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- [00:00]
A
Top three quarterbacks averaged $52 million a year. Head coaches average $6.6 million a year. You were offered reportedly $100 million by the Mohammed Dolphins for four years. Didn't take it. You're rumored to be the highest or second highest paid coach in the league. Who's more important than winning, quarterbacks or coaches?
- [00:17]
B
Well, look, let's follow the money, but certainly the quarterback position touches the ball 70 times, 75 times a game. And I always like to say we all get on that plane and go right, and the starting quarterback goes up those steps and he goes left.
- [00:39]
A
You're listening to part two of my awesome interview with Sean Payton, one of the best and most successful coaches in NFL history and the current head coach of the Denver Broncos. If you haven't yet listened to part one of my interview with Sean, be sure to check that one out first. Now, without further ado, here's part two of my interview with the awesome Sean Payton. So 2006 rolls around, and you have an opportunity to coach the team that's a laughing stock of the league, had won, I think, one playoff game in 39 years in the league, if I'm not mistaken.
- [01:11]
B
Yeah.
- [01:11]
A
And you had the opportunity to go to New Orleans. It was five months after Hurricane Katrina.
- [01:16]
B
Right? After Katrina. Yeah. Post Katrina. That's right. So 2006, post Katrina.
- [01:20]
A
So why take a chance on going to the laughing stock? Is it because if you don't improve, it's not your fault? Or is it an opportunity to say, I can't get any worse?
- [01:29]
B
It's probably a little bit of all of it. Our season ended in Dallas in 06, and I went and interviewed in Green Bay.
- [01:40]
A
That was a job you wanted.
- [01:42]
B
It was. I'm from Chicago. And that look, that job, I think, you know, carried that.
- [01:49]
A
Yeah. Lambeau, you got Wrigley, you got everything right.
- [01:52]
B
You got the history there. I interviewed with Green Bay, came back, interviewed with New Orleans, and was scheduled to interview with Buffalo. And while I was on my interview in New Orleans, I met Mickey Loomis. Certainly he was the gm, so he was the guy interviewing me. And he was the one bright spot because, look, this is five months post Katrina, so you still feel the effects everywhere. I mean, it. You know, it. It was. And Mickey, to his credit, didn't hide it like the, you know, the windows weren't tinted or anything. We saw it all. And, And. And so that first day when he's taken me around. Have you ever been somewhere where you're kind of listening and I kind of like them. And yet you're tuned out because you're thinking, there's no way I'm coming here. I'm waiting to hear about Green Bay. And that was me a little bit. And so you have that moment. You're freshening up, and I check the cell phone, get a voicemail from the late Ted Thompson. Hey, we're going in a different direction. I'm like, wow. I remember throwing the phone into the pillow and just thinking, man. And then here it is again. You're regrouping. And now it's like, all right, I didn't. For some reason, I didn't want to go to the Northeast again. Marv Levy was. Was the acting president at that time for Buffalo.
- [03:21]
A
Great head coach.
- [03:22]
B
Yeah, yeah. Fantastic hall of Fame head coach. I knew I couldn't get in the habit of turning these jobs down. Like, you know, and so I went back and Mickey and I spoke again a couple times. And then, you know, he says, hey, I'm going to call you. I think it was Tuesday night after I speak with the owner, and we're going to offer you the head job. I just want you to be heads up. And so I remember my wife feeling somewhat apprehensive. I mean, I think she was like, all right, this is three years from removed from the Raiders, but, you know, this is a challenge. And we were at a Jon Bon Jovi concert, and, you know, I got the vibrating phone, and this is back when it was like, I'm going to give you. Well, so it's 06. It's probably a razor. And I step outside, and I'm kind of in the outskirts of the arena, and he's offering me the job. And then here we go. What happened coincidentally, though, Breeze, you know, kind of comes next, and then there's a series of events. How we all end up there is pretty unique, and it's kind of how life can kind of take you in certain paths. But we all got in for football, and all of a sudden, it became a little bit more than just football because of what had taken place there five months earlier. We had immediate success in that first year. We went to the championship game, and we'd come home at the airport, there'd be 3,500 people there.
- [05:02]
A
Right. I think in all our careers, it's very hard. You like to go with the flow and have the courage, stand alone is really, really hard to do. You're a new coach, and you take a bet on a guy that is a torn rotator cuff, may never throw again. And the only team that wanted it was the Miami Dolphins. But you are betting your future on this quarterback ultimately became the number two passer, number two yards, number two completion percentage, holds behind Tom Brady, every important record as a quarterback. What were you thinking? And I think you're betting everything on this guy.
- [05:35]
B
Well, do you remember the scene in Jerry Maguire? And I think it's Tom Cruise. And like, he decides, like, he says, I'm going, and he grabs the goldfish. And who wants to go with me? And it's like crickets in there. And then finally a couple guys. Well, no, it's just. It's just he's got the goldfish. And Renee Zellweger, like, stands up. She said, I'll go. And that was it. And so we had to be somewhat aggressive. And the unique thing about Drew's injury, there have been a few quarterbacks that had a torn rotator. No one there. There was just no precedent for a fully torn one. So we couldn't look back to 1978. This player was there. It just had never happened. So I think a lot of it was our belief in the things we knew to be true about Drew. In fact, I know that was the case. We were betting on, like, if anyone's going to rehab this the way he needs to, if anyone's going to approach this, because the Chargers had just released him and they had drafted Philip Rivers the year before. So he becomes available and we're recruiting him, Miami's recruiting him. And ultimately Miami does offer him a contract with just less guarantee. We. We offer him a bigger contract. And we just had to be aggressive because, you know, I think we had the second pick of the draft. And if we knew there was one of these just blue chip quarterbacks, we might have approached it differently. But I don't think we felt well, we didn't feel strong enough. We were evaluating that class. But that allowed us to take the best player available rather than possibly reach for a quarterback.
- [07:26]
A
So Hurricane Katrina, for those people who are a little younger and don't really remember.
- [07:30]
B
Yeah, 05 August, I think.
- [07:32]
A
05. $186 billion in property damage. 1392 people died. You played your season away, so you didn't have a home game.
- [07:40]
B
So that was the. So that was the. So the Saints played their season away. I'm at the Cowboys. That's the 05 season. So the Saints relocated to San Antonio. They set up kind of their facility there. They played some home games in San Antonio. I think Randy. They played a couple in Baton Rouge. But really a hodgepodge, a disarray. And it was really, quite honestly. And let's. It wasn't the priority even because New Orleans went through a stretch where like, we as a country were like, are we going to get this city back? Because most of it is under sea level. And. And so how much are we going to lose of this city, you know? Or is education coming back? Is. Are the hospitals coming back? What's the infrastructure going to look like? Those were as. Just as. Are the Saints going to return? There was question of whether they were going to return. And so that happens in 05. That team, that season finishes their 3 and 13, and now they're relocating. In fact, the day I interview in New Orleans was their second day back in their home offices from San Antonio. And mind you, the home offices were taken over by FEMA and like the National Guard. And it was one of the search and rescue kind of like, you know, one of the locations they used to fly helicopters off the lawns. So there were a lot of things going on in the city that were. It was in recovery mode.
- [09:15]
A
Right. So let's talk about the first game. Back in the video, they played in midfield. You later said that that moment you thought was more important emotionally than winning the Super Bowl.
- [09:24]
B
Yeah.
- [09:24]
A
So what. What were you feeling when you see all these people?
- [09:27]
B
I made this comment, I think that 06 team, we had a long training camp because, you know, we went away for camp. There was nothing ready in New Orleans. I think we were seven weeks in. In Jackson, Mississippi. And then, of course, our train or our preseason games were on the road. And then our home preseason games were in Shreveport and Jackson. They were on the road. And then we opened the first two weeks of the season on the road because all of this waiting for the. There was a lot of damage done to the Superdome. So week one, we beat Cleveland. We had a really good win against Green Bay. And now we're coming home. We're going to have our first regular season home game. And this is going to, I think, be a national TV game. It is Monday Night Football. Oh, they brought in entertainment. Bono. There's really going to be almost like a rebirth celebration for the city that, you know, they're back. The. The Superdome is fixed. And my concern is the head coach is like, so there's a lot to this. Right? I mean, there's a lot of emotion to what we're discussing for this game. And yet it only, you know, none of these things are special if you don't win and so we'd not played a home game, so half the team hadn't taken their cars to the Superdome to get ready for a home game. And so, you know, we kind of go through. I take them there, in fact, the night before to play this video. I wanted them to get all this out of the way so that we could focus on football Sunday or Monday. So we had a practice there, turned the lights off, put the video board up, kind of recreated what was going to happen Monday night. And all of that was great. And so here it is, Monday night. Normally, guys are at the stadium coaches three and a half, four hours before the game. Breeze, like, clock worth. Four hours before the game. You have to be there two hours prior. That's the cut off. And so we're going through early warmups, early outs, and, man, Drew's still not there yet. You know, it's. He's got another 40 minutes. But it's unusual he's not there. We're now down to, like, 15 minutes, and he's going to be late. And we get. When he got caught in Traffic, you got U2, Green Day. You got all this going on. And this is. This is what concerned me. He got caught in traffic, and he's got this old Land Rover with, like, the grill on top, and he. We get the police out finally to escort him to the stadium. He pulls up into the parking garage and his truck gets stuck in the concrete barrier. Like, you can't make this up. Now I'm looking at my watch and I'm like, he's got eight minutes or I have to find him. And. But the problem isn't any of that. It's just that I know how. I know how. How he's so scheduled, and I know even though he's late, this is gonna. I'm like, man, I hope this doesn't affect him, because this means there's an hour and 50 minutes of stuff he normally does that he's not going to be able to do, like, you know, in other words, in his routine. And he le. He throws the keys. We were just talking about this the other day. Throws the keys in his car seat, says, help me park that. And it's. It's wedged. They're going to have to, like, take the air out of his tires, by the way. And he runs down the hallway, and here he comes, and. And I'm like, hey, it's good. You can make it. You know, this is like our first home game. He plays well. It's one of those games Steve Gleason blocks the punt. And early on, it was so. It was as loud of a stadium as you can ever remember, but there were tears with it, there was emotions with it. This is when I kind of referenced earlier, when you realized this was bigger than football, like that night. And anyone that was there that night would have said, wow, that. That was. It was hard for any of us to anticipate that's what it was going to be like. And it was like, you know, when it ended, you're like, holy cow. And then we had something. We're three zero. And, you know, we always talk about confidence. You can wish for it, you can think it, you could say, I'm confident. But it's only born out of demonstrated ability. And so we won week one, and I didn't know what kind of team we had. You know, I knew we'd be tough, but. And then we won week two, and then we won week three, and then pretty soon, well, it doesn't matter what we think we're going to be. This team thinks they're pretty good, right? And so we went on and went to the NFC Championship game. That's that first year, one game away from the Super Bowl. So in all those years, I would say that might not have been our best team, but in a bar fight, that team would have beaten any of them.
- [14:23]
A
Every athlete, every kid, man, woman, doesn't matter. Wants to win the championship, doesn't matter what they're doing. You play in the biggest, second, biggest, second most popular sport in the world. Soccer's first. But in the US football, football is king. You win the Super Bowl 2008, 2009, 30.
- [14:39]
B
Yeah.
- [14:39]
A
31 to 17 against the Colts. What was the feeling in that game? The exact feeling. If you can close your eyes and say, I know we're going to win. And then when you actually won, what. What did you say to yourself?
- [14:51]
B
I. I think this. You always start with, and what's the message to the team? And there's four things you can be in an event. You can be the favorite or the underdog, and then the other two things you can be is the better team or the worst team. So then if I give you those combinations, you can be the better team. That's the favorite. That happens a lot, right? And you can be the worst team in the underdog. That's two. You don't ever want to be the worst team in the favorite. That's three. But you really, as a coach, want to be the better team as the underdog. And I Told our players that and I said, I think we're the better team. And we're, you know, a seven and a half, eight point underdog. And so you, you, you, you create the message for the next. It's two weeks because you have that, that additional week. And so that's quite a bit of time. And it's a game where there's a lot more distractions, more tickets, family members, and a lot of these distractions are coming from within. So anyway, that was the message. It didn't start out well. In fact, it was fairly low scoring, it was sloppy game in the first half and then I think the second half was entirely different. And I know there was the onside kick but, but there was so much more execution by both teams. This became a higher scoring game. And then of course we get the turnover by Tracy Porter and that, you know, we needed that to, to secure a two score lead. And here's that moment where you're looking at the clock and there's call it 38 seconds and they have the ball, but they're down 14. And I remember thinking, God, it's Peyton Manning though. And I've seen him do some crazy things, you know, and so it took me a while to finally say, all right, you know, like, you know, we're wearing a mic for this whole thing. There's a six hour wire and you don't really get begin to enjoy it until like, you know for sure. And then they turn it over on downs. We have the ball, we take a knee and they don't use a timeout, in other words.
- [17:19]
A
Right.
- [17:19]
B
It begins to tick down I think at that moment and the Gatorade hits you and then it's kind of surreal.
- [17:26]
A
Well, what is it like? Surreal?
- [17:33]
B
It's, it's, it's everything, it's everything you work towards. You know, I'll tell you what it's like. You, you, the hardest thing about that game. Most teams or leagues will have that in the locker room. Our league puts it in the podium midfield. So you, you're never with your team again. You're not back in the locker room with them. You know, there's, there's sets over here, interviews, there's no closure with your team. There's no bring it up great job. You had it the week before the championship game. You don't have it in the Super Bowl. And so one by one we're getting on the buses, we're all showering and the buses are waiting. There's five buses, bus 1, 2, 3. And you ride the same bus you always ride. And. And all week long, when you're in that game, you get, like, this presidential police escort, and that just tells you how many vehicles. And the highway parts. And we're probably 26 minutes from the Intercontinental in Miami. We were in Miami, and the Colts were in Fort Lauderdale. And we're on bus one, and the bus driver's backing up, and he takes off, and we begin the trip down the highway. And I remember thinking to myself, I said, bussy. And he turned to me and I said, slow down. Because we knew once we got to that hotel that, you know, once our eyes closed that night, it's, you know, it's gonna. That you want it to last. And I said, just slow down a little bit. You're. You're for. They're all following you. And, yeah, it's that. It's that Shaw. Shawshank moment where you're, you know, you're having a Mick Ultra and you're on a bus, and you're just kind of. But there is a little bit of. And I say this because I remembered on the bus. It's. I remember turning to Vit saying, man, there's no more games to play. And you're a little bit like, God, I hate that it's over. Meaning you had a good run going. You like coaching this team, and this team has been magnificent. And you're like, I hate that it's over. And, like, there's that postpartum bit that's like, God, I wish I could play one more game next week. Or, you know, and so you want to just slow it down and enjoy it.
- [19:50]
A
What would your parents have said to you when you won that game?
- [19:55]
B
Well, I would have heard my mom at the stadium, so. And then my dad probably would have said something quietly like, great job. You know, But. But, yeah, I would have heard my mom. I don't care where we played. She was just loud, like. And she was unapologetic. You know, it was like, hey, I'm gonna. So now they were. My father wasn't. My mother was. Was alive. When we played in the super bowl down in Tampa when I was at the Giants, and, you know, we played the Ravens, they had a great defense. We don't score a touchdown on offense. We have one kick return, a lopsided super bowl game. And then. So when you're on the losing end of that game that you kind of get roped off and pushed into your locker room, and then finally back at the hotel, and it's only your Mother that could say great job tonight. And I'm like, what game are you watching? You know, but they would have been, yeah, they would have been proud because, you know, they were the ones in the carpool lines, they were the ones signing you up for Little League, you know, all of it. And you know, they were, they were shoot a part of the whole journey.
- [21:03]
A
You're a family guy. I'm a family guy. I was very lucky at a young age to make a bunch of money. So I was my own boss. You don't have that luxury when you coach a team. We talk about the demands of being a coach. Missed your sister's wedding. But talk about how hard it is to be a coach and then talk about why you stepped down after 15 years as a Saints coach.
- [21:25]
B
Yeah, I think the challenge is, is there, look, being a coach, being an NFL head coach and certainly a college head coach. And it's seasonal. What I mean by that, there's a six month period where there's not a lot of free time. So you do miss certain things. And then there's some things that you get to do though, you know, with your children that don't happen normally because.
- [21:53]
A
You'Re a rock star and everyone wants to hang with you.
- [21:55]
B
Yeah. But I mean, I think more importantly that, you know, like we made a big deal in New Orleans when we went there is win, lose or draw, after any home game, win, lose or draw, that we were going to have a touch football game on the field afterwards with all the players and coaches, kids like at the Superdome. So, you know, the game's over, you go clean up, you come back out and the kids are already out there with the, you know, and there's like somebody, an older kid's going to be the full time quarterback. And there's eight on this team, eight on this team. And the young kids, you'll win, lose or draw, they're just fired up to be out there playing. And I think you have to be more creative and create opportunities, you know, like Monday night family night for dinner. In season, it's an opportunity where the, you know, the young children come in, see their dad before the work week starts. So I think any career comes with, hey, here are some of the things that make this job difficult. But here's a cool thing about this job and I think that it's kind of one of these jobs, but certainly you're going to miss some events. Like there's going to be some things where you're on the phone saying, hey, I'm Proud of you and because of the schedule. But then there's going to be that moment where I got a picture of my son and my daughter and Connor's blowing a bubble and he's on the stage at the super bowl as like an 8, 9 year old boy and he's like, yeah, this is kind of what we do. This is what we do. So having him around or my daughter around, she's now in sports with FanDuel. My son just finished school at TCU. It probably shaped a little bit of how they chose their fields.
- [23:50]
A
Talk about what it takes to be successful. One of the things that made me successful is something I call extreme preparation. So if someone prepares for a podcast, one hour, I'm going 10, sometimes 15 or 20.
- [24:01]
B
No, no, I get it.
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A
How important is extreme preparation?
- [24:04]
B
Look, we have to be maniacal with the details. And someone says, why one in the morning? It's hard to explain the video, the game plan, but I think that term applies to what we do. Extreme preparation. And call it whatever you want, but I think that we have to be, we have to be good teachers. We can know it, but we've got to find a way for it to resonate with, with our team. And, and then I think just as importantly, we have to identify who we're looking for relative to putting together this culture as we build. You know, and if we're not paying attention to that, we can be fantastic with the details, we can out prepare our opponent. But if we don't have the right people in this team setting, then we're going to be tired and unsuccessful.
- [25:09]
A
A lot of people will say quarterbacks, the most important position on the field today. Top three quarterbacks average $52 million a year. Head coaches average $6.6 million a year. You were offered reportedly $100 million by the Mohammed Dolphins for four years. Didn't take it. You're rumored to be the highest or second highest paid coach in the league. Who's more important to winning, quarterbacks or coaches?
- [25:32]
B
Well, look, let's follow the money and say, look, you got to have the quarterback. But I think this, this one's easy for me because this is only until recently that we that like, even when a team like New England wins six Super Bowls, goes to nine, whatever that we got to dissect like the credit here. And the bottom line is you got a great quarterback, hall of Famer, you got first ballot, hall of Fame quarterback, head coach and ownership group. And all of it is important. And so, you know, a fantastic movie script and you got, you know, De Niro or one of these great directors. And if you're successful, enjoy it because you know how hard it is. But certainly the quarterback position touches the ball 70 times, 75 times a game. And I always like to say we all get on that plane and go right, and the starting quarterback goes up those steps and he goes left. So you have to have really, really good players, and you have to have good teachers. And so it's a team sport, and so it makes for good discussion relative to what's most important. But the key is what's necessary. And you have to have. You have to have that yin and yang, and that's what we're working on here.
- [27:13]
A
I finish every podcast with a game called Fill in the blank to excellence. One word answers are ready to play.
- [27:19]
B
Yeah, Here we go.
- [27:21]
A
My number one personal goal in life.
- [27:22]
B
Is, I would say, health and happiness.
- [27:25]
A
The biggest lesson I've learned in my life is.
- [27:30]
B
Patience. Yeah, patience.
- [27:33]
A
My number one personal goal is win.
- [27:36]
B
Another super bowl with a different. A different team.
- [27:39]
A
My biggest fear is getting old. If you are the commissioner of the league right now, the first thing I would do is.
- [27:50]
B
If I'm the commissioner of the NFL, the first thing I would do is I would begin to. They've already done a good job with player safety, but I would really begin to look closely at, like, what's on the horizon relative to our officiating challenges, because I think those guys do a great job. But it's becoming more and more complex.
- [28:10]
A
The Broncos don't win the super bowl this year. The team that I hope wins it is nobody. Not the Detroit Lions. You got Dan Campbell, former Saints.
- [28:21]
B
Sure. Fill in the blank.
- [28:23]
A
Okay. If you could. If you could go back in time and give your 21 year old self one piece of advice, what would it be?
- [28:32]
B
Yeah, that's a good one. Because I don't know if I gave my 21 year old self this piece of advice that I would have been then formed in such a way. In other words, I don't think we want the cheat code. But I'd certainly say let's not worry about the Anhills and focus more on the things that are more important. But I think there's something that happens when you do this that's necessary. So be careful sometimes of the cheat code.
- [29:02]
A
The one question you wish I had asked you but didn't is, I don't have one.
- [29:07]
B
It's been a good interview.
- [29:08]
A
Appreciate you being here. Thanks for taking your time. You're an awesome guy.
- [29:12]
B
Thank you.
- [29:13]
A
Good luck to you.
- [29:13]
B
Thank you.
- [29:14]
A
You guys kill it. Except against the Lions. No offense to you.
- [29:16]
B
Yeah, that's not my guy. Dan Campbell. And he's a stud. Yeah. Great guy. Thank you guys, for coming.
- [29:23]
A
Appreciate you.
- [29:23]
B
We'll see you.
- [29:24]
A
See you next week.