446 Joe Rogan Experience Review of Dr. Zahi Hawass

Summary

Podcast Summary: Joe Rogan Experience Review Podcast – Episode 446: Review of Dr. Zahi Hawass

Release Date: May 28, 2025
Hosts: Adam Thorne & Pete
Guest: Dr. Zahi Hawass (Reviewed)
Duration: Approximately 43 minutes of content

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Introduction

In Episode 446 of the Joe Rogan Experience Review podcast, hosts Adam Thorne and Pete delve into a critical analysis of Dr. Zahi Hawass's appearance on Joe Rogan's show. This episode aims to unpack the controversies and shortcomings perceived during Hawass's discussion, offering listeners a comprehensive breakdown of what transpired and its implications for both Hawass and the broader field of Egyptology.

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Major Controversy: Hawass’s Performance on Rogan’s Podcast

[01:53] Adam Thorne:
"We're reviewing Dr. Hawass. My guest today is good old Pete. What's cracking?"

The hosts immediately set the tone by describing Dr. Zahi Hawass's appearance as potentially "the worst podcast" Rogan has ever hosted. They express disappointment in Hawass's demeanor and approach during the conversation.

[02:16] Pete:
"It seemed like he was talking to a brick wall."

[04:25] Pete:
"He definitely did. And it was to gatekeep into and to keep his power structure intact."

The primary critique revolves around Hawass's inability to engage constructively, leading the hosts to perceive his approach as defensive and protective of his established authority in Egyptology.

---

Specific Critiques and Points of Discussion

1. Pyramid Construction Debate

A significant portion of the episode focuses on Hawass's explanations regarding the construction of the pyramids, specifically addressing the size and placement of the stone blocks.

[02:19] Pete:
"He kept talking about these 4-ton bricks. Those ones aren't very problematic. The ones that cause issues are the ones that are like 80 tons."

The hosts challenge Hawass's remarks on the logistics of moving massive stone blocks, questioning the feasibility of transporting 80-ton blocks without clear evidence or methodology.

[03:04] Adam Thorne:
"Which actually is how it works in Greece, you know that, right?"

They draw parallels to ancient Greek structures like the Parthenon, which also utilized large stone blocks, suggesting that Egyptians employed sophisticated but known techniques rather than attributing pyramid construction to unknown or extraordinary methods.

2. Gatekeeping and Scientific Openness

Adam and Pete criticize Hawass for what they perceive as gatekeeping within the field of Egyptology, arguing that his reluctance to entertain alternative theories stifles scientific progress.

[09:05] Adam Thorne:
"Gatekeeping is a big problem. I don't care for that at all. You see, in all areas of life. And I don't think there's a benefit for it."

They advocate for a more inclusive and inquisitive scientific community that welcomes diverse viewpoints and investigates anomalies rather than dismissing them outright.

3. Lack of Evidence and Transparency

The hosts highlight Hawass's failure to provide concrete evidence to support his claims, further undermining his credibility.

[06:23] Adam Thorne:
"You should have followed up with Jamie with some pictures. Remember that part? He never gave us those pictures."

They point out that Hawass did not provide visual or empirical evidence during his podcast appearance, which left listeners without substantiation for his assertions.

4. Hawass’s Demeanor and Professionalism

Hawass's on-air behavior is another focal point of the critique, with Adam and Pete describing his attitude as dismissive and antagonistic.

[16:19] Pete:
"Those two-ton blocks are like the filler pieces supporting the structure. And that structure like clearly is not a tomb."

[19:14] Adam Thorne:
"Maybe it's not very good, dude. How could it be?"

Their observations suggest that Hawass's confrontational approach alienated both themselves and potentially the audience, detracting from a productive dialogue.

---

Evidence Discussed: Diorite Vessels and Hieroglyphics

The episode delves into specific archaeological findings, questioning traditional interpretations and highlighting potential gaps in Hawass’s explanations.

[30:42] Pete:
"The diorite was cut with a slower circular saw, maybe, or lathe, and the progression was faster. The evidence of the tool marks are bigger. He didn't have an answer for it either."

The hosts discuss the intricate craftsmanship of diorite vessels, emphasizing the advanced techniques required to shape such hard materials, which Hawass failed to adequately address.

[10:48] Adam Thorne:
"What about the hieroglyphic that has straight up a helicopter on it, a UFO and like a jet?"

They bring up intriguing hieroglyphics purportedly depicting modern technology, questioning why Hawass dismisses such evidence without exploration.

---

Interpersonal Dynamics and Host Reactions

Throughout the episode, Adam and Pete express frustration with both Hawass and the format of his appearance on Rogan's podcast.

[22:33] Adam Thorne:
"He's been in the echo chamber, like people are kissing his ass. Everything he says is gospel because he shouted over Joe for like two plus hours."

[38:51] Adam Thorne:
"He got too popular, dude. That's what it is. You get that popular, and people are mad that their nerds they listen to aren't as popular."

These remarks highlight the tension between maintaining scientific integrity and navigating public popularity, suggesting that Hawass's approach may be influenced by his desire to uphold his reputation.

---

Hosts’ Final Thoughts and Recommendations

Adam and Pete conclude with a nuanced view, acknowledging that while Hawass may have valuable insights, his presentation and defenses were lackluster.

[44:03] Pete:
"It is worth listening to because you'll never hear somebody talk for two and a half hours and say less."

[44:52] Pete:
"It's worth listening to because you'll never hear somebody talk for two and a half hours and say less. He said he didn't have much in the way of answers for Joe."

They recommend the episode primarily for its illustrative value on how not to effectively communicate complex ideas to a broad audience, especially when lacking substantial evidence.

---

Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Adam Thorne [01:53]:
  "We're reviewing Dr. Hawass. My guest today is good old Pete. What's cracking?"

• Pete [02:16]:
  "It seemed like he was talking to a brick wall."

• Pete [09:05]:
  "Gatekeeping is a big problem. I don't care for that at all."

• Adam Thorne [06:23]:
  "You should have followed up with Jamie with some pictures. Remember that part? He never gave us those pictures."

• Adam Thorne [22:33]:
  "He's been in the echo chamber, like people are kissing his ass. Everything he says is gospel because he shouted over Joe for like two plus hours."

• Pete [44:52]:
  "It's worth listening to because you'll never hear somebody talk for two and a half hours and say less."

---

Conclusion

Episode 446 of the Joe Rogan Experience Review podcast offers a critical examination of Dr. Zahi Hawass's appearance on Joe Rogan's platform. Through incisive dialogue, Adam Thorne and Pete dissect Hawass's arguments, demeanor, and the overall effectiveness of his communication. While recognizing Hawass's expertise in Egyptology, the hosts underscore the importance of openness, evidence-based discussion, and constructive engagement in fostering scientific advancement. This episode serves as both a critique and a call for more transparent and inquisitive approaches within specialized fields.

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Note: This summary intentionally omits advertisements, intros, outros, and non-content sections to focus solely on the substantive discussions between the hosts regarding Dr. Zahi Hawass's podcast appearance.

Transcript

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[Adam Thorne]

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[Adam Thorne]

What a bizarre thing we've created. Now with your hosts, Adam Thorne.

[Pete]

This might either be the worst podcast.

[Adam Thorne]

Or the best one. One go. Enjoy the show. Hey, ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to the Joe Rogan Experience Review. This week we are reviewing Dr. Hawass. My guest today is good old pizza. What's cracking?

[Pete]

Oh, not too much. Glad to be here. Thank you for having me.

[Adam Thorne]

Mm.

[Pete]

Cheers.

[Adam Thorne]

So let's start with the major controversy that has happened here. Rogan describes this as maybe the worst podcast he's ever had to do. He was patient, but certainly struggling to keep his patience on this one. What were your thoughts?

[Pete]

It seemed like he was talking to a brick wall.

[Adam Thorne]

Bad, right?

[Pete]

It was really weird for me. I had to. I watched it and excuse me, I listened to it in pieces because I was just like shouting at my headphones, like, what about the 80 ton bricks? He kept talking about these 4 ton bricks. Those ones Aren't very problematic. The. The ones that cause issues are the ones that are like 80 tons. How do they do that? Yeah, that's not even to mention the ones that are. That comprise the base of the pyramid, which are. They don't even know how much they weigh. They can't.

[Adam Thorne]

They.

[Pete]

They have huge ranges for those base pieces, and those base pieces might be built upon a. Might be the structure of a far older structure.

[Adam Thorne]

Right. Which actually is how it works in Greece. You know that, right?

[Pete]

Oh, yeah, yeah. The Parthenon's built on those, like, hundreds of tons. Blocks.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah. Which they think were placed there way long before they made those, and they have no idea how that happened. So you're just like, okay, we're not.

[Pete]

Saying it's aliens, but, you know, if you don't research it and look at it, then how could. That's Graham's thing. Just investigate it.

[Adam Thorne]

But why is it so important for him to say we have all the answers? Do they think in the. You know, and we hear this from Graham. Graham, like, you know, archeologists want to be able to tell you they know the answer so that we think that they know what they're talking about. But why is it a problem just to say, hey, actually, we're the best at this and we still don't know. Isn't that reasonable? If he had come on this podcast and been like, all right, here's what I've researched, here's what I've looked at. Also, realistically, there's some major unknown questions here, and I'm happy to explore them just like you are. It's. It's like he came on with an agenda for sure.

[Pete]

He definitely. He definitely did. And it was to gatekeep into and to keep his power structure in intact.

[Adam Thorne]

Dude, he lost so much credibility on this. I don't even think he realizes what he did.

[Pete]

The whole. When he says, I'm a scientist and I look at the evidence, what's in front of me, completely lose. It's a. It's a contradiction because he's not looking at what's right in front of him. Let's evaluate this new evidence. Scientist, Right?

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah.

[Pete]

Put it into the. Put it into the picture. How much cooler would it be if he was like, what a mystery. We've. We've are uncovering incredible mysteries. This is gonna keep us busy for decades. We don't know now or we really never knew. And that would lend credibility to him versus what he did, which.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, yeah, smoke a cigar. Really weird.

[Pete]

I was about to Say that too. He was cheaping on it. Like the last end of a high school's school is blunt. Like, yeah, come on. He has a mouth. Actually, his mouth, his whole demeanor is offensive to me.

[Adam Thorne]

It was, it was a struggle and it was a shame. I was really hoping that he'd be more open about, you know, and I'm kind of hoping that it doesn't destroy, you know, Hancock's chances again back out.

[Pete]

There, you know he's banned from the pyramids.

[Adam Thorne]

No, he said he could. He, he was hanging out with this guy again. He's like, cool with him. So we'll see how long that lasts after this. But also, you know, he's like, come here, we'll show you how to ch. I'm like, okay, maybe they can do it, but I don't think it's as simple as how you're describing. And he's like, it's in my book.

[Pete]

All right, you should have brought it. And you should have brought your computer, you wanker.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, and you should have followed up with Jamie with some pictures. Remember that part? If you were just listening to it, you may have missed this, but at the point where he was like, yeah, we'll follow up with, you know, photos and evidence and all the rest of it in, you know, a week from now. And Jamie just wrote a little thing. He never, never gave us those pictures. I've never seen that in an episode ever.

[Pete]

It was like pulling teeth from a toothless individual, dude.

[Adam Thorne]

It was a game changer, you know, and if anything I, it's made like if he came on to like push a narrative which was, it was all just made regular by great stonemasons and it's all reasonable and that's how it was done. And the timeline is perfect. I couldn't believe in it less now. That's what it did for me.

[Pete]

Yeah, yeah, I can vibe with that.

[Adam Thorne]

Uh huh. I'm like, oh shit, the aliens did make it.

[Pete]

I just like, what is the big deal about saying humans have been here a lot longer than what we've first. Modern humans have been here for a long time and maybe a million years longer than we thought we were here for. Is there like, is that terrible to look for the evidence for that? Like, it's mind boggling to me. They, I think it was in the 80s they found a fossilized modern human head skull encased in stone in Morocco. And it was, they were first thinking that it was, oh, just some paleo hominids that were not modern humans. But then it turns out they had burned their flint to make it work better. You. You burn flint in order to realign the crystalline structure to make better stone tools. These, these, when you do that, you lock in new structure for these for excellent tools that allow for dating. And it is older than 50, 000 years, of course, because they're encased in Iraq. But this is just another example of aberrant data on the edges of their data set that they kind of brush off. And that is just not scientific. We got to get to the bottom of this. You don't do it by just gaslighting and gatekeeping.

[Adam Thorne]

Right.

[Pete]

If I'm to use some terms.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, yeah. Gatekeeping is a big problem. I don't care for that at all. You see, in all areas of life. And I don't think there's a benefit for it. You know, it doesn't bring in new ideas. I think it brings in, you know, stubborn ignorance in a way. And it, and it just keeps you stuck. And it's like, what are we trying to do? What's the big deal? Let's bring some ideas into the mix and really explore them. Yeah, I don't really understand what they're worried about, I guess being wrong.

[Pete]

You lose me. You lose me when you do that. When I can clearly see through you.

[Adam Thorne]

Let's get into some of the specifics of what he was talking about. I mean, when he jumped to, you know, oh, we did the research, I discovered everything. Like, that's a red flag, dude.

[Pete]

That's a red flag when you say I that much about you having a team. I can't imagine working with him. I. You would be a slave to him.

[Adam Thorne]

He's just puffing on cigars.

[Pete]

And why do you take every other illuminated text or hieroglyphics as canon? Like everything he's talking about is set in stone, literally. But the all there's another hieroglyphic that talks about kings that go back 30,000 years.

[Adam Thorne]

Right.

[Pete]

And though he's okay with the last 10. But the. But as before that it's all legend and fable and, and not evidence. That doesn't seem. Why would you take that bit and not that bit?

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah. Also, what about the hieroglyphic that has straight up a helicopter on it, a UFO and like a jet. This podcast is brought to you by DraftKings Casino. Spring is in full bloom on DraftKings Casino. New offers and promos are sprouting up daily rain right now. New players can play five bucks on anything and get 350 casino spins instantly on a featured slot game. Download the app and sign up with code jre. Take the featured slot for a spin and explore thousands of others in the DraftKings game library. Check back daily to claim the hottest offers and promos on DraftKings. Casino. The crown is yours. Gambling problem core 1-800- gambler in Connecticut. Help is available for problem gambling. Call 888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org Please play responsibly. 21/physically present in Michigan, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, West Virginia only. Void in Connecticut and Ontario eligibility restrictions apply. New customers only. Non withdrawable casino spins Valid for featured only and expire in seen terms [e-mail] promos. Ends June 15, 2025 at 11:59pm Eastern Standard Time. Like this.

[Pete]

The top. At the top. In that temple. At the top. Yeah, of. I think it's the top of a. A plinth. Yeah, that's. Explain that, Zawas.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, that. What. What are those shapes?

[Pete]

Because would you draw a shape like that? Unless you saw a shape like that.

[Adam Thorne]

Which is kind of wild, really. You know, I mean, there's not. It's not like there's inventions from 200 years. It's not like there's a train on one of them. It's almost like they're like, oh, we're gonna. We're gonna give you a message that you'll, like, will be so clear to you at a certain point in time that you cannot deny it. See if you can figure it out.

[Pete]

And I'm not throwing out the baby with the bathwater here. I'm sure he's done a lot of great work and research, and maybe his iteration of this is correct. I'm okay with accepting that. If it's correct, that's fine.

[Adam Thorne]

It just didn't.

[Pete]

Let's look at the other evidence.

[Adam Thorne]

Exactly. Yeah. I'm not saying what. The work he's doing is not good. And at times, you know, I just wonder. It just didn't sit well with me. Right. So think about it from like a Rogan podcast where he has like a political commentator on. And you're just sensing that it's bullshit. It's like, it doesn't mean that he hasn't done good work at some point or her. But thank you. It's giving you. Yeah, you're welcome. It's giving you a bit of a feel for, like, maybe this is bullshit, dude. And he would go back to his book a few times, and Rogan even was like, trying to be Polite, like doing a great job, I think. And he was like, oh, the book, okay. Like, it was just driving him nuts. Because, dude, Rogan, Rogan has done enough of these. He may be the podcaster that has the most hours in podcasting of all time. I think he's. If, you know, if there was a chart just for like the most hours ever talking to somebody, he might be winning that one too. It'd be close. Maybe there's some other psycho out there doing it. But, you know, he's. He's learning a lot every time. And he's just like, his bullshit meter is not bad, right? It doesn't mean it's perfect, but you've got to assume that it's like, better than a lot of people's.

[Pete]

I would. That's one of the things that I would noticed is Joe might not know the exact pronunciations or timelines of discovery for lots of this stuff, but he knows more about the pyramids and the Great Pyramid probably specifically than anybody you or I know.

[Adam Thorne]

Oh, 100%, dude.

[Pete]

He was like, well, what about the 80 to 100 ton blocks below that? And it was never even talked about again.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, he's like, they float them down the Nile. It's fine. Joe was like, they came from the mountains. He's like, no way. No, it came from a stone quarry right next to the. And I'm like, yeah, maybe it is as simple as, like, they just wait for the floods. They just float them down the river. But it also doesn't explain why the fuck they. Why, why put those blocks in the middle of that thing. Seems like a shitload of unnecessary work when you're building the rest of the pyramids with like two ton blocks.

[Pete]

It's. Those two ton blocks are like the filler pieces supporting the structure. And that, that structure like clearly is not a tomb. It is not a tomb. If the tomb is a tomb, the king sarcophagus is like seven feet tall, right? And it specifically weighs, or excuse me, generally weighs like 30 tons of carved diorite. And that diorite is almost, you almost can't scratch it with a diamond. It's that hard, right? And, and the old kingdom didn't have iron. They had. They. They think they cut these stones with silica imbued ropes and copper tools. That's it. It's just literally impossible. There's two kinds of hieroglyphics. There's the kind that are in the diorite, etched a few millimeters into the diorite, and they are just like the hieroglyphics of the old kingdom and then the old kingdoms are scratched in and painted. They are not. And when they tried. And there's also this clear after the fact scratching on the diorite, which is just a thumbnails mark on those things of hieroglyphics. They could barely scratch that stuff. The whole thing was not addressed. And I, I guess it's just, it's a. I'm getting worked up over here about it. I need to, I need to take a. Take a. Let me take a drink of this.

[Adam Thorne]

Let's take five. Let's take five. No, I think you're right, man. I. Here's the thing, right? It's like two things could have happened on this. He could have come on, been open minded. It would have persuaded me. It's way easier to believe that the actual narrative could be real. Right. If you really think about it, it's fun to jump into conspiracies, but if you just take everything at face value, it takes a lot less energy and there sometimes is a reasonable story behind it. And in order to create that narrative, it doesn't hurt to be open to other ideas. Right. If he had just addressed it like, yeah, you know, it does seem unusual that they could place all those blocks and the, the, you know, hundred ton blocks or whatever, the 10 ton blocks, like the bigger ones were, you know, kind of odd to put in those places. Also, we don't fully understand their construction methods. He came in like he was fucking there, dude, right? And I'm like, he's my research, my book. I was like, all right, this motherfucker wants to sell a book that's number one.

[Pete]

Should have brought one. He should have brought one for Joe and Jamie.

[Adam Thorne]

Maybe it's not very good, dude.

[Pete]

How could it be?

[Adam Thorne]

And they're like, is it online? Can we look online? He goes, why would I put online? It's in my book. Like, that's the dude. It just. From a standpoint of book selling, this was the worst book selling attempt of any guest that ever went on Rogan, I would say. And I've reviewed a lot.

[Pete]

You have?

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah. Personally, I did it.

[Pete]

Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

You?

[Pete]

Yeah. You have? Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah. Whether you like it or not, I'm like, probably the foremost reviewer.

[Pete]

Of the. Gee, I'm just getting worked up about the WASPS some more, dude.

[Adam Thorne]

Let's go. There's so much more to it.

[Pete]

Hold on. Leave the scroll down here. I'm jumping over all over the place.

[Adam Thorne]

We're not in a rush. We're not in a rush. We're gonna get to the bottom of this, dude. We're gonna get to the bottom, find out why. Like, what do you think the motivation is to be gatekeeping like this?

[Pete]

I think it has something to do with his position, his. Also his tie to the land. He did say that the people that constructed the pyramids, the pyramids were the genetic forebears of the people that. So the people that made it are related to the people that are there now.

[Adam Thorne]

Right.

[Pete]

I think that has a lot to do with his pride and ego. A lot of. A lot of ego. I want to ask him why. Why after the great Pyramid, which is the oldest, if I'm correct. If I'm not, I'm sorry.

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[Adam Thorne]

Let's go.

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[Pete]

Every pyramid after that is worse, right? Way, way worse.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, that's interesting.

[Pete]

This. The Great Pyramid is mathematically perfect. It's geographically perfect. It aligns with the stars. At least it did 12,000 years ago. And the. I think a lot of it has to do with his ties to the land and his position as the gatekeeper. I'm sure he goes to all the best parties.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, and it does sound like he's been in the echo chamber, like people are kissing his ass. You know, everything he says is gospel because, I mean, he shouted over Joe for like two plus hours.

[Pete]

Joe did a really good job about like just kind of like glancing over at Jamie and like, oh my goodness, dude.

[Adam Thorne]

You know what this has done? You don't fuck with Joe Rogan, let me tell you that much. He is gonna have on the. Whoever the scientists are that like discovered the structures underneath. He's gonna have them on. He's probably gonna text Elon and be like, you make satellites that can just. He's going to get to the bottom of this himself. This is annoyed Joe. I guarantee it. And he's in a position where he's always been a curious guy. And he's like, you know what? I'm going to find out what the fuck is going on under there. And I hope he does.

[Pete]

There's shafts that they just label ventilation tunnels. And they sit. They send a rover down it. There's these things. They. These cool robots go in there. They cut a hole and they go in and before you know it, it's blocked by a weird door. It's not a ventilation chamber if it's blocked.

[Adam Thorne]

No.

[Pete]

What was it for? There's no answer to this stuff.

[Adam Thorne]

What do you think? Throughout a theory.

[Pete]

Geez. Like, okay, cheese.

[Adam Thorne]

It's for cheese.

[Pete]

I said, geez.

[Adam Thorne]

It would have been. Would have been a cool theory though. Cheese making. There's a.

[Pete]

There's a professor I've listened to and follow his work named Robert Garland.

[Adam Thorne]

Mm.

[Pete]

And he is an ancient historian and he talks about the great pyramids and he talks about how that because they're. They're in the old kingdom, which is not that long ago compared to the. As old as the things is the Sphinx is like What? Like they've decided 15, 000 years old from Robert Shock's work. Yeah.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah.

[Pete]

Der El Medina. Der El Medina, I hope I'm pronouncing that correctly, is a dedicated work camp of high level craftsmen. And I didn't hear that mentioned once. I didn't hear that mentioned one time. That's just some stuff that he probably didn't have a hand in unearthing. So if it doesn't fit into his purview of his. Of his world, then he just throws it out. Well. And these guys weren't the ancients that. Okay. I'm going to say I think it was created long ago through Robert Schoch's work about the erosion of the Sphinx and how the Sphinx probably had a lion's head instead of a pharaoh's head. So they recrafted it and repurposed it. There's just so Many questions.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah. And he did not fill me with confidence, I'll tell you that much. You know, it was like, let's assume everything he said was correct. He was the worst ambassador to deliver that message.

[Pete]

Oh, that's perfect, actually.

[Adam Thorne]

Right?

[Pete]

Totally.

[Adam Thorne]

So, again, baby bathwater. Like, I'm sure he's doing some stuff, but I don't think he is the best ambassador for this. And it doesn't hurt to throw, like, okay, so Egypt, Cairo, the legacy of what the pyramids are. I mean, to be fair, the pyramids weren't there. That's just a desert kind of place. You know, it's like, whatever. I don't know. Egypt's economy isn't great. It's kind of volatile. You don't necessarily want to go over there on vacation sometimes. I would say that's. It's dangerous. If it didn't have the pyramids and the other things, I don't know what the appeal would be. So if you want to spruce that place up and make it really inviting, how about create some exciting mystery around it? I think it would be massively impelling if they just went, oh, you know what? We think that it could have been.

[Pete]

Oh, here's this new technology, satellite tomography.

[Adam Thorne]

Right?

[Pete]

A new tool.

[Adam Thorne]

Come check it out. There's, like, 600ft of chambers underneath that we haven't looked at. Like, come explore it with us. Add it to their museum. Also, how are those granite pots cut that are perfect? And they're like, oh, yeah, they just chipped away at them. All right, dude, right?

[Pete]

It's more. They're more accurate than a potter's wheel. Like, you can't spin a pot more perfect than these objects.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah. I love it. When. When Rogan had that engineer on. I don't know if you remember this one yet, dude, it was so good. And he was just like, well, people basically would bring things to me, different types of technology, and it would just be like a pot or a. A thing. And they'd be like, reverse injured near this. Like, figure out how it was made. And it's very complicated to do. You could imagine that somebody would get very good at reverse engineering some things, you know, they could get good at. And it just accidentally led him into examining some of these. This ancient pottery, and he's like, the precision is unmatchable. Like, we could do it today, but we would need computers. We would need so many things, like the. The resources necessary to do it. And they're like, oh, yeah, they just collected water in this. Or kept beets in there.

[Pete]

They. They would put onion soup and beer in these perfect vessels.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, that is still perfect because when you cut it out of that stuff, it. No matter how it was stored for two plus thousand years, it doesn't even have a chip in it. You could throw it out of a. A plane probably, and it would just bounce.

[Pete]

Some of them are broken, and some of them. Their lips are cracked or their handles, but there's many that are intact.

[Adam Thorne]

But, dude, think about it. Any that are intact, any with that much time, it's like, yeah, what? This isn't like a wooden table. None of those made it, bro.

[Pete]

Everything in the old kingdom was made out of an alabaster, which is a very soft stone. It's like marble.

[Adam Thorne]

Right.

[Pete]

So I think that marble is very closely related to it. So you can cut that out with the key. You could just whittle that thing down. Yeah, the. The. On the one more thing about the diorite vessels, the. What the engineer was talking about was, yeah, we can make this, but we have to spin this blade this fast, and the progression rate is going to be evident and slower than. Than what we see on the diorite. So the diorite was cut with a slower circular saw, maybe, or lathe, and the progression was faster. So the. The evidence of the tool marks are bigger. What we can do is we can make very fine cuts spinning at a high rate of speed with a slow progression, where they had a slow rate of speed and a fast progression. It's. It just blew his mind, right? He's like, we can't do this.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah. And he didn't really have a, like a. An answer for it either. It was just like, okay, that's what it looks like. And I don't know. And the pyramids.

[Pete]

The pyramids. That's how he says.

[Adam Thorne]

Remember what he was like correcting Joe on how to say his name?

[Pete]

Zawas all right.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, he. He was pretty hostile. And Joe even said a few times, he was like, hey, you don't need to argue with people that aren't here. I'm giving you the biggest platform in the world for as long as you want. Come in and be persuasive. And he was like, will you. Will you introduce me in Houston? Joe's like, no. I mean, I would. He probably would if he had asked him a month earlier. I'm like, I don't know how popular you think you are, bro, but you need to slow your roll.

[Pete]

Huge ego. I used to watch those Unveiling the Pyramid Secrets live episodes on abc.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, they were fun.

[Pete]

They were fun, but it never got anywhere.

[Adam Thorne]

No.

[Pete]

I was like, okay, let's see.

[Adam Thorne]

No, it was like Bigfoot. It was like the Bigfoot show.

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[Adam Thorne]

Let's go.

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[Adam Thorne]

The numbers look good. Brad, you're on mute.

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[Adam Thorne]

Ghost hunter. Remember ghost hunters? They're like, oh, we saw an orb. I'm like, I think it was a moth.

[Pete]

That's a moth buster.

[Adam Thorne]

It's a moth dude. Yeah, they don't. If they actually found anything good, they're not showing us. That's what that guy was telling me. Like that's what I was hearing from him. If they found something real good, they're like, we ain't telling no one.

[Pete]

It's also probably sold to somebody in that. In the. The obviously less than honest Egyptology industry, its foundations are on grave robbing.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, it's a good point.

[Pete]

The only iron they found was in. Well, one of the only iron pieces they found was in King Tut's tomb and it was a meteorite dagger that they melted down and made into a. Into a dagger. Other than that, copper, brass, gold, silver, electrum, no other metals. You can't cut diorite with that stuff.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, what can you cut that with? Either the same thing or diamonds.

[Pete]

You have to have like tungsten carbide. You have to have a diamond tip. You had. It's it's like a 9 or an 8 on the Mohs hardness scale, which is just. It's like a sapphire. Maybe a little less than a sapphire. Maybe it's like a seven.

[Adam Thorne]

Okay.

[Pete]

It's incredibly hard.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah.

[Pete]

Unscratchable. Nearly. With. With your hand. With a piece of copper, you can't scratch it.

[Adam Thorne]

No shit. We could, like, throw those pots around all day. Nothing.

[Pete]

There's a. There's another guy that. With the ponytail that I think. Is he a Kiwi that comes on Rogan or an Aussie that talks about these pots quite a bit? I forget his name. Sorry, sorry, everybody. He's got a ponytail. He's like a thicker guy. Well, he's a. One of the diorite experts.

[Adam Thorne]

Oh, no.

[Pete]

I'd have to look that up. Maybe we can find that and put it in there. I'll look it up.

[Adam Thorne]

We'll put. We'll put it in the bio. Put in the bio link. But, yeah, listen, I'm gonna put. I'm gonna put like four or five of my favorite YouTube videos in the bio. If you've listened and you're just like, all right, well, but he's also the expert. I'm like, yeah, I get it. But also check these out and look at these questions and just see. See if something doesn't sit right with you. And it just seemed like he wanted to make. He's like, come. Come to Egypt right now and. And I'll show you how these things are made. You know, I wish Rogan would, honestly, even though he probably feels like it's a waste of his time, but, like, go there and see if they can chop out a 2 ton block and how long it would take and how perfect it is. Like, go take, you know, a tape measure and the perfect measurement machine and just see how accurate it is. It's like, hey, if they. If they can do it with primitive tools and do it quickly, maybe I'm back on board. I'm not saying that I'm not, but it's made me raise more questions, dude. It's made me more suspicious than anything I've ever heard. And I don't think that was Rogan's plan. I think that he wanted to, like, just kind of find peace for himself. Like, oh, maybe it was like this.

[Pete]

I mean, he's the foremost Egyptologist. It's. He. That's a big deal. Yeah, I think it's a big deal, but it's.

[Adam Thorne]

No, it is for sure.

[Pete]

Yeah. He did. Yeah, he didn't. He did not. Win us over. And he's pushed us. Push us away. It's another. It's like, what are you hiding then? Or why are you afraid of the truth? Why don't we look at not the truth? Why are you afraid of potential new evidence? He didn't have anything to say about the. He didn't talk to the Italian team that did the tomography. He's not very. He's not very. He's. He listened to another guy who says. Says he's, like, just kind of dismissing all that new potential evidence.

[Adam Thorne]

Well, if you. If you watch the episode back, and I've watched it twice, he keeps saying he's not a scientist, even though he has the PhD or whatever. And then every now and again, he'd be like, I'm a scientist, Joe. Show me the. Like that. That is not a language barrier thing, Pete. That is just nonsense. That is basically Joe being like, I'm not the authority here. I'm just a comedian. And then giving himself an out, which is fun. I love that. I respect it. I think podcasts can do it, because that's the only way to safely explore something that is pushing the limits. But if you're the authority, if you're the top guy in Egypt, don't jump back between, I'm not a scientist. I am one. I am. I'm not. I'm not. Because at no point does Joe go, I am the authority on this. Unless you're talking about the ufc.

[Pete]

He stays in his lane. I don't understand why people get on Joe's case for just being a podcaster and he's just talking to people.

[Adam Thorne]

He got too popular, dude. That's what it is. You get that popular, and people are mad that their fucking nerds they listen to aren't as popular. You know, I can't tell you how many times I've had conversations with people that love cnn, and they just say, well, he's not a real journalist. I'm like, no, I don't think he thinks he is either. Well, you know, Don Lemon is. And I'm like, yeah, but he's also a clown. And he says, really? Just dumb shit. So actually, your dumb shit is dumber when you say you're a real journalist than if a comedian is saying some things and it happens to sound a bit dumb.

[Pete]

Whatever he says ends in a question mark. He's not saying declaring much. He's saying, well, what about how did they raise this block? That's 18 tons, 45ft in the air? And, you know, oh, it was a mud construction and they brought it 500 miles away on a boat made out of reeds to here in flood times. Yeah, it's. He's just asking questions. And Hawass was being a bit of a cunt.

[Adam Thorne]

I love it. I have to agree. I mean, it's. It's harsh to say, you know, but it just kind of is. It's how I felt about it. And it was, it was kind of a bummer because I, I really wanted an opportunity for them to just like, you know, for him to just be a bit more open. And it was completely closed off. And I don't know what the motivation for that is, but either way, it's worth listening to, especially because Rogan said this might be the worst part he's ever done. And listen, when I say that, it doesn't mean it's not worth listening to. It just means that it was the most annoying fucking thing that he's ever had to sit through. And he's a patient dude for sure.

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[Adam Thorne]

Let's go.

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[Adam Thorne]

Brad, you're on mute.

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[Adam Thorne]

Fiverr.Com 3 hours 5 times a week with a bunch of different people. And you know, people have annoyed him here and there. Candace Owens got on his nerves about climate change. He's had. Who was that dork that he brought on that was like, couldn't make his mind up about Gender and was trying to defend it. I forget.

[Pete]

I forgot the name of that guy.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, but you know, I'm talking about.

[Pete]

I do know what I'm talking. Yeah, you're talking about. Anyway, also the. Remember, is his name Scribble or Dibble?

[Adam Thorne]

Oh, Flint. Yeah, Flint Dibble. I mean, this guy has been described as the Egyptian version of Flint Devil. Like, just a gatekeeper to archeology. And, you know, I think. And this is what they were worried about, this is why the archeologists are so defensive, is because they don't want to lose their grip on people believing that they are the most knowledgeable. But I think that the motivation behind it is the fact that they know that they don't really have the answers for things. So they held onto it so tight that they basically became snake oil salesmen. In a way, it's like, I just want the prestige, but I don't really know how anything works. And they are losing confidence. Yeah.

[Pete]

Damaged the whole conversation.

[Adam Thorne]

Yeah, yeah. It's like politicians that won't apologize. We do not trust you more, you dorks. Don't do it. Because people aren't stupid, dude. You know, people are not. And we know when we're being fed bullshit. And it just sounds a lot like. It sounds like there's some bullshit going on.

[Pete]

Absolutely.

[Adam Thorne]

Well, I say it's worth watching. Pete obviously got riled up.

[Pete]

I love that everybody, my goodness.

[Adam Thorne]

And you know, I had kind of similar feelings. And if you look online, they, like, go to the bio of this. There's a bunch of videos I'm going to post right now from YouTubers that just kind of broke this down. And they're short. They're like ten minutes. Um, and it. It just kind of gives you an idea of like, I don't think anyone was sold on this. Nobody moved, like, went away from this podcast being like, you know what? He had some really good points, and that was probably true. And now I'm sold on this whole process. It is maybe the best example I've ever seen of how not to sell your idea to millions of people. Final thoughts.

[Pete]

Pete, it's worth listening to because you'll never hear somebody talk for two and a half hours and say less. He said he didn't have much in the way of answers for Joe.

[Adam Thorne]

I agree. I agree. Go check it out. Look at the shit in the bio. It's going to be good. And Pete, as always, thank you. And everybody else, I hope you enjoyed it. We'll talk to you next time.

[Pete]

Adios.

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[Adam Thorne]

Let's go.

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And young Mason Moore got more done quickly uploading HD product demos and video conferencing without FreeSync.

[Adam Thorne]

The numbers look good. Brad. You're on mute.

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