Podcast Summary

Podcast: Keeping It Real: Conversations with Jillian Michaels
Episode: TRUMP TO INVADE GREENLAND, RESCUE IRAN, & RUN VENEZUELA?!
Host: Jillian Michaels
Guest: Dinesh D'Souza (conservative commentator, author, filmmaker)
Date: January 18, 2026

Overview

In this episode, Jillian Michaels hosts Dinesh D’Souza for a candid and wide-ranging discussion on America’s role in international conflicts, particularly focusing on the prospects and consequences of regime change in Venezuela and Iran, and the controversial idea of American intervention in Greenland. The conversation examines the complexities of "America First" foreign policy, the morality and pragmatism behind interventionism, and the historical context for U.S. actions abroad. D’Souza provides historical analysis, defends intervention under certain circumstances, and challenges popular narratives on the left and right. The episode is intellectually provocative, charged with strong opinions, and explores contentious geopolitical questions with nuance and candor.

Main Discussion Points & Insights

1. What Does “America First” Mean?

• Defining America First:
  • D’Souza argues it means putting American interests and values first, but not to the exclusion of trade, alliances, or international cooperation. He draws an analogy to personal relationships: “Life is not just about common values. It’s also about common interests. And that’s all really, we’re saying about America’s role in the world, to be attentive, that we live in a big neighborhood.” (D'Souza, 02:19)
• Rejecting ‘America Only’:
  • Michaels voices skepticism that “America First” has morphed into “America Only,” arguing that some conservatives have lost nuance. (Michaels, 03:26)

2. The Morality and Pragmatism of Regime Change

• When Is Regime Change Justified?
  • D’Souza distinguishes between scenarios where interests and values align (such as Iran/Venezuela), making intervention appealing, and those where a pro-American dictator abuses his people, creating a conundrum. (D’Souza, 04:23)
  • “Any genuine libertarian should support the advance of freedom in the world.” (D'Souza, 05:47)
• Examples: Afghanistan vs. Iraq
  • Afghanistan: Regime change justified, but post-invasion nation-building was the mistake. (D'Souza, 08:05)
  • Iraq: Removing Saddam was a mistake given the lack of WMDs and resulting instability. “The current Iraqi regime is very much on the side of the Iranians...there’s essentially a hostile, anti-American regime in Iraq.” (D'Souza, 10:18)

3. The Consequences of Proxy Wars

• The Mujahideen and Radical Islam:
  • U.S. supported anti-Soviet fighters in the 1980s—hugely successful in ending the Cold War, but the aftermath facilitated the rise of radical Islam targeting the West. (D'Souza, 11:20)
  • “We should not minimize our own successes...but, yes, having pushed the Soviet Union out, we now had a new problem.” (D'Souza, 12:44)

4. The Roots of Radical Islam and Iran’s Unique Position

• Historical Context:
  • D’Souza provides a brief history of Islam’s expansion, explaining how Iran was conquered and forcibly converted. The modern theocracy under the Ayatollahs is unique in Islamic history. (D'Souza, 20:50)
• Iranian Identity:
  • Notably, Iranians are ethnically and culturally distinct from Arabs, and many view the Islamist regime as an occupying force. (Guest C, 17:01)
  • “They forced people to convert to Islam. They changed our language in our schools.” (Guest C, 17:46)

5. Venezuela’s Dire State

• Foreign Interference & Crime:
  • Venezuela is described as a “criminal hub” with Russian, Iranian, and terrorist groups operating alongside drug cartels. Genuine regime change, with international support, is advocated to restore freedom and stability. (Guest D, 19:06)

6. The Altruism and Risks of American Intervention

• The Case for Helping Iran:
  • Clips from Van Jones and others express hope that freeing Iranians could unleash vast positive potential for humanity, echoing bipartisan calls for action. (Van Jones, 24:06)
  • “It’s worth the fight to get them free...you need the Persians back on the map for this century to work out.” (Van Jones, 24:41)

7. Successes and Failures of Regime Change

• Historical Examples:
  • D’Souza counters the notion that regime change “never works” by citing Japan, Germany, post-Cold War Eastern Europe, Kuwait, and South Korea as successes. (D'Souza, 28:00)
  • “Japan has been a pro-Western, pro-American, stable country for now 75 years...it has worked out splendidly.” (D'Souza, 28:46)
• Caution:
  • However, he warns against U.S. attempts to “rebuild” countries—locals must govern: “Venezuela...has an American style constitution...There is no reason to believe the Venezuelans can’t run their own country.” (D'Souza, 30:36)

8. Selective Outrage and Double Standards

• The Politics of Human Rights:
  • Michaels decries hypocrisy, noting Obama’s drone strikes and lack of protest as compared to Trump. D’Souza attributes political protest to selective interests, not principle. (Michaels 48:45, D’Souza 50:03)
  • “A lot of the people who say ‘I care about human rights’, what they really mean is, ‘I care about human rights for these people, but not for those people.’” (D'Souza, 50:39)

9. America’s Partners in the Middle East

• On Gulf States and Refugees:
  • The episode discusses why Arab states don’t take more action against Iran or accept Palestinian refugees, with D’Souza pointing out their own calculations and internal security concerns. (Michaels, 36:43; D'Souza, 37:41)
  • “They don’t want the Palestinians...they see the Palestinians as the troublemakers that most of them actually are.” (D’Souza, 39:54)

10. Is the U.S. at War?

• Defining War:
  • D’Souza draws a distinction between ‘acts of war’ and targeted interventions, arguing tactical strikes or capturing dictators isn’t the same as full-scale war. (D'Souza, 47:12)
  • “Blowing up a drug boat is not a war. Even capturing Maduro is not a war.” (D’Souza, 47:38)

11. The Greenland Question

• Trump’s Interest in Greenland:
  • Michaels expresses alarm at Trump’s comments about acting in Greenland "whether they like it or not".
  • D’Souza advises negotiation rather than threats and cautions against blurring rhetoric with action: “Trump will sometimes say really outrageous things...Trump is more accurately judged by his conduct.” (D’Souza, 53:48 & 55:28)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Any genuine libertarian should support the advance of freedom in the world.”
  — Dinesh D’Souza (05:47)
• “The mistake came after the regime change...To do this with, like, 8th-century tribesmen is absurd.”
  — Dinesh D’Souza on Afghanistan (08:36)
• “This was a giant victory... the liberation of hundreds of millions of people worldwide.”
  — Dinesh D’Souza on the Cold War (12:27)
• “They have chafed for 50 years, almost 50 years under this Islamic regime. They hate it and they want their old way of life back.”
  — Dinesh D’Souza on Iran (21:57)
• “You need the Persians back on the map for this century to work out.”
  — Van Jones (24:41)
• “If you told me I can have one wish in foreign policy, what should it be? ... I would rather see the mullahs hit the eject button and out they go.”
  — D'Souza (36:13)
• “A lot of the people who say ‘I care about human rights,’ what they really mean is, ‘I care about human rights for these people, but not for those people.’”
  — D’Souza (50:39)
• “Trump is more accurately judged by his conduct.”
  — Dinesh D’Souza (55:28)

Key Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:55 — Defining “America First”
• 04:23 — Debating the morality and practicality of regime change
• 08:36 — Successes and failures post-intervention (Afghanistan/Iraq)
• 11:20 — U.S. involvement in Afghanistan against the Soviets
• 17:01 — Iranian identity and the Islamist regime
• 19:06 — Venezuelan guest details state of Venezuela
• 24:06 — Van Jones’ emotional plea for a free Iran
• 28:00–30:36 — D’Souza offers counter-examples of successful regime change
• 36:13 — Strategic importance of ousting the mullahs in Iran
• 39:54 — Middle East states and the Palestinian refugee issue
• 47:12 — What defines “war” in modern U.S. interventions
• 53:48 — Trump’s Greenland rhetoric and the gap between talk and action

Tone and Style

The conversation is bold, honest, and unfiltered—true to Jillian Michaels’ stated mission for the podcast. D’Souza is unfailingly direct, relishes historical depth, and indulges in some biting critiques of his political adversaries. Michaels keeps the discussion grounded and relatable, repeatedly emphasizing her position as a layperson asking tough questions.

Conclusion

This episode challenges common assumptions about U.S. foreign policy and “regime change”, offering both a defense of strategic intervention and a warning against naïve nation-building. It is a primer on major controversies—Venezuela, Iran, and even Greenland—meant to equip listeners with historical context and skeptical questions for navigating present-day headlines. Whether or not listeners agree with Dinesh D’Souza, the episode offers a model for passionate, nuanced political dialogue that goes beneath the headlines.

For more from Dinesh D’Souza:

• X (formerly Twitter): @DineshDSouza
• YouTube: Dinesh D’Souza
• New film: The Dragon's Prophecy (available on Apple iTunes, Amazon, Walmart)
• Podcast: Launching February, “The Dinesh Show”

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