← Juicebox Podcast: Type 1 Diabetes
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- [00:00]
A
Hello, friends, and welcome to episode 1064 of the Juice Box Podcast. Hello, everyone. Welcome back. This is another installment of the parenting series that still doesn't seem to have a name. We just call it Parenting. I guess that's the name, really. Today's episode is called Self care and Personal Growth. For for parents. It's with Erica Forsyth, who of course is a geez. A lifelong type one almost 35 plus years. She's a therapist and you can Visit her@ericaforsyth.com while you're listening. Please remember that nothing you hear on the Juice Box Podcast should be considered advice, medical or otherwise. Always consult a physician before making any changes to your healthcare plan or becoming bold with insulin. Check out cozyearth.com and then use the offer code juicebox at checkout to save 40%. Check out the private Facebook group Juice Box podcast type 1 diabetes and then become a member. That's pretty much what I got for you today. You know what? No, forget that. You want an Omnipod, you want a Dexcom. You want to check out US Med? How about Gevo Kypopen? Use the links. They're in the show notes of this audio player and they also exist@juiceboxpodcast.com when you support the podcast using those links, you help to keep the show free and plentiful. This episode of the Juice Box podcast is sponsored by usmed. Now, usmed is where Arden gets her Dexcom and Omnipod supplies from, but they have much more than that. Usmed.com/juicebox head over there now and get your free benefits check. Or you can call 888-721-1514. U.S. med has everything you're looking for and so much more. Hey Erica, how are you?
- [02:00]
B
Hi. Well, thanks. How are you?
- [02:03]
A
I'm good. We are doing episode three today of the parenting series. Today's task for us is going to be talking about self care and personal growth for the parents.
- [02:15]
B
Yes.
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A
I have to admit if I put this list together on my own, I wouldn't have put this in here. So I'm very interested in why you put it in.
- [02:22]
B
I think it's important as we've reviewed so far, the different parenting styles and then in our most recent episode, we discussed communication, positive communication, and the effectiveness of conflict resolution. I think it's good to kind of pause and we can really get down on ourselves as parents and I think it's important to take a pause on the education and information and say we also need to take care of ourselves in this process. As we are thinking about, gosh, I. I really want to grow in this area as a parent, or, gosh, I could really improve in how I communicate with my partner or my child. We also need to look at ourselves and say, gosh, we need to take breaks. We need to implement either small or large ways to practice the self care.
- [03:12]
A
Okay, this is with a diabetes diagnosis in your life and without both, right?
- [03:19]
B
Yes, yes, absolutely. Absolutely.
- [03:21]
A
But it does become more in your face. I think once there's diabetes, I would actually think whether you're a parent of a child with type 1 or if you had diabetes yourself, I think it kind of ramps up at that point. And. And someone shared a personal anecdote with me recently that I'm going to. I think I'm going to bring up in this episode. But the first thing I think is, for me, you know, I had a baby when, I mean, I wasn't really super young, but I wasn't probably as old as I wish I was when Kelly had Cole. And then Arden came, you know, a handful of years later. What I can say is that when you're young and you have that, you still have that, like, I can do anything feeling and you're never tired. Right. It doesn't matter what you eat. It doesn't seem like. And, you know, your body just chugs along and then you get thrown into that kid thing, you attack that. I mean, I attacked it with the same kind of, like, perspective of like, we can do anything and blah, blah, blah, but it kicks your ass pretty quick, you know? And the first thing that gets you, I mean, what are your remembrances of having small children? It's, you know, what's the first thing that kind of took you from your baseline just down a little bit and you didn't rebound again?
- [04:36]
B
Oh, lack of sleep, for sure.
- [04:39]
A
That's what I was gonna say, too. And the thing people tell you while you're pregnant, get your sleep now.
- [04:45]
B
Yes.
- [04:46]
A
Yeah, that's like a little falsehood, because I think people think you can bank sleep a little bit. Yeah, Like, I'll sleep for a year and I'll be good for three years. And boy, it doesn't work like that. It takes a couple of nights of broken sleep and you just, your eyes get crossed, you know, and then you're off to the races, right? Then you're. Then you're not judging things and making decisions as your best self anymore, and you don't know it after a while. I think that's kind of the scary part, honestly.
- [05:20]
B
Absolutely. Yeah. Lack of sleep, you. Then you think you, you have adjusted, and that becomes your new normal. And then adding in, if you have a young child, infant toddler, young child who is diagnosed with diabetes, then that obviously compounds it. But I think we do. We kind of trick ourselves thinking, okay, I'm just. I'm going to be tired. I'm going to function this way. And you do adjust and adapt. But then you. It's like, you know, when you are sick, you have a cold for so long, and then all of a sudden you don't have the cold. You're like, oh, my gosh, I forgot what it was like to. To not be sick. I think this minute you start to recoup some of that sleep, you start to realize, wow, I've been really irritable and not being able to make decisions correctly or speaking the way I want to.
- [06:07]
A
I sometimes think that when people think they've adjusted, what they've really done is lowered their bar, right? Because anything that doesn't end with you falling over dead, you think you've adjusted. You're like, I can do it. You ever hear people say, I only need three hours of sleep a night? And I'm like, that's not right at all.
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B
I mean, maybe some people do, but I certainly, certainly you need more than that. Yes.
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A
I mean, I think fairly, like, you know, believable. Science tells you you need, I think, at least six, Right? Like, some people are bend, some people work better, 6, 7, 8. Some people, like, fall. But when you start telling yourself, I'm the one who doesn't need to sleep. You are. I mean, I did it. I'm speaking from personal experience. You know, the diabetes, especially in the beginning, without the monitoring that exists now, you know, you were up at all hours of the night. And, you know, I mean, if you have a CGM now and you can think of what that feels like when it's just warming up and you're like, I don't know what's happening. That was 24 7. You know, you grew up like this and live like this for decades, but that's 247 as a parent, where you're laying in bed thinking, I wonder what her blood sugar is now. And then you go check, and then you go lay back down. And then you realize, I wonder what it is now and what is it in 10 minutes? And is it rising or falling? And then you try to sleep, and that's, that's, that's a tough, tough thing to do. So you don't, you don't Sleep. You get the situations you hear people say all the time, like, I made their blood sugar high so they could sleep and blah, blah, blah. Like you get into those situations where you catch a couple of hours, but man, you never really hit that deep, that deep sleep. And I don't know, I just, for me, it, I think it alters who you are. I just, I really do. So. So then the problem is how do you fix that?
- [07:52]
B
Yes. Well, and I think just before we move into that, I think the difference with, as we were talking, remembering, you know, being a parent to an, an infant or newborn is you also can tell yourself, okay, this is temporary. You know, at some point your child is going to start sleeping through the night. And then obviously the difference with a parent with type one or, you know, treating your child with type one is, you know, they're. It's never really going. You feel like it's never going to end. And in that space is where the self care needs to kick in.
- [08:24]
A
Yeah. And for good reasons too, because if you keep spiraling, if the baby, the quote unquote baby is now the diabetes. And the feeling is the baby's never going to grow up. So it's always going to be an infant. It's always going to need me in the middle of the night at weird times. If that's your expectation and it keeps creating bigger and bigger deficits for you, and I mean like physical and mental deficits for you, then you are in the worst position possible to figure out diabetes so that the baby can grow up and it can get more manageable for you. That's.
- [08:55]
B
Yes.
- [08:56]
A
You know what I mean? Like, that's the spot where you have to, it's where you have to, at some point, say, I have to give a little bit of now away for later. Does that make sense? Like. Like we're either going to stay in this hell forever or where I'm going to find a way to get some sleep, find some clarity, figure this out so that this isn't always happening. Yeah, I think that's, it's. But how do you make that leap when it feels like closing your eyes is ignoring something that's potentially dangerous?
- [09:27]
B
I think we could answer that two different ways. The first, acknowledging that is, is what is keeping you up. Make the assumption that your child's management is in range and things feel in control. What is keeping you up is the anxiety or the, you know, as we talked about in the last episode, like that mental load. If you're thinking about all your tasks that you did or did not complete that day, and what you need to do the next day. And then you're wondering if your child's safe, if that piece is what's keeping you up, then I would, you know, encourage you to look at. Okay, is it. Do you need to find support? Do you need to find mental health support? Do you need to find support groups? Are there other outlets that you can tap into to help kind of alleviate some of that burden that you're carrying? And maybe the first step is saying to yourself, I'm never going to finish the task list. I'm never going to check it all off. Maybe it's reaching out to your peers, to your community, to your family members. I think that we could go into that path. And then the other path is, well, is it because you aren't. You haven't found the right way to manage your child's diabetes. And it does feel, you know, uncontrollable, scary, confusing, the way it does for a lot of us for the first weeks, months, years.
- [10:53]
A
Yeah. Well, I know for sure the wrong thing to do is to yell at each other.
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B
Yeah.
- [10:58]
A
But when you get that, that anxiety bubbles up inside and diabetes can't hear you, so you can't yell at it. You pretty much can't yell at your kids. But. But, you know, I have to say, though, I. I did a talk this weekend with a room full of children, like, from, like, they were like 5 years old to, I think, like 13 or 14. It was really great. And some of them, Some of their parents stayed and some of their parents didn't. And I made this announcement at the beginning. I'm like, listen, this is not really meant for you guys to be here. We want the kids to speak freely, so, you know, get out. And. But some people stayed, which was fine. But some of the kids still had the nerve to speak up in front of their parents. And that was interesting because I asked them, hey, what do your parents do that you wish they didn't do? And one girl said, they yell at me about my diabetes. And, like, her mom was sitting right next to her, and I was like, this kid needs help that badly that she was willing to say that out loud with her mom and her mom, like, I felt bad for her.
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B
Yeah.
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A
Because then she spoke up and said, you know, I, you know, I don't mean to do that. And, you know, I was like, oh, this is good. But so they. They were talking and. And that was it. Kids said, either I get yelled at for it or it sometimes makes. They make it Feel like it's my fault. And those are where. Those are tough. Right? Because I figure the yelling is just the, the anxiety, the adrenaline from all this just boiling over and maybe fear. Yeah, yeah, for sure. And then the, even the blaming thing is, I think I get that. I think it's like, you know, I've done everything I know how to do and it still went wrong, so this wasn't my fault. Like, it's almost that pressure of, like, I don't want to be the one to cause your health issue and there's no one else to blame. So to alleviate your own burden, you push it to somebody else. You know, Meanwhile, it's. It's diabetes fault, you know, it's not. It's no, it's no one's fault, really. It's difficult. But anyway, the parents, like, talked about it and it was, it seemed good for them know, it was. It was nice. And, and I, and I think about that now while you're talking, because this is what's going to happen. I mean, I lived through it. There was a. I can remember very clearly this moment. It's in the middle of the night, and Arden hadn't had diabetes for long. She was like really little still. And I can picture us in our old kitchen with her sitting on the counter. We've tested her blood sugar, it's low. And my wife thinks that one food product is the way to bring her blood sugar up. And I think it's another one. And we get embroiled standing on a freezing kitchen floor in our underwear at 3 o' clock in the morning, yelling at each other about which one of these things is going to save Arden's life. And we're reasonably intelligent people. And that was a moment I look back on and I think, oh, my God, what was wrong with us? Like, who cares? They just give her something. But it was that. It's that feeling inside, like I've had the answer. Like, you asked me a question, what's going to save Arden? And an answer popped into my head. Same thing happened to Kelly, and now we think we're saving her life. And anyone who disagrees with us is disagreeing with saving Arden is how it felt. And then we argued with each other in front of our kid who had a low blood sugar and floor was cold. I remember the floor being really cold.
- [14:31]
B
Wow.
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A
Yeah.
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B
So well, and layering on, you know, all of the. Just exhaustion you're carrying. It's the middle of the night, you guys are fatigued. You probably, you know, you're under stress. And now. And now we're going to try and have a reasonable conversation when Arden just needs, you know, needs something.
- [14:47]
A
Well, while there's a ticking time bomb next to you. Yeah, that's how it feels. It's going tick, tick, tick, tick tickets. I'm going to blow up. I'm going to blow up. Do the right thing, cut the right wire is kind of how it feels, you know? And I don't know how much good parenting I would have had to go through and my wife would have had to go through or how much counseling we would have needed for that not to happen that night. I have no idea. Do you know what I mean? Or if it was fait accompli, if it was always going to go down like that. I have no idea.
- [15:15]
B
Right. Well, I think part of it is being able to maybe say not in the moment, but to say later, like, you know what? This probably is very normal. This is a very normal experience for parents, particularly. How old. I mean, that was. You guys were new, newly into it.
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A
I mean, Arden was, like, still 2 years old.
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B
Okay.
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A
And that makes me 19, 17 years younger than this, I think. Is that how math works? I mean, I was like, I was almost 20. I was probably, like, in my early 30s.
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B
Okay. And she was just a couple months into it.
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A
Yeah. And we didn't know what the hell we were doing.
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B
Yeah. Yeah.
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A
Now, by the way, it's like, hey, I think your blood sugar is low. And then nobody panics anymore. We're just like. We're just like something. Take care of it. But that's experience. Right.
- [16:05]
B
Over and over and over. But I think the piece of, you know, the parenting, as I talk about a lot with parents who. Whom I work with is diabetes, can bring to the surface all those issues that maybe we thought you thought there had been, you know, you had addressed or communication styles that it just brings it all to the surface. And that's okay. There's. It's not. There's not shame in that. That's just how chronic illness in a family can affect you. And so just even acknowledging with your partner, wow, we are. This is really hard. And yes, we. We can understand why we're disagreeing and we're arguing. And how can we, like, so kind of like, normalizing it for yourselves, I think, is part of the process and not, you know, we're not arguing because you're arguing, but say, well, we're arguing because this is really stressful, and we're really tired and really stressed. And a lot of People are probably doing this as well in our same shoes.
- [17:05]
A
There are times when I think of the rate of divorce, for example, and I think that it's sort of random, like unless there's something like really crazy going on, you know, I mean, people are being abusive to each other or something like that. Like taking that stuff aside, just taking two regular people who are together. I think that everybody who has diabetes has diabetes supplies. But not everybody gets them from US Med the way we do. US Med.com forward/juicebox or call 888-72115. USMed is the number one distributor for Freestyle Libre systems nationwide. They are the number one specialty distributor for Omnipod Dash, the number one fastest growing tandem distributor nationwide. And they always provide 90 days worth of supplies and fast and free shipping. That's right. Usmed carries everything from insulin pumps to diabetes testing supplies right up to your latest CGMs like the Freestyle Libre 2N3 and the Dexcom G6N7. They even have Omnipod Dash and Omnipod 5. They have an A plus rating with the Better Business Bureau. And you can reach them at 888-721-1514 or by going to my link usmed.com juicebox when you contact them, you get your free benefits check. And then if they take your insurance, you're off and going. And U.S. med takes over 800 private insurers and Medicare nationwide. Better service and better care is what usmed wants to provide for you. Usmed.com juicebox get your diabetes supplies the same way arden does from US Med links in the show notes links@juiceboxpodcast.com to USMed and all the sponsors. When you use my links, you're supporting the show. Most of us are not brought up in a way where we have good conflict resolution. I don't know that we're good at those things generally as people. So sometimes I just think it's like a roll of the dice. Like how many bad situations do you get in and is there enough time in between them for a cleansing of your palate? And are people whose relationships fail just in more of a rapid fire problem than other people? Like, is it kind of that random? Like, have you ever had that feeling? Like, have you ever been in a disagreement with your spouse and thought, if only that wouldn't have come on television just now, or we could handle this next week, but not today. We just had that thing three days ago. Do you know what I mean by that?
- [19:49]
B
Yes, yes, yes. There's some moment or one look, or one phrase that you hear or someone else says can just trigger you both, just enough to get you into that space and you're like, wow, what if I had just driven home five minutes later?
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A
Oh no, a hundred percent. And then that feeling of if only this would have happened two weeks from now even, and we were in a calmer place, like this would have been okay. But then what happens when it's diabetes and it's a low blood sugar at 2 o' clock in the morning followed by a high blood sugar at 7am, followed by a spouse who doesn't want a bolus and one does want a bolus and like, and these things keep happening every three hours. And then you hear people get divorced and you think, well, yeah, that makes sense. They're in constant conflict. Right. I don't know that that means that you're bad at conflict resolution. I think it kind of could mean that it's difficult to, I don't know, it's just difficult to be, be shot at constantly like that, you know?
- [20:44]
B
Yes. John Gottman, who has done a lot of research in relationships, he's a psychologist. I'm trying to, I'm gonna try and pull up the stat really quickly. He has, he says that we need like 90 positive interactions for every negative. And that could mean a look, a gesture, a positive, you know, sentence. So they're not huge, but I know that's not the right number, but it's a massive amount. It's a massive amount for every negative. Because we know we're going to have these, you know, negative interactions with our partners.
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A
Right.
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B
So I will.
- [21:23]
A
So you're saying when I walk into my bedroom and I see my wife's shoes all over the place, and I think, why does a person need that many shoes? And why don't they put them away? I now have to have 90 good interactions with my wife to make that feeling go away.
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B
Yes. Something, something around that number.
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A
And when she looks over at me and thinks, oh, that guy ruined my life by marrying me, now 90 good things have to happen to me.
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B
Yes, yes. I don't know, maybe next time I'll, I'll have the right number, the, the ratio. But it is, I mean, it is, it's, it's pretty significant. He, he can predict with all of his research. He's done amazing things in the, in the relationships and marriages. You know, there's like predictive factors leading to divorce. But one of the things that is preventative factor is this ratio of positive to negative interactions.
- [22:15]
A
I love that you said that it made me feel like I noticed something that was true. I was. I was like, oh, maybe I'm right. I. Again, I'll share this one. I think this is a tried and true marriage. Valuable marriage technique. Look for someone you can both be mad at at the same time. I love being on the same side of an argument with my wife. That's. There's nothing better than when she says something and I'm like, ooh, that does make me upset, too. I immediately get next to her, and I'm like, you and I, we're in this together. I hate that person, too. And then I. And I. I honestly think. I know that sounds. Maybe it sounds ridiculous. I honestly think that it helps every once in a while just to be kind of sympatico on something. You know what I mean? Like, something that's inarguable. Like, we're right, by the way. I don't know if we're really right. It doesn't really matter.
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B
Right.
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A
But we're right. Those people are clearly wrong. This thing is definitely wrong. Whatever. We agree. We're on the same team. I think it's like a. It's almost like team building a little bit.
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B
Yes. Well, it's. I mean, absolutely, because you think about. You feel bonded next to your teammates when you're competing against someone else, the other team. Right. And the goal is to win. So it's a similar experience. The emotions that you experience in that. The connectivity. Okay, my wife's got my back in this. She's got mine. We both feel the same way on this topic.
- [23:32]
A
Right. And I go so far down this road because I think that in the moment when these things are happening, first of all, you did not plan for your kid to have diabetes. So this stuff is going to come at you a million miles an hour if it happened to you the way it happened to us. Our life was going along pretty well. Like, we were savers and planners a little bit. We were moving in a direction on purpose, you know, like. And we were growing our family, and we were growing our, you know, our home. And we were doing the things that, you know. You know, you're supposed to do in that Norman Rockwell painting. So we were on the. On our way to those things. Then all of a sudden somebody's like, hey, that kid's pancreas doesn't work anymore, and this is insulin, and if you use too much, it'll kill her. And if you don't use enough, you're going to kill her later. And we were like, oh, great, I was just cutting the lawn last weekend. You know what I mean? Like, I didn't, I didn't know about all this. You don't have time to say, oh, I hope my blah, blah, blah, skills are intact, because I bet you we're going to be yelling at each other six months from now in the kitchen.
- [24:30]
B
And.
- [24:31]
A
And it hits you so quickly. It hits you quickly and slowly at the same time. I don't know if that makes sense or not, but it's like a drip, drip, drip, almost like a torture. And at the same time, it bowls you over, so you get knocked back. And then every time you try to stand back up again, it just feels like that slow drip is pushing you back down. And like you said earlier, after a while you don't notice it happening. And that. That's really when you get to it. So, I mean, what, what would help? Like a. A safe word. That's the wrong phrasing. But, but do you know, like, maybe somebody should. Maybe you should get together with your spouse and say, hey, if something goes off the rails, we need to be able to say something that the other. We both agree, we'll just stop. Does that work?
- [25:15]
B
Yes, yes. And I think, well, it works. I know it works really well with parent and child. Like, if they. If you both find yourselves, you know, looping through the same argument to have that, that safe word or kind of a cue word, then that you're telling your brain and your child or your partner's brain, oh, yeah, we're doing that thing again, let's say the word. And sometimes it can make you laugh. It could be silly, like, you know, snoopy. I mean, I don't know, like something that just interrupts that pattern for you to step away. And then you guys. And then you can regroup. I like, I think, yeah. When you're finding yourselves in that pattern because you're exhausted and you're stressed and exhausted doesn't even describe it. Right. That the fatigue level is so significant, it's hard to even notice when you're in it.
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A
Yeah.
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B
When you are looping through, I think that the safe word and then know what you're going to do next is also really helpful to step away, to take your deep breaths, to say, hey, let's regroup in 30 minutes or tomorrow. And sometimes you don't even need to necessarily reconnect. You both are just acknowledging, oh, yeah, we're doing this thing again, because, wow, what we're doing is really hard. And I think the first step, even in self care, besides all the things that, you know, we've always, we talk about is really just the self compassion piece of. Okay, how can you be compassionate towards yourself doing something that is so challenging day in, day out and then offering that compassion to your partner as well? But that's, I just, I like that, you know, self care is self compassion. When there's so much pressure that you place on yourself as a parent to a type 1 child that is just, it's hard to bear.
- [27:05]
A
Yeah. And I guess so you can, you can seek this kind of care or do things for yourself. I mean, in your private time. Like, is it a thing you should do on your own? Do you know what I mean? Like, do I, do I do it at work? Do I do it in the car? Do I do it while the kids are snapping? You know, like, where do you, like, if you figure out something that would help you. I don't know, I don't even know what that thing would be. Like a thing that would alleviate your stress or anxiety for a little bit. I mean, how do you implement it into a day that already seems very full to begin with? You know what I mean? And how do you know yourself well enough to, to decide what that thing should be?
- [27:47]
B
Those are great questions.
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A
Yeah.
- [27:49]
B
If you find that you are constantly feeling like, you know, the, the mantra of I'm never not a good enough parent, I'm not a good enough spouse, I'm not a good enough employee, I'm not a good enough homemaker, or I'm not, you know, all anything you can fill in the blank if you, if you resonate with that, that is an indicator for you to say, gosh, I'm being really hard on myself. There's something in your self talk and narrative that you are trying to perform and perfect and produce something that is unattainable. Because as we know, perfect management is unattainable and being perfect in general is unattainable. But if you're living under that pressure and feeling like, gosh, I can never, I'm never going to get my list done. I'm never going to, you know, do all the things I want to do, then you're just, that's that critic, that self criticism is hard to carry. That also creates emotional fatigue and physical fatigue and stress. So understanding and cluing and kind of checking in with yourself of how do you, how do you talk to yourself in those moments when you're driving to work, when you're, you know, doing the dishes, when you're typing at Work. What is that voice that you hear?
- [29:09]
A
Yeah.
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B
And then the next step is to try and integrate some of that self compassion. Like, you know what, I'm doing the best I can. I'm working really hard. And if that feels like that step can be hard to do independently. And so maybe that is when therapy can be helpful or support groups or share kind of unloading some of the burden, if you can, to your, your partner or to your family and just
- [29:33]
A
let somebody else tell you, hey, I've been through that and it's, you know, it gets better or don't be so hard on yourself. That kind of stuff.
- [29:40]
B
Yes. I mean, normalizing your experience, I think it can be helpful for someone to say, don't be so hard on yourself. But sometimes you can even receive that
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A
as, oh, look, you're doing this wrong.
- [29:52]
B
Shame. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Is further, kind of further shaming.
- [29:55]
A
Way to go. You can't handle that kid's blood sugar and you don't even know how to talk to yourself. Like, you could feel like, oh, great. Yeah, that's wonder.
- [30:02]
B
But I think people mean well when they're trying to say, like, like, you're doing a great job, you're doing the best you can, don't be so hard on yourself. That's all that's helpful. And someone's trying to cheer you on. So if you're saying those things, I'm not saying that's, that's bad. But to receive that can be challenging if you haven't learned how to say, you know what, I am doing the best I can and I am doing a good enough job. And maybe it's simply starting off with I am good enough, period, to loop
- [30:31]
A
back to the first episode about the different parenting styles. Which parenting style would have prepared me better for my daughter having diabetes?
- [30:43]
B
Well, like as you as a child having parents, are you.
- [30:46]
A
What, what, what could my parents have done that would have made me a more reasonable human being? And so when this thing happened to me, maybe I would have said, I guess it doesn't matter if she drinks the milk or the juice.
- [30:59]
B
Probably the authoritative right. Where you are giving space to the child. There's these boundaries. There's expectations, there's rules and consequences. There's also space for mistakes.
- [31:16]
A
Okay.
- [31:17]
B
And letting the child learn from some of those mistakes that you're not going to be perfect and that you can, you know, within that you're not letting them make mistakes. You're not being permissive, but you're also allowing them to learn from. From like you're not going to be perfect.
- [31:35]
A
It's. It's interesting, isn't it, that the way my parents parented me, for example, I don't think by any stretch of imagination would have been something somebody would have told you to do in a parenting manual. And yet the mix of who I am and the experiences I went through led me to be a person who's a reasonably good parent. But not until I met my wife, who fine tuned the whole thing at the end, right?
- [32:00]
B
Like, she.
- [32:01]
A
She took. Like, she took what they put out in the world. Me. And she was like, that's close, but not quite right. And then, you know, and then she was like, here. Like this. This. Don't yell. Stuff like that. And now I'm a. I'm a. I'm a very good parent now. Like, I just. I am. I'm 52. I mean, I couldn't actually raise a baby anymore, but if you gave me one, I think it would turn out really great. So if I could stay alive long enough to handle it. But. So there's this weirdness because there's something about the mess that my life was that turned me into this. And at the same time, I sit here and I say, well, if people would have just done a better job, maybe I would have gotten to it sooner. But then also, there's part of me that thinks that maybe I never would have gotten to it. Like, maybe the tornado is part of how I ended up where I am. And are we really trying to be perfect or fit a mold? Or are we just. Maybe we should just be looking at some simple truths. Like, we shouldn't be yelling at each other. Don't blame people for things. Don't pressure people. You don't need to be perfect. Like, just like, those simplicities, I think, are what lead to a reasonable human being coming out of your house as an adult. But I could be completely wrong. And if my kids end up shooting somebody in the street, you guys will be like, that guy was definitely wrong. But right now. But right now, Erica's like, don't use such rough examples, please. Let's just say if they're found selling heroin. How's that?
- [33:30]
B
Oh, my gosh.
- [33:31]
A
So what else would make you come? Never mind. I'm just. My kids are on a good path. So far. I'm comfortable with where they are. And I think if I were to, like, disappear today, they'd be all right. Like, it's sort of like the best thing. I mean, that was my hope, right? That they'd Be able to take care of themselves reasonably. But I don't think it's because I followed an exact parenting style. I think it's because I honestly, I think it's because we followed common sense. But I don't know how to teach that to people either. You know what?
- [34:02]
B
Common sense, and also a sense of safety, security, that they are loved. You want your child to know that they are loved for who they are, not for what they do. And that sense of secure attachment, you probably really, I imagine, focused in on because that you didn't necessarily have that growing up. And so you did evolve because of your childhood and who you wanted to become as a parent.
- [34:31]
A
It ends up being a blend, too. One of the best ways I can explain this is that if I talked to Arden before a softball game, I would say I'd tell her I loved her. I would tell her, it doesn't matter if you get a hit today, Just do your best, all that stuff. But then I'd leave her with, get out there and make those girls cry. Because if they're not crying when this is over, we have not beat them sufficiently. Now did I really want them crying? No. She knew I didn't really mean that like that. But there was this, like, there was this. This place of comfort and safety. You're okay. I love you. No matter what happens. None of this matters. It's a softball game, blah, blah, blah. But if we're going to get involved in it, go out there and.
- [35:11]
B
And do your best.
- [35:13]
A
Yeah, yeah. Like, really try. Like, don't just show up here for fun. Like, let's try to kick their ass if we can. And even with that, you know, I say all the time, using sports again, as an example, they say that the. They say, the statistics say that the year my son started playing Little League when he was 4 or 5 years old, that 4 million other American boys started playing Little League baseball that year.
- [35:36]
B
Wow.
- [35:36]
A
And that when those boys went to College, slightly over 9,000 of them went to play college baseball. Of those 4 million kids, wow. That's D, 1, 2, 3, and juco. That's four levels of college baseball. And I watched those other guys whose kids did not make it to college to play baseball, I watched how they talked to their kids, and it was, go get it, kill it. You can't fail. Blah, blah, blah. I would tell my son over and over again, this is just practice. Like, everything is practice. Why do we play baseball? So you can play more baseball. You want to get better so that somebody still wants you on their team next year. Like, that's what you're doing. None of this matters. It's all meaningless. And I never told my son, I never told my son that baseball mattered until the first time he showed up at a college recruiting thing. And I just told him in the car, I said, it all matters now. Like, if you want to keep playing baseball, you actually have to go do the thing right now. And then he went and did it and then he went to college and played baseball. But it was, I'll tell you right now, if you go back 15 years before that and get all those dads together and I would have said, that's how I'm going to parent this, they would have laughed me right out of that room. My son's the only one that went to play college baseball in this town at his age group. So I don't know, man. He also was talented and athletic and like, don't get me wrong, I didn't just like, he was like this little shubby kid.
- [37:07]
B
It wasn't all you, you could do it, buddy.
- [37:08]
A
Like, it wasn't that because I know plenty of kids who love baseball, they can't hold the bat right. But that's not, that's. You can't talk them into getting there. But I do think that as he's become an adult, I see that in him still like that he knows that the thing I'm doing is the thing I'm doing. It's not the end all be all. Like, this doesn't have to go perfectly. And I don't know, to me, those are the little things as you're parenting. Those are the important ideas to pull out and to use repetition for. And I think you can also offer that back to yourself as a parent. Yes, right. Which is that, you know, whether or not my kid comes home today with an A on a test or, you know, got in trouble for cursing in social studies, like, this is not. This wasn't the goal. You know what I mean? Like, you're not trying to be the prettiest girl in 8th grade is kind of what I'm thinking. Like there's, you should have a long term view of what you're trying to accomplish and, and see that these small moments, while important, none of them rise to the occasion of needing to be judged over, I guess. And yes, I think that about diabetes too. If you're still alive, you're doing great. You know, there's always time to learn and grow and get better so you can play again tomorrow. I guess that's What. I think that's what I'm saying.
- [38:30]
B
And in. But you're in a position now to be able to look back and reflect. And I think. And then when you're in it, you, I imagine you also had those moments of like, oh, my gosh, this feels really confusing or scary. And I'm very stressed out.
- [38:48]
A
That anxiety, like, should we be one of the people who throws a picnic after a game so everybody likes him? Will that make sure he plays like that crap that you're all worried about right now? So unimportant and. But I get it. Like, it popped up. And my wife hit me one time. She's like, you should coach a team. That's the only way he's going to get a fair shake. And she, by the way, in the moment, she wasn't wrong. But I said, I don't think that's good for him. So let those other three guys go out there and create horrible relationships with their sons to win a baseball game in a field in the middle of nowhere that nobody cares about. Like, I'm not, I'm not trading our relationship for that, you know, but, yeah, the, the hindsight is helpful because the pressure is immense while you're in it. And, and, and I do think that that does apply to a blood sugar 180. Oh, my God, I messed it up. This is the end. We're never going to get this. This is a failure. Like, I know how that feels, but that's not true, you know, like, that's not true at all. Arden's A1C is. Is terrific right now. She's off at college again. I'd have to look it up, but I think it's somewhere near like, six two right now. That's her managing on her own with an algorithm, but her managing on her own and, you know, her variability was terrific. Last week. I looked at. I think it was like 28 or so. Like, her standard deviation was like 28 last week. I was like, that's amazing. She still had, I would say, four or five blood sugars in the last week and a half that went up to 200 and stayed there for a while. And it was a mistake. It was a bad site. It was one time was a bad site that she should have changed. And I chose not to tell her that because I think she knows. And it would be worse for our relationship if I, if I said that in that moment, right? If she was 8 and we were at home, I would have been like, you're taking this pump off an hour Doing the other. But this is a different situation. One time she just missed on some food, but she's like cooking for herself now and like, you gotta kind of see the bigger picture. Like, she got an apartment, she's making her own meals, she forgot the pre bolus, but she also made a meal for herself. And I was like, good, well then we're not gonna say anything about this now. If it stays high for a little while, I'll send a text and I'll say, hey, you know what? I think you gotta look. Is the algorithm asking for insulin that you're not like, like you should give it. If it's asking. And she doesn't even answer me anymore. I just, it happens. Her blood sugar comes down and even that, like, I'm not looking to be right. Like, you know what I mean? Like, I don't have a need to be like, see, I told you so. I just want her to like, I think one day she'll just start doing it on her own. And.
- [41:34]
B
And again, you know, and she is right. She is doing it on her own.
- [41:38]
A
Yeah, she's doing terrific. But again, if you, if you stop in any one of those scenarios and start judging every step, as this is completely dire, then you're gonna go crazy. They're gonna go crazy. You're gonna have a bad relationship. Blood sugars are not going to be good. It's not going to lead to some sort of like, oh, he was right, I'll take care of it. And in the meantime, you're all beat up. And I mean all of you, you're all beat up by it. So there's some reason, something in that I'm not great at, like, I'm not very good at tying this together for some reason today, but something in that is why you have to take care of yourself and not put yourself in a position where you're ranting or raving or seeing things as dire when they're not, because it snowballs and then you're flying down the hill and you can't stop anymore. So is that right?
- [42:29]
B
Yes. Yes. Because in the moment, as you're caregiving for your 5 year old or 10 year old or 15 year old, you're also doing all the other things to function as an adult. And then you have this other significant load of stress as you're managing, watching, watching the numbers on the decks on the CGM or however you're managing. And then you can get. So I think as you're articulating, you just get so caught up in each Moment to moment to moment, and having that automatic thought response of, are we are? Am I failing? Is my child failing? This is overwhelming. And oftentimes I will meet with caregivers who are wanting support for their children, and then soon enough, they realize, gosh, I just need this space. I need the support. And even as a caregiver, when you're looking for help for your child or your other family members, you're still thinking about the other person, but eventually you then come, you realize, gosh, you know what? This is too much. It's too much to carry by yourself and even simply by taking that time out of your day. And I'm not just talking about for therapy, but for anything.
- [43:49]
A
I just interviewed a woman recently who has type one or kid has type one, and they're both on the same algorithm, and she said something about the podcast made her think, oh, I should go back and look at settings. We could probably tighten this up a little bit. Things have gotten away from us over time. So she goes, looks at the kids, settings, adjusts them all, brings blood sugars back where she wants, and then never does it for herself. I said, why not? She goes, I don't know. I said, it would have been five more minutes. You were there, you're already doing it. Why not just do it for yourself, too? She's like, I don't know why I didn't do it for myself. So, I mean, that's always going to be. You're gonna see parents do that all the time, right?
- [44:28]
B
Absolutely.
- [44:29]
A
Yeah. Yeah. You know, you make a meal for someone and you don't even eat. You just have the scraps while you're cooking or something like that, and you're like, it's okay as long as they're okay. Like that. That kind of stuff is always gonna be. But you have to. You have to find a way to step back. And. And I have a real serious question that you're initially gonna think is me joking around, but I am absolutely not. Okay.
- [44:49]
B
Okay.
- [44:50]
A
As married people, intimacy and sex is really important. Except when all this stuff starts happening as one of the first things to go out the window, you know, it's not fun like it was when you were young anymore. Like, that just was gonna happen. By the way, whether your kid gets diabetes or not, that's gonna happen one way or the other. But it's. It's. It's not gonna feel like you're in the back of a car and we're 16, and this is crazy, you know, But. But it's still Very important. Like even just like skin on skin contact, like holding hands or like rubbing people's backs or something, all that stuff starts to drift away when you're pissed and we're tired or tired. And I'm going to generalize here, you could make me pissed or tired or all the things. And then Erica asked me if I wanted to have sex and I would 100% say yes. But it doesn't seem to work the same way for ladies sometimes. And so then that feels like rejection for the guy. And I'm sure women feel terrible because they're not getting the things that they need to feel like they want to have sex either. I don't know how to fix this. Like, I don't know what to say to people. Obviously it's also, I mean, maybe I'm wrong, but I also think it's a little bit of nature trying to say like, well, you already made babies, we don't need you to keep doing this. Like, so maybe your desire drops to begin with, but then all this stuff happens on top of it. You can't even find the fun part of it, let alone the emotional like part of it. So I don't know, like, is there, is there a thing people should be looking at for that?
- [46:22]
B
And I think it's interesting that we bring this up in kind of our self care topic, the physical intimacy. I think we do often think in with your partner that it has to be, it has to be sex, but it doesn't always have to be, particularly if that's gone out the window and has been out the window for a long time. To go back to just saying, let's just sit on the couch and hold hands while we scroll. Right. Or just the skin to skin contact or hey, will you scratch my back tonight? And then you take turns. So starting small, reintroducing that into your relationship can be really significant and just reminding each other that a, it feels good. And then also you remind yourself that you're there for each other, not just, you know, emotionally, but physically. And sometimes those smaller physical, intimate intimacy moments can lead to one partner feeling more connected emotionally, which then may lead to the next step physically, if that makes sense. Right. Sometimes stereotypically, women want to feel connected emotionally before having sex or being physical.
- [47:38]
A
Sure.
- [47:39]
B
But then for the opposite, as you were saying, you know, the, the, I
- [47:43]
A
could do it in the mall if my mom was watching. I think that's the point.
- [47:46]
B
Yeah.
- [47:46]
A
Yeah. So, so, right.
- [47:49]
B
Oh my gosh. Yeah, that one made me blush. So they, the. And obviously in those stereotypes, sometimes there is truth. But I think starting small, I think just like with anything, with self care, with. With exercise, with doing something, we think, well, I gotta. I gotta go run for an hour even though I haven't walked for 10 minutes, and we gotta start having sex again even though we haven't held hands or kissed or hugged in weeks or months.
- [48:19]
A
Yeah.
- [48:19]
B
So just kind of going back and like, as if you were dating. I mean, I don't know. Old school, like, starting over slowly.
- [48:26]
A
Kissing is so much fun. But it does feel like a thing you do when you're younger that wanes as you get older, which doesn't make any sense because it's free and easy and people like it. So it's. I listen, I can give my perspective. I can say that when intimacy leaves, it feels like rejection. And when you're trying so hard in other aspects of your life, it's even harder because you're like, I'm a good person. I. I'm a good parent. I'm here. I'm not high, I'm not drunk, I'm not gone, I'm not cheating, and I'm still not the right thing for this decision. That's hard. That's difficult. So where I get where women can feel the way they feel, like you said, generally speaking, I think I've spoken to a lot of guys privately. That's how guys feel. They don't say it, and I don't think women expect that.
- [49:19]
B
Mm.
- [49:19]
A
Right. But it feels very much like you feel like a little kid and somebody told you they're not interested in you. Like, that's. That's how it feels. So I don't think most women would look across the room with her husband and think he feels rejected. I think they might think, well, he wants to get laid and I'm not up for it. Now he's pouting. But that's not how it feels. So.
- [49:40]
B
Yes, yes. And. And how amazing. I know this would be hard. It can be challenging to then articulate that. Right. To. To your partner.
- [49:50]
A
Oh, because we're boys. So it's going to come out. I'd really like to have sex, whatever.
- [49:55]
B
Whether you're the. The, you know, whatever gender, you are experiencing that. Because then guess what? What does that do? That then bridges the emotional connection, intimacy. To be able to say how you're feeling in the moment, which is hard.
- [50:09]
A
But Erica, couldn't it also, if I just expressed how I feel, then make my, like, my partner feel like, oh, I'm letting him down and Then that's worse. And then we spiral, too. Like, there's. Everyone's got to, like, I don't know. Like, I, I don't know. I don't know how to. Like, obviously these are things that have been talked about for eons, but, you know, between people, this is not like a new story. Obviously. I hear women in their 50s who are getting divorced talk about, I can't wait to meet a man who. And then they list all the things that they, that their husband they feel isn't. And you hear guys say, I, you know, that are divorced. Like, I can't wait. I'm gonna meet a younger girl who's more interested in being intimate. Like, it's just, it's like, I mean, this is not a new story, but if you're trying to keep your life together and you're trying to raise a child with diabetes and all this stuff is happening, I'm just going to come out and say, if you just bang once in a while, things will be better.
- [51:05]
B
That's your, that's your pro tip.
- [51:06]
A
I don't think anybody needs to be in love for 10 good minutes to make everything a little better for everybody. As long as we're all trying equally. You understand what I'm saying? Can't be selfish. I don't know, maybe I'm wrong. But you go ahead and pull a thousand guys, I bet you I know what answers you're going to get. You want me to smile more? I know how to make that happen. But then, but, and, but that's difficult because it's such a simple thing and it is accurate. I'm, I'm gonna just go out on a limb here and tell you it's a pretty accurate statement. I don't know, that, that generally speaking, women have, like, a simple thing that could accurately elevate their mood so easily. Like, seriously, if my wife and I had sex now and then she asked for an in ground pool three hours from now, I guarantee I'd be like, I don't know why we shouldn't get a pool. That sounds like a terrific idea. I've been arguing against the pool for 20 years. She just didn't know how to ask for it. Like, so. Oh, my gosh, no. Not that I'm in charge and she's not, but, like, I'm not joking. Like, I swear to you, a tiny bit of intimacy right now, there's literally nothing that would ruin the rest of my day. I would be if I had a car accident and they were pulling me out And I was going to be okay. And the guy's like, how's it going? I'd be like, I had sex earlier today. Everything's fine. We can buy a new car. I don't know. I'm trying to make a point. You guys got to take care of yourselves. I think this is a big part of it. I don't think anybody's talking about it. So, you know, your thoughts will probably be more professional.
- [52:36]
B
No, I think. But even in. As you're listening to this, if you're feeling like, you know, gosh, this is us. This is our, you know, our marriage, our relationship. And sometimes it feels more complicated than just, let's just go have sex and it'll fix everything. Sometimes it is simple as. As that. And sometimes it's really complicated. So then maybe you're. If you. Even if you feel like, gosh, I don't even want to hold hands with this person. I don't want to kiss, I don't want to hug, then I would look at. Okay, is it. What are the deeper issues going on? It's been a pattern, all those things.
- [53:08]
A
Yeah, of course. I mean, if you're having some visceral hate of another person, I'm not saying you should just swallow that and go have sex. I'm saying if you're in, like, a regular, reasonably, like, common situation where you're, you know, you love each other and you just. These things have happened and you've drifted away. Like, I don't, you know, I don't know, like, it. It's. I mean, at the very least, it's free and it's worth a shot. Not like you got to buy a pool. You know what I mean? You know, you got to get a fence. If you get an inground pool, you have to get a fence, you got to get a pool, ruins your yard for two years. These are the reasons I'm against it. They're very expensive. That's the other idea.
- [53:46]
B
Yes.
- [53:47]
A
Anyway, I love our conversations, and yet at the end of every one of them, I'm like, I don't know if any of this is fixable. So when there is no real light switch answer. What is the answer to waking up tomorrow and it all just feeling like it's worthwhile and a good experience for you? What do you think about that? What is your mantra? What keeps you marching forward?
- [54:16]
B
Gosh, I think being present in the day, kind of having hope and trust that I am good enough and I'm going to do the best I can today. I Think, yes, we have future goals, we have future worries. When we get caught up and stuck in all of that, it's hard to then come back to just being present. Right. And so trusting that you are like, as a parent, I'm thinking about myself as a parent and then also as a type one. I'm going to take it one day at a time. I'm going to do the best I can. I'm going to ask for forgiveness when I make mistakes for my. Towards myself and towards others, because I am going to make mistakes all the time.
- [55:02]
A
Yeah.
- [55:02]
B
I think there's this element too, of, you know, balancing chronic illness is. It's real, it's serious. Diabetes is really serious. And weighing. Holding that, but also holding that, like, it hasn't brought me down. So I'm going to. I'm going to take it seriously. I'm going to do the best I can, and I'm not going to live in that space, you know, going back to, like, that scale. Right. That. Yes. It's not going to stop me from everything. I'm going to do all things I want to do, and I need to really take it seriously. And when one of those things gets off balance, then that's when emotionally you start to spiral a little bit.
- [55:41]
A
Yeah. So for me, I grew up, like, not drinking or getting high, so I don't have a. I'm not like a thrill seeker to begin. I do drive a little fast for dopamine, if I'm being honest. But. But, you know, what is that thing that makes you, like, say, this was a good day and I was exhilarated enough to want to go do it again, like, that kind of thing. For me, it's helping people, like, whether they're people in my life or like, you guys or anybody I meet along the way, I get a little charge out of people doing well, and I like facilitating that, like, like on some level. Right. And so. But there are plenty of people whose lives don't, like, lend those things, and they are thinking, like, I just got to get through this day and, and get a drink because that's where I'm going to get my zip from or I'm going to get high, and that's where I'm going to get my. My thing from. You know, I know that. I mean, listen, it's a. It's a human. It's part of the human condition. But, like, you need to find something that, like, jolts you up a little bit, you know what I mean? Makes you happy to, like, to be doing what you're doing. And, and that can be difficult to find that thing. I've shared on here before. People ask me, what are you going to do after you retire? And I, It's a, it's a sad question to me. I don't, I'm like, oh, God, like, I don't know, like, I'm pretty good at this. Can I keep doing this? You know? And they're like, well, what about for yourself? And you're. Oh, I don't know. You know, like, that's, that's the thing that. I think if we could all answer that question, it would be, it would be valuable for us and it would help your self care and it would help your parenting and it would help diabetes and it would help everything if you knew what it was that made you happy. Anyway, good luck figuring that out.
- [57:22]
B
Yes. Well, and I think, yeah, but like having that sense of purpose calling in life. Right. And how is that need being met? And is it. Do you have a faith or spirituality that is grounding you? Do you feel like you're. Yeah. You're just grinding it out day to day. And that's totally understandable, particularly in the newer stages. Right. You're just like certain survival mode and reminding yourself that that will, that survival mode will end.
- [57:53]
A
So not being a, A particularly religious person, and by that I mean, I'm not a religious person. Is that one of the things that people use religion for? Like, I guess so. Right. Like, I never thought about that. But purpose, like, like a reason why.
- [58:09]
B
Yes.
- [58:09]
A
Yeah. Yeah.
- [58:10]
B
Yes.
- [58:10]
A
Okay.
- [58:11]
B
Yes.
- [58:11]
A
That's interesting. I, I know that seems very obvious now that I think about it. It is really obvious. I just never really considered that before because it's never been a part of. It's never been a part of how I've motivated myself, I guess. Oh, it's interesting. Okay. Well, I, I appreciate you very much, obviously doing this, and I'll talk to you next time.
- [58:31]
B
Likewise.
- [58:31]
A
Yeah. Thank you.
- [58:32]
B
See you next time.
- [58:33]
A
Bye.
- [58:33]
B
Thank you. By.
- [58:43]
A
I hope you're enjoying the parenting series. If you are, please share it with someone else who you think might also enjoy it. Thanks so much to Erica, ericafoursy.com and of course to U.S. med for sponsoring this episode. Usmed.com juicebox head over there right now. Get all your supplies from U.S. med. Let them just send them to your door. They'll just show up out front. You'll be like, oh, but is that insulin pumps? Yep. And that's it. That's all I gotta do. It's amazing. Usmed.com juicebox Check out the Diabetes Pro tip series between episode 1000 and 1026 make your management easier. Get your A1Cs your time and range and your health where you want them with the Diabetes Pro Tip Series from the Juice Box Podcast. And don't forget about the private Facebook group juice box podcast type 1 diabetes over 43,000 members. There's a conversation happening right now that would interest you. Thank you so much for listening. I'll be back soon with another episode of the Juice Box Podcast.