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As Michael Oren and I quipped during this conversation, the book that propelled him to international fame was his New York Times bestselling work on the Six Day War, Six Days of War: June 1967 and the Making of the Modern Middle East. The book remains the finest treatment of that period in Israel’s history, a masterful account of a war that changed everything.

But everything is changing once again, and that subtitle, “the Making of the Modern Middle East” may need updating. For the Middle East that emerges from the war we are currently fighting will look nothing like the Middle East that emerged in 1967. What was once “modern” is now ancient.

What hasn’t changed is Ambassador Oren’s insightful analysis of this region, his keen assessment of both American and Israeli politics, and his deep understanding of both diplomacy and war. Michael and I chatted yesterday to get his sense of why this war is both justified and necessary, what Israel hopes will emerge from it, what could go wrong, how long President Trump is likely to stick with it—and much more.

WARNING: As we were recording, the air raid sirens went off more than once. We didn’t edit them all out, as the “interruption” gives a tiny sense of what life here is like these days. Israelis listening to the recording should recall that the siren is recorded, not live, but should be alert for sirens that are not part of the recording. Those outside Israel should be aware that there are sirens in the audio.

If you would like to share our conversation about what Israelis are feeling and expressing at this unprecedented moment in our history, we invite you to subscribe today.

Michael Oren served in the IDF as a Lone Soldier in the paratroopers. He was Israel’s ambassador to the United States from 2009 to 2013 and later served as a Member of Knesset and Deputy Minister of Diplomacy.

He is the author of several New York Times bestsellers including Six Days of War, Ally: My Journey Across the American-Israel Divide, and Power, Faith, and Fantasy. Ambassador Oren published 2048: The Rejuvenated State in 2023 and is the founder of Israel Advocacy Group.

His most recent writing can be found on his Substack, Clarity with Michael Oren.

The link at the top of this posting will take free subscribers to an excerpted portion of today’s conversation.

For paid subscribers, the link at the top will take you to the full conversation; below, paid subscribers will also find a transcript for those who prefer to read, as always.

Michael Oren: "The devil we don't know is better than the devil we did know."