bastard in the Wu Tang. Then I met this guy, Slick Rick with a patch on his eye. Then I met Chuck D from Public Enemy. I met them all. I met. I met a lot. And I thought, I'm gonna make a movie that speaks to the culture of hip hop. Two weeks later, I have one of those curiosity things with Frank Rich, the editor of the New York Times. What are you doing, Brian? I said, I just met this guy named Old Dirty Bastard. And I met a few others. I'm gonna. I think this movement is the real thing. It's going to be the culture. He said, I'm sorry, Brian. It's an inferior subculture that will fade and go away. So I left him and I thought, he's wrong and I'm gonna prove him wrong. And we turned this into a movie that gave it much more dignity. And the truth is, is hip hop is still here today.

[Podcast Host]

You've made people's careers. Tom Hanks, essentially. Meg Ryan.

[Brian Grazer]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Eminem. Are these people still appreciative of what you've done for them? I mean, can you call Marshall Mather and said, hey, Marshall, I was on this great podcast. You should do a show.

[Brian Grazer]

Would he do it?

[Podcast Host]

I don't know. Would he do it?

[Brian Grazer]

No, he wouldn't.

[Podcast Host]

He would. He's my boy from Detroit. I want Marsh my show.

[Brian Grazer]

No, he's an. He's kind of a to himself guy.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Brian Grazer]

I mean, he'd be always in the trailer. I mean, he was. Worked really hard. I will say this. He worked as hard as any professional I've ever worked with in my life. And he was trying. He was being a good dad, Great dad. This guy on time all the time, wrote all the song. He's a master. He act with honesty. His music was. He's so talented. He won an Oscar. The first hip hop artist to win an Oscar. Yeah, I mean, I don't get to talk to him but much because he doesn't talk to a lot of people. But I have tremendous admiration for this guy.

[Podcast Host]

I have to tell people how we met. I mean, how we met. You know, we're at the.

[Brian Grazer]

I have helped a lot of artists. I gave Johnny Depp his first job. I helped Marky Mark become Mark Wahlberg. And they do remember. They're really nice to me.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. Mark's a great guy.

[Brian Grazer]

Yeah. They're all decades later, like, very kind. And Tom Hanks, he shouldn't. He doesn't need to owe me anything because he's just. He has earned every bit of it. I'm lucky enough to. Made six movies with him, obviously. Honestly. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

I mean, we met again in Aspen.

[Brian Grazer]

Kimo Sabi.

[Podcast Host]

Kimo Sabe store. There's this cool place on top. It's kind of members only, but if you're a good customer, you're cool. Whatever. Yeah. So I walk up there, and you get margs up there, and I always, you know, stop there. Then they get two margs. Then you go back to the hotel, and then you go, dinner, and there's Brian Grazer sitting there like, all right, well, I've wanted Brian on my show for a while. I've admired you for a long time. I went right up to you. You know, today is February 5th.

[Brian Grazer]

Oh, boy. Here we go.

[Podcast Host]

Okay. Yeah. And so you wrote letters, and I heard you were doing these curiosity conversations a long time ago. I'm curious, too. So I wrote you this letter, which I sent, which I texted you when I ran into you again this year, because it was hard to. You were kind enough to say I was elusive. Yeah, I mean, you were, but. And, you know, what are you gonna do? I said, hey, I want to do. I mean, you could have said, no, I'm not doing it. But you were very gracious, I guess. You gave me your cell number. You responded right away.

[Brian Grazer]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

And then I see you again this. This year. Yeah. Over Christmas. We're at the same restaurant. I said, hey, Brian, you know, do you remember me? You know, not really. I said, I got the podcast, and then I went back, and I had been cleaning all my computer files maybe two months ago, and I saw this letter that I had written you on February 5, 2003, 26 years ago to the day that we're doing the show.

[Brian Grazer]

Oh, my God.

[Podcast Host]

And here's a letter.

[Brian Grazer]

Wow. I didn't know.

[Podcast Host]

Nice.

[Brian Grazer]

Yeah. I'm 34 years old. That would be you.

[Podcast Host]

That was me back in the day.

[Brian Grazer]

Northwest. Wow. Really nice. And nice. Very nice stationery.

[Podcast Host]

Well, I put on nice stationary and.

[Brian Grazer]

Oh, yeah, that's nice.

[Podcast Host]

So. So let me just ask you.

[Brian Grazer]

That's crazy. Put.

[Podcast Host]

Put you on the spot. Okay, so you asked for Meetings. But you didn't take my meeting.

[Brian Grazer]

Right.

[Podcast Host]

So why would I be so duplicitous? I'm just wondering, you know, there's symmetry. Like, I never forgot where I came from. And I'm not saying that you do either, but, like, you. I mean, I can't take all. I mean. I mean, LinkedIn. I get 10 messages a day. You meet with me, I'll meet with everyone who does the work. You know, kind of like what you said with Lou. And if you're doing all the research and write me the kind of letter that I wrote people, I will meet with you. But, hey, you know, can I have a cup of coffee? Not gonna happen.

[Brian Grazer]

Right.

[Podcast Host]

So what happened with my letter there?

[Brian Grazer]

On the letter?

[Podcast Host]

Well, just. Yeah.

[Brian Grazer]

Or in general?

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, yeah, just general. Like, why wouldn't you respond to this letter? Because the same thing. I'm not looking for a job, and I just want to talk to you.

[Brian Grazer]

I should have definitely responded.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Brian Grazer]

That I should have done.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Brian Grazer]

Maybe you think I read it.

[Podcast Host]

Well, I don't know if you read it, because I never heard back from you.

[Brian Grazer]

Was it an email?

[Podcast Host]

No. I sent. This is how. My letterhead. I mailed it.

[Brian Grazer]

Oh, I don't know.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Brian Grazer]

That could just be rude. Oh, I don't want to be rude, but there's at least 50. 50 chance. I never read it. At least I don't read any emails. By the way, that was a letter, but. So I don't know that there's no excuse for that one. I mean, other than I might not have read it. Yeah, that's a chance. That's literally 50, 50. And then as far as the podcast, part of it was, I really wanted to do it because I really liked you. I was very magnetized to you. But then it came around to my publicity. People said there was a period where I didn't want to. No, no. There was a. No, not about you. There was a period of time where I did not want to go on. There were subjects I didn't want to talk about. And so whether it was your podcast or a lesser, bigger whatever, I just didn't want to talk about certain subjects.

[Podcast Host]

We have so much more to talk about. I want to talk about Academy Awards because that's the Holy grail of your business, right? It's something everyone dreams about.

[Brian Grazer]

Yes.

[Podcast Host]

And we'll talk about the 68th Academy Award, where you have produced Apollo 13. It had nine. Nine nominations. And you had this embarrassing moment where you heard the B word. Sidney Poitier was Italian. You get up out of your chair and in front of 35 million people, you got to sit back down.

[Brian Grazer]

Yeah. Well, what happened there? What happened there? We did get a lot of Oscar nominations. A lot. And we won some, and basically we had a lot of momentum. And prior to that, every person said, you're gonna win an Oscar. And Mike Milken came to me, and I didn't know him, and he said, you're gonna win. And just please say these eight words. I go, I don't know, you know, but I had every oddsmakers in Vegas. Everything was where you're winning. So I wrote up a card that I was gonna say and put it in my tuxedo. I was pretty convinced I was gonna win, you know, because the 20th anniversary of NASA, there was a lot of things in alignment. And Sidney Poitier, I just somehow thought what was coming out of his mouth was Brian. So I got up to go on stage, and then I had to sit down, and I looked behind me so I didn't fall down on the chair, you know, miss my chair. And one studio chairman goes loser like that. And so that was kind of uncomfortable. Then I sit down, and there's Tom Hanks and Ron Howard and Jim Lovell. And Jim Lovell reaches way over these guys and grabs my wrist and said, I never made it to the moon either. And I thought, wow, that puts it in perspective. I mean, that guy actually went up in the rocket and didn't make it to the moon. I just didn't make. Get win an Oscar. So I thought, well, I can't feel that bad about myself.

[Podcast Host]

So the studio chairman was Harvey Weinstein?

[Brian Grazer]

No. Oh. He was very happy that I didn't win. But it was a different one.

[Podcast Host]

It was a different one.

[Brian Grazer]

Yeah, Because I didn't look at him. Okay. That dude's gross.

[Podcast Host]

Okay, I just have to ask this question, because Harvey was known by everyone in Hollywood to be doing inappropriate things.

[Brian Grazer]

Yes.

[Podcast Host]

I mean, you must have heard it too. I mean, you.

[Brian Grazer]

You. No.

[Podcast Host]

You never heard it?

[Brian Grazer]

No.

[Podcast Host]

I mean, I was shocked.

[Brian Grazer]

I knew not to like him.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Brian Grazer]

I didn't. I thought he was disgusting.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Brian Grazer]

I've been on airplanes, private jets with him that weren't his or mine.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Brian Grazer]

And sit right across him. I won't look at him.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Brian Grazer]

He's just a guy that I don't want to talk to. There's people, you know, have bad karma, and there's nothing. He'd always go, I'm gonna get you. I'm gonna get you an Oscar. You know, when I did win an Oscar. He said, I'm gonna get you more if you do something with. You know, he's just like a pig. I. I didn't want. There are a few people. I don't hate him. I just don't want to be around him. I just know bad shit's gonna come.

[Podcast Host]

Six years later, 74th Academy Award comes up.

[Brian Grazer]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

And you win For A Beautiful Mind.

[Brian Grazer]

I win.

[Podcast Host]

And I. I watched you get up on stage.

[Brian Grazer]

That was terrible.

[Podcast Host]

Right? And it was. It was. You were nervous. You were emotional when you were thanking everybody, you know, Ron in particular, and you said, this is a miracle. Oh, but it wasn't.

[Brian Grazer]

I mean, I don't remember because I never watched it.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. What's. I mean, you hear your name, it's the biggest award of the night. You're getting up, or you're just kind of losing all thought. No, you have to. Your legs are moving, but you can't really think about what's happening.

[Brian Grazer]

Yeah. And the first thing I said was. I know my. I think I remember what I said. I said. I know my nervousness seems imperceptible because it was very perceptible, I thought. And I remember Nicole Kidman sitting in the front row. Julia Roberts. All the great girls were in the front row. Julia, Renee Zellweger, Sandy Bullock, Nicole. I knew them all really well. And I remember. I think Nicole was. Lip was mouthing like, you can do it, Brian.

[Podcast Host]

You write a speech beforehand.

[Brian Grazer]

I did.

[Podcast Host]

I mean, everyone writes a speech. And then what do you do when you don't win? You put in the shredder when you get home, and it's, like, embarrassing.

[Brian Grazer]

Throw it away.

[Podcast Host]

Yes. Do you practice your speech before you give it? I mean, you don't practice at all. You're just writing down notes.

[Brian Grazer]

I never practice any speeches.

[Podcast Host]

The Academy Awards, there's a seating thing that's going on, and people in Hollywood have massive egos, Right? Massive egos. So are. Are people kind of like, okay, I'm in the first row. I'm in the second row. You know, do people kind of look

[Brian Grazer]

at that at the Oscars themselves?

[Podcast Host]

At the osc. Themselves? Because, you know, then you're in the fifth row, and, you know, you're not really a top three row.

[Brian Grazer]

No.

[Podcast Host]

Is that a thing? No. No, it's not.

[Brian Grazer]

No. Because they put the actors. I produced the Oscars once, so, yeah. No, it's not. I don't think it's a thing. I mean, if you're way in the back and you're no man's Land. That would not be good. Okay, but if you're in the, you know, top 20 rows, I mean, look, the top 10 rows are the right place to be. When you go further back, it's a little less good. Yeah, sure.

[Podcast Host]

I want to talk about one thing that makes people successful and been the core of my success, which is something called extreme preparation. So when someone prepares maybe one hour for things, I'll prepare 10 for this show. 14 hours.

[Brian Grazer]

Wow.

[Podcast Host]

How important has extreme preparation been to your success?

[Brian Grazer]

Well, it's been very, very. I don't practice before I do something because I like knowing something so well that it feels improvisational. But I know the material really well. I would say that I would test myself prior about the material that I'm going to talk about. And I do believe stories are really important. So I tell stories. And that's unfortunate for you because I went very long today.

[Podcast Host]

No, it's not unfortunate because it's been a phenomenal show.

[Brian Grazer]

Oh, great.

[Podcast Host]

Thanks. That's one of the best shows that I've ever done.

[Brian Grazer]

Oh, thanks.

[Podcast Host]

You're listening to part two of my incredible interview with Brian Grazer, one of the most successful producers in Hollywood history. If you haven't yet listened to part one, be sure to check that one out first. Now, without further ado, here's part two of my awesome conversation with Brian. I know we're at the end of our show, and I always conclude my show by something I call fill in the blank to excellence. Are you ready to play?

[Brian Grazer]

I'll try.

[Podcast Host]

The biggest lesson I've learned in my life is.

[Brian Grazer]

Oh. Oh, God, this is hard. Okay. What? The biggest lesson I've learned in my life is act immediately.

[Podcast Host]

My number one professional goal is to

[Brian Grazer]

strive for greatness all the time. My biggest fear is original originality and greatness.

[Podcast Host]

My biggest fear is.

[Brian Grazer]

Oh, embarrassment.

[Podcast Host]

My biggest regret is not doing a

[Brian Grazer]

couple business deals that I wished I would would have done.

[Podcast Host]

Let's go back because you. You said something a second ago. I just real quick. I want to talk about box office bombs. You know, we talked a little bit before the show. About box office. Yeah, about something you're working on. You had a movie last year with Sydney SWEENEY that cost $55 million to make and. And grossed 2.5 million. They pulled it from the big numbers right away. Yeah, big numbers. And in Hollywood, you're only as good as your latest film. As an actor, certainly. I mean. Yeah, not. Not you, but do you know a movie's really shitty before it comes Out.

[Sponsor/Advertiser]

It's not gonna work well.

[Brian Grazer]

That movie I didn't think was shitty. I didn't really work on it, actually, but my partner did. It was a favorite project of his, I thought. He did an amazing job directing it. He got a tremendous cast, I always felt. And he would tell you it's a small subject. In other words, I like. I pick, if I get to pick. I pick subjects that have a lot of scale and most importantly, sex appeal. And that didn't either have scale or appeal. It was like a very interesting and powerful story. And there's. It's. It's deep about a person that, played by Anna De Armas, that plays an imposter really, really, really well. And Sydney, who's earnest, and, you know, I think everyone, Jade, all the actors were good. So, I mean, it's just. It was a small subject. So I had low expectations on its success, but I always have high expectations on quality when Ron directs something and it was very good and people like that part of it. It's just a really small subject.

[Podcast Host]

The craziest thing that's happened in my

[Brian Grazer]

career, okay, the craziest thing that happened in my career was I was paying for movies with our own money. And so I could say yes or no without asking anybody. And I appear to be impulsive, but I'm not impulsive at all. I do well, act quickly on an opportunity, but I'm not really impulsive on things that require real thought, like saying yes to, you know, $50 million or something. So, anyway, the script comes to me. It's called Crybaby. The director of Hairspray, John Waters, was gonna direct it and he wanted Johnny Depp, who I also knew of from 21 Jump street and I read this script while I'm on an exercise bike. I'm really riveted. I think it's really hip. I think it's gonna be Grease, like blow up, Be like a massive hit. So I say yes on the spot. I'm payer playing everybody. I pay or play the director. I pay or play the whole movie. I pair play Johnny Depp, who's never acted in a feature film. And I'm now making the movie. The movie comes out, it's opening night is Friday night. And Ron, I say to Ron, let's go to it. We have a couple of sakes after a little sushi, and we go into the AFCO Cinema. It's an 800 seat theater. There's seven people in the theater. Seven. We got so drunk that because we couldn't it was so mentally abusive, like, to see that, like, not one person. And then for Ron, it was the craziest because he had this mustache that he wouldn't ever shave off. And I knew Andy Warhol really well, and I said. And Andy said to me, your. Your partner, Ron Howard is an American icon. And I go, I know he is. He said, if he shaves. If he allows me to shave his mustache off, I will do before and after, and I'll give him the originals. Little did Ron know they'd be worth about $250 million today. But he said. Ron goes, no, I don't want to shave my mustache off. I don't want to do that. No. Ron goes to my house. We watch Drugstore Cowboy twice. It's a very dark movie. We get drunker and drunker. He goes to lax, he wanders around kind of lost in the LAX terminal, and he goes to the bathroom and he gets a shaver, and he just decides to shave his mustache off because he's drunk. And he could have done it for Andy for $250 million. Instead, he just does it because he had nothing to do with the airport while he's waiting for the red eye. So, I mean, that was kind of crazy.

[Podcast Host]

That was back when he was flying commercial. Probably changed at some point.

[Brian Grazer]

Yeah. That's funny. Yeah. I mean, I've had a lot of craziest things. I've had movies that have turned into parties. I've had. I loved American Gangster because so many crazy things came out of that, you know, But I can't really say what they are.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Brian Grazer]

Because they involve people.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, people.

[Brian Grazer]

That's it.

[Podcast Host]

Confidential.

[Brian Grazer]

People. Yeah, people.

[Podcast Host]

The best advice I've ever received is do what's inevitable. The best movie of all time is

[Brian Grazer]

I like Godfather 2 and Citizen Kane.

[Podcast Host]

The best actor I've ever worked with is.

[Brian Grazer]

I can't say one. I have to say five.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Brian Grazer]

Eddie Murphy, Tom Hanks, Denzel Washington. Oh, I did work with Leo DiCaprio. He's way in there. Way in there.

[Podcast Host]

Okay, let me put you on the spot. On the flip side, which I'd love you to answer.

[Brian Grazer]

The worst actor, Leo DiCaprio is really, really, really good. He played J. Edgar Hoover in a movie that I did with Clint Eastwood, directed it. I never saw any actor so capable of the commitment to character and words that he could say giant mouthfuls of words that are so powerful and convincing. He's kind of a savant.

[Podcast Host]

I think the worst actor I've ever worked with is.

[Brian Grazer]

Oh, I Can't do that. I've had a lot of those.

[Podcast Host]

I didn't think you were gonna answer that one.

[Brian Grazer]

Yeah, no way.

[Podcast Host]

The one actor I've always wanted to work with but haven't is there's so

[Brian Grazer]

much I can't say. I don't know. These are too hard because there's a lot of actors I want to work with. I want to work with Zendaya, I want to work, I mean that are around right now that I haven't ever worked with. I never worked with Zendaya and I would really like to. I think she's sharp, you know, I mean I think she's hipin. Magical, you know. Oh, I've certainly not worked with Timothee Chalamer. Guy's really, really good.

[Podcast Host]

He's all the rage right now.

[Brian Grazer]

He is. He's so good. He was good in. He's so good in everything.

[Podcast Host]

The one thing I've dreamt about doing for a long time but haven't is

[Brian Grazer]

professionally going on a psychedelic trip in a really great environment. I've never done that. I've never done any psychedelics in my life. I'm very scared of that, but I'm very, very curious about it. So if I were in the Amazon or something, which I've been invited to, to do that, I don't think I courage to go and do it, but I would like to have the courage to do it and be safe.

[Podcast Host]

If I can invent one thing in the world, it would be peace. If I could go back in time and give my 21 year old self one piece of advice, it would be

[Brian Grazer]

don't worry so much.

[Podcast Host]

If you could meet one person in the world, who would it be?

[Brian Grazer]

This living today?

[Podcast Host]

You mean we could go living and we could go, let's go living and deceased.

[Brian Grazer]

Deceased.

[Sponsor/Advertiser]

Recent.

[Brian Grazer]

More recent would be somebody like Winston Churchill. He was pretty hip, he could drink, he was brave, he changed the nation. I mean, yeah, I think he's quite remarkable. There's so many people I think are quite remarkable. I think Jeff Bezos is really remarkable. He's a really good friend and he's got a great soul. Not only brilliant beyond belief, he's a kind human being. He has an exceptional life and he's an exceptional person.

[Podcast Host]

The one person who you haven't met, who you would like to meet today, who's a lie life.

[Brian Grazer]

I haven't met the new Pope and I really would like to meet the new Pope.

[Podcast Host]

If you were President of the United States today, the first thing you would

[Brian Grazer]

do is there's so many things, even the playing field.

[Podcast Host]

If you were on your deathbed and had a minute to live and you were surrounded by that bed, by Veronica and your four children, what's the one piece of advice you would give them?

[Brian Grazer]

Well, that's pretty emotional, I guess that I'll be okay, and so will you.

[Podcast Host]

The one question you wish I'd asked

[Brian Grazer]

you is, you're so difficult. You're so hard. It probably would have to do with the best parts of my creative process of creating things, building something from nothing. I mean, writers start with that, but I build whole movies sometimes just from nothing.

[Podcast Host]

So give us. Give us.

[Brian Grazer]

I think I'm kind, and I think I'm able to. I think I make a lot of mistakes with language and syntax, but I think people feel that I have a good heart and that my mistakes are just goofy mistakes. You know, like, I say things sometimes. I try to live a life unedited, for the most part, protective of people, but unedited. Truthful. Truthful to my own truth, my own soul. I believe in soul. I believe there's something greater than ourselves. And I believe in a global collective consciousness.

[Podcast Host]

We live in a very small town, as you know. A lot of cattiness. Jealousy. Jealousy. You're one of these guys that no one says a bad word about. Everyone likes, you know, you are kind. And so it did take us 23 years to sit down together. And I'm grateful that you came and you followed up. And I want all the people out there to know, if you want something, go after it. Don't be afraid to go up to people like Brian Grazer. Things happen that way. And that's how. That's how people get ahead. And that's one of the things that makes people successful. Just. Just go do it.

[Brian Grazer]

Yes, go do it. Yeah. I, too, have a piece of art by. I think his name is Jeffrey Deitch. Right?

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. So Jeffrey was the former.

[Brian Grazer]

Oh, not Jeffrey Deitch. I have a piece of. Anyway, it says now it's mirrors. Big. It weighed 400 pounds.

[Podcast Host]

Oh, it's by. Did you buy it at 303 Gallery or.

[Brian Grazer]

He lives in Venice, actually. This. This. He.

[Podcast Host]

He does the mirror words.

[Brian Grazer]

Mirror words, right. They're giant.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, it says.

[Brian Grazer]

Mine says now, I bought it like, I walked in. Reagan Gallery.

[Podcast Host]

Yep.

[Brian Grazer]

To Reagan Gallery. She had an opening.

[Podcast Host]

Judith Reagan.

[Brian Grazer]

Judith Reagan.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Brian Grazer]

Yeah, yeah. Doug Aiken.

[Podcast Host]

Doug Aiken.

[Brian Grazer]

We did it.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, we did it. Yeah.

[Brian Grazer]

Okay. And I saw these giant words, and I said, I want it. And then I Had to race to the Chinese for a premiere of one of my movies. But I saw it and bought it. That's on the spot. And then they said, we want to install it. They said, it weighs 400 pounds. I happened to be in Paris, meeting with Bernard Arnault in his office, who knows a lot about art. And I said something like, have you ever heard of Doug Akin? He goes, oh, I like his work. I said, we'll redo the wall. Because I had to take the wall down and put a new wall in for these letters. And I wasn't going to do that. But if he said no, I've never heard of him. I probably wouldn't. I might not have bought it. Or if he said, I don't know if I like that. His work. But he goes, oh, I like it. And I thought that was a tipping point moment. I go by tipping point moments all of the time in my life. I had a house in Hawaii on the North Shore. I loved it. 15 years. I had a tipping point moment. I sold it that day. Like, the day I felt. Had that feeling.

[Podcast Host]

I saw Doug Akins. I saw Doug akins work at 303 Gallery in New York. They had a piece. I saw it. And then I said, okay, I was born in 1980. So he did 1968. I'm like, oh, yeah. I think about it. It was very expensive. It was $250,000.

[Brian Grazer]

Wow.

[Podcast Host]

I didn't buy it. And then I'm at Tony Pritzker's house one day, and I walk into his, you know, huge room there, and there it is on the wall.

[Brian Grazer]

Wow.

[Podcast Host]

Really? Oh, my gosh. You know, I kind of like it. I kind of like it.

[Brian Grazer]

I've done that to you.

[Podcast Host]

I kind of like it. Thank you for being here. I really appreciate it. Been a huge fan of yours for a long time. Congrats on all your success. You're truly an incredible person. So thank you.

[Brian Grazer]

Wow. Thanks. That's so kind of you. You had good questions. Those are hard as could be. I cannot believe it. You are literally the most prepared person with the details of the subject that you're going to speak with. I mean, I've never been asked these questions before. They're truly so arresting and original that they kind of blow my mind. I can't wait to watch more episodes of your show.

[Podcast Host]

That's awesome. Thank you for the. Thank you for that compliment.

[Brian Grazer]

It.