ENCORE: Contouring And Crying

Summary

Karma & Chaos with Kail Lowry & Becky Hayter

Episode: ENCORE: Contouring And Crying
Air Date: October 7, 2025
Host: PodcastOne

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Episode Overview

In this lively encore episode, best friends Kail Lowry and Becky Hayter rekindle their chemistry while discussing the unapologetic realities of life in their 30s. Through candid stories, hilarious banter, and thoughtful listener engagement, the pair traverse topics from sleep envy and beauty routines to medical residency, LGBTQ+ family representation, flakiness in friendships, and the trials of motherhood. The episode masterfully balances humor with vulnerability, embodying the show’s ethos—embracing both the karma and chaos of modern adulthood.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Rekindled Friendship and Morning Chaos

• Setting the Scene: Becky jokes about being woken up by Kail to watch her get ready, expressing envy over Becky’s deep-sleep abilities. Kail admits to being restless, setting an early, offbeat energy.
  • Quote:
    • “You sleep like Sleeping Beauty.” – Kail (01:34)
    • “What’s it like to be God’s favorite?” – Becky (01:57)
• Laughs & Roasts: Becky teases Kail about needing a hair wash, leading to a mock-spiral and playful storytelling about the challenges of self-care.
• Camaraderie: Despite the chaos, they appreciate their support systems ("shout out to the team for making her look presentable" – Becky, 02:16).

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2. Medical Match Day, Doctor Smarts, and Street Skills

• Match Day Explained (04:07–08:19): Becky brings up Match Day—the system matching medical students with residencies—prompting a candid exploration of the fairness and logistics behind it.
  • Quote:
    • “You’re telling me these people spend X amount of years … just to not be able to pick what they go into?” – Becky (04:17)
• Fairness and Placement Debated: Kail is incredulous at the randomness, wanting more autonomy in placement, while Becky explains the benefits of broad doctor coverage.
• Personal Insights:
  • Becky shares how her partner, Leah, is a physician assistant, marveling at her memory and the rigors of medical education.
  • The friends riff on which specialty they’d pick, ultimately admitting neither feels “smart enough” for med school.
• Common Sense and Doctors (09:56–11:08):
  • The duo hilariously debates whether doctors can have both book smarts and street smarts, with anecdotes on family members lacking “street skills.”
  • Quote:
    • “Have we ever met a well-rounded doctor who has both street skills and smarts?” – Kail (10:18)

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3. New York Antics, Naked Encounters, and Shared Memories

• Wacky NYC Story (11:17–12:18): Kail shares a wild encounter of witnessing a naked man in the street—a prototypical chaos story that encapsulates their dynamic.
  • Quote:
    • “He got out of the driver’s side of that car with his dick flopping. It was big. Hung like a horse.” – Kail (11:55)
• They reminisce about being in New York for "Teen Mom" and randomly meeting Colin Kaepernick.

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4. Food Fads & Food Poisoning

• Matcha Debate (15:24–16:35): Becky rails against the matcha trend, describing it as “liquid with a little bit of grass and dirt.”
  • Quote:
    • “It tastes like dirt. … and grass.” – Becky (16:07)
  • The duo investigates different matcha recipes, concluding “authentic” matcha does taste earthy, not like Starbucks’ version.
• Food Poisoning Struggles (16:35–17:11):
  • Becky shares her first-time food poisoning ordeal, expressing empathy for Kail’s past experiences.
  • Discusses the added fear when her pregnant partner Leah faced similar issues.

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5. Bilingual Households and Parenting

• Spanish at Home (18:14–20:03): Kail talks about her beloved nanny (who only speaks Spanish), her motivation to help her kids be bilingual, and the challenges of non-native Spanish speakers keeping up.
  • Becky recalls navigating a “firefighter” language mix-up at Kail’s house (“bombero” = firefighter, 19:35).
• Parenting Mental Health: Isaac's school offers mental health days, leading to anecdotes about kids home, kitchen chaos, and a visit from the fire department.

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6. Letting Go: Outgrowing Baby Gear

• Baby Gear Cleanout (21:18–22:16): Kail describes giving away baby items as she retires from “having babies,” marking a bittersweet milestone.

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7. Community Feedback: Navigating LGBTQ+ Parenting Concerns

• Listener Responses & Representation (26:48–34:08):
  • Becky reads heartfelt messages about queer family visibility in schools, acknowledging both hopeful and painful real-world experiences.
  • Quote:
    • “Kids don’t care... The people that don’t get it are the people that are trying to control the narrative for children.” – Becky (28:55)
  • One story recounts a child being called a liar for having two moms, and a daughter bullied about her mothers’ sexuality, illustrating the difficulty of nontraditional families (29:25–30:56).
• Inclusivity in Curriculum: Both hosts argue for mandatory exposure to diverse family structures in schools, for all types of nontraditional families.
• Intersectionality: Discussions expand to biracial identities (for Kail’s children), the complexities of white-passing siblings, and the harms of colorism within communities.
  • Quote:
    • “A family doesn’t have to be the traditional one schools still want to pretend exists.” – Kail (33:08)

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8. Facebook Group Antics & Threesomes

• Facebook Community Shenanigans (35:30–37:32):
  • Becky shares a voice memo about someone in their Facebook group seeking a third for a threesome.
  • Both hosts riff on becoming “chaos dating” moderators and supporting open, judgment-free exploration.

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9. Food Allergies in Motherhood

• Listener Question: Food Allergies (43:01–46:58):
  • A Nebraska mom writes about her child’s multiple severe allergies; both hosts empathize, relate to eczema, and discuss the isolation of strict dietary restrictions.
• Resources & Community: Hosts suggest starting a support thread in the Facebook group for other families navigating allergies.

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10. Friendships: Flakiness, Boundaries & Self-Respect

• Listener Question: Flaky Friends (48:43–53:44):
  • Becky reads a message about handling a chronically unreliable friend, leading to a nuanced discussion of intent versus capacity.
  • Becky says persistent flakiness is a friendship red flag, and Kail describes her evolution from flakiness to honesty post-therapy.
  • Quote:
    • “If it’s a consistent thing … I have to distance myself from people that are too flaky. I have to stop inviting them to do things because it hurts my feelings.” – Becky (50:48)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "You sleep like Sleeping Beauty." – Kail (01:34)
• "What’s it like to be God’s favorite?" – Becky (01:57)
• “You’re telling me these people spend X amount of years ... just to not be able to pick what they go into?” – Becky (04:17)
• "Have we ever met a well-rounded doctor who has both street skills and smarts?" – Kail (10:18)
• “He got out of the driver’s side of that car with his dick flopping. It was big. Hung like a horse.” – Kail (11:55)
• “Kids don’t care ... the people that don’t get it are the people that are trying to control the narrative for children.” – Becky (28:55)
• “A family doesn’t have to be the traditional one schools still want to pretend exists.” – Kail (33:08)
• “If it’s a consistent thing … I have to distance myself from people that are too flaky. I have to stop inviting them to do things because it hurts my feelings.” – Becky (50:48)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Waking Up, Beauty Routines, and Hair Drama: 01:19–03:41
• Match Day / Medical Residency System: 04:07–08:19
• Doctors, Memory, and Street Smarts: 09:56–11:08
• Naked NYC Story & Chaos: 11:17–12:18
• Matcha Debate / Food Fads: 15:24–16:35, 40:23–41:39
• Food Poisoning Tales: 16:35–17:11
• Parenting, Mental Health Days, Fire Department Incident: 17:11–20:45
• Baby Gear Cleanout, Letting Go: 21:18–22:16
• LGBTQ+ Family Representation in Schools: 26:48–34:08
• Facebook Group Threesome Post: 35:30–37:32
• Food Allergies in Kids: 43:01–46:58
• Managing Flaky Friendships: 48:43–53:44

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Episode Tone & Final Thoughts

Kail and Becky maintain their signature blend of irreverent humor, vulnerability, and compassion. They move easily from roasting each other about sleep and hair to fielding listener stories about family, identity, and friendship. The episode showcases why Karma & Chaos stands out: raw honesty, laughter, relatability, and the affirming reminder that “the most thing that [you] needed... was a wake-up call” (Kail, 02:35)—whether that’s about hair, family, or the messiness of adulthood.

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Engage with the Hosts:

• Send stories to [e-mail]
• Becky: @hater25, beckyhater.com

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(Advertisements, sponsor messages, and outros have been excluded for content focus.)

Transcript

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[Becky Hater]

That's okay.

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[Becky Hater]

Some labeled no ding decline, which means.

[Kale]

If you're not approved, they won't hurt your credit scores.

[Becky Hater]

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[Kale]

Applying for Noting Declined cards won't hurt your credit scores if you aren't initially approved.

[Becky Hater]

2025 Experian experience. Good morning, good evening, good day, Shut the up.

[Kale]

Welcome to Coffee Comp. I mean, welcome to karma and chaos.

[Becky Hater]

Just if it seems like things are off, it's because it is. Because Kale has woken me up from my slumber to watch her get ready.

[Kale]

You sleep like Sleeping Beauty.

[Becky Hater]

It's funny because that sounds really nice, but the way that you delivered it sounded like you were gonna be mean.

[Kale]

Well, I am gonna be mean because nobody else I know on this entire planet sleeps as well as that. Like, you lay down on your back and you sleep peacefully the entire night and you don't move.

[Becky Hater]

What's it like to be God's favorite?

[Kale]

Truly, I was tossing and turning all night long.

[Becky Hater]

I know.

[Kale]

Every time. Did I wake you up?

[Becky Hater]

No.

[Kale]

Every time I tossed, I woke up.

[Becky Hater]

Because of the sirens outside, not because of you and the fighting. There was fighting? Yeah. There were people screaming outside our of our window. Anyway, so that is why things might feel a little funky. It's early. We have Stevie and Kristen here doing kills, makeup and hair shout out to the team for making her look presentable when otherwise she did not you.

[Kale]

Why? No. Let me tell y' all a story. So I last week was in an insane week, had a blowout. Taylor's on maternity leave, get a blowout. Becky comes to stay with me and she's like, you need to wash your hair. And I go, so I shower, I wash my hair. And she goes, I'm so glad you washed your hair. I am spiraling and I just need a minute. And like, the last thing that I needed, but also the most thing that I needed, that I needed really bad, was a wake up call. And that was it. But, like, I. There's a time and a place. Rebecca Hater. And I was going through it. Okay.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah. I have a hard time finding those times and places. There's no better than. There's no better time than right now.

[Kale]

Yeah. So I washed my hair. And it was always back to being great in the world.

[Becky Hater]

Now she's a brand new person here at 8am in the morning. Coming at you live from New York City.

[Kale]

Off.

[Becky Hater]

How many times are you gonna say that? You've never said that ever to me in an episode, and now you've said it three times.

[Kale]

Well, when you've hit a nerve, I guess so.

[Becky Hater]

All right, we're on our lesbian today with the boys, AKA the boys.

[Kale]

So why would she say that?

[Becky Hater]

I found something very interesting. I was reading on Tick Tock.

[Kale]

You were. You were educating yourself through Tic Tac.

[Becky Hater]

So you know how it is. The season of Match Day.

[Kale]

Match.

[Becky Hater]

It is the season of match day where all the doctors get matched with their residencies.

[Kale]

Oh, cool. That's cool.

[Becky Hater]

And so I think I saw that.

[Kale]

On Grey's Anatomy before.

[Becky Hater]

I don't think so.

[Kale]

Oh, somebody. I definitely have heard of it.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah, it's. I mean, it's like a pretty big social movement on the interweb of people getting matched with where they're gonna do their residency after they go through med school. Anyway, the. It was. It was interesting because I was reading the comments and someone made a comment like, you're telling me that these people spend X amount of years of their life just to not be able to pick what they go into. Like, they get matched with the program and specialty that they go into. And I was like, wow, that's really. And then someone commented, we don't need 90 of doctors, don't need to be plastic surgeons and match it. Like, when it. It being chosen for them helps make sure that there's doctors spread out around the entire country equally and make sure that there's doctors spread out around the different specialties equally. And I thought that was very interesting.

[Kale]

I understand that, but I don't know, like, I could, like a Certain. First of all, let me ask you this. What is the matching based on?

[Becky Hater]

I have no clue. I didn't do that research because I.

[Kale]

Don'T know that if I went to med school and was ma matched to do colonoscopies, I don't know why they would select me for that. Like, I feel as though.

[Becky Hater]

You.

[Kale]

There should be a new system where it's like, you're like, there are X amount of positions in each of these field. Pick your first choice, your second choice.

[Becky Hater]

I think that they do that.

[Kale]

Oh, thank God.

[Becky Hater]

You give your choices. You, like, kind of like military choosing. Right. Like, you give your choices of where you want to go.

[Kale]

Okay, that's fair. Yeah, that makes sense, because you do. We do need a number of.

[Becky Hater]

Not even by, like, specialty, but also by location and skills. Someone score higher to go into the middle of the country and live there. And, you know, but we need doctors.

[Kale]

I know that my. My aunt is a pathologist in Pennsylvania, and she was offered something in, like, Dallas, but she was able to turn it down or whatever.

[Becky Hater]

That sounds like she was just offered a job.

[Kale]

Oh, okay.

[Becky Hater]

So anyhow, that is my fun fact of today, because I thought that was really interesting and mind opening, but it also makes me. The next time I go to the.

[Kale]

Doctors, do they really want to be here?

[Becky Hater]

Yeah. Do they really want to be here?

[Kale]

Yeah.

[Becky Hater]

Or did they get forced here? Also, match day is really emotional because you have some people that are really excited about where they're going, and then you have others that are really sad, and then you have people that have formed, like, relationships, and then they get split up.

[Kale]

Yeah, I could see that. But that's like any. So are you saying they get matched, like, around the country?

[Becky Hater]

Yes.

[Kale]

But then once they finish their residency, can they go back to wherever they're they want?

[Becky Hater]

Yeah.

[Kale]

Okay. That's so fascinating to me. I'm not smart enough for med school, but if I was, I'd probably want to be a. I was gonna say an obgyn, but then I was like, I don't like kids that much.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah. For real. Coming from someone with more kids than everyone combined in the room, I would.

[Kale]

Probably be a brain doctor.

[Becky Hater]

Like a neuro. A neurosurgeon.

[Kale]

Yep. Nope. Just. Just checking it out. I don't want to do the surgeon part.

[Becky Hater]

I think I'd be orthopedic.

[Kale]

Yeah, I could do orthopedic surgeon. Maybe a pediatric surgeon. I'd probably be a pediatrician when I. I'm definitely.

[Becky Hater]

I'm also not smart enough. I'M the person I had to really try, you know, same. And I. Leah is obviously in that profession. She's a physician assistant, which is basically. It's like in between a nurse and a doctor. Like they can provide, they can prescribe, they just can't have their own practice. So we. I dated Leo while she was going through school, which if anyone is dating someone going through med school, Pennsylchool. Shout out to you. It is for the faint of. It's hard time consuming. Anyway. Shout out to all y'. All and shout out to anyone going through it. Proud of you. But I remember I would stop there every once in a while to see her and she would always be studying and I'd watch her study and she'd read through an entire sheet of paper and she would memorize it after one passed through. And I said, what? Like, did you just memorize all that stuff? And she said, yeah. And I was like, I'm fascinated. I'd have to put a sheet behind the person in front of me just to remember everything.

[Kale]

It takes me a really long time to memorize things. Yeah, that's. That's fascinating. Does she have like photographic memory?

[Becky Hater]

I think so. She's so smart.

[Kale]

That's really actually fascinating.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah. And so Matcha, Gail, do you like Matcha? Yes, I do my thing with Matcha. I've tried it a couple times.

[Kale]

Stevie, what the are you talking about? Well, we were just talking about photographic memory. What are you saying?

[Becky Hater]

I had nothing else to say there.

[Kale]

So there was. You have a transition? No, I was just gonna say like people that are doctors probably have really high IQs and actually some of them don't have any common sense.

[Becky Hater]

Okay.

[Kale]

My mom's brother is a doctor and I've heard he doesn't have much common sense. I'm not around him enough to know.

[Becky Hater]

But I would also say Leah lacks a little bit of common sense.

[Kale]

That's so fascinating. Have we ever met like a well rounded doctor that has both skills, like street skills and smarts? Do you know what I mean? I don't know that I have street skill is. Street skills to me is you go out on the street and you know how to act like you know what you're doing on the streets. Like if someone was to come up to your car and say, get out, you're not gonna get out. You're gonna drive away. Like you're not gonna let your get our carjacked.

[Becky Hater]

Okay. Okay. Like you're not gonna go in an open door or go down an alleyway.

[Kale]

Right?

[Becky Hater]

Yeah. Yeah, I bet there are a lot of people. You're not gonna get catfished by somebody, you know, asking to join a business with you.

[Kale]

You're not going to. You know who didn't have street skills?

[Becky Hater]

Don't even say my name.

[Kale]

You know who didn't have street skills?

[Becky Hater]

Who?

[Kale]

When you and me went to. You and I went to New York City and the guy was riding dirty in the streets and gets out of his car stark ass naked, dick flopping all over the place and had socks on. That guy didn't have street smarts. No, we saw him, he got out of the car and I said, can I take a picture of you? And he goes, yes. And he was this clearly like. We came up with scenarios of this man who probably got caught on someone else and was kicked out. All his was in his car. He was start. Like when I tell you.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah, he was, but ass naked.

[Kale]

He had no.

[Becky Hater]

He had socks and shoes on.

[Kale]

He got out of the driver's side of that car with his dick flopping. It was big. It was big. Hung like a horse. I said, excuse me. And he's just. Where. Why were we in New York?

[Becky Hater]

We were in New York for Teen mom reunion.

[Kale]

Yeah.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah. That's when we met Colin Kaepernick.

[Kale]

Oh, I for. Oh, I forgot about him. I hope he's doing well.

[Sponsor Voice]

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[Becky Hater]

Can we talk about matcha now?

[Kale]

Yeah, sure. Sure we can.

[Becky Hater]

So I've tried it twice now and I am just so confused. Concerned for all of those matcha lovers out there. It tastes like liquid with a little bit of grass and dirt.

[Kale]

No, not her calling you out right.

[Becky Hater]

In front of your face. Yes it does. It literally has a little bit of flavor of a little bit of earth.

[Kale]

Can someone please order matcha right now, please?

[Becky Hater]

I. I like to like things that everyone likes and so it really saddens me when I can't be cool and apart. Then like trendy, like, let me go get a matcha. It tastes like dirt.

[Kale]

No it doesn't.

[Becky Hater]

And like grass. Yes, it does.

[Kale]

Okay, can someone please place the order? That's crazy.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah. What? What's crazy?

[Kale]

I mean you eat seafood and it tastes like the sea.

[Becky Hater]

No, I don't really eat seafood like that. Cuz if it tastes Seafoody. I don't like it. Do you eat seafood?

[Kale]

No.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah, I don't like things that are fishy.

[Kale]

Well, you're in the wrong lane then.

[Becky Hater]

Kale is on her lesbian. Anyway, speaking about food, we haven't talked about this. I think it was my karma because I made fun of you for having food poisoning or the stomach bug, and I got food poisoning for the first time.

[Kale]

How was.

[Becky Hater]

Was the worst experience of my life. I wouldn't wish it upon my worst enemy. I. I've never been so panicked not knowing where things were coming out of and having to.

[Kale]

That's awful.

[Becky Hater]

It was so bad. Thankfully, it only lasted, like, 12 hours, but it was so bad. And I've never had that before in my entire life. Worst. Well, better case for me was that I was home when I had it. Worst case is that Leah had it when we were in the doctor, and that was really scary.

[Kale]

Yeah. And she's pregnant, so.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah. That's why it was really scary.

[Kale]

Yeah. Well, going to the hospital. I mean, I told you my story already of Dominican hospitals.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah.

[Kale]

Like, if you speak regular Spanish, it's fine. But Dominican Spanish is a. Is the next level. It's like AP classes, you know? Like, it's just.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah. I don't know Spanish at all, really.

[Kale]

I went to the medical, communicated with my nanny pretty well.

[Becky Hater]

I know. I showed up here yesterday. I answered someone in Spanish, and I was like, damn, I've been at Kale's house too long.

[Kale]

Well, what's so funny?

[Becky Hater]

And I said, what?

[Kale]

So she. For anyone listening, my nanny, she is literally like a mother to me, but she speaks no English at all. I love her to absolute pieces. I love it so much because, as you know, we talked about last week is my kids go to Spanish immersion school. Yeah. So it helps them out. But I posted a video of Valley taking her first steps, like, from her pov. And they're in. My nanny and her husband, who's like, my dad, are in the video speaking Spanish, and they're like, who's Hispanic? Like, what is going on? It's like. No, it's just my mom and dad.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah. At home, Kale does speak Spanish to her, but it's like, broken Spanish.

[Kale]

Yeah. It's like.

[Becky Hater]

It's like white people Spanish.

[Kale]

No, it's a little bit. It's like Spanglish. But I try to encourage as much as I can. Like, what I know I will reinforce. Do you know what I mean?

[Becky Hater]

Yeah. And honest, every year, I go through it. I, like, want to learn Spanish. And then I'll redownload duolingo. And then I just.

[Kale]

Duolingo is. As much as I love the, the idea you can't unless you're in it and you're around Spanish speaking people for a long, like long periods of time. It's just not helpful. Like it's not gonna work.

[Becky Hater]

I totally agree. But I always feel bad because she called me into the room and she kept saying bombero. And I said, I don't know what you're saying. And she's going like this and like, like pointing because Isaac set off the fire alarm. And I was like. And so she got, got out her phone and she looked it up and she was. And it means firefighter. And I was.

[Kale]

Where was I? Where was I? Where was I?

[Becky Hater]

You were in. You were. We were going through all the kids clothes. You were in the bedroom. Yeah. You were in the twin room.

[Kale]

Isaac takes a mental health day the other day. His school, it has a two day mental health day policy. Like you, each student is entitled to two mental health days. So he was like, can I take one saying all that so I don't get in trouble? Okay. He is cooking and sets the. He's cooking, right? Like baking and stuff. And he sets the fire alarm off. Well, because of the.

[Becky Hater]

He was cooking me breakfast.

[Kale]

The, the security system that I have. You don't get to just turn them off. The fire department comes.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah. So that's what she was trying to tell me. And I was like, oh, no, they're not coming here. I turned the alarm off fast enough and five minutes later there was a knock on the door from the fire department. So Bombero was right. Wait, was that right? Is that okay? Anyway, yeah, so that happened. I do have in New York City with me my entire. Carol told me that I wasn't going to be able to fit everything, but I did.

[Kale]

I gave Rebecca Hayter and Leah my entire. Like we went through the baby's stuff. Like when I didn't. Well, I'm not. We didn't just pick through it. Like, we emptied drawers, we emptied closets, we emptied rooms and just three large things, a bassinet extra. It was so much stuff, but it's packed to the brim to the point.

[Becky Hater]

That like it was all like below 12 months clothes. Yeah, like clothes that don't fit your kids anymore.

[Kale]

Yeah, I never will.

[Becky Hater]

Well, we're retired from having babies. Round of applause.

[Kale]

I was gonna have twins again. Absolutely not.

[Becky Hater]

So she didn't. She told me that I wasn't gonna be able to fit everything. She always doubts me. She's never about me.

[Kale]

First of all, you're being way more dramatic. All I said was, I don't think this is gonna fit. That's all I said.

[Becky Hater]

That's what I just said.

[Kale]

No, you were. You're making it seem like I was, like, doubting you. I didn't doubt you. I just was like, there's too much.

[Becky Hater]

Said, this isn't gonna fit.

[Kale]

And then the things made sounds the entire drive here. And Becky was like, I can't do this.

[Becky Hater]

I don't have seven kids causing chaos around me. I'm not used to sounds like I.

[Kale]

Can just tune out most of the time. Like, just like my kids could be doing the most wild. And I'm like, I have no idea what's going on. This. Something behind my seat was, like, flapping or, like, making noise. And Becky was like, I don't think I can do. Because you are some sort of a weird alien freak who drives in silence with your thoughts. Yeah. That's diabolical. That's unheard of. Like, I'm going to drive home today.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah.

[Kale]

And be crying in the club.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah.

[Kale]

With my music.

[Becky Hater]

We didn't listen to music on the way here.

[Kale]

No, we did not. And she almost downloaded fourth wing.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah. I had her stuck in the car for three hours. So anyway, I have three bins to go through in my car. She gave me a bassinet, she gave me a wagon, and she also gave me. We were like going through stuff and there was like a brand new outlet and she was like, oh, do you want this? I was like, yeah, like, shit, that is expensive.

[Kale]

That I forgot that I even had. Oh, I know.

[Becky Hater]

I helped clean out your closet.

[Kale]

That was so crazy.

[Becky Hater]

Outlets are a little bit controversial. Controversial. But I've been on the side of TikTok where like, the outlet has saved the baby's life. So we're pro outlet for right now because I think that they've like, shown to, like, leave marks or, like, brutal or something or, like, hurt.

[Kale]

Well, the thing is that Leah's a pa, so I think that she's gonna know not to put it too tight.

[Becky Hater]

Is she?

[Kale]

Yeah.

[Becky Hater]

She's not like a peds person. She works in the E.

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[Becky Hater]

Anyhow, I meant to say this yesterday. Well, actually let me transition into relative to kids because a couple episodes ago we talked about my fears and how I'm really nervous about my kid. Getting told he can't talk about having two moms and what that looks like and navigating those conversations. And we got a lot of feedback around it. First and foremost, I want to say I love when people give feedback. I love when people give their own experiences. But what I need people to do is open up their mind that their experience isn't the reality of everyone else. Right. Like, a lot of people say, oh, that's not what happened to me. That's not going to happen to you. And that's just not the reality of life. Right. Like, I love. And I'm glad that you like people that reached out. Don't think that my kid is going to go through something, but that's not the reality of life. And I hope to God, or hope to whoever, Rihanna, Lady Gaga, that it is the case that he just, you know, skates by in life never having to get bullied for having two hot moms. And. And so I took some screenshots of some responses that I wanted to read through one, but there was one I didn't screenshot, but this someone messaged me saying how there was two teachers in their school that were getting married, and the whole entire school, like, threw them, like, a bridal shower. Oh, stop.

[Kale]

I'll cry right now.

[Becky Hater]

I know. And so, yeah, it was really, like, just cute to see that a school like, that was open to allowing that love to be shown in a public way.

[Kale]

Yeah.

[Becky Hater]

Secondarily, there was a lot of message messages about how, like, kids don't care.

[Kale]

And they don't look at Creed. You literally talked about it last week. Creed literally said, can you get tattoos like my dad and be my dad? And then Lux is over here, like, you could be our third mom. Like, they don't care. They just want someone to love them.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah. And we get that. Right? That was a very common thread. Kids don't care. We get that. The people that don't get it are the people that are trying to control the narrative for children. What if they're not?

[Kale]

I just. It's so hard for me to understand and to wrap my head around the hatred surrounding the queer community. Like, I don't get it. I've literally seen queer couples be better parents than straight couples. Like, what is going on?

[Becky Hater]

Okay, I'm going to read two different messages that I got. Actually, I. I just screenshotted one. I screenshotted one because this isn't a good one. And I wanted to screenshot it so that I could read through it of a real life scenario of what could happen, which is sad anyhow. So this is. I'm not going to say their names. I don't know if they want me to share it. Her son had to do a project where you had to draw your family. And he was so excited to share with the class that he had two moms, a brother and sister. A little boy called him a liar and said that there was no way that he could have two moms because he needed to have a mom and a dad. My son was so upset about it. He. We talked to him and let him know that not everybody is okay with our living situation. Situation. And that's okay. He went into fifth grade this year, and when asked to do the family project, he asked me if it was okay to only include his brother and sister.

[Kale]

Oh, my God, I'll cry. Mine too.

[Becky Hater]

And myself. Because he didn't want anybody making fun of him for having two moms. It's a really sad world we live in. And my daughter was bullied in middle school. Someone started a rumor that since she had two moms, that she was also a lesbian. She dropped out of athletics for that reason. Girls would say. She would stare at them. Dressing kids can be so mean.

[Kale]

That's awful.

[Becky Hater]

Awful.

[Kale]

That's horrible.

[Becky Hater]

And, like, that's just, like, the reality of leaving it up to. And I know that there's a lot of people that disagree, but leaving it solely up to parents that to educate their children around different families. Education is all based on what's relative to someone, like, a kid's age. Like. But I truly believe that it should be mandatory in schools for there to be children's books. Just read about different families. And not just queer families. Families where, like, adopted families, families that have biracial parents, families where grandparents are raising. Because, like, that comment about it's. You can't have a family if you don't have a mom and dad. Also, it doesn't just hurt someone that has a mom and a mom. It hurts someone that might only have a single parent, might only have grandparents that raise them. So there's just a lot of different. I, you know, ways that family can be. Families can be built. And it's important that there is some exposure, because if there isn't, you get little pieces of that are gonna get beat up by me.

[Kale]

It's not the same. So I'm not comparing. But you just touched on, like, interracial or biracial. Lux and Creed are full siblings. Same mom, same dad, obviously. But they already talk about, like, their skin color because how is Creed so white? And Lux is the complexion that his dad is and stuff like that. And Lux says certain things about, you know, you know, being black or being white. And, you know, Creed is. I worry for Creed because I'm like, he's not going to feel black enough. He's not going to feel white enough. He's not going to feel Mexican enough. He's not going to feel anything enough. And I. So I understand, like, how do you fit into. And then like, I created a really fucked up dynamic with like all the. All the kids, dads and like all the siblings and like half siblings, not half siblings. You know what I mean? So, like, to your point, like, a family. Like a family doesn't have to be like the traditional one that I guess the schools want to pretend all still exist. Like all the families still look like.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah, yeah, I. I've noticed that Lux really likes to identify creeds.

[Kale]

Yeah.

[Becky Hater]

Whiteness. It sparks this memory in my mind on for the haters I interviewed. Linda. And Linda was adopted. She was adopted by white people. She was half black. And she went through, like, an identity crisis of, you know, not being white enough. And then because she got outcasted by those people, she was. Tried to make friends with black, like the black girls in her school, and then she was outcasted by them because she wasn't black enough. So they're like, that alone is education behind. Behind it as well. Like that your ability to welcome people into your friend group or welcome people into, you know, whatever that is, is. Is also why it's important to talk about diversity and just inclusion and. And all the things. So I agree.

[Kale]

Isaac struggled with that. I mean, I'm not gonna say he struggled, but he used to be called white boy all the time by his family members. And it was like, not Spanish, not Hispanic enough, not white enough.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah. For what make a kid feel like we have a lot of colorism and like, racism within bipoc communities because the proximity to whiteness is important in our society. So it's hard. There is a lot of levels to it. Yeah. So thank you all. There was so many kind messages. There were so many people that sent me, you know, personal dms that were telling me stories of hope, of different situations and how things are getting better. While it might not feel like things are getting better, there is a lot of, like, really good that's happening. A lot of people, you know, on our Facebook group that pops off all the time. I'm gonna switch this conversation really fast because I was just thinking about our Facebook group. And. Okay, as everyone knows, we keep talking about. I was at Kale's house, and I sent her a little voice note. A voice memo. I was laying in bed. I sent her a little voice memo, and I saw her the next day, and I said, did you listen to my voice memo?

[Kale]

I said, no.

[Becky Hater]

She said, no. And I said, listen to that thing right now.

[Kale]

Can I play it?

[Becky Hater]

You don't. You saved it.

[Kale]

No, I have my voice notes, like, saved forever kind of thing.

[Becky Hater]

That's terrifying.

[Kale]

Do you want me to turn it off?

[Becky Hater]

No, I don't care. You can play it.

[Kale]

Well, it's just like, what if you died? And I wanted to hear your voice one more time.

[Becky Hater]

That's really cute.

[Kale]

Like, I don't care what you were saying or who you were talking about. I just wanted to hear your voice, you know?

[Becky Hater]

Yeah, you're going to sleep. But there's someone in the Karma and Chaos Facebook group that's. That is asking to get a post to prove about them trying to find a third for their threesome. So I just wanted to wish you sweet dreams with that. Love you. Bye.

[Kale]

Like, what are you talking about? Did they find any prospects?

[Becky Hater]

So I look at. And I didn't approve yet because I was like, I don't know if the. The whole team is gonna be down to clown like this. And so.

[Kale]

Down to clown.

[Becky Hater]

And I said, can I approve it?

[Kale]

And I said, yeah.

[Becky Hater]

And she was like, yes. And so that was approved. And so essentially, we're now, like, almost like a dating app on Facebook.

[Kale]

Chaos dating. It's not legal. We're not dating, and we're not pips.

[Becky Hater]

Sorry. Sorry. Management hr. But I thought that was fun. And I agree.

[Kale]

And if they want to find another karmaroo to. To have some karmaru fun with them. Yeah. Then I want to support that for them.

[Becky Hater]

It was funny because I commented. I said, you know what? Hell, yeah. And someone said, I knew you were gonna be the first person to comment on this.

[Kale]

And I'm Becky, would you ever be willing to talk about your sexcapades?

[Becky Hater]

Maybe when I retire.

[Kale]

Like, you don't want to talk about a foursome at any point?

[Becky Hater]

No. Maybe when, like, because you retire me.

[Kale]

Okay, Sounds good.

[Becky Hater]

You know, so that is a fun.

[Kale]

Story, but it is a fun story.

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[Becky Hater]

All.

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[Kale]

Okay, I'm getting the dirt vibes. Did you mix the sweetener? No, I. I think I've been drinking fake Matcha my whole life, probably. I've been drinking, like, something mixed with something green. Are you drinking Starbucks Matcha? Yeah.

[Becky Hater]

Oh, yeah. That's not Matcha.

[Kale]

This tastes like dirt.

[Becky Hater]

And everyone said that I was crazy.

[Kale]

I would love this if it had other things in it. But this is an earthy vibe. This is. Yes. I. You know what? The whole outfit that I'm wearing is green. So let's go ahead and take a moment. We'll take a picture of, like, all the green things. Because some re. For some reason, I keep doing green, knowing I'm gonna sit on a green couch. Green means money, and I'm about to come into some big dollars.

[Becky Hater]

Me too.

[Kale]

Okay.

[Becky Hater]

Because that's what's gonna reach out to me and be like, I'm sorry for faking the business.

[Kale]

100. She is. She's gonna say, now we can get into real business.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah. And then I'll give that money.

[Kale]

And this is the foreshadowing of me making a lot of money in 2025, period. I'll be able to re up my scholarship fund at my alma mater. So I have a scholarship fund there. I'll be able to put money in there. I'll be able to pay my kids more. I'll be able to just do a lot of things.

[Becky Hater]

What about me?

[Kale]

You might get a raise.

[Becky Hater]

Yes. Yes. All right. It tastes like dirt, right? It does.

[Kale]

I was.

[Sponsor Voice]

I'm not.

[Kale]

Well, the coffee you're gonna like is next to you, so drink that instead.

[Becky Hater]

Here we go, people. We left off. We took a little bit of an intermission. So if things feel. Vibe feels different, it's because we did take an intermission because Becky works a day job. Yeah.

[Kale]

And I was crying in the corner, so just both things can happen simultaneously.

[Becky Hater]

What did you just say simultaneously?

[Kale]

Can you spell Simon simultaneously?

[Becky Hater]

No.

[Kale]

Okay.

[Becky Hater]

Did I say wrong?

[Kale]

Yes, you said it wrong both times. I. We used to do these, like, promos for Teen mom that were, like, behind. Like, we would sit in front of a green screen, and they had us sit. Spell, like, the most crazy words, and mine was syphilis, and I got it correct. We should do a version of that. I'll find the video for, like, an example, and then we should do that. That would be so funny.

[Becky Hater]

I'm not. I'm not partaking. Coming at you in April, Becky.

[Kale]

We're gonna force her to do it. That would be so fun.

[Becky Hater]

I don't know. How to spell. I'm literally the worst speller.

[Kale]

That's why it would be funny.

[Becky Hater]

Spell Kaya.

[Kale]

It's the same front, front and backwards, so.

[Becky Hater]

All right, let me read this. I've been taking screenshots. She. My God, you're.

[Kale]

You're unwell.

[Becky Hater]

I need to go home. Here we go. This is. Someone messaged me and said a topic I'd love for you guys to talk about. It's serious, so don't laugh. Is children and food allergies. Becky is going to have her first baby, and Kale has 7:12. Is this something y' all have ever experienced or have any insight? My middle child is six. He had. He has had food allergies since he was six months old and actually started reacting through my breast milk has been a journey, to say the least. And it's overwhelming and honestly lonely. So to talk about it and see if there's any other women that feel the same way would be nice to hear. I live in the tiniest town in Nebraska. There are cattle yards on all four sides of the town, and I drive over two hours to see a specialist.

[Kale]

Oh, wow.

[Becky Hater]

Just to follow through completely. His allergies are peanut, pork, wheat, dairy, and eggs. Thanks for the wide range of topics y' all touch on. I appreciate the variety.

[Kale]

I, knock on wood, have never experienced food allergies per se. I will say that Creed suffers from eczema big time. And I've noticed that certain things do form. Flare up his eczema. And I mean, it's pretty. Like the eczema is pretty bad. It's not like. Like a mild case of it. Eczema is an allergic reaction to what's going on inside your body. And I think that so many people don't recognize that. So it is your diet, but we have not been able to address this together. So it's like, whatever I do at my house doesn't happen over there. I know it's not the same thing, but no, I. I don't have any experience with the food allergy portion of it necessarily with, like, a specialist. I know that I took my nephew to Disney and he has food allergies. He's allergic to peanuts. Mike was there. He's nodding in the back of the room. We let Disney know, and they were highly accommodating and would literally prepare his meals in different room, like, different kitchens. I can imagine. And, like, I love my nephew to pieces. Like, I. I wouldn't. I do it ten times over, but I'm just like, I cannot imagine how lonely that must feel for parents and for the child as well, to constantly have to go through that. I wish I had more to say. I don't.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah. I don't have any experience with, like, food allergies firsthand. I do know one of my good friends. I just saw, they just had a bit. Well, he's seven months old, but fresh.

[Kale]

Freshy.

[Becky Hater]

He. He is allergic. Started showing signs of. Allergic to dairy, but it was through what she was eating.

[Kale]

Yeah.

[Becky Hater]

Like, she couldn't eat dairy because she was breastfeeding.

[Kale]

Right.

[Becky Hater]

And that scared me because I was like, holy. Your life could just completely change, like, and even like, based on your child's needs. Right. And especially living in the States where, like, our food is just filled with so much and you just have to like, look so closely to see what it's filled in.

[Kale]

It sucks because I think about, like, when I think about Creed, how do we tailor everybody's meals to fit his needs? Because we're. That's what we need to do. And I would imagine for this listener who wrote in, it's the same way. Because certain things you can't. Like peanuts, for example. Maybe you can have like your other kids eat, you know, something that has peanuts, contains peanuts somewhere else.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah.

[Kale]

But at home you have to completely alter everyone's diets to avoid cross contamination or, you know, an allergic reaction or something like that. So I. I could imagine how maybe we could start a thread in the Facebook group so that she. Because I don't have anything to offer. Like, maybe there are other people in the Facebook group that would be able to be better resources for her. And also I'll be following that post because I wonder how I can lessen the eczema flare ups. I know it's not the same, but for Creed, I could at least implement some of those things.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah. And if you hear anything, it's because I'm drinking coffee and I remember someone saying, I'd rather just know what you're doing than hearing it. So I'm sorry. Secondarily to that is the education that you have to give behind your kids too. Like, you have to trust a child and teach them if they have those types of allergies to make sure they're asking the right questions in any moment that they're like their parent is or isn't around. So, like right in school, going on field trips, going to friends houses, whatever that is, you know, they have to be able to know, like, educate them to be able to ask the questions.

[Kale]

They don't die for sure. I, that was like, what? I took my nephew to Disney. Like, knew he was allergic. I think it was to bees, which I had an EpiPen because Lincoln's allergic to them. And then the peanut thing, which is big, actually. Kaden, you know Kaden.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah.

[Kale]

Like, he's allergic to so many things. He's allergic to strawberries. He's allergic to apples. He's allergic to peanuts. Like, can smell peanuts from a mile away kind of thing. Like, very, very allergic. Yeah.

[Becky Hater]

How would our bodies just do that to us?

[Kale]

It's so interesting. Like, what about it is like, your body doesn't agree with. It's so interesting. And like, what did they do? Especially in the 1800s.

[Becky Hater]

Especially because there's natural things.

[Kale]

Well, like, they're coming over here by boat and having to eat, like.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah.

[Kale]

Secretions from the sea. What do they call it? Crustaceans. And they missed out on an opportunity. Creations. Get it? Like, they missed an opportunity here. I like, what did they died. Right?

[Becky Hater]

Yeah. And that's crazy because, like, it's just a natural, like, it's like people are. I didn't even know people could be allergic to strawberries.

[Kale]

Oh, yeah. Anything you could be allergic to water.

[Becky Hater]

What? Swear on my life you could be allergic to water.

[Kale]

Yes.

[Becky Hater]

Sunlight. Grass. Grass. I know, that's. Yeah. Wild. Next. Next topic. Someone sent me a message which is interesting because it aligns with something I did put in here, but it says, hi, Kaylin, Becky, can you guys please talk about flaky friends and how to deal with them? I have a friend that is flaky and I understand that she is busy, but so am I, and I don't think she values my time. I have talked to her about it and she chalked it up to her being busy, but I'm still a little frustrated with her about it. I love listening to you girls every week.

[Kale]

This one's hard because you just never know. Like, I, I have gone through periods of time where I'm flaky. You know that.

[Becky Hater]

I mean, yeah, I do know that. I've never been a flaky friend.

[Kale]

So I, I, it's hard because I go back and forth with it. Like right now, and I've talked to you guys about it on this podcast is like, right now I want to see people. I just can't. Like, I literally can't.

[Becky Hater]

And I think it's the reason for the flakiness too. Right. Like, obviously, if you have kids and you have, you know, high intensity job or something like that, I know people that are flaky because that's just a part of their personality, and I could never be that person. And it also makes me respect them and like them less as a friend.

[Kale]

I have since I went to therapy for, like, four years, like, back, like, straight. Right. I have now, instead of being flaky, I'm just honest.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah.

[Kale]

I'm not gonna say I'm gonna be somewhere if I'm not gonna be there. And I know that I'm not gonna be there where before I would tell people o be somewhere, I'll do something, and then, you know, I'm either overwhelmed and can't make it or I forgot or whatever the reason was. I didn't want to go. I don't give people. I don't set the expectation that I'm going to go.

[Becky Hater]

Do you think that your nail tech listens?

[Kale]

Trina, I'm going be so honest with you. I couldn't make my nail appointment. I lied to you about my nail appointment yesterday. I told you the kids were sick.

[Becky Hater]

I think it's fair to be frustrated.

[Kale]

Do you think that that lie was, like, appropriate?

[Becky Hater]

Yes, I do.

[Kale]

I was just like. Because you called me.

[Becky Hater]

It was just really. No, it was just really funny. I think it is fair to be frustrated with people that are flaky. I think if it's a consistent thing that they do. I have to distance myself from people that are too flaky. I have to stop inviting them to do things because it hurts my feelings. You know? Like, I just don't. I don't want to be in a relationship with someone. Friendship, whatever. Like, with someone that doesn't value my time or doesn't value just being honest with me.

[Kale]

Yeah.

[Becky Hater]

And so, like, I don't really have. I don't have anyone that. In my direct circle of friends, I don't really have anyone that is flaky. I have a lot of people that are busy, that I respect their busyness, and I just don't invite them to do things because it's just not worth it.

[Kale]

But when you say that, you. You feel like they're not, like, respecting or valuing your time. I have a friend that is always asking, like, oh, if you, like, if you want me to come hang or, like, if you want to go do this or if you want to. And, like, I want to, but, like, I can't. Like, I don't have the capacity for it.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah, you're different.

[Kale]

No, don't give me. Don't give me a pass, Becky.

[Becky Hater]

No, I'm not. I'M saying you're. The people around you are different in what way? I don't know how many people around you I don't know about right now, but historically.

[Kale]

Okay.

[Becky Hater]

I don't know how many people around you are true friends to you.

[Kale]

Okay.

[Becky Hater]

Right. So, like, if people want to just come hang out with you to spend time with you, is that a mutual. Like, because you both feel mutually friends. Like, if I text you and we're like. And was like, I want to come sit on your couch just to spend time with you, like, it's not something to double thing.

[Kale]

Right. I don't have to question your intentions of being my friend and wanting to come hang out with me. Where there are certain people who like.

[Becky Hater]

Why does someone want to just come spend time with you if you're not really friends, you know?

[Kale]

Well, so let's talk about that. Because I've done it in my life and I'm sure that other people have done it too. Or like, you notice that, like, for me, we were just talking about one of my exes. I feel as though she placed a. She emphasized her place in my life. I've had friends that emphasize our friendship, you know, emphasizing your place in somebody else's life and like, that's how they feel about me. But that's not. It's not mutual.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah.

[Kale]

And that's a real thing.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah, I. I agree. I think I see that very often that that happens to you.

[Kale]

Right.

[Becky Hater]

And so that's why I just think that your situation is a little different.

[Kale]

You should be careful also, because people will do the same too. I think you have a better to me. Yes.

[Becky Hater]

I don't need any more people in my life, though. I'm good with my people.

[Kale]

I think you're a good judge of character and you can like, sort of like.

[Becky Hater]

Yeah.

[Kale]

Feel out what someone's motives are. I'm not as good as that at that and I ignore that a lot. So just want you to be careful moving forward.

[Becky Hater]

I should be telling you that.

[Kale]

Okay. Yeah, I would agree.

[Becky Hater]

Okay, cool.

[Kale]

Thanks for the TED Talk. Well, on that note, don't forget to email us all your stories. Is it karma? Is it chaos? We haven't gotten one in a really long time.

[Becky Hater]

Or we just lie. We don't do get them now.

[Kale]

We get them a lot and we have not read them. But we want to bring this segment back full time. So let's go ahead and email info @karma chaos podcast.com. we're looking forward to it. It is in the description of this episode. So if you ever can't find it and you're trying to email, feel free to click the link and I love you. Where can people find you?

[Becky Hater]

I love you. Everyone can find me at hater25. I've been stepping my game up on socials so please come follow me. Kale yelled at me and come along for Come along for the journey. Follow for the haters. Becky hater.com See ya. Love you. Foreign.

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[Becky Hater]

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[Becky Hater]

This is my kind of place.

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Hi, I'm Lauren. And I'm Chandler and we're the hosts of Pop Apologist Podcast. A weekly podcast devoted to celebrity gossip, Hollywood deep dives, Real housewives, drama, and anything and everything. Taylor Swift. We're two sisters who make no apologies for our love of pop culture and the fact that a listers have might mean more to us than each other. Join us on your favorite podcast app every Wednesday for pop apologists. Pop Apologists. Your new favorite sister and celeb podcast.

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[Kale]

I swear if to continue this ad, please upgrade to premium plus platinum.

[Becky Hater]

What?

[Blue Apron Advertiser]

No. Anyway, Blue Apron.

[Kale]

This is a pay per listen ad. Please confirm your billing.

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[Kale]

Wait, no subscription?

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