433 Joe Rogan Experience Review of Chris Hughes

Summary

Episode Summary: Joe Rogan Experience Review Podcast – Episode 433: Review of Chris Hughes

Release Date: March 18, 2025

In Episode 433 of the Joe Rogan Experience Review Podcast, hosts Adam Thorne and Sean Houlahan delve deep into their analysis of a Joe Rogan Experience (JRE) episode featuring Chris Hughes. This detailed 45-minute breakdown explores a variety of thought-provoking topics brought up during the original podcast, ranging from mind control and persuasion to societal manipulations and personal development.

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1. Initial Impressions and Mind Control

The episode kicks off with Chris Hughes expressing his apprehensions about the JRE conversation:

Chris Hughes [01:50]: "This man scared me a little bit."

Hughes elaborates on Rogan's discussion about mind control and the ease with which persuasive individuals can influence suggestible audiences:

Chris Hughes [02:09]: "I can't even think of the word authoritarian. That's the one authoritarian figure. And how easy it is to persuade someone who's very open and suggestible."

Adam Thorne concurs, highlighting the vulnerability of Joe Rogan's audience:

Adam Thorne [02:30]: "It's like if everybody listening is that and you capture that type of audience with your podcast, then everything you could be saying is bullshit."

This segment underscores the potent influence media figures wield over their listeners, emphasizing the ethical responsibilities that come with such platforms.

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2. The Persuasion Experiment and Human Susceptibility

A significant portion of the discussion revolves around a classic persuasion experiment where participants were compelled to administer electric shocks to others, believing they were causing harm:

Adam Thorne [03:25]: "I find it shocking how people comply with authority figures even in morally questionable situations."

Chris Hughes reflects on the psychological mechanisms at play:

Chris Hughes [04:25]: "It would be interesting to see why they're doing it and who are they and what about them made them decide that."

This conversation highlights the profound impact authority can have on individual actions, often overriding personal moral judgments.

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3. Methylene Blue and Supplement Claims

The hosts critique Rogan's guest for promoting methylene blue as a cognitive enhancer without sufficient scientific backing:

Adam Thorne [06:29]: "It was like the subtext of the whole conversation, Chris was like. It was almost like he was selling methylene blue."

Chris Hughes expresses skepticism about the bold claims made regarding the supplement:

Chris Hughes [07:27]: "I don't know what the fuck methylene blue is."

This segment raises concerns about the promotion of unverified supplements on influential platforms, emphasizing the need for critical evaluation of such claims.

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4. Cult Recruitment and Psychological Manipulation

A deep dive into cult recruitment tactics reveals how vulnerable individuals can be coerced into extreme beliefs and behaviors:

Chris Hughes [16:37]: "It's very easy to fall into the temptation of these welcoming people who seem very nice."

The hosts reference movies like "Midsommar" and "Hereditary" to illustrate the psychological manipulation and control exerted by cults:

Chris Hughes [17:50]: "Great movie about cults... they gave them all mushrooms... red flag. Get out of there."

This discussion underscores the thin line between charismatic leadership and manipulative control, highlighting the dangers of psychological exploitation.

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5. Media Influence and Public Perception

The conversation shifts to the role of mainstream media in shaping public perception, particularly regarding figures like Joe Rogan:

Adam Thorne [28:44]: "What about people that watch the View and see that as, like, a source of news?"

Chris Hughes criticizes the lack of due diligence in media reporting:

Chris Hughes [29:19]: "She just doesn't like Joe Rogan or she... didn't check that Joe Rogan believes in dinosaurs or dragons."

This segment emphasizes the media's role in perpetuating misinformation and the importance of independent verification of facts.

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6. Assassinations and Government Manipulations

A controversial topic arises as the hosts discuss RFK's assassination and possible government involvement:

Adam Thorne [35:00]: "Are we ever gonna find out? I don't think so."

Chris Hughes speculates on government conspiracies:

Chris Hughes [36:43]: "They essentially lay it all out, but they were like, yeah, the movement towards the civil rights and all that stuff..."

This portion reflects on historical events and the lingering suspicions surrounding government actions, questioning the transparency and integrity of institutions.

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7. Positive Visualization and Personal Development

Transitioning to a more optimistic perspective, the hosts explore the concept of positive visualization as a tool for personal growth:

Adam Thorne [44:16]: "Because positive visualization, which anyone can do with practice, start out slow, give it a few minutes."

Chris Hughes highlights impactful quotes from the JRE episode:

Chris Hughes [42:13]: "If the opinion that's coming out needs people to be silenced, it's a psyop."

These reflections offer a counterbalance to earlier themes of manipulation, advocating for individual empowerment through mindset shifts.

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8. Final Thoughts and Takeaways

Concluding the episode, Adam Thorne and Chris Hughes summarize the complexities of media influence, government actions, and personal agency:

Adam Thorne [44:42]: "The government also does the same. It's just so much of that that's like tied into this."

Chris Hughes [44:44]: "Put your thinking cap on."

The hosts encourage listeners to remain vigilant and critical of the information they consume, emphasizing the importance of independent thought in a world rife with manipulation and misinformation.

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Notable Quotes

• Chris Hughes [01:50]: "This man scared me a little bit."
• Adam Thorne [02:30]: "It's like if everybody listening is that and you capture that type of audience with your podcast, then everything you could be saying is bullshit."
• Chris Hughes [16:37]: "It's very easy to fall into the temptation of these welcoming people who seem very nice."
• Chris Hughes [29:19]: "She just doesn't like Joe Rogan or she... didn't check that Joe Rogan believes in dinosaurs or dragons."
• Chris Hughes [42:13]: "If the opinion that's coming out needs people to be silenced, it's a psyop."
• Adam Thorne [44:42]: "The government also does the same. It's just so much of that that's like tied into this."

---

Conclusion

Episode 433 of the Joe Rogan Experience Review Podcast offers a comprehensive and critical analysis of the JRE episode featuring Chris Hughes. Through engaging dialogue and insightful commentary, Adam Thorne and Sean Houlahan shed light on the pervasive themes of manipulation, media influence, and personal agency. Listeners gain a deeper understanding of the psychological underpinnings that shape public discourse and the importance of maintaining autonomy in the face of persuasive forces.

Transcript

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[Sean Houlahan]

You are listening to the Joe Rogan Experience Review Podcast.

[Adam Thorne]

We find little nuggets, treasures, valuable pieces.

[Sean Houlahan]

Of gold in the Joe Rogan Experience Podcast and pass them on to you. Perhaps expand a little bit. We are not associated with Joe Rogan in any way. Think of us as the talking dead to Joe's Walking Dead.

[Adam Thorne]

You're listening to the Joe Rogan Experience Review. What a bizarre thing we've created now.

[Chris Hughes]

With your host, Adam Thorne. This might either be the worst podcast.

[Adam Thorne]

Or the best one. One go.

[Sean Houlahan]

Enjoy the show.

[Adam Thorne]

Hey, guys. And welcome to another episode of the JRE Review. Joining me today is good old Sean Houlahan.

[Chris Hughes]

Back again, back again, back again.

[Adam Thorne]

I said you'd be back.

[Chris Hughes]

I'm back. Here I am.

[Adam Thorne]

Here we are.

[Chris Hughes]

I didn't die.

[Adam Thorne]

Nope. Today we are reviewing Chris Hughes.

[Chris Hughes]

This man scared me a little bit. Really? Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

What was your initial feelings?

[Chris Hughes]

Well, he's very smart. But what I'm realizing when I'm. Because he's talking about mind control and persuading people and all of this stuff. And he's talking about you. Take an authoritative.

[Adam Thorne]

Spit it out.

[Chris Hughes]

I can't even think of the word authoritarian. That's the one authoritarian figure. And how easy it is to persuade someone who's very open and suggestible. And I'm thinking to myself, I'm like, fuck, is he doing this to me right now as I'm listening to this?

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, that's a good point. It's like if everybody listening is that and you capture that type of audience with your podcast, then everything you could be saying is bullshit. You just got to say it in the right way. People are all about it.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah, well, it's always. It made me think, too. Like, you know, I'm sure most people have met someone, wherever it is, at some sort of social gathering, someone you didn't know at all. And then you start talking with them, even for just a brief, brief period of time, and you're like, wow, this guy's great. And you can't really pinpoint what it is about them. Like, they. You don't know them, obviously, so you don't know, like, the quality of the person that they are, but just the way that they say things and their demeanor and the way that they conversate with you, you're just like, wow, there's something about this person that I really like, and I trust them. And it's so crazy how easily someone can get in there, and then you're, like, all of a sudden doing coke in an alley with them. It's crazy how quick that happens.

[Adam Thorne]

That was. It seemed like a very personal experience there.

[Chris Hughes]

It happens about three times a month.

[Adam Thorne]

Okay.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah. Different alley each time, though. That's why I fall for it. I'm like, shit, well, we're not going to Home Depot this time, so it must be different.

[Adam Thorne]

Well, I think more people are susceptible to this than want to admit. I mean, he brought up that experiment where people will shock others or think that they are shocking them, and then they get to these, like, higher and higher electrical charge amounts, and then it's like, a fatal one, and they keep going.

[Chris Hughes]

But they weren't actually killing the people. No. Okay. Thank God.

[Adam Thorne]

They're just, like, screaming on the other end of a thing, and then they go quiet.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah. And they only had, like. What was it? An hour beforehand to, like, talk them, talk to them, and basically convince them of this. I wonder what they said to those people. Like, you must have to really build animosity between the person that's doing it and the person that you're doing it to.

[Adam Thorne]

You know, I don't think that they are required to hate them. I think they're just required to understand that they are in charge and they are required to administer these shots, and they will be told when to administer them based on the responses. So someone in a lab coat that has authority over you or the individual in the experiment will tell you, okay, now shock them after that. And they just. It was 100% like, everyone did it.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah. That's crazy. Quite scary.

[Adam Thorne]

It's wild. I mean, since it's so common that everyone will do it. What does it mean to the individual that is, like, no, I won't. Like, are they the type of humans that are, I don't know, self destructive or constantly bickering with everyone? They're just like the loners with no friends. Like. Like, that's kind of the person that it takes.

[Chris Hughes]

I don't know.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, I don't know either.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah, I wish that they. I'd love to look into it because it'd be interesting to see, like, what types of people went, like, far with it, you know, like, what types of people were a little bit more timid. When did they come around? How did they come around, you know, like, on an individual basis looking at it? Because, I mean, if it's such crazy odds, like, you know, most people are doing this, it's like, it'd be interesting to see why they're doing it and who are they and what about them made them decide that?

[Adam Thorne]

I think it was just kind of like across the board. All types of people were willing to just sit there.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

With authority telling them to administer this, and they were willing to just let it happen even if they were unsure or uncomfortable about it. Like, that's, that's kind of. It's shocking.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah, that's not.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, it's not what you would think, um, the outcome would be, but it's, you know, that's what happens. And really, when you hear those numbers, you have to assume you'd be the same.

[Chris Hughes]

You would be the same. Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

And it's, it's like, yeah, I wonder what kind of situation I'd need to be in to just be like, okay, zap. Yeah, zap away. Had you ever heard of methylene blue that he kept talking about?

[Chris Hughes]

No.

[Adam Thorne]

It was like the subtext of the whole conversation, Chris was like. It was almost like he was selling methylene blue. He was making some bold claims.

[Chris Hughes]

He was making a lot of bold claims in there. Yeah. It was funny, like, what I was saying earlier about how he. I wonder if some of the stuff he was saying was working on me. I noticed that especially because he said at some point in the podcast, he was like, yeah, I'm probably the most qualified person on mind control in the U.S. he's like, I'm definitely the most qualified person on mind control. And maybe that's true or not, but that's very. The way he said it was very, like, confident and all of this stuff. I don't know what the fuck methylene blue is.

[Adam Thorne]

Well, back to that. That Was a very cocky thing to say.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

Like, if you met all the people that know everything about the mind control. He hadn't even read that book about the Manson stuff.

[Chris Hughes]

Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

Like, all right. Well, if you were the top guy, you would have. You'd know all the stuff.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah, especially. Cause that book put a big wave in things, you know, really for people in that sphere. That was. I remember when Joe had. Whoever it was. I think he had the author on back in the day. And I remember watching that episode and I was like, holy shit. Well, it was.

[Adam Thorne]

It was one of his best friends, so Fitzgerald. That often goes on Rogan. He's one of the comedians that Rogan started with, like, way back in Boston. Moved to Venice eventually, and it was one of his neighbors.

[Chris Hughes]

Oh, really?

[Adam Thorne]

That's how he got introduced to it. It wasn't just like this book was that massive. It's like one of Joe's closest and oldest comedy buddies knew that this guy had worked on this book for like, 20 years. And it was, you know, it's up Joe's alley. So they connected him. I mean, that. Some interesting coincidences there, but how fortunate for the writer because I'm sure he sold a shitload of copies now.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah. And, I mean, it's good that people know about this. It's good to know what the government has the capabilities to do and where they draw the line on morality stuff.

[Adam Thorne]

But back to methylene blue, it was like. It was like an interesting. It's like, ok, this. You get these seizures. You take this thing and it works for you. Great. I'm happy. Like, yeah, I'm glad you're not getting seizures. That sounds like it sucks, but. But then also, you know, you just kind of like touting this thing as, like, mitochondrial.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

Energy booster and all this cognitive stuff potentially, and just making a ton of claims and like, it just seemed disconnected from the whole rest of the conversation. Almost like he was psyoping us into being like, we should probably get this. Let's get this.

[Chris Hughes]

Don't let the. Don't let him talk to the Liver King, man. If that guy starts using mind control, we're all fucked. Oh, that guy's such a mess, though. But, yeah. I don't know. I hate to say it, but I feel like in some ways, not all the time, but. Well, I think it's just in general, like, everyone has a thing to sell, you know, like, everyone has a course that they're selling. Everyone has a supplement that they're selling, you know, like, if you're a gym influencer. That's just how you make money, you know. And I feel like in general, Joe kind of gets people on the show that do that a lot, you know, whether it's intentional or not, they just plug in their stuff, you know, which I can't fault them at all. Yeah, it's a massive platform to be able to promote your products, but it feels like some people lean into a little bit more and it's like you don't really.

[Adam Thorne]

Well, I don't think he's selling it, which is even more interesting. I guess that gives you a little bit more credibility when you're not trying to flog the product. But yeah, difficult try.

[Chris Hughes]

I mean, yeah, if you're having seizures, you know, talk to your doctor. But yeah, it's always interesting too, whenever people are like, it's like not a very well known drug or not something that many people have tested or tried and they're like, it works for me. And it's like, that's great. But you can't just go around saying it's gonna work for everybody. Not to say that this guy was. But there are people that do that a lot. They're like.

[Adam Thorne]

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[Chris Hughes]

Anecdotal evidence this has worked for everybody. It's like, that's not shit, dude.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah. Everyone you talk to.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah. Yeah. All of your meathead friends.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah. CGS are a big deal though.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

I mean, I've heard CBD is really good for seizures. I'VE heard that has been for, like.

[Chris Hughes]

Very young kids and people who have Parkinson's.

[Adam Thorne]

Right.

[Chris Hughes]

I remember recently, I watched this video. This guy who was this old guy, he had Parkinson's, like, really bad. Pretty bad. Like, he couldn't. He couldn't sit still at all. Like, he couldn't. He probably couldn't hold, like, a glass of water. And they. They give him weed. I think it was THC because it was a joint. Like, no one smokes joints of cbd, unless you're a weird hipster. But they give him this joint and he smokes it. And then I think 15 minutes go by and he's just chilling on the couch, like, very still. And then he just gets up like a normal person. Like, just gets up from the couch. They're like, how are you feeling? He's, like, different, but he's like, pretty much back to normal. It's insane.

[Adam Thorne]

And he's like, should we order a pizza?

[Chris Hughes]

He's like, hey, guys, I've been thinking about the moon landing.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah. He's like, you guys got any popcorn?

[Chris Hughes]

But I've heard a lot of that. I've heard a lot of, like, especially in kids with cbd, like, helping with seizures and.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah. Well, there's seizure Met anti. Seizure medication is like. I think it's quite damaging to their development. So it's either they take that and then don't get seizures, which might kill them, but then have all the problems from the medication.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

Or they, you know, they have this, like, type of CBD which really helps out. And then also low sugar diets, which Chris did talk about. Like, keto.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

Carnivore. For whatever reason, those are supposed to be pretty good for spit. You know, particular brain issues.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

I think.

[Chris Hughes]

I think in general, like, somewhat of a low sugar diet is. Is healthy for everyone. I mean, especially processed sugar in the US Is terrible for you. I'm the worst at it. I. I finished a whole pint of Ben and Jerry's last night, I will admit.

[Adam Thorne]

Did you?

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah. And so it's. It's not good, but shaking my head.

[Adam Thorne]

Shaking my head. Podcast listeners.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah. And I mean, kids nowadays are just hooked on all of that shit. But, yeah, it's hard. I mean, just with any medication for kids, it's like, you know, they struggle with it. Like, I'll use myself as an example with adhd. Like, when I was in school, it was like, all right, I'm very disruptive in class. When I pay attention, I'm a good student. But on classes that I Didn't really care about. It was like I was just disruptive. And so it's hard. Do you let them continue to be disruptive and try and figure it out on their own or do you give them medication and then deal with the side effects of that? And so it's tough for both parents and children to navigate that, especially at a young age, especially when they're disrupting learning and they can't fall into a healthy routine at school.

[Adam Thorne]

Right. Yeah. I mean, it does seem like the quick fix to a very complicated issue.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah. And I, I do think, especially with adhd, that a lot of people are over diagnosing and over prescribing medications to kids, which is in itself an issue.

[Adam Thorne]

Chris talked about, like how persuasion can hijack identity, making people comply not just with, I think he put it, ideas, but also a part of who they are. Right. And he was like, think cult recruitment, law enforcement, interrogations, that type of thing. Like it just, it just kind of like, I guess in a sense like just breaks you down and then aligns with maybe your sympathies and then just pulls you in to whatever it is.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah, yeah. The cult stuff was a little freaky. Um, I, I mean, it's not easy.

[Adam Thorne]

To get people to join cults.

[Chris Hughes]

No.

[Adam Thorne]

Should probably have like giveaways like, hey, get this dishwasher. Yeah, dishwasher, pretty good. I do need a dishwasher.

[Chris Hughes]

It's just three months, I'll be gone, I'll come back with a new dishwasher.

[Adam Thorne]

If I join this cult, they give me a whole uniform. It's. They give me meaning, I get a torch. Uh huh.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah. The cult one is interesting because I feel like that's right up the alley of mind control and getting into people's psyche and taking advantage of their problems in life. And because that's the most classic example of how you get someone to recruit in a cult is like, they're very vulnerable, going through hardships in life, and then you're like, hey, we did the same thing, join our cult. We're happy now. People are just, they don't know what to do with themselves. And so it's very easy to fall into the temptation of these welcoming people who seem very nice.

[Adam Thorne]

Right? Yeah. If you have no social group, no meaning, no direction, maybe not even any confidence, and you can get desperate for all of those things and you know, you only need three or four boxes to tick and then all of a sudden you are ready to get like you're just any direction where somebody is like, we really believe in you. Come with us. And it's not till you're balls deep in there that they're like, we're also having to sleep with your wife now.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah. And you're like, shit, I can't leave now. Have you ever seen the movie Midsommar?

[Adam Thorne]

No.

[Chris Hughes]

Great movie about cults. Florence Pugh is in that movie and she's the main character. And I won't spoil the movie for anybody. It's a great movie. You should go watch it. But the first 10 minutes of the movie are just insane. And this woman who. Her parents died and her sister as well, she joins her boyfriend on this cold. A bunch of people in the group are going to do research on this thing. But the. The like. You know, when you watch a horror movie, there's like, immediate, like, red flags where people just, like, illogically go forward with something and you're like, what the fuck are you thinking? You know, like. But the first, as soon as they arrive at this cult, the people are very happy to meet them, extremely welcoming and all this stuff.

[Adam Thorne]

And they say, let's split up.

[Chris Hughes]

No, they. Even worse. They gave them all mushrooms. They immediately hand them all mushrooms. They're like, hey, we're gonna trip. Like, as soon as they get out of the car. And then they all take them because they all fall for it. And I'm like, dude, if I go anywhere with people that I don't know, and the people that I don't know immediately offering mushrooms, red flag. Get out of there. Yeah, not great. And then psychedelics come up further in the movie and stuff. That's a great way that they control people. But, yeah, that movie still haunts me. My best friend made me watch that recently. That one in Hereditary. Have you ever seen that one? Another great cult movie. Same director, kind of different avenue. That one's more about, like, how this family gets twisted and they. Their. The mom herder mom dies. So the grandma dies. She was like the leader of the cult. And then the whole family just kind of gets taken over by this cult.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, it's.

[Chris Hughes]

It's. They're great movies, though. Like, it's very hard to make a horror movie that's not predictable and, you know, cringy. And they're both amazing movies, but both around cults.

[Adam Thorne]

Have you ever watched any of the documentaries around family members being taken in by cults and how helpless they feel? Because it's like the cult's designed to, like, cut off your family.

[Chris Hughes]

Oh, yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

And then you can't reach these people and then you realize, oh, this is your son or daughter or sister or whatever. And you can't do anything. Like the police won't go get them. They're adults. They can choose whatever they want.

[Chris Hughes]

Oh, that's so scary.

[Adam Thorne]

Just imagine like I have a young daughter and you know, she's one now, so she has 17 years before she can do whatever she wants legally as an adult. She'll be 18 then. And it's like in that time if I don't create a system to where she doesn't think that somebody grabs her with a like Right then at 18, they can just go take her. And she's like, I want to go with him. This is great. We surf all day and live in teepees or whatever they do and it's you just like no, no.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

And there will be nothing. It's just the heartbreak of the people is what gets me in these shows. It's so difficult.

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[Adam Thorne]

To watch and when they. When they kind of, like, sometimes get a hold of the person that left and they talk to them, I mean, they sound fairly reasonable. They've completely justified it to themselves. They get their own kind of value out of it, even though they have shut out their whole family, which they, you know, strategically demonize, you know.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah, no, that'd be freaky, man. And then, like, you try, if you ever did, like, you know, they're gone for a month or a year or however long it is, you have to imagine the longer they're gone, the worse it gets. Try and talk to them again. And they're just not the same person.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah.

[Chris Hughes]

Like, they're just so enveloped in it. There's no saving them. They've just become a completely different person. That's scary.

[Adam Thorne]

So you either just argue with them about their choices forever, or you just give them space to rant their crazy cult thoughts, and you're just, like, happy to be in their life a little bit. I mean, it would be such a mess. They're just very powerful, very dangerous, you know, fringe groups that can probably grab almost anyone with the right timing and direction.

[Chris Hughes]

Oh, yeah. I mean, even, you know, there's no ill intentions behind anything that, like, a lot of, you know, churches or religious people do a lot of time, you know, compared to a cult. But even them, you know, they're very, very welcoming. They want you to join the church. They're very eager to hear about you and your ideas. And if you're not very set on what you want to do and you have a plan that you want to follow and you're, you know, you're not looking to be persuaded, it's very easy to fall into that. I'm not saying people shouldn't go to church or church is bad and the same as cults, but they use. I feel like they use a lot of similar ways to get people to join and stuff like that.

[Adam Thorne]

There's tactics and. And, you know, people are. I don't want to say gullible, but they're very suggestible. He talked about that experiment Chris was talking about, where people would see different lengths, lines.

[Chris Hughes]

Oh, yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

And it was like, which is the shortest or longest or whatever. And everyone else in the experiment was a plant, so they would all agree with the wrong answer. And almost everybody that was the actual participant went later and would just agree with the group. And it's like, we're inclined to agree with a lot. I guess the larger the group, the more inclined we are.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

Do it. But, yeah, they We. They don't speak out. They're just like, oh, yeah, it's c. When they know, they can clearly see that it's not.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that one's concerning. Yeah. I mean, even, like, it's.

[Adam Thorne]

It must be, like, evolutionary, though.

[Chris Hughes]

There's so many examples of that, though, you know, like people my age. It's like the same thing with getting people to drink and drag them out to the bars. You might have one friend in your group that's not an alcohol person and they don't like to do it. But then you get one night when everyone's going and they're like, yeah, I'll go. And then they just turn into not themselves. They just follow the herd.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah. Peer pressure.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah. But I think too, especially it's a lot easier to do in young people. And you talked about this a lot. I mean, I was thinking about even just the way social media has done a lot of this stuff. Just like mind control and psychological hacks to get you to be more addicted to social media and getting that same constant dopamine fix. It's not the same thing as trying to convince someone to join a cult, but a lot of the same methods are used. It's like people who understand psychology who have this goal of, we want people to be either addicted to our phones or join our cults or whatever it is, and then they end up using it, using these psychological tips in the wrong ways. And then it's like, oh, we've got a bunch of people addicted to this stuff. Or, you know, anywhere you go, any sort of advertising is trying to do some level of that, trying to persuade you, trying to get you to do something, act now, buy now, you know, join.

[Adam Thorne]

Do you think it has something to do with, like, in a sense, developing your own identity? Like, all the people, even if they're not super happy with where their life is or who they are, they do have a sense of their own identity. And younger people are working on that.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah, they're just trying to figure stuff out. And so I feel like you're more likely to try stuff. You know, you're like, hear about some cool group overseas that's doing conservation or whatever. You know, you just read it without looking into it and you're like, wow, this sounds great. You know, I should try this. I should do this. Yeah, I feel like it's a lot easier to convince people who are trying to figure out what they want to do or, you know, they're just trying stuff out. It's a lot easier to get them. They're also more. More vulnerable to that kind of stuff. They just don't know. A younger person or older person, you have to assume has had more people try to steal their arm and manipulate them in ways, and so they kind of can tell the signs of it. Whereas a young person is just like, you know, they don't. They haven't had that experience yet. Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

They're looking for meaning and excitement.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

So if you can stimulate those two things even with a wacky idea, there's a good chance that it's a better message than their parents are giving them right now, which is, don't do this, don't do that. Go get a job.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

A bunch of hard stuff. And then someone else is like, just come live in the woods with us.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah, it's cool.

[Adam Thorne]

We got crystals. These ladies aren't wearing tops. Get in the water. You're like, okay, baptize.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah. Or I feel like, as well, too. I bet it's. It's a lot easier to convince young people because they don't have as much money, you know, if you're like, hey, you want to go on this trip? We'll feed you. We'll do all of this stuff. You're like, sweet. I don't have to worry about anything, you know? Whereas an older person's like, I can afford to feed myself. I don't really need to. Whatever, you know? But if you're like, even, you know, even, like, fucking test samples, you know, you go to Costco, they could put literally anything there, and you would try it because it's free.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah. Like, yeah. You're like, God, I really hate these berries, but I'll take them. Yeah. Well, you know, talking about how easy it is to persuade people. What about people that watch the View and see that as, like, a source of news? They discuss the time that that one lady was talking about Rogan and was like, oh, he believes in dragons.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

And I remember the clip. And they. And even someone on there was like, are you sure? She's like, oh, yeah. We double checked.

[Chris Hughes]

We checked. Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

And it's like, no, no, you didn't. And I'm wondering, like, how many people out there still now, if you brought up Joe Rogan, knew nothing about him and were like, well, I heard he believes in dragons. Like, the View is enough of a news source. It has to be to some people.

[Chris Hughes]

Or what was the one during COVID that he uses horse tranquilizers as medicine? Or what was the thing that they.

[Adam Thorne]

Were trying to say about Him. Ivermectin.

[Chris Hughes]

Yep. Well, I think it's like, I notice this all the time with people I know is even if people are so attached to their beliefs and their structure and the way that they see the world is so ingrained in their identity that when you challenge that in some way with new information, they'll actively try and fight it, regardless of whether you're right and they're wrong or whatever it is. Like, if you're challenging something that people believe. And he kind of hints on this too, along with that whole identity thing is like, you have to tie it into who they are as a person because that like clicks with people, that gets people's attention, that gets them hooked, you know. But with the View, you know, she didn't fucking know that. She didn't check that Joe Rogan believes in dinosaurs or dragons, whatever. She just, she doesn't like Joe Rogan. And she heard someone say something about Healey believes in dragons, and she was like, I'm gonna roll with this because I don't like Joe Rogan or she.

[Adam Thorne]

Doesn'T even really have an opinion about him. She's like told that he's just popular and people haven't been liking him. That's the narrative we gotta go with in wacky stuff. So just, you know, give him some shit.

[Chris Hughes]

Also, of all the things you're gonna say about someone as an insult, saying they believe in dragons is like, I don't know, that's kind of cool, man. If you were like, yeah, man, I still believe in dragons, I'd be like, all right, we can still be friends, dude.

[Adam Thorne]

When he put it on his Instagram.

[Chris Hughes]

It just backfired on them.

[Adam Thorne]

Dragon believer. It was one of the best things I've ever seen.

[Chris Hughes]

That would be such a flex. I would, I would say that to everyone and be like, hey, I got news. People thinking that I believe in dragons, I would.

[Adam Thorne]

I think that that might be the first thing I say to Rogan if I ever mean it. Be like, are you the guy that believes in dragons? Like. Like my only news source is the View. I'm just that guy, 43 year old white guy. I love the View.

[Chris Hughes]

I've never watched the View. It's like Good morning America, right? I've only some morning news show.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, it's just.

[Chris Hughes]

Just seems like bottom of the barrel of entertainment. Yeah, all of those news shows are terrible.

[Adam Thorne]

I love daytime TV is bad though. It's bad for your health.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah, it's so bad. I loved back in the day when before they got onto it. All these comedians like Tom Segura would go on pretending to be rappers and a joke of the entire production. It was so funny. Theo Vaughn used to do that. Oh my God, those were the days. And now all those people know like, hey, don't let these people do it. They're just gonna hijack your show.

[Adam Thorne]

They still have them on, but they all, all these guys do podcasts now.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

So all these new comedians and there's still a group now, like the more up and comers will still go and try and do morning TV if their social media isn't big enough. But most people are just putting their energy into social media. For one, if you're a comedian, you go to a town, right?

[Sean Houlahan]

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[Adam Thorne]

For the weekend somewhere your spots are late and you don't want to get up at like 5:30 to go to a news station and try and make your jokes and it's just all awkward, annoying nonsense. Yeah.

[Chris Hughes]

And a lot of those people don't even know how to take a joke. You know, they just, like, often they don't understand comedy. And they're so used to their suburban lives, they just can't. People that read good one 911 joke and they're just like, oh, my God, I'm gonna lose my job.

[Adam Thorne]

I mean, Bill Burr used to dismantle those clips so good, he just hammers them.

[Chris Hughes]

It's so funny.

[Adam Thorne]

What did you think about the rfk, Senator? RFK assassination in the hotel shot in the. What was it? The kitchen area. So this was shortly after JFK was shot. His brother was. And during the time when he was doing a presidential run, this guy, what was it? Sirhan Sirhan.

[Chris Hughes]

Oh, yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

Who supposedly, you know, assassinated him. But when they interviewed him, had no idea. Was like, I thought I was at a shooting range or like, you know, even up for probation. They're like, all you have to do is just say that you did this and, you know, we reduce your sentence or do something. He's like, I don't remember this.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah, that's crazy.

[Adam Thorne]

During the time that the CIA was doing all sorts of stuff, it was like, mind control, this and that. Are we ever gonna find out? I don't think so.

[Chris Hughes]

I thought Trump was gonna release the RFK stuff supposedly.

[Adam Thorne]

I mean, jfk. Yeah. RFK is like, obviously push for it. But, you know, here's what I think. I think if anything, the deal was, here you go, rfk. Here's all the information. It's what you thought it was anyway. Also, we can't really tell the public this. And you understand why.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

And that might be the deal. That might be why we don't ever get it.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah. Who knows? I mean, anyone with a brain can discern that it was probably the government, CIA. You know, the CIA has admitted.

[Adam Thorne]

I'm tuning you in.

[Chris Hughes]

They've admitted that they did mlk. They admitted that they assassinated mlk.

[Adam Thorne]

Wait, who did?

[Chris Hughes]

CIA.

[Adam Thorne]

What? I thought the FBI had it out for him.

[Chris Hughes]

Maybe it was. Well, the thing that I read, I read something recently that said it was the CIA. Because I was reading, I was at work and I just started looking on or I think my friend texted me something. But literally you can go to their website and they say, like, my bad, we understand that. Or I don't think that they necessarily admit it, but they essentially say the motivation behind it, how they would have done it, and all of this other stuff. They basically lay it all out, but they were like, yeah, the movement towards the civil rights and all that stuff. Like, he was such an important figure for all of that stuff and that they wanted to dismantle that and they couldn't have him be the voice of that. And so. But yeah, you can go on and read.

[Adam Thorne]

It's pretty gross.

[Chris Hughes]

Documents.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, that is. Yeah.

[Chris Hughes]

Well, I thought it was interesting too, in the podcast. I mean, I guess this is a better way of using mind control, but what they were talking about with, you know, using it in, like fighters to get them to, like, develop an alter ego in there so that they don't feel pain and, you know, don't run out of steam and stuff like that. That's.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah. Tyson worked with the hypnotist. Yeah, they discussed that. I mean, he was just a killing machine when he was in that ring and it probably really fucked him up, honestly, like, he was really young when they started hammering this narrative.

[Chris Hughes]

13 years old. Yeah. Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

So imagine trying to develop as an adult and then you've just had this narrative banged into you. Now you're like, I don't know, 21, you're one of the most famous people in the world. Everyone's terrified of you, you've got tons of money.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

I mean, tricky to navigate for sure. They even talked about Roy Jones. Roy Jones Jr. You familiar with him as a boxer? Amazing. Incredible. And he had the alter ego rj, and he pull him out and just crush people.

[Chris Hughes]

That's crazy.

[Adam Thorne]

I wonder how that could be. Like, it's one thing to think, you know, how lucky you have to be to even be physically badass enough to be one of the best boxers in the world, but then also you just happen to have this thing where you can create this, like, alter ego. It just seems to be like so many stars need to align to make these superhumans.

[Chris Hughes]

Well, for Mike Tyson, you know, I mean, you take someone who's 13 years old, he's already crazy at 13 years old, you know, and then you start doing this stuff. He's with the genetics and the work ethic that he has, he's already on track to be one of the greatest of all time. And then you start doing the mind control stuff and you just create this other monster.

[Adam Thorne]

Right.

[Chris Hughes]

And yeah, it is. It's like the perfect storm. You know, by the time the guy's 20, he's already had like seven years of just non stop boxing as an already good boxer, you know, like smashing everyone. Yeah. And so, you know, you add that with all of the side mind control training that he's doing and it's just like, yeah, you create someone who's literally unstoppable.

[Adam Thorne]

Well, but you know, and, and let's end on a bit of a positive to this one because this episode was, it was tough to hear. I mean, psyop stuff is hard to listen to and then thinking of all the nefarious shit that's probably going on with that. But you know, ultimately, you know, he talked about visualization and how powerful of a tool it is and yeah, it can be bad if you visualize your life sucking all the time. Yeah, it's probably not going to be great.

[Sean Houlahan]

Missions to Mars, driverless cars, AI chatbots. Feels like we're already living in the future. Well, Robinhood is built for the future of trading. Robinhood's intuitive design makes trading seamless spot opportunities and take control of your trades. With tools like screeners, simulated returns and strategy builder on Robinhood, traders have access to hundreds of popular stocks and ETFs 24 hours a day, five days a week so you can keep up with today's fast paced markets. You can now even trade stocks and crypto all in one place with the new desktop platform Robinhood Legend. The future of trading is fast, powerful and precise. Experience it now on Robinhood Investing is risky. Robinhood Financial LLC Member SIPC is a registered broker dealer. Trading during extended hours involves additional risks. Cryptocurrency services are offered through an account with Robinhood Crypto LLC. NMLS ID 1702840 Robinhood Crypto is licensed to engage in virtual currency business activity by the New York State Department of Financial Services.

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[Adam Thorne]

Because you're kind of writing that narrative, but the fact that positive visualization, which anyone can do with practice, start out slow, give it a few minutes. You know, just do your best. Even if you don't believe the narrative that you kind of written, you can just follow it. You can start getting some incredible wins, at least boost your confidence.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah One of my favorite things in the show, towards the end, he had two quotes. He said, if the opinion that's coming out needs people to be silenced, it's a psyop. Which is kind of true.

[Adam Thorne]

That was good.

[Chris Hughes]

And then the other one was, if you can't see anything wrong with the side you agree with and nothing right with the side you disagree with, you've been lied to. Which is a good goddamn quote.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, just very general. I mean, the other thing that came with the psyop is if they try to shut you down publicly, like publicly shame you, like, pretty much, you'll know that it's a psyop.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

I mean, yeah. And then, of course, they went into Covid for 10, 15 minutes because that's it. That was the first thing I was thinking about.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

As soon as they said it was like, oh, that was exactly what that is. And, you know, that's the narrative over and over again, which we've talked about a million times.

[Chris Hughes]

But yeah, because in Covid, you had that herd mentality where it was like people were. Like they said in the podcast, there was examples of left wing political websites saying, like, you know, people who are anti vaxxers dying, it's like something we have to accept or whatever it is, you know?

[Adam Thorne]

Oh, yeah, they were like, they wanted. They wanted them to die or found it, like, almost humorous because it was so obvious what they needed to do and you chose not to. It's almost like you're just jumping into an alligator pit. So what do you expect? This is Darwinism. That's the kind of talk that was coming up. And that's.

[Chris Hughes]

That's the way you do it, though. You don't have to. Why. Why spend all the time convincing people yourselves when you can convince other people to let them do the convincing for you?

[Adam Thorne]

Mm.

[Chris Hughes]

Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

And on that note, let's call it.

[Chris Hughes]

Well, one more thing. I bet this dude's gonna have so many fighters in his DMs being like, yo, can you train me? Can you create an alter ego? Yeah, he's probably gonna make a killing off of that.

[Adam Thorne]

I need an rj. Let's go. Anyway, yeah, it was interesting. It's. It's fascinating. It leads into a lot of the conversations that Rogan's been having recently. The Elon one, just everything with Doge and everything with, like, how politics works and how the media manipulates people. I mean, it's. It's. The government also does the same. It's just so much of that that's like tied into this.

[Chris Hughes]

Gotta look out, people.

[Adam Thorne]

There we go.

[Chris Hughes]

Put your thinking cap on.

[Adam Thorne]

All right, thanks, Sean. Appreciate it. And guys, we will talk to you next week.

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