DL Demon Queens of MAGA

Summary

Podcast Summary: I've Had It – "DL Demon Queens of MAGA"

Hosts: Jennifer Welch, Angie “Pumps” Sullivan (absent), special guest host Kylie
Guest: Tommy Vietor, co-host of Pod Save America
Date: October 30, 2025

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Episode Overview

This spirited and irreverent installment of I've Had It treats listeners to a candid, unfiltered discussion focused on political hypocrisy, the failures of Democratic messaging, and a deep dive into MAGA culture and its impact on American politics. With iconic guest Tommy Vietor joining Jennifer and Kylie (filling in for Angie), the group skewers the self-importance of modern political actors—from birthday-obsessed friends to the so-called "DL demon queens" of the right (closeted conservatives lashing out at others). The conversation is laced with personal anecdotes, biting humor, and sharp political insights, all delivered in the show’s signature tell-it-like-it-is style.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Opening Banter, Birthdays, and Hypocrisy

[02:12–07:46]

• Birthday fatigue: Kylie vents about the pressure to keep up with friends’ birthdays and the pettiness of keeping “Excel sheets” to track who fails to reciprocate.
  • Kylie: "I've had it with everybody having birthdays...I just am over it. I don't remember anyone's birthday. I send 60 emails a day and then I'm done talking to people." [02:28]
• Social tit-for-tat: Conversation on "Unfollow" apps and reciprocal birthday wishes, exposing petty social scorekeeping.
• Hypocrisy check: Kylie admits holding double standards about birthdays; hosts reflect on their own hypocritical tendencies in life and politics.

2. Annoyances of Public Life

[07:48–10:18]

• Walking etiquette and city living: Jennifer rails against slow or inconsiderate sidewalk walkers in NYC.
• Wild NYC story: Jennifer’s harrowing—and darkly comic—brush with a public masturbator.
  • Jennifer: "I've still got it," cracks Jennifer about being the unintentional “object" of the incident.
  • Kylie: "What if he had looked at you and it killed his boner? Like, I would think about that forever." [09:53]

3. Listener Reviews—Cultural Approval and Podcast as Political Litmus Test

[11:07–14:08]

• Listener praise: The hosts read two standout reviews, celebrating their podcast’s reputation as a “safe space” for allies and political honesty.
• "Cookout" approval: The show is publicly invited to the symbolic Black cookout for being authentic allies—on the condition they leave "potato salad with raisins" at home.
• Pod as test: Kylie relates how revealing podcast fandom in public doubles as a way to "find safe people" in a contentious political climate.

4. Guest Introduction: Tommy Vietor Joins

[18:22–19:15]

• Jennifer welcomes Tommy, with humorous banter about missing Crooked Con due to parental obligations and sharing mutual fan appreciation.
• Tommy: "You're a good mom. We'll miss you. It would have been very fun...hopefully we'll do it again." [19:20]

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Deep-Dive: MAGA Culture, Repression & Political Cowardice

5. "DL Demon Queens" of MAGA & Grievance Politics

[19:37–24:46]

• Tommy’s ‘Had It’: In a fiery opener, Tommy is exasperated by MAGA’s mainstreaming, the normalization of "losers" outflanking democracy, and figures like Stephen Miller, Don & Eric Trump.
  • Tommy: "I've had it with getting beaten by the biggest losers on the planet...I'm so tired of these losers beating us." [19:37]
• Jennifer’s theory: Satirical riff on the existence of “DL demon queens” (deeply repressed, closeted, often self-hating gays in the MAGA/right wing operating with venom due to internalized shame).
  • Jennifer: "They browbeat everybody all day long and then they get on Grindr at night and they go to gay stuff and they wake up..." [21:03]
• On the Trump family’s grift: The group skewers the normalization of blatant corruption and media’s failure to headline daily outrages.

6. Democrat Messaging—Missed Opportunities & the MAGA Void

[24:46–29:36]

• Peter Thiel as Antichrist thought-leader: Lampooning Thiel's strange reinvention—from "gay tech bible-thumper" to anti-democracy proselytizer.
• Democrats playing too “nice”: Jennifer and Tommy argue that Democrats’ reluctance for blunt, populist attacks leaves an opening for grifters and bad-faith actors.
  • Jennifer: "I wish Democrats would grow up here and just start saying shit like...you're going to let some guy that was born in Germany, raised in South Africa...decide we shouldn't have democracy..." [24:47]
• Marjorie Taylor Greene’s cunning: Despite being an "anti-Semite and grifter," she’s outmaneuvering Dems in social media and filling a void with right-wing messaging.

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7. U.S. Foreign Policy, the Israel-Gaza Debate & Democratic Credibility Gaps

[29:39–41:40]

Cory Booker Episode Postmortem

• Tommy’s critique: Frustrated by Senator Cory Booker’s evasions on Gaza/Israel and his reliance on deflection (“whataboutism” on Sudan, Yemen).
  • Tommy: "What the US does for Israel is just an entirely different category. And to suggest otherwise, I think is dishonest." [31:17]
• AIPAC’s influence: Jennifer notes both parties, especially establishment Dems, are beholden to AIPAC, and that AIPAC spent huge to elect Trump—a bipartisan accountability vacuum.
• Heartbreak over Democratic cowardice: Both Jennifer and Tommy articulate deep disappointment that mainstream Democrats refuse to straightforwardly acknowledge war crimes or stand up against right-wing talking points, fearing donor backlash.
  • Jennifer: "My heartache with Cory Booker was, was real... politicians like Cory Booker or Hakeem Jeffries or Nancy Pelosi were like, for me, okay, good, somebody gets it. Somebody's fighting for me. And then...this is a 911..." [38:04]

Reflecting Voter Priorities

• Jennifer underscores how living in red states means survival is often about civil rights at home, not foreign policy.
• Both hosts defend voting blue no matter what ("I would claw through 10 ft of concrete...to go vote for one of them over a MAGA Republican" [35:40]) while also demanding higher standards.

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8. Democratic Party Messaging, Leadership, & 2028 Hopes

[41:40–56:07]

• Accountability & credibility: The failure of Democrats like Cory Booker and Chuck Schumer to endorse progressive candidates, and their bland public profiles, is highlighted as a symptom of party malaise.
• Leadership vacuum: Tommy and Jennifer bemoan the absence of national Dems with spine or clear, punchy messaging. Age and old-school politics are blamed for stuck-in-the-past approaches.
  • Tommy: "Our leadership, we're not great messengers...everyone kind of looking around the party for leadership..." [44:29]
• Bernie, fresh faces, and candid talk: Jennifer points out how Bernie Sanders’ blunt, populist style has aged well, and both posit that plainspoken, unafraid messaging—especially on issues like Gaza and AIPAC—will be essential for Dems' survival.
• Democratic future bench: Tommy, reluctantly, name-checks Pete Buttigieg and Gavin Newsom as talents, but expresses a longing for truly inspiring candidates.
  • Tommy: "I'm just not really impressed by anybody right now...I want someone to make me, like, pound the table. Yes. You're getting me fired up." [52:44]
• Foreign policy litmus test: Both agree future Dem candidates must have honest, ready answers on Gaza, AIPAC, and foreign policy and not rely on "possum play and filibustering."
  • Jennifer: "...whoever the next nominee is on a national ticket better have a really good fucking answer for that thing..." [54:43]

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Memorable Quotes & Moments

"I've had it with getting beaten by the biggest losers on the planet. I'm thinking about Stephen Miller...they look like they were genetically engineered to survive golf cart crashes..."
– Tommy Vietor [19:37]

"We cannot lose our democracy to these fucking dorks."
– Jennifer Welch [20:24]

"There’s a group of DL demon queens...they browbeat everybody all day long and then get on Grindr at night..."
– Jennifer Welch [21:03]

"Democrats, sometimes think...the way we win elections, they stack this many accomplishments and we stack this many. And it's like, nope. Sometimes you need to pick an enemy and demagogue an issue."
– Tommy Vietor [25:50]

"I would claw through 10ft of concrete...to go vote for one of them over a MAGA Republican."
– Jennifer Welch [35:40]

"I want someone to like make my heart flow."
– Tommy Vietor, on 2028 Democratic hopefuls [54:17]

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Segment: “Had It or Hit It”

[59:11–65:36]

• Ms. Rachel: Tommy praises her for being kind, principled, and under unfair fire for supporting Palestinian children.
• Free speech hypocrites: Both explode at the hypocrisy of right-wingers who bark about free speech but want to silence dissent.
• Ted Cruz: Discussion of Cruz as "undefeated at sucking" but with the backhanded caveat that "sometimes assholes have moments of clarity."
• The United States: Tommy reaffirms deep love for America, highlighting protest culture, freedom to dissent, and the need to keep fighting for democracy.
  • Tommy: “I'm hitting it. I love this country. It's a great country. We gotta fight for it.” [65:36]

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Crooked Con Plug

[66:55–67:42] Tommy invites listeners to Crooked Con, a progressive political gathering in DC dedicated to activism, strategy, and community.

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Closing Thoughts

[67:42–68:47]

• Warm mutual admiration between hosts and guest.
• Kylie expresses admiration for the intelligence and impact of Pod Save America.

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Notable Timestamps

• Kylie complains about birthday expectations: [02:28]
• Jennifer details her NYC encounter: [09:08]
• Listener review—Cookout approval: [11:07]
• Tommy’s introduction and main grievance: [18:44, 19:37]
• DL demon queens tangent: [21:03]
• Arguing Democrats are too defensive, not bold: [25:50]
• Cory Booker, Gaza debate: [29:45–41:40]
• 2028 Democrat wish list, AIPAC, and foreign policy: [52:44–56:07]
• “Had It or Hit It” segment: [59:11–65:36]
• Closing appreciation for guest: [67:42–68:47]

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Final Assessment

“DL Demon Queens of MAGA” delivers I've Had It at its best: equal parts comic therapy, political exasperation, and fierce advocacy. Jennifer, Kylie, and Tommy dissect Democratic failings and MAGA's ascendancy with zero patience for hypocrisy or mediocrity. The episode is a masterclass in how to demand more from politicians—not just the moral minimum, but real leadership, backbone, and authenticity. Whether you’re a political junkie or just exhausted by the circus, this is a sharp, cathartic must-listen.

Transcript

[Jennifer]

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[Host (possibly Angie)]

This episode of I've had it is brought to you by booking.com Since 2010, they've helped over 1.8 billion vacation rental guests find places to stay. That's billion with a b. Head over to booking.com and start your listing today. Get seen, get booked on booking.com so we supposed to start the podcast. Welcome to America's Top DEI Podcast. Pumps is traveling to go see her son in Houston. So Kylie is subbing for Pumps today. And as you can see in the background I wrote in her office I hip lesbian office world headquarters behind her. So how Kylie, how are things going in the lesbian world headquarters?

[Kylie]

They're going good. I've got a lot of pressure filling in for pumps and a lot smaller tits, but I'm going to do my very best.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

You are that all. But all of that is true. All of that is 100 true. Kylie, what have you had it with?

[Kylie]

Okay, I've had it with everybody having birthdays and I just feel like I'm going to have to tell people and remember to text them happy birthday until I die. And if you forget, it's the end of the fucking world. And I have a friend who has an Excel sheet where she keeps track of who doesn't tell her happy birthday so that she knows so that she knows who not to tell back. So like I just am over it. I don't remember anyone's birthday. I send 60 emails a day and then I'm done talking to people.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Okay, let's. She has an Excel spreadsheet and she keeps inventory of people that don't wish her a happy birthday.

[Kylie]

Yeah, I've seen it. It's itemized by name.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

She said this out loud to you? Like, these are the people who didn't wish me happy birthday. How old is this person now?

[Kylie]

30, but she has a personality disorder. You know, undiagnosed maybe. But this is a real thing. Yeah.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

I mean, that is crazy. I mean, that is. The histrionics involved in that. The self importance. It's. That is wild. Is this a functioning adult?

[Kylie]

It is married. I mean, job gonna breed. It's just a problem for me because I can't remember that stuff.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Me ask you this. Is that off putting for you? Like, for me, that would make me, like, kind of think, I don't know if I want to be this person's friend anymore.

[Kylie]

Honestly, no. This person is my friend, like for 15 years now. As long as the crazy doesn't come at me, I rarely care.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Have you ever missed her birthday?

[Kylie]

Hell no. Because I know about this Excel sheet.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

That's wild. That is. And is she mad? Like when people don't. Is she hurt?

[Kylie]

Yeah. And it's like. It's the same people that use an Unfollow app. You know about these, that it's a separate app you download, and if someone unfollows you on socials, it tells you and they do it. They do this so that they go unfollow the person back. People just care a lot about this.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Wait a minute. So you get a notification if somebody unfollows you and then you go tit for tat?

[Kylie]

It's. It's tit for tat. That's what all this is. People care so much.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Wow. I'm just. I'm kind of speechless about all of that.

[Jennifer]

Yeah.

[Kylie]

It's a scary world out there. But I will say, on the contrary, if anyone forgets my birthday, I'm like, well, I guess our friendship doesn't mean much to them. So it's twofold.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Wait, if somebody forgets your birthday, you think that?

[Kylie]

Yeah, I want people to text me happy birthday.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Oh, you do? Yeah. So you're kind of similar.

[Kylie]

Probably, yeah. But I just don't want it turned on me. I'm a hypocrite is what it is.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Okay. I'm that way about the environment. I want to be an environmentalist. I know climate change is real. I do very little to combat it. Nope.

[Kylie]

Yep.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Yeah, I'M a total hypocrite on that. I absolutely don't care if people don't text me on my birthday. And sometimes it gets so overwhelming by like 5 or 6pm I'm like, enough, enough. It's not that big of a deal. It's a birthday. Everybody has one. I don't. Let me ask you this. Does the girl who has the spreadsheet, does she celebrate a birthday week, birthday month?

[Kylie]

I'm sure she's done a birthday week. There's no doubt in my mind. I mean, I haven't lived near her in a long time, so I'm not like, privy to all of it. But there's no way you have a spreadsheet about who tells you happy birthday and you're not celebrating a birthday week.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Yeah, well, that's. That's very alarming to me. The list, the reveal that you yourself get upset if people don't text you happy birthday. Yeah. What is that about?

[Kylie]

I don't know. Because I don't even. I get annoyed on my birthday. And to respond to everybody because I don't like texting people. I copy and paste. Thank you. I copy and paste into everyone. But it's just if no one texted me, I would be pissed. So it's like, what do I want?

[Host (possibly Angie)]

I would say if nobody texted me on my birthday, if not one person, I would probably be like, oh, my God. The irrelevance of that would be. That would be a fatal blow. There's no question. But like, when acquaintances, like, I have some people on my birthday, the tech stream is literally because Facebook or, you know, or social media sharing stories, then everybody knows it's your birthday. I have several people where the tech stream is only on my birthday. Happy birthday, Jennifer me saying thank you. Happy birthday, Jennifer me saying thank you. And it's like four or five years. And that's the extent of our communication. And I think if you're going 2, 3 years with zero communication, you don't have to wish each other happy birthday. It's kind of like an item of clothing. If you haven't worn it in two or three years, donate it, get rid of it.

[Kylie]

You should send that on the next one. When there's six happy birthday thank yous in a thread, you should be like, happy birthday. I think this is the last one.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

I think.

[Kylie]

I think I'll call it a relationship.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. All right. Let me tell you what I've had it with. I've had it with. And I think we've discussed this before. But now that I'm living in New York, it's a. It's a real issue for me. Listener Kylie is abundantly aware that I am a very fast walker. And I don't realize how fast I'm walking. It's just. I just do. I have one pace when I walk. And Kylie's kind of a famous non walker. Like, she can get less than a thousand steps in one day. So as I'm trekking down and my French bulldogs moved to New York with me, and they are excellent walkers, and we go on walks every night, and it's somebody who's walking in front of us, and they're at a good click, too. And then all of a sudden, stop right in the middle of the sidewalk with no announcement. Don't step aside. And then Cha cha tubs me. We're all just banging into the person. So I've had it with that. And then I told pimps a story, but I think I should tell you and the listener. So day two of me being in New York, I took the subway to soho to get my hair colored. And as I'm walking down the subway steps, there's a guy kind of lying on the steps. Before I got to the part where you pay, and he's masturbating.

[Tommy Vietor]

Sure.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Okay.

[Kylie]

Yeah.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

And it's kind of like I'm walking down and I see the motion, see that his pants are undone. I didn't quite see the pain or anything like that, but I was like, it can taste. I was like, oh, that's what he's doing. And then he looks up directly at me, and he says, I'm coming. And then he did.

[Kylie]

No.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Yeah. So I thought a couple of things about this. Number one, that's disgusting, for sure. But number two, I've still got it.

[Kylie]

No, that's exactly my first thought.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

You know what? I think I could be like, oh, my God, that's so disgusting. But then I got on the subway and I was like, you know, welcome to New York, Jennifer.

[Kylie]

I mean, what if he had looked at you and it killed his boner? Like, I would think about that forever.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

That would have been far more devastating than the money shot.

[Kylie]

I agree. It's disgusting, and I never want to see it. But if it's gonna happen, I at least am glad I could help take.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

It over the finish line. Yeah. Yeah. All right, well, I think welcome to I've had it. I'm Jennifer.

[Kylie]

I'm Kylie. She's HB H B I L, no H L, I C. Head lesbian in Charge.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

And it kind of is like h lick. It's kind of.

[Kylie]

That's kind of good.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

I should point out brand. So listener pumps went to Houston to see her son and she was like, I'm going to change the flight. I'm going to push it back. And I said, don't we film a million episodes all the time? Go enjoy the time with your son. And Kylie's subbing in one day.

[Kylie]

We're practicing codependency. I have had it. Podcast independency.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Independency.

[Kylie]

Yeah.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Yeah. Okay. Do we have any reviews of this podcast? We do.

[Kylie]

Up first, I've got a five star titled Jennifer and Angie Something something. It says black. Yes, Capital B. Christian Chicagoan woman here dropping by to extend a public invite to the black Cookout to Jen and Angie. These two get two lifetime passes, but it will be revoked if they bring potato salad with raisins to attend the amazing cultural event that is the black cookout. It's our circle of love. This podcast is thoughtful, honest, funny, and Jen and Angie show what it truly means to be an ally to the marginalized in this country and world. Thanks for keeping it real. Thanks for holding politicians feet to the fire. Loved your interview with Jeff Duncan. Thanks for speaking to the grief of this time and thanks for exposing these performative Christians wishing continued success.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

That is so nice. Very nice. The cookout, which I think all white people should aspire to be cookout approved white person for sure. And then we have to keep exposing the performative Christians because they're just too.

[Kylie]

Much and politicians on both sides. It's very important. That's what the right doesn't do. And I think that's why you guys make such an impact. I mean our inbox is full of positive and negative, but a lot of positive because people just feel so seen when you say these things to politicians on both sides.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Kylie]

Okay, I've got one more. Five stars with love from Buffalo. Courtney says. Saw a woman sitting next to me with the podcast on her phone while we were were both awaiting mammogram results this morning. Made me feel a little better to be next to someone like minded. Keep fighting the good fight. Love this pod and anyone else who is listening.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

That's so nice.

[Kylie]

The podcast has actually been a really good litmus test in public for me. Like I was getting some work done in my car and this like guy, blue collar, I just assumed he shouldn't know what I do for a living and then he texted me after because we got to talking about it. He was like, I'm a huge fan and so is my wife. And I was like, it's how I find safe people.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

That's a really good point. I was at the pet food store in Oklahoma City before I moved, and a couple of the people that work there, I thought for sure, maga, right? And they're like, hey, I've been watching your clips. And, you know, and she said something like, I am so done with Trump. So I don't know if she was maggot at some point, but no, it's. I kind of feel like everything right now when people say I'm not into politics. I just think that's such. Because everything is political right now. Everything. We're literally in the fight for, you know, our democracy. And I agree. It's a really good litmus test.

[Kylie]

It is. And saying I'm not into politics is someone who is just embarrassed to say their views, I think, because I agree.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

I think they're embarrassed to say they're maga. What about. Do you have any friends that have cut you off?

[Kylie]

I don't. I. I've had friends that used to talk about the podcast a lot when it was more surface, like when we talked about casserole or the hoa and they would text me all the time. Big fans. And then I noticed a lot of them die off when it became more political.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Yeah, it's a great way. It's a great way to eliminate this episode of I've had It is brought to you by booking.com pumps. I've got to say, if you're looking to grow your vacation rental business, this is the place to be. Booking.com is one of the most downloaded travel apps in the entire world. And for good reason. Reason. Since 2010, they've helped over 1.8 billion vacation rental guests find places to stay. That's billion with a B. But here's the thing. Most vacation rentals don't even realize they can list their properties on booking.com and if you're not on the platform, your rental is basically invisible to millions of booking.com travelers worldwide.

[Jennifer]

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[Host (possibly Angie)]

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[Jennifer]

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[Host (possibly Angie)]

Okay, we have a great guest today. He is one third of Pod Save America and we are going to rip it. So he's representing his group. Pumps is out. I'm representing. I've had it. So together we're going to make a dynamic duo. His name is Tommy Vitor Viator. Tommy, are you here?

[Tommy Vietor]

I'm right here. How you doing?

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Good, how are you? How do I pronounce your last vtour?

[Tommy Vietor]

It's fine.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

It doesn't matter vour.

[Tommy Vietor]

No one cares.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Let's welcome to. I've had it. Tommy. Vour. Tommy, how are you?

[Tommy Vietor]

I'm doing great. I'm very excited to do this. Thank you for inviting me.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

I'm very excited to do it too. And I was so upset because your staff at Crooked contacted us and wanted us to go to Crooked Con. I know I can't go because my youngest son is a freshman at USC and it's parents weekend that exact same weekend. So I'll be in la.

[Tommy Vietor]

Can't miss that.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Working mom his whole life. Like I have to show up to all of that big stuff.

[Tommy Vietor]

So you're. You're a good mom. We'll miss you. It would have been very fun. But you know what? Let's. Hopefully it'll be good and we'll do it again.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Yeah, if we stop democracy, we'll do it right.

[Tommy Vietor]

Details, details.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

All right, Tommy, what have you had it with?

[Tommy Vietor]

I have had it. I've had it with getting beaten by the biggest losers on the planet. I'm thinking about Stephen Miller, thinking about Don and Eric Trump. I'm thinking about all those racist assholes featured in that Politico story with their little telegram chat where they're talking about how they love Hitler and. Have you seen photos of these people? Yes. My friend sent me a tweet that said they look like they were genetically engineered to survive golf cart crashes because they're just.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

I saw that.

[Tommy Vietor]

Goofy looking. Anyway, I, I'm. I'm so tired of these losers beating us. And there's being this perception that MAGA is cool and that that is the ascendant part of the culture and it is just wrong and it's driving me crazy and we can't let it happen anymore.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

I couldn't agree more. I mean, I always say to Pumps, I'm like, we cannot lose our democracy to these fucking dorks. I mean, Stephen Miller is the worst, the worst, absolute fucking worst human being on the planet. And then you get to J.D. vance, who is a failed drag queen. You know, he is a failed drag queen. He wanted to be a drag queen. He couldn't do it. He wasn't fabulous enough. He goes off to Peter Thiel's gay boot camp in Silicon Valley and he comes out like a sociopathic, queer eyed freak show. You know, he'd be so much cooler if he'd just come out.

[Ad/Promo Voice]

And.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

You know, I have this whole theory, Tommy, that in the MAGA movement there's a group of DL demon queens. And I think That a lot of them are mad that they can't come out and feel pride, and so they browbeat everybody all day long and then they get on Grindr at night and they go to gay stuff and they wake up. But I think they think, like, the Mike Johnson of it all, he's such a nut. Evangelical. I think he thinks, okay, I can't stop doing gay stuff, but if I make America Christian nationalists, then I'm going to curry favor with God. I grew up in a red state around all these evangelicals and they think shit like this, the repression.

[Tommy Vietor]

No, sorry to interrupt. You're so right about the repressed. There's so many people who are repressing something and then acting out in a way that is evil and cruel towards the part of themselves that they hate. You just see that over and over and over again. Yeah, I'm. It makes me crazy. It makes me crazy.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

What about Dumb and Dumber? That's what I call Eric and Dawn.

[Tommy Vietor]

They are there. So there's a story in the Financial Times this week that says the Trump family organization has made 1 billion with a B dollars in realized gains from just their cryptocurrency business since he's taken office. Like, these people are making out like bandits and they are just looting the U.S. government and they are trading favors left and right. I mean, Trump, Trump went to Egypt, to the Sharm El Sheikh peace summit thing, and he's on stage and Praboa Subianto, the president of Indonesia, like, grabbed him and started asking him a question. He's like, do I talk to Don? Do I talk to Eric? And he's like, call Eric. He's a good boy. And they're just doing a, like a real estate deal on stage at this, at this peace summit. Like, what's happening here?

[Host (possibly Angie)]

You know, the thing is, when I think about it, it's every single day there's like 5 to 7 impeachable slash above the lead corporate media meltdown moments. But it's all just kind of skimmed over. It's all just kind of normalized. The fact that, like, to me, Trump's dementia is so pronounced, it's so obvious. Like every night he has like sundowner hour in the Oval, it seems like, and everybody's standing around him for his show and tell. And I have this theory, I think that like, the, the Peter Thiel, the Stephen Miller, the J.D. vance of it, they're like, okay, we're going to give him design projects. He can work on his redecorating, work on his arc to Trump. We're going to keep him super busy with that while we go shake down everybody and everything. Just be busy. He doesn't have the intellectual capacity to stay on to, to do all of these diabolical things. He's down with it, but he doesn't have the staying power to see it from start to completion because a lot of them don't have anything to do with him.

[Tommy Vietor]

Yeah. And well, I mean, he doesn't have staffers, he has fluffers. Right. I mean everyone is just there to tell him he's great. And it's this constant, just like nauseating process of this stroking this man's ego or something else. And yeah, it's hard to watch. And Peter Thiel, by the way, is apparently in the midst of doing like four nights of these lectures about the Antichrist in San Francisco. You could pay 200 bucks to watch Peter Thiel tell you about the Antichrist. That's a thing people are doing now.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Like, what's the. Okay, what? And I had to look him up because this is an interesting, like, case, psychological case study. So he's gay, out of the closet, married, has kids, total Bible thumper and like puts as a side hustle, does conferences on the Antichrist.

[Tommy Vietor]

Why?

[Host (possibly Angie)]

And he decided he doesn't think that democracy is great anymore and he wants to do away with it with his buddy Curtis Yarvin and move us into dark enlightenment. And here's the thing. I wish Democrats would grow up here and just start saying shit like you're going to let. And I know the messaging, we don't believe in this, in our core, but it would resonate. And I feel like we played two different games. And I feel like some Democrats need to say you're going to let some guy that was born in Germany, raised in South Africa, comes over here, gets tax loopholes and he's going to decide we shouldn't have democracy. And he's queer eyed JD Vance and owns this guy and you're going to let him destroy the country. But it's all this pussy fitting around with the Dems and it's. To me it seems like such a layup to take these guys out and they get their feelings hurt so bad. Like I've been going viral for 24 hours because I said JD Vance doesn't defend his mixed race kids and his wife of Indian descent. The right wing is melting down. I mean, they're losing their minds because I said that they're such titty babies.

[Tommy Vietor]

They can't even take it they're so sensitive. I mean, you're right. Like Democrats, I think, sometimes think, here's the way we win elections, they stack this many accomplishments and we stack this many. And it's like, nope, the way politics works is sometimes you need to pick an enemy and you need to demagogue an issue and you need to fight and make people think that you're on their side while the other guys are on a different side. And one thing I've been watching, and it's driving me insane, is the Trump administration right now is floating this proposal to bail out to Argentina. Why? Because their crazy president, this guy Javier Milei, is nice to Trump and shows up at cpac, these right wing conferences. And you know who's going to benefit from this bailout? BlackRock, Pimco, hedge funds, billionaires. It's like this was designed in a fucking lab to be the most politically damaging thing I've ever heard. And by the way, meanwhile, farmers in Argentina are undercutting U.S. soybean farmers by selling their crops to the Chinese. And these American farmers are about to go bankrupt. And yet we're going to give a $20 billion bailout to this country. How is this like light yourself on fire and go in front of the White House and talk about this?

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Here's the problem, the Democrats don't talk about it. And so guess who's filling that void right now? Marjorie Taylor Greene. Yeah, she is tweeting that the Democrats are not having moral clarity about Israel. And guess who is Marjorie Taylor Greene. So you have this nut who has a lot more political savviness than I ever thought, who is a grifter, who is an anti Semite, who has the most nefarious of intentions imaginable, but she hangs out with Steve Bannon all the time, who is a political strategist, a nut, but a smart political strategist. And they're filling this vacuum because you know what they see? They see that in this authoritarian Trump has to immense strength in order for it to stay all intact. He's got bruises on his hands, cankles, dementia, his makeup looks like shit. He's cheating at golf more and more and so he looks like this frail person. So the fissures and MAGA are happening. So the smart MAGA people, and I know that sounds like an oxymoron, and it is. But the most opportunistic MAGA people see this void that the Democrats will not fill. And so as a person who lived in OKLAHOMA CITY For 51 years, I know what the electorate Oklahoma City's perfectly purple. It's 50. 50. I know what middle Americans think. And when a politician says people in Israel have health care and people in Israel do not have student loan debt, that's going to hit hard in flying over states. And if the Democrats don't fill that void, then some grifting anti Semitic opportunists like Marjorie Taylor Greene is going to fill it. And now, Tommy, they're talking about changing the 20 billion to Argentina to 40.

[Tommy Vietor]

Yes, because why not double it? Let's just double down on this. This guy's an insane person. By the way, the president of Argentina used to carry a chainsaw to events because he was going to chainsaw the government. Then he gave his chainsaw to Elon Musk at CPAC because, like, why not give a man coming down from Academy in a chainsaw? What could go wrong with that? And also he talks about how his. He's got this corrupt sister who's his only advisor. He talked about talking to his dead dogs to get political advice. Like, this guy's bonkers. And we're like, yeah, there's 20 billion, here's 40 billion. Why not?

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Did you see his concert that he put on?

[Tommy Vietor]

Oh, my God, yes. It was like, it was, it was like low rent. Rolling Stones, you know, community theater, Rolling stones doing like 80s cover songs in a leather jacket with this crazy, like wolfman hair.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

You know, I thought it's so hard to out crazy Trump. Yeah, it's so hard to look like a bigger asshole than Trump. And when I saw that concert, I was like, he did it.

[Tommy Vietor]

Nailed it to him. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Okay, let's talk about Kylie. Our producer told me that you listened to the Cory Booker episode.

[Tommy Vietor]

I did. Okay, I have a lot of thoughts. Okay, let's just start with the Israel stuff because that's where I was like screaming at the phone. And I felt like I was really glad you pushed really hard. So what. What I found frustrating was you were making really valid, important points about how Americans don't want to support a country that is bombing kids in Gaza. Right. And a lot of his answers were deflection. And what about ism? And just to summarize, like, a lot of what he said was like, what about Sudan? And what about US Support for the Saudi led war in Yemen? And I just want to address those two issues quickly because those are very important and I care deeply about both. And. And so when it comes to Sudan, we need to restore the work USAID was doing because people are starving to death in refugee camps right now. And then the US Needs to crack down on the United Arab Emirates because they are funneling weapons to the rsf, which is the other half of the civil war happening in Sudan. So I'm with Cory Booker there. And then on Yemen, he was like, what about when Obama was supporting the Saudi led war in Yemen in 2015 with like refueling, logistics. And that is true. Like the Obama administration, which I worked for, I left in 2013. But they did this after. They're providing like logistics, intelligence, support, etc. And then arms sales. And then there was this awful airstrike on like a funeral or a wedding or something in Yemen. So the administration paused and then cut off that support. But it was a mistake for the Obama administration to do that. But like, we're talking about a thing that happened 10 years ago, right? And, but so like setting that aside, like, I'll take on those issues. I'll talk about them anytime. What the US does for Israel is just an entirely different category. And to suggest otherwise, I think is dishonest. Like the Congressional Research Service did a report on US Military support for Israel and they state in clear text the Israel is the largest cumulative recipient of U.S. foreign assistance since World War II. To date, the U.S. has provided 174 billion in military assistance to Israel. And on top of that, there's all this diplomatic cover at the United Nations. Bibi Netanyahu is a ICC indicted war criminal for starving kids to death, for bombing populated areas. And like, we're welcoming this man to Washington. He's been to the White House, what, four times? There was that awful picture in, in, in the Senate that you mentioned. It's like, this guy is a corrupt racist who before this war started was trying to shred Israel's judicial system. And so like, I've heard this argument over and over again from people like Senator Booker and other Democrats I fight with about this. That's like, well, I want to be in the room and I want to make my case to his face and not have these disputes spill out publicly. And I just want to say to them, what has that accomplished? Like, what has that improved? What did, what did you, did you break through with, with this corrupt, racist war criminal in your, in your meeting with them on Capitol Hill? No, he doesn't give a fuck about what Democrats think because Bibi Netanyahu wanted Donald Trump to win and he also, he wants you to lose your election. And let's just like be clear eyed about that.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Right? No, I completely agree. I knew when he was Throwing Obama under the bus. Who is. Because he brought up his parents being civil rights activists, and then he's. And I kept kind of probing him, and then he. When he threw Obama under the bus, which I agree with you, Obama was known as a drone president, and there's an argument to be made there. But that's a separate conversation than the one at hand. And Obama's universally beloved. I knew that he was underwater. I, I have a lot of thoughts about all of this. So I, I've always been the Democrat in this red state. And when you live in a red state, you are more domestically focused, especially if you live in a red state, because they are coming after civil liberties. They are Christian nationalists. Nothing that is happening right now on the national stage surprises me much because that's the way it was in a deeply religious red state. My whole life, local politics were just like this. And so of course I knew about Israel and of course I knew about Palestine. But when you live in Oklahoma and the oceans are a far, long way away. I'm not trying to sound glib, but you don't care that much because you have politicians that are trying to take away your right to an abortion, gay marriage, all sorts of things. And so, you know, I had kids, I was an interior designer. And then obviously get more and more and more into politics. And that when you see what's happening in Gaza, it's, it's a moment where you think about when you learned about World War II, who is speaking out, who, who is going to stand up for these people. And so it's, it was something that I really started digging into. And then I've been so shocked at the Democratic establishment's take on so much of this. And then when you dig into it more and more, they're all beholden to aipac. And then when you realize that AIPAC gave Trump just as much money to get elected as Elon Musk did, and then you start opening your eyes up more and more. And so when we first started talking about politics, obviously a bunch of white women, it was heartbreak Hotel. They were really mad at Pumps and me because we weren't maggot. And then we start talking about politics more and more. And then a couple weeks ago, three weeks ago, we were the moderator for Kamala Harris's book tour in la. Super cool thing to do, right? And then the leftists were really mad at us. And I want to be clear about this to the Democrats as much as Cory Booker and Hakeem Jeffries and Chuckles Schumer, Piss me off and what weak, duplicitous, bought and paid for politicians they are, I would claw through 10ft of concrete and get my fingers to the bone to go vote for one of them over a MAGA Republican.

[Tommy Vietor]

Beautifully said.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Because I have lived in a state where these MAGA Republicans have had super majorities. And in Oklahoma, it's ranked 50th in education. You got some nut who just resigned who's the biggest closet DL demon queen I've ever seen in my life. Obsessed with trans people, obsessed with porn, trying to annihilate teachers unions. They do away with workers rights. So as much as disgusted as I get with corporate Democrats, I know what's on the line to vote for them. They're not my first choice. So I feel like as we navigate this and I'm able to have Cory Booker on the pod and I'm able to talk to him about the things that I think are important and vulnerabilities of the party right now and the party's messaging. It's also important for people to understand he's not my first choice, but I would lit. I would walk barefoot uphill for 10 miles to vote for him over a Republican.

[Tommy Vietor]

Totally, totally. Like, I, I, first of all, I loved every minute of that rant. Like, I, I feel the same way. It's like sometimes political debates get so flattened. It's like, you know what, we're all adults here. Like, you don't get everything you want out of life. It could be infuriating and frustrating and sometimes our choices are bad and worse. But, but worse is worse, you know what I mean? And better is better. So, like, let's just like, put on our critical thinking hats and like the other part of the Booker, the sort of domestic political conversation with Booker, like, I get what he was saying there when he was like, my voters care about the economy, my voters care about me getting funding to get these lead pipes replaced because lead is devastating for kids. And I got that from the Biden administration. And I think that's all, like, totally fair and that's important and that is his job. But, like, the disconnect there was like, you're an activist. You know what I mean? Your job is not to, like, you're not serving constituency. Your job is to push him and other Democrats from the outside to be more progressive because, like, the squeaky wheel gets the grease. Like, you know what I mean? If you're hearing from only the pro Israel side, you're going to lean that direction. If you're not Hearing from people who are concerned about the war in Gaza, you're going to think there isn't a constituency. And also, like, I feel like what a lot of Democrats are saying when they say they want their leaders to fight harder is like, we want more harm reduction. Like, I get that Cory Booker trying to, like, pass things that are good, but, like, Trump is devastating communities right now, and it's like, how can you throw your body in front of that to block it? Like, I think that's what people are calling for.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Yeah, I completely agree. And I think my, my heartache with Cory Booker was, was real. Like, I, as a person, a liberal person that's not religious at all, that lived in this Bible thumper red state. I mean, Republicans out the wazoo, politicians like Cory Booker or Hakeem Jeffries or Nancy Pelosi were like, for me, it was like, okay, good, somebody gets it. Somebody's fighting for me. And then when I see, like, this is a 91 1, all hands on deck and we're voting to confirm. What's his name? Kushner.

[Tommy Vietor]

Yeah.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

You know, my thing is, like, you have to be a credible messenger, Senator Booker. You have to have credibility. And so when you say you care, oh, my God, look at what ICE is doing. Look at what ICE is doing. These little kids and sending them to court and they don't have a lawyer, and these five year olds are standing in front of a judge that is abhorrent. And Corey did a whole Instagram reel on that. And then you find out that he, you know, is funding and consistently voting. The only bipartisanship that I see right now is the support for Israel, which Israel. The government at least favors maga, which is interesting to me because all the anti Semites I know are Republicans, evangelicals, or the most anti Semitic people I've ever met. But the credible messenger part of the Democratic Party is super important to me right now. Like, if you can't cherry pick which kids you care about, which is why I, you know, I care about Israeli safety. I do. But I also care about Palestinian safety. I care about both. And I feel like the Israeli propaganda tries to force you to pick one, to value one over the other. But that's kind of the government they're trying to set up is an ethno state that favors Jewish people over others. So they're projecting that onto us. And I think there's a massive vacuum here, Tommy, a massive vacuum. And grifters that are truly anti Semitic are going to fill this void. And the problem with all of these fuckers that are playing patty cake with these fascists is at some point, the knives are going to be turned at you. The Latinos for Trump just found this out. You know, I. I don't know how they didn't see the mass deportation now signs, but now they're getting deported and they're starting to find out. But I want to make one more point about Kamala. For a lot of people in this country, if you're gay, if you're trans, if you're a woman that lives in a red state and you were raped and you had to travel, and this is very real. This happens all the time. You had to have somebody sponsor you and go get money and try to sneak out of the state to go get an abortion because you didn't want to have your rapist baby. A Kamala Harris candidacy for that person who doesn't think in terms of the global stage meant a lifeline. Yeah. Living in a red state for so long, I understand that. I understand how important that is for so many marginalized people. And on the left, it's. I feel like you're damned if you do, you're damned if you don't. Like, if you don't go for far enough left, then you're ridiculed. And I feel like as we build our tent and structure it, the people that piss me off the most in this tent are the Cory Bookers and the Hakeem Jeffries. Because I can't understand, and this is a question I wanted to get to with him, but he had to go vote even though the government shut down. Why he hasn't endorsed or on Mom. Donnie.

[Tommy Vietor]

Yeah, that's crazy. I find it. The caution around Mamdani's race is exhausting and infuriating. He is a really exciting, cool young politician with some really progressive positions who seems like fundamentally a very decent and good guy. And the idea that the leadership of the party cannot back him for some strange, mysterious region is just. It's pathetic to me. It's absurd to me. And it's also like, hey, guys, do you think this is really going to save you? Do you think the Republicans aren't going to try to suggest that you believe everything that Mamdani believes at the next election? Of course they are. So just sack up and, like, support the guy that is exciting people, especially young voters, and actually able to communicate with them, like, in a way. In a way that, like, no one has done since what AOC kind of came onto the scene. Like, this is a sort of, like, A step change in terms of just the ability to. To communicate a message and values and actually seem credible to people. Like, that's. That credibility gap is not. It's not being problems not being solved by a lot of Democrats.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

And I don't know why he doesn't just say something to the extent that Zoran's a little bit further left than I am. But I believe in democracy and I believe in the Democratic primary. I think it's very Trumpian that Cory Booker and Chuckles don't endorse him. I think it. It's giving Trump. It's giving Trump vibes. And we are supposed to be the party that we believe in free and fair elections, and this person's the winner and they won't endorse. And one thing I wish I would have said to Corey on the interview is he said a lot of people don't know who Chuck Schumer is. And that's true. A lot of people have no idea. But at this point, in this moment, everybody should know who the Senate Minority Leader is, because that's how loud and that's how much hell they should be raising. Everybody in America should know exactly who is the face that's fighting for them. That is the closest proximity in the House and Senate to get things done. And the fact that Hakeem Jeffries and Chuck Schumer are not household names right now, tell you what a shitty job they're doing, because I think the Democrats, like, I heard. What's that old guy's name from Louisiana that did the Clinton campaign manager.

[Tommy Vietor]

Oh, Jesus Christ. James Carville.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Him. Okay, James Carville. He said he has a political strategy and he may have evolved since then. So I don't want to pigeonhole him into this. I heard this a couple months ago that, like, when your other side is really messing up, just sit back and let them mess up. And if this was a Mitt Romney Presidency or John McCance. Yeah. Let him step in it. But this is different. And I think the fact. I wish I would have pushed back on him on that, that. That they're not being that loud is evidence to what a failed resistance they're putting up.

[Tommy Vietor]

Yeah. And look, I mean, I am like you. I think of my best comebacks in the car on the way back from the argument. So. But, like, I honestly, I had the same thought as I was listening. It's like, yeah, like, our leadership, we're not great messengers. We're not great communicators. And in this moment, I think there is a huge void in terms of everyone kind of looking around the party for leadership. And then, like, some Democrats are surprising. Like, Chris Van Hollen, senator from Maryland, was not someone I was, like, super familiar with, but he went down to El Salvador to try to get contact with Kilmar Abrego Garcia during the Sukot stuff. He's been really out front and a leader on all things Gaza. And I'm, like, seeing someone like that step up and inspire you, like, that's cool and important, but I'd like to see. I'd like to see a lot more of it from leadership. And sometimes I worry with Schumer that, like, a lot of this is. Is age and just kind of, like, coming from a different era and this. This lingering belief that, like, oh, Republicans will come to their senses after Trump. And, you know, we can go back to the old ways where we, like, kind of negotiated things in good faith and got drinks later. Like, I just. I kind of think that version of politics is dead, or at least dead for a long time, and we gotta, like, snap it up, you know, like, figure out the next thing.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

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[Kylie]

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[Host (possibly Angie)]

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[Jennifer]

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[Host (possibly Angie)]

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[Host (possibly Angie)]

Criminal defense lawyer and he was born and raised in a town called Hugo, Oklahoma. 5,000 people. He's a Democrat, but he grew up around all of the in the part of Oklahoma where Trump wins like 80, 20, right? So when he heard Cory Booker dodge when I said, do you think Benjamin Netanyahu is a war criminal? Yes or no?

[Tommy Vietor]

Yes.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

And he couldn't answer it. My husband said, you think Trump would blink? You think he'd think two fucking seconds before he'd answer that? And that's the difference. They're playing two different games here. The Democrats want to govern incrementally and word salad and all of this rhetoric and I just don't think it resonates anymore. And I remember when Trump first came on the scene when he went down the escalator, nobody thought he was ever going to win the primary. Tommy. But when he was at the debates and he was brow beating Marco Rubio and Ted Cruz, I loved it.

[Tommy Vietor]

I loved it.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

I loved it too.

[Tommy Vietor]

I would cancel plans to go home and watch those debates. I remember like there was a party, my friend. So I was like, I'm sick. I got to go home because I wanted to watch that. Because he would say be like, hey Rand Paul, your Hair sucks and you're ugly and you're like, oh, my God, we can do this now. This is great. But, yeah, no, I. Trump. Look, I'm not a big Trump fan. He is an incredibly successful and adept politician, in part because he says what he thinks in an unvarnished, blunt way. And I think, like, on your Gaza point, like, I'm with you. Right. I think most voters are not primarily focused on foreign policy, however. Like, they've consumed information about the war in Gaza for the last year. They've heard it called the genocide. They've heard about the icc. They've heard about kids getting starved and bombed. And when you can't just speak candidly about that, or when you seem like you're dodging or ducking, they start to wonder, like, what else is this person not being straight with me on? Or, like, why can't they tell me the truth here? Like, what is it about them that is just. It gives you a bad feeling.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

It just makes you think that the fix is in on them. Because if you can't say Benjamin Netanyahu's a war criminal, which I think is just an objection, I mean, it's just true. It's just a fact. And that he, you know, and that he knows on some point, because the photo shoot where he's kind of like, hiding.

[Tommy Vietor]

Yes.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

And it's. The more you open up your eyes to it. For me, as somebody who was like an MSNBC Democrat, I was a good Democrat. I watched MSNBC every night, and I hosted fundraisers for local politicians. They always lost in Oklahoma, but I did my part right. I had Obama signs in my yard, Hillary signs in my yard. But the more I opened up my eyes to all of it, the persons whose message has aged the best is Bernie's. His message has. I remember I put a Hillary sign in the yard, and my son was like, mom, you're such a centrist. I can't believe you don't have a Bernie sign in your yard. How I managed to raise liberals in Oklahoma, but my son was kind of right, because those policies have left an incremental governing and the wages not raising and the wealth disparity has created this. This vacuum. And when Trump comes in and he's saying, lie in Ted, and he's beaten up on people, it makes people feel like somebody's fighting for them. And he gives that state of mind. And I think it would. I really impressed with Graham Platner out of Maine. I think somebody like that would really resonate well in. In Flyover. States because he's just very plain spoken. He calls people out. Mamdani is so talented. It's a shame that he wasn't born here because he has the ability to stay classy and cutting all at the same time. I think he's just very impressive. But who do you think the. Like, if we, if the election were. The primaries were next month for President, 2028. Let's fast forward. Who would be your top three that you think would. It would narrow down to.

[Tommy Vietor]

I mean, like, I just want to start this by being honest that, like, I'm just not really impressed by anybody right now. And like, I'm not trying to duck your question. Like, I'm happy to talk about names, but, like, I want my look. When I was, you know, in 2004, I worked on the John Edwards for President campaign. We lost to John Kerry. I was trying to figure out what the hell to do with my life. I was sleeping on a couch, broke and jobless, like, waiting to get a job. And I found Barack Obama. I read his book. I got obsessed with it and I was like, I became obsessed with working for him. It was all I wanted to do. It inspired me, it excited me. And it's like, I'm not looking for that again because I'm old now and, you know, have kids and can't do that. But, like, I. I want someone to make me, like, pound the table. Yes. You're. You're getting me fired up. And so there are people I think are really talented. Like, I think Pete Buttigieg is really talented. You could throw that guy on Fox News. Could be a ten on one interview. Like, he will hold his own. He will do and say impressive things. I think Gavin Newsom is fighting harder than anyone. And I'll be honest. Like, back in the day, I did not like Gavin Newsom in like the 2008 era. He was on the other side of the Clinton Obama thing. I had some hard feelings about him. I sort of thought some things in his record were shitty. Then I met him. I interviewed him a couple times. I spent time with him and I was like, God damn it. I really like this guy. So annoying. Like, he got me like that. He's funny. He's like, he wants to win. He's like, you know, he's like, one of us. He could be on the show and he's just, just. He would just hang out with you guys and you would have a blast. So I'll, I'll pause there because I want to list a billion people, but Like, I don't know, I want someone to like make my heart flow.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

That you mentioned though. I feel like this is what we need to start talking about. It's what I talked about with Corey. So I believe Pete kind of face planted on Urals podcast with a Gaza question, correct?

[Tommy Vietor]

Oh, big time.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Yeah. Yeah. And then recently Gavin was asked about apac and he, who's always such a smooth operator, you can tell, like hamster just starts taking off on the well. And he's like, interesting. You're asking.

[Kylie]

Yeah.

[Tommy Vietor]

That's weird.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Interesting. That's weird. I've never thought about it. I feel like these people, if you want to run on a national ticket, you better have a good answer for that. And they think this is the difference. The megabase is stupid. They're not. They, they read, I'm sure I'll get ripped for that, but I don't care. They read information and watch information that is not fact based. So they think they're really well informed. The on the left side we are more informed. And so I feel like a lot of them are treating us like we're stupid. Like with Corey, I feel like I felt like the whole thing was an insult to our intelligence that he can't say, of course he's a war criminal and all of that filibustering that they do doesn't work so well. And I feel like who, whoever the next nominee is on a national ticket better have a really good fucking answer for that thing because the right machine is already seeing curtains on Trump. They already see it. He's frail. Biology is going to catch up with him any minute. And so they're seeing a post MAGA electorate and Marge is positioning herself, Tucker Carlson is positioning himself. I think he could run. And I think if the Democrats do not start talking about this in a smart way that addresses it instead of playing dumb and possum, it's going to fuck them. I really do.

[Tommy Vietor]

Yeah. No, what I heard from Senator Booker was just like, it sounded so defensive. And it's sort of starting at this place where sort of like it was almost like suggesting you were unfairly singling out Israel out of some animus. And it's like, no, man. Like people are talking about this because there's been this horrific war that has filled our TV and social media feeds for two years. And I don't ever, I don't want to see any kid die. I don't want to like, I don't want my tax dollars to go to bombing kids in Gaza. And it's just like, like that's not singling, that's not, that's not an anti Semitic thing to say. That's not singling out a single country. That's like being self aware that we've given what, $174 billion to Israel and military funding in like we are viewed as a party in this conflict. And I think that honestly some terrorist group a decade from now is going to blow up some bus full of tourists in Greece or someplace and it's going to be because of the war in Gaza and US support for that. And I don't want that to happen. So like that piece of it for me on the APAC front, I just think we should just be clear about like kind of what a PAC's goals are. Like it's an organization that essentially is demanding that everyone vote the kind of Netanyahu line. If you stray, you get attacked. Like I got called an anti Semite by the head of the ADL for suggesting that Bibi Netanyahu drunk dragged Trump into war with Iran. Which is like self evidently true. But I think, but I think like for Democrats it's like, hey, AIPAC wants you to lose. They primarily intervene in Democratic Party primaries and take out progressive candidates. So let's just like be, just, just be honest about like who, what this organization's values are and if you want to be associated with that, okay. But like, like, don't, don't tell me I'm wrong for raising it.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

I agree. I completely agree. And I think it's sometimes it's been a difficult conversation for a lot of us to have because I have, I'm an atheist. I've always been an atheist, but I have a lot of Jewish friends. And in Oklahoma, all of the Democratic fundraisers that I would go to the most progressive people there were Jewish people. We have very small Jewish community. I sent my kids to a Jewish preschool. And so I understand from having Jewish friends the dark cloud that you must grow up with, reading about World War II and the Holocaust and how horrible that is. But I also have some Palestinian friends and I have to value both of their suffering and both of their dark clouds the same and not give preferential treatment to either. And I think the emotional blackmail that is being put on by Israeli propaganda style sites to emotionally blackmail us that when we say that we see something that is morally wrong, that if we say that then somehow we have to tiptoe because we're going to be called an anti Semite is just wrong. And I think this situation is Craving a Democratic leader that can come up and speak factually and truthfully about this. Put the kibosh on all the AIPAC money. Like you said, they always want the Republicans to win. Okay, Tommy.

[Tommy Vietor]

Mm.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Let's play our game. It's a world famous game. Had it or hit it. Gavin Newsom's played it. Your former boss, Barack Obama's played it. Now you will play it. Oh, my God. Welcome to had it or Hit It. I would hit it. I hit it every day. Sometimes twice a day. Okay. Had it or hit it? Ms. Rachel.

[Tommy Vietor]

Hit it. I love Ms. Rachel. She's on all the time in my house. Also, she has been, like, speaking up for the humanity of Palestinian kids. These monsters attacked her for it. This group called Stop Anti Semitism suggested she was funded by Hamas. I made this video, like, defending her and calling these people insane. So now we're friends and we text. She's the nicest human being on the planet. Stop attacking Ms. Rachel for caring about children. Sorry if I'm going on too long, but it's. It's outrageous.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

No, I love that. So she followed me and followed the podcast on Instagram, so I have her on I screen. I asked her, but I think she's busy. I mean, I will. I'm gonna have her on. So I screenshot and circled it and sent it to my nephews. I have an older sister, so my nephews are, like, in their 30s, and they have little toddlers right now. And they were freaking out, freaking out that Ms. Rachel had followed me. She's the queen. Had it or hit it? Free speech, hypocrites.

[Tommy Vietor]

Hit it. I'm tired of these people. I'm tired of these people. Wait. I'm sorry. I've had it. I do not want to have sex with all the people trying to kick you out of the country. You were critical of Charlie Kirk.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Yeah.

[Tommy Vietor]

No. I'm so sick of this hypocrisy. You know what I mean? Like, remember Elon Musk used to tell us he was a free speech absolutist? Where'd that go? You know, where'd that go for Jimmy Kimmel? Where'd that go for any. Any student here who happens to have, like, written a completely vanilla, banal op ed about how, like, the war in Gaza is bad? Like, I just. I'm so tired of this. You guys do not care about free speech. You care about you speech. You, like, you want that to be free, you know?

[Host (possibly Angie)]

These guys are such babies pumps, and I call them titty babies. They just the. The list of things that they're triggered by. Jimmy Kimmel, Bad Bunny. White liberal women, Mexicans, black people, Colin Kaepernick. And it grows. Drag queens, gay people, Pod Save America. Guys. Can you imagine navigating a remote control? If you were a MAGA Republican, could you imagine the minefield that that would be? I mean, these guys are such pussies. It's unbelievable. It goes back to your very original grievance that we're getting beat by these total dorks that are terrified of Jimmy Kimmel, Stephen Colbert, and Bad Bunny.

[Tommy Vietor]

Yes, yes. And the President and the Vice President are like, number one. They log on to Twitter, they find something to be aggrieved about, and they write these like op ed length screech. Should you have something better to do?

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Have you seen that guy? Speaking of op ed link tweets his name. He's a big Bill Ackman, that guy. Total nut. I mean, can you imagine? Here's my thing about these billionaires. Can you imagine? You have crushed capitalism.

[Tommy Vietor]

Yes.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

You haven't flown commercial in decades. You. You can do whatever the you want to do, and then you saddle up with Trump. Like, that's your legacy. You don't leave some sort of thumbprint that you did something good, that you did something earnest, that you really help people. Your legacy is going to be writing novels on a white supremacist website named Twitter. For a man that cheats at golf, that is dumber than a box of hot rocks. It's unbelievable.

[Tommy Vietor]

They're so whiny, it makes me insane. Like, yeah, go, go get on your pj. Go to STOD or something. Whatever you people do.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Exactly. Okay. Had it or hit it, Ted Cruz.

[Tommy Vietor]

I'm hesitating because Ted was the only person who actually took a principal position on the topic. We just talked about when Kimmel was suspended and said, actually, no, this is bad for the FCC to do that. And so George Bush had a famous line, was the soft bigotry of low expectations. But I'm, I'm, I'm tapping that ass right now.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

So Ted Cruz, we pumps. And I always say we have the most unfuckable men in America list. And Ted Cruz was number one forever. And then until the rise of Stephen Miller. And now it's neck to neck. Like Stephen Miller, Ted Cruz, obviously neck to neck. But something glorious happened. Ted Cruz. I was on CNN the other night and I was bashing JD Vance because he wouldn't condemn the young Republicans. And I was like, you know, you have an Indian wife. You have mixed race kids, Magath. He won't stand up for them. He's not going to stand up for you. Ted Cruz retweeted the clip here. It is so good. He writes, this is disgusting. Leave his kids alone. Which, Tommy, I think this is so rich coming from the guy who Donald Trump called his wife ugly, said that his dad assassinated jfk, and then Ted Cruz is literally like feigning tears at the rnc, screaming, God bless Donald Trump. It's unbelievable, the moral collapse that happens when people capitulate to Trump. It's like one tiny centimeter and then progressively they become worse and worse and worse. Each and every day, everybody in his orbit becomes a worse person.

[Tommy Vietor]

That was. What a ridiculous, whiny baby. Especially when you think of the broader context, which is like Donald Trump and Republicans have spent the last five or ten years spending the majority of their time, like demagoguing trans kids, right? And like, you know, saying the meanest things they could possibly say to a community and attacking them constantly as part of just like a political prop. So Ted can fuck off. He is a little teddy baby. Should I take back my thing? No, I'm glad he said what he said about free speech.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

You have to have had it with Ted Cruz. You can have the caveat that sometimes assholes have moments of clarity. Yeah, that's it. Ted had moment. Raphael had a moment of clarity. But he sucks. He will always suck. He's undefeated at sucking. Well, actually, I mean, Stephen Miller probably sucks more. Okay, last one. Had it or hit it? The United States of America.

[Tommy Vietor]

Oh, I'm hitting it. I love this country. It's a great country. We gotta fight for it. I think what I'm excited about, right, Today's Friday the 17th. Tomorrow is Saturday. No kings. There's gonna be millions of people out on the streets protesting in their own unique, fun ways. In Portland, they'll be doing naked bike rides. Oh, the terrorists. The terrorist rallies that we're all going to tomorrow. Yeah, no, yeah, that's exactly right. The Hamas fueled terrorist rallies we're all attending tomorrow. No, but it is like, look, the first Trump administration, it was like out of the gate, huge protests. Women's March, March for our lives, right? There was this solidarity. There was this feeling that we were pushing back. Immediately there was a reminder to Trump that he had not won the popular vote, that we had the numbers and there was strength in that. And this time it has just been the opposite, right? It is this void and we are all feeling it and we're all looking for our leaders to step up, but I'm sick of waiting for them. So I'm really excited for everybody to come out this week and be on the streets and to be protesting. And so that's what I love about America, that we can still do that. That you and I can say the meanest things imaginable about the White House and we're allowed to do it. So I'm gonna hit it.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Okay. And now tell our listeners about Crooked Con.

[Tommy Vietor]

Oh, yeah, Crooked Con is coming up. It's. What the hell date is it?

[Host (possibly Angie)]

I know it's. I know when it is parents weekend at us.

[Tommy Vietor]

That's right. Yeah. No, cricket con is in DC on November 7th. We are trying to get the least annoying politicians, the smartest activists and strategists together to just get in a room and talk about the future of the country, what we can do better, how to fix things, how to fight. I'm going to do a nerdy thing about progressive foreign policy. I'm excited to do it. It's always fun to see people in person. I think we desperately need to convene more. Republicans are really good at this. Like cpac. They bring them all together, all these goobers in a room, and they figure stuff out and we got to do it. So I'm very excited about Crooked Con. So go to crookedcon.com if you want to come.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Cool. All right. Tommy, I just so enjoyed this. It's been long.

[Tommy Vietor]

Thank you so much for having me. You're like the only person in my TikTok these days, so it's really great. I feel like, I feel like, you know, this is a big deal for me.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Oh, thank you. We are huge fans of Pod Save and all of the work you do. And I agree with you that we all need to unite and collaborate as much as possible. And I just appreciate it.

[Tommy Vietor]

Thank you so much. This is really fun.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Okay, bye. He's cool, right?

[Kylie]

I love him.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

So smart.

[Kylie]

Oh, I would be so scared to be in a room with any of the Pod Save guys and try to hold my own.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Yeah, they're all very, very smart. They're all good looking guys too. I think that they're like the OG left political podcasters.

[Kylie]

Agree.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Yeah, Yeah, I think they're all great. Well, guys, Kylie, thank you for subbing for pumps. Make sure you check out Crooked Con. Make sure you buy our book. Life is a Lazy Susan of sandwiches. And we'll see you next. When do we see you, Kylie?

[Kylie]

We'll see you next Tuesday and Thursday.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Thursday. Thursday. All right, bye. I'll tell you what I've had it with. Let's hear it. I've had it with that. Listen up, patriots, Gatriots and Natriots. We have a new podcast that has dropped. It's called IHIP News. It's Monday through Friday. Every day, 15 to 20 minute hot takes on the political landscape of the United States of America, always served with a side of petty grievances.

[Jennifer]

We are on all the available platforms. Apple, Spotify, Google, wherever you get your podcasts and YouTube.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

Please go, rate, subscribe and review so that we will chart upwards with America's greatest legal mind. Pumps, pumps. What does an eagle say?

[Tommy Vietor]

Caca.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

A little bit more enthusiasm.

[Kylie]

Caca.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

That's it.

[Jennifer]

That's.

[Host (possibly Angie)]

That's caca. That's the patriotism that this country needs right there.