Lindsay Duncan & Charlotte Regan on MINT, and Thea Gajić on SURVIVING EARTH

Summary

Kermode on Film – Episode Summary

Date: April 28, 2026
Host: Mark Kermode
Guests: Lindsay Duncan, Charlotte Regan (on BBC’s Mint), Thea Gajić (on Surviving Earth)

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Episode Overview

This episode presents the first segment of the live MK3D show recorded at BFI Southbank. Mark Kermode welcomes acclaimed actress Lindsay Duncan and director/writer Charlotte Regan to discuss their new BBC series Mint, followed by director Thea Gajić sharing insights into her debut feature Surviving Earth. The episode also features clips, discussion of creative influences, audience Q&A spirit, and reflections on the filmmaking process.

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1. BBC's "Mint": Cast and Creators in Conversation

Guests: Lindsay Duncan (actress, plays Ollie), Charlotte Regan (writer/director)
Segment Start: [03:49]

About the Series

• Premise: Follows the children of a Glasgow crime family, focusing more on their interpersonal dynamics and relationships than on the crime itself.
• Genre-Bending Approach: Although set in a crime milieu, Mint mixes realism with magical realism, offering cinematic, visually innovative storytelling.

Charlotte Regan on Describing Mint

“It's about the kids of a crime family in Glasgow and it's kind of not very crimey. Couldn't afford the shootouts. So it's mostly, you know, them dating and the kind of intimate moments between the shootouts...”
([05:43] Charlotte Regan)

Visual and Narrative Style

• Emphasis on the protagonist Shannon’s perspective: “Really embedded in her perspective... lots of jazzy bits... really cinematic.” ([06:42] Charlotte Regan)
• Key visual motif: magical realism, exemplified by a flying sequence during a first kiss ([12:07]).

Origin Story

• The show’s conception began years before Regan's previous feature Scrapper, originally as a story centered on Ollie (Duncan’s character).

Character Spotlight: Lindsay Duncan as Ollie

"She's a grandmother, but unlike any grandmother you probably know... women who were not giving up on anything. She's very active... She uses sex as a kind of power play because she's decided, at this point in her life, definitely, that she's living life on her own terms."
([07:53] Lindsay Duncan)

On Working Together

• Lindsay Duncan on being cast and the script: “I just thought this... she’s asking me to do this, and it’s quite out there.” ([09:06])

Memorable Moment: The Flying Kiss

“From the first draft, it said they fly. And Angus, the Scottish producer, was like, ‘fucking hell. This is Angus. It comes. It can't be anything but this. I'm unwilling to compromise.’”
([12:52] Charlotte Regan)

Gender Roles and Representation

• Deliberate decision to flip the crime genre’s gender expectations, with women like Ollie and Shannon at the heart:

“That was very like the big kind of anchor to the show…” ([15:54] Charlotte Regan)

On Directing Style

• Lindsay Duncan describes Charlotte Regan as "so gentle and incredibly polite... the set is happy, it's totally relaxed... with an iron will."
  ([17:39], [18:57])

Notable Quote on Directing:

“It's never controlling. It's always, 'should we? Could we maybe?'”
([18:54] Lindsay Duncan)

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2. Inspirational Films Chosen by the Guests

Charlotte Regan’s Pick: "The Guard" Opening Sequence

([19:48])

• Admired for its immediately clear character work:

“I just remember watching it and thinking, I just know his character and I don't need to know anything else... I can just sit with him in whatever story he wants to be in now...”
([20:23] Charlotte Regan)

• Influenced Mint’s tonal bravery, partly shaped by Regan’s exposure to Korean dramas’ fluid tonal shifts:

“They so bravely changed tone, you know... I think that massively influenced the writing of Mint.”
([21:25] Charlotte Regan)

Lindsay Duncan’s Pick: "The Lacemaker" (1977), starring Isabelle Huppert

([22:15])

• A lesson in powerful, understated screen acting, especially in scenes heavy with listening rather than dialogue:

“You can really judge an actor by that... On camera, you can do something extraordinary... she's almost transparent... she does it with so little.”
([24:33] Lindsay Duncan)

• Deeply affected by Huppert's performance and career path:

“If I could swap, if I could be...be someone else as an actor, that...it would be Isabelle Huppert, because I think she's extraordinary.”
([26:18] Lindsay Duncan)

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3. Catching Up: What’s Next for Duncan & Regan?

• Lindsay Duncan is “waiting for the Scottish parts” ([27:14])
• Charlotte Regan: “Walking my overweight dog, trying to help it lose weight, and doing Pilates” ([27:27]); confirms work on a new film but jokes, “who knows if it’s total shite” ([27:47])

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4. "Surviving Earth": Q&A with Thea Gajić

Guest: Thea Gajić (writer/director)
Segment Start: [29:53]

About the Film

• Story: An autobiographical drama about Gajić’s Serbian father, a refugee navigating post-Yugoslav England and finding hope via friendship and music as he forms a band with friends from rehab.
• Central Motif: Music is both a thematic and atmospheric anchor, developed using real songs performed by Gajić’s father’s actual band members.

Personal Connection

• Gajić discusses growing up with a musical father who “constantly flooded me with sound,” and the importance of reconnecting with her Balkan heritage during the filmmaking process ([33:17]–[36:20]).

On Community Reception

• Positive audience reactions from both Balkan and recovery communities, including a screening in Sarajevo:

“There is usually always someone in recovery in our audiences who stands up and makes a really tender comment about how the film has given them hope...”
([40:49] Thea Gajić)

Music Process

• Songs written for the film based on originals from her father’s band; recorded with surviving members in a haunted house in Bath ([34:22])

Filmmaking as Healing

• The film is a vessel for processing grief and understanding her father:

“I think it's been really great to constantly talk about something and not have to, like, hide in the depths of grief... through writing a version of him and through re exploring and understanding him more beyond his father role, I think it's been really fulfilling.”
([41:54] Thea Gajić)

On Creative Background

• No formal film school; learned through acting and transitioning to directing. Quit acting partly due to exhaustion with the self-tape audition process ([39:18]-[40:08]).

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5. Inspirational Choice: "Moonlight" (dir. Barry Jenkins)

([43:22])

• Chosen by Thea Gajić for its boldness, beauty, and poetic everyday realism:

“For me, it's like the sheer poetry in the everyday... [the film] reinforced that belief I had that film is the authorship of who wrote it and the collaborators behind it... And I also Just love it for the tenderness in the masculinity...”
([47:07] Thea Gajić)

• Highlights the impact of storytelling that isn’t “Oscar-bait” but still achieves enormous success ([46:24]–[46:53]).

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6. On the Future and Life Beyond the Films

• Gajić says she is “trying to find that flow state” again, balancing life and writing her next film ([49:12]-[50:08]).
• Both guests celebrated for their thoughtful, groundbreaking work and offered warm encouragement by Kermode.

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• Charlotte Regan (on her mother’s review habits):
  “My mom sends me all the bad ones on Letterboxd, which I really like to keep me grounded.” ([14:20])
• Lindsay Duncan (on Charlotte Regan’s directing):
  “You don’t make stuff like this without knowing what you want...” ([18:57])
• Thea Gajić (on lessons from her father):
  “He could just sense things...he’d just know that there was like some underground bar...with this amazing band...” ([38:26])

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Key Timestamps

• [03:49] – Discussion begins on Mint
• [06:42] – Visual style and writing of Mint
• [12:07] – The magical flying kiss scene
• [15:54] – Gender roles in the crime genre
• [19:48] – Inspirational film clips: "The Guard" and "The Lacemaker"
• [29:53] – Introduction to Surviving Earth
• [33:17] – Autobiographical roots and music in Surviving Earth
• [40:49] – Audience reactions and feedback
• [43:22] – Inspirational film: "Moonlight"
• [49:12] – The “flow state” and creative process

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Episode Tone & Style

As usual with Kermode’s live shows, the tone is warm, self-deprecating, candid, and lively, with a strong focus on the creative journey rather than industry platitudes. The guests are unguarded, reflective, and often humorous, offering honest appraisals of their processes and careers.

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Summary prepared for listeners seeking an engaging, content-rich recap of the episode’s main discussions, cinematic insights, and memorable moments.

Transcript

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[Lindsay Duncan]

In every job that must be done, there is an element of fun. You find the fun and snap.

[Narrator/Clip Voice]

Did you know that the very first

[Lindsay Duncan]

assembly of photographs in sequential order to

[Thea Gaetch]

create a motion Picture was a 2

[Lindsay Duncan]

second clip of a black man on horse?

[Mark Kermode]

We want the finest wines available to humanity.

[Clip Voice]

We want them here and we want them now.

[Thea Gaetch]

You really don't want me to play, huh? No, I do.

[Charlotte Regan]

Captain Howdy said no.

[Lindsay Duncan]

Captain who?

[Mark Kermode]

Hi, this is Mark Kermode. Thanks for downloading this Kermode on Film podcast. This episode is the first half of the MK3D show, recorded live at the BFI South bank on 27 April 2026. Three people join me in this episode. First off, I'm delighted to talk to actress Lindsey Duncan and writer director Charlotte Regan to talk about their new BBC series, Mint. And I talked to writer director Thea Gaetch about her directorial feature debut, Surviving Earth. So sit back, relax, take a front row seat at MK3D at the BFI Southbank. Enjoy. I think that's the first time we've had two whoops as I've entered. I'm all in favour of this. I think this is something we should cultivate. This is. Is it the 111th or the 112th show? We're all too old to remember. It's been the longest gap between two MK3Ds because the last one that we did was seven weeks ago, which was in the BFI iMax. If any of you came to that. It was a very, very big screen. Can I get a cat call? Yeah, yeah. Don't patronize me. All right. Just so you know, is a kind of bit of an early warning. The next show, because we had the long gap. The next show is in two weeks time. So there's this and then there's literally two weeks, and then after that we're kind of back to something vaguely resembling normality, whatever that may or may not be. We've got a packed show show for you this evening. It's just an absolutely fabulous lineup. So we're going to move straight on because we've got an awful lot of stuff to get through. Incidentally, after we finished here, there is a screening of Rose of Nevada. Here I Think there are still some tickets left. So if anybody at the end of the show feels, oh, you know, want to see Rosa Nevada? Which is a fantastic, wonderful film that opened on Friday, it's playing in here, I think about half an hour after we finish. So let's start with one of the most remarkable pieces of television of the year. You'll all have read about Mint and many of you may have actually watched all of it. All the episodes are available on BBC iPlayer at the moment. And it's eight episodes and I did the thing about sitting down thinking I'll watch one and then four hours later realizing that I'd watched the entire series. It's really remarkable piece of work. It's been getting great reviews and so let's take a look at a very quick clip from it. It's directed by Charlotte Regan, whose work you will know from Scrapper, and has a star studded cast, including the great Lindsey Duncan. Here is a scene from Mint.

[Lindsay Duncan]

Look, you're just stressed when you're emotional. Your cycle gets all messed up. Got one. It's a wee bit historical, but they still work. Thanks.

[Thea Gaetch]

What now?

[Lindsay Duncan]

You just leave it on the bath for a few minutes.

[Mark Kermode]

How long for?

[Lindsay Duncan]

Just long enough for you to tell me all about it. Not today, please. Nan the Dinson Boy.

[Mark Kermode]

Anne, please welcome back to the show Lindsey Duncan and for the first time, writer, director Charlotte Regan. Welcome to the show. Congratulations on the series. As I said, I did the thing about binging the entire thing in one go. For anyone who hasn't seen it. Charlotte, do you want to just give a little thumbnail of what it is? Because it's a number of different genres sort of flying together. How would you describe it?

[Charlotte Regan]

I'm actually terrible at describing it.

[Lindsay Duncan]

Don't look at me.

[Mark Kermode]

I only ask because you wrote and directed it, so that's

[Thea Gaetch]

better.

[Charlotte Regan]

It is about the kids of a crime family in Glasgow and it's kind of not very crimey. Couldn't afford the shootouts. So it's mostly, you know, them dating and the kind of intimate moments between the shootouts and the kind of aftermath of all the big gangster moments.

[Mark Kermode]

So when you say it's not very crimey, I think what you mean by that is that although there is a crime background to the narrative, that's not primarily what it's about. I mean, you don't see jobs being done, there's not police on their trail. It's all to do with the internal dynamics of the characters. And it also has a kind of wonderful mix of down to earth realism and this kind of magical realism. We'll show a clip that illustrates that. But do you want to say a little bit about the visual style of it? Because it's some of the most breathtaking television to watch. It's really, really cinematic. Tell us about that mix of realism and kind of fantasia.

[Charlotte Regan]

It's very much kind of like if the main character, Shannon, retold this story. So it's kind of really embedded in her perspective, so we kind of see what she feels, I suppose. So it's lots of, I would call them, jazzy bits on set. I would be like, now just walk around and look cool, guys, and I'll get some jazzy bits. And the first few days, everyone's like, oh. And then after a few days, you all got really into it. Like showing myself in slow motion. I look so cool.

[Lindsay Duncan]

Yeah.

[Charlotte Regan]

So lots of jazzy bits.

[Mark Kermode]

When did you start writing it?

[Charlotte Regan]

About four years ago.

[Mark Kermode]

So did it predate Scrapper?

[Charlotte Regan]

The original idea predated Scrapper.

[Lindsay Duncan]

Yeah.

[Charlotte Regan]

But it started a very different story about Lindsay's character, Ollie, because I love epic Ollies of the world, you know, epic grams. Epic grams are the best kind of humans and world. So it was very much about Ollie and her life and.

[Lindsay Duncan]

Yeah.

[Mark Kermode]

So years ago, Lindsay. It's a magnificent performance, which you clearly relish the hell out of doing. Describe Ollie for us.

[Lindsay Duncan]

Well, she's a grandmother, but unlike any grandmother you probably know, or maybe you do, in which case, tell me everything. Charlie tells me that she does know people of this age who behave like Ollie. A lot of source material for women who were not giving up on anything. She's very active.

[Mark Kermode]

Yes.

[Lindsay Duncan]

In one aspect of her life, actually. It's not the BBC, is it? I can say whatever you want.

[Mark Kermode]

You can say whatever you want.

[Lindsay Duncan]

She loves. She really loves it. She can't get enough of it.

[Mark Kermode]

And I love the fact you couldn't say that on the BBC.

[Lindsay Duncan]

Well, I'm not even sure, but anyway. And also, she uses sex as a kind of power play because she's decided, at this point in her life, definitely, that she's living life on her own terms. And that's what she does. And so terrifying men is clearly part of the pleasure for her. Sounds great, actually.

[Mark Kermode]

And I presume that you, when you read the script, had you already seen Charlotte?

[Lindsay Duncan]

Oh, yes, I'd seen Scrapper. And so, you know, you get the email thing, details of this, and honestly, I couldn't believe it because I thought she's going to ask me a. To work with him, which I was really excited about having seen Scrapper. And then when I read it, I went, oh, no, really? She asked me to do this, and I still don't know why, because, you know, you rarely ask someone why they want to work with you in case it's not the answer I couldn't get. So. And so. So I still don't know. Don't tell me. But I just thought this. She's asking me to do this, and it's quite out there, you know, and I. It is, yeah. It is, yeah. So that was really, really exciting. And I knew also from the script, because it does describe aspects of the way it's shot where I knew it was going to be visually exciting and there would be. In the key areas, it wouldn't be shot. Literally, this is what happens. And so it's the most wonderful way to convey deep feelings. So reading the script, I knew that would happen, and it was just really, really exciting.

[Mark Kermode]

Since you've set that up rather brilliantly, shall we? If we can show a clip from an episode of Mint. And this is basically what I was talking about, the magical realism thing. This is the first kiss between these two characters and an expression of their love in a very physical way. So let's take a look.

[Narrator/Clip Voice]

You've got a second chance. You could go home, escape it all. It's just irrelevant. It's just medicine. It's just medicine. You could still be what you want to. What you said you were When I met you when you met me When I met you.

[Thea Gaetch]

Sa.

[Mark Kermode]

What did it say in the script? Did it say they fly?

[Charlotte Regan]

It did. It did. From the first draft, it said they fly. And Angus, the Scottish producer, was like, fucking hell. This is Angus. It comes. It can't be anything but this. I'm unwilling to compromise. So, yeah, it always said that they flied for their first kiss.

[Lindsay Duncan]

Yeah.

[Mark Kermode]

Can I ask a really stupid question? Okay. I understand that there'll be strings involved and everything. How it's not superimposed. They are hanging in off of, what, a crane or what? How.

[Lindsay Duncan]

Yeah, Big.

[Charlotte Regan]

Big crane in a park. Yeah, it was a great time. It was the best day of filming, other than all the days that Lady Duncan was on set, obviously.

[Mark Kermode]

And did you shoot that quite near the beginning of the shoot? I read that it was one of the first things that you did.

[Charlotte Regan]

No, I think it was. It was the only rehearsal day, so we did that early on to check how if Ben and Emma were total shy on wires or not. And we would need to quickly rewrite it. But they were both great, thank God. So we rehearsed it early to make sure we could do it. And then it was towards the end because it was Ben who plays Aaron's last day on set.

[Mark Kermode]

I mean, I think it's a wonderful piece of tv. I read somebody compared the visual style to. They said it's like the most beautiful television since Twin Peaks. And at first I thought it was a strange comparison, but that thing about one foot in the ground, you know, one foot somewhere else really sort of seemed to ring true. Do you read reviews of your own work?

[Charlotte Regan]

My mom sends me all the bad ones on letterboxd.

[Mark Kermode]

Wow.

[Charlotte Regan]

Which I really like to keep me grounded, which is really nice. So no, I'll some sometimes, but I try not to at this point. Maybe later I'll go to them. But it's like a weird stage, isn't it, where you've given up ownership of this thing that you've sat with for four or five years. So other than my mom being like. I can't remember her voice. Did I tell you she called me and said the reviews are positive. That surprises me.

[Mark Kermode]

Wow.

[Charlotte Regan]

I get a more via mom. But she loves it, really. She's just keeping me.

[Thea Gaetch]

You know.

[Mark Kermode]

The first time I was ever on radio, it was LBC and I was rubbish. I was totally panicked. And my mum, I knew that she was going to listen to it and I came out afterwards. It was like I'd been in a road accident or something. It was really, really terrible. And I went to a phone box who's before mobile phones. And I rang her and she answered the phone. I said, did you hear it? She went, yeah, I said. And she went. The signal was very clear. In terms of the way in which the series has been received. Everyone is sort of trying to find a way of describing it. I said that thing about its kind of cross generic. It goes across a number of different things. But one thing that it definitely does is turn the kind of the gender stereotype when it's absolutely. The stories are being seen through the women characters, which is not something which is kind of usual for the crime. Was that very deliberate or was it just completely organic?

[Clip Voice]

No.

[Mark Kermode]

Yeah.

[Charlotte Regan]

That was very like the big kind of anchor to the show, you know, is like that you get characters like Aaron who are in the vulnerable position in this and women like Ollie or Shannon. So that was something we kind of always had in mind.

[Mark Kermode]

Did you love playing Ollie?

[Lindsay Duncan]

Yes, I did.

[Mark Kermode]

Because, I mean, you are brilliant. But I did think you're having a Ball.

[Lindsay Duncan]

Yeah. Well, it looks as if she's having a ball.

[Mark Kermode]

So, you know, except for the moments that she isn't, which is.

[Lindsay Duncan]

And then it's quite shocking in a way. And great, because there's just so much more to her than her just, you know, careering around telling people what to do and having sex. Not that you see that you'll be relieved to know, obviously. But yeah, it was great. And I also love being Scottish because I am, but only technically because I was born there of Scottish parents. And I feel Scottish. I don't feel English, but I don't feel I can claim it, you know, because I wasn't brought up there. So. But playing someone with a Scottish accent and shooting in Scotland, it's a very sweet feeling, you know, apart from playing an outrageous character and having that, you know, the freedom. Because I've never done anything like this before. And that's, you know, the actors dream is to be asked to do something you haven't done before. And you think, well, somebody must think that's a good idea. And just the idea of just stretching yourself.

[Mark Kermode]

And what's Charlotte like as a director?

[Lindsay Duncan]

Really difficult. She's so. Well, you know, this is. She's so gentle and incredibly polite as if, you know, asking you to do something is an outrageous demand. And would you mind terribly if maybe, you know. And she calls everyone boss as well. At first when I met her, I went home and I said, charlie's great. She calls me boss. It's really cool. Then I realized she called everyone, undermined my status quite a lot. But she's so.

[Thea Gaetch]

I mean, you are.

[Lindsay Duncan]

You always present things as if it would be really nice of us to comply with an idea and then it's a really good idea. So the set is happy, it's totally relaxed and you'll, you know, you know, obviously, you know, with that ass licking, ridiculously reading the script, that you're with a very crowded creative mind and also someone who has a cinematic vision, so you're really prepared to do whatever she suggests. But it's never controlling. It's always, should we? Could we maybe?

[Mark Kermode]

Is that rare?

[Lindsay Duncan]

It is, yes. Well, it's not rare to work with people who ask you if it would be okay if you'd feel comfortable doing something. But I think that combination of real sweetness and gentleness with what has to be an iron will. You don't make stuff like this without knowing what you want. And I think what is up there on the screen reflects what you wrote and what you intended. And there will be maybe things that we all did that maybe weren't exactly. And that's maybe, hopefully a bonus. But your vision was very, very clear. And I think to be on a set which is that relaxed but aiming high, that's the kind of perfect thing. And you don't get that very often.

[Mark Kermode]

I asked you both to pick an inspirational movie. Charlotte, we'll go with yours first. What did you choose?

[Charlotte Regan]

I chose the opening of the Guard, which I think is like the most perfect character opening ever made.

[Mark Kermode]

Well, since it's. The opening doesn't require a setup. So let's see the opening of the Guard, then we'll talk about it. Okay. I don't think your mummy would be

[Lindsay Duncan]

too pleased about that now.

[Mark Kermode]

What a beautiful fucking day. So tell me, tell me what's so perfect about it.

[Charlotte Regan]

I just remember watching it and thinking, I just know his character and I don't need to know anything else. I can just sit with him in whatever story he wants to be in now because that so perfectly has summed up who he is. And I love, like, dark humor. I've always loved films that are really dark. My mum, who I grew up with, had the darkest humor in the world, so it's probably her influence. Yeah. Where she'd put on a sad movie, she'd be like, that's funny, innit?

[Thea Gaetch]

But what they're going through,

[Charlotte Regan]

terrible sense

[Thea Gaetch]

of humor, but a great one.

[Charlotte Regan]

So, yeah, I just love it. I feel like you can just sit with him throughout anything now. And I feel so perfectly grounded in who he is and what the story is.

[Mark Kermode]

I suppose it's also. Isn't. It's the fact that it's. It sets all that up with almost no words at all. It's all to do with what you see. And it's really, really compact, as you said. That's it. At the end of that beginning, you know where you are. Do you ever find yourself, look, taking lessons from things that you've seen and loved? I mean, do you think, oh, I've learned that from watching that movie?

[Charlotte Regan]

Yeah, Yeah, I think all the time. Like, when I was writing Mint, I was living with my best friend who loved K dramas, like Korean dramas, so. And they so bravely changed tone, you know, just constantly, you're like, oh, it's a trauma now. Now it's a comedy, now it's a musical. And you're like, you just have to. As an audience, you just have to accept it, you know? And I think that massively influenced the writing of Mint. You know, I was like, Fuck it. Audiences will just have to live with some sparkles coming up as things go on. So I think whatever I'm, yeah, watching at the time, or have watched in the past, influences Lindsay.

[Mark Kermode]

I asked you to choose something as well. And what's interesting is that the clip that. That you've chosen, there is a lot of words in it, but what we're interested in isn't the words tell us the film and the clip that we're about to watch.

[Lindsay Duncan]

So this is a film from 1977, and the first time I saw Isabelle Huppert. She's very, very young in it. And it really affected me on many levels. But if we're talking about things that maybe influenced you to some extent, I think as a young actor, certainly my generation, you thought you judged a part by how many lines you'd got. And then later on you learn that there's something incredibly compelling about watching people listen and watch. And you can really judge an actor by that. And in the theatre, you know, you can be doing that. You can support the play very, very well. But, you know, people might not look at you, but you should be paying attention and listening truthfully. But on camera, you can do something extraordinary. I mean, you just. You see. You know, you just see inside someone. And Isabel Huppert in this. Well, throughout the film, the Lacemaker, she's almost transparent. It's quite extraordinary that someone so young can have the responsibility in the film to the extent that she does. And it's very moving without ever being sentimental at all. And this particular scene, she's with people who are very different from her. They're students, they're sort of pseudo intellectuals. They're talking about Marxism. Exactly. And there is this person who, in every cell of her body, is an honest human being. Quiet, shy, unassuming, in love. And you see all of it on her face. And it's the most extraordinary experience to see someone give a performance like that with so little. It's brilliant. Great.

[Mark Kermode]

Let's take a look. So you say that seeing that profoundly affected you.

[Lindsay Duncan]

Well, the whole film affected me because her story is so powerful and she is almost like an absence for a lot of the time. But because she's so brilliant, you're drawn to what happens to her. And she's completely out of her depth. But it's that thing of holding something together with so little. I mean, often she hardly speaks above a whisper. She's so contained, she's so shy. She's in love with someone who. Who comes from this gang. And you know, imagine it's just so. It's so painful to see what she's going through. And then there's moments when she. She's with him and her whole face lights up, but most of it she does without words. And to the very end when she. It's just her face, really. And I just think for someone so. So young to achieve that is remarkable. And, well, we know what happened to her anyway, she's pretty successful, but it was.

[Mark Kermode]

The really remarkable thing is it's only a couple of years later that she's in Heaven's Gate. I mean, it's like, you know, and she. It's. I mean, I was. When I first saw the clip, I was really. Wow, she looks like she's about 15 years old.

[Lindsay Duncan]

Yeah, she looks so young and she's not straining at all to be anything, to do. Do anything. And, you know, most of us learn to strip away, but she just had that. And it was. It moved me as a film, but I was. I was blown away by seeing her work. I just thought she was amazing. And I've continued to feel like that ever since. And I've always felt that if I could swap, if I could be. Have someone else's career, be someone else as an actor, that. That it would be Isabelle Luper, because I think she's extraordinary.

[Mark Kermode]

What are you doing now?

[Lindsay Duncan]

I'm going for a drink.

[Mark Kermode]

No, I didn't mean. It's going to be one of those shows, isn't it? What are you working on at the moment?

[Lindsay Duncan]

Nothing. Nothing.

[Mark Kermode]

Okay. Really?

[Lindsay Duncan]

Really?

[Mark Kermode]

You're like the hardest person. Working person, show business.

[Lindsay Duncan]

Well, don't exaggerate, but that's nice of you to say. So I'm waiting for the Scottish parts.

[Mark Kermode]

Okay.

[Clip Voice]

Come my way.

[Mark Kermode]

Okay.

[Lindsay Duncan]

Okay. Yeah.

[Mark Kermode]

Charlotte,

[Charlotte Regan]

walk in my overweight dog trying to help it loosen weight and doing Pilates. Pilates. Lindsay Duncan's encouraged Pilates. Trying the Pilates.

[Lindsay Duncan]

Two cast members doing it now.

[Charlotte Regan]

Yeah, nothing. Nothing other than those things, you know.

[Mark Kermode]

But you have another film in the works or.

[Charlotte Regan]

Yeah, yeah, we're in a film at the minute, but who knows if it's total shite. Yeah.

[Mark Kermode]

Or not.

[Charlotte Regan]

It's hard to know, isn't it?

[Mark Kermode]

Yeah, I think it's not going to be total shite.

[Charlotte Regan]

My mum says otherwise.

[Mark Kermode]

Okay. All right. Well, give my love to your mom. Meanwhile, from the rest of us, congratulations to both of you. The show is fantastic. The whole show is on iplayer. Honestly, if you sit down and start, you'll. That'll be the next four hours of your life because you won't want to stop. Thank you so much for coming on the show and I wish you all the best with whatever it is that you do next.

[Lindsay Duncan]

Thank you.

[Mark Kermode]

Thank you. Par le tu francais, hablas espanol? Parl italiano?

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[Mark Kermode]

Okay, here's a trailer for a film which opened in UK cinemas on Friday. So currently playing. And it's a really, really exciting, interesting film. Take a look at this.

[Character in Surviving Earth Clip]

Always stick to these three things in life. Something to do, someone to love, and something to look forward to. Hey, Mikey.

[Mark Kermode]

Hey, aren't you all right?

[Character in Surviving Earth Clip]

This is Maria, my daughter. I don't think you've met.

[Thea Gaetch]

Are you darling?

[Lindsay Duncan]

Nice to meet you.

[Mark Kermode]

Nice to meet you.

[Character in Surviving Earth Clip]

I've got something for you.

[Lindsay Duncan]

I can't play.

[Character in Surviving Earth Clip]

Oh, Maria. How many times have I told you? If you can breathe, you can.

[Lindsay Duncan]

You can play the harmonica.

[Character in Surviving Earth Clip]

Yeah. We have a 9 to 5 Mishko. We need our own night. We find a venue, we promote it ourselves, we sell tickets. Think big.

[Thea Gaetch]

Bad.

[Character in Surviving Earth Clip]

Relax, darling. It's just a drink. About 200 people. Seoul, 100 people.

[Mark Kermode]

It's called the Balkan Express. Thank bag.

[Lindsay Duncan]

One of us needs be an adult bladder.

[Thea Gaetch]

I'm not giving a bird.

[Mark Kermode]

Stop it, Mar.

[Character in Surviving Earth Clip]

Stop being a child,

[Charlotte Regan]

idiot.

[Lindsay Duncan]

You promised you wouldn't do this again.

[Thea Gaetch]

Do you know how scary it is to see you like that? To not know what you're about to do next?

[Lindsay Duncan]

Maria, I know how these environments can be a trigger for you.

[Character in Surviving Earth Clip]

I miss to you.

[Lindsay Duncan]

She needs time.

[Character in Surviving Earth Clip]

This is overreacting.

[Lindsay Duncan]

Oh, we promise we'd do better.

[Character in Surviving Earth Clip]

I'M the only one who needs to do better. This is real. I'm so proud of you.

[Lindsay Duncan]

I want you to do well. You know, believe in yourself.

[Character in Surviving Earth Clip]

Something to do, someone to love, and something to look forward to.

[Mark Kermode]

It's a fantastic feature debut from my next guest, please welcome Thea Gaetch. Thea, welcome to the show. Congratulations on the film. You and I met about a year ago at a film festival in Croatia in which you were talking about the film and, you know, looking for distribution for it. It's now being distributed by the bfi.

[Thea Gaetch]

No, by Metis Films.

[Mark Kermode]

That's exactly what I meant. And I don't know why I said the other thing. And terrific reviews. Congratulations.

[Thea Gaetch]

Thank you.

[Mark Kermode]

It's very autobiographical.

[Thea Gaetch]

Yes. Yeah.

[Mark Kermode]

Tell me about the sort of story behind the film.

[Thea Gaetch]

Yeah, it's about my dad and a portion of his life which I. I guess focused around the time where he was crafting this band with his friends from rehab. And it's about, I guess, how he tried to navigate his world in England after fleeing the Yugoslavian wars and finding hope and joy through music and through community.

[Mark Kermode]

The music is a really, really big part of the film. And you and I started talking about it because either I had a harmonica or one of us had a harmonica there.

[Thea Gaetch]

No, I have.

[Mark Kermode]

Oh, that's what it was, is you have a harmonica tattoo. Yes, that's exactly. I don't think I've ever seen a harmonica tattoo.

[Thea Gaetch]

Well, I got it after our world premiere in south by Southwest, which was, like, kind of rogue because we just Googled the tattoo shop. And as I was sitting in the chair, I realized, hmm, like, is this a great idea?

[Mark Kermode]

It is a great idea, but it worked out.

[Thea Gaetch]

It worked out like the tattoo shop itself was that really, like, cool and trendy so that, like, it looked fine, but it was like the tattoo artist himself, you know, I mean, I don't know anything about that guy, but it worked out.

[Mark Kermode]

It's a very cool tattoo.

[Thea Gaetch]

Thank you.

[Mark Kermode]

And so was that. Was that music around you a lot? Because you can. You seem to be kind of completely marinated. And one of the lovely things about the film is it's got. Deals with some very dark subject matter, but the music really lifts it to another level. I was Charlotte about, you know, the kind of the flying sequences in this. The music is the. Is the thing that lifts it into another realm, isn't it?

[Thea Gaetch]

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, definitely. It was. We based the original songs in the film off the original songs that My bad and that my dad and his band played which was that really beautiful opportunity to be able to do. We kind of deconstructed his original songs and recreated them with some of the existing members of his band in, like, this haunted house in Bath. Yeah. I only stayed there one night because after the first night, I got the vibes and I was like, oh, so

[Mark Kermode]

you mean you think it actually was.

[Thea Gaetch]

No, it was. It was. It was, yeah, for sure. But the band didn't care.

[Mark Kermode]

Okay, yeah. Give me. Give me a hint of the haunted vibes.

[Thea Gaetch]

It was just. It's just like, energetically. It was just really. And I was staying in, like, the newer wing of this house, and even that was messed up. And our producers, our producer's mum was there and she's obviously older than everyone else and Balkan. So in the morning I went to her and I was like, mom, like, this house is haunted. Right? And she looked at me and she

[Mark Kermode]

just went, so are you. Are you naturally quite fey? I mean, fae, as in. In touch with, you know, the sort of spiritual side of things?

[Thea Gaetch]

Should I say yes and just claim it?

[Mark Kermode]

You can do. Yeah. I mean, my. My mom was. My mom was from the Isle of Man, and my mom, who was a doctor and a gp and very, very scientific, but if you walk down an avenue of trees and she got a funny feeling about it, she wasn't going anywhere.

[Thea Gaetch]

Yeah, I guess I do get stuff like that, but I'm not, like. I can't, like, do crystal ball stuff.

[Mark Kermode]

No, no, but that's all. Crystal ball stuff is all night. I don't mean, are you a wizard? I mean, I mean, like. Like, because there's some. There is something in the. Being attuned to music, being attuned to vibration. There is something going on there, isn't it?

[Thea Gaetch]

Yeah, no, I think. I think so.

[Mark Kermode]

And. And just explain for everyone your background in terms of your heritage is.

[Thea Gaetch]

My dad was Serbian and my mom's from Liverpool.

[Mark Kermode]

And you grew up in London, so you've got a mix of everything.

[Thea Gaetch]

Yeah, a bit of everything. I think it's also the beautiful thing about doing the film actually was kind of reconnecting with the Balkan community a bit, because, I guess it's hard when, you know, you lose a parent from one or the other side of your heritage, how do you stay connected to that strand? Yeah, so it was nice. And there's a big Serbian community in West London, but I'm from South London, so. So it was nice to delve back into that with these cast members and through retelling this story.

[Mark Kermode]

And how has the film played with those different communities.

[Thea Gaetch]

Yeah, really well. We had an open air screening in Sarajevo at the film festival, which I was really nervous about and it was a massive audience, but it all seemed to go down well.

[Mark Kermode]

You were nervous because what?

[Thea Gaetch]

Because I guess showing it to the region and you're represented. I didn't grow up there and I don't live there. And so I'm representing my own truth and my experience of it, having lived here and being a child of a refugee. But I didn't live there myself. So I guess there's an element of like hoping that you've represented their reality as well as possible.

[Mark Kermode]

Are you bilingual?

[Thea Gaetch]

No, I'm not fluent. I can understand some stuff, but not fluent.

[Mark Kermode]

Would you ever think about wanting to. I always said that thing about two languages in one brain is the most amazing thing. I know anybody can do it at all.

[Thea Gaetch]

Yeah, it's. It's incredible. I did take. I did start to do lessons before shooting the film, actually. Well, early, early prep days, but I just didn't continue them. I can't remember why. I think I had. I have a six year old, so at the time I had a younger child. So I think it was. I was just juggling a bit too much and.

[Mark Kermode]

Do you play music?

[Thea Gaetch]

No, not personally.

[Mark Kermode]

That's surprising because the film has a real musical sensibility to it. I kind of assumed that maybe you did that maybe you maybe played the chromatic or something.

[Thea Gaetch]

No. Well, I think he just like. People describe my dad as like having a nose for music. Like he could just sense things that you could walk down a street and there'd be like an alleyway and he'd just know that there was like some underground bar going on down there with this amazing band that are yet to be discovered. And I think he just constantly flooded me with sound and was always like putting videos in my face and making me watch 12 minutes of something that, you know, I lost interest in after the second minute, obviously, but he was

[Lindsay Duncan]

like one of those.

[Thea Gaetch]

One of those people that. That in the moment you're like, alright, alright, I get it. And then, you know, five years later you're like, oh yeah, I do get it. And thank you for.

[Mark Kermode]

So was that your film education? Literally having stuff shoved in front of you for 12 minutes and watch this.

[Thea Gaetch]

Yeah, I didn't. I mean, I didn't go to film school, so I. A lot of what I've learned has been through acting. I trained as an actor for a while. That was like my main passion. And so I think Everything else kind of came through that angle until I started to make short films. And then I kind of free myself into the craft of direct.

[Mark Kermode]

And once you did that, once you became a director, did the acting just completely, it was like, no, I'm a director. That's. That's what I want to do.

[Thea Gaetch]

Yeah. I mean, I acted in some of my shorts at first. First and then. Yeah, I think I kind of just got fatigued by self taping and the

[Mark Kermode]

whole rigmarole of self taping is the thing you have to do to audition for a part. Now you tape yourself doing it.

[Thea Gaetch]

Yeah, yeah.

[Mark Kermode]

Which sounds soul destroying.

[Thea Gaetch]

Yeah, it is, it is. And then especially again, having a child and like, I was a single parent and trying to find time to set up lighting and your iPhone and the tripod and everything. And I was just like, every time a side would come in, I'd be like, no one's got a gun to my head. Why am I rolling my eyes at these auditions? Do you know what I mean? So I just kind of. Yeah, I just parked it. And at the same time that we were in development for the feature and

[Mark Kermode]

how have you felt about the reaction to the film? Because the reviews have been really, really positive. We saw some of them on the. On the trailer there. And as I said, when we first met a year or so ago, you weren't, you know, you didn't know that it was going to be that well received. How have you felt about how well received it. It's been.

[Thea Gaetch]

It's been incredible, really. I think we are touching the people and the communities that we hope to. There is usually always someone in recovery in our audiences who stands up and makes a really tender comment about how the film has given them hope or given them a deeper level of understanding.

[Mark Kermode]

Because you've been doing Q&As and going out and talking about the. The film with screenings.

[Thea Gaetch]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I think, yeah, it's been. It's been really moving actually, to know that despite some of the tragedy in the film and the darker themes, people are still gaining the silver lining from it and understanding that the bigger picture is about humanity and how we can show up for each other and be kinder to ourselves and that therefore make better use of the time that we have here.

[Mark Kermode]

And what about from your own point of view? Because obviously the film is sort of dedicated to a memory which is keeping somebody very, very present, and music does exactly that. I mean, did you find the process of making the film healing?

[Thea Gaetch]

Yeah, absolutely. I think I don't know my journey of grief without it, I guess. So I'm actually interested to see when it's all out in the world, what I'll be left with. I don't anticipate anything crazy, but I'm just intrigued by it. I think it's been really great to constantly talk about something and not have to, like, hide in the depths of grief and yeah. Be able to constantly have back and forth and in doing so, learn more about my dad than I did before. And obviously he can't answer some of the many questions that I may have had. But I think through writing a version of him and through re exploring and understanding him more beyond his father role, I think it's been really fulfilling.

[Mark Kermode]

I think you've done a really terrific job and it was a huge relief as well because obviously we'd spoken and you told me about the film. There's always that terrifying thing if somebody tells you about a film and you want you would watch it. You think, please let this be good and. But I was really. I just thought it was such a confident bit of filmmaking. I mean, it's absolutely, you know, it's. It's got a real sensibility and I love the way the music is used. I asked you to choose an inspirational film and you chose Moonlight. Yeah. Do you want to tell us anything about the scene we're going to watch from moonlight, which I think is actually quite an iconic scene now. But what is the scene?

[Thea Gaetch]

It is just after Juana and Little have come out of the waves and they are having a conversation on a bench about, I guess the title of the film.

[Babbel Ad]

Yeah.

[Mark Kermode]

Okay.

[Clip Voice]

Let me tell you something, man. Black people everywhere. Remember that, okay? No place you can go in the world. World ain't got no black people. We was the first on this planet.

[Mark Kermode]

Parle tu francais.

[Charlotte Regan]

Hablas espanol?

[Mark Kermode]

Par.

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[Clip Voice]

I've been here a long time and I'm from Cuba. A lot of black folks in Cuba. You wouldn't know that from being here, though. I go wild. Little shorty man just like you running around with no shoes on. The moon was out. This one time I run by this old. This old lady. I was running, hollering, cutting a fool boy, this old lady, she stopped me, she said, running around, catching up all that light in moonlight. Black boys look blue. You blue. That's why I gonna call you Blue.

[Thea Gaetch]

Say your name Blue.

[Mark Kermode]

Nah,

[Clip Voice]

At some point, you gotta decide for yourself who you gonna be. Can't let nobody make that decision. For.

[Mark Kermode]

The most remarkable thing about that is I remember seeing moonlight for the first time and thinking, this is great. I love this film. It's going to be an art house thing. The fact that it then went on to become the huge sort of sensation that it was, Honestly, I would be stunned if anybody accurately predicted that the first time they saw it. But the thing that I really love about that is it is a demonstration that a film that you do not look at and think Oscar bait actually then goes on to be that kind of success. Can you remember when you first saw it?

[Thea Gaetch]

Yeah, I was. I was in LA for the first time after I had this Sundance ignite fellowship with Charlotte. Actually, that's where we met.

[Mark Kermode]

That's why he was in the green room. He's.

[Lindsay Duncan]

Oh.

[Thea Gaetch]

And after Sundance, I went to stay with some friends in LA and I took myself to watch moonlight by myself. And I was just. Yeah, I was just stunned by just the. I think for me, it's like the sheer poetry in the everyday that he was able to. To exhibit. And exactly what he said, for that to go on and be what it is now, I think it just did a massive thing in my brain that was like, you get told, oh, make your stage directions this short and make sure that you're, you know, blah, blah, blah, blah, whatever. And then I read the script and the poetry is there. It's like on the page. It's written in the stage directions, it's written in the actions, it's written in the dialogue. And I think it just kind of reinforced that belief I had that film is the authorship of who wrote it and the collaborators behind it. And I think it just does a great job at showcasing that. And I also Just love it for the tenderness in the masculinity, I think is like so beautiful and beautifully portrayed by the whole cast. And the other thing that I remember when I watched it for the first time, when Juan disappears in the second half and you, like, you were so attached to this man and then without any explanation, he's just gone. And I remember scene after scene, like, where is he? Where is he? And I think that was also such a strong choice. And, you know, there's no spoon feed in there. You're trying to piece together what happened to him through Tiny. I think he's mentioned twice, if you listen carefully. And yeah, I just think it was. It was just brilliant.

[Mark Kermode]

Do you know what you're doing next?

[Thea Gaetch]

I'm trying to figure it out.

[Mark Kermode]

Star Wars?

[Thea Gaetch]

No, I'm trying to get a Star Wars.

[Mark Kermode]

That's what happens.

[Thea Gaetch]

I'm trying to figure it out. I. Yeah, we spoke earlier. I'm just trying to find that flow state that I mentioned.

[Mark Kermode]

I love that phrase. Explain what you meant by that.

[Thea Gaetch]

Okay, well, I was reading a parenting book called All Joy and no Fun, which I'm sure every parent will relate to. And in the book it was talking about children. Always. The reason why adults find it difficult sometimes when parenting is because children are constantly breaking your flow state. So you get into something if. Even if it's play with them, and then they decide, no, I don't want you to hold your car in that way. I want it to be upside down or whatever it is. And then you're like, oh, I don't want to do this anymore because it's broken up your state. Right. And I think after I read that, I was like, oh, this is literally can be related to anything. And so I think, yeah, it's that my flow state with writing the next film keeps getting broken by. Obviously the work I want to do with this and just life and other things. And I think I'm looking forward to

[Mark Kermode]

locking in in the meantime. This is currently Ant Cinemas being brilliantly distributed by Metis. Thank you.

[Thea Gaetch]

Thank you.

[Mark Kermode]

And do go and see it. I mean, it's really. I think it's lovely to see it on a big screen because it's really cinematic.

[Thea Gaetch]

It's playing here.

[Mark Kermode]

It's playing here. And honestly, congratulations, it's an excellent piece of work and I really, really hope that it leads on to you being able to do whatever it is you want to do next when the flow state takes you to the right place. Anyway, the film is in cinemas now. Do go and see it. It's Terrific. Thank you so much. That's it for the this week's edition of Kermode on Film. The MK3D shows happen live every month at the BFI South bank in London. Tickets are available on the BFI website. Next week I'll be back here with the second half of that show talking about my film of the year, Rose of Nevada with director Mark Jenkin and the brilliant George Mackay and Callum Turner. For more conversations about film from me and Simon Mayo, head over to Kermo de Mayo's take wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks for listening. Keep watching the Skies par le tu francais hablas espanol Parl Italiano.

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[Simon Mayo]

Hello, this is Simon Mayo.

[Mark Kermode]

And this is Mark kermode.

[Simon Mayo]

He's the UK's best and most trusted film critic.

[Mark Kermode]

He's a best selling writer, broadcaster and and national treasure.

[Simon Mayo]

Far too kind. Kermode and Mayo's Take has all the reviews you need and star guests such as Sir Ian McKellen.

[Character in Surviving Earth Clip]

Nice to be with you.

[Simon Mayo]

Emma Stone that sounds like something I

[Lindsay Duncan]

would love to be a part of.

[Mark Kermode]

Ewan McGregor I'm very good. How are you doing?

[Simon Mayo]

Kate Planchette what was that word you used?

[Lindsay Duncan]

Cattywampus.

[Simon Mayo]

Kerma de Mayo's take. All the film you need available wherever you get your podcasts.