INSIDE THE MIND OF SINGLE GUYS

Summary

Kat on the Loose: INSIDE THE MIND OF SINGLE GUYS

Host: Kat Zammuto
Guests: Michael Patrick Shields & Michael “Henderson” Henderson
Date: November 26, 2025

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Episode Overview

In this candid and playful episode, Kat Zammuto welcomes two of her single male friends—Michael Patrick Shields, a veteran radio host and travel writer, and Henderson, a successful entrepreneur with a law enforcement and private security background—to share an unfiltered look into the mind of single men. The conversation covers a range of relationship topics: why these high-value men are single, their dating philosophies, red flags, being approached by women, boundaries, and the dynamics of success in relationships—all seasoned by anecdotes, laughter, and a dash of advice for women seeking insight into male perspectives.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Meet the Guests & Setting the Scene

• Kat introduces Michael Patrick Shields and Henderson, both highly accomplished, attractive, and single—sparking curiosity about why they’re still unattached.
• Henderson appears via the warmth of his fireplace; Michael Patrick, ever the showman, records from his bedroom, “candles over here and champagne. So I welcome you to my bachelor bed” ([01:58]).
• The group reminisces about a recent night out, noting how organic conversations about dating challenges inspired this episode.

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2. Why Are They Single? (05:00–09:00)

• Henderson: Never married, claims he’s been proposed to four times but didn't accept due to his hectic, travel-centric job and inability to offer consistency to potential partners.
  • “My job was traveling all over the world and protecting people... I was gone maybe 200 days a year... That just wasn’t conducive to giving them the stability they wanted. So I said no.” ([05:47])
  • Comfortable alone, sometimes feels open to relationships but isn’t always seeking them enthusiastically.
• Michael Patrick: Four marriages, five engagements, but not “afraid to commit.”
  • “At least I'm not afraid to commit...I was head over heels with all of them and to some degree, to this day, I still am” ([08:10]).
  • Prefers relationships to happen organically rather than through relentless pursuit or the “dating app hustle.”

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3. Dating in the App Era: Green Flags & Red Flags (09:00–16:45)

• Green flags for Henderson: Kindness, meeting in the real world—not on apps.
  • “Kindness as soon as I meet...I’ve been very fortunate to meet people just in person” ([09:28]).
  • Tried dating apps very briefly (“probably the worst time,” during pandemic lockdown). Not for him.
• Michael Patrick’s Foodie Call Experience: Cautious about dating apps after being used for meals.
  • “They call it a foodie call, not a booty call. You end up having this dinner...and then off they go” ([10:39]).
  • Both men agree high-value dating happens off the apps and with selectivity.
• Kat on Date Effort: Prefers a man who plans romantic, thoughtful dates.
  • “I love old-fashioned men. It has nothing to do with the money... I like the gesture of a guy that plans a romantic date. I want a type A man...” ([11:41]).

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4. Paying for Dates & Reciprocity (19:08–20:55)

• Sex Early in Dating: Does it change their view of a woman?
  • Henderson: No, as long as she displays genuine reciprocation and kindness. What turns him off is lack of generosity in return—no small gestures or tokens.
    • “If we go somewhere and they have coconut water and you don’t want to buy me coconut water, then I’m probably going to be almost done with you...” ([20:05])
• Both men prize reciprocity in kindness, not entitlement or expectation.

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5. Gold Diggers, Foodie Calls, and Boundaries (21:27–26:06)

• Henderson’s Gold Digger Story: At a Beverly Hills bar, he refuses to buy drinks for a group of women who expected it. He notes he does not attract those types.
  • “Those gold diggers don’t like me anyway, so I’m good.” ([22:52])
• Both men are wary of being used for financial gain, agree that gestures should be genuine, not transactional.
• Michael Patrick: Still enjoys classic chivalry—“the male thing kicks in where you feel gallant and maybe you feel generous...” ([26:06])
• They also highlight “mini-relationships”—meaningful spontaneous connections during travel.

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6. Being Pursued vs. Pursuing (28:11–32:31)

• Kat: Never pursues men; believes men should be the hunters.
• Henderson: Likes to see interest from a woman but too much pursuit gets “annoying”—effort is appreciated, desperation is not.
  • “It can be annoying...if it’s too aggressive, too much, I’m like, what’s up with that?” ([31:06])
• Michael Patrick: Enjoys being pursued but with balance, values mutual effort.

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7. Time Management & Relationship Priorities (33:12–35:26)

• “Too Busy” Excuse:
  • Kat challenges the “busy” narrative: “When you like someone, you can be the busiest person on the planet...you always fit that person in your schedule.” ([32:31])
  • Henderson: Agrees, but stresses that timing and seasonality matter—sometimes patience is needed.
  • Michael Patrick: When truly struck by “the thunderbolt,” nothing stands in the way.

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8. Red Flags & Deal Breakers (39:00–45:39)

• Male Friends as a Deal Breaker:
  • Michael Patrick brings up if having mostly male friends is a red flag; Kat counters that trust and loyalty are non-negotiable—type A men aren’t threatened.
  • Henderson: Boundaries are the core issue; lack of them is a deal breaker.
    • “If you don’t have boundaries just in your life, period...that’s the biggest red flag in my life.” ([42:27])
• Michael Patrick: Warns that the spark-creating traits can aggravate you in the long term. Prefers a “flexible freeze”—be open to changing expectations.
  • “Sometimes the things that will attract you...maybe you can’t live with [them]” ([45:07]).

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9. Are Men Intimidated by Successful Women? (46:25–49:07)

• Kat: Asserts most men are intimidated by highly successful women, despite what they say.
• Henderson: Personally unconcerned by a woman’s economic or career status—but only if she maintains femininity in the relationship. Admits, “I think most men...are [intimidated],” and they “can’t handle that.”
• Michael Patrick: Sees successful women as exciting and aspires to be with someone who “brings new intellect and excitement.”
  • “I aspire to be with women who can bring new intellect and new excitement...” ([47:49])

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10. Sweet Gestures & Real Connection (50:14–53:13)

• Handwritten Notes & Small Gifts:
  • Michael Patrick shares a funny story about gifting a date a candle—swapping a $97 Ivy candle for a $15 Michaels store candle out of practicality ([51:02]).
  • Kat emphasizes how meaningful such gestures are for women.
• Both value genuine acts over grandiosity—a theme echoed throughout the episode.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments (with timestamps)

• On their relationship status:
  • “At least I'm not afraid to commit is what I tell them, you know...I was head over heels with all of them and to some degree, to this day, I still am...” – Michael Patrick Shields ([08:10])
• On first date expectations:
  • “I like the gesture of a guy that plans a romantic date. I want a type A man.” – Kat ([11:41])
• On food-dated dating apps:
  • “They call it a foodie call, not a booty call.” – Michael Patrick ([10:39])
• On reciprocity:
  • “If we go somewhere and they have coconut water and you don't want to buy me coconut water, then I’m probably going to be almost done with you, right?” – Henderson ([20:05])
• On boundaries:
  • “If you don't have boundaries just in your life, period... that's the biggest red flag in my life.” – Henderson ([42:27])
• On being too busy:
  • “When you like someone, you can be the busiest person on the planet...you always fit that person in your schedule.” – Kat ([32:31])
• On success in women:
  • “They say they want an independent woman, but then when they get one, they can’t handle that.” – Henderson ([47:45])
  • “I aspire to be with women who can bring new intellect and new excitement.” – Michael Patrick ([47:49])

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Introductions & Why Single? – [01:58] to [09:00]
• Green Flags/First Date Philosophy – [09:28] to [16:45]
• “Foodie Call” & Dating App Stories – [10:39] to [14:10]
• Reciprocity & Early Sex – [19:08] to [20:55]
• Experiences with Gold Diggers – [21:27] to [22:52]
• Being Approached, Chivalry – [26:06] to [27:32]
• Being Pursued Versus Pursuing – [28:11] to [32:31]
• Time and Attention in Relationships – [33:10] to [35:26]
• Red Flags & Deal Breakers – [39:00] to [45:39]
• Success in Women & Male Insecurity – [46:25] to [49:07]
• Sweet Gestures & Candle Story – [50:14] to [53:13]

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Tone & Style

• The tone is lighthearted, irreverent, yet often deeply self-aware, alternating between playful banter and moments of genuine vulnerability.
• Kat serves as a strong, sassy moderator who is both empathetic and forthright. Henderson is reflective, analytical, and values authenticity. Michael Patrick brings wit, self-deprecation, and a seasoned perspective on relationships.

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Key Takeaways

• High-quality single men do exist; they value kindness, selectivity, and real-world connection.
• Reciprocity and genuine gestures matter as much as (or more than) traditional gender roles or financial generosity.
• A major red flag for both is a lack of boundaries; confidence and mutual respect are non-negotiable.
• Most men are honest about being intimidated by truly independent, successful women, but the right partner finds this (paired with femininity) attractive.
• Both playful and profound, the conversation demystifies how successful single men approach love, dating, and relationships.

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For more from Kat Zammuto and her guests, listen to the full episode of "Kat on the Loose" wherever you get your podcasts, or find the video episode on YouTube.

Transcript

[A]

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[B]

I decided that if we're going to do this, I'd welcome you right into my bedroom. Right on my bed. As you can see, I've got candles over here and champagne. So I welcome you. I welcome you to my bachelor bed.

[A]

There you go. So if you guys are listening to the audio episode, make sure you go look at the video of his bed on YouTube, Ken on the show.

[B]

And Cat. Cat, if you can't handle seeing this, I have blindfold for you too.

[A]

Now we're getting kinky.

[B]

Goes with any bed. Same.

[A]

And my other Michael, who is Michael Henderson, who goes by Henderson, we're going to call him. Hi, Henderson. Thank you for doing this.

[C]

You're welcome. So I'm not letting you in my bedroom until that's personal. And that's. That takes some time. But I'LL give you my fireplace, though.

[A]

Look beautiful.

[B]

Sunday.

[A]

That's what I was thinking. Today. Today. Talk about the perfect day to cuddle, snuggle. Right? Stay home with someone. I'm home with my dogs. So I'm snuggling three moody dogs who cannot go out because of the rain. Mike. Okay, so you, you folded. You're blindfolded yourself. You don't want to look at the camera. You want to do this blindfolded.

[C]

This is a dating game now. Oh, boy.

[A]

This is a dating game.

[B]

The Bachelorettes. Where are they?

[A]

Well, you only have this one tonight, but let's. Oh, yeah, I hope so. Right? Well, guys, let's try to get serious for a second so we can pack up as much information as possible. We, we saw each other last week. We were hanging out at this really cool bar here in Beverly Hills. And organically, we started talking about the world of dating relationships. And I realized you guys have a lot to say about it because first of all, you're both single. You're both super successful. For those of you listening who don't know that, I'm going to give you the information really, really quickly. Michael, Patrick Shields is a super successful radio host. I think you've had your radio show for like two decades, correct, Michael?

[B]

Yeah, that's right. Thank you.

[A]

Yeah. You, you are a journalist. You write several travel columns. And again, they're both single. You're single. We're going to talk about you've been through several marriages and you're going to tell us why and if you want to get married again. Henderson, have you ever been married yourself.

[C]

Or your never been married?

[A]

Okay, so you're that unicorn. You've never been married, you're super successful, super good looking.

[C]

I've been proposed to four times.

[A]

Oh, my God. We got to talk about that. But hold on. Just so the girls know, both of you have great careers. Henderson has an extensive background in law enforcement. Interestingly enough, your company, your private security company is called Phoenix. My creative services agency is called Phoenix.

[C]

See, we are there.

[A]

Yeah, we know. My dog name is Phoenix. My company name is Phoenix. I have a tattoo, Phoenix. I love the phoenix.

[C]

It's a strong meaning. Free for sure.

[A]

Yeah, very strong. So both of you guys are. Are super successful at what you do. You're very talented, you're very intelligent. So the first question I want to ask in a nutshell, and please be as honest as you can about it, why are you single? Because you want to be single? Because you've been burned too many times? Because you're waiting for the perfect someone or you're just happy as. As the way things are.

[C]

Oh, that's loaded.

[A]

That's loaded.

[B]

Henderson said a minute ago that he had been proposed to four times. He didn't say that he proposed four times. Are you saying that you had four women who proposed to you? Did they get down on one knee or how did that all go?

[C]

No. And that was maybe. Yeah. No, that's when I had hair and I was younger, probably a little, you know, like, looked a little different, but nonetheless. Yeah, you know, they were corporate women. They were very business minded, which I appreciate. And, like, I love women that handled their business and that are, some people say, independent and strong. I use that kind of loosely. And they were all good women. There was no doubt about it. I think at the time in my life, I couldn't provide a lot of consistency. You know, my job was traveling all over the world and protecting people and doing these things in third world countries. And so I was gone maybe 200 days a year, give or take. So that just wasn't conducive to giving them the stability that I knew that they wanted. So I said no.

[B]

I didn't like James Bond and money, because you were always coming back from the Far east or Middle East.

[C]

Well, that's a different podcast. That's a different podcast. You can Google and find all that.

[A]

Wait, wait, wait, wait. Neither one of you answered the question. Are you single now by choice, or are you looking for the right partner?

[C]

Yeah, so I am looking for the right partner.

[B]

Okay.

[C]

But in the same breath of that, though, I am very comfortable and content being by myself until, you know, that right person comes along. And I also found that I've been in waves of moments where I don't even want to try.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And that's actually a good time to heal and do other things. But then there are moments where, you know, I have to go. Yeah, I need to be open. Let me go out. Let me do some dating.

[A]

I'm exactly the same. I'm super happy by myself. I take crazy long breaks from dating, which I call the man diet. The dating diet. Yeah, but I am. Yeah, but I am open. I want to be in a relationship, but I'm not in a hurry at all. How about you, Michael Patrick Shoes? Are you single by choice? Do you want to find a partner or you're like, I've had enough.

[B]

Well, people, you know, they ask when they meet you, are you married? And I say occasionally, because.

[A]

What is that supposed to mean?

[B]

Well, I'VE had four marriages and five engagements. Oh, and busy boy.

[C]

Do tell.

[B]

At least I'm not afraid to commit is what I tell them, you know. But yeah, I was head over heels with all of them and to some degree, to this day, I still am because, you know, it's natural if you're going to be that deep in with somebody. So I don't go about it. I don't look though I know there are women and men who make a job of it, you know, where they're, they're going out three, four nights a week and working the apps and, and all that sort of thing. And I've come to believe that it will find you, you know, organically is the best.

[A]

I agree. I totally agree. So that's not good.

[B]

You know, life is short and some people are, they're on a mission, you know.

[A]

Yeah. Too much. So let's talk about that. For all the ladies out there listening, all the single women out there that complain that there are no high quality single guys out there, you are proof that yes there are. Because you're very high quality or single, you're crazy intelligent, you're successful, you have careers. What would be a major like green flag, like when you guys meet a girl, whether it's on a dating app or a bar, whatever it is, what is something they're like, oh, okay, this is amazing. I really want this characteristic in a partner.

[C]

I'll go first. Kindness as soon as I meet. And I don't do apps. So that's the other thing.

[A]

So nobody's gonna find you on any dating app.

[C]

Not a one. Unless. Unless it's a friend that I don't know that use my face. But other than that, which I don't know, I don't know that to be the case or why they would want to. But like that was a mistake. But nonetheless, I am all about walking into an establishment or. And I've been very fortunate to meet people just in person and I think that's a good way for my personality to show and then you can immediately get that, that spark or you know, beyond the attraction piece. But that's very comfortable for me. I actually did Tinder the first week the entire world shut down and it was, which is probably the worst time to I guess beyond an app. But I think they had a two day cancellation so it was basically from a Thursday to Thursday. Nothing worked. I was probably a walking red flag and I was like, this isn't for me. And so I jumped off.

[A]

Yeah, you're not the only One, there are a lot of high value people that are like, they're just like, I don't want to do the dinner. How about you, Michael Patrick?

[B]

Well, I heard it, I experienced this and I heard a phrase that actually describes it and that is that you might, when you're on the app, have the interest of a woman or meet them and they want to go out with you and so they expect to go to dinner and they call it a foodie call, not a booty call. You end up having this dinner with them and they tolerate the conversation for the evening and then off they go. So.

[A]

But that's not nice. That's like using someone for.

[B]

But it's happened. It's definitely happened to me twice. And now I know there's a label for it.

[A]

So I never look, I do this podcast and it's the first time I hear that, never heard it.

[B]

Yeah. Professional eaters. I say, oh, wow. So if you had a man cat and he invited you to take a beach walk or get coffee.

[A]

I will not do that on a first date ever. Not a chance.

[B]

You want a meal?

[A]

No, it's not that I want a meal. I want a man. That's me, right? I love old fashioned men. It has nothing to do with the money. I can buy as many meals as I want. Luckily, I take myself to any restaurant I want. But I like the gesture of a guy that plans a romantic date. I want a type a man. We were talking about that actually when we met because I'm, I'm so busy. Like I'm in control the entire day. I'm the boss. I run my company, I run the show. La la la. So in my personal life, I want a guy that is going to say, you know, let's go here. I booked this place, the romantic. I don't want like a walk, walk on the beach. That's. I do that with my friends. You. I will not do that. Be honest, Michael. I don't want most women, most women that know their value, they don't want to walk with you on the beach. And I understand the food is, It's a different situation. It's not fair. But I'm saying like, if two people are interested in each other, I think the guy should put the effort and plan a nice date.

[B]

I knew a guy, his name was Michael and he used the apps.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Scheduled every 45 minutes when if he was going to go out and do it, he scheduled every 45 minutes a different woman at a coffee house. And since he was there, he figured I might as well maximize the time.

[A]

Yeah, that happened to me. That happened to me.

[B]

Did it?

[A]

Yeah. Like my, my. I have my bestie who is. Oh, you met him, you know, Doug, my bestie. That went. So there is a dude that lives in his building that wanted to go out with me and meet me. And so he insisted so much. That was like more than two years ago. I was like, okay, whatever, let's do it. So we went to this coffee shop on Melrose and immediately I'm like, okay, I don't want to date this dude for many reasons. And then like a few hours later, I was walking Phoenix, my dog, and the dude was there with another girl. So I'm like, this is really fishy. What the fuck is going on? So I'm like, I'm going to come back here tomorrow. And sure enough, that was his little, you know, thing that he did. He booked a bunch of that's. He didn't shower, he didn't change clothes. He would literally walk from the tennis club and like, do this women on rotation. But I mean, that's not nice. But we're talking here about like high value dating, like for people that actually want a relationship.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, not talking about players. So you are jaded, Michael Patrick, you don't want to take girls to dinner because you don't want to fall in the hands of a foodie.

[B]

No. The problem is I. I'm still susceptible. But you know, when, when it, when you get the thunderbolt, like Michael Corleone in the Godfather, it's undeniable. And so you will do silly things, you'll do romantic things, you'll do anything.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But as for a first date minus the thunderbolt, I don't know.

[C]

Yeah. I'm the complete opposite of that. Yes.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

I don't.

[C]

Well, I don't know about all out, but I like to eat, so I am a food same. So I, I enjoy food. And the way I look at it, and this may be wrong, I'm not sure, but it's convenient for me. So I don't have a ton of time to go out and do multiple dates. One, I think that's kind of. That's a waste of money. I'd rather spend money doing some other things than, you know, doing that. So I don't go out and, you know, shoot my shot, if you will. Often I usually, I usually let probably good ones go by. Right. I'm like, do I really feel like it or. I got to travel a lot this, you know, this month. Or these weeks, you know, so I'll meet someone, I'll connect, I'll travel. Then I'll forget who the hell I met, and it just becomes a. It becomes a thing right when I get back. But if I don't text you before I leave, then I don't remember who you are. So I stopped doing that. But I have to eat. And so if I go to a nice place in Bel Air or wherever I go, you know, we're all in the neighborhood, so where we go, the places we go. Yeah, I have to go anyway because I have to eat. And so if I have to add another 2, $300 to the tab, I mean, it's okay to meet someone that is know I get to actually get to meet and get to spend that hour, two hours, three hours, four hours with. To really see that personality. Yeah, they usually. Usually go. Yeah, they usually last. They usually don't just run out on me, Michael. So maybe I'm using it wisely, you know, for the first minute and then maybe not. But I mean, I figure I have to spend it anyway and I have to eat. So it's like I go places that I'm going to go anyway. So, you know, it's. It's no knock on the chin, you know, if it doesn't happen to work out. But I am very selective, though, of who I. I give my time and energy to.

[A]

Very same same. I'm the same. I'm crazy selective in terms of who I accept to go on a date with. And maybe that's what you should do, Michael Patrick, instead, like, that would be a. A good way for you to separate the footy calls from the. From the real. From the real dates, Right? Somebody that really is into you. Somebody that really cares about you. I guess. Guys, I never thought I would say this, but this Black Friday, instead of buying more stuff I don't need, I decided to invest in my sex life instead. We all know Black Friday is about deals, but what would you rather do? Spend hundreds of dollars in stuff you don't need or 69 bucks on improving your sex life? Life, yes. @beducated.com Real Talk. No one ever really teaches us how to be amazing in bed. We're just supposed to figure it out somehow, right? Well, that's exactly what I thought until I found Educated. I started exploring their courses because I wanted to understand not just pleasure, but connection. And it completely changed how I see intimacy. I learned simple, real techniques that make you more confident, more in tune with your partner, and honestly, more Empowered in your own body, Beducated is a safe space for all. And that's my favorite part. No matter relationship status, sexual orientation or gender. So if you're ready to level up your love and sex life solo or with a partner, go to beducate me cat 69. That's my code. Kat K A T 69 to get 65 off the yearly pass. That's their biggest discount of the year and it's completely risk free. 14 day money back guarantee. So go to beducate me cat 69 and give yourself a gift that will last. Now let's shift gears because I have a lot of questions I want to ask you guys, right? So you take a girl on a date. Let's say it's someone you guys really like, okay. Which I understand it's very rare for both of you. Then you take them on another date and another date and another date. Do. Does it change your mind if you, let's say second date or third date, you guys end up having sex like really soon. Do you see that woman differently because she gave you everything basically quickly or that doesn't make any difference. They're both silent. Oh my God. They're both like staring in space.

[C]

I would say, I would say that. No, it does not.

[A]

Are you being honest?

[C]

No, I'm being a million percent honest. And the reason I'm saying that is because I, I have to look at other characteristics and other behavior patterns to let me know that how high is that body count, right. And, and what that really means if I really dissect it too much. But that doesn't, that doesn't change anything for me. What changes for me is when I go into the fourth, fifth date, I don't mind paying. I don't have that issue. However, I do start to lose interest quickly if they don't reciprocate any type of kindness or generosity. So we might be in two different economics that levels and that's okay. However, if we go somewhere and they have coconut water and you don't want to buy me coconut water, then I'm probably going to be almost done with you, right?

[A]

Really?

[C]

Yeah. Or you know, you come over to the house and you don't want to bring a bottle water or whatever that is or hey, I'm on my way, would you like a bottle of water? Or you know, I make salads, you know, hey, I was thinking about making a salad. If I don't see any type of, that type of kindness, then I'm usually just about to red flag you. And cut you off and. And real quick, it's not because I feel like I need that. That attention or that appreciation by itself. The way that I interact with people, period, is always showing kindness. The way that I, you know, my businesses work the way that we want to interact with people. We want to give people, we want to help people, we want to do a lot for other people. And if you don't have that in your heart, Jesus, genuinely, for me, and you think this is something you want, then I know you can't be a fit to even help me do great things for the world.

[A]

No, and I agree with you, because, listen, this is what I always tell girls, right? If you're dating a guy that makes more money than you and he's paying for all the dates and everything, maybe you can say, hey, tonight, let's stay home and I'll cook you dinner, right? Or do you want to come over for breakfast? There's always small gestures that you can do to show that you appreciate everything that he's doing. And I completely agree. I don't like these. That act entitled, like, oh, just take care of me. Do everything for me, because I'm a princess. I'm. I'm done with those. I don't like those.

[C]

Yeah, well, I don't even have. I don't even attract those. I. I have a. I know we don't have time, but I have a really good. I had my general contractor for one of my companies fly into town and. And that we're working on projects and all this other stuff. And. And he came in and we'd do some meetings and tours and whatever. We wound up. Because he wanted to kind of, you know, hang out. We wound up at Wally's Beverly Hills. And he got to see firsthand, right, the gold digger, you know, the. The playing thing. And they tried to get him. You know, they tried to get him to buy a drink. And. But I had never seen this happen ever, in the sense that I said, no, no, no, don't do that, because they were going to order the drink for them. I said, no, don't do that. Let them order their own drink. And then they ordered their drink. And then the lady tapped me on the shoulder and pointed to the bartender, and I looked at her and I said, no, I don't. I don't do that. I don't know. You go away. And so literally, the bartender was like, you guys gonna pay for this? Who's gonna pay for this? Talking to the girls, there was three of them. And so none of them were like, oh, well, let me see my wallet. And they didn't show. The bartender pulled the drinks back. They did an about face and did a curly Larry mole right outside of Wally's. And I never see them doing about face. Usually they'll just go find a guy real quick that'll come pay for that. And anyway, my buddy Matt, he got to see that firsthand and go, oh, sheesh. You know, I've never seen that. And I'm like, well, those gold diggers don't like me anyway, so I'm good.

[A]

So I think I'm glad you're mentioning that because there are so many women out there. Of course, we know in Beverly Hills there. Oh, my God. I always say, like, they go out hunting, right? They literally go out hunting for dudes. I know a bunch of them, like, they go to the same bars almost every night, almost every weekend. And all they want to find is a dude to pay for their. Like Michael Patrick said, the, the foodies, the foodie call. But I, I'm happy you guys are mentioning because it's coming from the guy's perspective. I don't think any guys like, like any man likes to feel used. Correct? If you want to offer a girl a drink, it's because you offer them a drink. But I don't think any guy likes to be approached, cornered by a woman, trying to get from them. Do you guys both agree with that?

[B]

I wouldn't mind being cornered a little more often.

[C]

Tell it to him, Michael. Get it to him, buddy. Tell them how it is, bro.

[A]

I'm. I'm talking about public places, Michael.

[B]

I'm not talking about that type of public is. Okay, it's all right.

[A]

We work it out. Okay, so if a girls approach you at a bar and they're like, hey, you want to buy me a drink? You're totally good with that.

[B]

Well, if a girl approaches me at a bar, first I say, am I on candid camera?

[A]

Oh, come on.

[B]

You're both too young to remember candid cameras.

[C]

No, we get it.

[A]

I remember that young. I remember.

[B]

Gosh, I'll tell you one. You know, I figured out women like men who dance, right? So I'm really a dancer. I have some talents, but it's not one. But I said, one day, you know, if you're going to do this kind of thing, you better learn how to dance. So I went to this bar and I had some drinks and I said, all right, I'm going to go out there and dance. So I went out there, got My groove on as best I could. Here comes this little blonde, and she comes up to me, and she starts dancing with me. And I thought, some bitch. This works, you know?

[A]

Hi.

[B]

I said, hi. She's just tossing her hair around. She says, what are you doing? I said, dancing. She said, are you sure? And I said, oh, hell. And I left the dance floor.

[C]

Oh, that's all right.

[A]

That was mean. That was mean. That was not.

[C]

Yeah, people can be mean, Michael.

[A]

People. Women can be really mean. Really, really mean. So. No, but, Michael, seriously, what's your. Your stance in terms of paying for things? Are you good with just taking care of them, or do you feel used? Like, Henderson was saying he doesn't think. Like, if you're sitting at a bar with a friend and girls come and say, you want buy me drinks? I agree. More like the way he does it. Like, I don't know. I don't see why. I don't like when girls do that. I never did that in my life. I swear to God. All the times that people bought me drinks because they offer me. I never approach the guy and say, hey, excuse me, do you want to buy me a drink, dude? I. I think that's very aggressive. But tell me your. Your honest response. You don't mind that when girls do that?

[B]

I. You know, I just think it is what it is. It's sort of the. The male thing kicks in where you feel gallant and maybe you feel generous and.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, it just. It just is that way. Maybe. Maybe younger generation, it isn't, but for us. Yeah. It's not even anything that you think about. You know, you just.

[A]

But listen, you were complaining about the. The foodie calls, the dinner dates.

[B]

Well, yeah, but, I mean, that's the long con. You. You know, that's the. That's the long play. Yeah. So, Austin, I absolutely fanta. I even wrote a book called Travel Tattler Less Than Torrid Tales. And what that means is I had. And I'm sure Henderson has had the same thing because he travels around the world. You can have a relationship, I'll call it, for an hour and a half with someone that you run into in a nice. Could be a hotel lobby, could be a club, could be on a train. Who knows? And you might have an enriching conversation that was sweet. And you really felt good about it, and then it ended because that person got on her flight and you got on yours, and it might have never been any better than that little bit of, you know, something that you shared together for a minute. So I try to, like, just live it out and I try to embrace those sorts of things and, and, you know, I'm often just delighted by the people that I meet.

[A]

You just leave the moment.

[C]

I love that.

[B]

Yeah, I never be better than that. You know, maybe you keep in touch, maybe you don't, but you can feast off of these kinds of mini relationships if you keep your heart open and your eyes open.

[A]

But do you want to have another relationship, Michael, or you've had enough?

[B]

No, I, I would never be so stupid as to say that I, that I wouldn't have a relationship. I mean, I've already been married four times. I do have some credentials in this area.

[A]

A lot of ex wives there. Now another question, guys.

[B]

How about one for the thumb, like they say. The Steelers used to say they wanted five super bowl rings, one more wedding ring, one for them all.

[C]

Let's help them get one.

[A]

There we go. Hopefully they'll get you the next Mrs. Shields is the, the last one that part perhaps. Okay, next question. Guys. Do you like when a woman pursues you or you're like, no, men are hunters. I want to do the pursuit. I'll tell you, me, I never, ever, ever pursue men. I think that's way too aggressive. I, I think it by nature, men are the hunt. Men are the ones that should text, call, invite you on a date, you know, do all the pursuing. But I know I'm very old fashioned when it comes to dating relationships. Although I do the podcast. People think I'm like different men every night, but it's not the case.

[B]

Check, please.

[A]

I'm very, very like the. I know because my, the image I have because of the show. I get so many messages, like, so many dudes thinking they're gonna like, bang me just because of the show. I'm like, if, you know, if you know how chill I am, you know.

[B]

About dating you, you now have.

[C]

I get it.

[B]

You now have two grown men blushing. Congratulations.

[A]

Yeah, you guys are so cute. Why? Because I said, well.

[B]

You'Re good.

[A]

Okay, so answer my question. Do you guys like, if a woman is pursuing you, like, hey, do you want to go on a date? And I mean, Henderson, you've been freaking proposed to. I cannot imagine a woman doing that to a guy.

[C]

I know.

[B]

That's so crazy.

[C]

But it happens.

[B]

It happens.

[A]

Yes. But how do you guys feel? Do you like being pursued? Or do you feel like, whoa, that's like too much. Let me do it.

[C]

Well, I'm, I have figured out and I don't know if this is right or wrong again. But I know that when a woman. The relationship has a better chance of lasting if the woman finds you attractive. Right. Or she likes you a lot or, you know, to some degree more than you attempting to get someone to learn to like you. Right. So I would say that. Yeah, I'd like to have. Excuse me. I like to have that interest. I like to see that interest from a woman so that you're not the one that's constantly making the communication and you're not getting that back. So I definitely am all about, yes, Some effort. Effort is. Effort goes a long way.

[A]

No, but wait a second. There's a big difference between effort, of course, if you like someone, you tell them, or pursuing you, like, oh, my God, Anderson, you're so cute. Do you want to go on a date? Do you want to go to dinner? Do you want to do this? You want to do that?

[C]

Like, yeah, that can be somewhere. I mean, I appreciate it, and I. I do. I like it. I do like it, but it can be annoying. It can be annoying. It could be very annoying. I'm not gonna lie. You want it to be truthful. I mean, it can be as annoying.

[A]

Can you. Can you enlighten us so serious. Because I know there are a lot of women listening. How the. When does it get annoying if you do it too much?

[C]

Yeah, I mean. I mean, look at it. If it were just the reverse, right? When guys really pursue and go, go, go, go, go, and go, go, go, go, go. And, you know, especially when you're busy, right? Or you have goals and you have things that you're working on, you're like, yeah, I like you. I want to maybe get to know you. But, you know, can we figure it out? Work. Work it through, or, you know, figure this out? But if it's that, go, go, go, go, go. I'm like, there's got to be a flag in there somewhere. Like, what is that? Psychotic. Whatever. You know, I mean, I've been fortunate, knock on wood. You know, I haven't had to call Beverly Hills PD for anything yet. So, I mean, they just wave, and I wave back, and that's our relationship. So I haven't had any stalkers or anything like that, but I've been very cognizant of that. That chase. Like, if it's too aggressive, too much, I'm like, what? What's up with that?

[A]

Something wrong? Yeah, yeah.

[C]

I mean, I'm okay, but I'm not like Brad Pitt, you know, these young, you know, tens and twelves run around out here. So I'm like, you like me that much? Like, wait, what's wrong with you?

[A]

Yeah, look, I agree. I think there is such a thing as too much. However you said, oh, sometimes I'm too busy. I always believe the end of that phrase. If you tell someone I'm too busy, the end of that phrase is for you. Oh, God. When you like someone, you can be the busiest person. Person on the planet. Like, let's say today is a rainy Monday. It's Monday. We're busy working, like 12 hours a day, 14 hours a day. But if you were dating someone and you really like them, you're like, oh, you know, let's grab a bite, let's sleep together. Let's watch a movie. You always fit that person in your schedule. Do you guys agree or not?

[C]

Sometimes.

[A]

Sometimes.

[C]

Yeah. I don't. I mean, I try to take it out of. I used to say, yes, you're right. I. I would take it, but I've been working lately on taking it out of the black and white. Right. And really putting an asterisk on it just because. Yeah, you can be very interested. Okay? We're all very busy. We all have things to do. You're absolutely right. But there are also seasons of that busyness. Right. And there are times where you're like, I really like you. I really want to get to see you. But I unfortunately don't work nine to five. I, you know, or I have to travel. So I can't give you that just yet. But if you really think you're interested when I come back or when we can make that time, we can do that. But most women don't like that. They don't want to wait.

[A]

Same for you, Michael, because obviously you travel all the time. You're going to travel this week. You're always on the go. Do you believe you find time if you want to pursue someone or you're kind of like Henderson, you're like, you know, maybe I'm just too busy right now.

[B]

Woody Allen said, the heart wants what it wants. And I think this is like I talked about earlier with the thunderbolt. If you're interested and engaged and enchanted and infatuated, you know, it. It's a different feeling than anything else.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

It is consuming and it is motivating and it. It is beautiful. I mean, it's. You remember that song? There was a really beautiful song called I Wish I Was in Love Again. And the lyrics are all about how crazy it is and how, you know, complicated it can be and.

[C]

But I wish I was in love again. Yeah. Now, here you go.

[B]

Take that.

[C]

Take that for one second and then use that scenario I gave and go, hey, you know, yeah, I'm going to be a little patient. Yeah, you can communicate, but I'm going to be a little patient because I might not get to really start spending that real time for maybe three weeks later. Right. And then how wonderful life can be. But because they're so right now that you miss out on the best things. I'll tell you, I am a vibe. Right. I know that. So you miss out on all this cool, like, you know, relaxing, fun, caring, loving because you couldn't be patient just to, you know, to take a chance on that.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So, girls, listen up. Be patient if you meet someone, because I know that's. And I agree. Look, I'm a woman girl. I know how girls are because all my besties are men. I told Michael that I just get along better with men because I think women are very difficult in general. And I know a lot of times a girl meets a nice guy and they want everything, like, right away. Like, they want a commitment and they want you to make plans. And I want you to do this, do that, do that, and. And you just nailed something really important. Sometimes, like, just pace it. You don't have to. You cannot meet someone and then build a relationship with them in two weeks, Right?

[C]

I don't think so, but I don't know.

[A]

I don't think so, but I don't know.

[C]

Yeah. I mean, I'm looking at the guy that's been divorced four times. So I don't know. Like, is that really how this goes? I don't.

[B]

Don't believe in love at first sight then. Or I do.

[C]

I do still do that. Yeah. 100%. 100%.

[B]

And there's. There's a seduction dance that takes place. And it's not that you want to play games, but there is the fun of it, you know, of.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Of having that sort of tay to tay.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like it's. It's just magic when it happens.

[A]

I completely agree. The countdown is on. Holiday shopping season is officially here. Uncommon Goods takes the stress out of gifting with thousands of unique, high quality finds you won't see anywhere. So don't wait until last minute. The most meaningful gifts get scooped up fast. And now's the perfect time to cross names off your list. Uncommon Goods looks for products that are high quality, unique, and often handmade or made in the usa. Many are crafted by independent artists and small, small businesses, making Every gift feel meaningful and truly one of a kind. I found this anti stress heart shaped pillow that I am madly in love with and sure enough all my friends and family members that come over and see it fall in love with this pillow. So I bought several of them as gifts and believe me, the price is incredible. Under 100 bucks, Uncommon Goods has something for for everyone. From moms and dads to kids and teens, from book lovers, history buffs, die hard football fans to foodies, mixologists, every gardeners, you find thousands of new gift ideas that you won't find anywhere else. When you shop at Uncommon Goods, you're supporting artists and small independent businesses. And with every purchase you make it, Uncommon Goods they give back $1 to a non profit partner of your choice. They've donated more than three, $3 million to date. So don't wait. Cross those names off your list before the rush to get 15 off your next gift, go to uncommongoods.com cat that's uncommongoods.com cat K A T for 15 off Uncommon Goods were all out of the ordinary. Now guys, I. Michael, you probably can give us a good answer, but. But because you've been divorced four times. But I'm sure Henderson must have been. In relationships, what is a major deal breaker for you guys in a woman? Like you're dating someone or married, whatever it is you like them. Is there something like major, major, major red flag that you say, okay, that's it.

[B]

Go ahead.

[C]

Michael, thanks for.

[A]

When you guys are both like you're serious staring in space, let's talk about.

[B]

One of the traditional ones is something that you just mentioned and that is that all of your friends are men that some guys can't handle. That, that you would date, I'm guessing, right? Has that caused you problems in the past?

[A]

Never. Because. No, because I tell you why. Two reasons. First reason, I only date men that are super confident, like type A personality, that know their game. They're like, okay, I'm with her because I'm loyal to a fault. I'm loyal like a dog. It is literally what turns me on when I'm in a relationship is because I want to be with one man. My man. So either you trust me or you don't. I do not want to date some child that is like insecure or you know, I introduce all my guy friends. You know, they're literally like my brothers. But I do not want to date a guy that is insecure because I have male friends. I want to date a guy that knows like no matter what she's doing. She's mine. You know, that's the kind of man that I like. So it never caused problems for me. But I guess so for you, it would be a red flag if a girl has a lot of male friends, Michael.

[B]

No, I'm just. You brought it up and it occurred to me, you know, but it's a.

[C]

Great point, you know, Michael. Yeah, go ahead.

[B]

No, I just think that you evolve about these things. And again, it's very situational. If you say that and you're sensitive to the fact that this could be awkward and you are so, you know, protective and supportive of this person that you're interested in, I think that's a mature way to go about it. For instance, if Henderson were with a woman and the, you know, when he goes out, 16 other women approach him, he's got to find a way to diffuse that, I'm guessing, right? Like, and even if they are your friends or you're just, you know, if the server calls you honey, sometimes women get upset about things like that.

[A]

But look, it's all about trust, isn't it? Like any relationship, it's about being loyal to each other and you trust the person you are with. Don't you guys think?

[C]

So I'm going to say, and this is actually my answer, I'm going to say boundaries. I think boundaries is the real truth. And so for me, yeah, I know men, right? And I know there's different categories of us, right? And so I know the player, I know the guy, I know the. I know the friend zone guy. I know the guy that, you know that's your bestie, that you love to death, that will bag you down right now, soon as the cameras go off, right? So we understand, right? We understand all of that. So for me, it's like, well, how do you interact with that and what are those boundaries, right? And it's the same thing with female friends that I have, that I have no desire to sleep with, right? So when I'm single, we still have. I still have boundaries with them, right? So there's certain things I do and certain things I don't do, and we could do things together and, you know, whatever. But then when I have someone that's in my life, right, those still those same people, we interact the exact same. So there's no odd, you know, there's no odd awkward scenario because there are boundaries that I put in place to make sure that a woman would feel comfortable and confident with, you know, X, Y, Z person. And so if she has those boundaries I'm good. If she doesn't, then that's the biggest red flag in my life. If you don't have boundaries just in your life, period.

[A]

Now that I agree, you have to have boundaries for sure. But I think at the end of the day, you just respect whoever you're dating. It's all about respect and loyalty. Don't you guys agree?

[B]

I agree sound easy, but it is.

[A]

Either you're loyal and respect for you're not, that's it. It's very easy. But neither one of you answered my question. What is a deal breaker for you guys?

[C]

Yeah, well, when I say boundaries, I mean boundaries.

[A]

That's your deal.

[C]

You know, people who just, they, they. I've, I've met a few people, one from one extreme to the other. I've met a woman who literally was. She was married before and she was so. She was nice, I mean, very nice actually. But she was so wild and enjoying life, right? So, so much so that every human being that she talked to, she had to talk to, right? Or if there were a group of people, she had to go, you know, put herself in that space. And, and when I sent her back to the streets, my comment to her was, my comment to her was, you know, you're, you're a lovely person. But I said, there's a couple of things that, you know, I just can't, I can't deal with. 1. Is that my opinion? And she asked me, so I basically shared this with her, is that if you don't have enough self respect for yourself to appreciate the person that you're with, whether it's me or someone else, because they're giving their time to want to spend with you. You want to share that with strangers and do that, that's a lack of boundaries and control, self control. And I said, that's just something that I don't want to be a part of. And then other things that just were like, oh, wow, you live dangerously, right? Bringing a lot of different energy and strangers into your life, into your world. And you know, people have ulterior motives and it's just a crazy world. And I'm like, I'm too protective of you know what I built what I'm doing, where I am in life, you know, the work I do, the things I do, blah, blah, blah. And so I sent her back to the Boulevard.

[A]

The boulevard. How about you, Michael? What's a deal breaker? I mean.

[B]

Well, I think, you know what, there was a play that was really well titled and it was called I love you. You're perfect. Now change. I think about that very often because sometimes the things that will attract you to a woman over the long haul or a man, maybe you can't live with, maybe you like initially that they're sassy or outspoken or, you know, party girl or, you know.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Things that got you to the party, then you're, you're not happy with long term. So I, I, I, I am aware of that kind of thing.

[A]

That is so true.

[B]

But I do. You know, George Bush had a phrase called the flexible freeze. And when you talk about deal breakers, I think love is a flexible freeze. Because you can go in with all these ideas about what you'll accept and what you won't, but sometimes that freeze is flexible. If the love.

[A]

Yeah, that is so true. Last but not least, before we run out of time, this is a topic that I talk on Cat on the Loose for many years. Different experts have different opinions. I know mine, but I want to know you, because since you guys are men and single men, I want you guys to tell me what you think. I have this belief based on my experience. Okay, that's just me, Katherine. I'm not an expert. It's just my experience that most men, even if they say they're not, and I think we talked about it as well a little bit last week, most men are intimidated by successful women, women that have a lot of things going on, even if they say they're not at the beginning, or do you guys remember we talked a little bit?

[C]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

Now please tell me, do you agree with me? You think it's total baloney. Please be honest. Or you can talk about your experience. Are you guys, do you feel intimidated? Like if you meet a girl that is super successful, has a lot going on, or maybe make more, more money than you or as much money as you, is it too much for you? Or do you feel like you're gonna compete with her art or just feel intimidated by all of that? Or not. It's all.

[C]

Yeah. So my answer is split. So for me, I'm completely comfortable with it. I've dated even some of my longer term relationships. They made way more money than me. They've been heirs to, you know, billionaire families, you know, what have you. And I fit right in. So I felt comfortable in that space and I'm okay with that completely. However, even though they were wildly successful, they controlled their masculinity and they brought femininity to the relationship. And so that really made it very comfortable for me because I don't want to Fight the world on my own task and then come home and fight, you know, again. So that was really important. But I will say over the years that, yeah, I think most men, and like, most men might kill me for this, but I think most men are. They say they want an independent woman, but then when they get one, they can't handle that.

[A]

I agree. I totally agree. How about you, Michael? What do you think?

[B]

No, I. I aspire to be with women who can bring new intellect and new excitement. I. I was married to a dentist, and I remember the first time when I was, you know, started dating her. I went to her practice to drop off a card or a flower or something, and from the lobby I could see into the operatory where she was working. And I stopped in my tracks for a minute and I said, look at that.

[C]

Yeah, there's something about it. Yes, yes.

[A]

There's something about a woman with a career.

[C]

Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, and I think women should understand that, like, especially, you know, when they. When they become our age, right. They get older and they start wondering, you know, yes, there's guys that just want to sleep with them. But then there are men out there, and I've been saying this for decades, like, there are men that sincerely are attracted to you, that care for you and want to get to know you. And if, you know, we can, you know, find that balance between, yes. Your masculinity and your responsibility and your career, and then also still be a woman, you're going to find what you're looking for. Because we do exist. Like, we do. We do like that. We do want that, but that is fine.

[A]

But I love that you both said that. I really do.

[B]

Right now, Kat, my biggest crush is on the Prime Minister of Italy, Giorgio Maloney. Does that answer your question?

[A]

Georgia Maloney. There you go. No, but I love that you guys are saying that because I hope women out there are listening. I'm a huge proponent, right, for women being independent, having careers, being financially independent. I don't like sugar babies at all. I think that's such a stupid idea. But I'm happy that you guys are saying that you are attracted to girls that have stuck stuff going on, because that's the message we send out there. Get a life, do stuff. Right. Because, yeah, you're going to be more attracted to a great partner.

[C]

Well, even when they're younger and, you know, you see the potential that they have, it's a. It's an exciting push to get them to continue to work harder or, you know, you know, negotiate Better at their careers or, you know, whatever that is.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

You know, to make them better than they ever thought they could be. For sure.

[A]

Thank you, guys. You have been amazing. I appreciate you opening up your. Your bedroom, Michael.

[C]

I don't. I don't. That's a one sided comment.

[A]

But you showed us. I said, Michael. I said, Michael. Well, you showed us your fireplace. You open up your mind. You guys are super honest. I adore both of you. I will say that. Michael, Michael, one of the things that I admire so much about you is girl, look at that. This is for the guys listening how much women like gestures. You are one of the dying, dying art in the world that actually writes cards. Handwritten cards.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I'm so freaking old school because I write everything. And I think that's such a kind, sweet, nice gesture. So obviously you're a gentleman. You deserve a lot more than a foodie call.

[B]

Well, I'll tell you one fast one if you still have time. I had a first date down in Redondo beach, and I was running late and I said, I gotta. I always take something. I always take some little gift. And I said, shoot, I'm out of time. I gotta get something. Oh, at the Ivy, they have candles. So I'll run up to the Ivy, park the car, jump in, get the candle and drive out. So I run up into the Ivy, I asked for a candle, they bring it down all packaged, and they said, okay, that'll be $97. I was like, did you say $97?

[A]

Oh, my God.

[B]

Now, of course, I had to buy it because it would be too embarrassing. They packaged it all up and everything. But as I'm driving to Redondo, I'm like, I don't know this woman. It's a $97 candle. She's not going to know it's a $97 candle because she's from Redondo to be a dol. So luckily, about three blocks before the bar where I was to meet her, the restaurant, there was a Michael store. I ran in there and got a $15 candle, swapped it out and gave her that. And so now when I go to the Ivy, India Irving always says to me, did anybody get the real candle yet?

[A]

So you're holding the. Well, look, it's understandable because if it was a date from Beverly Hills, we know what the Ivy is, we would understand it. But I totally agree with you. Like a date, somebody you just met. It wouldn't even make sense.

[B]

So she wouldn't know.

[A]

So I'm like, I don't blame you. I don't.

[B]

I want to meet a candle worthy woman. If you like candles. Here we go right here.

[A]

I have a crazy candle story that I actually did a podcast episode about it, but that was a completely different chaotic situation because I was dating someone for many, many, many months last year that you got to listen to the episode. It was one of our top episodes. And my boyfriend, he was my boyfriend, he bought himself a Lamborghini for Christmas. So I bought him. Yeah. So I bought him, like, what am I gonna give this dude? So I bought him a bunch of Lamborghini wines. La la la la. Very long story.

[B]

Thoughtful. Yeah.

[A]

Then he gave me nothing for Christmas. And then a few days after Christmas, he gave me a candle from. From a French store on Melrose. And I went there to the store and I found out he bought two exact cand candles.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But this was not like it's different. Like in your case, your story, you said you were giving a candle to somebody that you'd never met. That's a very appropriate G. But if you're dating someone for six months, you are all over their life, right? And after Christmas, you're like, oh, here, I gave you a candle. And he bought another candle for somebody, some co worker at the same time. That's like super insensitive, right? I mean, that's. That's a deal.

[B]

The scary part is you went up there to sleuth it out, though.

[A]

I went there with a girlfriend. Yeah. It's a long story. I'll send you the link to the episode so you can listen to the whole thing. It's called Lamborghini's Luncher and Candle. I think we lost Henderson. I don't know what happened to him, but I'm gonna say Henderson. Thank you so much for. For doing this. You guys are incredible. Michael Save changes Travel travels. I'm so grateful that you're here. I'm sure. Cheers. With love. Because I'm not drinking alcohol. I'll drink a glass of champagne when you come back from Vegas because I know you're going to cover the race and do an amazing job. I'm very grateful. Thank you. You're super talented and tell people where they can listen to your radio show because it's fabulous.

[B]

Mibigshow.com if you're interested in the travel writing, my book is Travel Tattler, which you can get at Amazon. You'll find other books there too. But I love to hear your travel stories. So find me on Instagram and tell me the places you've been and give me suggestions and let's talk travel over a good glass of wine and a candle.

[A]

I love that deal. Done, done and done. I'll talk to you soon, guys. Be safe out there and never give up on finding love. I'll talk to you very soon.

[C]

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[B]

Or your money back.

[C]

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