Moose Meltdowns

Summary

Karma & Chaos with Kail Lowry & Becky Hayter

Episode: "Moose Meltdowns"

Date: February 17, 2026
Host: PodcastOne

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Episode Overview

In this candid and lively episode of Karma & Chaos, Kail Lowry and Becky Hayter (using their playful code names Chandler and Lauren) catch up with each other and their audience, discussing everything from bizarre animal facts to deeply personal reflections on friendship, parenting, and the state of the world. The pair oscillate between humor and heartfelt vulnerability—embracing both the wild chaos and moments of karmic clarity that define modern adulthood. This episode stands out for its honest dives into relationship dynamics, generational shifts, parenting philosophy, and impassioned sociopolitical commentary.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Moose Antler Epiphany (00:54–04:16)

• Chandler (Kail) opens with a random factoid—discovering that moose shed their antlers, which sent her into a late-night spiral of animal research.
  • Quote (Chandler, 02:01): “I just never in my 33 years would have ever predicted or could have assumed that this type of animal would shake off their antlers...why would I ever think that?”
• Discussion evolves into word confusion (is it "mooses" or "meese"?), coupled with reflections on how little adult life actually prepares you for managing obscure, real-world situations.

2. Pop Culture & Social Media Moments (04:16–05:34)

• Lauren shares a viral TikTok about people not viewing their friends’ partners as "real people,” likening them more to pets or sidekicks.
  • This launches a lighthearted tangent about “pet insurance for your partner,” and a mock suggestion for future “moose-based” merch.

3. Winter Woes & Homeowner Panic (05:35–07:09)

• Chandler recounts panicking over winter storm advice—admitting she didn’t know what her HVAC unit looks like—and how social media “tips” can stir unnecessary confusion.
  • Quote (Chandler, 06:08): “You don’t need to bully me. I’ve been bullied enough today.”

4. Friendship Boundaries & Setting People Up for Success (07:10–11:34)

• Lauren shares a powerful TikTok takeaway: “Don’t set people up for failure. Don’t put people where they don’t belong.” She reflects on recognizing friends’ boundaries and honoring their limitations, which Chandler agrees with, connecting it back to her experience of lying to friends during a difficult relationship.
  • Quote (Lauren, 07:44): “I never put [pathological liars] in a situation where I needed them to tell me the truth.”
  • Quote (Chandler, 09:47): “You didn’t put me in a situation to lie, but I did anyway.”
• The duo acknowledges the importance of transparency and not expecting people to fill roles that don’t fit them.

5. Being Invited & Accepting Invitations (13:37–16:24)

• Lauren laments feeling left out for not being asked to do things by friends—then tells a story about being spontaneous and accepting last-minute invites, a rarity for both her and her friend Leah.

6. Parenting & Teaching About Relationships (16:24–22:47)

• The conversation shifts to TikTok prompting about modeling healthy vs. unhealthy relationships for children. While Lauren discusses the need for kids to see conflict resolution, Chandler wrestles with the complexity of teaching what she's never seen modeled herself.
  • Quote (Chandler, 17:22): “How do you teach someone what you don’t know? ... I’ve never been modeled a healthy relationship.”
  • Quote (Lauren, 19:09): “Kids need to see you work through problems in healthy ways...if they just see rainbows, that doesn’t set them up for a realistic future.”
• They conclude that instilling confidence and self-worth is as crucial as modeling healthy conflict.

7. Generational Shifts: Sex Ed & AI (27:48–36:59)

• Chandler shares findings from a 2026 Gen Z survey: a significant number are turning to AI chatbots for diagnosing STDs/STIs, with mixed results and privacy concerns.
  • Quote (Chandler, 27:48): “I thought we were being more proactive about conversations around sex...now we are reverting to AI because it feels safer.”
• Lauren adds that use of AI for first-line medical advice is becoming the norm across generations, not just Gen Z. They discuss the pressing need for destigmatizing conversations about sexual health, warning against shame culture and highlighting the dangers of untreated STIs.

8. Child Protection & Political Frustrations (33:34–36:59)

• Lauren expresses intense frustration at the lack of progress on child protection against pedophilia, calling for more decisive action using available technology and resources.
  • Quote (Lauren, 34:21): “We have access to that information—why the aren’t we doing more? Why aren’t things being done?”

9. Sociopolitical Advocacy and Public Figure Dilemmas (36:59–46:25)

• Chandler addresses the difficulty for public figures to speak on political or humanitarian issues—fear of backlash vs. the moral imperative.
  • Quote (Chandler, 38:31): “We want to use our platforms, but...if we say the wrong thing...we lose our entire livelihood.”
  • Lauren urges listeners to separate human rights from party lines, advocating for speaking out “at what cost?”

10. Immigration, Implicit Bias, and Humanity (46:25–58:43)

• A major segment dives deep into the realities of immigration, misconceptions about undocumented immigrants, the deep-rooted challenges in the path to citizenship, and the often-overlooked value immigrant communities provide.
  • Quote (Lauren, 49:48): “If you take out 14 million undocumented people–this country will crumble 1000%.”
  • Chandler shares personal growth, confronting her own implicit bias and the importance of self-education:
    • Quote (Chandler, 43:29): “It took me publicly making comments for me to understand...it was ingrained in me. It was implicit. I did not know that I was racist.”
• Both stress the importance of questioning one’s own beliefs, educating oneself, and offering empathy and open-mindedness, regardless of political leaning.

11. Parenting Reflection, Empathy, and Personal Stories (54:00–58:27)

• Chandler recounts her son's heartbreak when a friend, likely affected by immigration enforcement, disappears from school, reinforcing the episode's emotional core.

12. Book Club: Razorblade Tears & Social Issues in Literature (63:19–67:59)

• Chandler and Lauren recommend S.A. Cosby’s Razorblade Tears for its nuanced portraits of race, sexuality, and fatherhood.
  • Quote (Lauren, 64:09): “It touches on what we were speaking to as well. ... I finished it last night and I cried.”
• Discussion on the value of reading diverse authors and perspectives—plus future plans for book club.

13. Parenting Prompt: Selfish Career Wishes For Their Kids (68:03–73:34)

• The hosts joke about what careers they would “selfishly” wish on their kids purely for their own benefit: Lauren wants a Michelin-star chef (“for personal dining perks”), while Chandler imagines being the mother of a professional athlete (“I love going to sporting events, even though I don’t play sports!”).

14. Karma vs. Chaos: Airplane Lie & Teacher Dilemma (73:49–76:11)

• Listener submission: A teacher “lies” to an airline about all students being deaf to keep a group seated together—only to have their flight canceled and everyone stuck overnight in an airport. Discussion ponders: was it karma or the natural chaos of chaperoning middle schoolers?
  • Quote (Lauren, 75:22): “It does feel a little bit like karma, even though I support the lie.”
  • Both land on: It’s a bit of both—desperate times, best intentions, and everyone did the best they could.

15. Closing Reflections: Empathy, Humanity, and Looking Back (76:11–end)

• Chandler shares plans for a horse tattoo, muses on being “found in the trenches (or hell)”, and both close with signature banter and encouragement to keep reflecting and growing.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Hidden Knowledge and Humility:

  • Chandler, 02:01 — "I just never in my 33 years would have ever predicted or could have assumed that this type of animal would shake off their antlers..."

• On Setting Friendship Boundaries:

  • Lauren, 07:44 — "I never put [pathological liars] in a situation where I needed them to tell me the truth."

• On Parenting and Modeling Relationships:

  • Chandler, 17:22 — “How do you teach someone what you don’t know? ... I’ve never been modeled a healthy relationship.”

• On Implicit Bias and Self-Education:

  • Chandler, 43:29 — “It took me publicly making comments for me to understand...it was ingrained in me. It was implicit. I did not know that I was racist.”

• On Immigration and the American Dream:

  • Lauren, 49:48 — “If you take out 14 million undocumented people–this country will crumble 1000%.”

• On Empathy and Reflection:

  • Chandler (about her son), 54:00 — "He named his friend, and that's all he said—just his name. It's like, just to remember his friend's name."

• On Literature's Social Value:

  • Lauren, 64:09 — “It touches on what we were speaking to as well. ... I finished it last night and I cried.”

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Moose antler meltdown: 00:54–04:16
• Friendship/partner as "pets": 04:16–05:34
• Winter homeowner panic: 05:35–07:09
• Friend boundary wisdom & lying in friendships: 07:10–11:34
• Spontaneous friend invites: 13:37–16:24
• Parenting/teaching healthy relationships: 16:24–22:47
• Gen Z, sex ed & AI: 27:48–36:59
• Child protection & social priorities: 33:34–36:59
• Public figures and political speech: 36:59–46:25
• Immigration, implicit bias, and empathy: 46:25–58:43
• Chandler’s son & lost friend: 54:00–58:27
• Emotional book club: Razorblade Tears: 63:19–67:59
• Selfish career hopes for kids: 68:03–73:34
• Teacher, airplane & karma/chaos dilemma: 73:49–76:11

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Tone & Style

The conversation is raw, unfiltered, and deeply empathetic—with frequent jumps from humor and pop culture flights-of-fancy to pointed social commentary and honest introspection. Chandler (Kail) is especially open about her personal growth, challenging listeners to pursue uncomfortable self-examination and social action. Lauren’s infectious humor and straight-to-the-point advice offer warmth and relatability throughout even the heavier moments.

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Takeaways

• Growth is messy: Both hosts encourage listeners to challenge their assumptions, own past mistakes, and keep learning—whether about moose antlers, friendship dynamics, or biases.
• Empathy is vital: The impact of immigration enforcement, social stigma, and systemic issues is made poignantly real through their stories.
• Community matters: Even small moments—saying yes to dinner, teaching kids honest lessons—are part of building more honest and compassionate relationships.
• Literature heals and informs: Book recs like Razorblade Tears tie personal stories to broader themes of identity, justice, and reconciliation.

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For those who missed the episode:
"Moose Meltdowns" is a sprawling, emotional, and thought-provoking ride—from the surprise of antler-shedding to debates about public responsibility, parenthood, and our shared humanity. Both hosts balance laughter with expletive-laced truth, unpacking the chaos and chasing that ever-elusive karma together.

Transcript

[Lauren]

Why have I asked my electrician I found on Angie.com to bury my pet hamster? I was so moved by how carefully he buried my electrical wires, I knew I could trust him to bury my sweet nibbles after his untimely end. This is very strange, Angie.

[Chandler]

The one you trust to find the ones you trust.

[Lauren]

Find pros for all your home [e-mail].

[Chandler]

Welcome back to another episode of Karma and Chaos.

[Lauren]

Let's try this again, huh?

[Chandler]

We tried to record, and then I had a mental breakdown, and so now.

[Lauren]

We'Re back, and she started crying, and it made me uncomfortable. Good evening, good day, good night. Whenever you're listening to this podcast, we are happy to have you here. We love you. Thanks for joining along in this crazy friendship and journey.

[Chandler]

I love that introduction. Thank you.

[Lauren]

You're welcome.

[Chandler]

Could I ask you a question? This is literally exactly how the other episode that we have to completely scrap went. Did you know that moose shed their antlers?

[Lauren]

Yes.

[Chandler]

I found out last week when I watched a video of a moose caught on a drone shaking its antlers off. And the way that I immediately start researching because I thought it was AI.

[Lauren]

At least you're getting cautious.

[Chandler]

So I'm googling because I'm. This has me up. Why? Why do they do that?

[Sponsor/Ad Reader]

What is the.

[Chandler]

Like, I don't know what's going on.

[Lauren]

We shed eggs.

[Sponsor/Ad Reader]

What?

[Chandler]

And I am shook over.

[Lauren]

What is the what? Like, do you think you know everything about animals?

[Chandler]

Yeah, I do.

[Lauren]

No, let's not bring up the H word, okay?

[Chandler]

No, I don't think I know everything about animals, but I just never in my 33 years would have ever predicted or could have assumed that this type of animal would shake off their antlers. Like, why would I ever know that? Why would I ever think that? Why would I ever. Why would that ever cross my mind? When would that have ever come up in my whole life?

[Lauren]

That's what I mean. Like, why are you so shocked by it?

[Chandler]

Because every single person in this room knew except me.

[Lauren]

I think I just assume anything with horns shed their horns at some point.

[Chandler]

It. It really changed my life.

[Lauren]

You know how big mooses are, right?

[Chandler]

Yeah.

[Lauren]

Yeah, they're big.

[Chandler]

It's interesting that you say mooses, because. Right. Like, I don't have a whole lot of conversations about moose. Right. And. But, like, a goose is geese and a moose is not me. So it's like, I need to go to bed. Like, I imagine hating me, and I'm in bed, blankets up to my eyeballs, and I'm Researching moose. Why was this moose caught on camera? On a. In a drone. Right, Like a drone caught it.

[Lauren]

Cuz.

[Chandler]

Otherwise, how did we learn that they did that? Well, if anyone didn't know moose and me and deer. Not deers, not door. They all shed their antlers.

[Lauren]

Yes. Speaking of animals, I saw a tik tok. Are you looking at me like that?

[Chandler]

I'm traumatized by our first attempt at this episode. I'm traumatized. So I don't know where this is going.

[Lauren]

Were you done with the moose conversation?

[Chandler]

Yeah, I was. I am.

[Lauren]

We could keep going. It just feels like.

[Chandler]

I don't know. I feel. But I will say that maybe the Karma Roos need a moose best friend. So I think our next version of merch should be a kanga.

[Lauren]

And a moose is kanga. Nickname for kangaroos.

[Chandler]

If it's not, I just made it one.

[Lauren]

I've never heard it. So we'll think about it. We'll. We'll take it back to the board. Yeah.

[Chandler]

Okay.

[Lauren]

I saw a tik tok that was talking about how people go after their best friend's partner. And it was funny because it was. It was saying, like, do people really go after their friend's man? Because I don't really see him as a person. I see him like a pet or something. I was like, talking about, like, how are we trying to steal our best friends, man? Like, that's not even a person. Like, that's just like a sidekick. Like, yeah, like, you have pet insurance on them. Yeah. Like, not even real medical insurance.

[Chandler]

Can we just get like. Like a carousel going of all of our significant others as animals? Like, you know that Snapchat filter that's like, I'm a dog. Let's make a carousel of all of our significant others as all of us.

[Lauren]

Like, who are you referring to ever?

[Chandler]

Like, killer network.

[Lauren]

Oh, I'm like, who's us in this equation? You never know.

[Chandler]

I also. So someone messaged me. So we sort of. Recently, when this airs, I don't know what date it'll be, but within the last six weeks, we had a couple major snowstorms. You guys all saw Becky swinging from the pergola like Tarzan in her shorts and busting her ass. And so we. We've all had some snowstorms. And so with that, someone messaged me and they freaked me the out. I'm texting Rebecca. Like, I going to do. I don't even know where my H VAC unit is. Like, I don't even know what that looks like. And she Tells me that to make sure that I keep it clear, to not burn it out and to put my heat on, emergency heat to prevent it from, like, doing something. And I also never knew that, and I just feel like that should be common knowledge. If that is true, you're not explaining.

[Lauren]

It right, and I don't think it's common knowledge, and I don't think it's benefiting anyone because you're just not helping.

[Chandler]

You don't need to bully me. I've been bullied enough today. So let me read you the screenshot so that you can understand what I'm trying to say. I created an album in my phone called Podcast Topic so that I could be more clear. She said, hey, later. Hey. Sharing the info. My uncle, who works in H vac, he retired, he said, put your emergency heat on during the storm. It'll save the unit. I don't know what that means, but I immediately text Rebecca because now I'm panicking because I'm in a situation where, like, I live in the middle of nowhere. If I have to get something like emergency heat or I need, you know, heat, amount of propane, like, I'm freaking out.

[Lauren]

What is turning your emergency heat on mean, though? Thank you for bringing that to the attention of everyone, though. It sounds like maybe it could really good news.

[Chandler]

Maybe. Maybe it could help someone. That's what I was saying. And so if you're in the winter, I don't. Is this airing in the winter? What? Becky, we have lived a year and six weeks. Okay?

[Sponsor/Ad Reader]

Please give us a break.

[Lauren]

Listen, I'm tiptoeing around her right now because I don't want to make her cry again. So I also saw something, and this is a little bit more of a serious conversation just around people in our lives. And it was speaking about how, like, you shouldn't set someone up for failure. Like, don't put them in places where people don't belong. And I really valued that because I. I do feel like I've done that, like, really well in my life. Right? Like, I had. It just sparks a memory. I had friends in high school who I knew were, like, hyp.

[Chandler]

Wait, Hypochondriac.

[Lauren]

No. Pathological liars. And, like, I never put them in a situation where I needed them to tell me the truth, right? So, like, it's like, knowing people's qualities and, like, not setting them up. People who are of value to you. Right? Like, I have friends that. It's like, I'm not gonna invite you to my house four times a Month. Like, I'm not setting you up for that, because that's just not feasible. Or that's not doable for you, and if I did that to you, it would then probably eventually cause friction between us because of, like, the constant. No. Or, like, the con. Like, so it's like putting people in places, like, don't. Like, not setting people up for failure inside your friendships. Like, understanding who they are and, like, learning, like, who they are, because everyone is going to be different. Right.

[Chandler]

I actually really appreciate that. Like, that whole sediment.

[Lauren]

Are you gonna cry?

[Chandler]

No. But. What. I'm gonna laugh because yesterday we were recording Barely Famous Podcast, and we were talking about how I used to have to lie when I was with Chris a lot. And one of the people that called me out on my lies was you.

[Lauren]

Yeah. You talked about me.

[Chandler]

I didn't say your name. I just said that, like, during that relationship, I would. You know, we would. It would be really bad, and I would, like, tell my friends, and they would know and they would want to help me, and then I would go back to him, and then I would. Didn't want. I couldn't tell you guys that I was going back.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

And so then I would have to lie. Well, Kale, what trip? Like, what trip are you on?

[Lauren]

And I'm taking that picture.

[Chandler]

No, I'm by myself. And you're like. No, the. You're not. And you literally came to me to my face. It wasn't even. It wasn't even online or in a text. We were physically in the same room. And she came. She walked up to me and was like, kale, you were not by yourself. Like, I already know the truth. Why are you lying? And it was, like, looking back, it was a really, really up place. But I say all that to say, you put me in a situation. A lie.

[Lauren]

I put you in a situation to lie?

[Chandler]

No, like, you didn't put me in a situation to lie, but I chose to lie. Like, you. Like, I think I did say you put me in a situation to lie. And I meant you didn't put me in a situation to lie, but I did anyway.

[Lauren]

Yeah. Can we cut back to the part last episode where I talked about how I was traumatized from our friendship?

[Sponsor/Ad Reader]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

I'm pretty sure Alessandra was, like, in the other room during my therapy sessions, and I was, like, screaming at the top of my lungs.

[Sponsor/Ad Reader]

It was only the second time I, like, actually really met her.

[Lauren]

We're new people now. But.

[Chandler]

But no, I really appreciate the sentiment because I think sometimes we do it unintentionally. But then there are frenemies who are like, they want something to complain about. They want to be like, oh, I invite her all the time and she never does it. Or not for me. I'm just making up examples. This isn't, I'm not talking about myself, I'm saying. Or like, you know, every time I invite her, she says no. Or she always goes to see these other people but not me. Or that's actually when I've heard before where it's like I'm flying all over the country but I won't go see my friend, right? And it's like, okay, but I'm traveling for work and I'm seeing other people while I'm there for work. It's not like I'm flying to see them specifically.

[Lauren]

Your life is different. Your life.

[Chandler]

No, no, no. But it's just like things like that that I feel like I'm sure that I have unintentionally guilt trip someone or whatever. And it's like, I don't want to put them in that situation. Like, don't put people where they, what did it.

[Lauren]

Don't, like, don't, don't set up people for like failure. Like, don't put a friend in a situation like, you know that isn't for them. Or like don't add trust or not trust, but like, don't set someone up like you when you know that, like whatever that scenario, whatever that ask, whatever that scene is, like, just isn't for them. Right.

[Chandler]

Yeah, no, I get that and I really appreciate that.

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[Lauren]

It was so funny. So I know that I we talk about like my friendships and just friendships in general and I've been complaining or I've just been like really heavy lately of like not being asked to do things and it was so funny. It was like last week or something or two weeks ago my friend Ryan like texted my group chat with Spencer and Luke and said like sent a picture of food, like the food he was cooking for dinner. I was like oh I'm so jealous. And he was like well come over for dinner. And I was like okay. And it was like a Monday. And I like texted Leah. I was like hey, do you want to go to Ryan's for dinner? No pressure but like up like I'm going to go with Bex. And she was like no, I don't think so. And then she ended up like going cuz he lives like an hour and a half away. It's not like you know, next door.

[Sponsor/Ad Reader]

Do you want me to kill myself?

[Chandler]

So sorry Alessandra. I am so sorry.

[Lauren]

I'll just chuck a chapstick.

[Chandler]

Just I wish that literally like tearyhab tried to keep together to get knocked in the head. I am so wants me to kill myself. I am so sorry because if but.

[Lauren]

Like violence someone called H.R.

[Chandler]

No like I. No offense Alessandra, but I wish your your face was on camera. Because the look was like, did that really just happen? Like, I am so sorry. Just really turning things around. Oh my. Are you okay?

[Lauren]

What do you mean? Is she okay?

[Chandler]

It's like my headphones. It did not hurt.

[Lauren]

It's just like, is everyone okay? Do we need. Are we, we good?

[Chandler]

Remember when Lincoln asked if I think I could play football? What? Definitely not.

[Lauren]

No, you'd feel bad. Anywho, what I was saying was like.

[Chandler]

Leah ended up going.

[Lauren]

Leah felt like a little bit overwhelmed because she's not like a last minute person. She's not. And you know, I. I like walked in, I was talking to her. I was like, I've been like, really sad about my friends not asking me to do things. And like, who would I be if I didn't say yes to this? Right. Even though I invited myself as like, kind of. But like, that's the thing is like, I always, if someone asked me, do you think something like, I'm saying yes. And it. In that moment, except for the time.

[Chandler]

You told me no.

[Lauren]

You'Re talking about Lake Tahoe. Okay. And then I eventually said yes. And so it is just again, an insight into like, it takes a villager to be like, to have a village. And like, I. Oh, like just enjoy being asked to do things. But in that, in that same breath, there was something I want to talk to you about.

[Chandler]

Of.

[Lauren]

There was. It was another TikTok of someone talking about how if you're in a super healthy relationship, with which I feel like I am in, you need to teach your kids about unhealthy relationships because it sets them up for failure and like, really getting hurt and like manipulated if they just like, think that people are good by nature because, like, that's what they constantly see in their home. So like, not educating them on like the complexities of a relationship or, or like the expectations of them. And so I thought, I just thought it was like, interesting, like an interesting.

[Chandler]

Perspective that is challenging for me to think about as a parent because. Right. I have seven kids and I don't know that you can teach someone about an unhealthy relationship because there are so many variations and so many factors and it's not like.

[Lauren]

So keep going. Sorry.

[Chandler]

I think that. Oh, I hope I don't offend anyone by saying this. I think a lot of unhealthy relationships stem from people's childhoods and what was modeled from that to them by their own parents and caregivers. So a lot of that stuff is a lot of the toxicity. Not all of It. But I would argue that a lot of it is subconscious and it also comes from confidence, right? Like people who, that I have noticed now in my 30s, who are in healthy relationships comes from their own confidence, their own boundaries, their own individual selfworth, their own all of these things as an individual. The, the healthiest relationships that I know, they had all of those qualities before they got in the relationship. You can't really teach someone. Like, I don't know that I would be able to teach my kids about what's unhealthy when I've never been modeled a healthy relationship to this day, I've never. Do you know what I'm saying? I think. And like starts with your self worth. It starts with your self confidence. It starts with your own boundaries and knowing how to set boundaries from childhood all the way up through adulthood. If you don't have boundaries as a kid, you're probably not going to have them as an adult and then you're not going to hold your relationship to that standard. So like, I challenge that a little bit because how do you teach someone what you don't know? How do you teach someone that you've only known, which is unhealthy relationships.

[Lauren]

But that's, that's kind of the point of it, right? Like, you're not in the shoes of someone that like, has been in healthy relationships around the kids.

[Chandler]

So like, could you give me an example of.

[Lauren]

So like, if Bex, if Bex lives in the house with Lee and I never sees us fight, like, and it was speaking of like, your kids need to see you, like, have disagreements and.

[Chandler]

Like, in a healthy way.

[Lauren]

In a healthy way. Like, they can't just see you be happy and love each other like you. Like, if Bex lived his whole life never seeing Lee and I argue, never seeing us have to get through like, complexities of our, our relationship just saw us happy. Like, that doesn't set himself up for a realistic future of life even, even of friendships, right? Like, of friendships of complications. Like, your kids need to see you like, work through problems in like, healthy ways. Because if they just see rainbows. So like you're, you're. Which you do often and it's understandable. Like you relate it back to your life and you'll never know. No, no, you'll never be in that position to do like to think from that. Because you've been on. In unhealthy relationships historically, I would argue that like you're the triplets, like will grow up in that scenario now. Oh, I mean, like in Just in. In, like, love and nurture without, like, you know, the complexities of, like, what?

[Chandler]

Oh, no doubt. I mean, when Elijah came on to record for Patreon, we talked about that. You know, we've never gone to court, and we. I'm not gonna say we don't argue now about, like, the kids and stuff. Like, the other day, Rebecca was here, and Valley needed to go to an allergist for her peanut reaction. And so I have the kids, but Elijah made an appointment. I get the text that the appointment happened. So Elijah calls the doctor, makes her an appointment. I get the text before he tells me, and then he tells me it's to the p. Like, I find out it's through the pediatrician, but I don't need a referral. And so I'm arguing with him. Arguing like, I probably overreacted because if I would have just texted him and been like, clip it.

[Lauren]

Continue.

[Chandler]

But typically, like, if the kids are around, I don't think the kids have ever seen us argue that.

[Lauren]

And that's what I mean.

[Chandler]

Like, if anything ever was, like, emotionally charged, one, it was me being emotionally charged. And two, flip it in full transparency. But, like, they have only ever seen us be, like, cordial. So in some ways, I think that that's good. But also on the flip side of that, like, you could see, like, a marriage and you think, oh, like, well, this person was with this person for so long, it must be so healthy. And it's like, no, there are unhealthy marriages that are for sure, you know, that do not resolve conflict well. Or they don't talk at all, or they don't whatever. And they live under the same roof. And. And so there's a lot to go into relationships. And. But who's to say what is healthy versus not healthy?

[Lauren]

Who's to say?

[Chandler]

Like, how do you even broach that subject?

[Lauren]

I mean, I think healthy and unhealthy for. Is a different. It's like.

[Chandler]

But I think it starts with instilling confidence and self worth first. Because your kids, no matter how much you talk to them about unhealthy relationships, if they don't have those first, like, what is it? What is the word? Not, like, monumental. Like, those first, like, building blocks develop. Yes. Thank you. The developmental milestones of the confidence and the self worth, you can't really set boundaries and parameters. Your relationships for what you will and will not tolerate without that.

[Lauren]

Yeah, I don't think you're wrong. I just thought it was an int.

[Chandler]

Like, it's very interesting that's why I. I want to, like, dig into a little bit and see, like, the video, the comments and things like that. And if there was anybody else that, like, made videos similar.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

Because I would also love to know. I. I don't want my kids to repeat the cycle that I have repeated, obviously. Right. Like, I don't want them to continue that. But I also want them to look at other relationships in their lives and also recognize that. That just because they're different from mine doesn't make them more healthy at all.

[Lauren]

Yeah. I would love to, like, if you grew up in a healthy environment. Like, what.

[Chandler]

I almost did. What? When my aunt, My dad's sister was trying to get custody of me.

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[Chandler]

Like, I. Like, she raised three great kids that, I mean, just fantastic kids, like, all the way around. And like, I almost was raised with them. So, like, I almost had a healthy chance.

[Lauren]

You know, my dad always used to.

[Chandler]

To say what? Almost.

[Lauren]

Almost always count. Almost only count in hand grenades and horseshoes.

[Chandler]

Yeah. It's like, what, What? Last cigar.

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[Chandler]

Like, what's the cigar saying?

[Lauren]

If you almost hit someone, it's still going to hit them. And then in horseshoes, if you almost hit the pin, it still counts as a point.

[Chandler]

But what's the cigar saying?

[Lauren]

I don't know. Cigar.

[Chandler]

Close with no cigar. Also, speaking of trauma, remember that episode where you asked me about the neighbors and living with my neighbors?

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

And you said, well, how long was your mom gone for? And I said, I don't know. I re. Shared it to my personal Facebook and I tagged. You asked me, do they have any kids? And I said, two. So I tagged one of the kids and I was like, hey, like, do you remember? And she commented back. So I want to read to you what she said.

[Lauren]

This is exciting. Great journalistic work.

[Chandler]

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much. Okay, so reposted the reel. And it just. For those of you. If you didn't listen, you have to go a couple episodes back. I talk about how my freshman year of high school, my mom goes away to rehab and nobody tells me when she gets out. And she goes and lives with her husband and leaves me with the neighbor, never comes and picks me up. Okay. So I'm there, get kicked out of school. That's how I find out my mom's out of rehab. So I share this to my personal Facebook and I said, do you remember? Her name's Crystal, one of the kids. She's an adult now. I think we're two years apart. So she's like 31, she said. I don't remember how long she was gone for. It's all kind of fuzzy. I have specific memories of us in my room and all the stuff that happened at school for you. I feel like she was gone for a while though. And you're right, no one said that. And you're right, no one ever said when she got out or when she completed treatment. Bizarre. So many wild memories from that time.

[Lauren]

Not an answer, but thank you Crystal for the input.

[Chandler]

Well, it just goes to show that, like, nobody knows if she even completed treatment.

[Lauren]

That's crazy.

[Chandler]

But we know she fell off the wagon.

[Lauren]

But you almost had a good childhood.

[Chandler]

So I almost did.

[Lauren]

Yeah, there's that.

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[Chandler]

This time of year I'm going to.

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[Chandler]

The next thing I have on my list. Okay, let me pull up my album so I can read exactly what it says is fascinating because I'm scared for my children. Testing.com surveyed 2500 U. S Gen Z adults 2500 U. S Gen Z adults in January of 2026 and found 20% have asked AI chat box AI chatbots about STDs and STI and 1 in 10 have asked an AI chat box box to help diagnose an STI or an STD. In these scenarios, AI chatbots appear to have a high misdiagnosis rate. 31 were misdiagnosed. Other notable findings 52% of Gen Zers are seeking a diagnosis shared photos so they're sending photos of whatever it is they're experiencing to AI and asking for a diagnosis instead of going to a trusted adult or to Planned Parenthood or to wherever that looks like. And it says and 92% say they keep they'll keep using AI for STD questions despite privacy concerns. And when discussing STI and STDs, 35% say that they're more comfortable talking to an AI chatbot than a medical professional. I think that the problem that I'm having with this is that I thought we were being more proactive about conversations around sex and sexual education and things like that. And so now we are reverting to AI because it feels safer because adults maybe, maybe don't necessarily make their kids feel safe around talking about these things. And my theory still stands that very very strict parenting will lead to sneaky children and Sneaky adults. So if you're not having open and honest conversations and you're basically like, abstinence, abstinence, abstinence. If anyone does that, I'm sorry, this is not meant to be offensive. So it's. It's concerning because it doesn't matter how much you preach abstinence, Their kids are going to do what they're going to do no matter what. So if we're open and honest and we give them a safe space to talk about these things, they would not be relying on P. On chat bots and AI. And now we're worried about photos going around and you're being misdiagnosed. And now if. I mean, we know, we're millennials, we know that misdiagnosis or untreated STIs can lead to infertility and sometimes worse. So it's like, what are we doing that we're taking steps backwards here?

[Lauren]

So I actually have feelings about this. I work in benefits. So, like, I know the studies that there's more and more studies of not. It's not just Gen Z using AI to diagnose, like, everyone is everyone. Not take. Take everyone with a grain of salt.

[Chandler]

Right, like doctors are using it.

[Lauren]

No, no, like. Like people are using AI as a first level of.

[Chandler]

Of first line of care. Really?

[Lauren]

Right. Like, they're using AI as a first line of care and then making a decision from there. So it doesn't surprise me that Gen Z has like, a higher percentage of doing that as well. The issue is, is that it's not using the proper AI to do it because there are now, like, AI options or companies building, like, a medical care grade. Like, using AI like Chachi Beauty or Gemini. Like, that shouldn't be where you get your medical advice. But. And I'm only saying this is because the future is AI. Like, you are going to speak to AI before you get to a physician in the future. Like, that's the route that it's going. I work in. Like, I know that that's how everything is changing. And I don'. Think it's like, a bad thing. It's just using it the right way. But in the other conversation of teaching your kids about. I agree. Like, you can't teach your kids not to have sex. You have to tell them how to.

[Chandler]

Be safe about it.

[Lauren]

Yeah, how to be safe. The repercussions of it. But I also think that, like, I had a STD scare once and, like, I was like, it was. Ended up being just razorburn. And so I think that there's a lot of just like scare behind STDs of like, oh, or even having a yeast infection. It's like, oh my God, this is an std, right? Like there's or uti. It could be, oh my God, this is an std. So I don't know.

[Chandler]

I don't know. The whole conversation is very scary to think about. And I would be absolutely mortified if my children. I mean I talk to my kids about every thing we know. So to me, I would be mortified if my kids didn't feel safe enough to tell me about a concern from something like that or, you know. And Rebecca and I just had like a pretty in depth conversation the other day about like private parts. Like what to call private.

[Lauren]

Well, there's a lot of shame behind it. 100 and so I think that like, if we teach our kids and start raising our kids with less shame, like, you're bad. Like one in three people have an std. Like, it's like gonna happen. Like it could. It's not like it's some crazy mythological thing that like is can't happen to you, right? Like, it could happen. So it's just teaching, like teaching the precautions of it. Because the untreated STD is far worse than, than anything. I'm not. I'm honest. I don't know. I. I am so, just so tired of like. Because the other thing of it is the concern of kids sharing pictures on the Internet or into AI. I am just so tired of like.

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Like.

[Lauren]

This country of not taking like child pedophilia more seriously. And like, it is so frustrating. It is so disheartening to like, to hear about it, to see about it and it not just being a cold line. Right? Like, we have so many resources, we have access to so many things. And it's like, like, I just saw a video of Tim Tebow because he does a lot of work inside of like, pedophilia. And he showed a map of the United States and IP addresses that ping for searches for child like, pornography. And it's like, we have access to that information. Like, why the aren't we doing more? Like, why aren't things being done instead.

[Chandler]

Of focusing our resources on ice?

[Lauren]

It should be on, it should be.

[Chandler]

On child sexual assault content.

[Lauren]

100 I. I can't even support that. I can't even like, scream that into.

[Chandler]

The, like, whatever your stance is on ice, surely that if you are pro ice, that still does not trump, no pun intended, child sexual assault. Like, I cannot wrap my Head around the fact that we have let it come to like, I can't, I can't. Like you're putting immigration and undocumented people above children. I'm pretty clear on my stance with ice, so I, and that's on my socials everywhere. So same. I. It's really upsetting. I just don't understand how we're not doing more. I don't, I genuinely don't understand.

[Lauren]

I, I cannot. Well, I understand it because of the pure chaos that would disrupt in our. Like, I don't understand it get why people aren't doing anything, but I understand why nothing's being done because everyone's involved. Like, we trace things. If someone is searching and looking at kitty stuff, arrest them. No if, ands or buts about it anyway, that from the AI perspective, like, like them uploading pictures is the least concerning thing of mine. Just because like, unless they're faces, unless there was identical. Because people have all the pictures that they want anyway and they can create all the pictures that they want. So it is. Yeah, man, I, I'm just so tired of life. And like, I talk about this in therapy so much and I feel like the US government should have to pay for my therapy, but for how much. I like talk about the state of this world and I've cried 60 times in January and 30 of them were from the state of this world. And like, I am just so overwhelmed with privilege of like sitting in my house, sitting on this mountain because I like, like I technically don't have to do anything and I'll be fine, right? Like, I'm just sitting here, nothing happening around me, no one affected around me. And like, it's so consuming of like, what can you do more? And quite honestly, like, using your platform, like, I, I've, I've so proud of you always when you use your platform and use your voice to speak out about injustices that are going on. And like, I'm starting to realize that like, that can be enough for a lot of like, for like what you can do in, in that.

[Chandler]

Can I play devil's advocate a little bit?

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

It has been a really challenging situation for me to speak out. Not about specifically like anything involving like humans, but just politically speaking. And it's very challenging to talk about because you guys have to understand as listeners, people that are in the public eye, people that are public figures, some of us do not know what is going on and we don't know what resources to trust and who to believe. And so when we're digging and Digging and digging. We don't want to speak out of turn. And so it's like, we want to use our platforms, but we don't want to misspeak. And then on the other side of that is people who are in the public eye, who make money from being in the public eye, if they say the wrong thing that a majority of their audience doesn't, like, they lose their entire livelihood. They lose. But I'm talking about all public figures. I'm not necessarily talking about. I'm not speaking on ice and things like that. I'm just talking about, like, presidencies and things like that. And it's like, you want these certain people to speak up, and they're not speaking up. And then when they speak up, you. They. You might not agree with them. So now you've lost their trust. So they're doing what you want, but it doesn't align with what you align with. And now their entire. And, like, I'm not saying that's an excuse. I'm just trying to play devil's advocate to explain to people why certain people won't speak on politics.

[Lauren]

I know, but there, I think it's like, at what cost? Right? Like, they're. Historically, until this point, I. I think, like, even for myself, I think that there's been that line of, like, okay, like. Because that at. At that point, you're just speaking out against a politician. You're not speaking out against, like, injustices.

[Chandler]

Right. Injustice. Injustices is a different conversation. Right. Like, you could be a registered Republican and you can still speak up against what is going on with, like. And I just. That is more of my message to people, like, people who are not speaking up. Like, you're not speaking up on ice. You're not speaking up on, like, humanity. You're not speaking up on things that affect every human on the planet. We're talking about humanity as a whole.

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[Lauren]

I think people do have a responsibility to speak up about things.

[Chandler]

No, I'm not. I'm not saying they don't. What I'm saying is I was trying to give people, the audience insight on why some public figures don't. They're scared to lose their entire livelihood. They're scared to lose how they provide for their families. And I'm not saying that's right or wrong. What I'm saying is you're asking them and they. You might not like what they say, and now they've lost your support. And so. But then it's like, well, I don't want to support them anyway. If they don't align with what I align with, I don't want to support them anyway.

[Lauren]

I don't give a. I don't care.

[Chandler]

My kids are Hispanic and black. I have to speak on it. And just as a human being, I owe my audience. I owe my audience. If people don't want to support me because of my stance on it, I don't care if you unfollow me. But some do care. The people that need to recognize that they are racist cannot recognize that they are racist because they do not believe that their implicit bias is racism. I was guilty of that. I have made comments.

[Lauren]

You're guilty of it.

[Chandler]

I. But you have to get to a place where you recognize it. You cannot ag. Like, you can't fix something that you're not acknowledging. When a white person speaks up and says, I'm not racist. But that is implicit bias that has racial undertones. It took me publicly making comments for me to understand. And by comments, I mean, you guys watch Teen mom, right? Like, I don't need to tell you what I've said. I did not know that was racist. I did not know that that was implicit bias. I did not know. So then I get on when it airs, and I'm like, oh, I wasn't trying to be racist. This, that, and the third, okay, maybe I wasn't trying to be. That wasn't my intent. But at the bottom line is that it was ingrained in me. Right. It was implicit. I did not know that I was racist.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

And that is what I'm coming across now that I have started the journey. Well, this was years ago. I started the journey. But now I'm in a place where I'm reading. I'm still reading books on the stuff. Right. Like, if anyone is looking for a place to start and wondering, am I a white racist? Like, am I a person that is white and I'm racist and you don't know. Probably read American Dirt Hood feminism, small great things. Start. And start with those books and then ask yourself, am I racist? Because you likely are. You don't realize that you are. And so you're saying I'm not racist, but. Or, you know, connecting stereotypes with certain ethnicities and cultures and races. Like, you will realize very quickly, oh, yes, I am. And it might not be intentional, and it might not be something that was. Was necessarily taught by your parents. But I mean that's where it all starts too is like you have to have the level of self awareness to acknowledge that you are. You can't really say I'm not racist. Do you know what I'm saying? Because you said people won't look at themselves in the, in the mirror and say I am racist. No, because they don't realize they are. So that's all I was trying to get at. I hope what I'm saying is making sense. I'm not, it's not my intention to offend anyone and I'm not saying that I know all of it. I just know that I've, I've been doing a lot of work on this because it was very eye opening to myself. Just from making comments 10 years ago on TV, I did not know what I didn't know.

[Lauren]

Two things I'd like to say if I may. One, a topic on my list was to talk about things that you said at like someone was saying like well, she said this when you were 17. And I'm like, how do you, you can hold someone accountable for what they say when they're 17, but if they're actively changing throughout their life to be a better person, like you can't keep assuming that that's the person that they are. That's first thing. Second thing, since we already ripped the band aid off, I'd love to just maybe use this time to just educate people. And this is coming from a place of hope. Maybe this is coming from a place of understanding. Because I have a really hard time conceptualizing that like, like there's such bad people out there that they can't grasp the bigger picture, right? So I just want to put a couple facts out there, right? We can all agree that criminals should not be walking freely regardless if they're undocumented or not. Like we have that same nature. Yes, let's remove the dirtiest of dirty people. I don't care if they're undocumented or not. If they have like, like a true criminal violent background, like that should be important to anyone. So like we have sim like common like goals or like hopes from all this. But. And you had, we've. You've talked about this before on, on Barely Famous. But like the process to becoming documented is nearly impossible.

[Chandler]

Especially now.

[Lauren]

It is like it takes 10, 20 years. The only true path to citizenship that someone could really get right now is through marriage. And even in that it's super complex. And like I was arguing, I'm back in my arguing On Facebook. Error. I was arguing with someone on Facebook. And you know, and like, undocumented people don't get access to any type of federal funding, any type of government funding they pay into.

[Chandler]

They do pay into taxes.

[Lauren]

They do pay into taxes. And you might be like, how, right? And I'm not trying to like, shame.

[Chandler]

Anyone, just like, listen, am I'm shaming you?

[Lauren]

No, no, we're not. I like, want you to learn this in like a way that just hopefully you can consume it like, just by living here and existing here. You're paying into our tax system because you're paying rent, you're putting money in, like, you're working. You're buying things like you're pet. You're paying into like our tax system and they can't take benefit, like, benefit from it. So like, in, in people's dream world of taking 14 million people undocumented out, they don't understand the real re. Repercussions that happens to our society if that happens. And like, the, the comp. The complexities of that just in nature are so bad. This dude on Facebook was like, so if they're paying into a system they can't like, benefit from, if they can't travel back home, like, who would want to live like that, right? And like, that's the point, right? They want to live like that because this, it's like what they're doing better.

[Chandler]

Than where they were.

[Lauren]

Like, and it's like a full circle moment. Like, why are like, like, and it's like, hey man. Like, yeah, let's just, let's like, let's redo the immigration system and like, figure out a way to like, I don't give a. If someone like, and this is just me. I don't care if someone's undocumented or not. I don't care why or how they're here. Like, I, I think everyone should like, have the access. As a parent, if you're a parent, you would do anything to like, better your, better your child's life and better their. Your child's safety. And like, for anyone that says, like, just do it the right way, like, I, I, I encourage and do just to like, like, understand the complexities of.

[Chandler]

They can't understand it without examples.

[Lauren]

But like, I'm just try, like, I, I really like people. I'm tired of like, I just want you to see this the human aspect of it because trust me, if all of these people could be documented, they.

[Chandler]

Would, they literally would. They. Immigrants are some of the hardest the, the actually the Hardest. I don't care what, where you came from, immigration wise. I, I don't. They are the hardest working people in America. I have never, I, I would challenge you guys to look to, you know, immigrants. You, whether they're documented or undocumented. You know them, you know they're busting their asses. You know that they're, they're busting their asses. So please explain to me why you think that more immigrant, more immigrants are criminals than they are hard working. Make that make sense for me. They are going to come here and they are going to bus asses to make a better living here than they would be able to do in their, in your. The whatever country they came from. So I just, it is so hard for me to understand what this hate is for. And let's also, the other argument that I've seen a lot is well, other countries will kill you if you go into their countries undocumented. Even if it is true. Why do you want America to be like that? Yeah, we were built off of stone. Like everything is, we're built off the back of everything.

[Lauren]

Like, of everything. And like, and I, this is all coming from like, I just, I truly implore you, if you are listening and you have a completely different mindset to this, I just like really encourage you just to take a step back because like we all want the same thing, right? We all want a safe place to raise our families. Like we all want. Like, or maybe some all of us don't want equality but like we all just want the chance to live like an equal life. Like where we all have those same resources and like give that benefit to everyone else. Like, like life is hard enough. Like we are not enemies. I, I can promise you that. Like we, I hate the government, all sides of it. I have no like, like political affiliation. Just cuz like it's all just. And like we as humans, we as like Americans, we as.

[Chandler]

This shouldn't even be political.

[Lauren]

Everyday people should be more on like the same page than not. And like they're making us hate the wrong people. Like we should be hating them for like, like not like we should be hating the people up top and like billionaires and all these things. Like we shouldn't be hating each other and we shouldn't be hating undocumented people because I can promise you they're like the value that they have here is just insane. Like there's, I can't stress like you take out 14 million undocumented people, this.

[Chandler]

Country will crumble 1000%.

[Lauren]

And so like, like, that is not the answer. Let's.

[Chandler]

I'll tell you what, I. A little bit more humanity there.

[Lauren]

Because it's really frustrating to constantly hear.

[Chandler]

Like, immigrants be talked about for their labor.

[Lauren]

Yeah, yeah, but it's not even the labor. It's just, they're just like, they belong here. Right? Like, and it's like, and I, and I don't mean it to come off from like, from like a labor, a labor way.

[Chandler]

Like I said, they are the hardest workers. That's not their only quality at all.

[Lauren]

Like, these are humans.

[Chandler]

No, and that's what I'm saying. Like, humanity shouldn't be political. And I think that's the bottom line is that immigrants, undocumented, documented, whatever that looks like, should not be a political stance. It should not be. Oh, if you are in favor of humanity and human rights and equal, you know, equal opportunity for people, that should not be Republican versus Democrat. It's humidity. It's ethical. It's, it's, it's ethics, morals, all of those things.

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[Chandler]

Some of the kindest people in my life are immigrants. Documented, but. Or actually, I don't even know. I don't know the status of their documentation. I don't give a. Yeah, like, the.

[Lauren]

Lack of empathy and the lack of humanity in this all is what is most disheartening.

[Chandler]

I don't care if you vote Republican, Democrat, whatever. I'm voting for human rights. That's like, what it is I'm voting for. Just like everyone deserves a chance to be here and to make a living and to be safe and to raise their family, and I can't. Like, like, I guess a lot of These people maybe aren't directly impacted. They don't even know how they're impacted by immigration. They don't know. They think that UN undocumented people here or even documented people are stealing other people's jobs. Like, that's what they think. They really wholeheartedly believe that. And I just think to myself, like, yeah, my son, you know, Lincoln, he. He had a friend that was also from Guatemala. And we don't meet a whole other. Other.

[Sponsor/Ad Reader]

Other.

[Chandler]

We don't meet a whole lot of other Guatemalans. And so when his friend stopped showing up to school, he cried about it. This morning he came to say bye to me in the bathroom, and he's crying, and I said, are you crying? And he's like, yeah. And I said, what's going on? Like, what's wrong? And he said he named his friend, and that's all he said, just his name. It's like, just to remember his friend's name.

[Lauren]

Yeah, yeah, we.

[Chandler]

Not me and Alessandro crying.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

All day, every day.

[Lauren]

We need to do better. And like, I think I'm happy that we're talking about this because truly, like, prepared for our.

[Chandler]

Just know that it is possible that we could lose a lot of our following. Just so you know.

[Lauren]

And like, I don't want, like, and not. And it's not that, like, I don't want to say that I don't care about you if you don't. Like, I want. I truly want this conversation just to, like, just give it a chance. Like, give your mind a chance. Chance to think differently of how you've been thinking. If you do think like that, like, take it back. Like, if you want to have a conversation with me, why do I happily have a conversation? It's just like, there's this dude that, like, creates fake business or fake scenarios, but puts real numbers for people to call into. Like, this guy put. Built, like a fake ICE number. I saw this and. And it was like, the woman that called was a teacher and she was calling on one of her students because his parents didn't speak English. And. And the guy was like, so you want your. Your students. Parents to be deported because you think that they. And like, and he does it in a way that makes someone feel like.

[Chandler]

Make sure you say it out loud. Say it again. And it's like.

[Lauren]

And it's people like that, right? Like, we are in history books. We are in, like, history books. And it is. Is very apparent. Like, I live so much of my life. Like, I do not understand how, like, Nazi Germany happened. And like, we, like, are it. We are living in. In it. In like, not like direct parallels, but like, it's the same concept, the similarities of it. And like, I just.

[Chandler]

I urge you to just challenge yourself to think. Why do I think this? Right. Like, I think, think that is when the whole. All the comments that I have made in the past came up from, like, they resurfaced.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

I had to look at myself and why the would I say that? Like, what, what made me say. And I didn't have an answer. I don't know where I came up with those. Like, and I don't think I meant it how I said it. But either way you said what I said, I needed to dissect that. Why did I think that way? Well, I don't know. Nobody taught me about. Nobody taught me to hate other cultures or races or whatever. Stereotyping. That was more so I feel like the stereotype. And it's like, well, where did I learn that? Why do I feel that way? Okay, now I have to do the work. I have to read books. I have to look up all kinds of things. I need to figure out where did that come from. But I don't think that a lot of people are willing to challenge themselves.

[Lauren]

And maybe listening to this will change a few minds. I. I've had people reach out to me over the past month of like, you know, I grew up in the Bible Belt. I grew up like, thinking this way. And just like you posting things has, like, made me revisit it. Like, my outlook and like, my thought process. And that's what I just hope to do. Like, if we could just. Because I, like, I don't want to tiptoe around it. Like, I, like, I don't want to stay silent. Like, I don't want, you know, my kids or my grandkids to. My eyes are getting wet.

[Chandler]

Why are we all crying?

[Lauren]

Well, to look like, to look back at this time and be like, well, what did you do Right.

[Chandler]

Oh my God. That's a really good point.

[Lauren]

This is this. It's. I'm just, I'm so disgusted just by everything that if I can change just from like, speaking of this, if I, if we can change one person's mindset of just like, how they, how they feel about this situation and just like, open up their, like, well, also, I want you guys like, cut you off there.

[Chandler]

Yeah, I want to leave. I'll end the conversation on this thought too. Like, ask yourself, when you think of immigrants and ice, why are they only targeting black and Brown people. What about the white immigrants? They don't. They don't bother you. It's just the black and brown ones.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

So food for thought. Anyways. Anyways, that was pretty heavy.

[Lauren]

Yeah, I'm. I'm really happy we talked about it though, because it has been heavy on me of like, wanting to bring it up and wanting to. Because, like, I don't want. I don't want anything I do to feel like it's a place for people to not feel safe.

[Sponsor/Ad Reader]

Right.

[Chandler]

Well, it's not too late to change your mind.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

If you have been someone who was pro ice or. And you didn't even know why, it's not too late to do research and take it back. It's not too late for you to make a stance and. And say, you know what?

[Lauren]

Pedophiles, man. Like, all these goddamn government officials just trying to like, hurt us all around are all pedophiles anyway. Have you ever seen a pyramid in real life?

[Chandler]

No, but I really want to go to Egypt. Like, that's like a dream of mine. One day I'll be able to pay for it with credit card points.

[Lauren]

I can't comprehend how a pyramid was.

[Chandler]

Built by black and brown people. Straight up.

[Lauren]

Right.

[Chandler]

They're smarter than all of us.

[Lauren]

I need a. I need to do some more reach research.

[Chandler]

Okay.

[Lauren]

Actually, a good transition would be the monks.

[Chandler]

Are the monks like monks? M O K M O N K.

[Lauren]

Almost done with their journey? I think it's.

[Chandler]

What journey?

[Lauren]

Are you kidding me? The monks are on a peace walk.

[Chandler]

Monks from where?

[Lauren]

Yeah, they're all over. A bunch of monks doing what? They're. They're on a peace walk across.

[Chandler]

Are they here?

[Lauren]

Yes.

[Chandler]

Where are they walking across our country?

[Lauren]

Yeah. Well, they're in.

[Chandler]

Can we help them? Can we leave them water?

[Lauren]

Everyone does. Yeah.

[Chandler]

It's like in American dirt where they're. The.

[Sponsor/Ad Reader]

They're.

[Chandler]

There's Americans and American dirt that leave water for the immigrants. Walking people, walking them. You know what? I know you said we were going to move on, but I'm not ready, so. There are. There are people. Americans who are leaving water for people to cross the border. Right. And to help them, and they're Americans and I want to help the monks. Where are they? Is there. Is there a cam?

[Lauren]

You're a little too late because they're almost done. But every single state that they've walked into, like, people meet them and like they flowers and kids and like it. I'm gonna. You're gonna go when?

[Chandler]

Sorry, I don't Mean to cut you off. I'm just. I'm feeling a little passionate. Hello. People keep saying to me, then let them stay in your house. I would. Come on. Like, come on. Coyotes are welcome. Take a little break and head back. I'm gonna be a coyote. Like, I'm telling you.

[Lauren]

So on.

[Chandler]

Kale texts me on a random Saturday morning after reading American Dirt, and she. She hysterically crying, and she goes, how the do I become a coyote?

[Lauren]

I said, kale, are you kidding me?

[Chandler]

She said, I want to go to.

[Lauren]

Mexico, and I want to cross back.

[Chandler]

Into this country, see if I could do it. And then how do I become a coyote? Girl, we can help other ways than you. Well, because it's like, okay, try to follow the bouncing ball here, right? Like, I did Tough Mudder twice. Okay?

[Sponsor/Ad Reader]

Just.

[Chandler]

I know that sounds like it doesn't relate, but just listen. Just listen. So a lot of, like, on the videos where I have spoke up about ice, they'll say, let a family live with you. And I'm like, I literally would. Like, I just don't know how to get in touch with them. I would. Do you know what I mean? Like, they. Some of them get robbed to their cell phone, so, like, they can't call me. I give them my number, so I feel like, okay, Tough Mudder. So hold on, hold on. No, I. I took two pills today. It's not. Not. So. I did Tough Mudder once, and I sucked at it, right? It was awful. And then I did it again with the goal, like, I'm gonna do this, right? And I did it, and I really. I really did it. And so what I. Why I'm relating that to crossing the border is like, I feel like I need to do it. I need to experience it. I want to understand what they have to experience. Like, I'm willing to put myself in a position where I want to know what these people are going through to get to safety, to get to a place where. And so I said all that to say that this. These. Then there are Americans when they get there to. To cross the border. There are Americans that leave water for them because they know that they're coming illeg. Like, undocumented over here, and I want to help them. So then I'm like, okay, well, I can get. I can buy a house near the border, and then I can make that. They can stay with me because they can't get all the way to Delaware. Do you know what I mean? They can't walk from the border to Delaware. So, like, if I'm closer to the border. Then they can stay with me and then I really can let them stay with me.

[Lauren]

I think. I honestly, I think, think. But like, we can find. We can find things we can do. But like, I don't think you need to go on a crossing.

[Chandler]

What I'm saying is I'm willing. All the people telling me to let these people live with me and things like that. Like, I'm willing, like, I. If I knew how, I would. I just uncontrollably sobbed for American Dirt. And it really.

[Lauren]

I've never read it. And you need to. I know that I need to, but I had to stop reading the Nightingale because I. I couldn't stomach it. I couldn't stomach it during this period of time.

[Chandler]

Speaking of books, Michael G. Jordan is playing in fourth wing.

[Lauren]

Okay, I beat you to it. That's not what I was going to say. And he's not playing in fourth wing. It's his production company that's doing it. Oh, you're so dumb. Anyway, I just finished. We didn't talk about this last time. I just finished Razor Blade tears.

[Chandler]

Oh, my gosh.

[Lauren]

Relative to the conversation.

[Chandler]

To the conversation. SA Cosby is a black author. He doesn't get hype. The hype that he deserves. Happy Black History Month. He is. I've read two of his books so far and they were so good. And they touch on a lot of, like, social issues. Honestly, in the books.

[Lauren]

Can we talk about Razor Blade Tears a little bit?

[Chandler]

Yeah. And they also. He touches on homosexuality, racism.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

Murder. All of the things.

[Lauren]

Religion, all the things. It's really good.

[Chandler]

I literally have chills right now.

[Lauren]

I. I finished it last night and I cried.

[Chandler]

Yeah. And it was, you know, like the racism with Ike and then the. I forget Bunny Lee, Buddy Lee, racism.

[Lauren]

Don't do any. Give any.

[Chandler]

It's hard. Okay. We should talk about it on book club. Would you come on book club?

[Lauren]

I'm to going point. Yeah. Okay.

[Chandler]

You read it more recently, so. Okay, thanks.

[Lauren]

So I finished yesterday. So the book is about. There's the gay. A gay couple. Derek and Isaiah, married couple with a daughter. They get murdered. And. Oh, and they're an interracial couple.

[Chandler]

So they're gay and they're interracial.

[Lauren]

Yep. They get murdered. They both have a dad. Dads who are ex convicts. Buddy Lee and Ike. And they don't really know each other, but after their sons get murdered, they come band together to find out who murdered them. And it's like their journey of this. And there's just like, the way they touch on, you know what we kind of, like, were speaking to as well. I'm surprised. Like, I was thinking about you while reading it, because one, obviously, for me, it hits harder home with the whole, like, queer aspect. And then also it hits even more home, like having a kid. And then I was like, damn, I couldn't imagine being Kale reading this. Like, having a queer son.

[Chandler]

I was uncontrollably sobbing.

[Lauren]

Yeah.

[Chandler]

In Turks and Caicos, in bed, on my Kindle, uncontrollably.

[Lauren]

It's a really good book. So Razor blade tears. Add it to your tbr. It's a really easy, quick read.

[Chandler]

Yeah, it's super. It's like. And it's. It's.

[Lauren]

It's a little slow. I was gonna give it four stars. I ended up giving it five stars.

[Chandler]

Just because the subject matter.

[Lauren]

The subject matter.

[Chandler]

And you'll think about it for a really long time.

[Lauren]

It was a little slow up until, like, the last 25. It was still good. It was just like, a little slow. But I. Yeah, it was so good.

[Chandler]

He doesn't get enough hype as an author.

[Lauren]

I'll have to read another one of his books.

[Chandler]

We read King of Ashes, and then I want to do All Sinners Bleed. I want to do that one next. I just haven't gotten around to. I. I've been consumed by a lot of things in life, so I have not read as much as I should the last two months. And so who would have known? So, yeah. But great, great author. And I. I wish that he would do more with his social media because you can't tag him. And I feel like if you could tag him, he'd get more sales because you could be more interactive with his audience and things.

[Lauren]

You should bring him on the podcast.

[Chandler]

Well, I tried to reach out, and he doesn't allow it.

[Lauren]

Oh, did you just say that? Okay, I didn't know.

[Chandler]

Maybe I don't know what I've said. I never know when I'm on medicated. I don't know if what I'm saying comes out loud or if I'm just saying it in my head. Head or vice versa. I say it out loud and I thought it was an inside thought.

[Lauren]

That's fair. I mean, I do feel for people that need to be medicated just being friends with you.

[Chandler]

No, the best thing I ever did was medicate. But anyways, so essay Cosby. I. Maybe do you think, like. Because we could discuss that one, but maybe the three of us could read All Sinners Bleed. Discuss it on book club. And then that same live that we do that book club, we can discuss razor blade tears just so that it's like all Essay Cosby. That would be really fun. So I want to do that for March for my birthday.

[Sponsor/Ad Reader]

Sure.

[Chandler]

Like my birthday month. I meant let's all plan to read All Sinners Bleed and then do the live for march for on all Sinners Bleed. And then for anyone who's read Essay Cosby's.

[Lauren]

I'm downloading it now. I need a book for the ride home. Speaking of books, I'm not even going to ask. I'm just like over honestly asking. So I'm not even gonna bring it up.

[Chandler]

I have not read at all or listened to a single.

[Lauren]

I don't give a. Like, I don't give a. I'm not bringing it up anymore. I'm not setting you up for failure.

[Chandler]

Thank you.

[Lauren]

You're welcome.

[Chandler]

I don't know if that was shade or.

[Lauren]

I have one final question before. Before we get into. Is it karma or isn't chaos if you could selfishly pick a career for your kid, do not think logistically of the quality of their life or like, if you could selfishly pick a career in your. For your kid because it would benefit you?

[Chandler]

Oh, because it would benefit me.

[Lauren]

Yes.

[Chandler]

Okay.

[Lauren]

What would it be?

[Chandler]

Benefit me financially or ego?

[Lauren]

Don't think about, like, how would it benefit me?

[Chandler]

I need to know.

[Lauren]

So, like my.

[Chandler]

I'll give you my choice, but I need you to give me details. I need. I need. I need details.

[Lauren]

Yeah. Me giving you my answers.

[Sponsor/Ad Reader]

No.

[Chandler]

Does it benefit me financially or my ego? Because different.

[Lauren]

Okay, neither.

[Chandler]

But you said selfishly benefit me.

[Lauren]

Yes. Because of what the.

[Chandler]

In what way?

[Lauren]

Because what they're doing adds like happiness, value, ease of life. Like mine would be.

[Chandler]

So this has nothing to do with finances or ego?

[Lauren]

No, I literally just said that.

[Chandler]

Oh.

[Lauren]

Do you want know. Do you want to know mine? It'll help give context.

[Chandler]

Please.

[Lauren]

I would hope. Hope to. For them to be like a Michelin star chef. Because it would.

[Chandler]

What is Michelin?

[Lauren]

Like a really high, like top tier fine dining chef.

[Chandler]

Why that food is not good.

[Lauren]

Maybe for you. I enjoy fine dining food.

[Chandler]

Do you?

[Lauren]

I love it.

[Chandler]

The plates are this big. Sure. She'd also sleep in a bathtub if there was nowhere to sleep.

[Lauren]

I'm diverse.

[Chandler]

You're flexible.

[Lauren]

Yeah. You can't eat fine dining like fine dining food. You can't.

[Chandler]

But like fine dining food is this big on your plate and I walk away still hungry, going to McDonald's?

[Lauren]

No, it's good because you get to try so many different things off. This is my thing, no one else's. Literally. You don't have to choose this for a career path for your child. Pick your own. Good answer. Do you want to get. Do you want me to give you some good answers? Good answers would be maybe the CEO of Marriott because you could benefit from all the locations. Maybe like a, A private jet pilot.

[Chandler]

Because none of this stuff, none of this interests me.

[Lauren]

So what interests you? Is this another question I shouldn't have asked.

[Chandler]

She's gonna cry. Selfishly, if I could like a mechanic, you know, I don't care about that. I would selfishly want one of my children to be a professional athlete. So I could selfishly go to free games.

[Lauren]

Do you know what's so funny?

[Chandler]

What?

[Lauren]

That is a.

[Chandler]

A, I, I am not good at sports. I don't know how to play sports. But I love going to sporting events. Okay? So I. So because I have seven kids, I want to give more examples. So I would say. Okay, so I would say professional athlete for the games. I would say maybe a pilot because. Because I like to fly and travel.

[Lauren]

So say private jet pilot because like private commercial pilots don't really get that. I don't think get that many perks. But I don't know. What do I know?

[Chandler]

I don't know. So pilot and then probably some sort of like when I went to Thailand, there was this like contact that worked for the hotel chain. It wasn't just that specific hotel. And so he travels between the Thailand Ritz Carlton to, you know, all these other.

[Lauren]

Why don't you just make them the owner of the Ritz Carlton?

[Chandler]

No, because it's not the owner. It's like the, the, like a coordinator of some sort that gets to go and then they get to do.

[Lauren]

The owner would have. Have better perks.

[Chandler]

Yeah, but it's not usually until they're really old.

[Lauren]

Okay. It's not. We're not thinking.

[Chandler]

Okay, so anyways, a hotel person that would. Could get me like really cool locations. Okay, so we have professional athlete, pilot, hotel coordinator, PR reps.

[Lauren]

Damn, you get a lot of choices.

[Chandler]

I know. Like imagine I got to just like, I thought that this conversation was going to this, this tick tock that I saw of this woman. And she's talking about how she will pay for her child's entire college education as long as she gets to pick their profession and the profession or their major. Their field has to be a heavy hitter. It has to be One that requires a degree, like a lawyer, a doctor, a nurse, things like that. And she'll pay. Or she would pay for their wedding with a budget and there's a cap on it. It's one or the other. And a lot of people were arguing about whether or not that that is fair for her to pick their profession. And like, I was a little conflicted on it because I also gave that advice to Elliot, was like, you don't need to go to school for acting. You can take classes like that separately. You need to go, you need to have a plan where it's going to make you financially in a good spot. Right? So if Lincoln, Lux, Creed, Rio, Verse, Valley decided we don't want to go to college, okay, no problem. Because if you were going to go to college and waste your, your funds on communications, one, you could do communications without a degree. And two, like you're gonna owe more in loans and whatever, or use all of your trust fund for loan for college on a communications degree versus something that you could, you actually need. Like, like I said, doctor, accountant, whatever. And so that's where I thought you were going with it. But wait, I get more choices. Okay, what about Valley? Like, what could I do for her? Maybe, maybe like a CEO of like Netflix or something like a really high executive position of Netflix. Because then it's like we deserve a show because that would benefit not just her, because she's still a part of the family, but it would also benefit the rest of us financially.

[Lauren]

Anyway, thanks for, you know, sticking along with us for this episode. We know that wild ride, it was a. It would have been a wilder ride if we just continued with the last one we tried, but here we are. Do we have a. Karma is a karma is a cat? Guess.

[Chandler]

Okay, is it karma or is it chaos? Love your show. I'm a teacher at a school for students who are deaf, hard of hearing and hearing students who can benefit from learning asl, Deaf family member or non verbal. Oh, I didn't even think about American Sign Language for people who are just non verbal, like not necessarily deaf. Wow. Anyways, a few years ago, we took a group of about 20 middle middle schoolers to Washington DC. Out of these 20 students, nine were deaf or hard of hearing and the others were hearing hearing. We flew Southwest, which at the time had open seating. Our goal was to sit all the kids together because, well, at least that's the safest. They would only allow allow our students who were deaf and hard of hearing to board the plane early with chaperones and our hearing students had to board later. We ended up pretty spread out through the entire plane. On our flight back, we the teachers decided to tell the airline all of our students were deaf so that we could board together and keep them all in one section. All of our students knew how to sign, so we told our students we were going to to voice off through security until we boarded the plane. And on the plane it worked. We got them all together and all the students were silently silent signing the whole flight. All was great until we landed in Atlanta for our connecting flight. We landed about 10pm and learned that our connecting flight had been canceled and was not rescheduled until 8am the next morning. Could you imagine a situation like this with 20 students? We had to spend the night in the airport with 20 middle school kids. Kids. The kids all behaved well, minus a few tears, and we all eventually made it home. But was it karma for lying about our hearing kids being deaf or just the chaos of traveling with a group of middle schoolers?

[Lauren]

It does feel a little bit like karma, even though I support the lie.

[Chandler]

But then that is the the school's responsibility to have let the airline know and set up accommodations ahead of time. So that to me it feels like desperate times call for desperate measures so the teachers act accordingly based on the situation. And so it could be a little bit.

[Lauren]

I'm not mad at the lie, but I do.

[Chandler]

No, I'm not. But it is karma. It's both. Yeah, it is both. But I, I think the teachers did what they the best they could at the time.

[Lauren]

I find it really hard to believe that a airline wouldn't just let them all get on together because it's also.

[Chandler]

Going to be in the airline's responsibility if something happens to a hearing student, a middle school student who's not traveling with their parents in the back of the plane and everybody else is everywhere. So fascinating. Yeah, it feels a little bit like everybody was at fault here. So. Yeah.

[Lauren]

Well, that's it. Another episode down and no horses were hurt.

[Chandler]

I'm getting a horse tattoo.

[Lauren]

All right. What? Oh really? You're getting tattoo? Anyway. Okay, well, catch us next time. Tell them where to find you in the trenches.

[Chandler]

Yeah, I think find me in hell. Burning to ashes.

[Lauren]

All right, man. All social media hater25 make sure to give for the haters a listen in wallet therapy Thurs.

[Chandler]

Every other Thursday on for the haters dot com. Nope for the haters on for the.

[Lauren]

Haters for the haters.com goes to Becky hater.com great.

[Chandler]

Love y' all. See?

[Lauren]

Love y. Bye. Great review.

[Chandler]

Subscribe.

[Lauren]

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[Chandler]

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[Lauren]

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[Chandler]

Pluto TV stream now pay.

[Lauren]

Never. Hi, I'm Lauren.

[Chandler]

And I'm Chandler.

[Lauren]

And we're the hosts of Pop Apologist podcast, a weekly podcast devoted to celebrity gossip, Hollywood deep dives, Real Housewives, drama, and anything and everything. Taylor Swift.

[Chandler]

We're two sisters who make no apologies.

[Lauren]

For our love of pop culture and the fact that a lister might mean more to us than each other. Join us on your favorite podcast app every Wednesday for Pop Apologists. Pop Apologists, your new favorite sister and celeb podcast.