JACOB M HOFF & SAMANTHA WYNN GREENSTONE

Summary

Kat on the Loose

Host: Kat Zammuto
Guests: Jacob M. Hoff & Samantha Wynn Greenstone
Episode Date: December 12, 2024

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Episode Overview

This episode features a candid, heartfelt, and humorous conversation with viral social media couple Jacob M. Hoff and Samantha Wynn Greenstone. Kat dives deep into their unique love story—one that defies stereotypes and norms: Jacob is an openly gay man, Samantha is a straight woman, and yet they’re married, madly in love, and living authentically despite frequent curiosity and criticism from the public and even within queer circles. The discussion covers the origins of their connection, navigating societal expectations, personal growth, and the message that true love transcends labels.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. How Jacob and Samantha Met

[05:45–09:52]

• Samantha recalls auditioning for Fiddler on the Roof in San Diego, where she almost didn't go, but felt compelled last minute ("Just go," 06:50).
• Jacob was immediately impressed by Samantha’s audition energy:

  “That person has balls...whoever that is—immaculate person.” (Jacob, 07:20)

• The two ended up cast together, living in the same resort during the run, and quickly became inseparable friends with immediate, unexplainable chemistry.

2. From Friendship to Romantic Relationship

[10:00–15:06]

• They both felt confusion—Jacob as a gay man feeling ‘date’ vibes, Samantha feeling an unplaceable soul connection beyond typical gay-straight friendships.
• Samantha describes the pull as, “like reuniting with someone you’ve known in the past...his energy felt familiar and safe.” (11:02)
• For 18 months, they maintained a close friendship, wrestling with feelings that didn’t fit standard narratives.

3. Taking the Leap—Finding Clarity

[14:11–21:20]

• Samantha consults with an energy healer who tells her:

  "You two share a spiritual umbilical cord." (14:51)

• Empowered, Samantha texts Jacob to ask if he feels ‘more than friends.’ Jacob, after initial confusion, admits:

  “Of course I feel more for you, and I’m willing to try something here.” (20:44)

• Their relationship turns romantic, and, against the odds, it works both emotionally and physically.

4. Navigating Stereotypes & Backlash

[16:13–24:35]

• Discussion of criticism, especially from within the queer community—concerns about “conversion” narratives or undermining the idea that being gay is not a choice.
• Jacob is adamant:

  “Please, don’t try to push yourself on a gay person…there’s nothing more annoying.” (Jacob, 17:34)

• They emphasize never seeking to convince others to pursue similar relationships, only sharing their lived experience.

5. Monogamy, Identity, and Therapy

[23:32–27:16]

• Kat asks if their marriage is ‘open’; Jacob replies unequivocally:

  “Absolutely not…People think I must be suppressing my queer feelings, which is not the case. The thing that suppresses it is not being able to verbalize it.” (Jacob, 23:32)

• They attend couples therapy; their counselor shares she’s also in a unique orientation relationship—validating and giving them community.

6. Labels, Non-Binary Love, and Representation

[26:27–27:35]

• Realization that their relationship doesn’t fit common binaries; a friend calls their connection "non-binary in a way" (26:27).
• Still, Samantha emphasizes she’s a straight “girly girl” and Jacob remains gay/masculine—they just found an authentic, singular love.

7. Family, Social Acceptance, and Bridging Gaps

[27:50–40:14]

• Jacob grew up in a conservative family but found them surprisingly supportive; more skepticism comes from “woke” or liberal communities (28:09).
• Both see their relationship as a potential “bridge” between straight and LGBTQ+ communities—helpful for social understanding and acceptance.

8. What Love Really Means—Breaking Down the Experience

[41:34–44:38]

• Jacob and Samantha agree:

  “It’s not about that… I look at her and it’s the most beautiful thing I’ve ever seen—the most beautiful being.” (Jacob, 41:34)

• Both feel they’ve become their happiest, most authentic selves together.
• Emphasize loyalty and total honesty as foundation ("Brutally honest without being brutal," 43:53).

9. Social Media Journey: TikTok Fame and Authenticity

[47:22–54:01]

• Jacob explains the origins of his viral “Top Five” TikTok videos, mixing humor and oddities (e.g., “top five most popular birthdays”—most are in September, 50:05).
• Both note how being authentic and unfiltered works better than scripted, overly-edited content.
• Kat encourages them to create more joint content given their chemistry.

10. Life, Creativity, and What’s Next

[56:10–58:43]

• Currently producing a short documentary about their wedding/relationship with Shark Pig Studios, aiming for film festivals.
• Dream of creating a podcast and possibly reality or scripted TV.
• They hope to have children in future (“Kids are expensive!” Samantha, 57:01).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Following the Connection:

  “I wish everyone in the world met a person like that, that they feel truly…” (Kat, 15:06)

• On Navigating Criticism:

  “It means you’re doing something right if you’re pissing someone off.” (Samantha, 54:59)

• On Building a Foundation:

  “We would rather be brutally honest to each other, without being brutal.” (Samantha, 43:55)

• On Love’s Power:

  “Love is love…Don’t stop yourself from loving somebody just because you… feel one way or another.” (Jacob, 58:28)

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Important Segments & Timestamps

• Meeting at Fiddler on the Roof – [05:45–09:52]
• Realizing Deeper Feelings – [10:00–15:06]
• Energy Healer Epiphany – [14:11–15:06]
• Coming Out as a Couple – [17:43–21:27]
• Addressing Assumptions and Peer Pressure – [23:32–27:35]
• Therapy and Representation – [26:53–28:09]
• Social Media Critique & Strategy – [29:46–32:12]
• TikTok Fame and Creativity – [47:22–54:01]
• Plans for the Future and Family – [56:10–58:43]
• Closing Thoughts: Love Has No Boxes – [58:07–58:43]

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Final Themes & Takeaways

• Authenticity Above All: The couple’s success on social media and in life hinges on unapologetic honesty, humor, and rejection of externally imposed boxes.
• Love Transcends Labels: Their relationship is proof that connection, loyalty, and mutual elevation matter more than gender or orientation norms.
• Bridging Communities: Jacob and Samantha’s story offers new language and representation for relationships outside the expected, creating a bridge for understanding and inclusion.
• Encouragement to Others:

  “Go look for love in any way, shape, form, person that shows up, right?” (Kat, 58:07)

• A Message for Listeners:

  “Don’t stop yourself from loving somebody just because you… feel one way or the other. If you’re straight and you have a connection with a dude friend…just make it happen.” (Jacob, 58:28)

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Find Them Online:

• TikTok: @jakemhoff (2.4M+ followers)
• Instagram: Jacob M. Hoff & Samantha Wynn Greenstone
• YouTube: Sam and Jacob Show

Closing Note from Kat:
“This was a very special Kat on the Loose. Your love is inspiring.” (59:13)

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For anyone seeking a testament to boundary-breaking love, emotional resilience, and the transformative power of authenticity, this is a must-listen episode.

Transcript

[Kat]

Guys, thanks for helping me carry my Christmas tree.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Zoe, this thing weighs a ton. Drew Ski, lift with your legs, man. Santa.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Santa, did you get my letter?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

He's talking to you britches. I'm not.

[Kat]

Of course he did.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Right, Santa, you know my elf, Drew Ski here. He handles the nice list. And elf, I'm six' three. What everyone wants is iPhone 17 and at T Mobile, you can get it on them. That center stage front camera is amazing for group selfies, right, Mrs. Claus.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Hi, Mrs. Claude Claus, much younger sister.

[Kat]

And AT T Mobile, there's no trade in needed when you switch, so you can keep your old phone or give.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

It as a gift.

[Kat]

And the best part, you can make the switch to T mobile from your phone in just 15 minutes.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Nice. My side of the tree is slipping. Kimber, the holidays are better. AT T Mobile, switch in just 15 minutes and get iPhone 17 on us with no trade in needed. And now T mobile is available in U.S. cellular stores with sweet monthly bill.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Credits for well qualified customers plus tax and $35 vice connection charge credits and.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Imbalance due if you pay off earlier. Cancel financing agreement. 256 gigs. $830. Eligible for it in a new line. $100 plus a month plan with auto fees required. Check out 15 minutes or less per line.

[Kat]

Visit t mobile.com I am so excited to tell you guys about my guests today because I'm a huge fan and I absolutely adore them. I follow their amazing work on social media. They are fun, they are funny, they are amazing. They're actors, they're artists. And here's the different thing about them. They're married. They are in love. They've been together for six years. They literally just got married and they. Jacob is gay, Samantha is not. And they get a lot of questions, a lot of backlash about it. They're super, super open, talking about their incredible friendship, incredible relationship. Jacob has millions of followers on Tik Tok. He's super fun, super witty, super smart. And they're here to talk about all of it with us. Breaking rules, breaking stereotypes, and proving that you know what, Love has no boundaries. It has no rules. It's really all about how you feel about each other at the end of the day. I really hope you guys enjoy this amazing episode with these two adorable, adorable, fabulous people with incredibly great energy. Jacob M. Hoff and Samantha Wynn Greenstone. This episode of Cat on the Loose is brought to you by Girly a la mode. Building a worldwide community for body positivity, self love and inclusion. Every model body is beautiful. Every single piece on the collections is great for every single body, regardless of size, height, background, age. Super cozy hoodies, sweatshirts, beanies, sweatpants, adorable affordable gifts. Everything on the website is under 100 bucks. Check it out, you're gonna love it. And of course I love the message. Let's spread some love with Girly G I R L I E A la Mode Girly Alamode Shopping and on Instagram, Girly a la Mode. Are you an entrepreneur, business owner, or major expert in your field? Guess what, Your knowledge is worth money and you can monetize it. Maybe you already even have a course out there in one of these video uploading platforms and you're super frustrated because you don't know how to grow your brand. Let me tell you about Lightspeed vt, the only high technology, multi million dollar interactive training system in the world. And this is why Fortune 500 companies, CEOs, entrepreneurs, and some of the most successful people on the planet, such as Grant Cardone, Cardone University, Tony Robbins, Damon John are using it and making millions of dollars there. With light speed, you will be able to monetize your know your online courses millions of times faster and take your business to the next level by reaching a massive audience quickly, generating hundreds of thousands in monthly revenue and scaling super quickly. You want to see a demo, you want to get a free consultation? DM me, I'll hook you up. Or send a message. Text WhatsApp to 310-692-0578 and start the year monetizing your content big time on LightSpeed VT. Samantha, Jacob, welcome to Cat on the Loose.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Thank you.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Very stoked to be here.

[Kat]

I mean, I don't even have words, you know, I'm so excited. It's such an honor. I was saying before I got started, I'm a fan. I'm a huge fan of your work and mostly I'm a fan of your vibe.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Thank you.

[Kat]

I love you guys have the best energy.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

You too.

[Kat]

Thank you.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Honestly, we saw that right away. We were like, okay, she's the right person to sit down with.

[Kat]

I feel very honored because I'm sure a lot of people are going to try to invite you guys and because your story is so rich. So I want to pack up as much information as we possibly can because, you know, let's do this Fast and furious in 45 minutes. I know. Jacob, you have a huge, massive audience on social media. It's adorable how you tell people to follow some answers, follow some answer more and more because I hope the whole world finds out about her, but for people that don't know you guys. So let's rewind the story, and then we'll get to. To the wedding and everything else. You guys been together for six years, right? A long time. You just.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah, almost.

[Kat]

Almost eight.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah.

[Kat]

Holy cow.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

I know.

[Kat]

This is, like. I know. And for people that don't know, tell us, like, in a nutshell, how did you meet and, you know, how'd you decide? Okay, let's be a couple. We love and adore each other.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah. Do you want to start?

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Sure. Well, so it was 2015, it was the Monday after Thanksgiving, and I was in LA most of the time. Like, I wasn't. I hadn't fully lived in LA or fully moved, and I.

[Kat]

Okay, so where are you from?

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

I'm from San Diego.

[Kat]

Oh, okay.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

So I was bopping between contracts, kind of going, like, traveling to Northern California, wherever a theater contract would take me. But there was an audition happening the Monday after Thanksgiving. I was exhausted. I was like, I don't want to drive down to San Diego and do this audition, because I know how their auditions are. They take all day. It's like one of those places where you audition and then they do the callbacks on the same day, which is kind of unheard of in the theater industry. It's usually like, you audition, maybe you get a call back days later. And so I was just, like, not feeling it, but then something told me to go or I would regret it. I wasn't gonna go. And then at the last minute, just my gut was like, just go.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Just go.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And so I drove down and I sang and ended up getting a call back. Then they make the cuts and, you know, they keep the people for the callbacks. So I was there all day, and then I go in for the role of Frumasera. This is for Fiddler on the Roof, by the way.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Do you know Fiddler on the Roof?

[Kat]

Yeah, of course.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Okay, so Frumasera is the crazy witch in the dream.

[Kat]

Yes.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

So I'll let Jacob take the story from here, because this is where he came.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

So I'm sitting in the lobby and. And they bring the people in who are doing Frumase Sarah. And it's, like, quiet, and there's, like, all that tension for, you know, at an audition that there goes on, and all of a sudden there's just this, like, through the walls, and I'm like, what the hell was that? Because that was, like, a person. That person has balls. Even though that's women in there, that person has Gahones to make that sort of noise in a place like that. And I was like, whoever that is. Immaculate person.

[Kat]

So it didn't scare you? On the contrary. You were attracted.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Oh, I was immediately like, wow. Because, you know, everybody's trying to put on their best or their airs and be something else. And that the whole point is to just be like, crazy.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And it literally says in the script, she screams. So that was my version of a scream. And no one was screaming?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

No, there was no.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Like, if I'm gonna get this, it's because I'm gonna scream.

[Kat]

So you met her?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yes. They all come out of the room. And I. I know who it is. I mean, there's multiple people, but I just said, that's the person who made that cackle. And I was like, if they don't give you that part, they're crazy. Because that was something.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And then, like, later that week, like, they gave us the offers and Jacob ended up booking it too.

[Kat]

Oh, wow.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And it didn't start rehearsals until the beginning of January, so we didn't have any communication until then. And then the first rehearsal, we're singing through the score. They're teaching you the parts of the music. And then there's a break. And I'm sitting in the lobby and I'm like, very into water. So I had these two giant, like, water bottles. And Jacob approached me and started talking to me about my water. Cause he just.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

I believe in, like, clean drinking water. And yeah, it was just like. But immediately it's like, okay, this is something than anybody else I've ever met. And it's an immediate. Like, we just want to be together all the time. And so this weird. This place where we were doing the show, you live on a resort for they house.

[Kat]

You like, oh, nice.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah. So you really, you know, connect with the people who are living there. And we were both living there. And so we would hang out every single day and it would go till 4am and I would leave. And it would be this kind of weird thing where it's like, I'm leaving now. But it felt like I didn't want to. And, yeah, there was like this.

[Kat]

It was like the universe. It was something magical. But now. Okay, so then the story complicates for people who don't know you, who are not you.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Right.

[Kat]

Because you're gay. You're an openly gay man, and you're not.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Right.

[Kat]

So did it start, like, did you guys think we're gonna be best friends? Or did you or immediately, like, feel.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

More than That I immediately felt confusion. I. I very distinctly remember maybe, like, the second or third time we hung out. We went to a restaurant. And I remember picking Samantha up and, like, being like, this is weird. This feels like a date.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And then he paid. Like, he paid for my food and everything. I'm like, why is he paying for my food?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

And it was like this weird thing where I was like, huh. This is, like, weirdly kind of nice. Like, I like doing this with this person. But I'm confused because this is a woman.

[Kat]

Right.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

And this just isn't a feeling I've had before. And, yeah, it was. It was kind of a strange moment. But then I kind of packed that away and was like, oh, no, we're friends. And that we went about our relationship as friends. Yeah. For literally 18 months.

[Kat]

Oh, wow.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

But it was very confusing for me because I was feeling.

[Kat]

Were you. Were you feeling attracted to him?

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah. Well, I mean, aside from just thinking that he's handsome, but his. His soul was like. I. I felt this just thing that I could not explain. Cause I've had many gay friends in my life and never felt the way with them that I felt with Jacob. It really kind of. Now that I know what it is, the best way I can describe it is your reuniting with someone you've known in the past. I'm very into energy like you too. So his energy felt familiar and safe, But I just didn't know where to place it because. And it was confusing. Cause I knew it was gay.

[Kat]

Huh.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah. And it was definitely a confusing process. But at the same time, it was, like, very practical. It was just like, this relationship is working the way it's going. And there was kind of this element of, like, maybe there is a more of a feeling here. But it was. It was hard to kind of take the leap and explore it because, a. I didn't want to ruin anything and be like, oh, we tried it, and now it's awkward because I can't be in a relationship with a woman. And it was scary to mess that up.

[Kat]

Yeah. I can't. So. Okay. So I'm sure a lot of people out there. And I know you get these questions all the time on social media. So how did you guys figure out, okay, let's take the leap. Let's be a couple.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Okay.

[Kat]

Because I know most. Because same. I have a lot of gay. And I love and adore them. I never felt this connection, but I just love them as, like, my best friend.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah, exactly.

[Kat]

But for you guys, obviously, it was so much More. You must have gotten to a point that you were like, okay, we wanna be more than just friends, right?

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah. I mean, eventually, I was just like, he had shown up for me. For the next 18 months of our lives, he was always my opening night date to whatever show we did or if I had an extra ticket to something, it went to Jacob. Like, he was the first person I thought of and I spent any free time with. And then I was doing a show in San Diego, and I was living with a friend, and they had gone to an energy healer, and they came back and they were like, oh, my gosh, Sam, you have to go see this energy healer. Because I just feel like the way that she delivered her message to me just, like, really registered with my soul. And this is someone who I also believe is, like, sensitive to energy and spiritual. So I was like. I saw a pep in their step, and so I was like, okay, I gotta go and do this. And so I went to this store, which is, like, in Little Italy, San Diego. And it's kind of a hodgepodge of everything. Like, you walk in, and there's, like, they're trying to sell you crystals and bracelets. They got a bracelet for everything, you know, and then they have, like, San Diego ball caps. Like, it's a little kiosky, too.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

It's legit.

[Kat]

Yeah. Okay.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

I mean, whatever works.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

I mean, really, like, if I had walked into this place on my own without a recommendation, I would have been like, this is a sham. And maybe it is a sham, but I walk in, I talk to this woman, and she's just kind of, like, assessing my life, and she's like, do you have anyone? Like, are you seeing anyone? And I was like, well, I have this connection with my best friend, and I just don't know what it is. And she, like, stopped me right there, and she's like, look where your hand is. I guess it was, like, right here. And she's like, your hand is right where your umbilical cord is. So what I'm sensing is that you two share a spiritual umbilical cord.

[Kat]

Oh, wow.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And that, like.

[Kat]

And that's how you guys feel?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah. I feel like it's, like, written in the stars. And I guess to explain our energy as, like, kind of like we're, like, attached by a cord that really kind of registered.

[Kat]

I wish everybody in the world met a person like that, that they feel truly. Yeah, right. Because, I mean, I can see it when I see both of you together. It's just, like, always so Magical.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Thank you.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Thank you.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And I feel like that's what we're trying to encourage people to do is look for the person that makes you.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Feel this way or don't look, just be. Just feel your. Your real relationships out and they. This will guide you. But when people are out there trying to find somebody, it's harder to do that.

[Kat]

I agree. I think sometimes it's. At least in. In my opinion, these things have to be organic. Yes. You can't push it. You can't force it. But again, in your case, I guess because most people. Right. We grow up with all the stereotypes. What a relationship should be like, what a couple should. Looks like, should look like. If you're gay, you're like this. If you're not. And once you guys decided to be a couple, I mean, everybody around you must have been like, so people ask you if you're bi or you're not gay. Right. You get. You get most of the criticism, right, Jacob?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Right. Yeah. I think there's. There's a couple things a lot of people, I think within the queer community, some people get defensive because I think any marginalized community, once when you experience hatred or you experience anything, you become defensive of, no, this is how I feel, and that's understandable. And I think a lot of queer people are saying to me or looking at me and going, well, how can you be gay? Because it sounds like you can change your feelings and suddenly be attracted to women if you're with a woman.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And they think we're like, pushing this conversion narrative and giving power to the. Being gay is a choice movement. And we're like, not at all.

[Kat]

I don't. You. At least I've never seen. From all. All the 10 millions of videos you guys put out there, I don't think I've ever seen you try to convince somebody to live their lives the way you do.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Right?

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah.

[Kat]

You're literally talking about your own personal experience. You're not saying, like, you should be like me.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah. I mean, there's people who reach out to us and say, hey, I have a connection with a gay friend. And we tell them, this may not be what we have. This is. We have something unique. And don't try to. Please, don't try to push yourself on a gay person.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Right.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

I mean, there's nothing more annoying. Oh, my God. Yeah. It's like, this has to be a really.

[Kat]

Okay, so now we know you didn't push yourself on it.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

No, seriously, she really didn't. There was so much tension of, like, don't like, screw this thing up. We both were like, don't screw this thing up. Because, oh my God, like, you didn't.

[Kat]

Want to lose the friendship.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

In fact, like, we'd had sleepovers a few times before and we'd slept in the same bed and like, where other of my gay friends, when I've slept in the bed with them, we would be like, oh, cute, we're spooning. Or like, let's go watch this.

[Kat]

Yeah.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Jacob and I would be like, oh my gosh.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Looking the other direction. Yeah.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Like, don't touch each other's foot by accident. But like, if we accidentally would touch each other's foot, it would be like.

[Kat]

You were being extra respectful. Yeah.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah. It was just so.

[Kat]

It took you. It was a journey to. It was a huge journey to decide, like, we're gonna be a couple.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Well, yeah. And it wasn't until I went to the energy healer and she gave me this thing where I was like, okay, like, I have to tell Jacob about it now. I was like, jacob, do you. I texted him and I was like, that same night. Because I was just like, I can't live with this any longer. Like, I will regret the rest of my life regardless of what the answer is, not at least trying if I don't tell him now. And so I texted him and I was like, do you ever feel more for me than just a friend? And it was like, I've never done anything like that before. Like, I never would dare with anyone. But I think.

[Kat]

Cause that's very brave. It takes a lot. Cause imagine if he said like, no, you're crazy.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Right? And I'm a little like as. As, like, you know, as like, like futuristic and progressive as we are. I'm a little old fashioned in the sense where I'm like, I want to be courted.

[Kat]

And I think everybody does. Right? Yeah. It's kind of like you want to be loved back.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Exactly.

[Kat]

It doesn't matter by who it is, but it has to be mutual. Right?

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

So like, the thought of me making the first move was like. I was like, no way. Like, he must make that. But I just couldn't live with it any longer and I just had to at least like throw it out there after I heard the energy healer say this. And so I texted him and asked him if he had any feelings more than a friend for me. And his response was, what do you mean? I'm just like, fuck, what did I do?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Well, because it really, that moment was. I say there were two feelings that happened. There was a lot of confusion and anxiety because now I'm having to confront this in. Out in the open. And there was also like, yeah, I do. And I. And this is something I've been waiting for and kind of wanting to say myself, but didn't have the words or the ability to do so or the courage to do so. And here comes this cackling witch who is able to just have the balls to say things. And it was intense. And it was. Yeah, it. So there was. There was a lot of turmoil. But I eventually, after what saying, what do you mean? A couple minutes later, said, of course I feel more for you, and I'm willing to try something here. And.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And my soul had already left my body at that point when he was like, what do you mean? So I'm, like, floating around. And then when he said, of course I do, it was like. It literally, I felt like I saw. I mean, like heaven or. Or, you know, it just was like unicorns, magic stars dancing in front of me. It felt like. Like the universe was giving us this high five that was like, yes. You found each other at the end of a movie.

[Kat]

I love that.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Like, the ending. Music should chime in.

[Kat]

And so you said, let's try something. You guys didn't know. You didn't know you were gonna end up getting married years later.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Right.

[Kat]

You're like, let's try. So you. You. So how do you try? It should be a coin or not.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

You try. And bang.

[Kat]

Did it work?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

It worked immediately. And that was like. Okay. Like, that was the. The telling thing. Honestly, it was. There was a lot of fear in me that it wasn't gonna work and that, I mean, to be explicit, that I wasn't going to be able to get home.

[Kat]

Right. Right. And I'm sure that's because that's what a lot of people are thinking, because when you say I'm gay.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Right.

[Kat]

And you. And you're very open about it on social media, which I per. That's my style. Yeah. I think is the best we can be is like, you have to be yourself.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

You have to.

[Kat]

And the more open and real you are, I think it's the. The better. The best. It's better for our personal lives. It' for everything we do.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Right.

[Kat]

And you talk about it all the time. Yeah, but of course, if you're gay, you're attracted to men, right?

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yes.

[Kat]

As gorgeous and fabulous and beautiful and ador. Now you're in person like you're a little doll.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Oh, my gosh.

[Kat]

You're so beautiful.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

You are, too.

[Kat]

Thank you. But I'm. I'm sure you were wondering, and a lot of people that follow your work and everything were. Ask. Are wondering how did you deal with that? Right.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

It was a really long pro. Like, what you see now is years of psychological work and going to therapy and even the first few years of our relationship, this. That was tumultuous, that there was a. There was a period of a honeymoon stage where we were together, and it was blissful and wonderful. But there were a few years where we were in continued confusion and distress, and figuring this thing out and resolving on it was really difficult. And it was. We never. I've never strayed from our relationship. We've been monogamous the entire time.

[Kat]

So it's not like. And forgive me if you don't want to ask, you don't have to. So it's not like you're married. Because I. I think a lot of people are going to ask when they listen to the podcast, and I don't know if they ask you on social media. Also, you're married to Samantha, but do you go out with men because you're gay?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Right. They. Absolutely not. And that's. That's shocking to people. And they think, oh, I must be suppressing my queer feelings if I'm not going out there and acting on them. Which is completely not the case. The thing that suppresses it is not being able to verbalize it. And so eventually, what. Because I was still having this blockade of talking about it this way, and therapy helped. And the most helpful thing was we eventually got to this point where we said, we need to go to a couple's therapist and say, we need to talk to somebody about this dynamic. It's not represented at all.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Right.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

You can't think of a character on television or if there's a character, it's Willie Graves.

[Kat]

Let's pitch it.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

That's what we're trying to do. Because it's like, if there's. Okay, there's a couple characters. Cabaret, Sally Bowles and Cliff.

[Kat]

Oh, my God, I never would have remembered that one.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Right. But so they have this dynamic. It ends in tragedy. They split up. Sally gets Will and Grace.

[Kat]

They weren't really.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

They weren't a couple exactly.

[Kat]

They were besties. And everybody has a bestie. Gay friend.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Exactly.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And that's.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

That's. A lot of people say, oh, you guys are Will and Grace. And we're like, we're not. And so there's really nothing. And. And to show that that's the only thing people have to draw from, shows that this isn't a thing. And so.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And it was very. So we didn't have like any role model or. Or any guidance to think that this sort of relationship could work. We were kind of walking around being like, is this like, are we crazy? Are we freaks?

[Kat]

Yeah, that's what I was gonna mention. And I really admire this about you guys. Obviously you have very strong personalities to make this decision on your own because I can only imagine the peer pressure or comments. I don't know how your families reacted or friends or everything. You really gotta be strong about who you are and what you want. Because I think a lot of people in your situation maybe wouldn't even have pursued it because, oh, what is everybody else going to say?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah, yeah, oh, yeah. And we eventually we went to this counselor, this couple's counselor, and she's talking to us and we tell her our dynamic fully. And she's like, shocked. And she goes, now this is weird because I'm married to a woman and she's the only woman I've ever been attracted to. I feel I'm straight, but I'm just married to this woman.

[Kat]

The other side of the coin.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah. And it was like a moment where it was like, oh my God, somebody else feels this way. And not only that, she's a couples counselor, knows how to talk about it, and her mind is blown. And we're like, wait a minute, we're not alone.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

And that was where we really made a turning point in how we felt and I think in our comfort in our relationship.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And it wasn't even until a few years ago when a friend of ours was like, you know, and we started talking about like, the binary. Our friend was like, your relationship is kind of non binary in a way. And I was like, okay. And I like took that to heart, I guess, because it kind of transcends gender and. And labels in that way. But I didn't take it.

[Kat]

Yeah. Like, I'm not sure. Right. Because I'm not an expert. But you're still like a girly girl.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Exactly.

[Kat]

You're a woman. You're not a lesbian.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Right? Right.

[Kat]

You're not a them. Right. You're like Samantha, the girl.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah.

[Kat]

And you're Jacob. And you still say it to this day like, I'm gay and I'm. I had my. Now it's the fiance, now it's the wife life.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Right. And I think of myself as a masculine guy. Like, I don't think of myself as A queenie gay dude. I'm very, I, I, and I like the idea of people having whatever they want to feel like. If you want, if you're masculine, be masculine. But that doesn't change the fact that I'm attracted to men.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And his identity is so important to him because he was not a. It took him forever to even just feel safe just saying to the world, I am gay. With his upbringing, with.

[Kat]

Where are you, where are you from?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

I'm from Olympia, Washington.

[Kat]

Okay. Is your family there?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

My family, some of them live in Washington still. Some of them live in Nevada. And they, it was a conservative upbringing and it was. And the interesting thing is through all of this, they've been very accepting. They've been the most accepting.

[Kat]

Wow, that's great.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

The, the, the, the people that we have the hardest time convincing are the woke people or the liberal people.

[Kat]

Why would you try to convince anybody? Yeah, like, why do you care?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah, exactly, exactly.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

But it's funny because some of the people who like go to bat for us in the comments are like conservative women who are like fighting with people who are like, you are harming the queer community. We're like, don't you understand? The work you've done for the queer community is.

[Kat]

Now let me tell you, you, Samantha. Oh, you guys might think I'm crazy, right? Because of course, nowadays social media, there's always the trolls, the craziest. I think they're the ones that need the most love because they're the ones that are unhappy with their own lives.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Oh yeah. Oh yeah.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah. And it's, it's really sad if you, Right. You just want to give them more love.

[Kat]

Yeah. Like, why do you care? Like if somebody makes a nasty comment or something or if they don't agree, they're not involved in your lives. They're happy.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

They have no idea sex.

[Kat]

Like whatever.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Like I say, it's like when they're judging that they're judging the one minute slice that we're giving them in this video. And we get it too, because the nature of social media is sensational. Yeah, you have, we have to start our videos with, I'm Samantha, I'm marrying a gay man, or I'm gay and I'm marrying a woman. And that it's obnoxious. And to people who watch us were like, they're like, why do you keep having to say that?

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Like, it's the package. It's how you reach more people.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Of course, because you know this. Every video doesn't just go to your followers it goes to everybody.

[Kat]

Yeah.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

And they. For the first time you're seeing this, you have to know right off the bat what you're getting.

[Kat]

Yeah. No, And I remember a long time ago, you actually did a video about it. I wasn't even doing TikTok because I don't know how to. I have no time. And you said, this is one of the things that you have to do, like, pick like. Like something strong about your personality and your lifestyle. And you put it out there and you, like, we're gonna talk about your top five list, of course.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Oh, yeah.

[Kat]

And you talk. In your case, you're like, I get angry and I'm excited. So you put it out. And I said, yeah, but it's true. You gotta repeat, repeat, repeat the message. That's how you draw an audience.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah, exactly.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

It's just like little tweaks, little things, and then it. It, you know, becomes better or. Yeah, it reaches more people, and it's.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Kind of like your whole unedited, unfiltered thing. I think when you lead with authenticity and you just put everything out there, some people are going to be like, wait a minute. This must be scripted. I think we're conditioned because there is so much scripted stuff that people want to look for. Where's the shtick in this? And yet there's a shtick. But it's still our real life. We just lead with humor and happiness and openness and.

[Kat]

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[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

We're not ashamed of of you know.

[Kat]

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[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah.

[Kat]

You know, I don't know how to be any other way. And I really put my stories out there a lot and I get a ton of backlash for it.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Right.

[Kat]

Because I open up too much. And why do you do this and why do you do that? Even like platforms, they're like, oh, if you package this way, if you and I sticking to my style, that's where I'm getting to where I am. Because like we were saying, my audience likes that I'm very honest. And I think it's the same with you guys. When you tell your story, you're just really being yourselves. You're not trying to convince anybody to do the same or be the same.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

No. And I don't want people who don't. Like, the people we want in our corner are the people who naturally just see it. And if they don't see it and you want to criticize, that's fine. I'm never going to please you anyway. And also, I don't want your energy around me. I just want the love around us. And the right people always find you.

[Kat]

Like I find.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Exactly. Finally.

[Kat]

I know. Finally. But before we talk about your work and we run out of time finalizing the relationship, you went to the. And I like that you said that, that it wasn't like all smooth sailing. Right?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Right.

[Kat]

You went through because like most relationships. Right. It takes a lot to build it up.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah.

[Kat]

So you. You went to the. To the couple's therapy and she related, and then you guys really became a couple.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, we had been dating for a few years, but that brought us to that place of security a lot more. I mean, a lot of the insecurities that we were facing and weren't able to verbalize came. Came about and we were able. We found other friends that have this dynamic too, because of that. And.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And people reaching out to us that we don't even know that are like, oh, my gosh, I thought that I was alone. I'm in this mixed orientation relationship now. We have this title, this term for it, and.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Oh, go ahead.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And as we are. We're seeing that as we're sharing, there are more people who have this, and it's just kind of like no one's talking about it. And that's inspiring us to continue to talk about it because it's not like we're saying this is a new age type of relationship. We're saying these types of relationships exist. And maybe if we stop focusing on the label so much and the check boxes and you just focus on the energy and the connection you have with someone that's really. Love is love.

[Kat]

In simple, purest terms, you nailed it. I think at the end of the day, it's all about love and who you love. And I think you just did a video about that a few days ago. Right. You said, oh, people ask me why did I get married? And you said. Said I love her.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah. Yeah, exactly. It's that simple. It's the. We share a life together. We've built a life for eight years. Our. Her family is my family now.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

My family likes him more than they like me, but you can see that.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

And my mom feels she has a daughter. And so many things that just what happen when your lives connect and combine that way.

[Kat]

I am so happy that both your families are supportive.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah. Goodness, they're amazing.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah.

[Kat]

Because I think that that's crucial. Right. It's one of the most important parts.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah.

[Kat]

Oh, yeah.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

And I think this is a really good bridge between the people who are still having a hard time accepting queer people and a queer lifestyle or an understanding, a queer brain. Because I think a lot of people who are conservative or. Or have an issue with this and is they. They understand our relationship because it's a classic relationship. It's a man and a woman on the outside. But because I can verbalize this is my attraction. I think they understand that. And it's. I think it's going to unite the two, which is what we want is straight people in the queer community to get along and come together. And I think that this dynamic is. Is literally like bridging those two things.

[Kat]

I love that.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah. And to me, it feels like. I think that's why there are some voices in the queer community or. Or in any community that feel like they need to shout from the rooftops. No, it's this. Because instead of just talking about it and explaining things in practical terms, I think people just feel like they have to yell at each other. And nothing's getting done. No progress is getting made because it's yell, yell, yell, yell, yell. And if we can just sit down and just be like, this is who I am. This is why I feel this way, and just be practical about it without judgment. I think that is the key to progress in all types of relationships. Dynamics, identifications.

[Kat]

One million percent, I think. And this is something that I'm never going to understand. Why do people decide, like, their relationships have to be this box? You know, like, if you get married, it has to be a woman and a guy, or if you're gay, you have to be this and that. And if you're not, you know, but it isn't, right, because each person has completely different feelings. And you never know who you're gonna love, who you're gonna find. Like you said, the. I don't think it's just physical connection. Obviously. It's mental. It's spiritual. It's so much more than that. And like, you just. You guys just said, love is love. Yeah. It doesn't really matter. Anything else matters. Right. All that matters is how you feel and if you guys are happy.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Exactly. Exactly. And it's. It's such a different feeling than that lustful thing. It's. You know, I say. I joke and say, I'm not looking at her being like that ass and them titties. And, you know, it's. It's not about that. I look at her and it's the most beautiful thing I've ever seen. It's the most beautiful being.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And I feel that way. When he looks at me, I feel my most beautiful, amazing self. In fact, I feel like since we've been together, I've just evolved into my most happy, authentic version of myself. I feel just safe being Samantha.

[Kat]

That's amazing.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

But nothing's ever going to change the fact that I attracted to men.

[Kat]

Yeah.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

It's just. That's just.

[Kat]

It's just your nature. And you must get hit by men all the time. Right. I would guess. Because, you know, there's always the funny thing that, like, I don't know, but I would think, like, they see, oh, I'm gay and I'm married to her. I would think a lot of guys are like, huh, let me see if I can get him.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Oh, yeah. I don't know. I mean, I honestly don't experience a lot of. I mean, every once in a while we experience something, you know, weird energy.

[Kat]

Yeah.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

We experienced something at a party earlier.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

That person gave us weird energy.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah. You can tell. But it's like, it's so yucky because you're like, I don't want anybody invading my relationship or trying to interfere with what we have going on.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

We don't give, like, the. The energy I think we give when we're in social situations is. No, like, we are not approachable in that way. We're approachable in other ways.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Right. There's. There's a clear switch.

[Kat]

I can really, really see the loyalty and the connection very well. Like, even before I met you guys, like, all you have to do is look at the videos and how adorable it is and everything you guys do and build together. You know, I can see that. And I love that. Every single video, you're like, follow my fiance. Someone the phone. And now it's like, follow my wife. Follow.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

I'm like, that is hard to remember to say wife. Now.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

People will yell at him like, she's your wife now.

[Kat]

And I'm thinking every couple in the world should treat each other like that.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah.

[Kat]

Regardless of whether you're gay, straight, whatever you are, you should have this kind of, like, loyal. Because to me, loyalty is on top of my list.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Oh, it's the number one thing.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

It's number one loyalty and honesty. Yes.

[Kat]

Yeah. Yes. And we.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

To be honest, we have never lied to each other.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yep.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Like, we. Even a white. A little white lie. We were like, we would rather be brutally honest to each other without being brutal. That's like our thing. Brutally honest without being brutal.

[Kat]

Yep.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

And so many of these, like, Hollywood relationships, you see them and they're also out for themselves and their own gain. And you see it, and then they. One becomes a bigger star and they drop the other person. It's like, what is. What is going on here? Like, why are you not support. You're stronger together. I mean, you. All of these power couples, they're stronger together. And it. It's like, why is this Ruthlessness still existing probably.

[Kat]

Usually, you know, relationships like that, they didn't have a good foundation.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Exactly.

[Kat]

Right. It's. It's very, very weak from the get go. And it's pretty obvious that you got. Yeah, superficial. And you guys build it up really solid from many years ago. And I think that's why you got to this place where you are today.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Right.

[Kat]

And the beauty. You guys, when. When did you get. You literally just got married, right? In Boca. 2 ago yesterday, 2 weeks ago in Boca Raton. Why did you guys pick Boca?

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Well, my parents moved there a few years ago and it's kind of become this like happy place that my family congregates during Thanksgiving. And we originally were like, well, we wanted kind of like old Hollywood vibes and we're like checking out spots in Beverly Hills. But we were like, I don't know, this just kind of feels like too noisy. We just kind of want like a more quiet, intimate, easy thing.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

South Florida is the original Hollywood because all those people who came over here from New York and built film studios would vacation in Florida back in the 20s or the early 1900s. So they built Hollywood to look like South Florida. Like the Beverly Hills Hotel looks like one of those Florida places.

[Kat]

Like the Boca Raton.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah, exactly, exactly.

[Kat]

I. I lived there for a really long time.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Really?

[Kat]

You did?

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

In Boca Raton?

[Kat]

Well, I met my husband. Now he passed away, the one I told you. But I met him in Boca. He lived in Boca. His company is. The headquarters were in Fort Lauderdale. So we would go back and forth between the west coast and East Coast a lot. But we were based in, In. In Miami, in Boca because of his work. So for 15 years, you know, I go back and forth.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Wow. Yeah, it's a gorgeous area.

[Kat]

My sister lives there. You know, I'm a California. I love la.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

I totally.

[Kat]

Yeah. But. But I like going there. To visit?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah.

[Kat]

I love the vibe to visit for a few days.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

It's sleepy. It's. Yeah. Really?

[Kat]

But you guys are not going on a honeymoon?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

No, we haven't planned one yet. I mean, the Boca was like our home.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

It kind of was like a mini moon. And we went to Guatemala a few months ago.

[Kat]

I saw it on your social media.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Jacob pissed me off. The Guatemalan government?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yes. I said they were the number six country with the most kidnappings.

[Kat]

Oh, my God.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

So they like invited us out to pr.

[Kat]

Oh, they invited you?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Oh, yeah. Took us all over the country. We met the president.

[Kat]

Okay, can you make like the top shittiest restaurants in Beverly Hills? And we pick the most expensive ones and see if they invite us there for dinner.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Literally. I know, I know. The worst, worst luxury car brand.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

We learned worst service.

[Kat]

Yeah.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

I was like, start talking about the mall de.

[Kat]

Like, I know, but let's explain to people what you do. Cuz you. You started this top five. It's top five, right?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah.

[Kat]

And it's hilarious. Some are serious, some are fun, some are funny. And you do it like super fast. And you grew this huge audience. How did you come up with that?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

You know, I was just pretty res. Resolute on doing TikTok and being like, we're going to. This is blowing people up. It's making them popular. We need this. And I was doing whatever for six months.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Like, I like, whatever. Like he would. I would come home one day and then he would be like, he like had bought a blonde wig off Amazon and put a bead in there.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

I was like this surfer character and my whole thing was just like watching videos and being like, oh, dude, this is crazy.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And I was like, okay, but whatever you want, honey.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

You know, you start with big and you just start paring down and it eventually just comes back to who you are. You are. And.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And his first list he made was. We were actually on vacation in Boca Raton.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

No, the. No, the first one was the orphans Musical theater. But that wasn't on vacation. That was here.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

That was here. Okay.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

So the top five mus or orphans of musical theater.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah. Cuz I was just like, oh, I love. We love musicals. Like, let's do a musical theater list. And I had been seeing them on there. Like a few people had done them. And I was like, this is an interesting concept because the way the algorithm works works. You want to watch videos to the end. That's the biggest thing to make a video successful. And I was like, well, if they're waiting to get to number one, that makes them watch the whole video. And so very clever. Yeah. It was just. It was like. I remember. I remember that thought coming and being like, this could be a million dollar idea. And that I did it. And it did. Okay. And then like a few weeks later, it kept getting views. And I was like, huh, that kind of worked. And then we were on vacation and I started doing more of them. And then they were like, like real. I mean, for me, it was like thousands of views. I was like, oh my God, I'm getting out of the hundreds of views jail and into me.

[Kat]

Yeah, I'm in tik tok jail because I don't do it every day. I, you know, I don't have time. My thing is my Instagram is. Is pretty decent. It's not enormous, but it's pretty decent. So, you know, time. Right?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Exactly. And just over and over and cons.

[Kat]

You have to do it every day.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Literally every day.

[Kat]

Every day. Every day.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Exactly. And. And you can take it down about.

[Kat]

I know, I see it.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah. The only day I took off was our wedding. But in the last two and a half year, basically.

[Kat]

Oh, my God.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah.

[Kat]

And how do you come up with so many ideas?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

I either research them on. I mean, there's so many lists that have a lot of them I just find online and repeat. And that. That's actually the funniest because it's like some of these things, you're like, what? Why is this on here?

[Kat]

I saw one the other day that I was laughing so hard. You were like the. The top most popular birthday. And it's like, I think four out of the five are September.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Oh, yeah.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And you're like, I don't know what.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah, but people get buck wild in December.

[Kat]

I love them. I mean, they're so creative.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

They're so creative. Or like, sometimes I'll be, like, focused working on something else, and he'll be making a video and then he'll just say something, and it just like, makes me cackle so much. Cause he's so funny.

[Kat]

Yes.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And you get.

[Kat]

Sometimes you don't. I don't know if you honestly get angry, but just like your personality, like.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

I lean into that. This, like, frustrate. I mean, I do have a lot of anger that lives inside of me. Oh, yeah, that's my.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

It's definitely gone down. It's gone down since I started making these.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah, it's an out. It's a really good outlet because it's like, put it into being mad at car brands instead of being mad at people or at the world or road rage or wherever it was coming out.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

But sometimes you will come up with them on your own. Like, the top five worst girl names. Like, he's like, Amy. I just don't like that name. Amy.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

That's. Those are the most Clickbait. Those are the worst. Those are like, what am I doing? Sometimes I make those and I'm like, what am I doing?

[Kat]

No, they're awesome. And sometimes, like you said when you. You read a list that you found somewhere, I think it was the top. The top healthiest foods. I don't know. And. But you actually say, like, oh, some Harvard dudes Put this list. So they must know what they're saying.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Oh, yeah, those Harvard dudes.

[Kat]

So you're very honest about it. Very, very, very real.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah. And like, coming back to the. We were talking about your podcast being organic, unedited. That's. I found the best method for that. Like, I used to edit them. I used to try to make them jazzier and film them better. No, no views. The best thing is just one long tape going at it.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And it's kind of soul crushing in some ways because we're so creative and we, like, at the beginning of our relationship, we would, like, make short films or, like, funny little shorts all the time. And so that sort of a thing, like, that's what we, like, thrive and love to do. But then we'll get really excited and make something creative and put it up. And people, like, don't really care about it because they really just want to sit you watch you sit and talk.

[Kat]

But I think now maybe you could try that. I don't know, as you become more and more famous and you grow and you're in the media and everything. Could try. Because I know I would love that because I like his videos, but I also love when you guys, because you have such great chemistry together, I would definitely come up with something, you know.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Like, oh, yeah, we have some content.

[Kat]

Creation that you can together. You know, like, we used to walk.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Around town with this mannequin. We drove, like, an hour and a half away to get a mannequin. And she was, like, a part of all of our videos. And we, like, gave her this character. And there was one time we took the mannequin to Caesar's palace, just.

[Kat]

Oh, my God.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Like, we had these characters, and Jacob was this character. And, like, we actually got kicked out of Caesar's palace because they were like, the man.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

I made too much of a scene outside of the city.

[Kat]

You got kicked out of Caesar's Palace. Wow.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

For carrying around this panic.

[Kat]

Because.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah.

[Kat]

Can you ever go back?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

I know.

[Kat]

You should do a list about them if they invite you back.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

I actually said, I think I did put them on the bed. Best hotels in Vegas. Because I do think they're one of the best. They're gorgeous. And the shopping. Oh, my God.

[Kat]

Oh, yeah. The forum, right?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Oh, my God. It's so cool.

[Kat]

Yeah. Oh, my God, you guys are awesome. How many. How many not views followers you have on tick tock millions?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

2.4 million.

[Kat]

Now 2.5.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

So if you just became 2.4.

[Kat]

2.4. Holy cow.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah, it's Crazy.

[Kat]

If you guys are listening and you want to look at the videos, the account is exactly your name, right?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Jake M. Hoff.

[Kat]

M. Hoff with two Fs, guys. As in Frank. And on social media, it's the same for you and Samantha. I love your name. It's very chic.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Thank you. I know. I've like, we've been recently like talking about like, should I be changing my name?

[Kat]

No, you should put her last name.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

I know.

[Kat]

Jacob Hoff. Wynn Greenberg.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

I know, I know.

[Kat]

It's so chic. You're gonna sound like a British lord.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

I know. I love it. I know. We're like, what would we do for our child? Like would they take both of our last names? Kind of like the idea Wynhoff, like put it. The alliteration of it. Yeah.

[Kat]

It's so chic. Win Greenberg. Hoff or Hoffman. I don't know. I love it. I love it. Sounds like you're a princess.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Thank you. I am a princess.

[Kat]

Yeah. Well, you guys, it's such an honor talking to you. You're very inspiring. I honestly don't care whatever the. The negative because I think there's always right the unhappy a holes out there.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

It means you're doing something right if.

[Kat]

You'Re pissing someone off. I like I said I send them love. Like somebody writes something nasty, I'm like, oh my God, I send you so many kisses and hugs cuz I'm sure you need it if you're taking time writing something bad on my page. So. But other than that, I think I hope the entire world finds out about your story because at the end of the day, such an inspiring love story.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Thank you.

[Kat]

And being real, right? Like figuring out what matters to you.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

It's just so therapeutic to be able to. To just say your truth and let it be what it is and put it out there.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah. And just feels like pure to like lead with pure love. I think that's what the world needs and I hope that everyone finds the person that makes them feel that way.

[Kat]

Yes. That's an incredible message. And what's next for you guys? You said I. I can see you on a reality show or like a sitcom.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah.

[Kat]

Being made. Inspired by our dream is a podcast.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

I mean that's. We might have to pick your brain.

[Kat]

Because now we're is. You know, we're neighbor. We found out we're like neighbors. We're like a. We're not going to stay here on air where we live. But we're like a few blocks away from Each other.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Oh, that's great. That's great.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

We are making a short film, a short documentary about our wedding and our relationship.

[Kat]

Oh my God, I love that.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

So hopefully going to film festivals in the next couple years.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah, we want to shout out Shark Pig Studios cuz they're producing with us.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Oh my God, they're amazing.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

They did came out to the wedding.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

It was amazing.

[Kat]

Oh my God.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah. So that all these things that will kind of get out of the sensational social media world and, and solidify our relationship and help people understand this is real and this is who we are in our lives. It will all help sort of the understanding grow.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

And eventually we want a child. A child.

[Kat]

But then everyone's like a one.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Everyone's like, you have to give them.

[Kat]

A sibling or I think again that's your personal, very personal choice. Right. You have to have as many as think is good for you.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Kids are expensive.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

They are. I also don't know.

[Kat]

I don't have kids, but I have two dogs and let me tell you, they are like kids. They are like babies. They're my babies and they're very expensive. And kids. It's like a lot of work.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Yeah, totally.

[Kat]

But I can see you guys having a little one because you're going to be amazing parents. Just your energy is contagious. I'm insanely honored to have you here and I hope we're going to do many more. I'm sure I'll invite you back because I know I'm going to get like hundreds of questions.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Oh my gosh. This was so fun. Anytime.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

We really love.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

You're amazing.

[Kat]

It's such an honor. Congratulations on the beautiful, beautiful marriage. Do you. Other than the, the Instagram, the Tick tock. I'm gonna put the links on this episode so you guys can find them. Any other links. Anything else that you want me to tell? I think that's the main one.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah. Our YouTube is Sam and Jacob show and yeah, that one's growing too. We're starting to do more long form, trying to figure out the long form video thing there. So yeah, that one I can.

[Kat]

Yeah, that's a fabulous idea for you too because I can see you, you doing a lot of fun stuff on YouTube together.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Thank you.

[Kat]

You're so creative. You're adorable. Thank you so much. And I think the message that I always try to say is like love has no boundaries, right? No stereotypes. I can't stand when people put people in boxes and make decisions and you guys like the perfect example for that. So Guys, go look for love in any way, shape form, person that shows up, right?

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And don't, don't stop yourself from loving somebody just because you, you know, feel one way or the other. If you're straight and you have a connection with the dude friend that's happens to be really close, just make it happen.

[Samantha Wynn Greenstone]

Love transcends.

[Kat]

Yes. Thank you so much. Was such an honor having you guys. You're amazing guys. You're safe out there there. I know it's the holidays, a lot of people feeling really lonely. So if you know anybody lonely, go give them a hug, go give them a kiss, bake them a cookie, you know, spread love. I always say, like, spread love. Spread love, Spread love. Especially during the holiday season. They can be really tough out there. Take care of yourselves. And this was a very special cat on the loose. I'm insanely happy and honored and your love is inspiring. Thank you.

[Jacob M. Hoff]

Thank you.

[Kat]

We'll see you guys very soon. Kisses, kisses, kisses. This is a really good one. For everyone that loves to play poker and everyone that is planning a trip to Las Vegas, I invite you to come check out the most fun private game in the city, held right inside Aria's VIP poker room. Even if you're not that into poker or new to the game, this is a great opportunity to network with businessmen, athletes and celebrities. Celebrities in a super exclusive environment. Mr. Beast and then Bilzerian have played in it. Golf pros have played there. It's like an elite, exclusive social club, but also a really fun environment to play. Texas no Limit hold'.

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[Kat]

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