Triple Trumpers and Teeny Weenies

Summary

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I've Had It – “Triple Trumpers and Teeny Weenies”

Episode Date: August 21, 2025
Hosts: Jennifer Welch & Angie “Pumps” Sullivan
Special Guest: Dean Withers

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Episode Overview

In this dynamic and spirited episode, Jennifer and Angie (aka Pumps) dive headlong into what they’ve “had it” with—ranging from MAGA politics and American healthcare to misogyny, right-wing radicalization, and the insidious power of megachurches. Joined by activist and Gen Z political commentator Dean Withers, the show explores how young men are being radicalized, the cult-like devotion of Trump supporters, and the importance of public shaming in moving social change. Featuring pointed humor, righteous indignation, and real world stories, the episode galvanizes listeners to resist fascism, support progressive youth voices, and—most importantly—fight for those left behind.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

“Triple Trumpers” & Political Denial

[00:50 – 03:02]

• Angie’s Grievance:
  She’s “had it” with former Trump supporters now expressing “buyer’s remorse.” She rails against “triple trumpers” (those who supported Trump all three elections) claiming ignorance about Trump’s record:
  “That's willful denial. Because... all you had to do was Google ‘Donald Trump businessman, six times bankruptcy, casino bankruptcies, fraud verdicts out the gazoo.’ There's no excuse not to know.” – Angie [01:36]

• Jennifer’s Take:
  Finds it stunning that Trump—whom she calls a “mid range to fair con artist”—conned so many:
  “The more shocking, more telling part... is that seventy-seven million people fell prey... when I hear him talk, he's such a blowhard, right?” – Jennifer [01:53]

• Trump likened to Cheesecake Factory—too much, not enough expertise:
  “Donald Trump is like the WWE president and he's the Cheesecake Factory president.” – Jennifer [02:43]

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Healthcare System Grievances

[03:50 – 07:41]

• Jennifer’s Story:
  Shock at a $1,200 out-of-pocket bill for a routine kidney stone visit, despite insurance.
  “It is crazy that we live in the richest country in the history of the world and people will go bankrupt paying their medical bills.” – Jennifer [04:33]

• Highlights bipartisan failure and demonization of workers—politicians enjoy “gold star insurance,” while people struggle.

• Angie on Insurance Companies:
  Outrage that AI algorithms are used to deny claims, with MAGA politicians and even some corporate Democrats reinforcing this broken system.

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Corporate Welfare & Union-Bashing

[09:11 – 13:38]

• Jennifer asserts America consistently bails out corporations, not workers.

• Points out hypocrisy of union leaders endorsing Trump, who undermines unions.

• The right’s myth about radical teachers' agendas—paranoia and demonization fostered by Christian MAGA culture:
  “They beat up on teachers... hardworking people that do real physical manual labor.” – Jennifer [10:44]

• Rips into billionaire CEOs for disproportionate profits and abuse of infrastructure without sufficient taxation.

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Listener Feedback & Blue Dots in Red States

[14:00 – 17:16]

• “Kiki the Magic Lesbian” reads glowing five-star reviews from blue-state and Black queer listeners.

• Jennifer and Angie emphasize the power and distinctiveness of “blue dots in red states”:
  “We're a different breed of progressive, and we're going to bring the you brand to the midterms.” – Jennifer [14:48]

• Reflect on how calling out bigotry resonates—references to their viral moments and Fox News backlash:
  “The reason it hurt you... is because you know it's true.” – Jennifer [16:49]

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Christian Fundamentalism & Women’s Rights under Threat

[18:35 – 23:46]

• HuffPost Story: About a woman abused in a patriarchal church, with connections to Pete Hegseth.

• Jennifer draws parallels between MAGA goals and theocratic, authoritarian repression—warning of a push for “Christian golden age” that strips women’s rights.

• The hypocrisy: So many Republican women quietly pro-choice, never expecting Roe would actually fall.

• Angie:
  “You just don't understand how bad it was for women before they could get a divorce, before they could have their own money… They're trying to take away no-fault divorce.” – Angie [23:27]

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The Rise of Youth Misogyny & Social Media Algorithms

[23:46 – 24:52]

• Surveys show youngest boys are now most misogynistic, due to quick algorithmic radicalization via social media.

• Jennifer stresses importance of monitoring who young people follow:
  She’s proud her son watches progressive Hasan Piker and 20-year-old creator Dean Withers.

• Plays Dean Withers’s clip debating a MAGA supporter, deftly exposing cognitive dissonance.
  “You just said that you were a Christian... so then you wouldn't be a Christian?” – Dean Withers [26:17]

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Segment: Interview with Dean Withers

[33:49 – 75:56]

Dean’s Journey & Gen Z Radicalization

• Dean explains that car and gym culture is “coded right wing” online, making it fertile ground for misogynists like Andrew Tate to fill the gap left by a perceived lack of focus on young men from the left:
  “Andrew Tate ...hops in there and he says ‘I'm going to make you feel so self-important’... That's what has opened up the door... to heightened levels of misogyny.” – Dean [35:37]

• On Breaking Out of Conservatism:
  Dean’s friend and college philosophy led him to critical thinking and eventually progressive politics.

The Megachurch/Trump Parallel

• Dean & Jennifer rip into megachurches as the “religious industrial complex” that fosters anti-intellectualism, herd mentality, and the same cult behavior exemplified by MAGA:
  “It is all happening in mega churches... trained and indoctrinated to not...think critically... That's such a mind fuck.” – Jennifer [41:30]

The Cult of MAGA

• Dean describes three types of Trump supporters: willfully ignorant, misinformed, or “willfully evil.” Most eventually “move the goalposts” when presented with evidence of Trump’s misconduct.
  “Four out of five... will take that route of MAGA is a cult. They won't even care what they said before I played the clip.” – Dean [63:48]

“Owning the Libs” as Cult Ethos

• Jennifer:
  “Do you think the thesis... is ‘owning the libs’?”

• Dean:
  “That's one of the most common themes. Absolutely.” – Dean [64:12]

• Racism also cited as a core binding factor, especially surrounding immigration.

On Public Shaming

• Dean insists public ostracization and shaming are necessary tools for social change when critical thinking fails:
  “If we socially pressure these idiots... that want to come out here and tell us how invaluable women are... then I think we’ll eventually see generational change.” – Dean [56:13]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Jennifer: “All you had to do was give it a goo… That's what I've had it.” [01:36]
• Jennifer: “Donald Trump is like the WWE president and he's the Cheesecake Factory president.” [02:43]
• Jennifer: “When does the American worker ever get bailed out?” [09:11]
• Angie: “[Insurance companies are] looking for a way to deny your claims. And then this is what really chaps my ass.” [07:41]
• Dean Withers: “For those men who say ‘men are superior to women’—that is absolute beta... they have such little self-respect... It's a cope. It's a way to feel more important.” [54:32]
• Jennifer: “When it comes to the oppressors and when it comes to the bigots, I want to be able to say to them, fuck you.” [54:05]
• Jennifer (on Charlie Kirk): “Charlie Kirk's a pussy. I love it.” [68:36]
• Angie: “We need a debate between Charlie Kirk and Dean Withers!” [70:37]

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Had It / Hit It Segment

[65:20 – 72:08]

• FaceTime in public: unanimous “had it.”
• Autocorrect: both “hit it.”
• Charlie Kirk: “I've had it with Mr. Kirk big time.” – Dean
  Story follows about Kirk refusing to debate Dean, culminating in:
  “Charlie Kirk, why are you such a titty baby?” – Jennifer [70:48]

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Final Thoughts and Reflections

[75:57 – End]

• Jennifer and Angie express deep admiration for Dean Withers and reflect on the power of the next generation’s clarity and moral resolve.
• Emphasis on the importance of platforming and supporting progressive youth in the face of right-wing propaganda targeting young men.
• Final appeal: Buy their new book for tales of personal growth, mistakes, and hope.

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Top Timestamps

• 00:50 – Angie’s “Triple Trumpers” Rant
• 03:50 – Jennifer’s Healthcare System Story
• 09:11 – Corporate Welfare and Unions
• 14:00 – Blue Dots in Red States & Listener Feedback
• 17:16 – Jennifer’s Viral Rant & “Owning the Libs”
• 18:35 – Christian Nationalism and Women’s Rights
• 23:46 – Youth Misogyny & Social Media Radicalization
• 33:49 – Interview with Dean Withers Begins
• 35:37 – Dean on Radicalization of Young Men
• 41:30 – Megachurches & MAGA Indoctrination
• 63:03 – MAGA Cult & Types of Supporters
• 65:20 – Had It / Hit It Segment
• 68:32 – Story: Charlie Kirk Refuses to Debate Dean
• 72:08 – Merch: “Master Debater”
• 75:43 – Closing praise for Dean Withers

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Conclusion: Episode Essence

With trademark brashness and wit, Jennifer and Angie shine a spotlight on the cultural, economic, and political forces warping American public life. Their conversation with Dean Withers provides firsthand perspective on fighting rising misogyny and extremism among Gen Z, challenges listeners to reject cult thinking, and underscores the necessity of public confrontation in the fight against fascism—and, yes, teeny weenie energy.

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Transcript

[Jennifer]

So are we supposed to start the podcast?

[Angie]

Ready, one, two, three.

[Jennifer]

Patriots Gay Trio. They Trio, Black Trio, Brown Trio. For the permanent record, those of you that are new, the off is not to the aforementioned atriates.

[Angie]

Right.

[Jennifer]

It is to the people who don't support those people. That's right, yeah. Because sometimes we get new people and they're like, why did she say fuck off to those people? And it's just been an evolving thing that you have to have been here from the jump to understand. Like at one point we called her Princess Diana and Meemaw meat curtains. And it's just a long, sordid.

[Angie]

Now I'm a beaver.

[Jennifer]

Yeah. It's just, it's just non stop Thickery on America's top DEI podcast Pumps. What have you had it with?

[Angie]

Okay, what I've had it with. Before you even say it, I'm going to say, yes, I have this. But this is a different context because Jennifer Brown beats me about this all the time. So it's a spot it got it situation. What I've had it with is I open up my phone and it's all these triple trumpers that are now having buyer's remorse for obvious reasons. Small businesses are crapping out bankruptcy, deportation, deportation, jobs numbers. I mean, he's underwater on fucking immigration, okay? The economy shithole recession coming. And they're like, he condes. I just didn't know. I'm like, motherfucker, that's willful denial. Because you. All you had to do was give it a goo. Donald Trump businessman, six times bankruptcy, casino bankruptcies, fraud verdicts out the gazoo. Like, there's no excuse not to know. So now to say we were conned, it's like, yeah, he's a great con artist for sure, but you played a part in it. Like you. All you had to do was give it a goo. That's what that's. I've had it.

[Jennifer]

He really, he really is not that great of a con artist. I think the more shocking, more telling part of this is that 77 million people fell prey to a mid range to fair con artist. That's the problem for me because for me, when I hear him talk, he's such a blowhard, right? You immediately know when he's. I'm the. I know everything there is to know about grass. I know everything there is to know about Hannibal Lecter. Anybody who says they thing all the time about every subject, you immediately know they know nothing.

[Angie]

Right?

[Jennifer]

It reminds me of the Cheesecake Factory menu, right? When you have an Italian section An Asian section, a Mexican section, a Japanese section, an American section, all in one restaurant. You know that none of it is going to be good because they're not experts in any of it.

[Angie]

Right.

[Jennifer]

And I don't even know that I've ever had their cheesecake, but I would think, just based on the aforementioned menu diversity, that the cheesecake would probably be lackluster too. So Donald Trump is like the WWE president and he's the Cheesecake Factory president. No disrespect to cheesecake, unless you're triple trumpers.

[Angie]

Then fudge you, then fuck you.

[Jennifer]

Oh, I did find out after my rant about Cracker Barrel, I did find out that they supported DEI and Pride Month, but then I also found out that there was. There's like a big lawsuit against them. Black employees getting paid less. I haven't dived into all of it, but yeah, I just thought, you know, Cracker Barrel, I know that a name that black people call racist white people is cracker.

[Angie]

Right.

[Jennifer]

So when I was feeling that moment, I just thought this. There seems like there's nothing whiter than Cracker Barrel.

[Angie]

Right.

[Jennifer]

That story you have to walk through.

[Angie]

Before you get to the restaurant. It's like a Trump online flea market in real time.

[Jennifer]

Yeah.

[Angie]

Just a lot of knickknack patty wax.

[Jennifer]

It really, really is. Okay, let me tell you what I've had it with. I've had it with the cost of healthcare in this country.

[Angie]

Absolutely.

[Jennifer]

And I never get sick. I never go to the doctor. But you all know that like a month ago I had these kidney stones. And so I have to go to the hospital because I literally think I'm dying. I get so much pain. I'm like, this is not normal. More pain than childbirth. So I'm at the hospital for like probably four hours and then I get sent home. Well, I. And I have insurance and I paid a $200 copay when I arrived at the hospital. Hadn't thought about the bill or anything like that before I came up here to sit down. I had the part that my insurance didn't pay and it was a twelve hundred dollar hit out of pocket that I had to pay. Fortunately for me, I can pay that twelve hundred dollars. But I know a lot of people that do not have twelve hundred dollars sitting around to pay for a health issue like this. And it is crazy that we live in the richest country in the history of the world and people will go bankrupt paying their medical bills. And that's just. This is just a kidney stone issue. If you go get to cancer and all that, it's debilitating. But then the option for these people that don't have the twelve hundred dollars sitting around is they don't pay it because they don't have it well, then it goes on their credit report and it's constantly just squishing them down. So this whole system is set up and endorsed by MAGA and some corporate Dems. A lot of the American culture is set up to attack poor people. And then when people are in poverty and These people work 40 hours a week, right, then they are browbeat by politicians by saying if you want good insurance then you need to get a better job or you need to work harder. All of these politicians, mind you, have like, you know, gold star insurance through their job as being a member of Congress at the Senate. And it just when, when it happens and you look at it because I haven't really ever had health issues and I saw that bill, I thought, my God, I know a lot of people personally that I know that would get that $1200 hit and go, right? How am I going to pay this? How am I going to get this paid? By no fault of their own, they just got sick. I'm healthy. I, you know, you know me, you have to force me to go to the doctor. And I just, that really is just tragic. And within that issue that affects every American, whether you're a triple Trumper, a total racist, non racist woke ass liberal, everybody falls prey to our horrible for profit medical care system in the United States. And you see that if people live in, you know, suburbs or rural America or even inner cities anywhere and they're working 40 hours a week and then they have a side hustle doing some extra stuff on the weekend and then they get hit with this. You would get so disenchanted with both parties, right, because they're both beholden to corporate interests. And then you pile onto that, that you hear that this medical, you know, insurance company had record earnings and their CEO got a $50 million bonus for, right? And you're sitting there and then the media, the legacy media is calling you lazy and you know, not worthy of the decency and the respect of health care. And you see how all of this fascism comes into play with or without Trump. A lot of our systems have really, really failed hard working people.

[Angie]

What also comes to mind is when you see reports that these insurance companies create algorithms to deny claims. Artificial intelligence, I'm sorry, artificial intelligence. So they are looking for a way to deny your claims. And then this is what really chaps my ass. While everybody's debating Trump's horrific bill that is going to cut like what, 17 million Americans from Medicaid. James Lankford, one of our senators, big Jesus guy, big Jesus guy. I mean he stands on that Bible and he is not for poor people. He said, well these people, they should just get health, get a job and they'll have health insurance. Okay, problem with that, James, over 50% of the companies in this country do not provide health care insurance. So why don't you pass a law that if you have over X number of employees, and I don't mean like 150, I mean like if you have four employees or whatever, you have to cover them with health insurance, that would make a huge difference in people's lives. So they're not paying the premium, but instead we're going to have them work 40 hours a week at Walmart and then they need all these benefits because they make like 7:50, 7:25 an hour minimum wage. So they have to have these benefits. They don't have health insurance, but they're the problem and not the corporations and the businesses that are not providing access.

[Jennifer]

It's corporate welfare. It is total. This country is set up where corporations will always get bailed out. Banks, airlines, the farmers, they're always getting bailed out. But when does the American worker ever get bailed out? In fact what they do is then they start demonizing the American workers efforts to unionize, right? And then they start brow beating unions. And then in a weird twist, this last election, one of the main big union guys who got in a fight with booster box, Mark Wayne Mullens, our other dipshit big Jesus guy, Senator big Jesus guy, they endorsed Trump. Well now they fucked around and now they're finding out that, you know, the Republican party has been on the record for wanting to dismantle and demean unions across the board. In our state listener, this red state, they say that teachers unions, and this is just a complete lie, but this is how deranged these Jesus freak hypocritical MAGA Christians are that teachers, teachers unions have an agenda to radicalized a radical transgender litter box agenda onto the students of Oklahoma, number one, that's just a million percent not happening. But they beat up on teachers, they beat up on hardworking people that do like real physical manual labor. That I guarantee you, James Lankford, I guarantee you if we had a push up contest, I guarantee you I'd beat his ass.

[Angie]

I'd beat his ass.

[Jennifer]

Yeah, I mean he is A pink arm pussy. However, they beat up on these hardworking people. But then, then they say both things like he'll get out and he'll speak about his faith and how he, the good people of Oklahoma and you know, we're Bible reading folk and we, you know, we, we, we're the. And then he goes, and he votes against veterans, he votes against unions and all of these MAGA Christians and a lot of the corporate Democrats, they have enabled and participated in a system that has left the American worker behind. All to prop up a few people that are in the board of directors. And then they brag about record profits and they brag about the CEO bonuses and then they demean the people who get left behind. And it is, it's completely insane. Like when you think about how Elon Musk got all of his money, I mean it started under a Democratic administration, Barack Hussein Obama, and he got all those tax credits and his customer base were all liberals. Well, you know, then he gets all strung out on ketamine and apparently this is a rumor. I don't know if it's true or not. He had a botched penis surgery. I read that on his own website. X. I don't know if it's true, but I read it on his website.

[Angie]

That would track with his behavior.

[Jennifer]

Yeah. And then he starts spiraling and he goes dark maga. This guy would be nothing without the American taxpayer. And you get all of these people to go vote for the Elon Musk's, the Donald Trumps, the Jeff Bezos of the world. And like they don't want to take care of their workers. I would think, like if you're a billionaire and you won a capitalism, you were able to skirt the system and right place, right time and all this shit, you'd be like, you know what? I want to do something really different. I want to be the billionaire that said I, my CEO is going to be paid and paid the most, but it's not going to be such a disproportionate percentage of profits. I'm going to make sure the people that work here are paid really well. I'm going to make sure they have gold star insurance. Because I have, I just looked at Tesla stock. It's worth over $1 trillion. I think the same for Amazon. That's, that's just you money. But when they give you money, they literally look at all of the workers and all of the American taxpayers that help them get there and say fuck you. Yeah. And think about this listener, Jeff Bezos should pay Extra, extra, extra, extra, extra in taxes because his company use uses more roads than you do. His company uses more airspace than you do. They use a lot more infrastructure, which means it tears it down. So there should be a special tax because he runs his business, because he doesn't have retail stores that he has to pay ren for. All of his stores are all these trucks that are out on the road.

[Angie]

All the time that you see constantly. Yeah.

[Jennifer]

And so it's just insane. But what do we know? We're just two old broads with our little podcast. Welcome to I've had it. I'm Jennifer.

[Angie]

I'm Angie Hbic. The aforementioned beaver. Head beaver in charge.

[Jennifer]

Yeah, the head beaver in charge. Let's do a little check in with Kiki the magic lesbian. Hi.

[Angie]

Hi.

[Kiki the magic lesbian]

I have two reviews for you today.

[Angie]

Okay. Okay.

[Kiki the magic lesbian]

The first one is truth shall prevail from Mary Mack from New Haven. Five stars. And she says, love this podcast. A ray of hope in a desolate landscape. I live in a blue state, so to hear such clarity from ground zero of maggot land is a rope I am clinging to in this wretched dystopia of the United States.

[Jennifer]

Of the divided states.

[Kiki the magic lesbian]

Sorry. Of the divided states.

[Jennifer]

Yeah, she said divided states, and that is true. Thank you so much, Mary Mack from New Haven. And I have to tell everybody because we have a lot of people from blue states. We have international listeners, and we also have a lot of blue dots in red states. And Mary Mack, the. The blue dots in red states. We're pissed.

[Angie]

Yeah.

[Jennifer]

And we're a different breed of liberal. We're a different breed of progressive, and we're going to bring the you brand to the midterms, and we're going to bring the you brand to the 2028 Gavin Newsom. I don't care what they do. Gerrymander. Anyway, same for you, Pritzker. Same for you, Kathy Hochul. Any blue state. Let's gerrymander. Let's fucking go.

[Angie]

Let's fucking go. Because the reality is the Republicans have far, far, far less population. Yes. I mean, it's not even close.

[Jennifer]

Not even. Not even comparable.

[Angie]

All right.

[Kiki the magic lesbian]

Okay. This one is five stars, titled Love it from Burn a Tree, and she writes, as a married black lesbian female entrepreneur. I absolutely love you girls. I'm currently sitting in a Mexican restaurant, and boy, do I have some pictures to share of the light people in here.

[Jennifer]

I'm telling you what some. I'm going to tell you what, guys. The reason that clip of me calling them out went so viral Like Greg Gut feels like, who is this lady anyway? I've never heard of her. And I'm like Greg, exactly. Why are you talking about me then? Y' all are talking about me because it hurt you. In the same sentence they said this reminds me of Hillary Clinton calling us deplorables. There's still 10 years later but hurt over that. You know why? Because it resonated. Because they recognized it was true.

[Angie]

Right?

[Jennifer]

Donald Trump every single day for 10 years wakes up happy Easter to everybody except for the pathetic low life scumbag leftist losers. And you don't hear liberals going oh my God, Donald Trump called me a scum loser. Especially ten years later. But the reason you guys got so butthurt about that from a no name, we don't even know who she is. Have a Wikipedia page, she gets too much Botox, blah blah, guilty on all charges. Totally am. You should see what I look like without the Botox. You'd really be scared then. But the reason it hurt you and the reason Fox News did wall to wall coverage is because you know it's true.

[Angie]

Right?

[Jennifer]

You know, when you hang out with all white people, you know the racism that's dripped in and you probably leave those places and you don't feel too good about it and then you do go to a Mexican restaurant or you do go to a business that's run and or operated by immigrants and they're is a sense of humanity and kindness and common thread there. Then you're like this is pretty cool about America and you know, you know it. And that's why they did wall to wall coverage.

[Angie]

Yeah.

[Jennifer]

And I stand by it. I stand by it. Triple trumpers. Triple trumpers. If you went 1, 2, 3, if you voted for him three times, if you triple down on this guy and you want an ethno state, then live in it, start living in it right now. The rest of us want to watch sports. We support African American athlet, support our businesses from people who are first generation Americans. I support anybody who wants to come over to this country with a dream just like anybody, like our ancestors did. And I'm not going to be addict to them. So you just swing for the fences, Fox News. Because I ain't scared.

[Angie]

Yeah. I mean all day on that day, I can't remember the day it was. I mean you led every single news.

[Jennifer]

Program and they kept Fox News and they kept who is this lady?

[Angie]

Who is. And I'm like, Greg, if you watched Fox News the whole day, you would intimately be familiar with her by now, because it has been the nonstop story. In the meantime, the news breaks that Ghislaine Maxwell has been transferred and has work release. But of course, we're not talking about that on Fox.

[Jennifer]

No, no, no, no, no, no, no.

[Angie]

No, no, no, no. We're talking about Biden.

[Jennifer]

We're talking about you.

[Angie]

What else are we talking about? Hunter's laptop. Hunter being back in the news, gives him huge segments. Jesse Waters is convincing us what's masculine. Wink, wink.

[Jennifer]

All right, now onto the news. Huffington Post has an article coming out, and it says, my husband said God wanted him to spank me. Our church told me I couldn't say no. If this sounds familiar to you, Secretary of Defense Pete Hegseth is part of the same denomination. So this is that church that Pete Hegseth. CNN did a report on it where they talked about women need to submit to the husband, they want to do away with the 19th Amendment, and that women were just to be vessels for breeding. Okay, And Pete Hegseth, when they posted the video of this article, he retweeted it and put all Christ all the time. And this is the work that Angie and I want to do with this podcast. You guys, aside from just brow beating idiocy, we're in the middle of fighting fascism. Once we win that, then we'll go back to brow beating idiocy. Right now, the work that we want to do is to say to women and men that look and sound like us that triple trumped, do you want your daughter in a marriage where her husband can violently abuse her? Do you want that for her? Because I think your answer is probably no. In the same way, if I were to ask you the question, if your daughter is raped, do you want her to carry her rapist baby? And I think your answer is probably no. Well, they've already proven to us they're taking away her options with right number two. But if your answer is num is no to question number one, then I have to remind you that this administration, their answer to number one is yes. They do not want women to be able to get divorces. All of the stuff, if you're old enough to remember when George W. Bush spoke about Sharia law and Islamic countries that. That have Sharia law, hate us for our freedom. Basically, what the MAGA movement wants now for your daughters, for your sisters, for your mothers, for marginalized groups, is for them to be kept contained, controlled, and abused. So you're voting for this. And I know and Pumps knows, too. A lot of women that have always been Republicans that have always voted Republican, they, they were pro choice. Either they had an abortion themselves before they ever got married and their husband doesn't know about it, maybe their daughter has had an abortion and the husband doesn't know about it. But they're inherently pro choice. But because of their religious indoctrination, they always vote Republican. They never thought the Republican vote would lead to the overturning of Roe v. Wade. And because of that overturning, women are dying, women are suffering, and women are forced to carry their rapists baby. And if you're a rich woman or man and your child gets impregnated, you can get on an airplane and you can go to a blue state where they treat people with decency, integrity, integrity, give them agency and give them autonomy. You can travel there if you have the money and your child can receive that care. But in red states like ours, all of these MAGA policies are attacks on poor people. And what I ask you is when you put your head on the pillow at night, and I don't care if you're religious or not, but I'm not. And I have this kind of moral clarity about this. Shouldn't we fight for the rights of the weakest among us? Isn't that the bravest thing to do? Isn't that the most earnest, morally correct thing to do, to fight for those that are the weakest among us to be able to rise up from suffering?

[Angie]

Yeah, I would think, and been a long time since I've been knee deep in the Bible, but I think that was one of the main tenets of Jesus Christ and that we're doing the exact opposite.

[Jennifer]

Yeah. So this is. You guys, this is crazy. I mean, this, this woman, her husband said that God told her that God wants me to spank you. And then of course, that led to just horrific abuse. Doug Wilson, who is the pastor of the Secretary of Defense, Pete Hegseth, this is his church. He' the one who's all about this. And he's the one who is trying to promote the Christian golden age under Donald Trump. And I have a big news flash for all of the women that vote because their husband says, hey, if you want that extra purse and you want that extra vacation, you better go vote Trump, otherwise we have to pay a lot of taxes and you're not going to get stuff. And that conversation happens all over America. You're voting against your own rights and you're voting for a future where your daughter will be openly and legally abused and basically a hostage in her own home.

[Angie]

Right and it's already happening now. You see it everywhere, all these people that are like, rah, rah trad wives and all that. I'm like, you don't understand how bad it was for women before they could get a divorce, before they could have their own money. You just don't understand before note, fault divorce. They're trying to take away no fault divorce.

[Jennifer]

All right, next up, for the first time in history, repeated studies are suggesting that now the most misogynistic, outdated, regressive attitudes towards women and girls are the most common among the youngest. Based on her research, she says a teenage boy will have extreme misogynistic content served directly into his feed less than half an hour after setting up an account on social media. The reason for this is because of a really algorithmically facilitated form of mass radicalization that is happening to young men and boys.

[Angie]

That's terrifying. That's absolutely terrifying because there's no way you can keep your kids from having the Internet. You know what I mean? They're acting like there is, but there really isn't. And that, you know, look at who's making the algorithms. Of course, I mean, I think of like neutered Mark Zuckerberg, Elon Musk, like these people are not have any intention of making sure there's integrity and those kind of things are kept from the Internet.

[Jennifer]

And so in, in talking about what we can do because long once Trump is done, we still have major problems in this country. And as mothers, one of the biggest things I've done with my kids over the last five to six years, and I have one that's 19 and one that's 22, is ask them what, who they follow online. And I check and see who they are following online. And that is something that you need to check. You need to check your friends, you need to check your kids, especially like, who are they following? And my oldest son followed Hasan Piker and watched his Twitch streams. And he is a progressive, a real alpha male that stands up for women, that he himself is for the advancement of women and for the equality of women and for the equality of black and brown people in the LGBTQ+ community. And he has stood on that. And another one that my youngest son just turned me on to is a 20 year old content creator that my youngest son watches a lot. And this guy's name is Dean Withers. And Kylie has a clip of the work that he does. He goes live on TikTok, I believe, and he streams and he debates with maga people. And here is an Example of the work that this guy, this 20 year old kid is doing right now. And I'm so proud of my son that this is who he has found to follow. All right, play the clip.

[Dean Withers]

Why did you vote for Trump? Well, I voted for Trump because I didn't really like the whole Biden administration because it presented weakness. Okay, so what specifically about the Biden Harris administration presented weakness? Well, just that, you know, they wanted to help everybody they could. So you think like, okay, are you a Christian? Yeah. Did Jesus want to help everybody that he could? Well, I don't really know if Jesus was actually alive. Can't prove that. You just said that you were a Christian. Well, yeah, that's what I align with. So if you're a Christian, that means that you believe Jesus was alive? Well, I believe in what I know for a fact. So then you wouldn't be a Christian? Then I guess I wouldn't be a Christian. I'm so sorry. You're just racking my brain. I like, this is hell for me.

[Jennifer]

So he does these, you know, hours long where they come on and he. I don't think he's necessarily trying to change their opinion as much as he is. Highlight the moral duplicity and the cognitive dissonance because maybe if you see it in another person, you're like, well, boy, that sounds crazy. This guy kind of owned. Owned them. It would start unlocking parts of your own moral duplicity and your own moral rot and maybe bring you back to a more to at the impetus of maybe some enlightenment towards being a better person, a more empathetic person, a more kind person. So at my son's request, we were able to get a hold of this Dean Withers. And that's one of the coolest things about the podcast is right. Like my son doesn't watch the podcast, but now he will be able to watch this one because he's a huge Dean Withers fan. And so I would like to welcome Dean Withers. He is a political content creator, 20 years old to I've had it, Pumps. And I need to share with everybody that we have written a book. It's called Life is a Lazy Susan of Shit Sandwiches and Believe it or not pumps. And I have not always been so rock solid. And we talk about all of our trials, tribulations, most of all are fuck ups. Yes. Because fuck ups are relatable and a part of the human experience.

[Angie]

I have gotten so much feedback regarding the book that because of my situation with the religion and addiction and all that, that people relate to that. So I do think there's something to take away that's comforting about it because we've all been in very difficult situations.

[Jennifer]

And Listener, what we want you to do this is the IT book for summer reading. So please get your copy of Life is a Lazy Susan of Shit Sandwiches and take a picture of yourself with the book in really great places. And tag at I've had it podcast and we will share your images with our Summer IT book. You can buy it in bookstores, you can buy it in the link in our bio. You can buy it at Target, Walmart, Amazon, etc, all the retailers. Happy reading and Happy summer. Foreign let's just go ahead and have a little chat about a subject the whole world wants us to ignore. And I'm talking about our hormones. You know Listener, hormone health is so important because it controls so many things in our day to day life. Our energy levels, mood, metabolism, sleep and even skin health.

[Angie]

Your body is constantly changing. Hormones shift, energy fluctuates and stress takes a toll. If you're feeling sluggish, stressed out or just off, it might be time to start looking at your hormone health.

[Jennifer]

And that's why Listener I recently started using Glow by Beam. It's a once daily hormone balancing blend for women that has made a huge improvement in my life. And you need to try it too. It contains 18 comprehensive active ingredients, vitamins, minerals and natural antioxidants and added electrolytes for a hydration boost. Over 40 women have trusted Glow by Beam to support their hormone health and now it's your turn. Glow is here to help bring you back to Balance. Because balance isn't a luxury, it's essential for a limited time. Beam is offering our listeners up to 35% off Glow. Just visit shop beam.com had it and use code hat it at checkout that shop be a m.com hatit and don't forget to use the code Hattit for your exclusive discount. Today's episode of I've had it is brought to you by Honey Love. You know Listener, when I think about summer, I think about breezy dresses, bold colors and effortlessly cool looks. And then I oftentimes think about bras and I'm like, there's nothing effortless about that. And that's why I'm so happy. I have discovered Honey Love shapewear. They have the targetive compression and their bras are just so incredibly comfortable.

[Angie]

What I love about my Honey Love Super Power short is that it holds my stomach in. That's my problem area. And they have what's called Mesh Sculpt. It's the ultimate summer shapewear and it's not super hot.

[Jennifer]

And Honey Love isn't just about shapewear. They also have unbelievably comfortable bras. Honey Love's best selling crossover bra, which is my favorite by the way. Listener gives all the support of traditional bras without using any underwires. I even forget that I have it on Listener. Treat yourself to the most comfortable shapewear on Earth and save 20 off site wide at honeylove.com had it use our exclusive link to get 20% off honeylove.com had it after you purchase, they'll ask where you heard about them. Please support our show and tell them that we sent you Experience the new standard in shapewear with Honey Love. I'm so done with people acting like low sex drive is just a part of aging. Like, oh, you're in your 40s. What did you expect? I expected to still want sex, thanks.

[Angie]

Exactly. And that's why there's Addie. It's the first FDA approved little pink pill for certain pre menopausal women who are bothered by a low sex drive.

[Jennifer]

Addie helps bring back your libido. It helps you feel like yourself again.

[Angie]

Yes, it's real, it's researched, and it's not just part of getting older. It's something you can treat. Go to addie.com to learn more. A--Y-I.com addy or flibanserin is for premenopausal.

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[Dean Withers]

Hi, nice to meet you guys.

[Angie]

Hi, nice to meet you.

[Jennifer]

You know, it was my son, my youngest son, who told me about you, and so he sent me some videos, and I started watching it, and I thought, you know, this. I love this guy. And we have to build such a huge coalition, all like a big tent coalition against fascism. And so I'm so excited that you could join us today. And most importantly, as a mother to a child your age, I'm forever grateful that you exist and that you are getting such huge numbers. I'm forever grateful that I raised my son well enough that he found you and he watches you instead of Andrew Tate or what's his name, Charlie Kirk. How are you today, Dean?

[Dean Withers]

Well, you know, I'm doing pretty good. It's a nice morning out here in Colorado and about your son. So every day I run a podcast where people can tune in and talk, talk to me, and I typically talk to Trump supporters. But one day about a month ago, he actually came up and he said that he was excited to see me on his mom's podcast in around a month. So I actually got a small chance to meet and talk to your son. And that is really cool that he's been able to manage to go down the right path instead of the wrong path. And, you know, that's what I focus on is trying to provide some type of political outlet for younger Americans online that doesn't make you raging misogynist racists or condone fascists. Fascists or fascism.

[Jennifer]

I know. And why do you. Why do you think that there is this problem and it's really heightened at people your age that they are so radicalized so quickly to have such misogynistic views that you would think that, like, people my parents age or my grandparents would have. But we're seeing the most extreme radicalization at your age. What's your take on that? Dean?

[Dean Withers]

Well, I think there's a lot of reasons why we see younger Americans, a lot of younger men as well, shifting farther to the right. That one reason we see this is because right now, the right kind of dominates the culture in younger men. You know, maybe a lot of younger men like cars. Well, for whatever reason, liking cars is right coded. Same thing with going to the gym. For whatever reason, gym influencers online are right coded. And one thing that they have been good at is really ingraining themselves into that culture. And the left hasn't been as good at, at that and you know, the last four or so years. So maybe that's what has kind of opened up the gateway. But I mean, even building off of that, I would say one thing that people like Andrew Tate capitalize on is the idea that, well, a lot of the people on the left are evaluating systemic issues that impact this country and the people within it. And a lot of people on the left like to focus on marginalized communities because if we want equality, we need to focus on those that are disadvantaged and, you know, get everybody to an even, to an even playing field. But then people like Andrew Tate have the takeaway. Well, this just means that they're not focusing as much on young white men. So then he sees that as a market opening and he hops in there and he says, hey, for all these young men that feel forgotten by the left, I'm going to make you feel so self important. In fact, I'm going to tell you that you're more important than everybody around you. And that's what has opened up the door in my mind to heightened levels of misogyny within young men in this country. At least one of the respects.

[Jennifer]

All right, Dean. We like to ask all of our guests what they've had it with. So now it's your turn. Dean Withers, what have you had it with?

[Dean Withers]

Well, I think I sent you over a handful of things before we hopped on here, but there was one big one that I wasn't able to send over to you that I've really had it with. Is it okay if I bring that up or should I share it?

[Jennifer]

Oh, sure, yeah.

[Dean Withers]

Okay. Okay. I've really had it with coffee from coffee shops. And I know that sounds crazy, but I've just. I've had it. I've had it with, with coffee shops. Let me tell you, in the last six or seven months, I have gotten really into making coffee at home. And, you know, I've. I've made the investment. I've bought my own espresso machine. I focused on where you get the best beans from in the process to get the best cup of coffee. And what I've realized is it is so easy to make a cup of coffee, a nice latte or a polish out of espresso that is better than anything that you will get from nine out of 10 coffee shops in your hometown. Just by taking a little bit more time, you get a better cup of joe. But whenever I go to these coffee shops that will charge me 7, $8 for the same thing, you know, It's, It's. It's rushed through and at the expense of, like, so much quality, it tastes worse. And I've had it. You know, that's one thing I've had it with.

[Jennifer]

So you're a coffee supremacist?

[Dean Withers]

I. Well, I guess, you know, some may say. Some may say. I, you know, I don't. I don't frown upon, you know, the coffee of others, but I do frown upon, you know, charging $7 to make a suboptimal cup of coffee with a really good espresso machine. Because that's another thing. A lot of these coffee shops have great equipment it. But they just don't use it in a way that produces the highest quality coffee.

[Angie]

I'll tell you what else about the whole coffee shop thing. I'm. First of all, I'm not spending $8 on coffee, full stop. But putting it on the Internet. If everybody's drinking coffee and everybody's buying coffee at stores, it's not newsworthy. It's not. Putting it on your social. That just drives me crazy. Dean, do you put your coffee on your social media feed?

[Dean Withers]

I don't. I don't put it on my social media feed, but I've been considering it. It's. It's been. It's been a thought in the back of that.

[Jennifer]

It's. It's incubating. Like, you're making such supreme coffee. You're like, I might have to share how f. How fantastic this is. But I can agree with you on this because coffee is. I. I really love coffee. I don't drink. And so, like, a really good pharmaceutical strength hit of coffee. Like, even thinking about it right now, I'm like Pavlov's Dogs. Like, my mouth can start salivating thinking about a really strong espresso. Okay, let's move on to one of your other grievances, which happens to be my number one grievance. And these are mega churches.

[Dean Withers]

Oh, yeah. You know, so the mega. I think mega church pastors. Now, I. I've done a little bit of research. I haven't done enough to be able to sit here and philosophize about the intricacies of why these people suck. But from what I do know, mega church pastors just. Just on the surface level, irk me. You know, I'll be looking at people like Kenneth Copeland, I think his name is. Who is worth. He might be a billionaire. I'm probably wrong. If it's not a billionaire, he's worth, you know, multiple hundreds of millions of dollars. Who Will go out and make statements about how he's spending millions of dollars on a new private jet pulling from the donations to the church because he doesn't want to be in a tube in the sky with demons referring to everybody else than economy plus. And then he turns around and he'll go on stage, either online or at his megachurch and say how much, you know, Jesus loves everybody and how he's a good person with good intentions and good goals to, you know, convert the world into one and which is moral and going to heaven. But then acts completely different in private. I mean, you know, it just, it kind of shows me that it's, it's about the money, it's, it's about fostering people into a group of followers that is so devout and so loyal because they think that it's well intentioned and in servience of their God. But in all reality it's just a dark twist on pulling at people's desires to be part of a group to exploit them financially.

[Jennifer]

And it's a religious industrial complex that operates in this country without taxes and is responsible for all the indoctrination that MAGA talks about that they think is going on in public schools. It is all happening in mega churches and they are trained and indoctrinated to not, not critically think. And the money that goes into this, like we have a megachurch in Oklahoma and now they have them all over the United States. It's called Life Church. And I looked on their website and they have I think 600 million just sitting, you know, just, just sitting in the bank. The pastor has a couple of private planes. He's a big MAGA guy. He's now going on tour with like Kaylee Ann McEnany and all of this stuff. And it is, to me it is the biggest grift. And it is so insidious to go into these communities in suburban America, rural America, and provide them with what they think is culture. And they have rock bands and the light shows and then they're just indoctrinating them against critical thinking. And that's such a mind fuck when you tell a kid when they think, wait a minute, did somebody really live to be 900 years old? Or did Noah get all those animals? No, you can't think that, you can't question that. That's the devil at work. To me that is just such, it's a beautiful. I think it's child abuse. And I think we live in Oklahoma City, Dean. So we're in pumps. Was raised in this culture I think it is the worst cancer in America and I think it led a lot of these voters straight into maga. Blind obedience. Let's face it, he's just like an evangelical preacher. He griffs, he has the hair. Bullshit artist. I mean, Trump is familiar to them because he's just like a evangelical megachurch pastor.

[Dean Withers]

Right. You know, I think that this is a perfect opportunity to wrap in Trump. But you know, first, I agree with everything you just said. You know, I myself grew up going to a private Catholic school and you know, I vividly remember being 12 or 13 and starting to have questions about, you know, what was being forced on me by my family, friends and school. And the answer was always, well, you can't ask that. And the moment you start asking these questions, you're looking for evidence instead of following with faith. And that's a mark of the devil, as you pointed out, out and more. So wrapping Trump into this, it's, it's, it is an industrial complex of hinging on people's anti intellectualism, forcing them to follow a narrative and you know, think with the, with the hive instead of galvanizing, you know, the importance of critical thought inside of us. You know, he will just turn around and lie, lie, lie, lie, lie. He will contour any narrative to his advantage, no matter who suffers because of that.

[Jennifer]

It.

[Dean Withers]

And I feel like that is one thing that he has done better than any other politician, you know, that's, that's served our country in my lifetime and he's done it, you know, without, without a care in the world. And I mean this is now why we have people believing that the GOP and MAGA as a whole are maybe truly tough on crime even though like somehow they're also supporting a 34 count felon that is part in violent offenders.

[Jennifer]

Right.

[Dean Withers]

It's just because you'll tell them they, they hate crime and, or truly good for the economy. You know, it is the, we're entering into the golden age of American prosperity even though we're adding $4 trillion to our national debt and kicking 10 million people off of health care. You know, they don't want to talk about that. And it all goes back to, you know, the new dawn of anti intellectualism, the acceptance of cult like behaviors and the depiction of Trump very similarly to that of a God or a megachurch pastor.

[Angie]

Yeah, it's really interesting to me and we were talking about before you came on your background, you were raised by conserv of parents, Catholic school. I wasn't able to pull my head out of my ass until way later.

[Jennifer]

In life, few years ago, maybe a.

[Angie]

Decade probably started or whatever. But so you're 20. How does this work? Because I was outside the scope of my parents, you know, I was no longer in that, going every day doing what they were saying. You're living, I presume you were living in your parents home through like high school. So how did that happen for you?

[Dean Withers]

Well, that's a good question. You know, I feel like I had a lot of bad influences, you know, we've already kind of talked about and that you just repeated. But I also had some good influences. You know, I had a friend throughout high school that was, you know, another guy kind of like me, but he held the polar opposite political beliefs. And he's also a really intelligent guy and really good at debating. He got me into debating too. So that's why I do what I do now. But you know, I would talk to him and I would actually debate with him for so long. And we did this for months and for years, intermittently, kind of just for fun to explore truth. And the more I talked to him, the more he was right and I was wrong. And then, you know, we had January 6th come around. And that was kind of like the big moment for me where I was like, dude, we have a president that is sending fake slates of electorates into seven of our key swing states that he lost in the election to try to, to rig the outcome of the vote. There's no way that anybody can support this. So that's when I redacted my support from Trump, but still kind of held on to those right leaning social takes. But as time progressed, that trend continued. But then the big moment was going to college in CU Boulder. I got really interested in philosophy, so I took an intro to philosophy course by this professor of the name of Michael Humer. Now Michael Humer is libertarian right wing, but inside of his classes I learned the foundation of thinking critically, attempting to reason with the use of a quote unquote scientific method and exploring truth in a brand new way. And it is those virtues that I then took to the online coliseum of political debate and started exploring this with others and eventually reasoned myself to all the conclusions that I hold now.

[Angie]

Yeah, it's crazy because when I was doing work with my therapist on religion, he was like, just go pick up some Freud. Go pick, you know, different things. And when you really start reading it, I mean, obviously when you have things like you're not supposed to critically think. I can't critically think. And then you Start pulling yourself away from that. But when you start reading and researching and learning about religion, kind of.

[Dean Withers]

Made.

[Angie]

Me kind of like embarrassed. Maybe not to other people. I felt gullible. That's what it was. I mean, I was just like, you're not a dumb shit. I mean, you might be a dumb shit, but not total dumb shit.

[Jennifer]

But you were indoctrinating.

[Angie]

No, no, no. I know, but there was a part of me that felt very, very gullible, more than betrayed. Just felt because I think the people that were bringing me to it were earnest in their beliefs, but nobody ever critically thought. And I. And I missed that boat for like 30 years.

[Dean Withers]

Well, I think what you're describing is the inclination of humanity to want things to be true that will benefit them personally. And I mean, I think that's one big reason why so many people have been quote, unquote, gullible to so many faith. Faiths is because, you know, a faith gives you the representation of an idea that you don't actually die, you live forever. In fact, you're going to live in the best possible plane of existence created by a God that's all perfect, all knowing and all loving. And, you know, when we kind of compartment, compartmentalize that fact alongside other facts, such as the idea that when you're a Christian inside of a Christian community, your life is going to be significantly easier than if you were an atheist. We see a perfect framing, sir. So for why so many people might be quote, unquote, gullible. But I mean, you know, I think at the end of the day, religion truly does benefit a lot of people. There's a lot of people that do it right. There's a lot of people that are able to guide their lives with their faith as a weapon of love instead. Sorry, a symbol of love instead of a weapon of hate. But, you know, I just think the moment that they cross that line and go into that territory of saying that, you know, we now need to ban women and girls access to health care, because apparently the Bible says so. Or guess what? Now we're going to challenge the Supreme Court to overturn gay marriage. Because I think the Bible says so, is when we get into a very dangerous territory where we really need to start promoting critical thoughts, where we really need to start hammering home about a separation between the church and the state. And we probably need to retrospect and reflect on what led people into these positions of such faith and grandeur in the first place. Kind of like we're doing right now.

[Jennifer]

Yeah. And I think the one thing that particularly irritates me, living in the Bible Belt about Christianity and Catholics are not like this because you have to, like, go to school and pass a test to be a Catholic. You have to get confirmed and all that. But evangelicals, the recruiting, oh, my God. Let me just tell you what I went through growing up. So my parents, atheists, I, all of my peers, Bible thumpers, tongue talkers, constantly told me I was going to go to hell. But I was never indoctrinated. And so whenever they would tell me about spiritual warfare and all this stuff, I wanted to be a part of their group because I was young, I was an impressionable teenager. So I'd go to their churches with them, and then I would leave and I'd go back home and I would tattle on myself to my mom. Like, I went to church. These people are really screwed up. She's like, I told you. And then the. This lie that's told to a lot of Christian, particularly women in the south by evangelical Christians. And the lie is that if you pray and you're a good girl and you submit to your husband, everything's going to be fine. And that's why I think you have. Have Pete Hegseth's pastor, who recently did the. The alarming story on CNN that Pete Hegseth retweeted, all of Christ, all the time, they're coming after women like us. And so when I think about these MAGA men, we're talking about the manosphere and sexism. When I think about their growing list of people that they're scared of, it's really ridiculous. Like, drag queens, trigger city trans kids wound up like cheap clocks. Believe the lie that kids are going to school and getting their wieners whacked off. They believe that. They believe that kids are going to school taking shits and litter boxes. They're triggered by cat litter. They are triggered by flags, rainbow flags. They're triggered by Hispanic people, Asian people, black people, any form of an immigrant. They're triggered by people that speak English as a second language. And now they've added to their list the liberal white woman, the liberal white woman. These alpha men are terrified of liberal white women. And I just think it's such a layup for Democrats and progressives because this is such beta. And I'm not really into quantifying masculinity, but they are.

[Angie]

That's what I was going to say. I've never even thought about it. I've just thought, he's a pussy little dick energy. But now I'M fixated on somebody that lifts up women, lifts up other people. And I think, okay, that's an alpha male. The people that are browbeating women and trans kids, those are fucking pussies.

[Jennifer]

I agree.

[Angie]

And they're just crying around. We can't be first at everything anymore. Shut the fuck up with your teeny weeny. Sorry.

[Dean Withers]

I feel like.

[Angie]

I don't know, that just felt weird. Cause you're so young and I'm old. I don't know, that just felt weird in front of you. And I say it every day on the podcast and. But Dean, I just. I don't know, I feel very weird right now.

[Jennifer]

We get.

[Dean Withers]

No, it's okay.

[Jennifer]

We get really worked up over this because we feel like to be the opposition to this. Your generation, I appreciate so much because you don't want to harm anyone and you want to be inclusive of everyone, and I feel that too. But when it comes to the oppressors and when it comes to the bigots, I want to be able to say to them, fuck you. I think you're a piece of shit. I think you exude little dick energy. But the difference between you and me is I'm going to vote for you to not go bankrupt when you have that heart attack, that inevitable heart attack from all the fried food you're eating, you fat ass. That's what a Gen Xer. That's how I want the Democrats to fight them. You want me to suffer just because I'm a liberal white woman. And recently I went viral on something and I received, received multiple, multiple dms, emails, phone calls wishing sexual violence on me. And that's the difference. I don't want these people to suffer, but I sure as want to tell them what pieces of I think they are.

[Dean Withers]

Well, I mean, I think if you ever tune into my podcast, you'll see something pretty similar. Listen, outside of talking about politics, one big thing that I discuss in my live streams is misogyny is the patriarchy. And this typically would, would find its way into my live streams by talking to men on the right that think men are better at leading than women.

[Angie]

Yeah.

[Dean Withers]

And I have had so many of these conversations and for those at some of the times, it reduces down to the idea that men are superior to women. And there's something very interesting that you guys just brought up of the idea of, you know, the men that are out here thinking that men are superior to women. We live in a male centered world and it should be that way. Men are better. No, that is like absolutely Beta, I mean, think about it. These people have such little self respect, little self dignity, a little self worth, that instead of, I don't know, going to therapy and working on it, they instead project their own issues onto those around them and they'll say, hmm, if I decide that all of the women around me are less valuable than I am, then I will be more valuable than 50% of people alive, respectively. And I just think it's a cope. It's just a big cope. It's a way to feel more important. And of course, you know, none of them are emotionally intelligent. None of them have a good head on their shoulders. So they're gonna do it in the most harmful way possible. And I mean, it's that system and many others that have upheld, you know, these virtues for so long and ensured that women didn't have the right to vote until the 1920s. Women didn't have the right to, to get a credit card without their husband's consent until the 1970s. And women didn't have the right to report rape inside of a marriage federally until the 1980s. So get pissed. I mean, it's important to get pissed. Shame them. You know, one thing that I can guarantee will absolutely be a tool of making our society better is public ostracization and shame. There's so many people out there that the critical thinking we've been talking about simply won't work on, but social pressure always will. So if we socially pressure these idiots, these, these brainless who want to, want to come out here and tell us how invaluable women are and how everybody sucks except for rich white men, if we shame them, then I think we'll eventually see generational change and move away from those ideals.

[Jennifer]

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[Angie]

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[Angie]

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[Angie]

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[Jennifer]

Okay, so Dean, you, you spend a lot of time talking to MAGA people. And tell me, number one, the first part of my question, and what is the common thread that you see, you know, over 90% of maybe your callers or the people that you talk to that they have in common. And number two, do you think it is a culture?

[Dean Withers]

So point number one, what's something that everybody has in common? Either being willfully ignorant, ignorant or evil. That's, that's the way I look at it. Willfully ignorant, misinformed, or evil. Those are the three traits that pretty much everybody I talk to has in common. You know, to start off with, number one, willfully ignorant. You know, somebody can support Trump if they just simply don't know what he's doing and don't really care. Point number two, misinform. Somebody could support Trump if they think that his policy is generating good outcomes because they're misinformed about, about the nuances of said policy, et cetera. Or third, somebody will support Trump because they're willfully evil and they want a fascist to take over. That's something they all have in common. Yeah. And then in response to your second question asking if MAG is a cult, I think that there's a lot of people that support Trump that genuinely are good people that are just misinformed. I talked to a handful of people like that on my stream. You know, we'll have people come up, they'll say, I support Trump. Then I'll start informing them on why they're wrong. And they'll be like, dang, dude, I've never thought about it this way. You're right. I no longer support him. So I see that side. But there's even more people that truly are members of the cult, don't care and won't ever care. And I see that on my live even more. You know, something that I will frequently do is I will ask these Trump supporters if they hold any red lines against Donald Trump. Hypothetically, if Donald Trump did X, they would stop supporting him. And if it's not murder, Donald Trump's either done it or something close to it, and I could always turn it around back on them and then they'll still support him. A good example of this was yesterday. I was sitting on my live stream, I was talking to a Trump supporter and I asked them because they had brought up the fact that they care about child safety. I asked them, would you still support Trump if he had openly boasted about perving on naked adult women and naked teenage girls in their changing rooms without their consent and then ogled at their naked bodies? And they said, no, I would stop supporting Trump right now if he did that. That's. That's perverted. I couldn't. I couldn't. Well, then I'll play them the clip from Howard Stern's podcast in 2005 where Donald Trump did exactly that. I mean, it's crazy. If you haven't heard this, please go on YouTube and find it now. You guys know what I'm talking about. And then I'll play them the clip, and then I'll be like, okay, you're at a fork in the road. Right before I played you this clip, you told me that you would stop supporting Trump. Trump if this is something he had done. And then I'll usually even get it a little bit more into it and play their answer back, because I have the ability to do that. And I'll. And I'll say, you're at a fork in the road. You could either be, you know, be a man of your word and stop supporting him or prove to everybody watching that mag is a cult. And, like, four out of five people that I do this to will take that route of mag is a cult. They won't even care what they said before I played the clip. They. They learned that this hypothetical red line is something Trump has actually done. And then they go right into that mental gymnastic mode of trying to find a way to defend it.

[Jennifer]

All right, Dean, let me ask you this. Do you think the thesis sentence or the ethos of that cult, the number one prevailing value that they have over all others is owning the libs and never agreeing with the libs. From your experience talking to them, this.

[Dean Withers]

Is one of the most common things. That's one of the most common themes. Absolutely.

[Angie]

What about racism? I feel like that binds them pretty tight too.

[Dean Withers]

Oh, yeah, yeah, definitely. I talk to a bunch of very racist Trump supporters. There's a lot of them that will just intentionally mispronounce Kamala Harris's name to be an asshole. And then there's also a lot of Trump supporters that will come up on my live stream and talk about immigrants with me and mass deportation, and it always reduces down to something racist. I mean, so immigration is, you know, like, the main topic I like to focus on or like to study. I like to Read about. And the facts just don't matter to these people. At the end of the day, you know, they will accept if mass deportation fucking destroyed this country and, you know, sent our economy into the blender and made everybody live in poverty with crime out the ass. As long as the undocumented immigrants were out, they're happy. And you know, I just, there's no way that that doesn't reduce back to racism. And you know, know, they'll even, sometimes they'll be like, okay, I, I'm pretty sure what you're telling me reduces down to racism. Feel free to prove me wrong by giving me good reason to actually support the claim. And they don't. They can't.

[Jennifer]

Okay, Dean, now we're going to play a game that we play with all of our guests called had it or Hit It. Oh my God. Welcome to had it or Hit It. I would hit it. I hit it every day, sometimes twice a day. Had it or hit FaceTime calls in public.

[Dean Withers]

Oh, I've had it with that.

[Angie]

Had it. People that did that sack.

[Dean Withers]

Wait, had it means that's bad, right?

[Jennifer]

Bad, right?

[Dean Withers]

Yeah, okay. Yeah, I've had it with that.

[Jennifer]

Okay. Had it or hit it? Autocorrect.

[Dean Withers]

Oh, hit it. Oh, I love autocorrect. I can't spell at all. I love it.

[Angie]

Yeah, I can't spell either.

[Jennifer]

Okay. Had it or hit it.

[Angie]

Charlie Kirk.

[Dean Withers]

Oh, I've had it with Mr. Kirk big time.

[Jennifer]

Is it true that he refuses to debate you?

[Dean Withers]

It is true.

[Jennifer]

Spill.

[Dean Withers]

The tea explicitly refuses to debate me. There's quite a story here.

[Jennifer]

Okay, spill it. Spill it.

[Dean Withers]

So this is pretty hot. In fact, there's a lot about this that I haven't publicly spoken about. But I'll publicly speak about it now. Why not?

[Jennifer]

Oh, yay. Breaking goes breaking news.

[Dean Withers]

Before the election, I went on Jubilee and there was specifically an episode where Charlie Kirk was surrounded by 20 liberals, including me, me. And we all sat down, I debated him. It was fun. I think I destroyed him. It was awesome. But anyways, after this episode, I was able to get a hold of the number of his manager. And after this Jubilee video aired, you know, and everybody was like, dang. You know, Dean Withers made a good point. I reached out to his manager and I was like, hey, I would love to have a follow up debate and sit down with Charlie Kirk. Can we get this done? And he was like, well, let me ask Charlie. I'll get right back to you. He goes and he asks Charlie. Charlie's like, sure, I'll do Another sit down debate with Dean. With him, there's his manager. Ryan sends me back a message saying that. And I'm like, okay, let's schedule it. When does this. When are we going to do this? He's like, right after the election. We're going to do this. Okay. The election passes. I reach back out to his manager. When is this happening? Left me on red. You know, open the text, left it on red. Couple of months go by, I try again, same thing, okay. Then I drop it. But then I end up going down to Texas A and M when Charlie Kirk was down there doing his sit down, prove me wrong. And. And I'd go down there because I really want to talk to him, right? So I get up to his. To his booth. I'm the first in line. You know, he'll. I think he said that. Oh, I cut in front of everybody. No, I was the first person there. Three hours early, right?

[Angie]

He's mad. He cut.

[Dean Withers]

You cut.

[Angie]

You cut her.

[Dean Withers]

What a titty, baby.

[Angie]

What a baby.

[Dean Withers]

And then I bring the camera with me and I'm explicitly denied entry into the line to debate him. And they. And he will say, his staffers will say it's because Dean didn't go to the school. School. They were letting people in that didn't go to the school. People are coming on the mic explicitly saying that they didn't go to the school. Other influencers that were there with me that Charlie Kirk knew didn't go to the school, got the chance to talk to him, but he didn't want to talk to me. And, you know, that's fine. He ran from me. There was a clip of Trump supporters in the crowd actually asking him to debate me, and then him going, it's fine, whatever. He ran for me now. I ended up recording that. I posted it online and it got 50 million views across my social media platform.

[Jennifer]

God, I love that.

[Dean Withers]

Yeah. Charlie Kirk running.

[Jennifer]

Charlie Kirk's a pussy. I love it.

[Dean Withers]

And then, yeah, one last part of the story here. After I posted these clips on my social media, Charlie Kirk's manager then reached out to me and said, hey, Kirk would love to have you sit down as a guest on his podcast and have a debate with you.

[Jennifer]

You.

[Dean Withers]

I even got a call from his executive producer saying, let's get this done. Let's select a date, let's select a time. This is going to be awesome. And after that, I then sent out a tweet saying, charlie Kirk has agreed to sit down. He stopped running. That was four months ago. I haven't heard a word or a peep from them since I tried reaching back out. He just simply doesn't want to chat.

[Angie]

No, because he's scared. Because he's a dipshit and you're not. And he's is a puss boy.

[Jennifer]

Here's the most important part about this listener. So whether you're in, you know, a Gen Z like Dean or Millennial, and you have, you know, children that you're raising or Gen Xers or whatever, we need to traffic all the kids and all of the youth that are interested in politics to Dean. The reason he doesn't want to sit down with you is he doesn't want to platform you because you will start taking some of his support because you spit facts, you reasonably think. And you're not an. And you can be an asshole for good, but Charlie Kirk is a prick for bad just for the sake of being a prick, just for the sake of being a grifter. And he knows that if he has you on and he platforms you that you will start stealing some of his base voluntarily. They will voluntarily go to you. So we have to do, in this big tent that we're making, we have to do. We have to drive all traffic to Dean Withers. I'm a hundred percent in with you on this. This. We have to shame Charlie Kirk. Kylie, I need you to make this into a real right pussy. Charlie Kirk is. We need to get it going on TikTok and all that stuff.

[Angie]

Be humiliated.

[Jennifer]

Well, yes, but. Of course he would be humiliated. He knows it. But he also knows a lot of those college students that watch him would kind of be like, yeah, you might.

[Angie]

I mean, I just. We need. We need a debate between Charlie Kirk and Dean Withers.

[Jennifer]

Charlie Kirk, why are you being a pissy? Why won't you debate Dean Withers? Charlie Kirk?

[Angie]

What's the matter? He's like half your age, dude.

[Jennifer]

Charlie Kirk, why are you such a titty baby?

[Angie]

Cry, cry, cry.

[Jennifer]

Oh, and then south park really gave it to him, which was fantastic. But okay, let me just ask you. We're going long, but I think our listeners are really gonna love you if you have time. Let me just ask you this.

[Dean Withers]

Go ahead.

[Jennifer]

Does he realize when he made the T shirt that said master Debater, does he realize that he's owning himself for that, or is he trying to go, look, I'm leaning into it. I mean, he got completely annihilated by South Park. Park.

[Dean Withers]

He made a shirt that said that. I didn't even know that you're Being.

[Jennifer]

No Kylie, put it up on the screen. Charlie Kirk made a Kylie will find it. He's selling merch that says Master debater, right?

[Dean Withers]

Oh, geez. Well, I think he's really trying to lean into it and like hopes that he is. Look at that. Yeah, okay, Master Debater. He's really trying to lean into it and hopes that, you know, people will be like, we'll look at him and you know, they'll see this guy that's like, hey, I don't mind getting made fun of on South Park. I'm cool. I'm with it. Yippee. But like, in all reality, I don't know, it's clear to me that he's trying too hard. That south park episode was fucking hilarious. They did a wonderful job. And he's just really trying to lean into it so then he doesn't look butt hurt. And of course he had to throw the grift in as the sprinkles on. I'm sure that t shirt costs $45.

[Jennifer]

Yeah, I think he's scared of being platformed next to you because he knows, knows a lot of women that he's trying to. Something in them was like, wait a minute, an Mrs. Degree? Hold up a second. You know? And what he's trying to present to the public could be easily disputed as evil and shameless and grifting bullshit by you in record time. I mean, he would invite you on for an hour, you would mop the floor with him in 45 seconds. He's that big, big of a dumbass dipshit. And I just, I know it's not right to make fun of people's appearances, but the gums and the smile, it's just too much.

[Angie]

Here's what happened. I didn't ever notice that before Jennifer points it out to me. Now I can't see anything else. I'm just like, oh my gosh, he does. He looks like a cartoon character when he smiles.

[Dean Withers]

If I could give my take on him real quick, you know, I, I think that Charlie Kirk isn't a dumbass. I think he's more insidious than a dumbass. You're right. Incredibly intelligent and he knows exactly what he's doing. You know, to deny that he's been able to build a very strong, well founded and powerful machine on the right to pull the support of the youth would be denying reality. That's a fact. But in a sense, I feel like this is more insidious because Charlie Kirk, he will never go against maga. He will never go against Trump. And if, you know, you ask me, I feel like that's the reason why he won't debate me, is because. Because he knows that in some ways, he's just flat out wrong. And it would maybe take 30 seconds for me to detail this, but he will continue to hold to it and believe it anyways, because he's a shill for Trump. And whatever he says Charlie Kirk does. I have never seen Charlie Kirk go against the status quo of the right. And in the minute ways that he has separated, it's usually in a way that is even further to the right. Right, not further to the left. He's. He's just a grifter for whatever Trump wants him to say or do. And that's just more insidious than being a dumbass. In my mind.

[Jennifer]

I. You know what? I completely agree with you. He isn't a dumbass. It is very insidious, and he knows exactly what he's doing. And we would be remiss if we didn't point out that he was the big promoter of release the files. Release the files. Release the files. One could even say he was the alpha of. Of releasing the files. But like any faux alpha would do, when Trump called him and said, hey, quit talking about this, he immediately said, like, immediately, right now, do you want me to post? Go live? Okay, I will. And he immediately followed in line with it. And so it's. They. I would think for these people that are that. That go that hard in the paint for Trump, they have to limit their exposure, like you said, because he has no conviction. So he can only see. Speak to the cult, and he can only speak to people who want to confirm their own bias. And having you on there, even people that are listening to Charlie Kirk for the purposes of confirmation bias, it's. This isn't even really deep nuance thinking to say so all it took was for Trump to call you, and now you don't care about something. And you could, you know, do the math on how many minutes he talked about it and how many posts he did about him. It's a very simple takedown. But, oh, my gosh, Dean, with. I love having you on, I see why my son is a huge fan of yours. I want you to take over the youth airwaves from the Charlie Kirks of the world. We're big fans of yours, and I can't thank you enough for coming on because now my son will listen to my podcast.

[Angie]

He'll think you're cool.

[Dean Withers]

Well, it was a pleasure to sit down with you both. I really enjoyed the last 50 minutes or so and I appreciate the invite and it was fun to get to chat. It was fun to get to chat.

[Angie]

All right, thanks, Dean.

[Jennifer]

Thanks, Dean. Bye. Bye.

[Dean Withers]

Have a good one.

[Jennifer]

Bye.

[Dean Withers]

Bye.

[Jennifer]

Don't you think his parents are really proud?

[Angie]

Okay, 100%.

[Jennifer]

Like, how smart is he?

[Angie]

100%. I. But being that they're conservative, I wonder if there's a torture there. But no, you'd have to be super proud of your. His parents. And I'm just going to. I mean, I know this is going to shock people. At 20, I was not that together. Not even a little bit.

[Jennifer]

I wasn't either. I wasn't even close to being that pulled together.

[Angie]

No, no. He is just. He's five stars. He's getting five stars from me.

[Jennifer]

I love the tea. The Charlie Kirk tea.

[Angie]

It surprised me. Zero. That Charlie Kirk is a piss.

[Jennifer]

But I agree with Dean that Charlie. It's insidious. That Charlie Kirk, we outwardly, we see dipshit, but he's being a dipshit intentionally. He's intentionally dipshitting himself for the grift.

[Angie]

Right. Well, and here's the deal, too. And correct me if I'm wrong, I might have my MAGA influencers confused. He wasn't religious until he realized the Christian right was going for maga and now he's religious.

[Jennifer]

Yeah, I think that he. I believe that that's true. That he was trying initially in his first foray into politics. He was like, he saw that the trends against religion and he was. He was kind of like, yeah, we don't need to be so Jesusy, and I'm all for separation of church and state. But then he realized, like, everybody realizes, like maga. Like Donald Trump realized, like Vladimir Putin has realized, like Benjamin Netanyahu has realized the easiest people to manipulate are the brainwashed Christians. Those are the easiest ones to get the money from. That's why they're so. That's why these mega churches, these pastors are so wealthy, healthy, because the congregation is the easiest to manipulate, the easiest among us. There's no critical thinking. They just accept everything at face value.

[Angie]

And cognitive dissonance is a way of life for sure.

[Jennifer]

All right, listen up. This. We went long today because Dean was cool. And I honestly didn't realize. We went long because it was such a good conversation. Please buy our book. Life is a Lazy Susan of Shit Sandwiches. The link is below in the show notes Pumps.

[Angie]

Tell them we will see you next Tuesday. Tuesday and Thursday. I'll tell you what I've had it with.

[Jennifer]

Let's hear it. I've had it with that. Listen up, patriots, gay triots and Natriots. We have a new podcast that has dropped. It's called IHIP News. It's Monday through Friday. Every day, 15 to 20 minute hot takes on the political landscape of the United States of America. America always served with a side of petty grievances.

[Angie]

We are on all the available platforms. Apple, Spotify, Google, whatever you get your podcast and YouTube, please go rate, subscribe.

[Jennifer]

And review so that we will chart upwards with America's greatest legal mind. Pumps, pumps. What does an eagle say? Caca. A little bit more enthusiasm. That's it. That's, that's, that's the patriotism that this country needs right there.