Surviving The Mexican D*ug Cartel

Summary

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Podcast Summary: Intentionally Disrupting

Episode: "Surviving The Mexican D*ug Cartel"

Host: Dr. Leslie Dobson
Guest: "Samantha" (pseudonym), ex-cartel member from Cabo, Mexico
Date: February 24, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode features Dr. Leslie Dobson in conversation with "Samantha," a former member of a major Mexican cartel. Through dark humor, raw honesty, and engaging storytelling, Dr. Leslie guides listeners through Samantha's journey—from a challenging childhood in poverty, to her recruitment into the cartel under threat of death, to a near-fatal assassination attempt, and ultimately her escape and present-day struggles. The episode sheds light on the everyday realities of cartel life, challenging popular American narratives about cartel violence, government corruption, and the blurred lines between survival and criminality.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Samantha’s Early Life & Recruitment (00:00 – 07:30)

• Childhood in Poverty (01:25):

  • Samantha started working in construction at age 12, making $150 a week for eight hours a day.
  • “She used to just be at home with her mom and just cleaning... Then she started working in construction.” (01:25, B)

• Accidental Entry into the Cartel (03:28):

  • She began selling drugs after finding a stash on the street; soon, cartel members confronted her.
  • “They took her and they put a gun in her head... they were going to kill her in that moment. And she said, just kill me because I have nothing to live for.” (03:28, B)

• No Choice but to Join (07:02):

  • Survival required her to work for the cartel or face death: “Yeah, it was work for them or kill or they will kill her.” (07:02, B)

2. Daily Life & Dangers in the Cartel (08:21 – 21:45)

• Operational Details (08:21):

  • She was given a phone and car, had to separate from her family for their safety, and required permission for any movement.
  • “You can't do anything without asking for permission.” (14:12, B)

• Violence & Paranoia (09:55):

  • Cartel rivalry explained: Much violence was internal—between cartels or aimed at thieves, not random tourists.
  • “It was more cartel against cartel and owning land.” (10:17, A)

• Harsh Control & Abuse (14:48):

  • Disobedience was punished by beatings.
  • “They would just punch her and... beat you up.” (14:51, B)

• Drug Use and Payment (16:07):

  • She earned up to $3,000/day, expected to hand in the majority to her boss.
  • Used “ice” (crystal meth), both to stay awake and as escapism, at first daily, now only occasionally.
  • “She had to be active 24 hours, 24/7... So she was using drugs to keep awake all day, every day.” (17:24, B)

3. The Assassination Attempt & Aftermath (21:47 – 36:52)

• Getting Shot Eight Times (26:49):

  • She was ambushed while on a delivery; managed to drive almost to the hospital before passing out.
  • “She got shot eight times, and she kept driving, trying to get to the hospital... two blocks before she got into the hospital, she faint.” (26:49, B)

• Cartel-Government Collusion (25:34):

  • Detailing how government transitions mean new cartel affiliations and violence against previous cartel employees.
  • “The government has their own cartels. People.” (25:37, B)

• Near-Death Experience (31:24):

  • Hospital staff thought she was dead until she woke up and instinctively lashed out, confused and traumatized.
  • “Then when the nurse came in to check on the body, she opened her eyes... she just started punching everybody.” (31:28, B)

• Exit from Cartel Life (33:53):

  • Used her injury as leverage to leave the cartel with the boss’s blessing, motivated by fear for her daughters.
  • “She told him that she wanted to quit... he said that it was okay for her to leave.” (33:53, B)

4. Cartel Dynamics; Truths & Myths (36:52 – 53:43)

• Hierarchy & Disposability (35:23):

  • Lower-level members like Samantha suffer the most in cartel wars, rarely meeting top bosses.
  • “All the employees are the ones that lose in the fight up with the cartels.” (35:23, B)

• Cartel vs. American Gangs (57:00):

  • Cultural comparison: American gangs respect their workers more; Mexican cartels are ruthless.
  • “In America, they respect a little more their workers. And here is like, no, kill her. Kill her.” (57:00, B)

• Public Safety & Advice to Tourists (40:18, 41:24):

  • Americans are generally safe in Cabo—even drug buyers—as long as they stay out of internal disputes.
  • “Yeah, they're safe. We need them. As long as you don't get in trouble and just buy the drugs....” (40:18, B)
  • The main access point for Americans to buy drugs is via taxi drivers at the airport.

• Government-Cartel Symbiosis (54:05, 55:08):

  • The lines between state and cartel are blurred: “The same government is the cartel... The government money comes from the cartel, and the cartel makes money because the government opens the door for them.” (54:05, 55:08, B)

5. Life After the Cartel & Personal Reflections (37:17 – End)

• Life, Regret, and Hope (44:43, 49:20):

  • Now working odd jobs, Samantha expresses happiness for her new freedom and wants to help others, especially disabled women.
  • “She likes to help handicapped people, especially women...” (49:42, B)

• Motherhood & Breaking the Cycle (45:19, 61:09):

  • Open with her daughters about her past, stressing education and distancing them from cartel life.
  • “She wants her daughter to get educated and not to be in the same path that she took.” (59:55, B)

• Physical and Mental Recovery (57:48, 59:00):

  • Ongoing pain from gunshot wounds but a sense of luck and survival: “Do you feel lucky to be alive?” — “A lot. Yeah, she really do.”* (59:00, A/B)

• Broader Social Reflection (59:55):

  • Disillusioned with widespread violence and lack of community compassion in Mexico and beyond.

• Advice to Others (39:11, 52:43):

  • Warns listeners: aligning with the cartel is dangerous, but those who “do right by them” are typically left alone.
  • “It's not as bad as it looks, but only if you do the things right and not to try to mess with the cartel.” (52:43, B)

• Visions for the Future (49:20, 59:04):

  • Dream of helping others, lamenting the challenges in finding legitimate work, and wishing for a better future for her daughters.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Dr. Leslie’s Sarcastic Take on American News:

  • “Oh, well, fuck them. So it didn’t feel like you had a choice.” (06:44, A)
  • Commentary on U.S. media’s portrayal of Mexican violence: “Our news made it seem like Americans would be killed if they came.” (09:28, A)

• On the Perpetual Cycle:

  • “She can’t see Mexico without cartel because. Without government, they don’t have drugs, and without drugs, no government. So it's... they're together.” (54:29, B)

• On Surviving Violence:

  • “She got shot eight times, and she kept driving, trying to get to the hospital...” (26:49, B)
  • “When the nurse came in to check on the body, she opened her eyes...” (31:24, B)

• On Compassion:

  • “She doesn't like violence and injustice and she feels that right now there is a lot of violence for women. So she likes to help with that.” (50:53, B)

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Timeline of Important Segments

| Timestamp | Topic/Segment | |:---------:|:---------------------------------------------------------------------| | 00:00 | Dr. Leslie introduces Samantha and outlines the episode’s unique access | | 01:25 | Samantha describes her early work and poverty, starting at age 12 | | 03:28 | The story of her accidental recruitment and forced involvement | | 06:44 | Revelations of betrayal and survival under threat | | 08:21 | The operational structure of cartel life | | 14:12 | The total control the cartel exerts over even the smallest aspects of life | | 17:24 | High earnings, constant danger, and reliance on drugs | | 21:47 | Samantha’s account of the assassination attempt | | 25:34 | Explanation of Mexican government-cartel collusion and frequent power struggles | | 26:49 | Her escape to the hospital after being shot eight times | | 31:24 | Hospital staff believe she's dead; revival and trauma | | 33:53 | Leaving the cartel after the shooting | | 35:23 | Hierarchies and disposability within the cartel | | 40:18 | Americans’ safety and tourist perceptions | | 41:24 | Americans’ drug access in Cabo explained | | 52:43 | Advice for dealing with the cartel: keep your head low | | 54:05 | Cartel-government fusion | | 57:00 | Cultural contrast: Mexican cartels vs. U.S. gangs | | 59:00 | Samantha’s feelings of luck and hopes for her daughters |

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Final Reflections

This episode is a powerful, gritty, and often darkly humorous window into the life of someone trapped between poverty, survival, and the shadows of organized crime. Dr. Leslie’s brash American perspective collides with Samantha’s hard-won pragmatism, illuminating the reality that, for many in Mexico, “the government is the cartel—and the cartel is the government.” Samantha’s survival is proof of both extraordinary resilience and the inescapable complexities of Mexico’s war on drugs, family, and hope.

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Transcript

[A]

I have the unique opportunity of speaking with an ex cartel member today. I came out to Cabo to speak with her and I'm very excited to share her story. But I'm also very excited to share the story of the cartel with Americans because I feel like we have a lot of information that is just simply not true. I am very honored and lucky to be able to speak with her today because she survived being shot many times in an attempted murder when people around her, her friends, were actually killed. So we're going to jump over to the name which we picked, which is Samantha. And we have a friend of mine interpreting because Samantha only speaks Spanish and I only speak English. So we're going to jump right into some hard hitting questions. Thank you for being here. So can you tell me a little bit about your life before the cartel?

[B]

She used to just be at home with her mom and just cleaning, helping, helping, cleaning her mom the house and do chores. And then she started working in construction. Okay, okay.

[A]

And what did you do in construction, Vikas?

[B]

As a noble, She will do the mix of the concrete and to put the rocks in the walls.

[A]

Okay, and how much did they pay you? What was your money?

[B]

She will get 2,500 pesos. That is like $150.

[A]

$150 a week. A week.

[B]

Okay. For eight hours a day.

[A]

Eight hours a day. $150. Wow. How old were you when you.

[B]

12.

[A]

Wow. Okay. And so how. How old were you when you started to work for the cartel?

[B]

20. Okay.

[A]

Can you tell me a little bit about how, how it started, how you became involved?

[B]

So she used to like walk around and party around, and one time she found a block of drug taped with bronze tape and she opened it and she started selling that because she knew it was drug. And then one time the police pick her up. So the, the people from the cartel pick her up. When? After she found the. The drugs and they took her and they put a gun in her head and she used to use a lot of drugs back then and she was kind of like a crazy lady. No. And they were going to kill her in that moment. And she said, just kill me because I have nothing to live for. So they took the gun down and kind of like offered her a job to start shelling trucks.

[A]

But why did you feel like you had nothing to live for?

[B]

Like they were going to kill her? Like, she thought that it was easier just to let them know that she didn't care because they already had like the gun ready to kill her. So she's like, what? Just do it. But she was dropped, I think. Ice. She used to do ice.

[A]

What's ice?

[B]

No, She was doing this. They call it ice and they put it in a pipe and fire it and then they smoke it.

[A]

Like crystal methamphetamine?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay. But more pure.

[B]

Yeah, more pure, yeah.

[A]

Okay. So you knew that they had so much power that they were going to kill you.

[B]

So she didn't know that her close friends were involved also in the cartel. And they went to tell the hire people that she was stealing the drugs and selling them. Oh, so they told on her. So that's why she thought that they were going to kill her.

[A]

Oh, well, fuck them. So it didn't feel like you had a choice.

[B]

Yeah, it was work for them or kill or they will kill her. And they took her to like far, far away. Nobody was around and they were going to kill her.

[A]

Is that what I read about called the torture zones or the torture areas? Yeah. That's terrifying. Can you tell me more about the torture areas or what we call them?

[B]

She doesn't know that much. She never do any torture things. She only was selling the drugs.

[A]

And then do they. They then tell you your job and your assignment, what happens after?

[B]

So they gave her a phone, they gave her a car, and in the phone was all the contacts that she was supposed to deliver the drugs to. And so she took herself out of her family circle and she got out of the house. So she didn't put her daughters in danger.

[A]

You have daughters?

[B]

Two daughters. Oh, night receive nidos 13 and 4 and 12 now. Yeah. How old they were? So she started when? Six years ago. There was this rival thing in Cabo between two cartels. And that's when she started working with them when everybody was the cartel were fighting to each other. And we had a lot of shooting around and a lot of dead people.

[A]

Well, I remember in America it was all over our news saying, don't go to Cabo, you'll be killed.

[B]

So in Cabo we have two cartels, the San Lucas and the San Jose. So the San Jose start selling drugs in San Lucas. So they didn't like it, so that's why it started shooting everywhere. But it was just between them. Probably a lot of people got in the middle, but it was just between them.

[A]

Okay. So yeah, I mean, our news made it seem like Americans would be killed if they came. But it was more cartel against cartel and owning land.

[B]

Yeah, It was only in the cartel and there were a lot of people around that they Would start stealing drugs from the cartel. So that's where the people that they were shooting at too.

[A]

What you were doing was really dangerous. So what kept you in it?

[B]

They were threatening her that if she leaves, they will kill her. So she just kept going until. You want to go through the shooting. And she last two years after they shot her.

[A]

Oh, you stayed even after?

[B]

No. Okay, okay. So. So she lasts two years working for them until they shot her for seven times.

[A]

Can you tell me about it? Maybe. Maybe in, like, shorter sentences and then we can translate and hear the story.

[B]

She's talking about the shooting six years ago that they killed one American in Palmilla in one of the nicest neighborhoods in Cabo. And that's why she thinks that Americans didn't want to come back to Cabo because they shot. The only news that went through was the one that the American was killed in Palmia. Pero lo que quiera que nos platiques. Okay, Okay. So she remembers that one day she had her daughter really sick. She was dehydrated and with really high fever, and she had to ask her boss to go out and take her to the hospital.

[A]

Her boss, like,

[B]

For her to sell the drugs. She has a boss, and she had to ask him to go out and to take her daughter to the hospital.

[A]

Oh, so they controlled everything? Everything you did?

[B]

Yeah, she has to whatever. To go to the market, to go to everything. You can't do anything without asking for permission.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

So you live in Vivas and Casa Conos. You must be in rent. Okay. So she lives by herself, but she has to ask about, like, if she goes anywhere, she has to ask for permission.

[A]

What would happen if you didn't ask?

[B]

Yeah, they will go and look for

[A]

her

[B]

and they will beat her. They would just punch her and they

[A]

would beat you up. If you didn't tell them, they would beat you up. But so are they. It controls your life. They're watching you all the time.

[B]

And they have to be very careful with all the people that they have for selling the drugs, because some of them, they're drug addicts. And they. If has one ounce, they will take a little bit and a little bit of each bag and sell it extra. So they have to be very on what every sale person is doing.

[A]

Wow. How was the money?

[B]

For everything that she will sell, she has to give to her boss 80,000 pesos a day. So it's like 80,000 pesos, $44,000 a

[A]

day, and you give to your boss, and.

[B]

So they will give her the drugs and she will. She can sell them as much as they want. As much as she want? She had to give the 80,000 pesos to her boss, and she will keep, like, 15,000 pesos for herself a day. So it's like $3,000.

[A]

$3,000 a day? Yeah. That's a lot of money versus $150. Were you using the drugs, too?

[B]

She had to be active 24 hours, 24, seven, because she didn't have someone to do the job with her. So she had to have. Well, she was using drugs to keep awake all day, every day.

[A]

So are the drugs given to you as part of what you sell, or do you take them from what you're supposed to sell?

[B]

Okay, they will give her 12, like, six package, seven packages of whatever drug they will give her to sell, and she has to sell five for to give back the money to her boss. And the other two, she will keep them for her use.

[A]

Oh, so it's like a tip.

[B]

So she will sell those to and consume part of it and then for her to have money.

[A]

I've never done crystal methamphetamine. What does it feel like? What did it do to you?

[B]

She will feel relaxed, not to feel anything, not to get sleepy.

[A]

How long does it last?

[B]

No. So it depends on how you consume the drug. It can be in a pipe, it can be in a light bulb, or it can be in a spoon. So it depends on how you consume the drug, is the effects that she gets. But she's been using that for a long time, so she has to do different types of consuming for her to have the different reactions. The only thing she was using it is to stay awake. Okay.

[A]

Do you still use it now? How often?

[B]

And she used to do it every day. Not. Not anymore. And once or twice a week. Yeah, it depends on the money.

[A]

Does it. Does it help your emotions?

[B]

Yeah, it helps for her to control her emotions because.

[A]

Do you have trauma and anxiety from.

[B]

No, she likes it because she can not take in it anytime she wants. Oh, so she just. Just do it when it's not a. It's not a need. It's more of a reward. Yeah.

[A]

Okay, we're gonna take a quick break, and we'll be right back. So can you talk about getting shot? Like, what was that like to actually

[B]

be shot by a guy? Quesiente. At the moment, she didn't feel anything, but, like, minutes later, she started feeling warm. Her entire body.

[A]

So what was. Yeah, what was happening? You were just. You were standing in a group of people and you were shot.

[B]

So she went to take her daughter to the doctor. So she told her mom that she was going to get a doctor for her daughter and drink water.

[A]

Drink water.

[B]

Yeah. Okay.

[A]

We can be human, be normal.

[B]

I know.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

And as soon as she jumped in the car, she felt that something bad was going to happen. Oh. And as soon as she passed the convenience store by her house, she saw everybody that they were waiting for her, it was directly to her, like they were going to kill her.

[A]

So the day that your boss took. Took your daughter to the doctors was the same day it happened.

[B]

So she was going to deliver some drugs and she was going to go back to get her daughter. And as soon as she saw the store, she saw the people waiting for her. And. So they. She saw the people, and as soon as they saw her, they start shooting at her car. Why. They sold the cartel. It's hard for me to understand this a little bit, but I'll ask her if I have a doubt. What she's saying is the Jose Pan El Govierno. Okay. So in Mexico, we have different types of government. When the elections won. Here in Cabo, we have a one named Pan P A N. And they bought the cartels. So they kind of, like, put their new cartels like their own cartels in Cabo.

[A]

They bought the cartels? The government bought the cartels?

[B]

Yeah, that's how it works. Like, okay, the. The government has their own cartels. People.

[A]

Would that be like. Like Elon Musk buying the cartel because he was loved by Trump right now

[B]

more than Elon Musk, it will be like Trump buying the cartels because now he's going to be the president. Okay. Not that he's buying the cartel. He brings.

[A]

So the government came in and said, the cartels are here no matter what. I want to control them.

[B]

No, no, no. I am going to bring my own people from the cartel.

[A]

My own people.

[B]

My people. Because now I am ruling. I'm government. I am the government in Cabo now. I'm bringing my cartel so the cartel from the other government and start killing their employees because they don't need them anymore.

[A]

It's that. It's that heartless.

[B]

Yeah, it's like when. When somebody buys a company, you have to. You deal with them or you fire them. So in a cartel, you fire the new people.

[A]

So if you were to buy, like, the Ford company, you just are going to kill all the employees because you want to change it to Chevy.

[B]

Exactly. Yes. Anton says. So she got shot in eight times, and she Kept driving, trying to get to the hospital, but two blocks before, and she was covered in blood, and her car was covered in blood. And two blocks before she got into the hospital, she faint because she was very injured. Okay. So two blocks before shipping, and that's when the police arrived to her and brought an ambulance and they took her to the hospital.

[A]

My God, you're so tough to drive that far. After how, how long, how many minutes do you think were you driving after you had been shot?

[B]

And she was close to the hospital, but not close because they blocked some streets so she had to go around.

[A]

And when this happened, you were with other people who got killed.

[B]

They will never let her get anyone in her car because the car belonged to the cartel. Oh, so she was the only one who drive and the only person that got shot was her. Nobody else got injured.

[A]

Oh, okay. And you were. And it happened while you were inside the car?

[B]

Yeah. She always have to be by herself because if she's in the car with somebody else and the police gets her, her boss is not going to do anything for the other person. They will save her, but the other person is gone. They will put her in. Put her, Put the person in jail or kill them or whatever they don't respond for. So that's why she wasn't allowed to bring anyone in the car. So.

[A]

Because they own the car.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

What was it like when you saw them and knew that they were there to kill you?

[B]

She was. She felt like her world just collapsed because she was told that they were going to keep her alive because they needed her and they were going to protect her. So when she noticed that they were there to kill her, her world just collapsed. She felt.

[A]

That's fucking insane. So how long were you in the hospital?

[B]

A little more than a month.

[A]

And what happened after.

[B]

They thought that she was dead, so. And. So the ambulance thought that everybody thought that she was dead. So they took her to La Paz, to the hospital, and they just put her in a room thinking that she was dead. And then when the nurse came in to check on the body, she opened her eyes and that's when they connected her again to the machines. And she was quantum. And she was in coma for a week after they thought she was dead. So when she woke up, she saw all these people around her and she just started popping, punching everybody. Because the last memory she had in her head was that they were there to kill her.

[A]

Just the nurses and doctors?

[B]

Yeah. She thought that whoever was going to kill her.

[A]

Are you. Are you a good fighter? Have you trained. Are you trained in fighting?

[B]

No, but she can hit a man. She has got into fights with men, so she's tough. Well, in that business you have to.

[A]

So wait, so was that. Did you quit after that? Did they.

[B]

So she talked to her boss and she told him that she wanted to quit because she was already in a lot of danger and she didn't want to risk her daughters more than she already did. So he said that it was okay for him for her to leave the. The job. And she just wanted to know how much money she owed him because of everything about the doctors. And. And he said nothing. It's okay. We are. Because of the shooting. That's why it was easier for her to get out of it.

[A]

But who. It wasn't your boss who wanted to kill you. Oh, did they want to kill your boss too?

[B]

And they always want to kill the higher level of. But all the employees are the one that loses in the fight up with

[A]

the cartels because they can access you where.

[B]

So they want to kill her boss and the boss of her boss of her boss of her boss. And the lower rank are the ones who get shot before they get to their bosses.

[A]

Well, that's shitty. That's just how it works. You just start.

[B]

She didn't. She never met her boss. So she had someone to deliver just the product. Oh, but she will talk to him by phone, so whatever she needed from him. Yeah, he wasn't here probably. He lives in California.

[A]

Does he live near me?

[B]

Maybe he's your neighbor.

[A]

So, I mean, are you okay now?

[B]

Yeah. She got out of it safe and sound, like she's okay. She doesn't seem to be in danger anymore.

[A]

Yeah. Why did you want to leave?

[B]

She risked her family and her daughters a lot. So she just wanted. Because she never had a life, she always had to be to take care of the phone and pick up all the calls and to deliver whatever they said. And so she needed a break. And after the shooting, she felt that was about time.

[A]

I think that was a good idea.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

So how is your life now?

[B]

So now she tries to get a job. She had a job after that, after the shooting, doing events like putting all the tables and stuff.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

But now the company she used to work, it's bankrupt. So they close. And now what she does is whatever job somebody asks her to do, she will do it like cleaning a piece of land or doing wood locks. Wood locks on little jobs like that.

[A]

So if you could. If you could give a message to people if they are approached by cartel. What would you tell them to do?

[B]

She can get in contact with the cartel sometimes just to. Because she has a client that needs something. So she will put it in contact with the Coachell, but that's about it.

[A]

We'll be right back after this break. Would you say that Americans are safe coming to Cabo? Even if Americans are buying drugs from cartel here? A Cabo,

[B]

Yeah, they're safe. We need them. Yeah. As long as you don't get in trouble and just buying the drugs. They don't. They won't do anything to them.

[A]

Are the drugs safe? I mean, I know. I know drugs are not safe, but.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

No, but some they don't want to kill. Yeah. Like how many do they want to.

[B]

Yeah, she said that they're good. Okay.

[A]

So there isn't a big plant.

[B]

It also depends on your consume. Like, if American gets crazy and do more than they should, they're going to die, but not because the cartel wants them to die.

[A]

So how does an American know what drugs to buy and from who? When they're here?

[B]

They only smoke weed. The Americans, I think Americans, the only thing they want to come here is to get weed.

[A]

Oh, so if they're. If someone wants to sell them.

[B]

Crystal method. Oh, the people from the airport, the ones that they do transportation, those are the ones who sell the drugs to the Americans that they get here. Like, if you arrive to Cabo in the airport, you take a taxi and the taxi is going to. Oh, you want this? They are the main contact to get trucks in Cabo.

[A]

Okay. So if the cartel asked you to come back and work for them, would you?

[B]

No, not anymore.

[A]

No. Do they try?

[B]

So after the shooting, he moved to Mexico City and was there for two months and then went to Guerrero and stayed there for. So she left over here. And during that year, they asked her to come back and she said no. And now that she's back, they've been asking her to come back, but she kept saying no.

[A]

Is it hard to say no?

[B]

It's not hard to say no. And they can make her. They respect that part.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay. So what's life like now? What, What. What do you do now? Are you with your children and family? And.

[B]

Her family was upset with her about she joining the cartel. But they tried to help as much as they can because we're Mexican. And they are happy now that she's not there anymore.

[A]

Are you happy now?

[B]

Yeah, because she has her own life now.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I asked her if she missed the money, and she said that not that much because she's been always good on finding jobs and take care of her and her family. Why not? She's always looking for a way to make money. Oh yeah, but not easy money. Please.

[A]

Do you ever worry about your children joining the cartel or them asking her?

[B]

Them? So she talks to them, try to explain a little bit, but they don't go out that much, so. So they just go to school, to the playground and that's it. So people around her daughters, they told their daughters about what she was doing and they started asking her questions and she had to start to explain to them little by little. But yeah, she told them the truth.

[A]

How long are you going to keep doing the drugs? Do you want to stop?

[B]

So she stopped consuming drugs and then when she lost her job, she got depressed and she started using them again. But she got sad because she was able to leave them on her own and now she's back. So if she wants, she will quit anytime she wants until she wants.

[A]

There are other things than drugs. Do you feel like you can access good health care here and like therapy and crescape?

[B]

She can do it on her own. She has a good conviction. Whenever she wants she will stop consuming. But she doesn't want.

[A]

I can understand.

[B]

It's her joy right now. It's too. It's too. She consumed to have energy. So it's not that it makes her happy or sad or anything, it's just for her to have energy.

[A]

But what about coffee?

[B]

She also smokes cigarettes. So she takes a into the woods and get wood for. So it's a hard job for her to sell the. The wood locks. Okay. She needs energy more than coffee.

[A]

So what do you want to do in the future? What do you want to do for life and with your kids?

[B]

She wants to make a lot of money to help people. She likes to help people.

[A]

Oh, doing what?

[B]

She has money. She likes to help handicapped people, like especially women. So she likes to have a lot of money too. And when she has a lot of money, she helps a lot of disabled women. She needs a job and she's looking for a job to make more money so she can help more. And she's not happy about not finding a job like that.

[A]

What is it about helping disabled women that makes you happy?

[B]

She doesn't like violence and injustice and she feels that right now there is a lot of violence for women. So she doesn't like it. So that's why she likes to help with that.

[A]

Did you have to be violent when you were working in the cartel?

[B]

No, she was never violent. She was very. It was very easy. She was humble. And if somebody asked for a favor, she will help.

[A]

That's so wild that there's. There's a good. It feels like there's good in it, but also there's. They will kill you in a second.

[B]

It's an experience that you have to live once in a lifetime.

[A]

Is there. Can you tell people who don't understand the cartel, can you give them a message about what we hear is not real? Like the truth behind it?

[B]

So it's not as bad as it looks, but only if you do the things right and not to try to mess with the cartel. Like, if you do right with them, they will do right with you, but if you mess with them, they will kill you.

[A]

Do you. At the end of the day, do you think the cartels are good for Mexico or bad?

[B]

How things are right now, she doesn't know if they are good or not

[A]

because there are changes with the government or.

[B]

The government has changed a lot, and they don't want to make deals with the cartels anymore. So it's been harder.

[A]

So if the government was making more deals, you would be more in favor of the cartels and they would be helpful?

[B]

Yeah. The same government is the cartel. Yeah. All the cartel people are

[A]

the government is the cartel.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

What would Mexico be like without the cartel?

[B]

No, She doesn't know. She doesn't. She can't see Mexico without cartel because. Without government, they don't have a drugs, and without no drugs, no government. So it's. They're together. They come together.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

The government money comes from the cartel, and the cartel makes money because the government opens the door for them. So it comes together.

[A]

Wow. Does the cartel make fun of American gangs? Do they think they're wimps?

[B]

Los carteles de Mexico, Piensanque Los Angeles. Las las Pandillas Americanas on Maricas. No, no. Really?

[A]

I've heard before that they.

[B]

Haven't heard that.

[A]

Oh, how funny. Yeah. I mean, maybe it's just that the cartel. No, I. I've known other Mexican cartel who. It's just it's such a strong family, and it's so much bigger and they're. They are so much more. It's so easy for them to kill and make decisions when in gangs, it's harder to.

[B]

She thinks that it works different in America than in Mexico because in America, they respect a little more their workers. And here is like, no, kill her. Kill her. Yeah. So maybe that's why we have we're not wimps.

[A]

Okay. Did you just crack your neck? Does it feel good? And her neck. See, how is your. How is your physical health after being shot eight times?

[B]

She has her. Her shoulder is not in the right place, but that's the only thing she has. So he's not in their place. So in the winter it col. She had two wood gunshots in her shoulder.

[A]

Oh, yeah, you have holes in your body. Wow. So she, she's pointing to parts of her head that were shot and her neck and her shoulder.

[B]

One in her lungs, one, two in her shoulders. One went through her neck and went through the other cheek, one in the next to her eye.

[A]

Wow. Do you feel lucky to be alive.

[B]

A lot? Yeah. Yeah, she really do.

[A]

Yeah, I feel. I feel you're lucky. Yeah. Okay. What do you hope happens next in life for the future of your family, your kids, Mexico?

[B]

She has no hope that much right now because she feels that there's a lot of violence in this world and nobody's humble, nobody takes care of anybody. And she's a little scared about that. And she thinks that that's why this here in Mexico and everywhere, that's the problem, that violence and people not caring, it's not good. She wants her daughter to get educated and not to be in the same path that she took.

[A]

Where do you want them to be?

[B]

One wants to be a chef and the other one wants to be in fashion. She does a lot of. She says that her daughter looks like you. Oh.

[A]

Oh. And she's gonna be in fashion.

[B]

Okay. She likes to make clothes and cut her T shirts and stuff to make them better.

[A]

Does she sell them?

[B]

Las vende? Oh, she makes for her dolls.

[A]

Oh, she could sell that. Do you have. Do you have Etsy? Do you have Etsy, the website in Mexico where you can make things and you put them online and sell them?

[B]

That would be nice. She's going to tell her daughter.

[A]

Okay. I mean, we'll. I will. I will never tell anyone who you are or what you look like, but maybe we can somehow help promote her. Her clothing company. We'll find a way.

[B]

We'll look for it.