A Mental Health Heart-to-Heart ft. Whitney Simmons

Summary

Podcast Title: Khloé in Wonder Land
Episode: A Mental Health Heart-to-Heart ft. Whitney Simmons
Release Date: June 19, 2025
Host: Khloé Kardashian
Guest: Whitney Simmons

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Introduction

In this heartfelt episode of Khloé in Wonder Land, Khloé Kardashian sits down with fitness guru and mental health advocate Whitney Simmons. The conversation delves deep into Whitney's personal journey with mental health, the role of fitness in her life, and the broader implications of body image and social media on women's self-esteem.

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Whitney's Mental Health Journey

Whitney opens up about her long-standing struggle with mental illness, emphasizing the isolation and devastation that negative self-talk breeds among women.

• Whitney (00:26): "I unfortunately was struggling with mental illness for many years. You feel so alone... I started becoming more of an advocate for mental health, is by being someone who's been through it."

She recounts a pivotal moment when overwhelming online criticism led her to a breaking point, highlighting the urgent need for supportive communities and open conversations about mental health.

• Whitney (01:03): "I just got done reading these 130 plus comments about everything they hate about me and my body. My brain said, let's just end it all."

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Fitness as a Tool for Mental Health

Whitney shares how discovering the gym in her early twenties was a turning point not just for her physical health but also for her mental well-being. Despite initial resistance, encouraged by her father, fitness became a sanctuary for her during a turbulent period.

• Whitney (02:23): "I found the gym when I was in my early 20s and a little bit confused on where I was going in life... he dragged me to the gym and said, let's try something new."

However, Whitney also acknowledges the potential pitfalls of fitness when driven by negative motivations, recounting how the gym became a traumatic space during her deepest struggles.

• Whitney (04:07): "Especially for me, when I was really struggling with my mental health over the last couple of years, the gym became a very traumatic place for me."

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Body Image and Self-Love

A significant portion of the discussion centers on body image, self-love, and the destructive nature of self-criticism. Whitney advocates for using fitness as a means to foster self-love rather than chase unrealistic standards.

• Whitney (07:36): "We need to be training out of self love, not hatred. So when it comes to those body checks, stop it."

Khloé relates her own journey, expressing how her approach to fitness shifted from an obsession with weight to focusing on muscle definition and overall mental well-being.

• Khloé (06:18): "It sounds to me like now, instead of training out of a place of wanting to be smaller or wanting to change everything about you physically, you are training from a place of self-love."

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Impact of Social Media on Mental Health

The conversation touches on the detrimental effects of social media, particularly platforms like TikTok and Instagram, where negative comments can severely impact mental health. Whitney expresses concern over the prevalence of "skinny talk" and the unrealistic body standards perpetuated online.

• Whitney (08:35): "TikTok on the health side is very scary to me. They call it skinny talk."

Khloé adds her perspective on the shifting focus from purely being skinny to a more holistic approach to health in younger generations, though she remains wary of the persistent negativity on certain platforms.

• Khloé (08:03): "I do appreciate that from when I was younger... now I see that shift, and I wonder if you see that shift as well."

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Strategies for Coping and Self-Care

Both Khloé and Whitney share personal strategies for maintaining mental health amidst the pressures of public life and social media. These include setting boundaries with technology, engaging in physical activities, and fostering positive self-talk.

• Whitney (43:38): "Put my phone down. Take time away and be okay with that."
• Khloé (44:48): "I lean on my faith a lot... I start my day from a day of gratitude because I feel like that sets the tone."

Whitney emphasizes the importance of self-love and gradual mindset shifts to combat negative self-perception.

• Whitney (16:06): "Start by challenging yourself to change your mindset. What are things you love about yourself rather than things you hate."

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Advocacy and the Alive App

Whitney introduces her app, Alive, which embodies her mission to support women's mental and physical health. The app serves as a companion in the gym, providing guidance that prioritizes self-love and holistic well-being over mere physical transformation.

• Whitney (11:07): "Alive is exactly what I want women to feel when they go into that gym... it makes women feel their best physically and mentally."

Khloé praises Whitney for her initiative, highlighting the app's role in promoting sustainable and healthy habits.

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Messages of Hope and Encouragement

Towards the end of the episode, both hosts share uplifting messages aimed at those struggling with mental health issues. Whitney reiterates that no one is alone in their struggles and encourages seeking help as a sign of strength.

• Whitney (62:53): "You are not alone. There are so many women and men who are struggling and it's okay to not feel okay."

Khloé echoes this sentiment, emphasizing the importance of a supportive community and self-compassion.

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Conclusion

This episode of Khloé in Wonder Land offers a profound exploration of mental health intertwined with physical fitness. Whitney Simmons' candid revelations and actionable advice provide listeners with both empathy and tools to foster self-love and resilience. The discussion underscores the critical need for supportive environments and the transformative power of embracing one's true self.

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Notable Quotes:

• Whitney (00:26): "We need to be training out of self love, not hatred."
• Whitney (04:07): "Fitness should be a tool to better your physical, emotional, mental health."
• Khloé (06:18): "I am sort of obsessed with like, muscle cuts, like definition."
• Whitney (16:06): "Start by challenging yourself to change your mindset."
• Whitney (62:53): "You are not alone. There are so many women and men who are struggling and it's okay to not feel okay."

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This comprehensive summary captures the essence of the episode, highlighting pivotal moments and insightful discussions that shed light on the intricate relationship between mental health and physical fitness.

Transcript

[Chloe]

I was reaching fire Love.

[Whitney]

Like your stars.

[Chloe]

No, sit. Get comfortable.

[Whitney]

What are we talking about today?

[Chloe]

Anything? No. We'll talk about who you are, how you got here, and really, like, dive in. I think for, like, the mental health stuff. If you're comfortable with that love.

[Whitney]

It's my favorite thing to talk about. We need to be training out of self love, not hatred. I'm so tired of women hating their bodies. It is so devastating when I hear them speak negatively about their physique. Let's start speaking kinder to ourselves. I unfortunately, was struggling with mental illness for many years. You feel so alone. And I said, maybe this is something that I need to speak out about because I'm not seeing a lot of people talk about this. So that's how I started becoming more of an advocate for mental health, is by being someone who's been through it.

[Chloe]

Right.

[Whitney]

I just got done reading these 130 plus comments about everything they hate about me and my body. My brain said, let's just end it all. Let's be done. And in that moment, I needed help, and I need women to understand that there's no shame in asking for help. Thank you.

[Chloe]

Take your chance. Discover chance. Who splanted the new fragrance? Chanel? As long as I want it so I'll be more comfortable.

[Whitney]

I won't play among the stars. A little more. A little more.

[Chloe]

Whitney, I'm so happy to have you on Chloe in Wonderland. You are the founder of Alive. And today I wanted to talk about fitness because you are the queen of fitness, but also to talk about your mental health journey because I think it could be so helpful to so many people.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

And if you wanted to start and sort of explain what you do, how you got to where you are, and give people a little backstory.

[Whitney]

I found the gym when I was in my early 20s and a little bit confused on where I was going in life. I feel like your early mid-20s, you're like, what am I doing?

[Chloe]

Right?

[Whitney]

And when I found the gym, I had just been in this funk, and my dad dragged my ass to the gym. And he said, you got to try something else.

[Chloe]

Because your dad was a workout.

[Whitney]

He's always been a workout lover. Like, up at 5am I can hear him through the vents of our house, like, grunting. I can hear his music. Like, my wake up call was his workout.

[Chloe]

Okay. And so he said, your dad's probably me.

[Whitney]

Honestly, because you're a five amer, huh?

[Chloe]

I am, yeah. Yeah.

[Whitney]

It's very amazing.

[Chloe]

It's nuts.

[Whitney]

And still to this day, my dad is 60 years old and working out at 5am it's amazing. And my wake up call was my dad. So he's always been into fitness, always been into working out. I kind of dabbled in it here and there, but I was just in that place where I moved home because I was not doing well. I was going to transfer schools, I was going to move back to the Midwest. I was done. And he dragged me to the gym and said, let's try something new. Let's do something to focus on not only your physical, but more importantly your mental health. And so that summer that I moved home is when I was introduced and fell in love with weight training. And from there just kept going.

[Chloe]

I heard you say that working out was a passion of yours, but it also sort of killed you in a way.

[Whitney]

Oh, yes.

[Chloe]

What do you mean by that?

[Whitney]

I think fitness can be used as a tool to support your mental, physical, emotional health. But if it's not done correctly, I think it can harm that.

[Chloe]

In what ways?

[Whitney]

So you're training, you are chasing these dreams. Right. You're chasing a physique, you are comparing yourself to other women you see online. You want to be anybody but yourself.

[Chloe]

Right.

[Whitney]

Especially for me, when I was really struggling with my mental health over the last couple of years, the gym became a very traumatic place for me.

[Chloe]

Wow.

[Whitney]

I found out about the passing of a very close friend when I was in the gym. And it took me almost a year before I was able to step back into that gym.

[Chloe]

Right.

[Whitney]

So you kind of have to focus on finding that sweet spot when it comes to training because fitness should be a tool to better your physical, emotional, mental health. But I see a lot of women, including myself, I fell for the exact same trap where it takes you right into the opposite direction and it starts negatively impacting you.

[Chloe]

For me, the gym, like I felt like I was so nuts when I was younger. I played sports as a kid, but I think more because my parents encouraged me to cause I was on the chubbier side. But I loved sports. I was still really active. I just was on the chubbier side. But I never went to a gym. And then I would say during my divorce, so like later 20s, I started going to the gym and really falling in love with what it did for my mental and not really realizing, oh, like I never thought I could ever be thinner just cause I was big my whole life. And everyone told me, oh, you're big boned or whatever they tell you to convince you that this is the way you are. But then I did start becoming obsessed with like, wow, I'm changing things or doing this or that. But now, like, I don't weigh myself maybe like once or twice a year, but not like, not to, because I don't care about what the scale says. I care about how I look and. But now I am sort of obsessed with like, muscle cuts, like definition. I'm like, wow, I didn't know I could ever have good arms. So like now I'm like, this is crazy. But I will say how much it does for my mental. I feel like I'm in such a better place when I get that energy out of me.

[Whitney]

And it sounds to me like now, instead of training out of a place of wanting to be smaller or wanting to change everything about you physically, you are training from a place of self. Love.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Whitney]

Which is so important. And I always think about when you look at other women in your life who you love, your mom, your sisters. I think of my little sister, E. Claire. She is gorgeous, charismatic. She is kind. She is the funniest girl in the room. She is so resilient. I never, when I think about how much I love her, I'm never thinking about her physique.

[Chloe]

I know her body isn't that interesting.

[Whitney]

You're never doing that to.

[Chloe]

No.

[Whitney]

Any women you love?

[Chloe]

No. Any, like, I think about when you're, you know, passed away, when people describe you, they never are like, well, she had a six pack. No one says that they talk about your heart and your soul or the way that you made them feel.

[Whitney]

Yes. So imagine if we switched that mindset and we reflected back on us because why are we as women treating ourselves with so much hatred, using fitness as a tool to get smaller rather than as a tool to become better physically and emotionally.

[Chloe]

I will say that I. It could just be my algorithm. But I do appreciate that from when I was younger, not even a kid in like my later 20s, what I would hear is always the comparisons. It was like, you know, the heroin chic, all the diet pills. You could go into any pharmacy, like a Rite Aid or one of those and walk in and buy any diet supplement. It was such the norm.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

And it was the norm for me. And it wasn't weird if you were taking all these different over the counter things. Appreciate now that especially younger people, from what I see, it's not so much about skinny. I think it's more about health, like the water consumption, the things that. I don't even know if I drank water when I was in my 20s, like things that nobody paid attention to. So I do see that shift, and I wonder if you see that shift as well.

[Whitney]

I am like 50, 50 on it. I'm a little worried with what I'm seeing right now, especially on TikTok.

[Chloe]

I'm not a big tiktoker.

[Whitney]

Yeah. TikTok on the health side is very scary to me. They call it skinny talk.

[Chloe]

I don't know about skinny talk.

[Whitney]

It's. It's worrying me for the women who are stepping into the health and wellness space, I think that's when a lot of women start to realize, like, okay, I need to change some habits or live a little bit healthier, because that's my goal. Right. I want women to create sustainable, long lasting, healthy habits that take you all through life. And I think a lot of those habits are built in your 20s.

[Chloe]

Yeah.

[Whitney]

And when I get on TikTok and I see women saying, I reached my goal weight, but I'm still not happy. I'm £150 now. I need to be 100.

[Chloe]

That's scary.

[Whitney]

It's scary and it's very worrisome. And I think it goes against everything that I'm trying to introduce in the wellness space.

[Chloe]

I think what people need to know about you is, yes, you are this fitness guru, but you also are a huge mental health advocate.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

And how did you get into mental health or advocating for mental health?

[Whitney]

I started by being someone who was in the trenches. I unfortunately was really struggling with mental illness for many years. And I always say, you don't know what it's like until you really go through changes you, and it changes you good and it changes you bad. But to me, it started with grief. It started with severe depression, and that led to suicidal ideation. And it's scary because it happened so quickly. And when I started going through is when I said, maybe this is something that I need to speak out about because I'm not seeing a lot of people talk about this. So you feel so alone.

[Chloe]

Right.

[Whitney]

And when you start sharing your story, you are being vulnerable. You are helping other women. So that's how I started becoming more of an advocate for mental health, is by being someone who's been through it.

[Chloe]

Right. And I'm sure people feel like they can relate to you so much more and they can talk to you, because you're not just someone that's advocating for mental health and haven't been in the trenches. You're someone that has been there. And you created your app alive, which I think the name is Such a beautiful, clever name.

[Whitney]

Thank you.

[Chloe]

And what does your app have to offer?

[Whitney]

Alive is exactly what I want women to feel when they go into that gym. Whether it's weight training or Pilates, you have a live next to you as your best friend, your mental and physical support as you step into a gym. So when I created an app, I created an app that is not overwhelming, welcoming, and makes women feel their best physically and mentally. I was looking at other apps on the market and I felt nobody was touching on both of those topics, which is something that's just very passionate to me. Fitness is a tool to better your physical, your mental, your emotional health. It is not a tool to use out of hatred. I am so tired of women hating their bodies. It is so devastating when I am in front of a woman and I think they are the most amazing person. I think of my sister, my mom, and I hear them speak negatively about their physique. Things that we don't care about.

[Chloe]

Right.

[Whitney]

So when I started Alive, that was my goal. I want women to feel and know their worth. I want them to feel supported in the gym, outside of the gym. I want women to understand it is not about your physique, it is about your health.

[Chloe]

I think it's so important to teach people. I have a daughter, she's 7, and we don't talk about our bodies and stuff like that. Not about the appearance of it, but I love that she sees me work out and be healthy, but not in an obsessive way. I just want her to know I'm active and it doesn't even have to be in the gym. We run around or we're outside. I like that. And then I also have like a food problem where I love the kids menu and like, nothing adult, which isn't great. But I like her to see the balance.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

And that's fine if other people eat healthy and don't work. Whatever. I do what's best for me. But I like her to see, like, I'm active because I'm healthy and I want to be strong so I can always play with you and do whatever. But I like her to see me eat a pizza and that kind of stuff. I never want them to see people, like, even like picking your body apart, those types of things. I get really nervous about that stuff, but more so not what's in my household with social media. And those are the things I can't control. So I try to, as much as I can control what happens inside my house, do that.

[Whitney]

Yes. And it's also Teaching your daughter or our sisters and our friends. Like, we may be tracking macros and we may be working out, but we're doing that to fuel our bodies. I saw a mom show her daughter that she was weighing out her food, and instead of saying, I'm restricting myself, she's saying, I'm making sure I am giving myself the proper fuel. And I loved that outlook because that is what we need women to be seeing.

[Chloe]

Well, those words are so powerful and especially for a little mind, sometimes we don't realize the power. Like, I remember things people said to me when I was 10 that that person probably had no idea what that sentence did to me. And we don't realize how much weight our words carry. So we have to be careful.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

Saying the same thing, just a different way.

[Whitney]

And speaking of body ch, I have been thinking so heavily about that because I think as you grow up and you're growing into your body and you're like, what are these changes? What is going on? I still remember the day I grew hips and I said, excuse me, I sat in my grandma's basement to my dad and I said, I've never struggled with my body image before, and now I have these hips and I look at society's standards of beauty and I'm not fitting it anymore. And so it's helping women understand that health comes in all shapes and sizes.

[Chloe]

Yes, for sure.

[Whitney]

And body checks. When it comes to body checks, how many women stand in the mirror at the end of the day? I've seen my baby sister do it, and she picks and she pulls and she beats herself up because she doesn't look how she thinks society wants her to look. And so I always encourage women, let's focus on the good. Try speaking kindly to yourself for five days straight. Don't say one negative thing about yourself.

[Chloe]

That's probably so hard.

[Whitney]

So hard it is. But that's the mindset shift that you have to make. We need to be training out of self love, not hatred. So when it comes to those body checks, stop it. And also, let's start speaking kinder to ourselves.

[Chloe]

How did you start? Because I believe. Well, I know our brain is a muscle, but retraining that. How did you start retraining your brain to do these kind affirmations for yourself?

[Whitney]

Well, I would like to say I'm definitely not perfect when I say these things. This is hopeful, wishful thinking. I want every woman to feel like this. But I definitely still struggle with, you know, I'm around some of the biggest names in the fitness Industry, the most beautiful, muscular women. I'm in front of you right now. The most beautiful woman with, like, the most beautiful shoulders. Right. So it's so hard not to take that and be like, well, my shoulders don't look like that, and I don't look like this, and I don't look like this. So it's just doing your best every single day. Start by challenging yourself to change your mindset. What are things you love about yourself rather than things you hate? How can we change the narrative to start speaking kinder? Training out of self love rather than hatred? Little steps. For me, it was, I need to stop the body checks. Because every night when I sit in front of that mirror, all I could see was all the things I hated about my body. And when I would go to a event in the fitness industry, I'm around the most beautiful, well, chiseled women. How do I stop comparing myself to these women? It starts with self love.

[Chloe]

It does.

[Whitney]

And I know self love is so cheesy.

[Chloe]

No, but it's really what matters. And I know it is cheesy because I think it's overused the expression. But it is really all that matters.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

But even when you came in here today, you were like, oh, I'm so nervous, and I'm so nervous. And I think we. Like, when you're in the room with all these fitness women, I don't think you realize they're probably looking at you and doing the same thing. And it's sad that we all feel the need to do that.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

But I'm nervous being here. I'm nervous having this interview. What if I don't ask the right questions? Like, I think all these things when I'm like, I know we're just talking. If I don't ask the right question, I can look down. Like, I know that we have that, but still, we're in our heads. And like you said, we're always comparing whether we know it or not.

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[Whitney]

A question I have for you that I often think about because you are very much so in the limelight and I am constantly critiqued for my physique. I can't even imagine how somebody of your level would feel. How do you deal with that?

[Chloe]

You know, at first it's interesting. What I do say is the bigger I was, I was way more confident I think because like what are you going to say about me? I know all the things you're going to say and I would have my days that I would feel low and all of that. And then I will say when I started my fitness journey and like becoming in shape, I felt such a need that I had to keep this up. Like Even if it wasn't for me, I felt like, well, I can't get fat again because everyone's expecting that to happen. And it was also a different type of attention I was now receiving. And then once I got a little older, I was like, well, wait, this is gross. Like, I hated that. That's why I was getting more attention, because I looked a certain way. Because it's exciting and it's all this newness. So you're in, you're in it and you're like loving it. And then after a minute you sort of remove yourself and you're like, this is all so fake.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

And I think as long as you know that and you're like, I know this is all smoke and mirrors. I know this is all so fake and I'm not doing it for them. I need to make sure I'm doing this for me. I mean, it's a lot of, like, I have a lot of self check ins. And not that this is good, but sort of when I have bad things happen to me in my life, I get to be really introverted and have these major self check ins and then realize like, am I doing this for me? Am I doing this because I'm trying to impress somebody else or for society or what? And once you real, like, whatever your answer is that you come to, I think when you realize, okay, I need to do what's best for me and you start doing that, the rest doesn't really matter. I'm 40 now and I honestly think the older you get, I mean, that's the saying, with age comes wisdom. But it does. And you're just like, you don't bother me the way you once did. Yes, definitely at first, for so many people, it's really hard to endure all that noise. But it is just noise.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

And I've learned no matter what, I've never, I'm never going to make people happy. Because I was once bigger, I was thinner and I had the same amount of people but from different ends. When I lost weight, I was a traitor to the bigger community. I'm not myself. I'm not funny anymore. I'm not all the things that I still am at my core.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

I just aesthetically look a little different.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

Or a lot different. Whatever you want to say. So once I really came to terms with that too, like, you know what? I'm never gonna make everyone happy, but am I happy? Okay, cool.

[Whitney]

Yeah. To hear you say that you felt. Yes. And to hear that you felt more confident when you had more Weight on you is crazy. It is crazy, right? And it's crazy because society was probably telling you you needed to lose weight.

[Chloe]

Well, I never thought I was fat until I got on TV and everyone told me how fat I was. And I was like, oh, me? I didn't know I was fat. And what's interesting is looking back, I'm like, wait, I actually wasn't as fat as even I convinced myself that I was. But it was a different time too. People were so thin during that time.

[Whitney]

I think about that all the time. I never dealt with such bad self confidence and, and esteem until I started posting workouts online. And every part of my body that people did not like, they wanted to tell me about it.

[Chloe]

And what's interesting is those people, they're not doing anything. They're on the couch judging you. Not that we care to pick them apart, but it's always the ones that are literally behind a computer not doing a thing or that they. I always hear like, oh, must be easy when you have a trainer. Or it must be easy when you have an at home gym. I'm like, well, I didn't for years. I got an at home gym four years ago. But what about the years it took me to get here? Like, everyone wants an excuse. Must be okay. Well, it wasn't easy 15 years ago, but I didn't use those excuses then. I was at 24 Hour Fitness. I was doing what I needed to do to get there.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

So people will always have something to say.

[Whitney]

Always.

[Chloe]

And I feel like when you do put yourself out there and especially working out, people come from my form. I'm like, I'm not a trainer. Like they want to say something.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

And tear you apart just to be like, gotcha. I never said I was going perfect form. I'm doing the best I can, whatever.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

And I think the more vulnerable, like because you do something that people feel like they can analyze, like if you were showing your accounting stuff, people. There's not a lot of accountants out there. But everyone thinks they can talk about someone's body. They just feel like they have the right to do so.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

I don't know why, but they feel like they do.

[Whitney]

It is absolutely heartbreaking to me.

[Chloe]

And so how do you deal with it?

[Whitney]

It's been very difficult. I think when you ask me about my mental health, it's the online harassment that I receive about my body played a huge role in the mental illness struggles that I had. I remember like it was yesterday and I've shared the story before. But I had just gotten done reading an entire thread. Over 130 comments about every reason why I should not be in the fitness industry.

[Chloe]

Oh, my God.

[Whitney]

From. She doesn't have enough muscle. Well, then she has too much muscle now she's overweight. Now she's underweight. She doesn't even look fit. Right. Who are these people that feel that they can comment on another woman's body?

[Chloe]

Right.

[Whitney]

And I've heard you say before, words are so meaningful. And I got done reading this thread and I was already really struggling. I was in the depths of my depression, not getting out of bed. I was just. I remember my husband, it was during, you know, Covid times. He was upstairs working. And I was just so embarrassed that I was struggling so deeply with my mental illness and depression. I couldn't get out of bed. And I was so embarrassed to have him come downstairs and see me like that because that wasn't the woman he married. That's not the woman he met.

[Chloe]

Right.

[Whitney]

And he. He's thankfully loved me through every phase. But in those deep, dark moments, you see all these comments about you, and in my head it's like, well, sure, they're not wrong. Let me take care of this. And that was the day. That was the first time that I really thought I could no longer be here. And it's going to be okay.

[Chloe]

Wow.

[Whitney]

And I was driving, and I had just dropped my husband off at the airport and I said goodbye, and I was. The whole time I was driving there, I was thinking about all these comments and all these people that you will never please, they hate you and they want to hate you, and you will never change their mind. And I am such a people pleaser. And I said, if they hate me so much, let me just take care of this. I'll just leave. Let me be done. And that's how meaningful words are, especially when somebody is struggling so deeply.

[Chloe]

I was just gonna say, because when I am having a dark time, and then if I see something or hear something or read something, it affects me so much more. Like, if I'm in a good headspace and I read the same thing, I can brush it off.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

But if I'm already down, I will believe this like it is the Bible. I take it to my heart and I carry it with me the whole day.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

And the older I've gotten, I've learned how to manage, like, have self control, I guess, because I've learned. Okay, I'm not in a good headspace today. It's just a bad day. Not A bad life. But I'm not gonna read or go on social because sometimes if I go on and on my Explore, I'm gonna, you know, it's not a relatable circumstance, but I might see something on the explore page and like, I know I'm not strong enough today to do that. And then there's days I'm like, I'm fucking amazing. So I'm gonna go and do everything if I want to read it. But I think it takes us to know either through experience, which is horrible. Like you.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

Age, whatever it is. But it has to be now. It's an. Social media has to be a tool that we control and not have it control us.

[Whitney]

I love that. That's definitely something I need to work on. Because it did. It does still have such an impact on me and I do feel through therapy and through self love and working so deeply on being happy and comfortable in the skin I'm in and being confident in who I am that it does allow these comments to just brush off a bit more. But it has taken a lot of time for me to get here. So I look at you and I'm like, this is so admirable because you have so many eyes on you. And for you to be able to sit here and say, I brush this off my back, it is amazing.

[Chloe]

But it's taken me years as well. I met with this brain doctor named Dr. Amen. And what I loved, he's like, name your brain. And sometimes if you're getting out of control, whatever the name is, you know, like, Sarah, shut the fuck up right now. It's so silly.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

But sometimes you need something to identify or else you just feel like, okay, I'm. I'm spinning and spiraling.

[Whitney]

Yes. Because in that moment, right after I dropped my husband off at the airport, I just got done reading these 130 plus comments about everything they hate about me and my body. My brain said, let's just end it all. Let's be done. And I'm driving, there's this huge concrete wall. And that was the first time where I had that thought. And I reached out to my mom and I said, mom, I'm really struggling. For the first time. I think that I'm dealing with suicidal ideation and I've lost my grandma to suicide her mom. So that was a really hard moment for me. But.

[Chloe]

And I'm sure so scary for your mom.

[Whitney]

Yes. And I know that my mom's also struggled with thoughts like that before as well. And so it's hard Because I don't want to break my mom's heart. I don't want to go to her and say, this is what I'm struggling with. But that is why I continue to advocate for mental health. Because in that moment, I needed help. And I need women to understand that there's no shame in asking for help.

[Chloe]

No, there's not. And I feel like people are getting a little more comfortable with that. But still, there's a lot that needs to be talked about more. And I see sad things on my Explorer page of there's no look to suicidal thoughts, people. I don't know the term, but you see like, oh, the day before this is what the person was doing. And then you see the tragic event the next day. And that breaks my heart. Because you're like, well, how do you know if someone's suffering or going through that?

[Whitney]

Because a lot of people don't feel comfortable talking about it. And I see the same thing. And the comments, they were so happy. They were happy. Go lucky. You could tell nothing was wrong. But the day before, I saw a whole video full of hate comments for that same person. And so that is why our words are so powerful and why we need to be so, so careful with them. Especially in this world that we live in right now, where you can leave a comment on any platform under any post. How can we take a step back and just be a little bit more careful with our words? Because it is affecting people and it is heavily affecting women's confidence and self esteem.

[Chloe]

Do you think laws, different laws need to be passed for social media?

[Whitney]

I don't know.

[Chloe]

That's a great question because I like, I think it was Alexa. Weren't we talking about this? It was something with. Or maybe it was my sisters I was talking about this with. But with social media, they were, I think it was like 13 and older than. You can go on Tick Tock or Instagram, something like that. But then the government, I think recently just said that they admitted it. You probably shouldn't be 16 or 17 to go on it. But it was something where they just said all of this. I'm like, then why are we still saying that in order to sign up for these platforms, you can be 13 if. If one is saying one thing, but then whoever owns all these apps are saying another thing. I find that so irresponsible. And why aren't we more concerned about this?

[Whitney]

Agreed. I always think about when I see a photo of somebody online, whether it's on my Explorer pager or, you know, TikTok anything and I go and look at the comments. Well, I first see this image and I'm like, how beautiful is this woman? I love this post. And then you read these comments and they are just the nastiest, vile, most hatred comments. And I think about somebody like your daughter who gets on social media in a couple years or my little sister.

[Chloe]

Or my mom, I really will.

[Whitney]

I'm not even a mother and I.

[Chloe]

Would as well twitching like it's not going to happen.

[Whitney]

But that what worries me because if I see these comments and I'm younger, I'm in my early 20s and I look at this beautiful photo of somebody and then the comments are just hateful. How, how does that affect anybody who sees that post and thought wait, this woman is gorgeous inside and out. How is that affecting girls, younger women, women in their 20s when they see these comments of somebody saying you're overweight, you look like this. You look like this. Well, I'm gonna take that and say, well then I must be really ugly.

[Chloe]

Right.

[Whitney]

You know, it's, it's a tricky thing to navigate.

[Chloe]

I've also have never and I, I don't care who I am. Like I think at any level I've never ever looked at someone's page and been like, let me write something demonic to them.

[Whitney]

Completely agree. And so I think for women like you and I, it's so hard to relate to that and understand why it's happening, especially when it's happening to you. That was something I really struggled with.

[Chloe]

Right.

[Whitney]

I would never leave these comments about another woman.

[Chloe]

I don't even know if I think them. And if I am like talking about someone, it's all internal. I'm like, what is she wearing? It's still nothing super nasty. It's more like girl, what is she doing? Yes, but that's it. I'm not like, look at that fat roll. Like I cuz I don't even look like that.

[Whitney]

But there's so many people that feel that they can leave these comments and it is having such a negative toll on people that share their life online.

[Chloe]

So where do you go from here? Because also what you're doing is helping so many people. But I don't want it to be at the cost of you.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

Do you know what I mean? Like, but also, and I don't want you to feel like you can't stop because you are helping other people. Because also if you ever want to stop, that means you still helped all these people and it's fabulous and you still have Your Alive app and all those things. But have you, because of this, pulled back, posting, like, your workouts and all of that?

[Whitney]

For a few years, I pulled back on my vulnerability online. I needed to protect my mental space. So while I was working through my mental illnesses, I got on medication. I was in therapy. I decided, okay, I'm going to take a step back and just not share as much to protect my own mental health. And I've definitely, like, here. I'm so comfortable now to share my story. And I will continue to share my story because that's my job right now, is to help women feel comfortable in their own skin.

[Chloe]

But with remaining pulled back, I've definitely.

[Whitney]

Taken a step forward again, but only because I.

[Chloe]

Because I don't think being pulled back is bad.

[Whitney]

Yes. I agree.

[Chloe]

I don't.

[Whitney]

I agree because I definitely, at one point was sharing too much. Right. I don't think there's anything wrong with taking a step back. And I think if you look across my platforms, I am still a few steps back, but definitely a few steps forward than I once was when I was struggling.

[Chloe]

And maybe that middle ground is perfect for you because I think we all. You try things, you're like, okay, I didn't like the way that made me feel or whatever. I know for me, I pull back in ways that I can because my job is to be vulnerable and all of that. But if it does me a disservice, then I'm not gonna have a job soon because I don't have myself.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

So I pull back in areas that I'm just not comfortable with. And then in others, I lean in and give, and that's okay. It's also like when people go, you've changed. Thank you. I hope so.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

If I'm the same person I was 20 years ago, just.

[Whitney]

I get that comment all the time. I've been online for nine years now sharing every part of my world and my life and my family, and I get that comment all the time. She's changed. I wish she looked like she did in 2016 when she had the. This much more muscle.

[Chloe]

Yeah.

[Whitney]

I wish that she acted like this. Well, then I'd be acting like I was 23 years old again.

[Chloe]

Right.

[Whitney]

I'm 32 now.

[Chloe]

Right.

[Whitney]

I hope that I've changed, and that's okay if you don't want to continue following along my journey. But I need to continue doing what I feel I'm called to do, and that is to help women. And so you'll see that across my pages. I Constantly talk about, you know, when I was at my thinnest is when I was struggling the most with my mental illnesses and I put that weight back on and I call out the people who feel that they get to comment on my body.

[Chloe]

But you should.

[Whitney]

As I've worked through my mental illnesses and I've worked through training and using training as a tool for self love, I feel confident enough to present that and say, hey, I know that I've gained weight. I see that you guys are calling me out for it. Now you're saying I'm pregnant because I'm holding on to lower belly fat, which is very normal as a woman.

[Chloe]

Yes. Oh, the pregnancy card all the time is always, always. Can they be more creative? I know you're not a mental health doctor.

[Whitney]

Absolutely not.

[Chloe]

So this is just from your experience. Do you have any advice or suggestions for someone that isn't sure if they have mental illness but maybe has dark thoughts? Because I think some people get confused because I think social media is such a dark place and sometimes they see things and I'm not saying it's like Munchausens, you just start believing things, but sometimes people are sort of fed information and they start having these thoughts because they're seeing these things.

[Whitney]

Absolutely.

[Chloe]

Do you know what I mean?

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

Do you have any advice or what someone should do if they're questioning?

[Whitney]

I don't want to give any medical advice.

[Chloe]

Yeah.

[Whitney]

But my first step was seeing a psychiatrist and getting help.

[Chloe]

And I do think a psychiatrist or a therapist is more common. Before it was so frowned upon.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

To look for those doctors, see those doctors. And now I feel like there's help in every city, there's support in every city where before it was not as available as it is now.

[Whitney]

And there are so many resources online now. Now we have a suicide prevention hotline.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Whitney]

So there are resources online that are accessible. But, you know, the first step for me after seeking professional help was talking about it. Talking about it with my husband, my sister, my friends, my parents, opening the conversation so that they know where I am and open how they can support me in those moments. And a lot of times you won't know. You know, my husband asked me, how can I help you? I have no idea. But we learned through that and we grew through that. And it takes time. But I was so happy and relieved to know that he knew what I was struggling with finally.

[Chloe]

Right. I think a lot of people feel that they're. When you're in that low of a place, that they're not Even worth someone standing by them. And everyone is everyone. And especially when you have that support system and if it's not your family, if it's the family you've created, allow them the opportunity.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

To show up for you.

[Whitney]

That is exactly it.

[Chloe]

It's a beautiful thing. What do you do to protect yourself when you feel like the Internet gets too much for you?

[Whitney]

Put my phone down.

[Chloe]

Yeah.

[Whitney]

Take time away and be okay with that.

[Chloe]

Do you have like set hours or are you on your phone whenever you want to be?

[Whitney]

I'm more of. You know how you said like, it's a bad day?

[Chloe]

Yeah.

[Whitney]

If it's a bad day and my anxiety is through the roof, what are things and steps I know I can take, that I learned through therapy, that I learned through the years that will help me. So, number one, I love a walk with my dogs and my husband, being able to go outside, breathe fresh air, have my phone down, going to the gym. I'm sure you, you know, you talked about that you felt such a increase in your mental health from training.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Whitney]

Whether it's getting steps in, a walk outside or a at home workout. Move your body, get out of that bubble where you're just so anxious and not feeling good sometimes.

[Chloe]

Just sunlight.

[Whitney]

Yes, I know. Getting outside every morning and just sitting in the sun for a moment changes my whole day.

[Chloe]

I know it does. It's that small and silly. And for me, like everyone's different. I lean on my faith a lot.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

And so for me, one reason why I wake up at 5 or 4:30, it's not because I'm like, this is so great to be up at this hour. But a lot is. You know, I have young kids and it's always so noisy in my home. I love all the noise.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

But I need those little bit of time, like an hour to myself that I have my coffee, I have my prayers. I like to start my day from a day of gratitude because I feel like that sets the tone.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

And I'm like, no, it's going to be a great day.

[Whitney]

And I really see right there the positive talk. The positive talk. Taking that moment for yourself. It is so important. I'm not a mom, but I constantly see moms that don't take that time for themselves and they are run down into the ground.

[Chloe]

Right.

[Whitney]

So I love that you wake up early to make sure that you're prioritizing yourself and your mental health to show up better for others.

[Chloe]

And all of that is through trial. Like I had to do a lot of other Things to be like, okay, I'm still not feeling well. I don't. I'm just not the best that I can be.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

And I experimented, did other things, and I'm like, this is for me. It's not. I say prayers at the end of the day with my kids, but I love to see start my day like that and take that time. And when I don't give myself that, like, if my kids wake up early, I notice it's not a bad day. But I'm not as chipper positive as I would be when I have that time for myself and the gym. For sure. Like, I notice when I'm going through something. I am such a beast in the gym and I kick ass, but, like, I have good energy all the time, but I just get it out in the gym and I leave it there, which is why I love it.

[Whitney]

I love that. And that is why I circle it back to why are we training? Why are we using training as a tool for self hatred when we can switch that mindset.

[Chloe]

I know.

[Whitney]

And it will change the whole trajectory of your day and how you see yourself.

[Chloe]

I know we don't think like this all the time, but someone, and I don't remember who said this, but someone was like, instead of saying, oh, I have to go to work today, I get to go to work today.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

And obviously there's not every day that we're like, I get to go to work today. We have our days.

[Whitney]

Absolutely.

[Chloe]

But switching just those. The one word in a sentence. It doesn't have to be the work thing. I get it. Everyone. But it can be, I get to see Whitney today.

[Whitney]

I have to work out today.

[Chloe]

I get to work out today.

[Whitney]

It is such a privilege because you, when you shift that mindset to, I am working out because I love my body because I need to take care of myself. It is how you are able to stay consistent and disciplined. And it is so much more of a positive outlook. And it doesn't have to be weight training. I know that there's so many different genres of working out that so many people love. Pilates, yoga, whatever it is. It's a form of self love. And it's so important to take care of yourself and have that mindset that I'm doing this to take care of myself, not because I hate myself.

[Chloe]

Right. And I love the people that are like, in the Zumba class or the dance classes that it's just all about fun.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

And yes, it's dance and getting your cardio in, but these people really just want to be healthy and do it in a fun way. And I love that. I love my weight training for me, but I admire the ones that are just, like, having a ball in the gym at all times. That's why I think, like, the gym without music, that is no place. I need to have all my jams on. Like, I love an ambiance in the gym.

[Whitney]

You would die. I've been doing mic'd up contents where, like, mic'd up workout, where I have a mic on and I have no music.

[Chloe]

Oh, my. I just can't get into it.

[Whitney]

I just get into it with the jokes, you know? Yeah, crack the jokes. And it gets me going. I'm like, all right.

[Chloe]

Well, in that you would have to have the jokes, because that's literally. I would be like, what are we doing? I don't want to hear me breathe.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

My knees cracking while I'm squatting. No, no, no. I can't.

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[Chloe]

Going back to the post you did where you posted yourself from.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

Your body from a year ago to now.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

Even though it was traumatic for you, I would say. And even though you got so much criticism and people analyzing you, I love that you have it pinned on your Instagram.

[Whitney]

Thank you.

[Chloe]

Because you're sort of like, well fuck all you.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

Just had to well I just want.

[Whitney]

When somebody comes to my page like this is me, this is what you're gonna get.

[Chloe]

Stunning both photos by the way. People are insane.

[Whitney]

I look at that girl on the left and I'm so sad for her genuinely. Because that was when I was struggling the most. The most.

[Chloe]

And you're the only one that knows that.

[Whitney]

Yes. I look at her and I'm so sad. And I look at the girl on the right that's put on weight and she's so strong. I came back to the gym and I said, I'm training to become stronger. I'm sure you feel the same way. I love weight training because it makes me feel so empowered.

[Chloe]

I feel so badass. Like, I can't believe I was able to do that.

[Whitney]

When I'm shoulder pressing 40 pounds, I'm like, oh, if I can do this, I can do anything.

[Chloe]

Oh, yeah, no, I feel the same way.

[Whitney]

So empowering. And that's why I love that post and that's why I have it pinned, is because this is what you're gonna get on my page. I am not here to help you become a smaller version of yourself. I am here to help you. If I could become better, I would. Physically, mentally.

[Chloe]

Yeah. So no, I love that. Has your definition of success changed since you started prioritizing your mental health?

[Whitney]

Absolutely.

[Chloe]

In what ways?

[Whitney]

When you suffer and are struggling, I'm sure you've been there. I always think about you and how resilient you are.

[Chloe]

Oh, my gosh.

[Whitney]

You are one of a kind.

[Chloe]

Thank you.

[Whitney]

Your story is so inspiring and I'm so happy that you feel vulnerable to share your story because I think it's changed so many lives, including mine. And for me, when I was struggling so much with my mental health, you really take a step back and say, oh, let me think about what's the most important in my life and focusing on bettering my mental health. And like you said, you still have up days, down days. I don't think I currently struggle with depression. But that doesn't mean you don't have depressive thoughts.

[Chloe]

Right.

[Whitney]

But what's most important to me now when I think of success is can I show up for the women who show up for me, who support me in every post, every comment, every message? Can I show up for them how I want them to show up for me? I want them to show up feeling confident, kind. I want them to love themselves. And so that's what's most important for me.

[Chloe]

I know people are afraid of getting older, but just this conversation. I love getting older. Like, just because I think anyone can relate to not maybe exactly what you're going through, but for the experiences that you're going through.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

Being picked apart, being insecure, not knowing what to do with that having depressive thoughts and then just sort of. Which you're going to have ups and downs. I'm not saying like, oh, it's all sunshine and rainbows. But the older you get, the more you're like, you can't hurt me anymore. You don't affect me. You'll have your days. But even like how you have that pinned, that's sort of like because I'm confident. And a lot of it is yes. Your self love. But the self love I also think comes with age. I don't know any young 20 year olds. If they say I love myself, like it's more of a cockiness as opposed to a legitimacy. I don't know. I, like I just met you today, but I'm so proud of you.

[Whitney]

Thank you.

[Chloe]

And I don't want that to sound like I'm being patronizing or anything.

[Whitney]

No, thank you. I can feel the joy about you. So thank you.

[Chloe]

I could feel the joy.

[Whitney]

I do agree with you. As you get older, the minute I turned 30, I said, Wait a minute. I know who I am. So you can say all these things about me. Yeah. I'm excited.

[Chloe]

Amazing.

[Whitney]

Like you can say all these things about me. But now I know who I am.

[Chloe]

Yeah.

[Whitney]

And I'm surrounded by people who love me for who I am. Not your perception of who I am that you create of me online. I know who I am. You can leave these comments about me. They still hurt. I'm never gonna say that they don't hurt.

[Chloe]

Oh yeah.

[Whitney]

But at least they don't take me back to where I was. Because as I get older, I am more confident and comfortable in who I am.

[Chloe]

Right. And I don't know if you are ever going to have kids. And if you do, you're going to be the best mom.

[Whitney]

Thank you.

[Chloe]

Because any child that grows up in a household with this type of mentality is so, so lucky.

[Whitney]

Thank you.

[Chloe]

And I don't think our parents meant any harm at all. It was just a different time.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

And the things that we focused on or didn't focus on were just very different.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

And then, you know, now we're in this social media craze and it's hard to navigate. Like I, when I came up, there was no social media until a few years into the show.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

My little sisters had to endure more. But they were so good at it, I think. Cause they also had us. But I'm like, if it affects me and when I'm in my 20s, 30s later. 20s, 30s, I don't. I Don't want teenagers on these apps having to deal with this stuff.

[Whitney]

I was very lucky to be raised with parents that were so incredibly encouraging of me. They never made me feel anything other than I'm amazing and I can do anything I set my mind to. And so when I think about you as a mom, I know that you're the same way. When I think about the mom I hope to be one day, that's. Those are the kind of thoughts I want my kids to have. You are. Are able to do anything they will. Yes.

[Chloe]

I love your motto. It's a beautiful day to be alive.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

What made you start believing in that again?

[Whitney]

What a great question. Because when I started that motto, when I started saying that started on my YouTube channel, when I started saying that, I loved it. It's a beautiful day to be alive, it was so representative of who I was at that moment. That. That Whitney that was showing up on YouTube, it. That was everything I was. But that has taken a whole new meaning since being in the trenches.

[Chloe]

Right.

[Whitney]

Since becoming a more mentally strong person. Now I look at that motto, and that's really what created the Alive app was it's a beautiful day to be alive. That's why we call it the Alive app. So when you open the Alive app, that's the first thing it says to you. That motto has taken on such a new meaning to me because when there's moments in my life where I was really struggling, like I just told you about, and you no longer want to be alive, this model is just taking on a whole new meaning. And it is a beautiful day to be alive, to want to be alive and have the opportunity to be alive.

[Chloe]

Yeah.

[Whitney]

So it has shifted dramatically, and now it just means so much more to me.

[Chloe]

It's very cosmic. Like how that was something you said and recited prior and then all of this, it was just sort of meant to be your motto.

[Whitney]

And I stopped saying it in my content for so many years because I didn't believe it anymore. So to be able to say that and say it so confidently, and it has this whole new meaning.

[Chloe]

It's beautiful.

[Whitney]

It is beautiful. And it means so much more to me now than it ever did.

[Chloe]

Do you have a message that sticks out to you that sort of reminds you why you do all of this? Like, does somebody. Have you heard a story from someone? Is there one person? Or do you get a similar comment in a positive way of why you do this?

[Whitney]

You know, what it really is, is when I meet the women who support me every time Whether I'm at Target or I'm at a fitness event where we're doing a meet and greet and I'm meeting these women, that's what does it for me. It is women who share their own stories with me and how when I started sharing my experience with mental illness, they shared their experiences with me. And it was the first time in that moment that I didn't feel so alone. Because when you are in the trenches like that, your brain makes you believe you're the only person dealing with this. And it's not true.

[Chloe]

Right.

[Whitney]

You are not alone. And these women showed up for me and they shared their stories with me and they gave me hope, and that's what I want to give to women.

[Chloe]

Yeah. Well, you are.

[Whitney]

Thank you.

[Chloe]

You are giving that to women and men. I'm sure there's men that look up to you and you're doing so much, and that's such a beautiful thing.

[Whitney]

Thank you.

[Chloe]

Is there. This is a silly question, but do you think that there's one platform that's more negative than the other?

[Whitney]

People always ask, okay, that's so interesting because I always ask my friends that, my other content creator friends. And it is just so 50 50. It is my most supportive community, kindest community. And I feel that it's the women that know me the most because it's my most vulnerable platform is YouTube.

[Chloe]

Okay.

[Whitney]

Nicest, kindest, most supportive women. And then tick tock.

[Chloe]

When TikTok went down for 10 hours.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

And people spiraled.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

But I was like, just go to Instagram. Because I'm not a huge TikToker.

[Whitney]

Yes.

[Chloe]

People would post like, these comments are so dark. Like, that would be the overall note that I would hear from TikTokers that went to Instagram. It was too dark for them.

[Whitney]

Instagram. It's very interesting to me because my demographic on Instagram is older. And that makes me sad that it's. It tends to be older women who criticize me more on Instagram, but it gives me hope for our future because then I get on TikTok where I have a higher, younger demographic, and it is full of the kindest, most supportive women. So it gives me hope, actually, that, like, we're working hard to change and disrupt the industry and it might be working.

[Chloe]

Yeah.

[Whitney]

Because you have this younger age group of women who are coming in and they are showing up with kindness. Where I go to Instagram and I'm.

[Chloe]

Like, right, it's heavy over here.

[Whitney]

Very heavy. Instagram comments are very heavy, very critical.

[Chloe]

I don't know much about YouTube, but that is what I hear about. Yes, Tick Tock versus Instagram. I want to end this on just if you have. For anyone that's struggling, whether it be if they're struggling with mental health or if they're struggling with the commentary, is there any message that you. I mean, I feel like you've given such beautiful, insightful messages, but is there anything you want them to know or hear from you?

[Whitney]

I just love to remind women that you are not alone. You are never alone.

[Chloe]

You never are.

[Whitney]

There are so many women and men who are struggling and it's okay to not feel okay. And there is a way out of this. When you're in those deep, dark trenches, you feel like you will never see the light of day again. You'll never see that light. But I promise you not to give up. And if you do not give up, you will find happiness again. And it doesn't mean everything's perfect, right? Like I told you, we still have depressive thoughts or hard days, but you are not alone. And it might take a little bit of time and work, but you will get there again. I feel like I lost happy, goofy, silly Whitney for so long and do.

[Chloe]

You think she's back?

[Whitney]

She's back. She's cracking jokes left and right in her content.

[Chloe]

I love that.

[Whitney]

And it just reminds me of like old Whitney again, where I lost her. And I feel like my brain didn't even let me have access to her anymore. But through a lot of time and work and self love, she's back. And I missed her so much. But I'm so happy she's here again.

[Chloe]

I'm so happy she's here.

[Whitney]

Thank you.

[Chloe]

This was so nice. Thank you for chatting.

[Whitney]

Thank you so much for having me.

[Chloe]

No, and thank you for being so vulnerable and sharing. I know a lot of these conversations aren't easy, but you know, and I'm going to remind you that every single thing that you've done in your life have brought you here. And it makes such a difference for so many people whether you see them all or hear them all. So many people are so appreciative that you're this vulnerable.

[Whitney]

Thank you so much.

[Chloe]

Because I'm sure people also look at you and see this gorgeous, beautiful woman, body, hair, face, all of it. And then hear how articulate and poised and smart you are. And they're like, damn. It's like, damn, damn, damn, damn. And then even someone like you can have intrigued, intrusive thoughts.

[Whitney]

Yeah.

[Chloe]

And I think that makes people feel seen at the same time. And you give people a lot of hope. And I love hope. Who doesn't love hope?

[Whitney]

Who doesn't love hope?

[Chloe]

Thank you.

[Whitney]

Thank you so much. Thanks for having me.

[Chloe]

Thanks for coming.

[Whitney]

Like a little warm.

[Chloe]

Sa.