Batya Ungar-Sargon WRECKS THE RADICAL LEFT

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Batya Ungar-Sargon WRECKS THE RADcial LEFT"

Keeping It Real: Conversations with Jillian Michaels
Host: Jillian Michaels
Guest: Batya Ungar-Sargon
Date: June 14, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Jillian Michaels welcomes Batya Ungar-Sargon—News Nation anchor, bestselling author, and self-described “MAGA lefty”—for an incisive and candid discussion on the growing problem of antisemitism, the shifting fault lines in American politics, and the radicalization of both left and right. Against the backdrop of escalating polarization, they examine media narratives, class divides, the abandonment of working-class Americans, and why Jews find themselves increasingly isolated. Batya’s new book, "Jews and the Left," serves as a thematic springboard for challenging received wisdom about who is really standing up—or turning against—American Jews.

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Main Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Horseshoe Theory of Extremes & Mainstreaming Antisemitism

[02:36–05:26]

• Political Alliances Fraying:
  Jillian and Batya open by discussing how antisemitism now bridges extremes, with segments of both far-left and far-right echoing identical anti-Israel rhetoric.
• Rejection vs. Elevation:
  Batya describes the difference in responses: "From top to bottom...the right totally rejecting [antisemitism], kicking them out. And the left basically elevating these figures into celebrities." ([04:23], Batya)
• Horseshoe Theory in Action:
  Jillian notes, "I could literally put up a video of Anna Kasparian...parroting the identical narrative as Nick Fuentes, who is as alt right as you could possibly get." ([05:26], Jillian)

2. Wokeness, Ideological Purity, and Denunciation

[07:27–12:11]

• Sam Harris as a Bellwether:
  Jillian references Sam Harris’s shifts, showing even stalwart progressives are realizing the extremism.
  Sam Harris (quoted): "The fact that the New York Times is burnishing Hasan Piker...who supports Hamas, Hezbollah, the Houthis...This is suicide in 2028." ([09:12], Harris)
• Batya’s Wake-Up Moment:
  Batya recalls her turning point: a Yale study showing white liberals speak to black people with less competence—a revelation that forced her to reconsider her progressive worldview.
  "My heart just dropped. What the study found...is an indictment of my entire worldview." ([13:26], Batya)

3. Race, Class, and the Weaponization of Identity

[14:22–18:39]

• Race as Deflection:
  Jillian critiques California politics, where legitimate critiques of leaders are dismissed as racism.
  "No, it's because the entire city burned down and she was in Ghana...It's because crime is out of control. And they just bring it all back to race." ([15:13], Jillian)
• Black Conservatives Disparaged:
  The episode highlights a Bill Maher exchange where black Republicans are labeled traitors.
• Democrats and Black America:
  Batya: "Black Americans are the most anti immigrant group in the Democrats entire coalition...They correctly have inferred that they have paid a massive price for mass migration..." ([18:39], Batya)
• GOP’s Missed Opportunity:
  Batya emphasizes that Republicans should do more to outreach and respect black voters, who are often more socially conservative.

4. Left/Right Double Standards on Diversity

[23:34–25:01]

• Democratic Moral Authority Challenged:
  Jillian: "The fact that the left just thinks they have the absolute moral authority on racial matters is staggering to me."
• Patronizing Language by Liberals:
  Referencing politicians who condescend, e.g., Gavin Newsom’s "I’m just like you" anecdote. ([24:34], Batya)

5. Social Penalties for Nonconformity

[25:49–29:06]

• 'Race Traitor' Rhetoric:
  Jillian: "It's insane...when black Americans step outside of this box...they get called all kinds of names...And to be honest, they do the same thing to gays."
• Cross-Ideological Alienation:
  Both Batya and Jillian express heartbreak at the inflexibility and punitive nature of identity politics across left and right.

6. The Shifting MAGA Coalition & the Cost of the Iran War

[29:06–41:48]

• Who Is MAGA Now?:
  The conversation covers the evolution of MAGA and the impact of new rightwing influencers leaving the movement.
• Economic Anxiety at Core:
  "They voted for him so they could have more money in their bank account at the end of the month...You can have access to the American dream again if you work hard." ([33:59], Batya)
• Iran War Fallout:
  Both agree they miscalculated how disruptive the war would be to Trump’s domestic agenda:
  "I know right now Americans who are in that boat, and it's not clear to me that the President understands that that is happening." ([39:23], Batya)
• Aid & Messaging Needs:
  Batya urges for stimulus or support for working class suffering under current conditions.

7. The Left, Anti-Zionism, and Obsession with Israel

[47:53–55:24]

• The Outsize Focus on Israel:
  Jillian: "How is every issue in American politics, how does it all track back to Israel and Zionism? How? Explain it to me." ([49:40], Jillian)
• Progressive Gatekeeping:
  Batya: "Anti Zionism is a gateway drug to leftism." ([52:51], Batya)
  "While like the vast majority of Americans are still Zionists. And so it just shows again how out of touch the left is."
• Selective Outrage & Double Standards:
  Jillian raises hypocrisy:
  "If you're upset about genocide, why are you not upset about South Sudan, Nigeria, the Uyghur community?...But somehow it only funnels into the corridor of the Jews." ([55:44], Jillian)

8. Predications and Looking Forward

[60:44–64:04]

• Electoral Predictions:
  Batya forecasts potential nominees and the limitations each party faces:
  "I know a lot of Democrats who would very happily vote for Marco Rubio and a lot of Republicans who would not vote for J.D. Vance. Now, does that mean the Republican Party is going to recognize this in time?"
• Closing Mutual Admiration:
  Batya praises Jillian as a source of humanity and reasoned discourse in a hostile environment.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the political divide:
  "Everything you think you know about America's political divide is wrong...Every aspect of that is not only wrong but exactly reversed."
  — Batya Ungar-Sargon ([10:58])

• On condescension from the left:
  “What the study found. Yale study found that when white liberals talk to black people, they…dumb down their vocabulary…and the study found that white conservatives do not do this.”
  — Batya ([13:26])

• On antisemitism’s crossing of lines:
  “There is only one side of the political aisle that is willing to allow Jew hate to become mainstream, and it's the left.”
  — Batya ([05:13])

• On black Republicans:
  “I don't think that you can be a rational MAGA, be black and be a rational MAGA person.”
  — Unidentified Commentator, cited by Jillian ([16:48])

• On political violence and dehumanization:
  "There's really only one side calling the other side Nazis. And it's got to stop."
  — Batya ([11:45])

• On the fixation with Israel:
  “Anti Zionism is a gateway drug to leftism.”
  — Batya ([53:07])

• On complexity and double standards:
  "This is the part where you could tell me 100% you're angry about all of these atrocities, all of these behaviors, but somehow it only funnels into the corridor of the Jews. And that's where you lose me..."
  — Jillian ([57:06])

• On Jillian’s impact:
  “Every video I see of you is of you being an absolute human in a context where people are trying to dehumanize you...the humanity that you bring to the space that we're in, which is just so violent and vile right now, is...precious.”
  — Batya ([62:35])

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Opening & Context Setting: 00:32–03:28
• Antisemitism: Left & Right Reactions: 03:28–05:26
• Horsehoe Theory & Media Echoes: 05:26–07:27
• Sam Harris/Critique of Progressive Downfall: 07:27–11:42
• Batya’s ‘Woke Up’ Story: 12:11–14:22
• Race/Rhetoric in Democratic Politics: 14:22–15:13
• Black Conservatives Criticized: 16:12–16:48
• Democrats/Black America, Immigration: 18:39–22:12
• Left/Right Diversity Double Standards: 23:34–24:57
• Within-Group Policing & Betrayal: 25:49–29:06
• Who Is MAGA? and Iran War: 29:06–39:23
• American Dream & Economic Pain: 39:23–41:48
• Israel/Palestine Centrality in US Politics: 47:53–55:24
• Selective Outrage & Progressive Anti-Zionism: 55:24–57:06
• Personal & Social Costs of Disagreement: 59:52–60:44
• Election/Party Strategy Predictions: 60:44–64:04
• Plug for Batya’s Book & Farewells: 64:04–End

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Conclusion

This episode delivers an unfiltered, challenging, and honest look at the breakdown of American political tribes, with a special focus on the consequences for Jews and working-class Americans. Through frank conversation, Jillian and Batya lay bare the selective outrage, double standards, and the risks of radicalism festering on both ends of the spectrum. Listeners are left with insights on America’s political realignment, the costs of ideological purity, and the urgent need for more authentic dialogue.

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Further Engagement:

• Batya's Book: "Jews and the Left"
• Batya's Substack: Batia Us
• News Nation (Sat 7pm, Sun 11am)
• “Keeping It Real” Podcast: Available on major platforms

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Transcript

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[Jillian Michaels]

The political map is officially tearing at the seams. Weaponized anti Semitism somehow units the fringes of both the far left and the far right in an unholy alliance.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 1]

It's not just Netanyahu on some level. It is the Israeli people, the behavior

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 2]

of the Israeli government, and quite honestly, the vast majority of the Israeli population.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 1]

Jewish people think they're better than everybody.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 2]

And you think you're better than everyone else.

[Mike Slater]

You know the Jews do this.

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

Yes.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 1]

Go back to Israel.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 2]

Go back to Israel.

[Jillian Michaels]

Midterm predictions are shattering. People are wondering what's going to become of MAGA with the massive shadow of the Iran war still looming. You know what's core MAGA now?

[Unidentified Commentator 1]

I have no idea.

[Jillian Michaels]

I think I know. Trump has said from the beginning while

[Unidentified Commentator 2]

supporting Israeli lobby

[Jillian Michaels]

need a different acronym. And joining me today is political disruptor Bhatia Angar Sargon. She's a PhD, a News Nation anchor, a best selling author and a self described MAGA lefty who regularly annihilates wokeism on CNN.

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

Graham Planner doesn't just have a Nazi tattoo. For 18 years he had a tattoo of the concentration camp guards on his chest and he knew what it was. These people who are defending him called me and every other MAGA person a Nazi for 10 years because we voted for someone who we thought would improve the lives of working class Americans and now they are lining up and defending a guy who had a Nazi tattoo which he knew about for 18 years.

[Jillian Michaels]

If you're liking the show, please be sure to like, share, comment and subscribe. Let's get into it. Keeping it real with Jillian Michaels. I cannot tell you how good it is to be talking to a friend right now. How are you, Bea? How are you?

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

I am so grateful to be here with you. It's funny because I feel the exact same way. For some reason, I'm honored to be here and so Grateful and so excited for this conversation.

[Jillian Michaels]

You know, I think we both try, you know, you regularly go on CNN and just annihilate wokesters and we both try to keep these lines of communication open with people who don't agree with us politically, but it is exhausting and in some cases quite dangerous ad be honest. And you know, the new book which we're gonna talk about is called Jews in the Left. I'm starting to feel, though, dude, like you may need to change the title of that book to Jews and Radicals on Both Sides. How are you feeling right now about the. Honestly, how are you feeling right now about the political map and the things that you're seeing in the Zeitgeist?

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

So I feel really good. It's a feel good book, actually. I really reject a lot of the narratives and the hysteria that are going on right now. It's funny you say that. I think you're alluding to the right wing anti Semitism we've seen of late.

[Jillian Michaels]

Oh yeah, it's funny that you get better. Yeah.

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

Because when I was writing the book, I finished the book and as I was submitting it to my editor, suddenly all of these sort of former MAGA right wing media stars were sort of turning on the Jews. And I thought to myself, am I about to become like a national laughingstock? I write this book about Jews and the left, how the left turned on the Jews and you have all these people on the right. But then something amazing happened, Gillian, which is that from top to bottom, from the president all the way down through Congress, senators, influencers, conservative pundits, conservative journalists, there was just a total rejection of the anti Jewish hate that these podcasters were trying to mainstream on the right. Like a complete and utter rejection. Donald Trump basically kicked them out of the party. And so you really had this split screen to where you had influencers on the left and influencers on the right saying anti Semitic things. One side, the right, which hand did I do? The right totally rejecting it, kicking them out. And the left basically elevating these figures into celebrities. And so the final act of this is all of these people on the right who were once on the right, who turned on Israel and on the Jews and on Trump, have now migrated over to this side and. And you see them on all the left wing podcasts. So I maintain that there is only one side of the political aisle that is willing to allow Jew hate to become mainstream, and it's the left. So much so that the right wingers trying to mainstream antisemitism are now booted into the left.

[Jillian Michaels]

You know, you make a really good point, actually. I have noticed this crazy horseshoe theory where I could literally put up a video of Anna Kasparian, who would pretty much agree with AOC on almost every single policy, parroting the identical narrative as Nick Fuentes, who is as alt right as you could possibly get.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 1]

Israel controls our government, control and influence and manipulate our system.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 2]

Ruled and controlled and manipulated by the nation state of Israel.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 1]

They are vampires. They suck our blood.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 2]

They suck the life out of this country.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 1]

We can not be slaves to Israel.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 2]

I'm not a slave to Israel.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 1]

Iran does not have a nuclear weapon.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 2]

Iran did not have a nuclear arsenal.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 1]

The supreme leader of Iran promulgated a fatwa.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 2]

He had put out a fatwa against nuclear weapons.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 1]

We had to join Israel's war of choice.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 2]

A war of choice. That's what this is.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 1]

The real threat to America is from Israel.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 2]

Our alliance with Israel as an existential threat to the United States.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 1]

It will nuke the entire world.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 2]

Israel is the biggest threat to world peace.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 1]

Let us never forget who the real enemy is.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 2]

The enemy is Israel.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 1]

We need to decouple from this country.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 2]

We need to decouple. Decouple. Let's separate.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 1]

We need to free America from this sick, perverse, parasitic organism that has attached itself to us. Foreign nationals leeching off of public services.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 2]

The pariah state that has leeched off the American people.

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 1]

It's not just Netanyahu on some level, it is the Israeli people, the behavior

[Anonymous Anti-Israel Speaker 2]

of the Israeli government, and quite honestly, the vast majority of the Israeli population.

[Jillian Michaels]

And I'm watching people like myself just sit in a state of total shock. I actually pulled a clip of Sam Harris that I want to show you. And I started watching Sam Harris again because a lot of my friends on the left really like him. And he's waking up to the feelings that people like yourself and myself have been having for years. And I've watched him and he's like, I just don't understand how they don't see it. Cuz he hates Trump so much that he's blinded by why anybody would think that the left has lost it. And now I think he gets it. Take a look at this, guys. Can we pull up SOT number two, please?

[Unidentified Commentator 2]

The fact that the New York Times is burnishing Hasan Piker as though he were the future of progressive politics in America is a very bad sign. I think it's. I mean, it's done immense brand damage in my mind to the times, as though it hasn't been happening. For years and years. But, I mean, it's just such a colossal moral and political error. But it makes me worry that I'm just, you know, wishcasting all of this and that the Democratic Party is unrecoverable. Now he's on record saying that America deserved 9 11. He supports Hamas, he supports Hezbollah, he supports the Houthis. He was on a. Another at least two New York Times podcasts, one of which he was there celebrating micro looting against corporations that you just think have too much money. This is just not anything like sanity for the Democrats, right? This is. This is. This is suicide in 2028.

[Jillian Michaels]

So I felt that the Democrats had reached that state much earlier than Hasan Piker. But it is fascinating to watch their lunacy spread. And it just starts to suck up everybody that's left on the party with a brain. I'm being honest. And the look on his face. I remember feeling that when they started transing kids and they started, you know, constantly engaging us in race baiting and racing wars and when blue cities erupted into violence and political leaders, mayors, there were, oh, it's the city of love. And I'm like, you guys are not so kabutzo. This is. This has got to be why you wrote the book. What are your thoughts as you watch Sam Harris wrestle with the feeling now that the Democrats are just too far gone?

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

It's really amazing because as you say, Gillian, a lot of us got there to the exact same spot just a little bit earlier. And when I hear people like Sam Harris saying that I still hate Trump, Trump is still the Antichrist, but the Democrats are really bad. I kind of want to take out a timeline and be like, here's me, where I was, where you are or were 10 years ago. Here, here's Maga. You know, you are here. You know, like, you're on the pad, okay? Like, you've gotten on the train and the train is headed in one direction. And it's realizing that everything you think you know about America's political divide is wrong. If you're on the left, you think that, you know, the left is the good guys on the side of the little guy. And the right is racist. The left cares about, you know, working class Americans, and the right only cares about the billionaires. And the left protects Jews and is where Jews are, the right are the Nazis. Every aspect of that is not only wrong, but exactly reversed. Exactly the opposite. And it's so incredible to watch people have these moments of, like, waking up. It's amazing to me because I'VE had the unique experience of being able to see people have this realization who called me a Nazi and a racist for realizing the exact thing they're realizing now just five years ago. You know what I mean? It's a very, very unique position. But, you know, have I gotten any apologies? I have not. But, you know, it's okay. It's okay. As long as people are waking up.

[Jillian Michaels]

That's.

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

That's the most important thing. I honestly, like, it's not that I want people to become Republicans. I just want us all to be better to each other. And there's really only one side calling the other side Nazis. And it's got to stop. There's only one side that is legitimizing political violence because it loves Hasan Piker. There's only one side. Trump shooting at Jews. And, you know, so I just want us all to be better and to find our way back to America, our loyalty to America. And that's really what the book is about.

[Jillian Michaels]

You know, you mentioned when you first woke up to the left, I was wondering if you could tell that story. Wasn't it an article that A study? It was a study about how the left infantilizes black people. Can you tell this story to the audience?

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

Yeah, it's a really good story. This was sort of my first moment of thinking, like, oh, God, am I on the wrong side? Like many people, I was a woke leftist. I had the TDS really bad. And people always ask me, like, well, how did you get rid of your tds? And the moment that I can remember first kind of waking up from my wokeness was in 2018, I saw a Yale study. It came across my feedback, and it said, there's a difference between how white liberals and white conservatives talk to black people. Now, in my woke state, I saw this headline, and I was thrilled. I was like, we got them. We got them. There's a Yale study proving that everybody who voted for Trump is a racist. I was so excited. So I print up the study, I start reading it. My heart just dropped. What the study found. Yale study found that when white liberals talk to black people, they do something that experts call present lower competence, meaning they dumb down their vocabulary and they use words with fewer syllables than when they talk to other white people. And the study found that white conservatives do not do this. And I remember looking at that and my heart just dropping to the floor and thinking to myself, not only is this obviously true, but it is an indictment of my entire worldview. And I thought to myself, I am not ready to deal with the implications of this being true. I need time. I put it in a drawer in my office and I closed it and I said, bhatia, I promise, I promised myself I'm coming back in three months and we're gonna deal with what this means. Because I had this feeling like I was about to lose all my friends. Which is exactly what happened, actually.

[Jillian Michaels]

Uh huh. Yep. A hundred percent. That's right. And then you get to, you get to defend the fact that, you know, you're a white nationalist and a Nazi and a transphobe and a race. You know, all those things. Then you get, you get to deal with that for the rest of your professional career, which is absurd, but also just utterly exhausting and has real ramifications. And I think, you know, we're seeing that bit of a sidebar here. We're seeing it in the political races in California. Like, I watch people say that they're gonna vote for Karen Bass again. And it's, dude, I watched a video with Kathy Griffin interviewing Karen Bass, telling her that people are just critical of her because she's a black woman.

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

I'm like, wait a minute.

[Jillian Michaels]

No, it's because the entire city burned down and she was in Ghana. It's because nothing has been rebuilt. It's because the homeless problem is out of control. It's because crime is out of control. It's because of corruption. And they just bring it all back to race. And then when they're, you know, Angelenos are asked on the street, why not give Spencer Pratt a chance? They all go, well, he's a Republican, as though it's the worst possible thing you could be. And I wanna talk a little bit about black Americans and the Republican Party for a second. Did you see this clip of Don Lemon on Bill Maher basically saying that any black American, something to the effect of, like, any black American who votes conservative is like a race traitor or dumb or imbecilic. Did you catch this by any chance? If not, no worries, I'll drop it in for the audience. But that's basically what he says.

[Unidentified Commentator 3]

It's the same thing when I see not all black Republicans, but when I see a black MAGA person who is carrying Donald Trump's water and they know that he's lying, it is the shortest line to the front. Because if you're black and you're whatever, any, you're just in line with a bunch of other Democrats that are doing the same thing that, that you're doing. But if you become a black maga, person. It's like, whoa, let's book this person. Let's put them on television.

[Jillian Michaels]

So you don't think you can be

[Unidentified Commentator 2]

a sincere black MAGA person?

[Unidentified Commentator 3]

No, no, I just said I don't think that. I just said I think there can be sincere Republicans, but you can't be

[Unidentified Commentator 2]

a sincere black Republican.

[Unidentified Commentator 3]

I don't think that you can. I don't think that you can be a rational maga, be black and be a rational MAGA person. I think you can be black and be a Republican.

[Jillian Michaels]

I think they would find that very insulting.

[Unidentified Commentator 3]

Well, I mean, the truth is often insulting.

[Jillian Michaels]

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[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

It's a great question. I mean, I would love to have him on my show. He's invited anytime. But like you said, it's very hard to get these people to show up and to debate. I would say to him, you know, the polling consistently shows that black Americans are the most anti immigrant group in the Democrats entire coalition. And this is something any person who spends any time talking to working class black people knows. They correctly have inferred that they have paid a massive price for mass migration to the tune of up to, you know, 40% reduction in wages. They are overrepresented in the working class, and illegal migrants take jobs from working class people. There's only two options. If you're living here illegally. You are either working, in which case you are driving down the wages of native born Americans, or you're living off of welfare, in which case native born Americans are paying to subsidize your life here. And both of those things are enraging to black Americans as they absolutely should be. So they've paid a real material cost. It's not just illegal immigration, though. Every single issue that the Democrats have chosen, you know, as their, you know, pet cause, their cause du jour, they cloak in the language of the great civil rights movement while actually using it to abandon black Americans again and again and again for other more favored groups, whether it's illegal aliens or women or LGBTQ or trans or now Palestinians. And then all of their activism goes into using that, the absolutely morally justified cause of the civil rights. They try to appropriate that energy for things that have absolutely nothing to do with it and actually, indeed come at the expense of the civil rights of Americans, like illegal migration. So it's just a massive, massive betrayal. Trump is actually increasing in approval with black Americans. The first term it was 12%. Now it's 16%. And it looks like the GOP is going to keep a lot of the gains that Trump made. He got about 25% of black Americans. Now, some of my. I have a debate going on with a friend of mine. He says that if I say, like Trump did so well with black Americans, this is like a real revolution. And he says if Trump didn't talk in a way that allowed black Americans to infer that he's racist, he would have done even better. And I don't think Trump is racist at all. But there's no need to post photos of a Hakeem Jeffries and write that he's a thug, right? I don't think Trump says that in a racist way, but black people hear that in a. That it, you know, they hear that as if it is a racial slur. And to me, it's like, why antagonize them? There should be a welcome mat open. They should be treated as, you know, respected and valued and voters that the GOP desperately wants to court because black Americans are very conservative socially. Like, they don't have any time for the trans stuff. I don't know if you noticed this but most of the trans social sports things, it's in the sports that are not dominated by young black girls. Because I think that the Democrats know that their parents just would not stand for it. And so they're not, like, pushing the issue there. It's a very interesting issue. And to me, it's shame on the Republican Party that they're not doing better to attract black candidates to go into the black community. I mean, they show up like once every four years and say, why don't you vote for us? We're the conservative party. You agree with us on immigration, you agree with us on all these other things. And there's just so much more work to be done, and I really wish that they were doing a better job of it.

[Jillian Michaels]

You know, there have been, ironically, some pretty good candidates, like Byron Donalds is gonna hopefully become governor of Florida when DeSantis term is over. And Trump did endorse him, but he didn't come out and support winsome Earle Sears, because at some point, my guess is this is the reason she was critical of him. Well, like, I actually.

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

I don't think so. I think that she was. No, tell me what you think. Yeah, from what I've heard, I mean, I love her. I think she's great. I love every time she talks, I'm like, yes, yes, yes. But she was running a very bad campaign, and I think it was very clear that she wasn't going to win. And Trump likes winners, so I really don't, I don't hold that against him. I think, like, like when you talk to Republicans, it's so funny when they say they don't want to vote for Karen Bass because she's a black woman. Like, people on the right are like, they love having diversity. They love when there is a person of color coming up the ranks. You know, like the fact that Marco Rubio is Hispanic. Like, they love that when he breaks out in Spanish. Like, they love that. Like, they want to be, like, seen as open to that. Trump really did pull together a multiracial working class coalition, and the Republicans that I know are very, very proud of that. So I think it really had more to do with the fact that Trump, she ran, like, a very bad campaign, which is a shame because she has a lot going for her.

[Jillian Michaels]

I know. And you know what I find so funny is that Obama, who shamed all of the black men for not voting for Harris, then went to fricking Virginia and campaigned against the black woman, who's a Marine, a small business owner, I think, has two Master's degrees, was the lieutenant governor for a white liberal who works for the CIA. I mean, I don't think either party is perfect, but the fact that the left just thinks they have the absolute moral authority on racial matters is staggering to me. Absolutely mind blowing. And I'll never forget when Hochul. This is my favorite example of that study you're talking about when Hochul said that black people may not be able to get an ID because they don't know how to use a computer.

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

I know. Or how about when Gavin Newsom said, like, to a room full of black people, I'm just like you. I got a. I got a 96. What was it on my SAT? What did you got?

[Jillian Michaels]

Some 960 on my SAT score. Yeah, of course. Everybody then pulled up clips of him talking to white guests on his podcast saying, I ripped through your book in two and a half hours.

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

Oh, my God. How did they not see this?

[Jillian Michaels]

A lot of them do. But then, you know, you've got the Don Lemons of the world that don't. And there was another clip recently, and this actually broke my heart. I guess in this. I didn't watch this, but I guess in the Kevin Hart roast on Netflix, Kevin Hart said something. Something to the effect of, like, if there was an anti black group on a Mount Rushmore, Stephen A. Smith would be on it. And Stephen A. I. Mama, that's crazy. I watched his. I was stunned and I was hurt for him. And I don't know. I'll actually drop it in here. I didn't know we were gonna go there. I'd show it to you, but. But here's here' of what he said. First of all, he was really hurt.

[Unidentified Commentator 1]

You know, I tried to. First of all, I got. At least I thought I had pretty damn good relationship with Kevin Hart. It's been on my show on many occasions. I've known her for years. I don't know. I mean, it's a roast, but, you know, he's getting crucified because a lot of people felt like too many jokes at this particular roast was tasteless. My attitude is a roast is a roast and people are there to be attacked. He's gotten attacked, all of that other stuff. But I'm not. Confront and ignore and failing to acknowledge that this year has been very, very difficult for me from the standpoint that even though I've been very, very blessed and fortunate to secure my future in ways that I never thought imaginable, first at ESPN and then here, SiriusXM. The flip side to that is that I've taken a lot of heat.

[Jillian Michaels]

He was genuinely hurt. He's like, I know Kevin. We're friends. And he's like, I'm not really gonna dignify this by addressing the matter, but he felt totally betrayed. And I thought, how is it possible that you take one of the most successful, intelligent, articulate black men in the country who people on both sides happen to love, that has the quality of character that he will talk to anybody on the right or the left, and he will voice his opinions fearlessly, whether you like him or not. I would think he would be just an exemplary role model, not just for the black community, but for young men. My son looks up to him, and he's not black. And the fact that you would then call him a race traitor, it just. It's insane that when black Americans step outside of this box that they're allowed to exist in, then they get called all kinds of names by white liberals and other black liberals, like the C word or house, N word or race traitor or Uncle Tom. And to be honest, they do the same thing to gays. It's crazy. They do the exact same thing to us. And I just. I'm heartbroken by the fact that they don't see the flaws within their own party until it comes for them, like it did with Sam Harris. Which brings me to a totally separate side of the party that is feeling very disenfranchised with the fringe on the right. So this is a young kid that I've never seen before. I think his name is Joshua Carr. And he is expressing the same dismay over the ways in which this radical antisemitism of the right wing has now completely bastardized MAGA. Take a look at this, guys. This is SAT1 team.

[Joshua Carr]

The GOP has not changed that much in the last eight years, Sean. They have not left you behind. You left them completely. Go watch Sean Ryan. Heck, watch him from two years ago. He's awesome. He actually talks about conservatism rather than Israel 247 or why we should align ourselves with the left. Hillary Clinton called us deplorables. Joe Biden called us fascist. And now Sean Ryan calls us pedophiles supporting Israel. And Megyn Kelly did not disagree, by the way. She did not speak up at all when he said that. They have made their full evolutions to the left. They're just parroting the same talking points. Megyn Kelly says MAGA is whatever Mark Levin is. I have not watched a single episode of Mark Levin in my life. I know who he is, obviously. I've seen maybe a couple 10 second clips in my entire life. Beyond that, I really don't even know who he is. He's on Fox News. He likes Israel, I guess. But I'm willing to bet that less than 10% of MAGA even know it. Mark, you know who Mark Levin is?

[Jillian Michaels]

Hey, Bill O'Reilly here. Please check out my new interview series, we'll do it Live. Each Thursday, I sit down with the most influential people in America. We're a no spin chat, no script. Anything could happen. You can find We'll do it live on BillOriley.com YouTube or wherever you download your podcast. In order for people to live healthier lives, you gotta sleep better. Sleep is the foundation because it impacts everything from mood, stamina, brain power, and so much more. Which is why I'm obsessed with my new Aurora Luxe mattress from Brooklyn Bedding. It's not just comfortable, it's intentionally built for restorative sleep. Brooklyn Bedding designs and assembles every mattress right in Arizona. So there's no middleman, just top quality and honest pricing. And best up, it's not a one size fits all because they offer mattresses for everybody, every sleep style, even in hard to find sizes. And they use glaciotex covers and temperature regulating materials to help you keep cool and comfortable all night long. It's one of the few mattress brands endorsed by the American Chiropractic association for spinal alignment and back health. And if you guys know anything about me, you know I had a pretty severe back injury in 2021. So this has been a game changer for me. They offer an amazing 120 night comfort trial. So love it or they'll help you return or swap it hassle free. No wonder these guys have been awarded the best mattress by CNET and best hybrid mattress by Wirecutter. So go to BrooklynBetting.com and use my promo code, Jillian at checkout to get 30% off site wide. This offer is not available anywhere else. You know what, I gotta be honest with you, Bea, I don't. I've never watched Mark Levin either. And I didn't even know who he was until Megyn Kelly went to war with him. And I guess that, you know, shame on me, but I didn't really know who he was. Of course I've watched Ben Shapiro. But the fact that now both sides, both sides on the fringe are attacking maga. Who is maga? Now? Who do you think MAGA consists of? Is it the disenfranchised Leftists with traditional conservatives. Who is this coalition now? Because it used to have Megyn Kelly and Tucker Carlson and Sean Ryan and all of those people. Then we lost, by the way. All of them did this. 180. Megyn Kelly looked me in the eye, by the way, and told me that I was on this continuum, right, of discovering how insane the left was and that she would never, ever vote for a Democrat, that she will never bend a knee to their insanity, and that they have to be fought at all costs to then go on, to then go on Shawn Ryan and say, I'm an independent and MAGA is basically dead. And I'm just like, what are we meant to do with this? Especially after losing Charlie Kirk, Jordan Peterson being out of the mix right now for health reasons. And the same with Dennis Prager. We've lost these three instrumental people to help build this coalition and then the others. I've made a total 180. That's just. I can't even wrap my head around. And you're seeing the frustration and the dismay and the confusion in these young MAGA men. And I feel it. And I wouldn't even describe myself as necessarily maga. I'm a moderate. What is going on with maga? Who is MAGA now? And how does that kid make you feel? Feel when you listen to them?

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

I don't think that there's been as much attrition as people think. There have been a number of podcasters, five, something like that, who left. And that's fine, but that's like five people. There are people who don't. It turned out that they didn't have a lot of influence. Right. Like, people, I think, including them, thought that they were sort of giving the marching orders to the Trump voter, and then they thought they were giving the marching orders to Trump. And when Trump said no to them over the war in Iran, they were just, like, so pissed off they left, which is fine. You know, I mean, to me, this question of who is maga, it's very hard to answer right now because things are in flux, but has nothing to do with those influencers. It has to do with the affordability question. People voted for Trump to bring costs down, and they voted for him so they could have more money in their bank account at the end of the month. Like, they thought that he represented this idea that we don't have to accept that America is a nation in decline, which a lot of us had accepted without even realizing it. Like, I'm in that camp. I was behaving Like a person who had accepted that, and that's terrible. And he said, you don't have to accept that. You don't have to live like this. You can have access to the American dream again if you work hard. And that's not true right now because of the war in Iran, because of the cost of gas, because of the cost of groceries.

[Jillian Michaels]

Going next. Yeah, was Iran.

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

And that's bad. And he needs to do something about that. In my view, the best thing to do would be to send out a stimulus check to working class people to help get them through the next few months, because it's gonna take a while to get that deal with Iran. And I was totally wrong about this, by the way. I was completely wrong. And I have no problem saying that. I thought it would go really fast and, and it's not going fast, and they're holding on and that's fine. I was wrong about that. Trump was wrong about that. It's a noble goal. I still support the goal. But he can't do it at the expense of the promises he made to his base, which is the working class. So I think that they need to send out a stimmy check or a tariff rebate, something to help working class people get through the next few months, because it's tough. And they need to feel like he understands where they are because that is why they voted for him.

[Jillian Michaels]

Yeah. You know when I think I feel very similarly to how you're feeling right now, I, I was waiting, right, to see, like, okay, is a deal imminent? Is a deal imminent? I'm not so sure how I feel about this yet. I kind of took a more Steven Crowder esque kind of approach of like, I'm going to give this three months, I'm going to reassess. You know, we're, we're pretty much there. And like you, I figured there's no way we would do this if he didn't have really good intelligence that there was going to be some sort of altered regime to take the reins quickly. Just like in Venezuela. I thought, oh, this will be genius. He's gonna have this negotiating power with China. I thought that he. I understood why he was doing it. I still understand why he's doing it. I think, just like you, I believe there was a good chance it would go quickly and work out. What are your feelings now? Do you think this is going to be like, the thing that destroys his presidency, or do you think if he can mitigate the interim damage, he can slowly strangle this regime? And ultimately, if he could, by the way, or, you know, strangle them into submission, into being a more malleable government. Although I hear that's impossible, that it could be the best thing for America. Like, what do you think is going to happen here?

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

I mean, if he pulls it off, it'll be amazing. The problem is, is if he has to settle for a deal that is something like the JCPOA or worse, that would be very bad. Like, very, very, very bad. I don't think he's likely to do that. I think he understands that that would be a big mistake and we don't have all the intelligence that he's working with. So I can say already now I am certain that I was wrong, that it would be quick, but I can't say what I think is going to come down the pike. It's not impossible that he will settle for a deal. You saw him saying the other day, like, they're committing never to have a nuclear weapon. But they always say that they're big effing liars, you know, like they're terrorists. Nothing they say matters. Yeah, what matters is that, like, we can check that. Right. So it's kind of all gonna be in the details. And it's very important not to be too credulous of this regime. Yeah, it's important, I think, to have humility. I'm feeling very humbled by how wrong I was about this. And I think it's very important to say that very loudly because that's our job as journalists. But I don't really know. I mean, Marco Rubio seems very confident that a very good deal is around the corner.

[Jillian Michaels]

Right. If it was, would you then go back and say, I'm no longer humbled. I was right. It was three months, we lost 14 service people. Yes, civilians were lost, which is terrible. But at the same time, the regime killed tens of thousands of their own people. And not to say it's a noble

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

goal, it's a noble goal, but. But to me, like Jillian, the thing that I find one of the most unbearable things to contemplate is a person who woke up early in the morning and worked really hard all day at a back breaking job and then maybe went to a second job to feed their family, got home, put the kids to bed, is lying in bed and cannot sleep because they know that bills are coming that they can't pay. Like, that scenario I find unbearable. And there's people in that scenario right now. And like I got on the Trump train because it was my view that he was the first President in a very long time who had a real plan for how to reverse that. And I still believe in the agenda and I still support the tariff regime. And I still think he. This is what he cares about too. But I know right now Americans who are in that boat, and it's not clear to me that the President understands that that is happening. And I want him to understand that. I want him to do something about it. I want him to talk to those people and I want him to mitigate what they are going through because they are bearing the burden of making all of our children and grandchildren safe from a nuclear armed Iran. And it's not fair that they are paying the most for it. Like with the tariffs, most of the tariffs, we produce 75% of the food we consume. So most of the tariffs were on luxury items, things you could choose not to buy. So the elites were really upset. Like, the people who buy a new iPhone every year were really mad that their iPhone is now maybe gonna cost like $100 more, you know, but like, it's not like beans were more expensive, right? It's not like, you know, the food that people need. Gas was getting cheaper and cheaper and cheaper. He was doing amazing on gas in a way that only a Republican can because the Democrats put environmental restrictions on, right? So it was really great, right? Like, that was good stuff, right? So. So working class people were having extra money at the end of the month. Wages were outpacing inflation. So people were having that extra cash, which is why they voted for him. They don't want handouts. They want more of the money that they earned. You know, and that's just not the case now. And it's, It's. It's a problem.

[Jillian Michaels]

You know, I was, I was watching Dave Rubin's Jubilee and this one kid, they were, oh, my God. I mean, poor Dave, he was like, it was so disturbing because they were so aggressive and so hostile. And I'm like, Because Dave tends to. He won't. He stopped engaging. He stopped. He's like, he doesn't want to do peers anymore. Which I don't blame him. You know, every time you do something like peers as much as I like peers, you end up just enduring all of these ad hominem attacks and subsequently followed by like 50 death threats on your social media. It's just not worth it. But, you know, I'm watching him listen to these kids and they're, and they're. Everything's worse under Trump. And I'm thinking that's like, literally, if we went Back three months before Iran, it would be the exact opposite. Inflation was at its lowest, gas was at its lowest, markets were at its highest. Like, yes, I get it, the job market is a problem. But hey, Biden got to claim all of those recovered jobs after Covid and Trump is like racing into AI, which is putting people out of work. I'm sorry, but it is. I know that I personally have not hired numerous individuals that I previously would have from photographers and stylists and models for different products. Like he's dealing with that and it's going to take time for the reshoring from the tariffs. Like, but man, now that Iran happened, you're kind of like, yeah, but three months ago, you know, you're like in this position where you're kind of like hogtied. Cuz you can't really say that now though, because of Iran. And yet I'm hopeful that a deal will be announced and then I can go back to thinking like, this is why I said I was waiting. This is why I had faith, you know, now it's all gonna make sense. But I guess I think I still am in a place of feeling as though I would give it another month or so to wait and see how history will judge this. But I can see everything you're saying. Like I wonder, why do you think the administration is not doing what you're suggesting? Cuz he knows he's racing into the midterms and that's gonna be bad fricking news if this does not resolve.

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

I think that his, the people around him are not telling him how bad it is on the street. And I think that the people in the administration are very weighted. I mean, they're wealthy people. They look at the stock market. The stock market is doing amazing. But A, most Americans are not invested in the stock market. And B, Jillian, anywhere from 40 to 80% of the gains have been with AI. It's a huge bubble. It's extremely dangerous. There's going to be a big backlash to it. Americans do not want data centers in their neighborhoods. It's a huge bubble and it's extremely dangerous and scary. One thing I will say, like those kids, they're wrong about the job market. There's a lot of jobs for working class people. There's a lot of jobs for high skilled labor. We have a massive shortage of skilled trades folks. There's no entry level white collar jobs anymore. So what you have now is a whole generation of young people who were told to go to college, who have college debt, who were told this is what gets you the American dream and this is what makes you politically better than the Nazis on the right. And now they can't get jobs. But they would never dream of like getting a working class job because that is coded as right and they think it's beneath them. But there is tons of work for young people who want to go into the trades. Unfortunately, Barack Obama defunded vocational training in high school and I think if the Labor Secretary had not left under scandalous situations, that might be something that a labor secretary would be pursuing right now because that is a great avenue to the American dream for especially young men.

[Mike Slater]

Hey, this is Mike Slater. I have a podcast called Politics by Faith. I would love for you to listen. We take the news of the day and we run it through the Bible. What does the Bible have to say about this? Because there's nothing new under the sun. Read the headlines. Everything's all crazy. World's coming to an end. It's all in the Bible. And after every episode, hopefully you leave with a proper perspective and a biblical piece. Please join us wherever you listen to podcasts and we also have a YouTube page as well. YouTube.com politicsbyfaith

[Jillian Michaels]

Every business asks the same question. How do we make AI work for us? Well, the possibilities are endless and guessing is too risky. But sitting on the sidelines isn't an option because your competitors are already making moves. No more waiting guys. With NetSuite by Oracle, you can put AI to work. Today, NetSuite is the number one AI Cloud ERP trusted by over 43,000 businesses. It's a unified suite that brings your financials, your inventory, your commerce, HR and sales CRM into a single source of truth. And that connected data makes your AI smarter. So it doesn't just guess, it knows. From software, IT healthcare to manufacturing financial services, Netsuite delivers a customized solution for your business. This is AI built into the system running your business. You can scale from millions to hundreds of millions and stay ahead. So if your revenues are at least in the seven figures, get our free business guide demystifying [e-mail] Jillian the guide is free to you at netsuite.com Jillian that's natsuite.com Jillian when you look at the midterms, what are your predictions? Because on one hand the left did not temper their crazy. I really thought that Trump getting elected, I thought they were going to say like okay, you know, this is pretty low hanging fruit. It's fairly obvious, like get on the right side of the 80, 20 issues. And, you know, we should be okay here. Put somebody forward. You know, as Sam Harris is like, I just worry this is the end of the left of center Democrat. What do you mean? You were. They're gone. You got one John Fetterman that's also

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

like, it's so funny because he's like, he's like, he's worried because he sees it as a personal betrayal of him. Like, you know what I mean? It's like, it's not actually a problem if the Democrats all become looney Tunes and then everybody votes for Republicans. Unless you're Sam Harris. Right? Like, that's not bad. People will find other candidates. Like, it's. I personally want the Democrats to be moderate because I want people have a choice. I want there to be a choice between, like more welfare or more tariffs, you know, like more immigrants or less immigrants. Like, that is a legitimate debate. We should be having that debate. But instead what we have is like, you, you know, guy who sided with like the World Trade center bombers, you know, versus Republican. Instead you have like, guy who loves Hasan Piker. You know, the Democrats are now like, their new thing is being anti Zionist. Like, that is such a ridiculous, despicable agenda for a major American political party, you know, Jillian, only 4% of Americans vote on foreign policy. 4%. And most of them are Republicans. And yet the progressives have decided this is going to be their number one do or die issue. Not having Zionists in their party, it just, it's so disgusting. And they'll say, we're not against Jews, we're just against Israel. Like, you'll have these Muslim candidates come out and say, we revere the Jewish faith. We just don't like Israel. And it's like, I'm sorry, most American Jews like their Zionism is their faith. They're not religious. They don't believe in the Bible, they don't keep the Torah, they don't keep Shabbos. It's a heavy lift being Orthodox. Trust me, I know most American Jews. They're really into the freedom thing, okay? Like, that's why they moved here, you know, in the 1900s. They're not religious. What they are is Zionists. And the left has no place for them anymore, which is what my new book is about.

[Jillian Michaels]

Well, let's talk about that for the shameless plug. But no, but that's actually, I mean, as you should be. That's actually what we're supposed to be talking about. But there's just so much going on, and I relate to so much of what you say, and you're just such a wealth of knowledge that I have been waiting to ask you all of these questions. So talking about being a Zionist, Bea, if I could tell you, dude, I think I've been to a synagogue for like a few of my friends when I was 13, a few of their bar mitzvahs and bat mitzvahs. I did grow up in the San Fernando Valley of Los Angeles. All my friends were Jews, Jewish, and I, you know, but my dad was full Arab, like Lebanese and Syrian and you know, my mom's father was like Turkish and also Sicilian. So like, lot of Arab in there. And I just thought my mom's mom was a Brit. Long story short, I ended up finding out years later I have like 30% Ashkenazi Jewish DNA. But my point of bringing all of this up is that I was raised without a religion and I'm genetically Arab and a little bit Ashkenazi Jew. Apparently I did not have a dog in the Israel, Palestine fight. I didn't wanna be involved. I didn't understand it. And even recently, can I tell you, I finally got like forced into holding a debate about this. And you know where we end up, by the way? Both sides are not perfect. Cause there were good people on both sides, not bad actors and, you know, no resolution. And I'm like, so why are we sitting in this room having this argument when none of us can do anything about this? And it is like, oh, in the past, the green line in 1967 and the Oslo Accords in Area C, and it is like it's mind numbing, mind numbing. And somehow every issue in American politics is now about Zionism in Israel, Palestine, when I would say probably 99% of us can't even wrap our head around it. I sat through two hours of this with a PhD in like a nuclear engineer and I still, still was like, I don't even know what the F you're talking about. Zone C and Area B and this agreement here and Camp David there. What in the. How is every issue, every issue in American politics, how does it all track back to Israel and Zionism? How? Explain it to me. How? I want to say AIPAC is responsible for all of it. And this tiny little country of 14 million people who aren't even all Jews, somehow controls Donald Trump and they're responsible for the World Trade center and the death on Charlie Kirk and Iraq, even though that's totally a lie and completely debunked. And what is happening? How did we get here? I don't even, I'm sorry to say, Mama, I don't even want this conversation. And every political conversation devolves into it. Help me.

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

It is so wild. It's because the left turned on the Jews and so they want that to be the debate. And then you have somebody like Megyn Kelly wake up and decide like, oh, Israel is the problem, and then find herself on the left. It's like anti Zionism is a gateway, gateway drug to leftism. You know, they take the drug.

[Jillian Michaels]

Yes.

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

It's so crazy. It is. And what's even crazier is that the vast majority of Americans, whether they're Republicans or Democrats, probably have the same view of the Middle East. They are Zionists. They want Israel to exist and to flourish and to defend itself. And they want the Palestinians not to be oppressed like that. Like that's. That that describes 80% of Americans, you know, and the other like, ding, ding, 25% is probably like. Yeah, exactly. It's like. And it's such a non issue. It's just so funny that like, people talk about like young men being on the Internet turning on Israel. They don't care about this at all. They, you know, they'll shitpost about it. I'm sorry, I don't know if I'm allowed to talk about, say that on the, on the podcast.

[Jillian Michaels]

Oh, 100%. Yeah. 100%. Yes.

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

It is so not an issue. Charlie Kirk, may his memory be for a blessing. Right before he died, he did a focus group and like 80%, 75% of the kids at his student action summit, 5,000 young leaders, conservative leaders, were pro Israel. They don't like foreign aid, which is. I don't like foreign aid either, you know, but like, would they rather the Christian holy sites be under the auspices of Muslims than Jews? No. Do they want Hamas to win the war? No. And that's 80% of Americans. So the progressives are trying very hard to make this a wedge issue issue, like a do or die issue, to shame people for taking APAC money, which is basically money from American Jews who care about Israel. Like they're. Because they're, they've turned on the Jews. They've become like deeply anti Zionist and the extent of their anti Zionism. Like Greta Thunberg has abandoned the climate to care for itself. Because now the Palestinian issue is like the number one issue for her. Like, like that, like to, to abandon the climate after telling us for so long this is like the do or die. I mean, what she says, you know, in 12 years, there'll be no planet. You think there'll be Palestinians on this non existent planet. You think that taking care of the climate should take precedence. But no, it's like it's become the, like the cause du jour, the price of entry to the left, while like the vast majority of Americans are still Zionists. And so it just shows again how out of touch the left is. And to explain how we got here and why. There is a good brand new book out.

[Jillian Michaels]

Yeah.

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

That goes through the whole history of why the left turned on the Jews, why it made anti Zionism its most important issue, despite the fact that most American Jews are democrats and very proudly so. And why there's now a tension at the heart of American Jewish identity between their liberalism and their Zionism.

[Jillian Michaels]

It is wild. Do you realize that in this debate that I was just mentioning to you, I've got a gentile arguing on behalf of Israel and a Jewish guy. I'm like, this is the craziest shit I've ever seen. This is the craziest shit I have ever seen. And you know, b, to be honest, listen, nobody wants the Palestinians to be oppressed. I get it. Civilian casualties are terrible. I get it. But like Hamas, horrendous. What happened to these kids, horrendous. Personally, I don't think there's a moral equivalence there, but that's. Listen, I think both are awful. Like, I can hold both of those things, but when you talk to me about money and politics, AIPAC is not the top of the list. And I know there are American Jews, but I just watched this young kid whose name I have just forgotten. Of course, ask Anna Casper. Why are you not outraged about American Iranians funding Thomas Massie? How come you're not pissed about that? If you're pissed about foreign lobbies? Israel's like, not even the top 10. Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Russia, China. Why are you not pissed about that? If you're upset about genocide, why are you not upset about South Sudan, Nigeria, the Uyghur community?

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

Like what?

[Jillian Michaels]

This is the part where you could tell me 100% you're angry about all of these atrocities, all of these behaviors, but somehow it only funnels into the corridor of the Jews. And that's where you lose me. That's where I do not think you are an honest actor. Because I can hold all of these truths at the same time. I can condemn the death of innocents on both sides. I can feel for the pain on both sides. And I just don't get it. The only group that I passionately Passionately dislike are terrorists. The rest of it I can feel very, very empathetic for and very sad and like it is a problem that nobody here in America could begin to fix. But I just, that's, it's the, you know, the way that they only apply their standards to just the Jews. And the last thought on this, I was talking to my wife about this the other day. I'm like, do you realize when we talk about Putin, like, if you wanted to say Netanyahu, let's just say Netanyahu is the worst person on the planet. Let's just say so I want to give that, I want to do the gimme on that. He's the worst person on the planet. Why do I never hear Netanyahu, Netanyahu, Netanyahu. The way that I always hear Putin, Putin, Putin. I don't hear the Russians did this to the Ukraine. I don't hear that. I heard Putin, Putin did this. Putin wants to bring the USSR back to power. Putin is the one who slaughtered all these innocents. Putin has been humiliated ever since he left the KGB and the USSR fell. I don't hear Netanyahu, Netanyahu, Netanyahu. I hear Israel. And then they very comfortably expanded that definition to the Jews, as much as they tried to deny it. And one of the heartbreaking things, and I'm wondering if you feel this way, there's an irony for me here where Dave Smith, Megyn Kelly, even Candace Owens a year ago. And by the way, have still, I'm sure it's coming, but have still never said a negative word about me, despite the fact that I passionately disagree with their politics. I'm having a hard time holding the fact that I think their narrative is becoming so dangerous and hurtful and harmful while still holding the fact that they were very decent human beings to me and continue to be like, do you struggle with that? I know you were very good. I know you were on Megyn Kelly's show all the time. And now she just went on Sean Ryan and said, israel is America's cancer. How are you feeling about this?

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

I mean, in general, I don't have that problem because people are very mean to me, including people who, like, I am very nice to. With Megan, though, specifically, she, she did a lot for me personally. She had me on her show many times. I, I, a lot of my followers met me through her. So to hear her say that is extremely painful because of everything I owe her. You know, like, she was very personally good to me. That is very painful. But in general, Most people are extremely mean to me, even when I'm nice to them. So I don't struggle with, like, oh, this person is so decent. Their views are so terrible. People who are decent, whose views are terrible, I have relationships with. They come on my show. We have debates publicly. Like, I'm in conversation with them. I want to hear what they think about things I want to know. Like, I have very close Palestinian friends who are totally anti Zionist. It's great. Like, they keep me honest, you know, but it's not something I struggle with.

[Jillian Michaels]

I get that. What are your predictions? J.D. vance, Marco Rubio, Gavin Newsom, AOC Outlier

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

I have said it before, and I'll say it again. I know a lot of Democrats who would very happily vote for Marco Rubio and a lot of Republicans who would not vote for J.D. vance. Now, does that mean the Republican Party is going to recognize this in time? I would not put it past them to get this wrong. They're very good at grabbing defeat from the jaws of victory. I think on the left probably go a more moderate route. I could see Kamala Harris being the nominee again. She has a lot of support among the people, even though the elites really don't want her to run again. But I would be surprised if it wasn't someone like Harris or Newsom, somebody kind of, you know, seen more as a centrist, although she is seen as far left. But whatever the agenda is, it's going to have to be something that's a little bit more moderate, because I think the elites in the party understand where the atmosphere is. And there's only so far you can get running just on, like, destroy Trump, especially if he's not on the ticket anymore. But I do want to say, Gillian, I think you are unbelievably precious. Every video I see of you is of you being an absolute human in a context where people are trying to dehumanize you or dehumanize each other or dehumanize another group. And the humanity that you bring to the space that we're in, which is just so violent and vile right now, is. I cannot overstate how precious that is to me as an American. I think that you, with your presence and with your aura and with that energy that you bring to everything you do, are like one of the very few people who's working to stitch back the fabric of our frayed society. And I know that you don't get the appreciation that you deserve for that, but I am just constantly humbled by the humanity you bring to people on the other side, I admire it. I want to be more liked you. I strive to be more like you and fail very often. And I'm so grateful to you for everything that you do and everything you're bringing to the conversation. And God bless and protect you. Thank you so much for having me.

[Jillian Michaels]

Well, you know what? It's totally mutual. You are all of those things. Which is why, like, instead of having a pit in my stomach for who I was going to talk to or what I was going to do today, I was like, oh my God, I'm so excited to talk to Bhatia. I'm so happy. And my wife was like, you should just do these podcasts. And I'm like, can't though, babe. Because then it's like, you know, you gotta, you gotta go into the fray for all the reasons that you do and all the reasons that I'm trying to. But I just want you to know that those feelings are abso freaking lutely mutual. Tell everybody where they can watch your show, where they can buy not just this book, but all of your books. You write for the frickin the Free Press. Like you're everywhere doing all the things. How can they follow you and get more of your brilliant words of wisdom?

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

So first of all, the book just came out this week and is available wherever books are sold. The Jews and the Left. You can get it on Amazon, you can get it from HarperCollins. It's really a love story song to America and to my fellow Jews. And so I hope that you buy it and enjoy it if you read it. I have a substack Batia Us where I write. I try to write a column every single day. I post all my videos, I post, I host conversations like this one. And I have a show on News Nation at 7pm Saturday night and it airs again Sunday morning at 11am I'm also on Twitter and Instagram and unbelievably grateful to you if you got this far for listening to this conversation and to you, Gillian, for having it.

[Jillian Michaels]

Thank you, buddy. You're wonderful. I appreciate you. I just bought the book actually this morning. I'm supporting my girl. Can't wait to read it. And I think I get to actually speak to you on your show this week. So I'm quite excited.

[Bhatia Angar Sargon]

Yes.

[Jillian Michaels]

Friday. Thank you so much for watching. If you enjoyed the podcast, please, like comment, subscribe and share. And make sure to let me know what guests you want to see on in the future. I'm Miranda Devine. Pod Force One is the podcast where I interview the most powerful people in Washington. This week we are with President Donald Trump. You won't want to miss this conversation that gets behind the headlines. Search Podforce One on Apple Podcasts or YouTube and please like and subscribe so you don't miss an episod.