Trump To Endrose Pratt!? Massie Revot Implodes. Stephen A Smith Speaks Out

Summary

Podcast Summary: Keeping It Real with Jillian Michaels – “Trump To Endorse Pratt!? Massie Revolt Implodes. Stephen A Smith Speaks Out”
Date: May 22, 2026
Host: Jillian Michaels
Guests: Dave Rubin, Stephen A. Smith

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Jillian Michaels and Dave Rubin deliver their signature unfiltered analysis of the week's biggest political and cultural firestorms. They unpack rumors about Trump’s potential endorsement of Spencer Pratt, the fallout from Thomas Massie’s primary defeat, and an impassioned viral monologue by Stephen A. Smith on the left’s evolution. With sharp commentary on media hypocrisy, the pitfalls of political culture, and the complexities of homelessness and economic debate, the episode blends hard-hitting critique, humor, and moments of unexpected humanity.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Trump Rumored to Endorse Spencer Pratt (00:28 – 06:18)

• Jillian reveals insider buzz that Donald Trump will endorse Spencer Pratt in the upcoming LA mayoral race, but Pratt reportedly does not want the endorsement.
  • “Trump is gonna endorse Spencer Pratt. That’s coming, I’m told, from a very good source. And apparently he does not want the endorsement.” (Jillian, 01:04)
• Dave Rubin’s analysis:
  • Accepting the Trump nod is politically essential in GOP circles, but “if Trump says it, then it is,” regardless of acceptance (01:20).
  • Admits LA’s electoral math is dauntingly blue and that local Republicans like Larry Elder see Pratt’s chances as “zero” (04:39).
  • "There’s a national thing happening around Spencer... you may want to get in on this man, because you’ve got a little nugget of something special happening around you right now." (Dave, 03:00)
• Jillian disagrees about the irrelevance of not accepting:
  • “If he does not accept, it will be the ultimate snub. And I think the Republicans in California will not appreciate it.” (Jillian, 01:56)
• Summary insight: Both agree it’s a political “damned if you do, damned if you don’t” for Pratt, in a city where Trump endorsements are a liability.

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2. Massie’s Primary Defeat & GOP In-Fighting (06:18 – 17:21)

• Trump’s animosity towards Thomas Massie:
  • Played a Trump clip calling Massie "the worst congressman in the history of our country" (06:25).
• Dave Rubin’s take:
  • Massie, though libertarian, became isolated by frequent opposition to his own party (“every time that we’ve needed Thomas for a vote, he has been completely unwilling to provide it.” – Dave, 10:23).
  • Suggests that Massie’s support from far-left figures harmed his standing with conservatives.
  • "The election proved that Trump still controls this party. He has 97% approval amongst MAGA." (Dave, 07:05)
• Jillian & Dave reflect on political authenticity:
  • Politics forces coalition-building and compromise, which clashes with their own desires for nuance and honesty (Jillian, 12:18; Dave, 13:37).
• Key Soundbite:
  • “You have your beliefs, and then we got a vote on some stuff, and we just couldn’t count on you. So don’t expect Trump to support you.” (Dave, 12:10)
• Meta-point:
  • Media and national commentators often distort the true local reasons for political upsets, ignoring “the internal demographics of Kentucky District 4” (Dave, 07:05).

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3. Qualifications Debate: Spencer Pratt vs. Karen Bass (17:21 – 26:00)

• Media Critique:
  • “The View” criticized Pratt’s lack of experience while touting Karen Bass’s credentials. Jillian and Dave highlight the inconsistency in how the media frames “qualifications.”
  • “The problem that I have with someone like Spencer Pratt throwing his hat into this particular ring as LA mayor: we’re talking about a $14.9 billion budget for the city... and he is not qualified for it.” (Jillian, 18:02)
• Comparisons:
  • Dave points out how politicians like AOC had minimal “real” experience (“AOC was a bartender...She’s educated. But so is he.” – 20:32).
  • “She went to communist Cuba ten plus times... saluted Castro as the commander and chief.” (Jillian, 23:00)
• On fires and government responsibility:
  • Dave contrasts LA’s handling of fires to Florida’s hurricane response, crediting Governor DeSantis for solid preparation post-disaster (24:01).
• Notable quote:
  • “What I blame [officials] for is: did they do their due diligence beforehand... And clearly the answer is no when it comes to [Karen Bass].” (Dave, 25:38)

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4. Pop Culture & the Critique of Capitalism (26:00 – 34:19)

• Celebrity hypocrisy on display:
  • Jillian introduces a viral clip of actors lambasting capitalism while reaping its rewards.
  • “The only people that really benefit are the top .003%." (Jillian, 26:19)
• Dave’s retort:
  • Skewers ‘anti-capitalist’ actors for their privilege and disconnect.
  • “The first girl... she’s a kids actor in some kids shows from China... You would never be on a red carpet in China talking about how bad communism is, is because they’ll kill you.” (Dave, 27:47)
• Debate on capitalism’s flaws:
  • Jillian floats the idea of closing corporate tax loopholes; Dave advocates a flat tax (31:00-32:53).
  • “It’s never about revenue. It’s a spending issue.” (Dave, 33:09)

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5. Stephen A. Smith’s Viral Rant: The Evolving Left (34:32 – 37:56)

• Played full soundbite from Stephen A. Smith:
  • Decries far-left extremism and erosion of common sense in the Democratic Party.
  • “I don’t recognize this left – or not this one... I’m a moderate, who will lean left on everything but dollars, meaning taxes. I can’t stand high taxes in California, New York, New Jersey...” (Stephen A., 34:32)
  • Criticizes “woke” culture and inconsistent focus on minorities who have long supported Democrats.
• Jillian asks:
  • Why does Stephen A. escape accusations of being “a crazy MAGA loon,” when others who call out leftist dogma get demonized? (36:08)

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6. Identity Politics, Media Hypocrisy, and Left-Right Dialogue (37:57 – 49:19)

• Dave on the “classic liberal” crisis:
  • “To defend your liberal beliefs has now become a conservative position.” (Dave, 37:57)
  • Notes the left’s obsession with “immutable characteristics”; anyone who breaks from this gets branded a traitor (44:14).
• Jillian discusses conservative civility compared to ad hominem left-wing attacks, referencing Sam Seder’s mockery (43:10; 44:14).
• Gay rights in politics:
  • Both note that principled conservatives support individual rights even if they maintain religious objections—civility is possible even with disagreement (Dave, 45:09).
  • Highlights double standards in progressive-Muslim alliances on LGBT issues (Dave, 46:46).

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7. Humanizing the Homelessness Crisis (49:56 – 57:48)

• Poignant viral video shown: A compilation of hands reaching out for food in major US cities.
  • Jillian: “It makes me want to cry watching it. And I forget that there are people behind all of this..." (50:54; 51:54)
• Dave’s reflection:
  • “Gad Saad has the [#1] selling book in the country right now and it’s called Suicidal Empathy. That is the best example of it right there.” (52:27)
  • Progressive empathy policies have unintentionally “enabled” dysfunction; contrasts with Miami’s safety and order.
• Jillian’s insight:
  • Her sadness compels her to “policies that... statistically seem the only thing that has any shot at helping people versus them dying on the sidewalk.” (55:46)
• Both urge listeners: before opining on big issues, do the research, look at evidence, and avoid tribalism.

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8. Optimism, Reagan’s Wisdom & the Value of Wonder (58:40 – End)

• Uplifting Reagan clip:
  • “I’ve had an unholy desire to invite some atheists to a dinner... and after dinner, ask them if they believed there was a cook.” (Reagan, 58:40)
• Dave on Reagan’s communication:
  • “Reagan was an absolute master at explaining complex things in very, very simple ways...” (59:15)
• Nostalgia and hope:
  • Longing for the cultural vibrancy of the 1980s, but both believe that, despite the negativity, “the future is going to be unbelievably bright and change us in ways that we cannot even imagine.” (Dave, 61:45)
• Jillian’s closing note:
  • Wishes for common ground, unity, and a renewed sense of shared wonder that transcends divisions. (61:45)

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Notable Quotes & Moments with Timestamps

• Dave Rubin:

  • “Every time you think, ‘oh, they’ve hit rock bottom...’ No, they find a new layer to dig under.” (03:00)
  • “Don’t expect Trump to support you... you have to map your beliefs to coalition building.” (12:10)

• Jillian Michaels:

  • “It’s so important to me to be able to say, like, this little issue, I don’t agree with Trump... It’s how I remain authentic and honest, true to myself...” (12:18)

• Stephen A. Smith (on today’s left):

  • “I don’t recognize this left or not this one. Not the one that I’ve been seeing over the last few years. I’m a moderate... and I’m still appalled by how far left the left has leaned. It’s disgraceful, no common sense…” (34:32)

• Dave Rubin (on identity politics):

  • “If you buck that trend, they consider you and I to basically be, I don’t know, Uncle Tom traitors or something like that.” (44:14)

• Jillian (on right-left treatment of gays):

  • “You can have conversations with conservatives and they can say, ‘I’m against gay marriage’... they are always civil. They never wage ad hominem attacks.” (42:02)

• Dave (on homelessness and “suicidal empathy”):

  • “We have such empathy for them that we actually won’t help them. And on top of that, we won’t create the economic conditions that would allow people to thrive so they end up in these situations.” (52:27)

• Ronald Reagan (recounted by Dave Rubin):

  • “I’ve had an unholy desire to invite some atheists to a dinner... and after dinner, ask them if they believed there was a cook.” (58:40)

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Segment Timestamps (approximate)

• Trump/Spencer Pratt Endorsement: 00:28 – 06:18
• Massie’s Defeat, GOP Dynamics: 06:18 – 17:21
• Pratt vs. Bass / Media Discussion: 17:21 – 26:00
• Celebrity Capitalism Critiques: 26:00 – 34:19
• Stephen A. Smith on “the Left”: 34:32 – 37:56
• Identity Politics & Hypocrisy: 37:57 – 49:19
• Homelessness/Empathy Debate: 49:56 – 57:48
• Hope/Optimism, Reagan Clip: 58:40 – End

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Episode Tone & Takeaways

• Candid, irreverent, combative: Jillian and Dave aren’t shy about challenging mainstream narratives or poking holes in political posturing from all sides.
• Deep polarization dissected: The “crazy left” vs. “MAGA right” is explored, but both agree that most Americans are more nuanced and open-minded than online or media caricatures.
• Empathy with boundaries: A recurring theme—kindness and compassion must be paired with practical policies and hard evidence.
• Hope for common ground: Despite gloom, both close on the idea that optimism, curiosity, and shared humanity can still unite.

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For New Listeners:
If you’re seeking a blend of passionate debate, humor, and moments of unfiltered emotional honesty about politics and society—with a focus on actionable insights over tribal shouting—this episode is a must-listen.

Transcript

[Stephen A. Smith]

And I'm here to tell you something right now. I don't recognize this left or not this one.

[Dave Rubin]

There was so much hatred. And I genuinely believe if they could have given were given the opportunity and could have got away with it would have killed me.

[Jillian Michaels]

It makes me want to cry watching it. The thing that annoys you the most about capitalism. Oh, my God.

[Dave Rubin]

It's never about revenue. It's a spending issue. I hope you're going to put them out of business. Don't tomorrow. He is so bad.

[Jillian Michaels]

Holy or schlugana. Happy Friday, team. My homie Dave Rubin is joining me for the rundown today. The Internet's on fire. Thomas Massie is out. Hollywood continues to lose its mind. Etc. Etc. Etc. We're breaking down the biggest viral moments of the week. Let's get into it. Keeping It Real with Jillian Michaels. Dave Rubin, I have some secret intel. Are you ready? Oh, my, yes. It might be public by the time this airs.

[Dave Rubin]

It's just for us, right? I'll put my ear.

[Jillian Michaels]

I'm actually being serious. Trump is gonna endorse Spencer Pratt. That's one. What do you think? What do you think? Yes, that's coming, I'm told, from a very good source. And apparently he does not want the endorsement.

[Dave Rubin]

Ah, that. So there's two little bites here. Well, first off, Jillian Michaels, you are on the short list of people on the Internet who I consider ballpark sane and that I actually trust and like. So I will take that information and do what I will with it. Look, you know, you. There have been rumblings about whether Trump would endorse him for a couple weeks now. The real issue is putting aside whether he will accept it or not. I mean, and in some sense it's irrelevant whether he accepts it or not because if Trump says it, then it is.

[Jillian Michaels]

I don't agree with you, D. I think if he does not accept will be the ultimate snub. And I think the Republicans in California will not appreciate it. I think he has to be gracious.

[Dave Rubin]

Oh, he. No, no. In terms of real politic, he has to. But if Trump endorses him, the message that's sent out to the system exists whether he accepts it or not. I think he'd be crazy not to accept it. I get what. Look, I lived in LA like you. I lived there for eight years and six years were absolutely wonderful. And the day Covid started, it was a nightmare. And then I got out two years later, as everyone knows. You have to accept it because I was just in Los Angeles last week. And it is worse. And it is worse every time I get there. And everyone knows it. You would have to be crazy. I mean, it's quite literally the definition of insanity if you keep doing the same thing with negative results and you do it over and over again. So the idea that you would vote for Karen Bass or this other Nithya woman who's just, wow, she may be even more bananas than.

[Jillian Michaels]

I didn't even think it was possible. I know.

[Dave Rubin]

Yeah, well, but this is what they do, right? So the Democrats, they take someone who's kind of crazy, and they always go further to the left. So think about it. Jasmine Crockett, totally bananas, far left, everyone's racist, whatever. And what did they do? They got rid of her because James Talarico ran to the left of her. He was like, oh, you think you're crazy? I'll show you crazy. Look what happened in Chicago. Lori Lightfoot, as far left. Looks like Beetlejuice. All of the stuff. And what happened? They ended up with Brandon Johnson, who's even more far left. New York City. Eric Adams, progressive Democrat, lefty, sanctuary city. What happened? You end up with. I call him Moron Zamboni. We could do. There's so many versions of this where every time you think, oh, they've hit rock bottom, so now somebody sane might start the rebound effect. No, they find a new layer to dig under. Anyway, I would say, look, Trump probably should endorse him because there's a national thing happening around Spencer. Whether it actually helps, whether he accepts or not. For him to not accept it would be purely like politics. Oh, my God, there's so many Trump deranged people here. I don't want to accept it. But that aside, I think Spencer likely will stick with politics in his future, assuming he loses. And it's like, you may want to get in on this man, because you've got a little nugget of something special happening around you right now. And if Trump gives you the nod, maybe, maybe there are just still enough sane people in la. My friend Larry Elder, who's lived there his entire life, he said, zero chance for Spencer. Can you explain? Larry's pretty good.

[Jillian Michaels]

I don't understand it.

[Dave Rubin]

He thinks purely just on the numbers. If you just purely look at how the Democrat, how many Democrats there are versus how many Republicans, and just the structure of LA and who actually votes and everything else on top of the fact you don't even, you know, this is a sidebar, I guess, but you don't even have to show an ID to vote. In la, as you know. So, you know, there could be all sorts of shenanigans and, you know, it's a great national story that's happening with this guy. But will, will he win regardless of Trump? I mean, it's, it's definitely uphill.

[Jillian Michaels]

Do you think it helps him or hurts him in Los Angeles?

[Dave Rubin]

I mean, the conventional answer would be that it would hurt him. Right. That if there were these liberals, let's say people that are similar, old school liberals, kind of the way you and I think, which there are obviously plenty of in la, that if they hear, oh, Trump endorsed him, it'll completely push them back to the radical left, could, you know, is there going to be somebody out there that is kind of thinking about voting for him? And then Trump says, I'm going to support the guy that said, okay, that's the thing I needed. That's hard to picture. Right, because if you're frustrated with all the things of L. A, you're already voting for Spencer Pratt. So it's definitely a tricky one, but as you know, we're just a couple days after a bunch of primaries, Trump, in his last 37 endorsements, you know how many he's won?

[Jillian Michaels]

All of them.

[Dave Rubin]

37. Oh, so if I. Yeah, he's 37 in a row. So if I was Spencer Pratt.

[Jillian Michaels]

Take it. Yeah, take it.

[Dave Rubin]

You take it.

[Jillian Michaels]

Well, speaking of that, obviously the defeat of Thomas Massie, Holy cow.

[Dave Rubin]

I hope you're gonna put him out of business tomorrow. I'm in the Oval Office and we're in a fight against the worst congressman in the history of our country. His name is Thomas Massie, he's from Kentucky. I hope you're going to put him out of business tomorrow. He is so bad. Got an election coming up. He's running against a great guy, a great patriot, Ed Gilrayne, he's fantastic. But forget that Massey's the worst congressman in the history of our country, always voting against Republicans and good values.

[Stephen A. Smith]

So get rid of Thomas Massie.

[Jillian Michaels]

Holy. Or Schlugana, what do you think?

[Dave Rubin]

Well, they did get rid of Thomas Massey. Let me say this. First off, I know Thomas pretty well. I've interviewed him probably six or eight times over the years. His son actually got married in Miami not too long ago, about two years ago, and they were here for the weekend. He called me up, he said, you want to have dinner? And I went out to dinner with him and a couple people with his wife, who is now deceased, who was a lovely woman. I've never had any problems with. Him. I like a lot of that libertarian stuff. I think something kind of weird shifted him with some of this woke right stuff over the past year or so. But I would say more than anything else, I did not criticize him once until I think the day before the election. And then all I said was, this is not a criticism of his policies or anything else. But there are two things with this guy. Number one, if you look at the people who supported him, so he had support from Code Pink, he had support from Hasan Piker, from the Young Turks, Ro Khanna, all of the lefties, right? So all of the lefties were supporting him. So if you're on the right and a Republican and all the lefties are supporting you, you might wanna say, why are these people supporting me? It's sort of like when all of the mainstream media and the ladies of the View, they hated Marjorie Taylor Greene and then the day she goes against Trump, she gets the red carpet. You might wanna say, why are they doing this? And clearly the reason the lefties loved Massey was because they sort of saw him as a useful tool against Trump. Now, he might say, that's because of my libertarian beliefs and I didn't want to do some of the things Trump was doing. But I would say you might want to think about why you're so aligned with people who should be so politically polar opposite than you are. Look, it's not a huge district in Kentucky. I love watching all these people on Twitter pretending they know anything about the internal demographics of Kentucky District 4. It's completely absurd. But I would say more than anything else, the election proved that Trump still controls this party. He has 97% approval amongst Maga. He's got to get some of those independents back for sure. That's the part that seems like it might be wavering a little bit. But don't go against Trump. And the reason I don't say that as like, bow to Trump and do everything he wants. I say that as because we are fighting right now. Such a radical Democrat party that wants to pack the court, that wants to make D.C. a state that has unleashed violence and drugs on our streets. All of the things that you and I talk about all the time that everyone knows that you might want to say, okay, I have my libertarian beliefs, but Donald Trump is actually the best thing that we're going to get right now. And maybe in the future there'll be something that's more libertarian. But you know Rand Paul, who's also from Kentucky, Senator, when I didn't support Trump the first Time around. I've always liked Rand because I have a lot of libertarian beliefs and he's the one that got me to really come around on Trump. So I think it's really unfortunate that it got so nasty, but I think it was important that he lost the

[Jillian Michaels]

race, actually, you know, funny you say that. J.D. vance made it very clear that this is a team sport and he wasn't a team player. Even though I appreciate, appreciated. I'm not saying his policies necessarily, but I appreciate the independent spirit of, like, I'm not going to be partisan. I'm going to call balls and strikes. There's a lot that, that he started to do towards.

[Dave Rubin]

He was great on Covid stuff.

[Jillian Michaels]

Right. Well, take a look at this.

[Dave Rubin]

This was one of the people I was working closest with it. But that's one thing. Being independent, having your own opinions is one thing. Voting against the party, every single issue, you're eventually going to make too many enemies. And that is the problem that Thomas has had. It's not one issue, it's not three or four issues. It's that every time that we've needed Thomas for a vote, he has been completely unwilling to provide it. Yeah, that's right. Right. Like, that's what it comes down to. J.D. by the way, in an extended version of that clip, he talks about how they're friends, he likes them. I mentioned on my show this morning that I actually, we did a bunch of shows in D.C. with a bunch of senators and congressmen, and I was with just the two of them chatting off camera. So they're friendly, they like each other. And again, I certainly like JD and before this got crazy, I really did like Massie, too. But JD Is just laying out what the truth is. In politics, you have your beliefs and you have to kind of have a hierarchy of what's most important to you. Some people might say low taxes, some people might say foreign policy, abortion, whatever. You have to figure out what's important to you. But then you have to map that to. You gotta vote with people, you gotta create a coalition and all of those things. And, you know, especially for you and I, and I'm sure most of the people in your audience let's, you know, people that are kind of not traditional Republicans or conservatives, something like that. We really understand that. I understand I'm gonna have to have some political disagreements with some people that I am gonna end up voting with, and then the hope is that you can work together. So I think J.D. that's where he's at, is Trump's really good at bumper sticker stuff, you know, like. Like Massey's dumb. Okay, fine. But what JD Laid out there, JD Laid out real politic. Here's actually how it works. You have beliefs, and then we got a vote on some stuff, and we just couldn't count on you. So don't expect Trump to support you. I think it's as simple as that.

[Jillian Michaels]

You know, I would never want to be a politician because it. It's so important to me to be able to say, like, this little issue. I don't agree with Trump on these three issues. I do agree with Trump on. And it. It's. It's how I remain authentic and honest, true to myself, and hopefully, whether the audience likes what I say or doesn't like what I say, at least they know I'm not here to lie to them. I don't have audience capture. I'm not looking for clicks. But in politics, it's. You're absolutely right. It's a very different game because they bury all of these issues in one bill. So you gotta vote for stuff. Try not to swear.

[Dave Rubin]

You're getting better. You're getting better. I think I pushed you a little bit after these last few months where I'm, you know, because Megyn Kelly keeps cursing like crazy, and I'm just like, you know what? It's not hard to be a little bit better than that. So I'm not cursing anymore on air, at least to the best of my abilities. And I'm bringing you with me, sister. Humble.

[Jillian Michaels]

I'm with you. The point is, you. You have no choice to get the bigger agenda passed. And Stephen Miller said that, you know, apparently Massie voted with Democrats 25% of the time and on some of the most substantial pieces of legislation, like funding

[Dave Rubin]

stuff, big, beautiful bill, et cetera.

[Jillian Michaels]

Yeah, right.

[Dave Rubin]

So. But look, Jillian, that's why I think you and I probably wouldn't make for great politicians. Believe me, I've had plenty of people over the years begging me to run for all kinds of things and, you know, offering to set up packs and everything. I don't think I could do it that way because I live too much in a. In a sort of gray nuance space. And I really do try to tell people what I feel to the. To the best extent, with all the knowledge that I have. You can agree or disagree, and I don't know that I could play that game very well. And I think Massie, hopefully, if he. If he does a little bit of a, you know, kind of autopsy on what happened here, I hope he will realize that this wasn't because of the Israel lobby or anything else. About 860,000 people voted in Kentucky. And you know what that means. You know, over half of them voted for Ed Gallerin, and that it might just be. They were several reasons. First off, it could be some internal Kentucky stuff that you and I wouldn't even really be privy to. Right. That's what most people vote for congresspeople for. Like your local congressman has something to do with your local stuff. Everyone's trying to make this about foreign policy, but the other part is that a bunch of those people might have just been like, you know what? It's two days before the election and Trump is making a point. This guy doesn't push the Trump agenda. We see what's going on with the Democrats. We don't want them to be in power. And that's why Trump was so pissed, I think, because Trump's realizing, boy, we're going into these midterms. If the Republicans lose the House and the Senate, or in essence, either, or he gets impeached, and then it's over. We're hung up in two years of just nothingness and just. We will watch the rats jump the ship from MAGA and the whole. In some sense, the whole country will fall apart pretty quickly at a political level. So I think Trump realized the urgency, and that's why he went in the way that he did.

[Jillian Michaels]

Last thought, having lived in Wyoming now for a couple of years, there's like 500,000 people in the state. It's nothing.

[Dave Rubin]

Right?

[Jillian Michaels]

You could win. You could become a senator, like that. And the only reason I'm bringing this up is because people are like, why

[Stephen A. Smith]

don't you run in Wyoming?

[Jillian Michaels]

And I'm like, what makes you think that I would be qualified to speak for people in Wyoming? And when I talk to people at the local businesses and I hear their grievances, Dave, it's nothing I understand. It's nothing I relate to. Which just goes more to your point of understanding what's going on in Kentucky. I'm like, I can't represent. I have no idea the struggles they have now in California. That would be a different story. I'd rather be dead than run for office.

[Dave Rubin]

Yeah, well, but that's the point. So it's like, if you look at. If you look at all of the pundit class on this, almost everyone's making this about foreign policy. And, you know, the other thing is, Massey can kept repeatedly calling Trump part of the Epstein class. I don't Feel like opening up that whole can of worms right now. But you know what? If you're telling the President of the United States that he's the Epstein class, the guy who released the 3 million documents, did more than the Biden administration or anything else, even though Massey didn't say anything during the Biden years about it, if you're gonna say to the president, in essence, you're either a pedophile or you're protecting pedophiles, he might get pissed at you. And I think other people kind of saw that. But, yes, local politics. If the founders were watching this right now, beyond their amazement that we can do this thing on zoom, they would basically be like, man, what happened here? Because the whole point of Congress, the whole idea of state representatives, it was mostly to fix what's in your district, and then you do a little business of the country. The senators are supposed to do, you know, they represent the state. There's only two of them. And they can do a little bit more of what's going on with the country. But the disproportionate focus we put on a random congressman as it relates to every freaking national policy, that is not the way this is supposed to be. It's the way it is, just not the way it's supposed to be.

[Jillian Michaels]

All right, moving on. The View was criticizing Spencer Pratt for his lack of experience and then applauding Karen Bass experience. So take a look at this. Bass handled the fires disastrously, but actually being qualified to take on that role is what's wrong.

[Dave Rubin]

So Karen Bass will be running against Spencer Pratt. I just want to make this point.

[Jillian Michaels]

So Karen Bass has a JFK profile in Courage Award.

[Dave Rubin]

She navigated California through the worst economic crisis since the Depression. Spencer Pratt was Snapchatter of the year at the 2018 Shorty Awards.

[Jillian Michaels]

Yeah, that's all. Well, I. You know. Well, I mean, I think you're talking about qualifications, right? Yeah. And the problem that I have with someone like Spencer Pratt throwing his hat into this particular ring as LA mayor, we're talking about a $14.9 billion budget for the city. It's the second largest city budget in the country, and he is not qualified for it. He's also a liar because he's a registered Republican, and he's running saying that he has no party affiliation, and that's just not true. Now, streaming podcasts on Fox one, because sometimes the headline isn't enough. FOX one brings you On Demand video podcasts that dive deeper into what's happening, getting you closer to the voices Shaping the conversation across news, politics, and culture. And get this. Keeping It Real is Now streaming on Fox 1. That means you can watch my show alongside other podcasts like Hang Out With Sean Hannity, the Riley Gaines show, and and Will Kane country all in one place. From the stories leading the day to hot takes and exclusive interviews, you'll hear from some of the boldest voices around. And the best part is that you can watch or listen on your schedule whenever it works for you. So stream podcasts on Fox 1 anywhere, anytime, on your favorite devices. Sign up [e-mail] okay, so there's a ton there, but what I want to start with is that she says the quiet part out loud, which is, he's really a Republican. And what does that mean? That he's a deplorable? That he's a disgusting racist transphobe. Like, what's the. That's the number one slur these days. That's the new pejorative.

[Dave Rubin]

It's so boring. You know, my guess, and people don't know, like, what his full set of political beliefs are. He's really focusing on homeless. He's focusing on drug use. He's focusing on, obviously on what happened with, with the fires and everything else. My guess would be he probably was just kind of a nominal LA liberal living in Palisades like everybody else. Like, not really political. That would be my guess. But, you know, as they say, a conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged by reality. And when your house burns down and your parents house burns down and the guy across the street literally dies in a fire. Yeah. You know a little something about this, Julian. You suddenly are mugged and you might be a little bit more of a Republican, but the idea that they suddenly care about qualifications. Do you know AOC's qualifications? And there's just simply no doubt they'll support her when she runs for president. What was AOC before all this, do you know?

[Jillian Michaels]

She was a bartender. She does. She's educated. But so is he. He has a degree in political science, so.

[Dave Rubin]

That's nonsense. That's nonsense. I have a degree in political science. That has nothing to do with what would make me qualified perhaps to run for something one day. Right? Like, oh, so, wow, you went to a college where they taught you about politics like that. That has nothing to do with nothing. It's completely absurd. They care about. And also, by the way, wait, I love that. What did Joy say? What are Karen Bass qualifications? She has a Profile in Courage award from the.

[Stephen A. Smith]

What was it?

[Dave Rubin]

From The Kennedy Center?

[Jillian Michaels]

Yeah, something like that. Wait, but Dee, hold on. Help me understand this because I. Maybe I have a huge blind spot. How did Karen Bass navigate the state of California as the mayor of one city in the state through the worst economic crisis since the Depression? Where did I. Somebody.

[Dave Rubin]

Right.

[Jillian Michaels]

I just don't.

[Dave Rubin]

Well, you could tell Joy didn't even know.

[Jillian Michaels]

Help me.

[Dave Rubin]

Well, Joy didn't even know what she was saying. I mean, she was just reading it off a card, which also tells you an awful lot on that show that she didn't know what she was talking about. But I don't know, is she? Well, basically, I think what she was saying was that, yes, that California got a lot of federal funds after Covid, so they were able to at least to some extent get out of the close to recession we had, which really was Gavin Newsom's fault in California, where they absolutely closed everything. I mean, you can just look at the numbers. The places that stayed open did much better economically than. Than the places that closed. So it's all just, it's just nothingness with these people. It's like, you know, you guys, you all live in New York City in fancy doorman buildings. You have security everywhere you go. And Jillian, you know, I was in LA last week and I walked through West Hollywood where I used to live. It used to be the coolest area. It was thriving. There were so many restaurants and businesses. There were people outdoors all the time. It was an empty ghost town. There were drug addicts everywhere. I quite literally, Gillian, I can't remember if I told you this on actual friends or not. I quite literally saw a guy who used to be a big time Hollywood producer who I knew well. I went to dinner with him about a year and a half ago. He's a full on drug addict now. Like he was a junkie on the street. Like with the, with the stoop and everything. That's what's happening in that town. So if you vote for Karen Bass again, who's been in charge, you will get exactly what you deserve.

[Jillian Michaels]

I.

[Dave Rubin]

Or you will deserve exactly what you.

[Jillian Michaels]

I guess so. Two. Two other things I want to point out. The woman went to communist Cuba ten plus times. It's somewhere in the teens. And when Castro died, she saluted him as the commander and chief. That is the reason I'm told that she actually wasn't tapped by Biden to become the vp because that was just such a dirty little secret. Now it's commonplace. It's like, of course we love communism. It's fantastic. But you're telling me this, this woman is a brilliant economist that navigated California through its financial crisis. California has the worst amount of fraud out of every state in the frickin union. And one last thought. Have you ever. I'm asking honestly, and maybe we should find it for the, for the sake of transparency. Has the view ever gone after Zoron or his lack of credentials? Cuz the budget in New York is more than the budget in la.

[Dave Rubin]

Not only he has no. I mean he was a, he was a state representative before he became mayor but if I'm not mistaken they can check us on this. I think he missed more than half of his votes. And again just being some like nominal legislature person in the middle of nowhere New York is not a qualification to then run New York, New York City. What you would want are business people, people who understand economics, who understand the structure of government to do things. But he's in the business of destroying the state. But let me just mention one other thing. Because of the fire thing, which is obviously what got Spencer Pratt radicalized into running. If you think about it this way, Florida, where I am now, gets hit with crazy hurricanes all the time. The most recent massive. We had a Category 5 that hit Southwest Florida, Hurricane Ian a couple years ago. It did unbelievably extensive damage that there's still. Now there are things that have not been rebuilt and we do have an insurance problem here. However, in all of the time, in the subsequent years, everyone in this state knows that it was prepared for it. Meaning when an act of God is going to happen, bad things are going to happen. There are going to be really bad hurricanes, there are going to be fires that happen, there's going to be earthquakes and tornadoes and all of those things. You can't expect the government to keep everyone safe and that there will be no damage or anything else. What you can hope for with your government is that they will do some of the legwork that will mitigate the damage afterwards. And we know that Florida does that extremely well in large part because of Desantis. Karen Bass on the other hand went to Ghana when she was told that these Santa Ana was winds were crazy and coming in. And then we can talk about the reservoir not having water and everything else. So the point is, it's not that I don't blame a horrific act of God on a politician. What I blame them for is did they do their due diligence beforehand so that the damage after can be as lessened as possible? And clearly the answer is no. When it comes to her.

[Jillian Michaels]

Speaking of L. A Then let's transition for a second to the celebrity sphere. The thing that annoys you the most about capitalism. Oh my God.

[Stephen A. Smith]

That's a long list.

[Jillian Michaels]

The only people that really benefit are the top.003%.

[Dave Rubin]

It's very simple. It's just way too imbalanced.

[Stephen A. Smith]

There's no way you need to have all that damn money if people out here and can't eat

[Dave Rubin]

the. The unfairness of the entire system.

[Jillian Michaels]

Okay, okay, hold on. I have had so many people who specialize in economics on the show. And you know what? I am able to walk away with this like a. Just like a fraction of understanding about pretty much one thing. Capitalism has beat out communism when it comes to the benefit of the common people over and over and over again. I mean just. It could be Trish Regan, it could be Suze Orman. It could be someone like Victor Davis Hanson who's a world class historian showing me how it all breaks down. It could be Bill O'Reilly. Same thing. Historian. Here's how it played out over here and here's how it played out over there. Do you have to be a genius to go, I don't know where communism has worked. I don't really know where socialism has worked. Maybe some like Nordic countries that are this big have some sort of form of democratic socialism that's turned out okay. Not really applicable to the United States model. But all millionaires. Dave, what is in their head?

[Dave Rubin]

First off, you know, I don't know. I've never seen those celebrities. I haven't either. Except the last guy was Jason Ritter. Do you know who his dad was?

[Jillian Michaels]

Oh, John Ritter's kid.

[Dave Rubin]

Yeah, John Ritter. The great John Ritter of Three's Company. One of the greatest comedic actors. We. I mean nobody could fall over a couch like that guy. I have so much love and warmth for him. And watching those Three's Company reruns on Nick at Nite when I was a kid. And that his son. His son. So think about it. John Ritter becomes a massive star. Right? I have no idea how many millions and millions. He was doing a top rated sitcom. I forget what it was called. What was the sitcom company when he died? No, no, no. When he died. He was on another show at the time. Something about your father or something. We'll get it in just a second. But this was a guy who became a huge success. Unbelievably talented. His son then is afforded all of the open doors. Probably grew up somewhere in Bel Air or Brentwood or whatever. And there he is, bitching and moaning about capitalism. What show was it? 8 Simple Rules for Dating. 8 Simple Rules for Dating My teenage Daughter. Yeah, that's what he was doing. And then during rehearsal one day, he just. He basically had a horrific heart attack and died. You know, the nonsense of all of this is that the first girl that you showed there. We covered this on my show this morning. She's a kids actor in some kids shows from China. And it's like, lady, lady, what are you talking about? You would never be on a red carpet in China talking about how bad communism is, is because they'll kill you. So you will come to America, tell us how bad capitalism is, and try to turn it into communism, even though you fled communism in the first place. It's so bananas. These people are incredibly backwards, and it's really, really dangerous. Gillian. You know, they have brainwashed so many young people into thinking this is true. I know the top 1% pay 47% in taxes, but please, somebody tell me what. And then Bernie will say they have to pay their fair share. Okay, would it be 65%? Would it be 80%? Would it be 95% plus a beheading? Give me the number that you need. Give me the number that you need to solve all of the problems. And that's the thing. There is no number because they can't solve everything. It's so weird. They hate the system, and then their answer is, the system should have more power over your life.

[Jillian Michaels]

God, you make a great point. The irony there. If I was to try to lean in on something, I always do this to you. Corporations get away with a hell of a lot, right? They've got their. What is it, like, Apple has their company based out of Ireland or something to get out of paying taxes? Would the argument be, that's a great thing because they give more jobs, so let them reinvest that whole Reaganomics concept? Or is the argument, like, these guys are getting away with too much? They've got all these tax loopholes and. Because I. I do think the answer is somewhere in the middle. But when you demonize capitalism, like, you move away from, let's say, laissez faire capitalism and free trade maybe to fair trade. Is there some sort of middle ground we could all arrive at? Or you think I've lost my tooth?

[Dave Rubin]

Well, this is where I usually think you're still a little squishy on things, but I love you for it. Look, capitalism is basically the idea that people will trade freely between each other. That's like the simplest kind of like third grade explanation of what capitalism is. Now, is it possible within that you're going to have some bad actors, some people are going to take advantage of people, people will figure out tax loopholes and all the things, of course, but the idea that there are some people who figure out tax loopholes better than others, well then you'd want to change the tax system.

[Jillian Michaels]

Perhaps.

[Dave Rubin]

But that's not, that's not an affront to capitalism as the, as the system. You know, if I wrote about this in my first book, like if you wanted the fairest system possible, what you should do is have a flat tax that everyone, you just pick a number, everyone. And everyone pays, let's say it's 12%. Just pick a number, everyone pays 12%. And then to even throw the progressives a bone, you could say, you know what, if you make under 50 grand a year, you'll pay nothing. And you know what, if you make over 5 mil a year, you got to pay 2% more. That would be the only way. And I don't even think that would be morally or even logically right because you know, if you throw these people a bone, that that's never enough for them. But let's just say that would leave 99.5% of the country paying the exact same amount in percentage in taxes. So the millionaires would pay that much and the guy making 100 grand or 80 grand, living a fairly nominal life would pay that much. That's the only fair thing. But nobody will go for that, right? Like people used to joke about a flat tax. Thirty years ago there was, what's his name, who was the libertarian that ran for president. The dorky guy with the glasses.

[Jillian Michaels]

Not Paul? No, not.

[Dave Rubin]

Oh, before Rand Paul there was the guy flat tax, and he's a big money guy and he's got glasses and he's working. Steve Forbes. Thank you, Steve Forbes.

[Jillian Michaels]

Okay, Steve. God.

[Dave Rubin]

So that would be the only fair thing you could do. But this, look, it's, it's so simple. Just, just look what's going on here in Florida versus look what's going on in New York. They're taxing the hell out of these corporations and they're taxing the hell out of the executives. And they're all moving down here, right?

[Jillian Michaels]

Yep.

[Dave Rubin]

And they're moving down here where there's, there's no state income tax. And then what happens? It's not just that you get the corporation down here, the people that work for the corporation. So like Ken Griffin at Citadel is a Great example. Mom da Me walks in front of his pied? Terre, basically in that commercial, says, burn down this thing and get his wife and grab her in her fur coat and do what you want with her. So he's like, all right, we're getting the hell out of Dodge. He's coming down to Florida right now. But it's not just that he's bringing that company and his resources as a business billionaire. The people that work for Citadel are going to be like, boy, I get to now move down to Florida where it's safer, where it's cleaner. Oh, there's no state income tax. So if I'm, you know, just some, like, mid level analyst at Citadel, let's say I make 175 grand, it's pretty good. Well, now I just got about 12% of that back in my pocket because I'm not paying New York for that. And then you suddenly look around and you're like, and you know what? We still have roads and the lights are still on. My God, how did this happen? Because it's never about revenue. It's a spending issue. The governments have plenty of money. It's that they are inefficient and incompetent. Although there are some places, again, like Florida, where it's not the case.

[Jillian Michaels]

Let's transition. You put a beautiful button on that for me. I have a question for you about this. It's unrelated, but I want to talk about it first. Let's watch. It's Stephen A. Smith sought number seven.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Some of these people, Stephen. Well, not all of them. Nope, nope, nope. You don't get to do that. Don't talk to me about mental illness on the side of the right. But you had people talking about transgender without parental consent and. And men transitioning to women and playing in women's sports and thinking that that was okay and people could be incarcerated and they could have sex changes and stuff like that. Oh, no, no, no. You don't get to sit up there and just point to the right about that and not act like there wasn't craziness on the left, too. I'm a moderate. I'm a moderate who primarily votes Democrat. And I'm here to tell you something right now. I don't recognize this left or not this one. Not the one that I've been seeing over the last few years. I'm a moderate who will lean left on everything but dollars, meaning taxes. I can't stand high taxes in California, New York, New Jersey. Okay. I'm a fiscal conservative with my money I'm liberal with everything else and I'm still appalled by how far left the left has leaned. It's disgraceful, no common sense. And oh by the way, when you talk about woke culture and cancel culture, don't come to me with the Republicans. It wasn't the Republicans that was trying to get people fired for pronouncing the wrong pronoun. That's the left and you're appealing to a community and in the meanwhile you turning your back on black folks who supported you since the 60s. Don't get me started with all of that. I got a lot of problems with Trump. I got a lot of problems with some of the things that I've seen from the Republican side. Most recently and in more immediate is the Affordable Care act and the fact that they still haven't had a plan all these damn years. You had an opportunity to have a plan and we still wait for the GOP to have a damn plan. You holding up everything. You ain't got no damn plan.

[Jillian Michaels]

That's good team. Small businesses are the backbone of the American economy. But getting funding from traditional banks is an uphill battle. So of the 36 million small businesses in the US over 70% report needing additional capital every year. So while revenue as at an all time high, big banks are tightening standards and approving fewer loans than ever, leaving owners stuck with mountains of paperwork. But if you want bank rates without bank delays, check out Cardiff Co Jillian for up to $500,000 in same day funding. Cardiff is the largest privately held small business lender in the US having funded over $12 billion since 2004. The application takes less than five minutes, has no impact on personal credit and approvals happen within minutes. With same day funding, banks try to lock out small businesses. Cardiff has the key. Big banks may not want to approve your business loans, but Cardiff does. So if you've been in business for at least a year and you're pulling in $20,000 a month in revenue, apply now for up to $500,000 in same day business funding at Cardiff Co. Jillian again that's Cardiff Co Jillian Real growth, fast funding. Cardiff borrow better. Here's the point that I that I wanted to make or the question I want to ask you about it is how come when someone like me or someone like you points out that kind of crazy the Sam Cedar Co's of the world are like I a turf. You are a radical feminist that just wants to deprive trans people of their rights. But when Joy Reed says can't have men in women's bathrooms. And when Stephen A. Smith says you can't have men and women's sports and you can't perform sex changes on children, zippo, zip, nada. Why haven't we labeled him a crazy MAGA loon?

[Dave Rubin]

Well, you know, it's interesting. I was on Stephen A's show this week and we've become friendly over the last year or so. And you know, Stephen A. Is kind of, he's got an interesting position because he's basically in that Bill Maher spot, which is that I'm still a liberal, barely in the classical sense of liberal, which, which in a normal world I think you and I are. I mean, I literally wrote the best selling book on liberalism in the last 50 years. And it's hard for me to call myself a liberal because the word has been so mucked up. But the space he's trying to occupy is the Bill Maher space, which is I'm a liberal, as he said, I lean left on most issues and I'm with the Democrats, but they've gone crazy. Now what I said to him on his show this week is, well, it's not to say whether you're a liberal or not, but to defend your liberal beliefs has now become a conservative position. And that's why, you know, Maha basically brought you over into MAGA. It's why I left the left 10 years ago. It's why pot smoking, MMA, mushroom eating, Joe Rogan supported Donald Trump. It's why Tulsi Gabbard, who was a Democrat for president a couple years ago, Bobby Kennedy quite literally was running as a Democrat last cycle and is now part of this. So I think he's, it's not confused. I think he's slightly missing the mark on what the Democrats are. It seems to me he has two kind of spots that he's slightly missing here. One is, and he asked me about this repeatedly and you should talk to him about it too, about Republicans and gays. And basically I said the ship has sailed. It's not to say that there aren't some religious conservatives that are not thrilled with gay marriage or something else. And yes, they're annoying online and by the way, they're entitled to their religious belief. I don't have a problem with that as long as you're not legislating my life. I believe that the liberal argument, which again has become a conservative argument, is that you have individual rights. So any adult should be allowed to engage in any other contractual relationship than any other adult, regardless of sexuality or gender or Anything else. So he was still hung up on that sort of gays can't be Republicans. And then his other one was that, you know, basically, Republicans don't do enough for black people. And what I tried to say to him was, well, you have to look at what Democrats who have owned black voters forever, what they have done. I mean, Democrats, did the welfare state Democrats, and did that help black families? No, actually, you can look at when the, when the welfare state kicked in. And don't take my word for this. Read Thomas Sowell or talk to Larry Elder. In the early 70s, the Black families started breaking down. Then you started getting generational poverty, which didn't exist beforehand. Because if you start giving people stuff and you give them subsidized housing and you give them food, they will stop working. And that has nothing to do with skin color. Right. Like, if you say to somebody, the example I always use is that my sister lived in a really nice building on the Upper west side with her husband and two kids. And she used to call it my little box, because although it was a nice building with the doorman, you know, 50 floors high, it was just a little box apartment, basically a studio that they turned, turned into a one bedroom because they built a wall, so you didn't even have a window in the main room. But they paid market price for it, which was like $5,000 a month. Half the building was subsidized housing. So there were people that lived in that building that paid quite literally $250 or $300 for that exact same apartment. So if you were that person, would you suddenly be like, boy, you know, the government's given me this thing for 300 bucks and I get food stamp, I don't have to do anything. And this schmuck upstairs is paying 5,000 for it. That's what creates class warfare, that's what creates resentment, and it's what creates the cycle of poverty. So to the extent that he still thinks that Democrat policies help black people, I think that's the disconnect I tried to say to him. Look, if you want to help black people, I think black people are like white people and everybody else. What you want to do is lower taxes, lower regulation, again, create conditions for them to succeed. And Donald Trump is trying to do that.

[Jillian Michaels]

I want to address the gay part for a moment because I've actually had a lot of conversations with Christian nationalists, and I got to tell you, Dave, they may not be for gay marriage. Matt Walsh, arguably being the most aggressive about gay families having. Having said that, I've spoken to Benny Johnson, who couldn't have been more lovely. I've watched your conversations with Charlie Kirk, who said, listen, I'm a Christian. America is not a theocracy. I wouldn't want to end your marriage. I've, I've spoke to Andrew Wilson, who is like, listen, you know, this is a power game and I want to win it, but couldn't have been more lovely to me outside of our position about that. And he was still lovely to me even when we were talking about. My point being, you can have conversations with conservatives and they can say, I'm against gay marriage, I'm against gay families. I don't believe in it from a religious perspective. But they are always civil. They never wage ad hominem attacks. They're never aggressive, they're never cruel. Whereas what I found so ironic in watching so many clips of Sam Seder, just like, hey, Bill O'Reilly here.

[Dave Rubin]

Please check out my new interview series,

[Jillian Michaels]

we'll do it live.

[Dave Rubin]

Each Thursday, I sit down with the most influential people, people in America. We're a no spin chat, no script. Anything could happen. You can find we'll do it live

[Jillian Michaels]

on Billor.com YouTube or wherever you download your podcast. You know, hurl his pejoratives at me. He made fun of gays at least three times. One is a clip of you and I, one is a clip of Benny and I, and one is a clip of Crowder and I. And it was like, I'm not trying to be a dick. It literally was like watching Beavis and Butthead. They're like, is that the meaning of the Gay Straight Alliance?

[Stephen A. Smith]

They're both gay.

[Jillian Michaels]

And I, I was shocked. And, and I'm thinking the worst attacks, the most vicious, the most aggressive, the most personal are from the Brian Shapiro's the Sam Cedars. So don't talk about gay.

[Dave Rubin]

I don't care about any of those guys. But what I would say is this. The problem is when you're a lefty and you believe that immutable characteristics are the most important thing, which is clearly that's what woke is. So if you buck that trend, right, they need their gays to be oppressed in a certain way. You need your blacks to be oppressed in a certain way. You have to push out white people, you have to push out Jews, like, you have to push out Asians. You have to keep everybody in that thing so they consider you and I to basically be, I don't know, Uncle Tom craters or something like that.

[Jillian Michaels]

Medical jobs in the gay Community.

[Dave Rubin]

You know, Jillian, I'll give you a great example of this, and I sort of blame you for it, but I did that ridiculous Surrounded show the other day, and I'm not sure when it's going up, but it was, you know, basically like MAGA guy versus 20 far left.

[Jillian Michaels]

Yeah.

[Dave Rubin]

I mean, I sat in that circle. I have never. It was such unrelenting hatred. It wasn't. Oh, we disagree with this guy. We think he's an idiot.

[Jillian Michaels]

That's what we want you, dad.

[Dave Rubin]

It was venomous hatred that I genuinely. I could feel daggers. You know, when you can actually have a physical reaction to an emotion that someone's giving you, I could feel daggers going into my neck. I'm not kidding you. There was so much hatred. And I genuinely believe that several of them, if they could have given. Were given the opportunity and could have got away with it, would have killed me. And they all, almost all of them, tried to use my sexuality against me by saying that I'm friends. They kept telling me the people I'm friends with hate me. And meanwhile, they clearly hate me as they're pretending to be the good guys. So what I would say is this. The simplest way I can answer it is this. Charlie and Charlie Kirk and Ben Shapiro, I think took. Charlie took. And Ben takes. Takes the most principled position on this, which is you are absolutely entitled to your religious beliefs 100%. And I would never force a church or a mosque or a temple to perform a gay wedding that was against their beliefs. I wouldn't. The civil law should be for equality based on the Constitution. Okay. And that is now what we have by marriage equality. Marriage is not in the Constitution. Right. So there's nothing that says the Constitution. Marriage is between a man and a woman. Marriage is not in the Constitution. But what is in the Constitution is equal opportunity is individual rights. We can do all the versions of that. So as long as the civil. The secular world treats everybody equal, which marriage equality got us to, then they can have their religious beliefs. Of course, the ultimate irony of all of this is that the very same people who are ranting and raving about how much they love the gays, you know, Mamdani, do you think his mosque performs gay marriages? Do you think Rashida Tlaib or Ilhan Omar's mosque does gay marriages? I'm pretty sure not. And why would he be at a homophobic mosque? That seems weird.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Oh, my God.

[Jillian Michaels]

D. I just. I fully got into that one thing in particular with Sam Cedar, because he was calling me an idiot. For saying that Iranians were out in the streets, which quite literally, I played the video of it for him, expressing concern that Mom Donnie was mirroring the early Ayatollah's political positions in, like, you know, 79.

[Dave Rubin]

Yeah.

[Jillian Michaels]

And he's like, oh, yeah?

[Stephen A. Smith]

Oh, yeah, like what? Like what?

[Jillian Michaels]

And I'm. I was trying to call up the graphics of, like, the policy side by side. And he just would not stop screaming at me. And he's like, and what you're saying he's an Islamist. And I finally was able to get one thing out. And I go, listen, the guy was on stage at a mosque linked to Iran. Gets off stage, and the imam swiftly calls for death to the infidels. That's.

[Stephen A. Smith]

I've seen it.

[Jillian Michaels]

That's me, you, Sam, and also all the gays. They stone gays to death. Yeah, well, that's why he's like, oh, nothing, nothing.

[Dave Rubin]

Queers for Palestine is very different than Palestine for queers. Right? That's why these people don't have their little pride parties in. In Gaza or. Or anywhere in the Muslim world. That's just true, right? Like, that's just true. It's not racist or Islamophobic or anything else to say that. And it shows you why all, you know, in. In England right now, which, you know, they've had their sort of Islamist Progressive alliance before we had ours. Theirs has been a couple years ahead of us. They're having huge problems right now. Like, the left in the UK is having huge problems because people are starting to. The gays are suddenly like, oh, yeah, this isn't looking so great. I just wanted to give head, not get beheaded. This is a bit much even for me.

[Stephen A. Smith]

We're leaving in.

[Jillian Michaels]

We're leaving out in.

[Dave Rubin]

He told me to get on my knees, I thought, but then you with the sword and I could keep doing this. You want to do a couple more of these?

[Jillian Michaels]

We think we, you know, it is a conservative. Let's. Let's ease them in gently, shall we?

[Dave Rubin]

He went to take something out of his pants. It turned out to be a machete. All right, all right, all right.

[Jillian Michaels]

Okay. With the time that I. I have left with you, I. I wanted to show you. We try to always end this Friday show with some things that are humanizing and at the very end, uplifting. So two more. I'm not going to tell you what this one is, but I want to get your reaction to it. Obviously, after you watch is SOT number nine.

[Dave Rubin]

Here you go, baby. Yeah, man. Want something to eat? Hell, yeah. Whole jumpsuit. Hell yeah.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Look at some pants for you.

[Dave Rubin]

Nobody came up and they fit just nice. Yep,

[Stephen A. Smith]

no problem at all. Hot food, bro.

[Dave Rubin]

Hell yeah.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Yo, bro. Yes, sir. Something to eat for you, my guy. I'll put it right there for you.

[Jillian Michaels]

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[Dave Rubin]

Yeah, you know, we've seen so many of these types of videos that you do become desensitized to it. There. There was something about that particular compilation. Maybe because you're just seeing his hand try to. You don't even see their faces like you just see a hand come out. There's something like particularly jarring about that. But look, this is, you know, Gad Sad has the number one selling book in the country right now and it's called Suicidal Empathy. And that is the best example of it right there. These are Democrat run cities. This is happening in Philly and Seattle and Portland and New York and particularly la and San Francisco and blah, blah, blah. It's not happening in Miami. Like, we can. Next time, I'm going to see you in south beach for our show on June 11th. Like, you want to go to Brickell. That's our downtown here. You won't see any of that. But there's a reason for it. These people that have said, oh, okay, we care about homeless people or we don't want to arrest drug addicts or whatever, we have such empathy for them that we actually won't help them. And on top of that, we won't create the economic conditions that would allow people to thrive so they end up in these situations. So I'm so empathetic for the drug user that I will give them the drugs or I will not. Or I will not arrest them for doing the drugs or. My solution is I don't want to be bigoted, so I'll just. I just want to. We just need more beds. You hear this a lot right now out of the LA mayoral race. They just need more beds. You think with those people that we just saw need our beds, they need something way. I mean, we've discussed this with Dr. Drew a million times. A million times. So Desantis always says, decline is a choice, and I'm so very, very aware and sensitive to that. While living in a place that is choosing to succeed and flourish, contrasted with the places that I visit, like New York and LA last week, LA was far worse than New York. New York has a sort of different undercurrent problem because it's an economic problem right now that I think we're not even seeing the full fruits of yet. LA has a very obvious drug, homeless, disaster problem. But if you want to help, if you want to help these people, you should be, I don't know, closing the border so fentanyl can't get in. You should, I don't know, maybe enforce laws so people can't be, you know, naked, injecting themselves with things on the street, etc. Etc. But it's always. It's always the empathetic progressive that leads to that and then blames us for it. Just one other thing real quick. When I did the Surrounded show, I talked to one of the people I debated was a, I believe, a trans person. Maybe it was a drag queen, I'm not sure. But it was somebody that was a man that appeared to be. Be a woman, let's say. And he or I actually did use her pronouns because I was trying to show somebody. I said, if you treat me with Respect. I'll treat you with respect. So I kept saying, she. Not that I got much respect back, but I did do that. And she kept saying, you know, that, you know, there are these. We should just leave them alone. Leave them alone or give them beds. And I was like. I was like, you know, if you're a mother and you're. You have a baby in a carriage and you're walking down the street in West Hollywood and there's drug addicts everywhere, wouldn't you be afraid? And should you have to be subjected to that? And she. She was like, I wouldn't be afraid. It's completely fine. They're not going to do anything to you. And it's like, sorry, that's not how society really exists. That's nonsense. And. And this is exactly what is wrong with everything. While you purport to be the good guy about everything.

[Jillian Michaels]

You know, what's interesting is that I feel the sadness when I watch that video, but it compels me even further into the policies that you just mentioned, because after having done numerous interviews and you mentioned Drew, he's an expert in all of this, that seems to be statistically the only thing that has any shot at helping people versus them dying on the sidewalk. You know, Shellenberger has a whole book about it called San Francisco. And it's like, before you give an opinion on capitalism or how to manage homelessness, do a little. Just a fraction of homework and listen to both sides and then look at the evidence for what works, instead of engaging in a tribal war that you know nothing about, whether it's capitalism versus communism, or give them beds and let them freeze to death in New York, per momdani, versus, like, not allowing them to loiter, arresting them, and giving them a choice between jail and treatment. But it's just. I just.

[Dave Rubin]

I'm so. Jillian, why is it that Texas, a very red state, you go to the one blue epicenter, Austin, and there's homelessness and drugs everywhere.

[Jillian Michaels]

It is.

[Dave Rubin]

And everyone that I talk to there, you know, I did. You know Jason Kalinakis from the all in podcast?

[Jillian Michaels]

Yes.

[Dave Rubin]

Yeah. You know him. He's a great guy. I did his show, and we're up in a nice building, and I walk right downstairs, and I don't know if he's a billionaire, but he's certainly worth hundreds of millions. Like, the guy's worth a lot of money. And there's a lot of, you know, he's in a nice fancy building. I go downstairs, and there's just drug addicts and Homeless people everywhere. I was walking with Phoenix, and we literally kept crossing the street because we didn't want to walk by, because you just don't know, are you gonna get stabbed or are they sick? Like, you just don't know. That has nothing to do with being mean or anything else. But I kept saying to Jason, I was like, I don't get it, man. Like, you've got all this money, you're in this fancy building here. What is going on down there? And he's like, well, you know, it's just in this three or four block radius. That's it. That's it. But that's not. But no, if. To whatever extent that's even true.

[Jillian Michaels]

That's not even that big, by the way. This big.

[Dave Rubin]

Right. Austin's pretty small.

[Jillian Michaels]

Anyway, just. Just saying. Because I remember I visited Austin and Nashville and Miami when I was escaping Los Angeles, and that was just next level. So much so that I. I looked at my Deshana, my wife, and I'm like, this is not even a consideration. I would not even give this a 5% chance. It looks just like LA. No. Like, I don't care if it's a blueberry in a red state. Like, I'd rather live in a raspberry in a blue state.

[Dave Rubin]

No, right. Exactly.

[Jillian Michaels]

Absolutely not. All right, last one. So this is a little positive uplifter to send you off into your remaining the remainder of your week.

[Dave Rubin]

I have long been unable to understand the atheist in this world of so much beauty. And I've had an unholy desire to invite some atheists to a dinner and then serve the most fabulous gourmet dinner that has ever been concocted. And after dinner, ask them if they believed there was a cook.

[Jillian Michaels]

I'm just gonna hand it over to

[Dave Rubin]

you, you know, Reagan. The beauty of Reagan, of course, is that he was a very successful Hollywood actor for decades before he got in. You know, eventually became governor of Cali and then President of the United States. You know, it's funny, you watch those clips of him, and it's very rehearsed, and he read everything and all that, and it's somehow, you watch it now and it feels very old and like, oh, it wouldn't fly now. Right. If you contrast that with Trump right off the cuff and everything else. But Reagan was an absolute master at explaining complex things in very, very simple ways. Partly his speechwriters, obviously, but also the softness of his voice, his tone, his inflection. Like, whatever he had learned from acting, he was a. He was a true master. And I think we miss. We miss communicators like that that can turn a phrase. I would say John Kennedy from Louisiana has got a little bit of that, but, you know, the Southern drawl kind of changes it a bit. He's a little more punchy, maybe than Reagan was. And I know there's a lot of people now that go after Reagan's legacy, but, you know, you and I were children of the 80s, and could there have ever been a better decade to grow up in, you know, where America was absolutely booming? You ever see those memes where it's like they show you, like, every weekend from, like, you know, 1982 to 1989. And every weekend it's like another incredible movie came out. It's like Temple of Doom, Ghostbusters, Star Wars, Total Recall, Rocky. And it's just like, how did it happen? Every week? You'd be like, it's Saturday night. Let's go do something awesome. And there was something new and cool, and we don't really have that anymore. You know, we don't. When's the last time you downloaded, like, an amazing album and you were like, holy cow. That's great. I know my guy over here loves the new Drake album, but, like, there's not that much. When's the last time you. You were like, holy cow. That movie was. Blew my mind away and changes everything. We're in a bit of a. We're in a bit of a calcified state right now, but because you do something that I do, which is try to take people to the weekend, positively, I would end with, we're on AI Horizon. And I think that the future is going to be unbelievably bright and change us in ways that we cannot even imagine. And there's some rich guy named Elon Musk, you may have heard of him, who wants life to go interplanetary. And, you know, the robotic cars are here, and we're going to all have optimists in our house house in a year from now. And there's so many cool things happening, and I can do all the dystopian versions of the future, but it comes with a lot of good stuff, too.

[Jillian Michaels]

I think the last thought on it for me was the fact that he talks about how beautiful and miraculous the world is, but he doesn't cite any specific religion. Not that there's anything wrong with doing that right, whether you're a Christian or Jew or Buddhist or Muslim or whatever it might be. But I think people just go into their silos now, like, My religion is the only way. And I just love that. It's like, the world is beautiful, and that makes me believe in God and we're all a part of that. I'm just so desperate to get back to something that we can find common ground on, that we can come together on, that isn't dividing us. And that. That clip made me feel that way.

[Dave Rubin]

Yeah, well, he's talking about the wonder, right? Like, so was there a chef? Wow. How do you explain this? That incredible Amelia just had, like, how did that happen? And the denomination doesn't matter there. That's your point. It just doesn't matter. And you know what, Gillian? I would say, look, we're creatures of the Internet. Everyone is slammed with social media all the time. Most people are much better than this noise. And that's why if you look at some of the people in our space that have gone crazy over the last couple years, every candidate that Tucker endorsed over the last six months lost fact. So that shows you something. He endorsed five guys. They all lost. Or five guys were on his show. They all lost. You know, the people that seem to be going crazy. Yeah, it burns hot for a while. I know you probably don't want me to say anything bad about Megan, but, like, her numbers are terrible right now. They're embarrassingly terrible.

[Jillian Michaels]

I miss her.

[Dave Rubin]

She made a choice, and I think she's paying for it with her own audience right now. It is what it is. I wish it didn't go that way, but if you just do something good over time, if you build it, they will come. Somebody said that once in another great movie of the 80s. Actually, that's how we were able to do it back then.

[Jillian Michaels]

Dave Rubin, you're fantastic. Tell everybody about the show that I get to join you for. And of course, everything that Rubin Report and all the books and the things and the stuff.

[Dave Rubin]

How I had to twist your arm to join me on June 11th in Miami at the Fillmore, which is a gorgeous theater. It's where Bill Maher did his last HBO special, I did it with Jordan Peterson years ago. It's a great theater in Miami beach. And on June 11th, it is me. It is Jillian Michaels, Ben Shapiro, Adam Carolla, and Florida Governor Ron DeSantis. We're going to write a Rubin Report show that morning. We'll have you and Ben do some stuff together. Carolla's going to do a little stand up. I'm going to do a sit down with the gov. There's going to be some free tequila. We're going to do some giveaways. It's just going to be a celebration of all of the good things, the good things about this state with, you know, on stage with people who I love, who I agree with some stuff and disagree with some stuff. Maybe we can get you and Ben to battle it out on some things. And it's just. It's just going to be a blast. Like, if you want to just have fun for a couple hours, come and see us. And if you. You know what? I'm going to put you on the spot here. If people buy the meet and greet package where they're supposed to meet me, will you hug some of these people?

[Jillian Michaels]

I already told the squad I'd be there. What do you mean?

[Dave Rubin]

Yeah, no, no. But will you stay around after so you could hug some of these people? Because they always want excessive hugs from me. But can I send some to you? Will hug some of these people. They can go to daverubin.com events. It's gonna be a great, great night. I promise you guys.

[Jillian Michaels]

Dee's giving out sloppy white kisses, by the way, if you stick around.

[Dave Rubin]

Yeah, the sloppy kisses. I get some of those every now and again. We try to limit those, but the hugging I can deal with.

[Jillian Michaels]

Thank you so much, sweetheart. I'm gonna put this up Friday. Have the team send me everything I need for the show notes.

[Dave Rubin]

Yep, will do. That was great. As always, you are a gem.

[Jillian Michaels]

I'll talk to you tomorrow.

[Dave Rubin]

Ta ta.

[Jillian Michaels]

Mwah. Mwah. Thank you so much for watching. If you enjoyed the podcast, please, like, comment, subscribe and share. And make sure to let me know what guests you want to see on in the.