Richard Kind

Summary

Joy Podcast Episode Summary: Richard Kind with Savannah Guthrie

Podcast Information:

• Title: Joy, a Podcast
• Host: Craig Ferguson
• Guest: Richard Kind
• Release Date: November 26, 2024
• Description: Craig Ferguson explores the modern state of joy by engaging with notable figures from various fields. In this episode, he sits down with actor Richard Kind and guest Savannah Guthrie to delve into their personal experiences, acting careers, and the pursuit of happiness amid a seemingly collapsing world.

---

1. Personal Connections and Early Encounters

Timestamp: 03:25 - 06:15

Craig Ferguson introduces Richard Kind, highlighting Kind's significant role not only in entertainment but also in his personal life. Richard shares a heartfelt story about attending Savannah Guthrie's Broadway show, which led to a life-changing encounter.

• Richard Kind: "My guest on the Joy podcast today is a gentleman who holds a very special place in my heart... I came to see you in that show, and very briefly afterwards, I came back and... met a woman that very night who I'm still married to." (04:14)

Savannah Guthrie expresses joy over Richard's story, emphasizing the memorable impact the show had on him.

---

2. Navigating Fame and Recognition

Timestamp: 07:18 - 10:51

Richard Kind and Savannah Guthrie discuss the nature of fame, particularly for character actors. They explore how the digital age has transformed recognition, allowing previously lesser-known actors to gain renewed attention through platforms like YouTube.

• Richard Kind: "I stopped doing my Late Night Show 10 years ago, and I still get people coming to live shows who clearly weren't old enough to watch me when I was doing the show." (09:21)

Savannah Guthrie reflects on her evolving recognition, noting that while she was always a consistent worker, modern platforms have amplified her presence.

• Savannah Guthrie: "I'm always working. I'm not always making a lot of money and not a lot of people are seeing me. And I'm not famous." (48:38)

---

3. The Craft of Acting and Audience Connection

Timestamp: 12:39 - 24:03

The conversation delves into the intricacies of acting, the relationship between actors and directors, and the importance of audience feedback. Savannah shares her desire for genuine connection with her audience, contrasting it with the often detached nature of single-camera productions.

• Savannah Guthrie: "I have to hear. I want a symbiotic relationship with the audience." (15:34)

They discuss the challenges of maintaining performance quality, especially when technical issues disrupt a scene.

• Richard Kind: "Like, if you have a very good take and someone says, 'There's a bad noise,' then let's do it again." (24:03)

---

4. The Impact of Child Acting in Hollywood

Timestamp: 31:40 - 51:43

Richard Kind and Savannah Guthrie address the complexities surrounding child actors. They critique the industry's approach to treating child actors differently, often leading to unhealthy dynamics and fame at a young age.

• Savannah Guthrie: "Children should not be actors... They feel that they are elevated in the world. That develops into a jerk." (31:54)

Richard Kind agrees, highlighting his discomfort with the motivations behind allowing children to pursue acting purely based on desire.

• Richard Kind: "They always say they want to do it. And I'm like, that's not a reason to let a kid do a thing." (49:18)

---

5. Personal Journeys and Professional Growth

Timestamp: 39:36 - 58:17

The guests share their personal paths to success, emphasizing perseverance, continuous learning, and the non-linear nature of careers in entertainment. Savannah narrates her transition from business aspirations to a thriving acting career through dedication and training at Second City.

• Savannah Guthrie: "I was making a living in Chicago. I was famous. I was successful. What a blessing." (43:04)

Richard Kind reflects on his own journey from struggling with alcoholism to achieving success on "The Drew Carey Show," underscoring the unpredictability of life paths.

• Richard Kind: "Between 29 and 32, I went from falling down drunk in the street to a regular cast member on the Drew Carey show." (45:13)

---

6. Reflections on Performance and Feedback

Timestamp: 52:26 - 58:17

Discussion shifts to the nature of performance, handling feedback, and personal validation. Savannah recounts an experience with Woody Allen, illustrating the fine balance between confidence and seeking affirmation.

• Savannah Guthrie: "I cringe to this day for having made that choice." (55:53)

Richard Kind shares his approach to handling audience reactions, balancing self-assurance with humility.

• Richard Kind: "If the show sucks tonight, it's not me." (21:14)

---

7. Closing Remarks and Personal Affirmations

Timestamp: 58:17 - End

The episode concludes with mutual appreciation. Richard thanks Savannah for introducing him to his wife, while Savannah lauds Richard's kindness and comedic talent.

• Savannah Guthrie: "I think the world of your comedy. I thought you were great." (58:56)
• Richard Kind: "You are great. You are wonderful." (58:53)

They express gratitude for each other's presence, reinforcing the theme of joy through meaningful connections.

---

Notable Quotes:

1. Richard Kind (04:14):
   "I came to see you in that show, and very briefly afterwards, I came back and... met a woman that very night who I'm still married to."

2. Savannah Guthrie (15:34):
   "I have to hear. I want a symbiotic relationship with the audience."

3. Savannah Guthrie (31:54):
   "Children should not be actors... They feel that they are elevated in the world. That develops into a jerk."

4. Richard Kind (45:13):
   "Between 29 and 32, I went from falling down drunk in the street to a regular cast member on the Drew Carey show."

5. Savannah Guthrie (55:53):
   "I cringe to this day for having made that choice."

6. Richard Kind (21:14):
   "If the show sucks tonight, it's not me."

7. Mutual Appreciation (58:17):
   Savannah Guthrie: "I think the world of your comedy. I thought you were great."
   Richard Kind: "You are great. You are wonderful."

---

Conclusions and Insights:

• The Pursuit of Joy: Both guests underscore the importance of finding joy through genuine connections, personal growth, and meaningful work rather than fame or external validation.

• Challenges of Fame: The conversation highlights the transient nature of recognition in the entertainment industry and the impact of digital platforms on an actor's career lifespan.

• Child Acting Concerns: There's a critical view of the industry's treatment of child actors, emphasizing the need for healthier career pathways and upbringing.

• Personal Accountability: Both Richard and Savannah acknowledge their responsibilities in maintaining humility and seeking internal fulfillment over external praise.

---

This episode of "Joy" provides an intimate look into the lives of Richard Kind and Savannah Guthrie, exploring the nuanced relationship between fame, personal happiness, and the craft of acting. Their candid discussions offer valuable insights for listeners seeking joy and fulfillment in their own lives.

Transcript

[Craig Ferguson]

All right, we're all set for the party. I've trimmed the tree, hung the mistletoe, and paired all those weird shaped knives and forks with the appropriate cheeses. And I plugged in the Partisan Partisan. It's a home cocktail maker that makes over 60 premium cocktails, plus a whole lot of seasonal favorites too. I just got it for 50 off. So how about a Cosmopolitan or a Mistletoe Margarita?

[Richard Kind]

I'm thirsty. Watch.

[Craig Ferguson]

I just pop in a capsule, choose my strength and wow.

[Richard Kind]

Beginning to feel more seasonal in here already.

[Craig Ferguson]

If your holiday party doesn't have a bartender, then you become the bartender. Unless you've got a Bartesian because Bartesian crafts every cocktail perfectly in as little as 30 seconds. And I just got it for $50 off.

[Richard Kind]

Tis the season to be jollier.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Add some holiday flavor to every celebration with the sleek, sophisticated home cocktail maker Bartesian. Pick up your phone and shake it to get $50 off any cocktail maker. Yes, you heard me. Shake your phone and get $50 off. Don't delay.

[Richard Kind]

It's better over here.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Now. AT T Mobile get four 5G phones on us and four lines for $25 a line per month when you switch with eligible trade ins. All on America's largest 5G network. Minimum of 4 lines for $25 per line per month with auto pay discount using debit or bank account. $5 more per line without auto pay plus taxes and fees and $10 device connection charge phones via 24 monthly bill credits for well qualified customers. Contact us before canceling entire account to continue bill credits or credit stop and B required finance agreement due bill credits end if you pay off devices early. CT mobile.com hi everyone, it's Savannah Guthrie and Hoda caught me from the Today show. Nobody does the holidays like today. From festive performances and great gift ideas to tips for the perfect holiday feast, join us every morning on NBC and make today your home for the holidays.

[Richard Kind]

The Craig Ferguson Pants on Fire Tour is on sale now. It's a new show, it's new material, but I'm afraid it's still only me, Craig Ferguson on my own, standing on a stage telling comedy words. Come and see me. Buy tickets, bring your loved ones or don't come and see me. Don't buy tickets and don't bring your loved ones. I'm not your dad. You come or don't come, but you should at least know it's happening. And it is. The tour kicks off late September and goes through the end of the year and beyond. Tickets are available at the craigfergusonshow.com tour. They're available at the craigfergusonsHow.com tour or at your local outlet in your region. My name is Craig Ferguson. The name of this podcast is Joy. I talk to interesting people about what brings them happiness. My guest on the Joy podcast today is a gentleman who holds a very special place in my heart. Not only is he a fabulous actor that's been in all the good things, but he also has a very significant small part in my own personal story. And you're about to find out what that is, along with a great many other things about the fabulously interesting, very original, lovely, super talented, famous actor, Richard Kind. I'm in New England. Are you in New York?

[Savannah Guthrie]

I am. Where in New England are you?

[Richard Kind]

Well, I'm not going to tell you. I'll tell you after.

[Savannah Guthrie]

All right.

[Richard Kind]

Okay. Yeah, because now we're on the. Yeah, I'm in New England.

[Savannah Guthrie]

That's very lovely.

[Richard Kind]

Yeah, no, it's very nice. But of course, I live in New York now, too.

[Savannah Guthrie]

No, I didn't know that.

[Richard Kind]

I'm. I'm moving back to the city. I'm moving back to the Upper east side.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Okay.

[Richard Kind]

Because you're in the Upper west side.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Upper west side. Yeah.

[Richard Kind]

I think of you as the quintessential New Yorker, which I know that you weren't born.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I wasn't born here. I lived years and years in la. Yeah. I'm an upper. Whenever I lived in New York, I lived Upper west side. I lived downtown for a while during Spin City. But, yeah, Upper west side is the best. It's where I raised my kids well.

[Richard Kind]

And also, I think of you as being the quintessential New Yorker for a very specific moment in time.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Go ahead.

[Richard Kind]

So do you remember when you were doing the Producers on Broadway?

[Savannah Guthrie]

Sure.

[Richard Kind]

Right. And I came to see you in.

[Savannah Guthrie]

That show at Broadway.

[Richard Kind]

Yeah, I came to see that show, and I came to see you in that show. And very briefly afterwards, I came back and I said, hi. You probably don't remember that because there was a lot of stuff going on. Well, funnily enough, I came back, I said hi after the show, and you were great in the show.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Great.

[Richard Kind]

And I came back to tell you that. And then after that, I went uptown because I had to do a thing, and I went to this event uptown called New Yorkers for Children, where I met a woman that very night who I'm still married to.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Oh, is that fantastic?

[Richard Kind]

Isn't that a story that.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Isn't that great?

[Richard Kind]

I know.

[Savannah Guthrie]

That is great. But seriously, how was I?

[Richard Kind]

You were great.

[Savannah Guthrie]

You were great. It was the high point of the evening, so you might have been in a good mood.

[Richard Kind]

I think I was. I think you cheered me up. I think it was. It was a very funny. It is a very funny show.

[Savannah Guthrie]

So wonderful. Was it your first time seeing the show?

[Richard Kind]

It was the first time seeing it live. I'd seen, obviously, the movie, but I had never seen the musical.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Okay. Yeah, Great. Oh, that's a wonderful story, isn't it? Good. I'm so happy for you. Oh, great.

[Richard Kind]

So in our family, every year on Christmas Eve, we have a photograph of you on our Christmas tree. And all the. And the children sing. Thank you.

[Savannah Guthrie]

That Guess it.

[Richard Kind]

Richard Kind.

[Savannah Guthrie]

This is a joke. This is a joke. Okay, good. Thank God. Thank God. But.

[Richard Kind]

No, but famous. You. I mean, you're famous anyway. You're the famous actor Richard Kind.

[Savannah Guthrie]

But okay, okay.

[Richard Kind]

But you're very, very, very famous in our family because the night I went to see Richard Kind of the Producers, I met the mother.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I embraced that reality. That is fantastic.

[Richard Kind]

Well, it's a very special place in my heart. But I think of you as being a Broadway guy, but I suppose you're not really a Broadway guy, really. I mean.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Well, you are.

[Richard Kind]

You're a Broadway guy, you're an actor. You do all of those things. Right.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I gotta tell you, I was 45 years old when I made my Broadway debut. But I've been going to Broadway plays since I was seven. I go, I see everything, and I do plays all the time. I do a play a year, easily a play a year. But it was very late because I kept wanting to be an actor. And I never thought, well, I was at Second City. I just thought I had to go, I had to do it. I had to make my mark. I had to do tv, I had to movies. And I always thought that Broadway would take me away from it, even though I loved doing Broadway. But Broadway meant a year of being in that particular show, which I did not wanna do. I don't like Broadway long runs.

[Richard Kind]

Broadway is its own ecosystem as well. Like, there are people who exist only in Broadway who are like massive stars in Broadway. And then you get to, you know, halfway along Pennsylvania and people don't know who they are. I mean, it's.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Right. Exactly. I. You know, I'm trying to say people think, oh, you're really having a moment now, and everything like that. No, I'm not. I have been working as much now as I have in my whole career. It's just the platforms are larger and are getting attention and they're with bigger stars. But I've been doing this just like this for a long, long time. It's just that now people are seeing it more.

[Richard Kind]

Well, it's funny, I feel. I feel like maybe I have a different perception of you. I think of you as being a big star since the 1990s. Since been. Since.

[Savannah Guthrie]

You're wrong.

[Richard Kind]

No, I'm not wrong.

[Savannah Guthrie]

You are wrong. I'm a go to character actor, along with about 15 or 20 others who beat me out for parts regularly. People who I admire. I'm somebody who, if you see me, if the normal guy sees me, they know my face. They can't place it. They certainly don't know my name. But more and more lately, they're knowing my name. But it was always, I used to joke they would see me. They go, but did I go to high school with you? Am I related to you? Do you owe me money? It's one of those things. They can't place it. Now they are more or less able to place it. And I'll tell you this. Well, you might even know this. Once you're off TV a year later, they don't know you.

[Richard Kind]

No, that's true. Well, that.

[Savannah Guthrie]

They do not know you.

[Richard Kind]

That used to be true until YouTube and the Internet created a whole new, like, repeat structure for old shows. Like, I stopped doing my Late Night Show 10 years ago.

[Savannah Guthrie]

10 years ago.

[Richard Kind]

I stopped 10 years ago. And I still get people coming to live shows who clearly never weren't old enough to watch me when I was doing the show, who say, I watch you on YouTube. Like, I'm someone who does a YouTube channel.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Yeah, I. Okay, you do have them. What you had, like, when I was on Spin City.

[Richard Kind]

Yeah.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Millions of people watch you.

[Richard Kind]

That's true. Yeah.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Now thousands watch you on YouTube. We used to have millions.

[Richard Kind]

Okay, the glory thing, because I was doing the Drew Carey show at the same time you were doing Spin.

[Savannah Guthrie]

True, that's true. Well, okay, Drew Carey was huge. That was huge for you. But no, here's what I'm saying is, after I did, let's say Spin City, I really would get people going, aren't you acting anymore? Yeah, it was. It's silly. You literally, they go, I go, I am. You're just not watching the channels I'm on and when. And I still get it. And I just go, am I not acting? I'm on everything all the time. I'm on everything now.

[Richard Kind]

Everything you're on. All the good things. All the murders in the building.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Great. You're always on the good Mulaney, that John Mulaney all. And everybody's in la. I'm all over the place. And somebody will really ask me nowadays, aren't you acting anymore? And I'm mystified, well, who is this asshole?

[Richard Kind]

That gotta be many of those people.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I got his name, I took his name and I found out. And he and I are having lunch and I'm gonna go through. And we're gonna go through my IMDb page.

[Richard Kind]

It's a funny thing because people sometimes will get annoyed. I've noticed this. If they say to you, hey, where do I know you from? And you're like, I don't wanna. I don't know.

[Savannah Guthrie]

That's the worst, you know. But I now have a thing. I say, you know, I go, what do you do for a living? He goes, I'm a dentist. What was the name of the last person you gave a crown to? That's what I give. That's what I say. Or I'll just say, they me right now. They go, where do I know you're from? And I go, everything. Just look at my IMDb page, you'll.

[Richard Kind]

Realize, well, you are kind of in everything. I mean, now I'm in everything. When you turned up in Only Murders in the Building, I thought, oh, really? Really? That. I mean, how long did that take? Two seasons.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Well, here's the thing, is that, you know, people ask, why aren't you on Murders in the Building? I go, because they haven't asked me. All they gotta do is ask me. So after three seasons, they asked me. Here I am.

[Richard Kind]

Yeah.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Yeah.

[Richard Kind]

So it's a funny thing though, isn't it? Because I think fame, and it's particularly proper actors like you who are like real actors who do it. It's a thing. And it's a craft and a job and an art that you really care about, and fame almost seems like a. Like a byproduct. Like it's not. I don't think of you as someone who. Look, maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think of you as someone who. Who courted being famous. It's more about being famous as a byproduct of what you do. And. And they don't know you. They know who you play because who you play. The cat. You play a very varied bunch of people.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Yeah, I like to say that. I do. When I was a kid and I lay in bed dreaming of fame, and I did. I dreamt of being an actor. I dreamt of being famous when I got angry at my parents and thought about running away. My note to my parents, my I'll show you note was, I'm on the movie screen and I'm talking to them going, I'll show you. You didn't let me go out and be with my friends tonight and I'll show you. And you wanted to run away. This was my. What do you say? What's the kind of note you write.

[Richard Kind]

When you run away note?

[Savannah Guthrie]

My runaway note. My runaway note was your runaway note. And so I did want to be a star when I was younger. And then I started acting, started having a career, and I realized I want to be a good actor. And I'll tell you this too, as you probably know, because, you know a lot of people who have achieved great fame, fame is a prison. Anybody who goes after fame is a fool.

[Richard Kind]

They're a fool.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Absolutely. How do you. How do you convince a young person that fame should not be your goal? Not only that, stay far away from it. You know why?

[Richard Kind]

If I could redo it, if I could relive my life, I would try and find a profession that had zero visibility, that had.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Oh, what? No. Oh, Craig, please. No, I like. No, no. Or a dry cleaner or a hitman that I have to stay out of everybody's way. Yes. No, no, no. Look, I do like people coming up to me and saying they like me with my ex wife. We would be walking down the street and we'd be arguing and somebody would go, oh, I love you. And I go, honey, please. You see, so it's. I do like people coming up and saying. And giving me affirmation. It does make me happy. She used to say, how can you have a bad day? People come up to you like that. What are you out of your mind? But I do happen to like affirmation. I love applause. It's one reason why I like theater. I like, you know, while you're on stage, forget the applause. You can hear them listening. You can hear them understanding what you're saying and connecting. And it's not with sound. You just feel it. That's a wonderful feeling. When I do single camera, I can't feel anything. They yell cut. And I go, was that any good? I don't know. I want to hear. I want a symbiotic relationship with the audience. You do it with your stand up. You certainly did it on your talk show.

[Richard Kind]

Yeah, but I wonder if that. Is that something that you're lacking in? Not you. Is that something that One is lacking in personal relationships that you're looking for an affirmation that a single person can give you.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I can't give you. Absolutely. There are other ways of finding satisfaction in the world and people who, as you just said, if I could sun the public life and find satisfaction, that's the whole thing. But I don't, I don't. My, my makeup is. I, I like this affirmation. It makes me happy. Applause. All that stuff makes me happy. As I get older. Okay, I can leave it all behind, but I still like it. I still, I don't. The, the amount that. That bottomless hole of affirmation, it has been filled up a lot. I'm okay.

[Richard Kind]

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[Craig Ferguson]

All right, we're all set for the party. I've trimmed the tree, hung the mistletoe, and paired all those weird shaped knives and forks with the appropriate cheeses. And I plugged in the Partisan Partisan. It's a home cocktail maker that makes over 60 premium cocktails, plus a whole lot of seasonal favorites, too. I just got it for 50 off, so how about a Cosmopolitan or a mistletoe margarita?

[Richard Kind]

I'm thirsty.

[Craig Ferguson]

Watch. I just pop in a capsule. Choose my strength and wow, it's beginning.

[Richard Kind]

To feel more seasonal in here already.

[Craig Ferguson]

If your holiday party doesn't have a bartender, then you become the bartender. Unless you've got a Bartesian, because Bartesian crafts every cocktail perfectly in as little as 30 seconds. And I just got it for $50 off.

[Richard Kind]

Tis the season to be jollier.

[Savannah Guthrie]

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[Richard Kind]

I think that's quite interesting because also the idea of. I've talked to quite a few people, very successful people like you, about ambition and what it looks like when you're young. The ambition that I felt when I was young and I've heard a lot of people say had a sort of. And even the runaway note story, it had a kind of anger, a kind of, A kind of fuck you about it.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Well, that's what those, it's famously the comedians will say. I killed them, I slayed them, I had them in the aisle. That's like, I need you, but I hate you. And I. Because I hate needing you. Yeah, I need them. I do.

[Richard Kind]

You still need them as much as you did, do you think?

[Savannah Guthrie]

No, no, no. But when I act, I do. I don't need them off stage as much, but when I'm acting, yeah, I need somebody to say, that's great. I always say I have an enormous ego and no confidence.

[Richard Kind]

Yeah.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I need to be told you're doing good. I also have a friend who did say, and I do believe this, I may not always be great, but I don't think I can suck anymore. Yeah, you know, I think I got it. I think I got it. I may not be great and I yearn for great. I really do. I really do. And not for the fame or the money or anything. I really want to do a good job.

[Richard Kind]

Sure. I feel the same way. I now begin each standup show by telling the audience how long I've been doing it, a number of awards and a rough idea of how much money I've made. And that's. So if the show sucks tonight, it's not me.

[Savannah Guthrie]

It's funny.

[Richard Kind]

It's just not.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Oh, that's funny. Well, that's hilarious. I would never say that, but so. So in other words, I've got it all. I've had my affirmation. This is on you. It's on you.

[Richard Kind]

This is on you. This is. Let's see how you do. You paid your money. I'm going to do my very best for you. But if you don't like it, that's because you don't like it.

[Savannah Guthrie]

It's nothing to do with me.

[Richard Kind]

I'll do it.

[Savannah Guthrie]

That's hilarious. I think that's great. That's fantastic. Did you.

[Richard Kind]

And I mean it, too, actually, not in a. I mean, it sounds very arrogant.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I don't. I do not feel that way. There are nights that you're better than other nights.

[Richard Kind]

Yeah.

[Savannah Guthrie]

You're just better.

[Richard Kind]

But you're not always in charge of how. The perception of that. Because I've done this probably the night I came to see you in Producers, you know that you say to an actor backstage or you've been on stage yourself and you tell them how great they were and they'll say, oh, no, you should have been here last night. Last night was much better. And you got to stop doing that.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Oh, you do. You do. Well, I'll tell you why you have to stop doing that is because then that person feels he's been cheated, and so it makes that person feel worse. And it may not be true about me. And the degree that you were better or worse is minuscule, Utterly minuscule. I could ask for another take, a second take, and you put them side by side. You can't tell the difference. You can't. A good director can, or sometimes you can, but most takes, they got it. You do have. Or let me put it this way, it's sufficient. Another take may be perfect and better. The other one was sufficient.

[Richard Kind]

But also, especially if you're talking about a take, if a director's looking at and going, that book behind Richard there. I don't like that book there. Let's take a look.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Yeah, but I have no control of that. I have no control of that. I'm talking about whether or not I hooked in with what is needed emotionally, what I had in my eyes, you know, stuff. Stuff like that that nobody's interested in.

[Richard Kind]

What doesn't. That isn't that frustrating as an actor. If you do a very good take and you have lovely. All the things you want in your eyes and stuff. And then someone says, that was great, but we heard a guy sneeze, so let's do it again.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Kills me. That kills me. Because that moment in a bottle, you know, to capture that, that's precious. And you got it because there was a hair in the. Len. You know, in the lens or whatever it is.

[Richard Kind]

Yeah.

[Savannah Guthrie]

You go, ah. Why?

[Richard Kind]

I don't think that happens anymore. I don't think you get a hair in the lens anymore.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I do know that Brando used to give his cinematographers a bottle of champagne on the first day of the shooting. And he would go up to him and say, if it's not good, look at me. Or if I think it's not good, look at me. And the cameraman will take the blame for. We gotta do another.

[Richard Kind]

That's kind of clever and manipulative.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I thought that was very smart. You know, the actor wants another. Yeah.

[Richard Kind]

I remember watching a couple of very clever women actors. I've got actresses that I worked with over the years who, on the first day of shooting would go to the dp. It was usually a man, and they would flirt with the DP immediately. They would establish a relationship with the dp. And I was like, what the hell? And I figured that the relationship, over time, it was a very kind of, I have to look good and you have to make me look good thing. It was very interesting. There's more. The politics of a set are far more complex than I think people understand, especially for things like the sound man makes, says, there's a bad noise and, you know, we can't get around it, or the airplane or the guy sneezes. Do you remember that time Christian Bale got into trouble because there was a. He was doing a. I think it was a bad movie.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Maybe. I think so. I do remember.

[Richard Kind]

And he yelled at someone for screwing up a take. And I remember because I was doing Late Night at the time, and I remember sticking up for him. You ask a guy. You ask a guy to go to the edge of what he can do, to take himself to the edge of psychosis and let it be recorded. And then you get upset with him. If he's upset while he's doing that, it seems like A real double standard.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I am with you now. That. Now he got angry. Look, I'm all for getting angry, too. And I'm going to tell you something else. The guys who went to work for Scott Rudin and Scott Rudin was horrible to them and blah, blah, blah.

[Richard Kind]

Yeah.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I go, then don't work for him. This is how he operates. What? You're walking into a blind alley. No, it's like saying, I heard the grenades go off, I saw the bombs, I saw the soldiers running. I said, you know what? I'm going to go to the other side of the street. Don't work for him. Yeah, he works a certain way.

[Richard Kind]

There's been quite a lot of that recently. I feel like the pendulum swinging the other way with that.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Don't worry. We got a president who'll take care of it. Don't you worry. Don't you start with me. That woke shit. Oh, please. It's all going to be taken care of.

[Richard Kind]

Ye. Yes, it is. Yes, it is. What about the. What about the origins of it for you? You don't come from a showbiz family, do you?

[Savannah Guthrie]

No, not at all. I think that the origins. Hold on. I got to sneeze.

[Richard Kind]

Hold on.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I didn't see the third one.

[Richard Kind]

One's a w. Oh, so one's a wish, two's a kiss, three's a disappointment. That's the rules of sneezing.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Oh, no. Well. Oh, God. Well, no wonder my life is a disappointment. I sneeze three times.

[Richard Kind]

You always sneeze three times?

[Savannah Guthrie]

Always. Always sneeze three times.

[Richard Kind]

Really? That doesn't seem possible. You can't always sneeze three times, Craig.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I'm special. This is what sets me apart.

[Richard Kind]

Do you have, like, specialities at the bottom of your resume?

[Savannah Guthrie]

Absolutely, you know. Oh, it's fine. Well, at the bottom of my resume, I always say my specialties, my biggest talent. Friends with George Clooney. That's my biggest talent. That's my biggest talent.

[Richard Kind]

Are you still friends with George Clooney?

[Savannah Guthrie]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. But I don't like to talk about him. He gets enough. No, no, no, no.

[Richard Kind]

I don't mean that. Do anything, but.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Yeah, I remember. Of course I am.

[Richard Kind]

What I remember about Clooney is. I'll talk about him for a minute. Because when Clooney was doing Error, I was doing the Drew Carey show, Right. And the way the trailers were set up at Warner Brothers.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Yeah, He.

[Richard Kind]

George would play basketball every day.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Every day.

[Richard Kind]

And he would go over and play basketball. We come back and all The. The women would hang out the trailers and watch him go play basketball.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Oh, that's funny.

[Richard Kind]

But he was. And that's when his star was really beginning to, you know. TV doctor. And he was great. And he was always great. And he was. Oh, and I.

[Savannah Guthrie]

No, no, no, no, no. He was not always great.

[Richard Kind]

He was always great to us.

[Savannah Guthrie]

He was always great person. He was always great. He's always great.

[Richard Kind]

Oh.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Since I knew him. He was a great man. A great, thoughtful, moral man. Yeah. Yeah.

[Richard Kind]

And that's what I mean. That's why I don't judge anybody on their act. And I'm no judge of that.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I don't know that if you judge George Clooney on his. I'm the man, you'll find. No, better not.

[Richard Kind]

Yeah, no, that's what I. That's what I always thought. He seems like a really decent. And I've never heard a bad story about him either, which in Hollywood is kind of like him and Henry Winkler. I think that's it.

[Savannah Guthrie]

You're right. And Richard kind. Have you heard a bad story about me?

[Richard Kind]

No, I. Actually, I haven't heard a bad story.

[Savannah Guthrie]

About, I don't know, bad stories about me. No, I can think. I feel bad about things, but I don't think people have bad stories about me.

[Richard Kind]

I can't imagine that they do.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I pride myself on it. But I feel guilty when I do do something wrong. When inside I know I've yelled at somebody or I'm nasty, but they don't know it. But I feel bad. I do.

[Richard Kind]

Well, I think that you're allowed to be human. When I was doing the late night show, what I noticed is because I met everybody. Everybody, like everybody comes through.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Yeah.

[Richard Kind]

And the mensch to douchebag ratio was exactly the same as any other walk in life.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I think that's true.

[Richard Kind]

You know, it's just that some people were great. Some people were assholes.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Well, actually, I disagree with that.

[Richard Kind]

What?

[Savannah Guthrie]

One of the reasons why I think children should not be actors, right. Is because you are treated differently by other people. An accountant does a good job, you thank him. You know, you have every. Every profession, you thank them. Thank you for doing a good job. Oh, my gosh, you went out of your way. You're fabulous. As a doctor, I owe you my life, blah, blah, blah. But an actor gets blind adoration. Adoration and a child who goes to set. They. All the adults on set open doors for a kid. Can I get you any water? They kowtow to a child. They'll open the Door. When a child should be opening a door for an adult.

[Richard Kind]

Agreed.

[Savannah Guthrie]

And children should be beaten up at school or should be kept in their place by their friends. And on set, it's the opposite.

[Richard Kind]

That is true.

[Savannah Guthrie]

And they feel that they are elevated in the world. I know this because I would come home and my kids would go, daddy, can you get me some water? And I'm going, no, you get me water. But they don't. I get my kids water.

[Richard Kind]

You know, it's funny, it's funny. I remember that when I was doing late night, my kids were very young. Like, at the very beginning, I was still changing diapers. So I would. I'd be talking to these fabulously glamorous people, and then really, within three or four minutes, I'd be in my office changing a diaper on a kid, absolutely wrestling them into the baby seat and going back home.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Oh, yeah, My kids make fun of me. My dad, my. My son, who's 19, literally will put his hands going, dad, why do you talk? He's hilarious. They go, why you. You have no idea what you're talking. I go, hey, I'm a national treasure.

[Richard Kind]

National treasure.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I'll go like that. Now, of course, I'm not a national. I know that. And to them, I'm their dad. Yes. You know, we have to take stock on ourselves. But if you. But. But an actor keeps getting told, oh, you're wonderful. Oh, I love you. Oh, you bring me such joy. They're going to go around thinking that. So that develops into a jerk. It can, it can. It can.

[Richard Kind]

If you.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Yes, if you do know. So the ratio is not the same.

[Richard Kind]

I think my feeling is it actually was because, first of all, I didn't talk to a lot of kid actors. What I did do.

[Savannah Guthrie]

No, I'm talking about adult actors, too.

[Richard Kind]

Well, adult actors.

[Savannah Guthrie]

But an adult actor isn't going to be lousy to you. He's about to go on, talk to you for 12 minutes. Why would they be?

[Richard Kind]

True. Yeah, but everybody talks to each other. The guy who's bringing them from the limo into the dressing room, I know this guy. We talk to each other every day. I say, what was you like?

[Savannah Guthrie]

He got.

[Richard Kind]

He was a jerk or he was nice. I mean, they, they. They kind of. Yeah, it's a small little ecosystem. So you get to hear if someone's an asshole.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Yeah. Hope. We're also liberal in our politics, and liberality usually means kindness. It means an openness to people. That's the liberal. That's what liberality really means, is is an openness. And I think that actors are usually liberal in their politics and liberal in their personalities and their acceptance of people. But I will tell you this. And who. I'll be damned if I can remember who it was, but I was talking to a director who was an actor first. Oh, God, who was it? Boy, I wish I could remember. Oh, I know who it was.

[Richard Kind]

I was so close.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Old man. Old man. He was on 30 something. It's all. And I know him well, and he's married to Melissa Gilbert and I know him.

[Richard Kind]

Oh, let's Google it.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Google it. Because he's a great. He's a dear, dear friend. But he was talking about. He was in on a meeting with, like, the producers and with the. And some of the writers and everything and go, well, they're really nuts. And he goes, yeah, we. Tim Busfield. Stop it. Stop looking. Tim Busfield.

[Richard Kind]

Tim Busfield just got it right now.

[Savannah Guthrie]

And he goes, of course they're nuts. You're asking them to bring up emotions in an unnatural situation, in a make. Pretend. We're asking them to go to the edge. We don't ask normal people to do that. And not only that, we're asking them to do. To go to the edge and then do it again and then do it again and then do it again within the same two or three hours. You got to be nuts. That is nuts. That's not how people are. We're also nuts because. Do you remember the scene in Tootsie where Dustin Hoffman is walking down Fifth Avenue for the first time dressed as Tootsie, and you can see him out of the crowd. The crowd is the world. The nut is who we're looking at. That's not right. The normality is you should be the guy over his left shoulder. That's normal. We're abnormal. In front of a camera, two people making out, telling each other such intimate things, while behind the camera are 50 people. Who does that? There's 50 people watching. We don't see it. We. The audience. There's 50 to 100 people behind the camera, and you're acting like an idiot in front of the camera.

[Richard Kind]

Well, then, in that sense, do you think it's unrealistic, this kind of new thing? Because everybody asked. I bet you, you get asked this all the time. If you mentioned George Clooney and he's a perfect example of it. Someone will say, is he nice? Like, what's.

[Savannah Guthrie]

All the time.

[Richard Kind]

He's like everybody else. He'll be nice sometimes. He'll be a jerk. At other Times he'll get happy, he'll get sad.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Absolutely.

[Richard Kind]

But this whole idea, like if you meet Lemmy from Motorhead, people will say, was he nice? They go, I don't need him to be nice. He's Lemmy. I don't need him to be nice. Like Mick Jagger, is he nice? I don't care. I don't care if he's nice. But niceness seems to be, you know, the single most valuable commodity. And I think it is because it's amplified now because of the airsat's fame that comes with social media. So that kind of like famous for being exactly who you are.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I think it's been that way since all the newspapers. That not the national crime, but, you know, Hollywood, the Hollywood report, Hollywood Confidential and stuff. You know, in the 30s, when you learned about serious stars, this was a way of making. Of selling movies and a way of selling movie stars. Hollywood Confidential, stuff like that, which have gone on and on. And today are, you know, Entertainment Tonight. We want to get closer to these people. Oh, I used to joke that when people saw George, they wouldn't get. They want to go up and maybe he'll rub off on me. They get to me, they go, oh, you know what? Not too close. It rubs off in case it rubs off. But people want to know these people because somehow it gives them importance, import. They met this person. They. I mean, that's Steve Martin's card. He gives he hands out cards. I met Steve Martin. I had an experience, or I had a personal experience with Steve Martin. He doesn't sign autographs. This is what he gives away. We do want that. I like it. I love my kids. I brag about who I saw that day. Today I was with Fred Armisen, who I adore, who I love Fred Armisen, love him. I admire him. I'm going to be working with him in a month. I love Fred Armisen. I'm going to tell my kids I did. My kids are so tired of hearing me justify my importance by who I saw that day. They are so tired of it.

[Richard Kind]

So you can't. Well, I was trying to actually get back to the. When you were a kid, though, I wanted to get the impulse of what makes the journey from a very like.

[Savannah Guthrie]

It's interesting. I. My grandparents, as I mentioned earlier, I came to New York, my grandparents took me to plays all the time. I was well educated in the arts. Oh, my daughter is calling in now from Spain and you know what I'm talking about.

[Richard Kind]

You want to take a call?

[Savannah Guthrie]

No, I'm Talking to Craig Ferguson. Talk to her. She's calling from Madrid. I want to come back as my. As Richard Kynes children. They got it. Great.

[Richard Kind]

Oh, yeah, my kids, too.

[Savannah Guthrie]

She's on a semester abroad and she's having a great time. So they took me to Broadway shows. They took me to Leonard Bernstein's Young People's concert. I had a magnificent upbringing as far as culture. I think that's why I'm who I am today. And I emulated at the time, Robert Preston, Zyra Mostel. These were heroes to me. I loved them. And then during school, I did all the plays and I was the star. You know, I was good. I had a modicum of talent. I became much better within the past 20 years, but I had talent. When I was a kid, my mom used to. She didn't read that stuff, but she loved saying who she liked or who she may have met, stuff like that. Or who she went to college with, which at the time were so on high. And I look back and I go, really? You're bragging about him? But so and so went on a cruise and they met, believe it or not, Jerry Paris. I'll always remember that The Alberts were on a cruise and met Jerry Paris and remained friends with him. What? But I was struck by that. Then I graduated. I graduated from Northwestern, supposed to be a lawyer, and go to business school and go into my dad's business and my dad's best friend. I tell the story all the time, where it was Sunday afternoon watching football, and he said, you should try New York and give it a go. Because when you're 40, you're going to resent your wife, you're going to resent your children, that you did not give it a go, that you're still at the jewelry store selling, being a businessman, you could have been an actor. So I did it, and I had talent. One year turned into two and three, and by the age of 29, 30, you should be going, I don't like this life of suffering. And I should be getting more work and people aren't appreciating me. That's when I went into Second City. So for four years I was acting every night. And I became better. And so I had no chance to leave that year. Between 28, 29 and 3334, I was taken care of. I was making a living in Chicago. I was famous. I was successful. I was downright successful. There were six people in the world who made a really good living acting or doing improv. And it was at Second City and I was one of the six. What a blessing.

[Richard Kind]

That is amazing.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Unbelievable.

[Craig Ferguson]

All right, we're all set for the party. I've trimmed the tree, hung the mistletoe, and paired all those weird shaped knives and forks with the appropriate cheeses. And I plugged in the Partisan.

[Richard Kind]

Partisan.

[Craig Ferguson]

It's a home cocktail maker that makes over 60 premium cocktails, plus a whole lot of seasonal favorites too. I just got it for 50 off. So how about a Cosmopolitan or a mistletoe margarita?

[Richard Kind]

I'm thirsty. Watch.

[Craig Ferguson]

I just pop in a capsule, choose my strength and wow, it's beginning to.

[Richard Kind]

Feel more seasonal in here already.

[Craig Ferguson]

If your holiday party doesn't have a bartender, then you become the bartender. Unless you've got a Bartesian because Bartesian crafts every cocktail perfectly in as little as 30 seconds. And I just got it for $50 off.

[Richard Kind]

Tis the season to be jollier.

[Savannah Guthrie]

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[Craig Ferguson]

Hi, I'm Cindy Crawford and I'm the founder of Meaningful Beauty. Well, I don't know about you, but like, I never liked being told, oh wow, you look so good for your age. Like, why even bother saying that? Why don't you just say you look great at any age?

[Richard Kind]

Every age.

[Craig Ferguson]

That's what Meaningful Beauty is all about. We create products that make you feel confident in your skin at the age you are now. Meaningful Beauty. Beautiful skin at every age. Learn [e-mail].

[Richard Kind]

It'S very interesting that time period you talk about though, because that's my experience as well. It was like I had done stand up. I was doing, doing stand up. I didn't feel like I was getting anywhere with it. And round about 29, I was like, actually that's when I got sober as well. I was like, I don't know about any of this. And in A very short space of time, between 29 and 32, I went from falling down drunk in the street to a regular cast member on the Drew Carey show in Los Angeles. From. From Glasgow to Los Angeles in that very short space of time. And I can't really tell how it happened.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Yeah, you know, I know. But it's at that age, and if you don't hit it, you could become an agent, a writer, a producer. There's, oh, what's his name? Danny Jacobson, who created Spin City and ran Spin City. I'm sorry. Who created a man about you. He was a handsome stud of a guy. He was in Greece, on Broadway, and around that time, after Grease, nothing happened. And that's when he became a comedy writer, went to work. I was there, and then became a really great comedy writer. You and I know if you can do anything other than that, do it. Anything. Anything other than that, do it for many reasons. Number one, you're never going to give a perfect performance. You'll give a good performance. You'll never be perfect. You can always be better, but you'll be a good writer. You can be great. So he was lucky. He became a writer and producer and made a gazillion dollars. He's much wealthier than me. He was a producer on a successful TV show. He made millions. I am a thousandaire successful actor.

[Richard Kind]

But your daughter's calling you from a sad master abroad in Spain right now.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I'm one of the lucky ones, I guess. There are 10 movie stars. What are there, 250 really big actors who make a decent, decent good. What a good businessman would make. Yeah, 250. Maybe there's 400.

[Richard Kind]

Yeah, maybe. I don't know if you're lucky. So it's very mercurial. It comes and it goes. I mean, there are times sometimes, like you're talking about recently. You do seem to be everywhere right now. It is interesting, but I've seen there have been parts of your career. If I was to look at your career, there have been moments in your career where you were everywhere. Like, if I think of you late, I think it's maybe late 90s, early 2000s, or maybe it's a bit later than that. You were everywhere then, too. I remember you being everywhere.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Craig, I'm the lucky guy. I've worked consistently. You haven't always seen me, but I've been doing shows. You do a TV show, millions watch you. You do a show, 900 to 1200 people are watching you, or you're doing a show for 90 people or 300, it doesn't matter. I'm always working. I'm not always making a lot of money and not a lot of people are seeing me. And I'm not famous. During those years when everybody's going, aren't you acting anymore? I'm always acting. I always am acting. I just am.

[Richard Kind]

Are your kids drawn to it?

[Savannah Guthrie]

Are your kids drawn into it? No, I'm a good father.

[Richard Kind]

Congratulations.

[Savannah Guthrie]

No, no, no. I know. No, but I kid them. I go, my kids were blessed with no talent, so I'm very lucky. They don't like that joke, but it's the truth. That's interesting.

[Richard Kind]

That's interesting. It's a funny thing, though, because I remember working with kid actors in Hollywood. I didn't like working with them either. I didn't like being around kid actors. I remember saying to the. They would always say to the parents, why do you let your kid be an actor in Hollywood?

[Savannah Guthrie]

And what did they say?

[Richard Kind]

They always say the same thing. They always say they want to do it.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Yeah, right.

[Richard Kind]

They want to do it. And I'm like, that's not a reason to let a kid do a thing. Yeah, because they want to do it. That's the opposite. My kids want to eat Skittles for breakfast.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I say the same thing. You think my kids want to eat vegetables? They'd rather have cotton candy. They don't know what the hell they want. They want to do it. Now, there's a couple of things as you bring that in about child actors. I don't like child actors. I don't. I liked Fred Savage. I worked with Fred Savage. He was a wonderful kid. And of course, you come across a couple. I instantly don't like the parents. Instantly, that's on me. They may be great people, but I instantly don't like the parents. And I'll tell you something else. I had a therapist whose daughter said she wanted to be an actress. Hell, go let her. Let her. Don't let her get money. The minute money comes into it, all of a sudden there are consequences and there's competition in ways that are not healthy. Let her do community theater. Go do school plays. Let her put on plays. Pay for them. Do what? Let her act. Act, act, act, act. She wants to act, let her act. She wants to be famous. She wants to be on tv. That's what she wants.

[Richard Kind]

Well, that's what I think. Because nowadays I always thought doing stand up comedy for me was kind of like being a job, like a realtor. No one grows up wanting to Be a realtor. But it's a pretty good job because other things don't work out. But now you get people who want to be stand up comedians. I like, I don't think.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I think, yeah, 8 year olds, 10 year olds, I think they want to be standups.

[Richard Kind]

That is crazy.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I don't necessarily agree with you. I understand that that's how you felt. But I believe they do. Jeff Garland tells a story that his parents took him at age 10 to see Jimmy Durante. Oh, wow. And the ride home, he says, does he get paid for that? And they go, yeah. He goes, that's what I want to do.

[Richard Kind]

That's very interesting.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Yeah, yeah, that's very.

[Richard Kind]

That's not my experience with it at all.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Yeah. I did not want to be Zero Marcel. I didn't. I loved Zero Marcel. I loved Robert President. They affected me. But when I got to be 17, 18, I wanted to do what they did, you know, I always wanted to be an actor, but I always wanted to be. Look, how many kids want to be a baseball player? How many kids want to be a fireman? You know? And I say in my. When I used to lie in bed when I was 14, 15, 16 years old, you know, kids want to dream of being center fielder for the. For the Yankees. I dreamt of being in a Stanley Kubrick movie, in an original Stephen Sondheim, Hal Prince musical and a Woody Allen movie. That's what I dreamt about. That's what I want to do.

[Richard Kind]

Have you done any of those things?

[Savannah Guthrie]

Okay, here's what, here's my joke is I was in an original Stephen Sondheim, Hal Prince musical. I was the lead. The lead me who sings the way that I say I could sing but not sing. Sondheim. But I did, so I did that. I was never in a Woody Allen movie. And even after Stanley Kubrick died, I thought I'd have a better chance of being in a Stanley Kubrick movie than a Woody Allen movie. And then finally, Woody Allen did put me in a movie. You've never heard of it? Yeah, it's called Rifkin's Festival. And it was. It was fun. It was fun. Nobody saw it. You know, it's now during his, you know, Me Too series of movies, but that's what it is.

[Richard Kind]

Yeah, that's interesting. Did you grow. Did you become friends with him? Is he a friend?

[Savannah Guthrie]

I can't say I was friends with him, but whenever I saw him, he knew who I was because I had auditioned for him a few times and he's very shockingly popular culture savvy. He watches a lot of tv. He knows a lot of stuff. Look, anybody who saw a serious man, anybody who's Jewish saw a serious man, you know that he saw a serious man. And I think he liked me. And then he cast me. He cast me.

[Richard Kind]

Good.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Yeah, it was good. I had a great time. And in fact, there was one moment, it was a dinner scene, A lot of the people in the cast had a very small part, but I remember certain things. I remember specifically. So at one point I was doing my lines and I was doing that, and he says, that's great, Richard. That's great. Don't hit the joke. I knew exactly what he was. Or don't hit the line. I know exactly what he was talking about. Exactly. And he was right. I hit. I hit the joke.

[Richard Kind]

And then explain hitting the joke to me. What does that mean? If I, like you, played it like it was a joke rather than a piece of dialogue.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Let's say, boy, it was a funny line that should have been conversational. And I knew it was funny. I hit the funny, let the funny sit. He was right. And I cringe to this day for having made that choice. I knew exactly what he was talking about. Exactly, exactly. In the old days, I wouldn't have been able to know. I knew exactly what he's talking about. The other thing is, I was doing the scene, I was saying the lines and he came out of the, you know, the village, video village, out from a tent, and he was laughing and he was happy. He says, good job. And then he went back and everybody looked at me and he goes. He never does that. He never comes out and says, that was good. Or laughing. Said it was good. Said it was good.

[Richard Kind]

See? See, you're different to me. Because if he had done that to me, I'd have think, I don't know. I'm going to get fired. If he never does that and he's done it, I'm going to get fired. That's what it is. I have a. I think I have a distrust, Craig.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I was good. I knew I was good. I was good. You were good. No, no, no. At that particular moment, I knew I was good. I knew it was good.

[Richard Kind]

You knew it was good? Yeah, I know. Well, you are good. You are.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I know when stuff is good, sometimes I still have to hear it. I still have to hear, how was that? Is that what you wanted? Sometimes when I'm really pathetic, really pathetic, I'll say, when I know it's good. I'll go to the director, go, is that good? And that's pathetic to me, and I know it. It's horrible.

[Richard Kind]

I don't think so.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Horrible.

[Richard Kind]

I don't think so horrible. I tell you what I think. I remember once having. There was a bunch of musicians and I was doing. I had been directing a movie and there was a score, the London Philharmonic in Abbey Road Studios. And they were doing the score for the movie and the conductor was conducting them and they were all great. I was a director of a movie. What a big movie. But we got the orchestra cheap. And I went out to the London fellow after they were finished and I stood up with the conductor, Stans, and I said, I know you're all professional musicians. I know that you do this day in and day out and it's not romantic to you, but I have to tell you, what you people do is otherworldly. And I cannot be. Express how much gratitude I feel for your skill and your talent and being here today. I mean, you'll get paid, but I just can't tell. And I could tell because I know people. I work with people I could tell by being honestly enthusiastic and grateful for what they've done. That. Who doesn't love hearing that? Who doesn't love. Attaboy. A pat in the back and say you were great. Thank you.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Yeah. Oh, absolutely. Oh, I think that. I think that's. I didn't know where your story was going, but I think. I think I do that a lot. I think I tell people my gratitude, my appreciation for what they do. Absolutely. All the time. Absolutely. I do. I'll do it to a.

[Richard Kind]

And I don't see any. What I mean is, I don't see anything pathetic about wanting that for yourself. I think that.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Oh, no. Oh, I agree. Yeah. I. What was pathetic is that I knew I was good and still go up to the. I still went fishing. I still went fishing for the compliment. Oh, no, no, no.

[Richard Kind]

I don't think there's any wrong with it. Anyway, listen, you are great. You are wonderful. I remain an enormous fan of your.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Work and many of you, because you were always really kind to me when I was on your show. I was on your show about three times and one time I think I did a bit for you. Yeah. And. Yeah, you're always great. Your comedy was great. You are. You're not snarky. You're, you know, try not to be. I think you weren't. I think you can. I think, you know, snarky. I think you know the area code of it all. And you can be not sarcastic, but you can be. You could poke fun, but never meanly. I think the world of your comedy. I thought you were great.

[Richard Kind]

God bless you. And right back at you.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Certainly. Great. Thanks.

[Richard Kind]

And thank you for sort of introducing me to my wife.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Sort of? Oh, no, no, no. I'm taking full responsibility. I deserve to have a Christmas ornament on your tree. I deserve a Christmas.

[Richard Kind]

You know what? It's going to happen. I'm going to have constructed for this year.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Yes.

[Richard Kind]

Thank you, Richard. You enjoy.

[Savannah Guthrie]

However, it'll be round, so don't make my face too fat. I'm kidding.

[Richard Kind]

Oh, okay. It'll be appropriately jolly for Christmas.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Fine. Okay. Craig, what a pleasure to talk to you. It's very nice.

[Richard Kind]

It's a joy for me. Thank you, Rachel. Thank you so much.

[Savannah Guthrie]

You bet.

[Craig Ferguson]

All right, we're all set for the party. I've trimmed the tree, hung the mistletoe, and pared all those weird shaped knives and forks with the appropriate cheeses. And I plugged in the Partisan.

[Richard Kind]

Partisan.

[Craig Ferguson]

It's a home cocktail maker that makes over 60 premium cocktails, plus a whole lot of seasonal favorites, too. I just got it for 50 off. So how about a Cosmopolitan or a mistletoe margarita?

[Richard Kind]

I'm thirsty.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Watch.

[Craig Ferguson]

I just pop in a capsule, choose my strength and wow, it's beginning to.

[Richard Kind]

Feel more seasonal in here already.

[Craig Ferguson]

If your holiday party doesn't have a bartender, then you become the bartender. Unless you've got a Bartesian, because Bartesian crafts every cocktail perfectly in as little as 30 seconds. And I just got it for $50 off.

[Richard Kind]

Tis the season to be jollier.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Add some holiday flavor to every celebration with the sleek, sophisticated home cocktail maker. Pick up your phone and shake it to get $50 off. Any cocktail maker.

[Richard Kind]

Yes, you heard me.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Shake your phone and get $50 off. Don't delay.

[Craig Ferguson]

This podcast is supported by BetterHelp, offering licensed therapists you can connect with via video phone or chat. Here's BetterHelp head of clinical operations, Heis Yu Jo discussing who can benefit from therapy.

[Savannah Guthrie]

I think a lot of people think.

[Craig Ferguson]

That you're supposed to be going to therapy once you're, like, having panic attacks every day. But before you get to that point, I think once you start even noticing that you feel a little bit off and you can't maintain this harmony that you once had in relationships, that could be a sign that maybe you want to go talk to somebody. There's always a benefit in talking to.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Someone because we can all benefit from.

[Craig Ferguson]

Improved insight about ourselves and who we are and how we behave with other people. So if you're human, that's like a good indicator that you could benefit from talking to somebody. Find out if therapy is right for you. Visit betterhelp.com today. That's betterhelp.com it's beginning to sound a.

[Savannah Guthrie]

Lot like the holidays.

[Richard Kind]

The Roku Channel, your home for free and premium TV is giving you access to holiday music and genre bass stations.

[Savannah Guthrie]

From iHeart, all for free.

[Richard Kind]

Find the soundtrack of the season with channels like Iheart, Christmas and North Pol Radio.

[Savannah Guthrie]

The Roku Channel is available on all.

[Richard Kind]

Roku devices, Web, Amazon, Fire TV, Google TV, Samsung TVs, and the Roku mobile app on iOS and Android devices.

[Savannah Guthrie]

So stream what you love and turn.

[Richard Kind]

Up the cheer with iheartradio on the Roku Channel. Happy streaming.