← Jesus People Podcast
Jesus People Podcast
How One Confession Sparked a Campus Revival | Jennie Allen | Jesus People Podcast Episode 64
00:44:18
Loading summary
Transcript129 lines
- [00:00]
A
You've really been at the center of the two major college revivals in the last five years.
- [00:06]
B
It was like my whole body weighed an extra £150, like I just couldn't move.
- [00:11]
A
There's something about confession that breaks the yoke, and then there's something about how the enemy moves, that wants to keep things in darkness.
- [00:18]
B
And I've seen miracles. I mean, I've seen masses come forward. I have watched repentance. I mean, people's lives are being changed.
- [00:25]
A
Why does it seemed like revival always breaks out when that happens? First?
- [00:30]
B
Everybody's yelling at their sin. This girl pierces through all of it, and at the top of her lung, yells out,
- [00:43]
A
Guys, welcome to the Jesus People Podcast. Today we've got the great honor of having Jenny Allen on the podcast. So excited for this one. Jenny, thank you so much for coming so far to. To visit us here in Dallas.
- [00:54]
B
Hey, it wasn't so far. I bet I was closer than most guests, but I'm so excited about this. And, Ryan, I just. Every time we hang out, I wish we could hang out for days. I just love your heart. I love what you're doing for the kingdom and how you're bringing light to stories that need to be told. And I'm just so grateful for you.
- [01:11]
A
Thank you. That means a lot. My wife was telling me earlier, don't embarrass me when Jenny comes over just because she just loves you. She loves you.
- [01:18]
B
I love her. So it's mutual.
- [01:20]
A
Now, she's the best. She's back there right now, but, yeah. She did your Bible studies in college, and it's crazy. Yeah. You've had such a long, fruitful ministry.
- [01:29]
B
Thank you.
- [01:29]
A
It's pretty cool. And you've seen some stuff recently that's been pretty incredible that I have not heard from you yet. I purposely wasn't asking you it when we were hanging out in the kitchen before, because I want to hear it here on this podcast. But you've really been at the center of the two major college revivals in the last five years, and one just happened, what, a week ago?
- [01:52]
B
Yeah. So Southeastern University seu. It was wild. I can tell you the whole story. But, yeah, I was so blessed to be in the room. I mean, just blown away.
- [02:04]
A
Yeah. I mean, tell me more. I know very little. I know that it was really. Were you going out there to speak?
- [02:10]
B
Yes. So there was a conference, and there were incredible speakers before me, so certainly God used just these few days to bring these students who already are mature. There's no doubt in my mind, like, that school is special and the work that's being done there and the leadership that's there, I got to know really well. In fact, I think we all consider each other family after that experience because it was so bonding. But I can say there's such special, humble leadership there. And the students are just fire. They love God. And so what happened was I was sitting there, it was the last day of the conference, and I was sitting off to the side worshiping before I walked up to speak. And I felt the same thing in my body that I felt at Asbury. I'd been blessed to go to Asbury in the early days when the first few days were happening where no one had heard about it, no one was there. I walked in and there was like 100 kids in the room in the middle of the night.
- [03:13]
A
Yeah, because you were one of the first to report on that. I remember seeing your social media videos being like, revivals happening at Asbury College.
- [03:20]
B
Yeah, I don't even know how I heard about was just super small. I mean, Luke Lafever is one of my best friends and he called and was like, ginny, we're going to Asbury. I was like, okay, let's go. And I bet it was day two or three. And so, you know, I remember even going to Asbury and thinking, nobody's going to care about this because nobody knows about this. But I just wanted to see it for myself. And of course, my heart just wants to see this happen on earth. I've been doing ministry for a long time, and Asbury was really some of the beginning of watching that happen. I will say in 2018, when Gen Z was first in the room on college campuses, I definitely tasted it. I saw it at Texas A and M in an arena. I did confession and they were yelling out their sin all over the arena. It was crazy. And it wouldn't stop. Baylor, same thing. We were there for hours and they were confessing their sin. That was in 2019. So, you know, I've seen it since Gen Z got in the room. You know, really is is my story on that. And then what happened though, at seu, I was sitting there worshiping and I felt the same thing in my body. And again, I've been on the road with unite, my friend Tanya Pruitt's ministry, and JP and I have been speaking in. I mean, I think I've been on like 20 campuses or so, and I've seen miracles. I mean, I've seen masses come forward. I have watched Repentance I mean, it's. You know, everybody's calling that revival, and they should, because it is real. I mean, people's lives are being changed. We're baptizing and pickup trucks and everywhere. It's so fun. But as far as, like, that feeling in my body because of the presence of God falling on a place, the only other time I'd felt it was Asbury. And so it's seu. I'm about to go speak. It's seu. I'm about to go up and speak. And I can't stand up to worship because of this weight I feel. And Asbury was the same feeling. It was like my whole body weighed an extra £150. Like, I just couldn't move and I couldn't sing. I couldn't do anything. And so I'm like, lord, what is happening? And the only thing I could think of was Asbury, because it was the same exact feeling in my body. And. And I heard the Lord. I mean, again, everybody might be critical of this, but in that moment, I felt the Lord whispering, I'm about to pour out my spirit on this place, and it is for the purpose of them pouring out my spirit on to the ends of the earth. And I was like, okay, well, what do you want me to do? Because I prepared a message, of course. He was like, I want you to call them to the mission field. I was like, okay, I don't have a message for that. It's not in my back pocket. But okay. So I go up, and that's what I taught, and that's what I preached. But at the end, I said, but you can't go and spend and give your life away to Jesus until you have confessed your sin and named whatever the bondage is that is controlling you. So we did that. And I just said, yell it out. Like, just yell it out.
- [06:31]
A
Everyone together. Everyone yelling.
- [06:32]
B
Yeah. I mean, there were probably, like, three, I don't know, 2,500, 3,000 students in the room, and they just start yelling their sin. It's really beautiful. I mean, just to hear wailing. I mean, there was wailing in the room. Just repentance. And this girl in the back, I can't wait to meet her. One of my friends was standing beside her and told me more of the story yesterday. Actually. She was, like, weeping, weeping, weeping. Like, convulsing, like, weeping before she did this. But I do believe God used her to break the room. Like, I do believe this was the moment. And everyone in the room would say, this is the Moment everybody's yelling at their sin. This girl pierces through all of it and at the top of her lung yells out, abortion. And my friend that was near her said, and then she just fell to the floor. Now this is a super religious school. I mean, that is a very brave thing. And all of the words changed after that. It was so much more raw. People were saying what was real. And so I really believe, like her bravery and courage was what happened that caused this to happen. And so I finished. I had never planned for that to go so long. I kind of thought they would like yell it all at once and we would be done. And, um, it went on for 15 minutes. They wouldn't stop. And so I am looking at the Pastor Jonathan on the side and I go, you know, I close somehow. I close. I sit down, we're past time now. Cause it's gone too long. I sit down with him and I'm like, hey man, you know, the thing I didn't get to do that I wish I'd done was just a commissioning because, you know, I talked about going to the ends of the earth and sharing the gospel. And so he was like on it. So he goes up and then calls me up with him. And this is the craziest part is he says, if you feel called to vocational ministry or called in the mission field, come forward. I think 1500. A thousand to 1500 students out of 3000. I mean, it was like awkward. The people that were left standing there, I was kind of proud of them. I was like, wait, a not like fake a calling, you know? Yeah, it's like, good for you. Like you don't feel called, don't come forward. And so, you know, most of the room came forward. And so now we're like commissioning these students to go and die. You know, I mean, what's crazy is I didn't know is that they in a few months are sending hundreds, I think I heard the number 700 students to really dangerous places and short term missions. And so I really do believe that where Asbury was for the world and built the world's faith, I really do believe that SEU was for those students. I think many of them will go on the mission field. I think many of them will give their lives to ministry. And I think this, you know, they went, they worshiped to finish the story. In case you haven't heard. They ended up kind of like Asbury. They couldn't stop. They didn't leave the room. And the presence of God was so thick, like they didn't leave. And they didn't leave until a week and a half later, like this past, you know, Friday. So it was just. It was surreal. And watching the leadership make decisions. I mean, they were so humble. And they're like, we're not forcing anything. If we think it's over, it's over. Like, we're not. They prayed every hour. They met and prayed every hour to consider, like, is this over? Do we need to keep going? And they just watched the students and just to see, like, if there's hunger and they want to be here, we're going to stay. Now, what you have to understand, I know people are critical of this. And just watch, like a sound bite on. On Instagram, go. Oh, that's just emotionalism. But what you have to understand is they didn't leave the room for days. So I want you to picture just worshiping for six hours. Like, just singing for six hours. Nothing else really, except for some prayer. I mean, you get bored. Like, anybody would get bored. Like, they're not looking at their phones.
- [10:21]
A
Yeah.
- [10:21]
B
They're not talking to each other. Like, they are praying and they are worshiping. You have to believe that something unique is happening for college students to do that for days upon days upon days. Right. That's just not. That's not emotionalism. That's like something that has come into the room that has captivated their attention in a unique way. And as someone who stayed for the first day and night and stayed till about 3am that night, I can just say it felt like a couple hours. I mean, you can't understand it unless you've been in a room. Like that time is just. It just stands still. Like, you have no concept of time. I didn't eat. I didn't drink. My legs that night. Like, when I went to sleep, I woke up and they were all cramping because I'd forgotten to drink all day. Like, you just. You just. You can't understand it unless you're in the room. But it is so different than. Than any other thing I've ever experienced. Except for Asbury.
- [11:19]
A
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I. In my own experience in youth ministry, there was one experience I had with that, and it started with confession. I was giving a message at a youth camp and heard the Lord say in the middle of the night, I couldn't sleep the whole night. And I'm like, what is going on? I get, like, really sick that morning. So I think there was some spiritual warfare going on. So the Lord say, like, you're supposed to call people to confession. You're supposed to put a microphone in, like, on the stage and then leave the stage.
- [11:50]
B
Cool.
- [11:50]
A
So I did it, and it was silent for, like, two minutes, which felt like, you know, to Ryan.
- [11:54]
B
I'm so proud of you. Yeah.
- [11:56]
A
And this was. I mean, this was probably 10 years ago.
- [11:59]
B
Yeah.
- [12:00]
A
And same deal with the girl who confessed the abortion. There was a couple kids that got up and, like, confessed. Gossip. And then there was one girl that got up and confessed looking at pornography.
- [12:11]
B
Wow.
- [12:11]
A
Which taboo for a girl to say. Right?
- [12:13]
B
Right. Big brave.
- [12:14]
A
And she gets up, and then something broke in the room. And I want to ask you, because you've seen this now a couple of times. Like, personally, you've met with these people. You've seen. You felt the spirit move.
- [12:26]
B
Yeah.
- [12:27]
A
There's something about confession that breaks the yoke. And then there's something about how the enemy moves, that wants to keep things in darkness.
- [12:35]
B
And you.
- [12:35]
A
You talk about this a lot in your new book, the lie you don't know you believe, which we'll put that in the show notes, because even just going through this, I'm like, oh, my gosh, the diagrams you have in there. I'm like, this is so good. Like, so if you guys are struggling with thoughts in your head and lies that you've believed, I would really encourage you to go check out this book. But tell me a little bit about conf. Confession. Like, why how does the enemy use it? And then why. Why does it seem like revival always breaks out when that happens first? When confession happens first?
- [13:03]
B
I feel a little bit like John the Baptist lately. Like, I just feel like it's. This is.
- [13:07]
A
You seem like John the Baptist.
- [13:08]
B
This is what I do. Like, I just. And I'm just like a revivalist. I mean, I just am unafraid to lead people to what I know will bring freedom. And it's not comfortable ever. But I think that's the cost. Right. I think I look at that, and I'm like, she paid the cost for that room. To experience God in that way, and it was costly. And I was so glad yesterday to get to talk to my friend Chi Chi, who was standing. I couldn't believe he was standing near her because we were actually sitting together the rest of the day. So I couldn't believe he was in the back of the room and he saw her and that. He told me the story of her convulsing before, like, and how hard. And that she just fell to the ground. And I thought, of course she did. Like, I just. I Think it's that hard? Like, the enemy has that much of a stake over our lives, and he has tricked us and made us believe, like, to the point that it physically feels impossible to say it out loud, that there's no way we can do it. I mean, she stood. I just picture, like, Braveheart. I know it's a really old movie, but it just showed up on Netflix again. I rewatched it. And it's like, you know, you say the thing and you say the thing that's, like, so hard and it flies in the face of. Of the way the world is, you know, and what is acceptable. And you say it and you yell it and it. And it breaks something. And there's a. There's a supernatural thing that is happening. Exchange between the darkness and light. And I do believe that the devil has all the power in the dark. All the power. You're giving it to him. You've signed it over. You've said, go ahead. Like, you have control over me. I just think you see it over and over again. How do pastors, mega church pastors that, you know, have all these eyeballs on them, how do they fall into such sin and, like, public, you know, immorality and all of these. All of these things. Like, how does this happen? It starts with, like, little secrets. It starts, and it grows. And then you have to protect those, and you have to protect that, and you can't tell anybody that. And then it grows, you know, and so I just. I think this is where we are, is, like, we have to. We're fighting for purity and holiness. We will never be people that are perfectly holy. Therefore, every one of us has fallen short of the glory of God and must name the ways in which we do that. Because he's mean. Because he wants to punish us. Because he wants us to suffer. No, because his kindness. His kindness knows that this is bondage and that we are miserable. We are miserable in hiding. It is a. It is a really isolating place to be alone in the dark with the devil.
- [15:46]
A
Right. Yeah. I think. One thing I think about is I know you're a fan of Jamie Winship. I love his definition of confession.
- [15:54]
B
Yeah.
- [15:55]
A
Just tell the truth.
- [15:56]
B
Yeah. I love that you just tell the truth. Yeah.
- [15:58]
A
Like. And then, so, like, you tell the truth, you change your mind, and then the form of your substance changes. It's like that. But everything starts with just telling the truth.
- [16:08]
B
Yeah.
- [16:08]
A
Which is not. I looked at pornography. I was insecure, and I had a rough day at work, and my boss made me feel Small. And so I looked at porn, right?
- [16:18]
B
It's, you know, I think of Hebrews 12 that says, like, run the race that I set before you, throwing off the weight and the sin. And I've always taught it in that way because I'm like, it's not always sin. And I do appreciate that and say that too. Of just is saying the truth of, you know, suicidal ideation. Obviously, for many people, that is not coming from a place of sin. That is an attack of the enemy. But it needs to be said out loud, right? I said, struggle with depression needs to be said out loud. The thing that happened to you that was not your fault when you were 8 years old needs to be said out loud like, these are the things that the enemy will use. And so I do think it's both sin and bondage or weight.
- [17:01]
A
Yeah. Yeah. And that's interesting. The weight can even be trauma.
- [17:06]
B
That wasn't your fault 100%. I would say the typical cycle of humanity is this. Certainly we were all born with the reality of sin, right? Like, we came out little sinners. We didn't have to learn it. We were good at it right when we came out. But I would say, just when you look at your life, to think something happened probably to you at some point. And specifically with this book, it's like a lie was. Was believed at some point. You were probably, you know, 5 years old, 7 years old, 10 years old. I was 12 years old when I believed the lie for the first time. And that grew and became something that felt like I had to measure up. I mean, I just. I was worthless. That's what I believed. I was worthless unless I hit these marks. But the problem was the marks kept moving and changing. Right? So something happens. You believe something at some point, and then at some point you get apathetic because you're like, I can't feel this way anymore. I just am tired. And so you start to sin, and sin becomes addiction. And sin is really good at becoming addiction. It's practiced. It just is. And so all of a sudden, now you're in bondage and you're enslaved to something that really started out as a hurt or a trauma.
- [18:24]
A
Yeah. I think every sin can be traced back to a lie. Because even if it's like, okay, I drank too much. Well, you believe the lie that. That alcohol would sustain you and fulfill you more than God's.
- [18:35]
B
Right. And even underneath that, you know, okay, so let's talk about the three lies. So there's three. I am worthless. I am unlovable. I am helpless. Those three come from Psych 101 and just this idea that all humans kind of fall into their identity can fall into one of those three places. So underneath those lies, though, is a deeper, more sinister lie, which is I could be in control. Like, I'm not helpless. I could be in control possibly if I work hard enough. Or I could be loved by everyone and liked by everyone, which isn't really possible. Or that I could finally matter. I could finally hit the mark and then I would matter. And that's actually the deeper lie. And so even the drinking, you know, back to your point, even the drinking is really probably coming from. I can't ever hit the mark or I keep disappointing people and I keep feeling rejection, or I keep trying to control my life and it's just not working out, you know. So ultimately it's like a drive, it's like an idol underneath all of us that's really just trying to complete our identity. We're just trying to be okay. You know, we're just. I mean, I love my counselor, he says, Dr. Kirk Thompson, he says we all come into the world looking for someone looking for us.
- [19:48]
A
Can you say that again?
- [19:48]
B
We all come into the world looking for someone looking for us. Wow. And we never stop. And so that's the core of it. Right? Like we're all just humans that were built by God that deeply, deeply long for connection. And so we're longing for approval, for measurement of success. We're longing for all these things because we think then people will see us, then we'll be important. And I think about how everybody wants to be famous right now. And even that it's coming from these lies. It's coming from the part of us that just says really want to be seen. I really want to matter. It's not bad desires. It's actually God given desires.
- [20:34]
A
Yeah.
- [20:35]
B
Wow. That we're just looking for the significance in the place the enemy's telling us to look.
- [20:42]
A
Yeah. I even think back to the garden, how Satan comes to them initially with a lie, which is you could be like God, but they were already kind of like God.
- [20:54]
B
They were made in his image very clear.
- [20:56]
A
They were like God. So he comes to them and he. And he.
- [20:59]
B
He's actually making them like him.
- [21:01]
A
Exactly. But the lie there was that God doesn't see you in a way that's good or righteous or worthy of love.
- [21:11]
B
Yeah.
- [21:12]
A
That's what he was calling to question. He was calling to question God's character. So it's interesting going the level Deeper of, like, why do I keep looking at porn? Why do I keep drinking? Why do I keep vaping? Why do keep gossiping like, it's one of those three core lives. Can you rattle those off again?
- [21:26]
B
I'm worthless. I'm helpless. I'm unlovable. And I don't. We don't. Nobody thinks this way. I mean, nobody has the thought to themselves, like, I'm worthless. That's super rare. But you'll feel like, gosh, I feel extra broken. I just feel like I can't do anything right. Yeah, I feel like I just keep messing up. Why do I keep messing up? Or you'll feel like I'm always striving. I've got to hit this. Like, if I don't get this, you feel like a panic, and you feel almost like it's not reasonable for what the thing is. I mean, this is a silly example. Really silly. So let me preface it with that. But this book is coming out this week, and I will care. I mean, I know that I shouldn't. I will know that I shouldn't, but I will care that my last three have done really well and hit lists. And I'm like, if this one doesn't, then my publisher's gonna be disappointed. And it's just a mark I really want to hit. And all of those feelings will come back and it will feel big unless I say it out loud. And I did. I said it out loud about a week ago to a friend. I just said, you know, I'm really scared. Like, this book isn't going to do as well, and it's not going to hit New York Times or. And my publisher's going to be disappointed in all these feelings. And, I mean, that was vulnerable to say, you know, I was like, she cares about souls in heaven. And I'm like, God. And like, I'm sitting there. We're just. It was vulnerable. And she starts laughing, and she's like, I'm not even gonna like you if you hit New York Times again. Like, that's just stupid. She's like, and we're laughing. We're both kind of laughing about it. And she's like, really? I don't think people are gonna like you if you hit it four times. That's just stupid. And all of a sudden, we're both dying laughing. And I feel so much relief just because I was brave to say it out loud.
- [23:03]
A
Totally.
- [23:03]
B
And then I was like, yeah, I don't play this game. You're right. Like, we don't care. We really don't. Yeah. But if I wouldn't have said it out loud back to confession, like if I didn't just say that stupid little fleeting thought that was growing in me, that like pressure that felt like my 12 year old self that was had to hit the mark and had to make the team and had to make the grades. Like if I, if I don't say it out loud, I start acting like a 12 year old again. That's what's scary about this.
- [23:30]
A
Yeah.
- [23:31]
B
Yeah. Is our five year old shows up.
- [23:33]
A
Totally.
- [23:34]
B
Our, our ten year old shows up and starts throwing a little tantrum. Yeah. And you're like, why am I acting like a 10 year old? Like why am I, why am I devolving into this insecurity and fear and all these things that I'm not typically on a good day. And it's because it brings out all the feelings you had back whenever that started, you know?
- [23:55]
A
Totally. Totally. Why does the Bible say, confess your sins one to another and you'll be healed, but when you confess your sins to God, you're forgiven?
- [24:04]
B
That's such a good question. And I definitely have put a lot of thought into that and nobody's ever asked me that. So I'm really happy that you said that. I think that is because I feel like the specialist doctor who has probably led people to repentance in every size room. Like from 65,000 passion to a living room. I've done it, I don't even know probably a hundred times. So I probably feel like an expert now on this subject. And I can say that I do this many times. I will have people confess to God first. The room doesn't change ever. They'll cry. I see them crying. They'll do it in the quietness of their heart. The room doesn't change after they say it out loud to a couple people or to the room. There is an exuberance and a joy that floods the room. And I believe why is because of Romans 8:1, that there is no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. And they test it. So they've tested Romans 8:1, they've put their whole weight. When that girl yelled abortion, she believed that she could do that. I think probably I'd love to interview that girl. I need to find her. I think probably she just dared to hope, like I don't even know that it was with deep conviction or she would have done it sooner, but she dared to hope that she could say this thing out loud that was crushing her, that was making her so Ill, like just she carried it for. So who knows? She probably had never told another soul. And then she yells it out. And there's a freedom that breaks through that you cannot understand unless you've experienced it. But I've seen it in a hundred rooms and it is the same every time. Does not come when they pray it, although I know it's sincere. And they're doing it to Jesus, I know they are. They're doing it to God the Father, they're doing it to the Holy Spirit. I believe they are saying it to him in the quietness of their heart. They don't get healed until they've tested that freedom. And when they test it, they're like, so cool. Sometimes I'll do where they say it to a neighbor and then they'll come back together and you feel like the room is so cute. You'll hear a room full of thousands of college students and you hear like a rumbling. You'll hear just this quiet whispering. And then the room gets louder and you hear them all, like sharing and laughing and crying and you hear it and it just gets bigger and louder. And then I'll have them come back together and I'll say, yell it out. And they yell it like that. Like, they yell it because they feel freedom and they feel victory over it. They feel like it doesn't have power over them anymore. And we all know that that doesn't mean that they're perfectly whole and healed at that moment. I mean, some of them are dealing with, you know, a decade long addiction to pornography. Some of them are naming something that they've struggled with for, you know, five years. But I'll say this, a lot of them are like, that changed everything. Like, I was free. I have not dealt with it since. Now some of them need aa. Some of them, you know, some of them, it's gonna be like, this is. But they. But they turn to the idea that now they can get help. You can't ever get help unless you say it out loud, right? So they can get help. They've got people in it with them. Yeah, it's a shift. Wow.
- [27:43]
A
Guys, I want to stop and tell you about my ministry. Share the struggle. I have for so long thought that the mental health crisis is the missions moment of our decade. And if you're needing support for your anxiety or your trauma or your marriage or relationships, we have coaches available that will pray with you, that'll do inner healing prayer with you, that'll go to the scriptures and then provide the best in class therapeutic principles to help you move forward in whatever God has for you. So check that out. We also have courses. You can go to sharethestruggle.org and get the relief you're needing. Yeah. So it's almost like confessing to the Lord is drawing upon the blood of Jesus poured out on the cross for our sins.
- [28:16]
B
It's believing.
- [28:17]
A
It's believing it internally confessing it. It's almost like you activate it in a way. Like you're saying, like, I am now living out this. I'm going to test this. I'm going to live this out communally through the body. And there's. Because then it says in First John that when you confess your sins to one another, you're healed. And what you're describing are rooms of thousands of people that get healed collectively.
- [28:40]
B
Special. Yeah.
- [28:41]
A
That's very, very special.
- [28:43]
B
And you feel it.
- [28:44]
A
Totally.
- [28:45]
B
Yeah.
- [28:46]
A
What is that? What is that healing? Because again, you're saying, like, hey, some of these people need to go to aa. What is happening to a soul in that moment?
- [28:54]
B
Well, they are breaking a lie. Okay? So they are no longer playing the enemy's game. And the enemy's game is isolation. So in the book I set up two kingdoms. One, there's a prince of both.
- [29:09]
A
Yes.
- [29:09]
B
And what we don't often do is give, which your podcast certainly has done, but we don't often talk about the prince of the world, how much power he has. He had enough power to look at Jesus and say, I'll give you the kingdoms of the world.
- [29:24]
A
Yeah.
- [29:25]
B
To God. And he knew who he was talking to.
- [29:28]
A
Yes.
- [29:29]
B
So he has dominion. You talk about principalities over northern Nigeria. You talk about northern Nigeria a lot. There are principalities working there. Certainly the spirit of God is springing up. But principalities are the ones behind the people killing the Nigerian pastors, because they have had strongholds there for so long that they are controlling people. They are controlling a place. And so, you know, Ephesians talks about this. I mean, it lays out that these principalities are powerful and strong. And. And then you see in 2 Corinthians, these strongholds, we have power over them. We have divine weapons that can break strongholds. So we see that there are things we can use against these principalities and against the enemy. But one of the greatest is confession, because you personally, like you look at in northern Nigeria, that is a place that has been put under a principality. But you personally are putting yourself under the power of the enemy when you do not confess and you live in secret. Whoa, you're saying you have power. You have more power than God. Over my life, yeah. Because if I believed Romans 8:1, there is no condemnation in those who are in Christ Jesus, then I would say it out loud and I would break that stronghold. But I don't know that I believe that. And I care more about my reputation than I do saying it out loud. I mean, I work in prisons, too. Same thing happens in prisons. And they'll name their thing out loud. They'll name their bondage, their sin, and that's risky.
- [31:04]
A
Can you tell me a story?
- [31:05]
B
Yeah. Maximum security prison in Las Vegas. It was women in this case. And there were 200 women in the room. Church hadn't been there since pre Covid. This is last year or a year and a half ago, so that long without really spiritual leadership in the prison. And so 200 women came to an event we were doing with God behind bars. And they had their arms crossed, and I taught the gospel. I taught Romans 8:1. I taught the love of God for them. And I was like, you guys are in the best position because unlike a lot of people sitting in pews of churches, you actually know you need God, you know? And so I said, here's what I would say is I know, I've watched prison movies. I know that you're. You know, I laughed about that, that it's risky to do this, but I want you to yell out your sin. They did it.
- [31:56]
A
They did it.
- [31:57]
B
Now I said, if you do it all this is my joke. I said, in this case, I was like, if you do it all together and you do it loud enough, then you cannot hear each other. I was like, so you got to all commit. And they were like, okay. So they did. And they did it all at once, and it was so powerful. And then they are all laughing. I mean, that's a lot of times the response is they just laugh because they can't believe. They just did that. After that, I said, and here's how you experience the forgiveness and freedom of Jesus and share the gospel. So simple. And I mean, I think 130 of them stood up and we baptized 115 that day.
- [32:34]
A
Oh, my goodness.
- [32:34]
B
Out of 200, I don't know what that percentage is. It was pretty high. I mean, it was pretty crazy.
- [32:39]
A
Yeah, that's well over 15.
- [32:41]
B
I mean, that's murderers, that's abusers. You know, it's crazy, but the gospel works. The gospel works and it sets people free. And if you saw those pictures, maybe there's a way we can give you well for YouTube for sure. If you saw the pictures of these women coming up out of the water, I mean, they are different. Like, you can tell. They believe it. They believe it. Wow. But there's something about the lie in our heads that we're the only ones and that we are too far gone, that we are too broken. That you bust. You bust that lie when you say it out loud. And when you hear everybody else say it out loud, that's the other power. It's not just that you're saying your thing out loud. You hear that girl, you hear that girl yell abortion, and that changes you. And, you know, you believe God for her, you know, and then you start to believe God for yourself. Yeah, there's a lot happening. And that's.
- [33:40]
A
Here's my.
- [33:40]
B
This is a funny subject, but you'll appreciate it. I have come to believe in these weird things that God asks us to do. Communion, baptism, confession. I believe in them now in a very different way than I used to. Everybody's always taught a lot of those things. Not confession, but baptism as symbol. And I don't know that I. I think it's way more. There's something supernatural. It's a weird practice to dunk somebody in water. You know, my Buddhist massage girl, because I've baptized so often, she's like, what do you do for a living? And I'm like, she knows I'm Christian. I've shared the gospel with her, but I'm a baptizer. I was like, do you know what baptism is? She's like, never heard of it. I was like, well, I explained it. She's like, that's so weird, you know? And I'm like, it is a weird idea. But I do believe that water, it is symbolic and you never forget it. It's a physical. He cares about the gospel being embodied. And if there's any pastors listening, I would just say this. Be sure that you're giving room for response and embodiment of what you're teaching. We're such a society of knowledge, and we think knowledge is what changes people's life. You have to have it. If you don't know God and know your Bible, you can't change. You can't know what you're supposed to do. So I believe it is a foundation. It's the beginning. Right? But I would just say make sure you give a lot of room for response for people, because when they embody it, when they yell their sin, when they say it, when they get baptized, you know, when there's ways for them to come to the altar when there's ways for them to respond. They are taking what you are saying to them as truth and what the Bible is saying to them as truth. And they're putting their own stake in the ground. They're physically moving towards something. I think it matters. Yeah.
- [35:25]
A
Yeah. I visited the Satanic temple in Salem, Massachusetts.
- [35:30]
B
You have the craziest stories.
- [35:31]
A
And I went in there and was just doing like, warfare prayer in there the whole time. And if I wasn't, I could feel like my stomach was, like, twisting, and so I had to keep praying. I leave the temple and instantly start feeling sick. Like, my throat starts getting really sore. And I'm like, oop, been here before. And I realized I probably didn't arm up the way I should have. So we took communion right then. I think we had orange juice and donuts for our communion, and it's all we had. That's all we could find at like 1am and. And instantly sore throat gone. So I have increasingly started taking communion. Started taking communion. We just. I just had a former Satanist on, and I'm like, taking communion right after
- [36:22]
B
this, and everybody hears my voice. I need to take communion right now. Yeah. I need to be healed.
- [36:27]
A
Yeah, right. Let's. Let's get it. Let's do it after this. But I'm learning it is far more than just a symbol. There's something that happens during baptism. I don't know if you've seen videos on social media of people literally having demons manifest when they come out of the water. I had that. I baptized a friend who had a very rough childhood, very rough background. Praise God, he got saved. I baptize him. And I knew I had enough data. Now that this is about to get really gnarly. He starts manifesting demons. He's on FaceTime with me and literally bashing his head into walls. I'm watching his eyes roll back in his head. His mouth would open. A full exorcist type stuff or exorcism type stuff that, like, I'm like, this is the gnarliest thing I've ever seen. But he kept saying he didn't like that I got in the water. He didn't like that I got in the water. And I was like, whoa. If you think that communion and baptism and confession, I think the Catholics got it right.
- [37:26]
B
Yeah.
- [37:26]
A
I think we've punted on this as Protestants for a while of like, being like, oh, just a symbolic thing of his body that was broken for us.
- [37:35]
B
Something happens. I've baptized too many People. I mean, I've baptized girl. I mean, every week I could tell you stories like this. Just last week, I baptized a boy just out of juvie. I baptized a girl that both her parents were atheists. I baptized a girl who was supposed to be aborted. Her mother is a witch, and she's been cursed her whole life.
- [37:51]
A
Whoa.
- [37:52]
B
And, I mean, when you. You're right. Like, you see a physical thing happen to them, it's the same as confession. It's like they come out, they go under the water. And a lot of times I'm really trying to navigate, like, are you saved? Like, are we sure you? And I heard some great wisdom on that, that just to never steal from someone a chance for them to respond to God. Because I, you know, I'm doing my best, we're all doing our best of just navigating. Like, do you understand the gospel? And we always ask really intrusive questions to make sure that they do. But I will say there are times I'm. I'm going, this girl is not free. And, I mean, she comes up and she is different. Whoa. It's like, exuberant. I. I don't know. So I'm figuring it out as the person that comes from an insanely conservative background, and still my theology is very conservative on all things. I'm just telling you what I've experienced in the supernatural that has blown my mind.
- [38:52]
A
Wow. Well, it's incredible. I mean, your ministry is incredible. I'm jealous for those moments. Those moments, because I've experienced them. There's nothing like the freedom that comes from those moments. And just being like, God is real and his word is true, and the things he tells us to do, there's a reason for it.
- [39:09]
B
Yeah.
- [39:10]
A
And sometimes those hard moments, like, I. I obviously wasn't there for this, but I can just picture that girl who had the abortion and her wrestle for 10 minutes of being like, don't do it. Don't do it. It's going to be weird. People are like. And then she just does it. And then.
- [39:25]
B
Yeah.
- [39:26]
A
She suffered in those 10 minutes internally for the freedom of thousands.
- [39:31]
B
Yeah.
- [39:32]
A
And I think that's what I would encourage you listening is that God not only has freedom for you, he has freedom for your whole community, for your whole family. When you take the first step and you say, I'm gonna be the person that's gonna be the weird one, that's gonna be like, I feel something funky in my house. Let's take communion.
- [39:49]
B
That's right.
- [39:50]
A
I feel like, hey, there's that little thing that, like. Like, me and Annie have gotten pretty good at this, where we'll just confess, like, small stuff. She'll be like, hey, babe, I. I bought this thing that, you know, it could be. It's, like, totally reasonable. She, like, bought something for, I don't know, the kitchen. That's like. She's like, but I didn't. I didn't ask you. And I'm like. Like, we've just gotten into that habit. And I feel like there's. There's been freedom in our marriage.
- [40:10]
B
Yeah.
- [40:11]
A
Because of that. Of just, like, where it would just
- [40:12]
B
be a little white lie. But you just.
- [40:14]
A
Yeah, we're not even a white lie. Just like, hey, I probably should have done this. And I didn't think to, you know, And I think, too, like, one thing that I've tried to do is confess the temptation, not the sin.
- [40:24]
B
Yeah, that's good.
- [40:25]
A
So, like, I.
- [40:26]
B
Better to knock that out than.
- [40:28]
A
Yeah, right. Because then you got accountability right there, too, that they're gonna check in on you. So, Jenny, thank you, guys. Please go check out this book. The lie you don't know you believe. I mean, I. This has got to be the most practical way to get free in life as a Christian is to confess your sin is to understand how the demonic works, how the kingdom of light works. Bring things into the light. Would you, if you were to just give one final word to the listener? Maybe they're thinking, like, I don't know who to confess to. I don't know that I have people to confess to. How do they find that right person? And then how do they go for that first step?
- [41:05]
B
Yeah, I would just say take the person you feel safest with. And right now, before I even finish talking, text them right now and say, hey, I need to tell you something that I'm scared to say out loud. And maybe just drop it in the text. Like, just say it like, I had an abortion or I am addicted to pornography and nobody knows. Like, say the thing and then say, will you help me? And ask for help. I'm telling you right then. You have unlocked something that is so powerful. And I know it's scary. And that's where, you know, people don't always respond well or respond correctly. They try to fix us. They try to, you know, I don't know. It's hard. And I would just say, say what you need to say. Say, I don't want you to fix me. I want you to walk through this with me. I want to help, but I need. I Just need you to be in this with me. And yeah, it's a beginning.
- [42:06]
A
That's good. Could you pray for them?
- [42:08]
B
Yes. So, God, I do think of the person listening that their heart is just racing right now because they're scared and they don't want to be found out yet. It is your kindness that leads us to confession and to repentance. And I just pray that they would experience your kindness and your mercy. And maybe the reason it feels so agonizing to say out loud is because they've dared to hope there could be forgiveness for them. And I just pray today, God, that they would believe it, that they would just. Just dare to believe that there is no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus and that we get to be free and that this is the means to that this is the way, the path, the cost to it, God, is to possibly be humiliated, to possibly be held to consequences that we don't want to face. I think that's. I'm watching a friend right now just battled with addiction and really bad choices for a long time. And they're facing the consequences and so lonely. It's so hard. And yet they've never been more happy and free. And that's what you can't understand right now. And God, I just pray you would, you know, just help people to hope, help people to believe. God, you're so. You are so able to do things we couldn't ever even ask or imagine. And God, I just pray for the faith, this mustard seed of faith that someone would have today to be brave to say it to a friend. And God, thank you for the reason that we can say it out loud. Thank you for the reason there is no condemnation, that you so love the world, that you sent your only begotten son, that who should ever believe in him wouldn't perish, but would have everlasting life. So thank you that you made the way for this to be possible. So we love you. In Jesus name, amen.
- [44:10]
A
Amen. Jenny, thank you. So glad to be your friend. So glad to be here. Yeah, guys, thank you for tuning in. See you guys next week.