Something Borrowed, Something Sued ft. Hayley Paige

Summary

Podcast Summary: Khloé in Wonder Land

Episode: "Something Borrowed, Something Sued" ft. Hayley Paige

Host: Khloé Kardashian
Guest: Hayley Paige (wedding dress designer)
Date: April 8, 2026

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Overview

This emotional and candid episode dives into the extraordinary legal and personal journey of renowned wedding dress designer Hayley Paige, most famous for her whimsical bridal creations—and later, for her prolonged legal battle over the rights to her very own name. Khloé and Hayley unpack the cautionary tale of signing away rights, the psychological toll of litigation, the creative pivots Hayley made, and her mission to support and educate young creators through advocacy. The episode also brings wedding dress trends, fun rapid-fire bridal questions, and advice for anyone navigating the entrepreneurial world.

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Main Discussion Points

1. Hayley's Background and Initial Success

• Hayley introduces herself as a wedding dress designer whose passion was discovered early thanks to her grandmother’s lessons in sewing.
• Bridal became her core identity: "It became my identity very, very young in life... bridal is kind of the equalizer in that anyone can be a main character as the bride." (Hayley Paige, 02:02)
• Discusses her early career dreams—making women feel confident, secure, and special in dresses.

2. The Perils of Contracts and Creativity

• At age 25, Hayley signed an employment contract with JLM Couture, which included a non-compete clause and the trademarking of her actual birth name. She signed without legal counsel due to lack of resources and eagerness for opportunity.
• Khloé underscores how common it is to get trapped in unfavorable contracts, even with legal representation.
  • "I have signed crazy things in my life that I'm like... what the fuck did I just sign?" (Khloé, 04:24)
• Intellectual property lesson: Hayley reflects on how contracts are “intellectual property software” that can be outdated, and how negotiating them is critical.
• Realization: "When you don't know what your value is, somebody else is gonna define it for you." (Hayley Paige, 04:58)

3. The Lawsuit & Losing Her Name

• Hayley describes the shock and fear of being sued by her employer during COVID-19, the imposition of a Temporary Restraining Order (TRO), and losing rights to her social media and even—literally—her own name.
  • "All my texts with my fiancé and like our DMs... really private messages... and then all of a sudden I couldn't even say [my name] at Starbucks." (Hayley Paige, 11:41 & 12:22)
• Her accounts were commandeered by the company, with friends and family unaware of the real situation.
  • "My family and friends who weren't told what was going on, they still thought it was me." (Hayley Paige, 14:25)

4. Community & Public Support

• Hayley’s new, small Instagram account and a viral video mobilized her bridal industry and customer community to support her.
  • "The public court is the people showed up for me, they shared it, they told bridal stores..." (Hayley Paige, 20:30)

5. The Extreme Reach of Non-Competes

• Her non-compete clause was extended from two to five years, including a ban on designing wedding dresses under any name and, bizarrely, potentially on even wearing one at her own wedding.
  • "I couldn't design using my name or design wedding dresses at all. At all. No matter what name I used." (Hayley Paige, 22:20)
  • "In your non-compete, it said that you can't wear a wedding dress on your own wedding." (Khloé, 30:29)

6. Survival, Identity and Reinvention

• Pivoted to designing shoes under the brand “She Is Cheval” (French for “horse”) during her non-compete.
• On coping: "I'm just a girl you might know." (Hayley Paige, 24:49)
• Emotional toll: “You do need to sit with your grief... I always get a little emotional when I think about, sorry, the bride.” (Hayley Paige, 26:40)
• Khloé praises her resilience and impact on brides: "You're not just some designer that's doing something in autopilot... You're a crusader." (Khloé, 26:58)

7. Advocacy and Changing the Law

• Senator Elizabeth Warren invited Hayley to testify before the Senate on non-competes right after Hayley regained her intellectual property through bankruptcy proceedings.
  • "She had followed the story and she watched Say Yes to the Dress... I'd love for you to come testify and tell your story." (Hayley Paige, 38:47)
• Started “A Girl You Might Know” Foundation—offering young entrepreneurs legal resources and advice, especially about contracts and personal branding.
• Hayley's landmark case changed case law on social media ownership:
  • "They found basic property law can be applied to a social media account... it belongs to the original holder and opener of the account." (Hayley Paige, 43:07)
  • She ultimately got her name and social media accounts back.

8. Healing & Creative Passions

• Movement and physical exercise were key to surviving litigation stress: "Movement was far more profound in my ability to deal with my situation than manifesting." (Hayley Paige, 46:14)
• Hayley shares her renewed creative drive and gratitude:
  • "I fought for it and got it back." (Hayley Paige, 45:15)
• Current focus: blending her “She Is Cheval” brand with her restored “Hayley Paige” name and bridal company.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “A contract is really intellectual property software. And software needs to be updated.” (Hayley Paige, 04:58)
• “I was even found in contempt of court for sketching on social media.” (Hayley Paige, 23:02)
• “You’re going to see me. Exactly.” (Khloé, 00:18)
• “This community rally was like, go design something else!” (Hayley Paige, 23:45)
• “Going through things where part of you breaks, you realize it's a shedding and that there is something you can leave behind.” (Hayley Paige, 29:00)
• “You sign a contract and basically sign away your constitutional rights.” (Hayley Paige, 45:21)
• “They found basic property law can be applied to a social media account... so unless... written into a contract... it belongs to the original holder.” (Hayley Paige, 43:07)
• “Now when I say my name, it comes with this just real gratitude and humility and, like, fortitude.” (Hayley Paige, 44:57)
• “I feel like I didn’t lose my whimsy through the wicked parts.” (Hayley Paige, 51:33)

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Key Timestamps

• 00:04 – Hayley describes her employment agreement and non-compete
• 02:02 – Discovering bridal as an identity/obsession
• 03:26 – Signing her first big contract at 25 without legal counsel
• 10:16 – First lawsuit, court-ordered loss of her name/social accounts
• 14:25 – Company posing as Hayley on her own social media
• 21:31 – Explanation of non-competes and their (over)broad application
• 22:45 – Pivoting from bridal to shoes, creating "She Is Cheval"
• 26:38 & 32:00 – Emotional moments, the toll on her personal life, and relationship growth
• 38:47 – Senate testimony and advocacy work
• 43:07 – Legal win: property law applies to social accounts; recovers Instagram
• 46:14 – Healing through movement/workouts
• 48:15 – Rebranding and merging Cheval & Hayley Paige
• 51:43 – Bridal trends: Basque waists, color dresses, "whimsy through the wicked parts"
• 53:01 – Fastest dress turnaround: her sister’s surprise wedding
• 63:14 – Reflections on influence/audience, building trustworthy brands
• 64:51 – Foundations, web/app info, where to find Hayley Paige’s work

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Fun & Fashion: Bridal Rapid-Fire

• Favorite current trends: Basque waists, color in wedding dresses (blush, blue, champagne), structured/architectural gowns
• Veil or no veil? Always veil! (55:27)
• Destination wedding or hometown? Destination (Italy, here we come!)
• Classic or dramatic gown? Dramatic
• Aisle reveal vs. first look? Aisle reveal is the moment

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Resources & Where to Find Hayley

• Nonprofit: A Girl You Might Know Foundation
• Bridal: haleypaige.com
• Instagram: @MsHayleyPaige (recovered!), @sheischeval
• App: Holy Mattress Emoji (wedding-themed emoji app)

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Conclusion & Takeaways

• Don’t sign contracts without full understanding and expert legal guidance.
• Your name and creative work are invaluable; protect them.
• Setbacks, even traumatic ones, can lead to positive transformation and new advocacy roles.
• Build resilient communities and ask for help—public voices can make all the difference.
• Creativity and movement are powerful tools for healing.
• Hayley's story is a cautionary tale but ultimately a hopeful reminder to honor one’s value, stay nimble, and always fight for your identity.

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This episode is rich with hard-earned wisdom, light moments, and inspiration—a must for anyone in creative industries, business, or simply seeking a story of reinvention and perseverance.

Transcript

[Chloe]

I'm on like this emotional roller coaster with your story, Ms. Haley Page.

[Haley Paige]

Good afternoon, everyone. I signed an employment agreement that included a non compete clause.

[Chloe]

I want people to know how easy it is to get into a bad deal.

[Haley Paige]

My former employer sued me. I was forbidden from using my own birth name.

[Chloe]

You're like, you're gonna see me. Exactly. Was that your first lawsuit?

[Haley Paige]

Oh, yeah.

[Chloe]

The first real lawsuit. You think you're going to jail? In your non compete, it said that you can't wear a wedding dress and your own wedding. Did you ever feel like you were losing hope?

[Haley Paige]

Yes. I always get like a little emotional when I think about. Sorry. The bride.

[Chloe]

Don't be sorry.

[Haley Paige]

Coming on Chloe to cry. There are so many teachable lessons in life. This was something that I just had to survive. I am Haley Paige. I'm Haley Paige.

[Chloe]

Let's all scream it. Haley Paige. What was the fastest turnaround for a wedding dress?

[Haley Paige]

It has to be my sister's.

[Chloe]

No.

[Haley Paige]

Yeah. So. So she had a surprise wedding.

[Chloe]

Who surprised her? Well, Hailey, thank you for coming on Chloe in Wonderland. I'm so happy to have you here. I'm on like this emotional rollercoaster with your story. But before we get into that, I would love for you to just sort of say who you are and what you do.

[Haley Paige]

Yeah.

[Chloe]

Yeah.

[Haley Paige]

I'm Hayley Page. Yeah. Which is so fun to say for many obvious reasons. Yes.

[Chloe]

Let's all scream it. Yes.

[Haley Paige]

And I'm a wedding dress designer. Also did a little detour into shoes during a non compete. But I'm just a girl that loves pretty dresses and making women feel beautiful. It's always been like my love language, I feel.

[Chloe]

And you started designing really young. You were in your early 20s or probably younger than that.

[Haley Paige]

Yeah, really young. My grandmother taught me to sew. And that early exposure was pretty much everything for me because it led me on the trajectory of just wanting to create and communicate that way through design.

[Chloe]

And were you always fixated on wedding dresses?

[Haley Paige]

Yes. Became my identity very, very young in life. And I think it was just a way to kind of express myself but also feel connected to what I wanted to say. And it made me feel the most confident.

[Chloe]

And at what age was that your niche?

[Haley Paige]

It was. The first dress I ever designed was a pink. Hot pink mini wedding dress.

[Chloe]

No way.

[Haley Paige]

And my mother was really, really encouraging of creating. Bought me a sewing machine.

[Chloe]

Love that.

[Haley Paige]

So. And I think just growing up in the 90s, being like a classic millennial, I love Disney princesses. Represent romance, all the good stuff.

[Chloe]

So did you always fantasize about your own wedding? Like, were you obsessed with weddings or you just had a gift for wedding dresses?

[Haley Paige]

I think I was just obsessed with the idea of this one dress carrying so much memory and meaning and it kind of transcending just normal fashion. Because I mean, as you know, with fashion, it can be so intimidating at times to feel like you have to either be a certain shape or silhouette or have a vibe to pull something off. And I feel like bridal is kind of the equalizer in that anyone can be a main character as the bride.

[Chloe]

So I, I love that you've been so incredible about being as vulnerable as you are and being so open and honest about your journey. You signed a deal when you were 25.

[Haley Paige]

It essentially was an employment contract. And being at the stage I was in my designer journey, it just was like the opportunity of a lifetime. Yes, right. And like something I had always dreamed of doing. And here I was getting the opportunity to ringlead my own collection and have my name, you know, up on lights

[Chloe]

everywhere around my show.

[Haley Paige]

And I didn't want anything to jeopardize that. I had never hired a lawyer before. I had no money to hire a lawyer, you know, so there are a lot of factors that kind of created an environment in which I mistook an opportunity for safety and didn't want to fumble it either. Because if I pushed back or if I was asking too many questions, maybe they would see me as difficult. And ultimately I was like, I have a goal. I just want to get out there and be a designer. And, you know, so I, I signed this contract without a lawyer and essentially gave the right for the company to trademark my name.

[Chloe]

And not to interrupt you, but I think it is so important what you just said because you are not the only one that has done that. This happens all the time and in so many different industries. It could be music, it can be, doesn't matter fashion, anything. I have signed crazy things in my life that I'm like. And I had lawyers, they just maybe weren't great, who knows? But I'm like, what the fuck did I just sign? I want people to know how easy it is to get into a bad deal and with intimidation or anything like that. And that's essentially what happened to you.

[Haley Paige]

Yeah. And it also made me realize that a contract is really intellectual property software. And software needs to be updated. And so if you're in a situation where somebody is encouraging you to sign a long term contract, you're essentially trying to understand what you're gonna be worth in X amount of years. And when you don't know what your value is, somebody else is gonna define it for you. And so in that scenario, I really took away so many lessons from the legalese world, of course, which is what we definitely wanna share through the nonprofit now. But it's more than that because it's a way for you to negotiate for yourself when you might not have the full picture.

[Chloe]

The beginning, you were 25 years old, you signed with JLM Couture, and at that time, what was going on in your life?

[Haley Paige]

I was pretty eager to just get out there and show people what I could do. And I really have an optimism hardwired in my soul. And I think that operating from a place like that can be reckless at times because you just think anything is figureoutable. Right? Anything can be negotiated. And that was something I really tethered with because you just start operating and you have this amazing job, which I did. And I got to connect with all these women and design these dresses and fiance, yes to the dress. And yes, it was just this great momentum. And I just felt, because this is going so well over here, I don't want to ruffle feathers over here, and someday I'll address this and it'll work out. Right.

[Chloe]

What were the dreams you had early on as a new up and coming wedding designer?

[Haley Paige]

I feel like it was just about making women feel secure and doing that a very specific way. I think growing up a gymnast and also just a girl, you know, you have your own insecurities and feelings of worthiness and trying to figure out where your worth and identity is tied to. And dress wear is just something where I would watch a woman put a dress on and she would feel so good about herself. And that was like a dopamine hit, you know, because it's the fact that we're communicating this way. But I'm also creating something that she loves, and then she makes it her own. And there's like this passing of the torch. And so I think that was the dream in itself, is that feeling of this is my purpose.

[Chloe]

Well, and I think it's so. It says something so special about you that you are choosing to be a designer in a field that is truly the most special day in a woman's life. And it's a dress that hopefully that person passes on to their daughter or their granddaughter. And it's such like, I'm not trying to discredit any other clothing. Everything is so special, and people put so much time and effort into it. But there, it's like the wedding dress that is, like, the ultimate and the omega of clothing to people.

[Haley Paige]

I mean. And you have worn a wedding dress before?

[Chloe]

Yes, I have.

[Haley Paige]

Did you feel like just the dress itself, you still feel connected to it?

[Chloe]

I do. I got married nine days after getting engaged. Very quickly, I knew my husband for 30 days. So really nuts. I was fortunate enough that somehow my mom called up Vera Wang, and we were like, we're getting married. And then she's like, yeah, come to New York. I think she thought, like, in a few months, I'm getting married, and then I go to the Vera Wang store in New York. She's like, so when's the wedding? I'm like, oh, in, like, five days. She's like, oh. So I was limited to what I could wear. I still loved my dress. I thought it was beautiful and timeless. If I got to customize something at a time, it would probably be just more extravagant.

[Haley Paige]

Not.

[Chloe]

But I loved my dress. It's classic. I have it. It's beautiful. My bridesmaids dresses were all Vera and just. It's so special, and I'll remember that forever. But you're right. Like, how you feel in it, if it's simple or princess like, you just feel like the most beautiful girl in the room. I guess that's the goal.

[Haley Paige]

It is the extension of your love and your love story.

[Chloe]

Do you have a signature wedding dress?

[Haley Paige]

Do you think we run on whimsy? I would say. Which includes a lot of texture and color, a lot of unique juxtapositions. We've done, like, laser cut, some faux leather. I like to experiment with textiles because I actually graduated with a bachelor's of science in fiber science. So you learn about the movements and behaviors of textures, and so I love that that kind of plays a role in it. But we have, like, a rainbow wedding dress, you know, so we really like to do.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Haley Paige]

Anything else.

[Chloe]

And I do think that so much has changed that people love to have the variety and versatility now, and they want to stand out, and they want to do something different. It's not your traditional wedding dresses anymore, but that's so special. And people that's. It's their day. They have the right to do whatever they want.

[Haley Paige]

Exactly. Go nuance.

[Chloe]

What I find frustrating and infuriating and also so hard to imagine. This is your name. Not only your brand, but it's your personal, real name. And now your name gets taken away from you. What. What does that mean exactly? Like, even on a personal level, it

[Haley Paige]

was actually During a negotiation period. So I was attempting to continue doing what I was doing. So there was a good faith negotiation effort. And during that period, there was just such a wide delta in the expectations and circumstances were so different than 10 years ago. And so the goalpost was just. It was far. And I ended up getting served a lawsuit. And so that happened during COVID And it was pretty jarring and scary, you know, like, am I going to jail? Yes, straight to jail. It was.

[Chloe]

Was that your first lawsuit?

[Haley Paige]

Oh, yeah.

[Chloe]

Oh, the first one is. Or like the first.

[Haley Paige]

The first big one. Cuz I. I had a divorce, which was a different kind of lawsuit.

[Chloe]

But no, the first real lawsuit. You just. You think you're going to jail.

[Haley Paige]

Gut punch.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Haley Paige]

And like, what did I do?

[Chloe]

What did I do and what happens? And do I go in front of a jury like you have? Yes. Oh my gosh.

[Haley Paige]

And you think of it like a

[Chloe]

night after your fifth. You're fine.

[Haley Paige]

You're like, this is a walk in the park. You're fine. Well, I look forward to getting there, but also not getting right.

[Chloe]

Oh my gosh. It means you made it. That's all, I think.

[Haley Paige]

Adulting, hardcore adulting. But it was really scary. And then there was an emergency TRO granted within a matter of days. So I had days to hire litigation, prepare my case.

[Chloe]

But a restraining order?

[Haley Paige]

Yes.

[Chloe]

Why?

[Haley Paige]

So it was.

[Chloe]

So a TRO is a restraining order, but why would.

[Haley Paige]

Yes, it's a restraining order. Basically there was arguments made about the name itself and that there was harm of some sort, because that's basically how you get a tro. And you know, I was learning this on the spot. But within a matter of 48 hours, I had to hand over all my personal passwords for my social media accounts that quickly. And I couldn't touch anything. So like all my texts with my fiance and like our DMs, you know, and like really private messages with your girlfriends and memes, you know, on anyone's face.

[Chloe]

Of course, if someone went through one of my DMs, I would be. No, I would be. They would kill me. That's not okay.

[Haley Paige]

And then the name, which was kind of ludicrous because it. It had been 30 something years of me using my name with no problem, and then all of a sudden I couldn't even say it at Starbucks, you know, so it was like, whoa. That's like. I didn't even know what to do with it at that point because it was so bizarre to me. And then the third part was really just A matter of I'm not going to be able to work under this kind of duress. And so I actually resigned and I was still technically under contract because there were two years left on my non compete. And so it was just so complex. There was a lot of nuance to. To understanding the lawsuit. It was Covid. So I had nothing better to do but to learn, okay, what have I done right? And how am I going to figure this out? Because the interesting thing about a contract is you have all these words on paper, but then it's how it's being interpreted. And so to the degree to which it was being interpreted was where I just kind of felt gobsmacked because I couldn't believe that so much was going well for so long, despite just a negotiation of trying to work things out. It all of a sudden was this like, detrimental, like. Yeah.

[Chloe]

And why they would go that extreme so quickly.

[Haley Paige]

Yes. So there was like a lot to negotiate and manage in just taking inventory on the situation.

[Chloe]

And being that it's Covid, I imagine the legal aspect would be much more delayed than life before COVID you would

[Haley Paige]

think, but it was pretty fast and furious.

[Chloe]

Oh, wow.

[Haley Paige]

And so this led to just like a back and forth, you know, claim after claim after back and forth. And here you are basically ping ponging in the beginning part of a lawsuit. And like you said, I was like, do I go to court? Like, we had some zooms where I was like shaking and terrified.

[Chloe]

Understood.

[Haley Paige]

Couldn't imagine going in person, you know, but like, you're just kind of thrown into it. And I think the part about being disassociated from my community was particularly scary because all of a sudden they were posting to my account to Ms. Haley Paige.

[Chloe]

Stop.

[Haley Paige]

And so my family and friends who weren't told what was going on, they still thought it was me.

[Chloe]

No, that's very violating.

[Haley Paige]

So it was very. I was like, oh my gosh, I don't know what to do.

[Chloe]

And were they pretending to be you?

[Haley Paige]

It was just a very scary situation of people not knowing.

[Chloe]

Right.

[Haley Paige]

And so for me, I was like, I've always been really open and transparent. That's something I feel like you can relate to and being just, you want to be salt of the earth, sugar of the sea kind of person. Right. And I felt mis. Misinterpreted and misappropriated kind of in that situation. So I got on another Instagram account with like barely any followers and just shared legally and factually what was going on.

[Chloe]

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[Haley Paige]

So very good argument to make. Basically the argument that they were making is that in trademark law and because there was an intellectual property provision to my contract that the two of those things tied together somewhat created a catch all where anything bearing that name crazy, they would own the property of. Right. So that was at least the argument to my knowledge, that they were kind of making at that time. And to me, you know, I'm looking at it from the perspective of, well, it's an employment contract. I was a head designer, I wasn't a social media director. Social media became a thing, Right. And I posted freely, but it's not like I was getting paid to post. Correct. You know, so there was arguments on both sides, but it really became this thing of like, hey, where's your Snapchat, your Pinterest, your TikTok, you know, and so like you can imagine, like all the hours that you pour into.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Haley Paige]

And it is an extension of who you are. You at least try to be as authentic as you can on social media for the most part.

[Chloe]

No, that is so violating.

[Haley Paige]

So luckily that video that I posted went viral.

[Chloe]

Well, I was just gonna Ask. So you then go on this other account that doesn't have a lot of followers. How does that go viral? So I, it was just, how does anything go viral? I don't really know.

[Haley Paige]

It was the public court. And I say that with so much gentle kindness because really that is what saved my entire life. Like the public court is the people showed up for me, they shared it, they told bridal stores, you know, cause I'm a B2B business mostly. So my dresses are sold to bridal stores. And you have these store owners that are like, wait, what? Like Haley's not behind the collection anymore. And wait, what? She's not behind her Instagram. And wait, wait, what? Right, so there was kind of that chain reaction and you just had this compounding community rally.

[Chloe]

Well, that's amazing. You had that. But this is like so unbelievable to me.

[Haley Paige]

It's a little banana.

[Chloe]

It's crazy.

[Haley Paige]

Yeah, it was bananas. I was not winning in the legal court. So that was scary.

[Chloe]

And that's, that's so infuriated. You're like, this is my fucking name. I was born with this name. That's horrible. So one of the biggest issues in your lawsuit was your non compete. And so what does that mean to the people that are listening? What is a non compete?

[Haley Paige]

It's essentially you agreeing to stay out of an industry for typically a designated period of time. Right. Oftentimes it comes with an exchange of money or monetary compensation. And it is a way for a business to protect oftentimes its proprietary technology or their proprietary goods. Right. And so in my situation, it's art, so it's not really proprietary. But I was put under the 2 year non compete of my contract. And then 2 like days before that non compete was up, there was another argument made that it was an extension of five years.

[Chloe]

Stop.

[Haley Paige]

Yeah. And that one wasn't so much tied to the name Haley Paige, but me, Haley Paige, the person.

[Chloe]

Which means you can't design elsewhere.

[Haley Paige]

I couldn't design using my name or design wedding dresses at all.

[Chloe]

At all.

[Haley Paige]

No matter what name I used. Right. So. And that actually stuck in the district court. So then I was under a 5 year non compete and I wasn't getting commission or paid. So it was essentially a seven year unpaid non compete.

[Chloe]

And not that in the full story, and not that this matters, but could you design different categories?

[Haley Paige]

I could.

[Chloe]

Okay.

[Haley Paige]

So that was really the pivot in my brain that made sense is like, okay, I can't design wedding dresses. I am gonna even stay away from dresses because I don't want anything to be misconstrued. At that point, I felt like I was really being watched. And I was even found in contempt of court for sketching on social media. And so that was.

[Chloe]

You've got to be kidding me.

[Haley Paige]

I was, like, in big trouble. It was a very, very scary time and.

[Chloe]

Scary time, but also, like, you must be a big threat. Do you know what I mean? Like, in a way, you're like, okay, you guys are so concerned about little old me like that. It's a little flattering now that we're past it. At the time, I'd be like, contempt of court. That sounds so scary. Like, it's all insane because you're sketching,

[Haley Paige]

sketching on social media on that other account. Right. But it was considered promotional and argued that way. And so at that point, I was like, okay, well, I'm not gonna sit for five years and have a victim consciousness. Like, that's not gonna do any good for me. And so luckily, again, this community rally was like, go design something else, you know? And so shoes were totally non competitive. Right.

[Chloe]

Right.

[Haley Paige]

I mean, I'm sure you could just wear shoes as a wedding dress, but let's not try to make that reach of an argument. But I did shoes for a while and I changed my name publicly to cheval, which is the French word for horse. And so I built a new brand around that.

[Chloe]

But your. What was your personal name?

[Haley Paige]

My. I didn't have a. I didn't. I had my legal name that I couldn't use publicly or in any business or commerce.

[Chloe]

But if I met, like, if I met you, I can be like, hi, Hayley. But you said, like, at Starbucks you couldn't say your name.

[Haley Paige]

Yeah. I would not be able to give you permission to use the name.

[Chloe]

Oh, my gosh.

[Haley Paige]

And it was. It was pretty intense because it was. The problem is, is that now that you have social branding and you have personal branding, you're technically advertising. Right?

[Chloe]

Right.

[Haley Paige]

And so if a name is a trademark and I am that person, it was just so convoluted that it was like, it's not even worth it, you know? And so for a good period of the two years, I was going by a girl you might know, because I was like, I'm just a girl you might know. Maybe not.

[Chloe]

Yeah.

[Haley Paige]

But like.

[Chloe]

No, but it's clever and cute and I love that.

[Haley Paige]

So that was vibe.

[Chloe]

What insanity. Okay, I'm sorry I interrupted you about the shoes. I'm so sorry. I'm just like, it is mind blowing.

[Haley Paige]

A little Hard to believe at times, but it also helped me that it was so unbelievable because it really did get the attention of a lot of legal people, attorneys, you know, big law firms. It got the attention of Senator Warren for, you know, come to speak at Congress, give your testimony on non competes. And so there was. To every part of my journey where there was this feeling of like an anchor. I also had a sale, and so, like, I got to choose between the two. And I was like, I'm gonna keep staying positive, just more responsively positive, you know, and not feel like this actually, this scary lawsuit is my identity. Cause that's where I think I would have really lost myself.

[Chloe]

Yeah. But I love that you've taken negatives and you've turned them into positives, and you do find the sale and everything. And what made you pick the name?

[Haley Paige]

It really was just a fun process of what name did I like. Right. And there were moments where I would just go listen to music and kind of get in a zone. And I kept going back to the song by America, which was A horse with no name. That's huge. Little bit of humor.

[Chloe]

I was gonna say this sort of just. It embodies your whole story. Yes.

[Haley Paige]

I was like, horse. And then Siobal, and I was like, oh, there's a Cheval Blanc restaurant my mentor took me to once. And I love that name. And it felt very elegant, but also strong and masculine. And, you know, like, I'm gonna make sure circumstances are not in the driver's seat from here on out and, like, run against the wind. And so I. I just liked that name and went with it.

[Chloe]

Did you ever feel like you were losing hope?

[Haley Paige]

Yes.

[Chloe]

Yeah.

[Haley Paige]

Yeah. There was definitely a lot of moments of just. You do need to sit with your grief because there's obviously something that's missing. Right. And you feel it like, that emptiness. And I always get, like, a little emotional when I think about, sorry, the bride.

[Chloe]

Don't be sorry.

[Haley Paige]

Sorry.

[Chloe]

No. But it shows how much passion and love you have for what you do. And you getting emotional for the brides. I think that's why everyone is rooting and rallying for you people, spread your story. Because it's not that you're just some designer that's doing something in autopilot and just doing it for money. You're doing it for these women. And you are a crusader. And I think the horse is so fitting because I think of you as, you know, the princess Charming, but on the white horse and coming in to save the day. And that's like, when I heard the name, that's what I thought of. I'm like, of course. This white horse, white wedding dress.

[Haley Paige]

And, yeah, it was one of those things where when you put your problem out into the world, you know that people are gonna feel the weight of it. And I just didn't want it to tarnish all these beautiful moments that these brides have had, you know, because life can really kick you, you know, gut punch you and also feel like, okay, I'm learning these lessons. It feels like a roundhouse kick to the face. But, like, I'm learning these things that I needed to know. The long, scenic route. But there was something where I just didn't want it to. The residual stress to impact those moments. Right, right. And I actually didn't experience that. I had so much support from these brides, but I also just felt like I couldn't communicate with as many of them as I wanted to on social and, like, let them know that, like, they should go buy a Haley Paige dress if they still want one.

[Chloe]

What you're showing for other people, like, okay, I made these mistakes. Don't copy what I do. But you're doing it in a way that's so relatable. And even when you go and talk in front of congress and you're doing something that's so intimidating and big, you're still doing it, but for the voice of everyone else that didn't have a voice, for the voice less. And I just think that's really big of you. And I think so much of why you are now where you are, and, like, you've gone full circle and now you're out on top is because of the spirit you have, because not everyone can do that.

[Haley Paige]

Thank you. It's been really shape shifty, you know? And like you said, when you go through things where part of you breaks, you realize it's a shedding and that there is something you can leave behind, and that's okay, because the strongest pieces are left. And that's what you take with you to rebuild. Um, and that's just something I've just kept close to the heart of. Like, you're never actually starting over, ever, because your experience, your credibility, even your mistakes have got you to where you are now, you know? And so, like, seeing the full picture. And I bet you read some Carl Yun with cosmic relevance and thinking of how, when. When you scale out and you really think about how special it is to. To be in the position you're in, to be alive and to have your faith and have Your family and have all these things, you know, you start to realize that it's just so rare. And so to get caught up in the weeds of these things that feel circumstantial at times, or feel like they're pulling you back or they're breaking parts of you, it's okay. Cause it's death to certain parts of your ego. Leave it behind. Right. And then rebuild. And.

[Chloe]

But such a beautiful mentality because not everyone has that mindset. But we do have to not let those things, let them crumble us. We have to use them and make it better and stronger. And you're right. Like even the most traumatic things, like the light, it's the shedding, the light does still come in.

[Haley Paige]

That's right.

[Chloe]

Something that I am mind blown on. So in your non compete, which this is like so stupid to me, it frustrates me. It said that you can't wear a wedding dress on your own wedding.

[Haley Paige]

So the way the non compete was phrased is it wasn't just tied to the name. Right. It was me, the human being as well. And what was scary about basically being in contempt of court for sketching online is that the argument was made about promotion. Because social media is promotion.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Haley Paige]

And so when I really thought about it in that situation. Cause my fiance and I had gotten engaged in 2018. Seven years later, we're still engaged, but we just thought about, okay, but if we were to get married, first of all, it's weird because like, does. Can he. Does he say my name? Can he say my name? Like if it's filmed. No. If they're pictures or video? No.

[Chloe]

Oh.

[Haley Paige]

And then if I was to wear a dress, would it be considered competitive?

[Chloe]

Because this is crazy.

[Haley Paige]

Right? So it wasn't really addressed in that moment during lawsuit. But it's one of those things where I was like, you know what? It's not worth it. I'm almost bankrupt here anyway. So like, let's take a beat, you know. And my fiance has been my rock this whole entire time. So he was like, let's bench this for a bit and we'll revisit it when we can, you know, or when it makes sense.

[Chloe]

So do you think you have like trauma to get married because of all of this? It's just too much.

[Haley Paige]

We, during that time definitely felt like just a lot of components that were dramatic.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Haley Paige]

And traumatic. Yeah. And I guess too, there was a big part of me that thought legally, if I was to go, like massively in debt, which I did, you know, for my legal Bills, like, why would you want to marry me? You know, like, if I have debt. You know what I mean? And so, like, I was thinking about all of those things just in that moment of time, and. And so it feels really cool that as a couple, we have grown so much, because when we first met, we were, like, very content coupley, like, bake Offs. And, oh, my gosh, we were in a different stage of life, right? And then we went through this, like, explosion of things. And so we came out of it. We went through it together and grew, but we came out very different people, but still very dedicated to each other, which is wonderful. And now that we're, like, finally planning the wedding and we're getting married and all this good stuff is happening, we have a wedding dress that we can design. Just feels like we really appreciate the shoulder to shoulder and the standing through the rain.

[Chloe]

I love that.

[Haley Paige]

So it's nice.

[Chloe]

It is nice.

[Haley Paige]

I'm definitely gonna cry all over my wedding as I go over him.

[Chloe]

As you should.

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[Chloe]

I want to hear about your journey to the Senate and, like, how crazy that is and how, like, first of all, I cannot public. I have to public speak, but I just want to die every time.

[Haley Paige]

What? You're so good at speaking. That's crazy.

[Chloe]

Oh, my gosh. I cannot handle it. Even this. I'm always, like, talking and I'm listening. Like, oh, my gosh. I'm supposed to be, like, running the show and, like, steering this, navigating it, because I get so into it and I like to actively listen. And so when I'm also doing something public speaking, I don't want to memorize.

[Haley Paige]

I was gonna say, do you like memorizing or no? No, because you never have to memorize for. For your show or for like. No.

[Chloe]

And I just. I'm such a chit chatter that I just want to chat again. Yeah. Just like, talk and hang with you. That I'm like, oh, my gosh.

[Haley Paige]

I feel like the Senate would appreciate that.

[Chloe]

Oh, my gosh, that's too scary for me. But tell me about that. Tell me about your journey there and your advocacy work.

[Haley Paige]

So Senator Warren slid into my DMs,

[Chloe]

believe it or not. Amazing.

[Haley Paige]

Which was incredible. I was like, wait, what is happening again?

[Chloe]

That is amazing.

[Haley Paige]

But yeah, she had followed the story and she watched Say yes to the dress. And so that is so cute. She's been fighting for banning non competes, the FTC and the whole shebang. And so she just said, I'd love for you to come testify and tell your story. And what was really poetic about it was that I had actually just gotten my intellectual property back in a bankruptcy court.

[Chloe]

Amazing.

[Haley Paige]

And so this was maybe a month later that I was being invited to tell the story start to finish. And I think during the lawsuit, there were parts where I just was so afraid that something I was saying would be misinterpreted or used against me in

[Chloe]

the court of law, which could be, yes, that's horrible.

[Haley Paige]

You're on the other side of it. And now I'm like, ugh. Like my shoulders went down, like, I can breathe. And I. I actually went into it very nervous as well, but with something with a bit of resolve. Because first of all, I just have to tell my story, which is the easiest thing in the world when you're just saying what happened. Right. But I also just felt this Elle woods, like, pomp and pageantry of it, that this is it, girls. Let's go, girls. Kick down the door and wear a pink suit. And so I just really went into it because I couldn't believe it. I felt God was giving me this moment to like, get up there and just say, like, here, here's what happened and here's why you need to be careful when you sign these contracts, you know? And so that's really what it meant to me. And my parents were there and Conrad came and my lawyers came. So it was like this like group moment and camaraderie.

[Chloe]

Going in together during all of this and you going through that journey and then getting your name back in the bankruptcy court, all of that. But on this way, were people, through your new social media account, were they telling you that they've been in similar situations? Like what made you start your nonprofit?

[Haley Paige]

Yes. So after we had put the problem

[Chloe]

out, isn't that what the Senate also what you were speaking, don't they sort of align?

[Haley Paige]

They do. The nonprofit is really about providing advocacy to young entrepreneurs and creators, especially during those formative years when they're likely to fall prey to one sided or predatorial contracts. Right. And they're operating with minimal resources. Luckily, we do have like chat GPT and these things that you could just Throw the contract in. Let's see what it says.

[Chloe]

Insane now, but it is.

[Haley Paige]

Lawyers still cannot be replaced. I will say Haynesboom is great. My legal team was fabulous, but really was this way to create conversation about what's going on here. Because especially in the influencer world and personal branding world, where you have these exclusivity content contracts, you sign all these perpetuities, all this name and likeness stuff, you've got AI coming into the picture now who owns what. And it. It really is complex and convoluted, and everyone is almost at a disadvantage if you're not investing and learning from it. And so our nonprofit has funding for contracts. We provide access to low bono and pro bono attorneys because a number of law firms are required to have pro bono hours served. And so many lawyers and law firms reach out to me because of the case. They're like, what's going. What's happening over here? You know, and let me help with other creators. And so we do that. And then we also just share mostly female stories, but stories of, you know, Kate Spade, Halston, Bobby Brown. I mean, I am not special in that this has happened before and it unfortunately probably will happen again. And so the best we can do is try to get ahead of it and not scare creators. Just arm them with the right. Right resources to at least start out on the right foot and not feel like they're being difficult just because they're trying to understand a contract or ask questions.

[Chloe]

I forgot about the Kate Spade one. I like remember that so vividly now.

[Haley Paige]

But the one thing I will share is that we did change case law, which is amazing.

[Chloe]

So that is amazing.

[Haley Paige]

My case. One of the things that was particularly strange was the social media element. Right?

[Chloe]

Right.

[Haley Paige]

Because like, how can it be a catch all? I was a designer. Why does a social media account have anything to do with a trademark? Right. Why didn't they just change the handle name? And so what we proved after two trips to an appellate court, so we had to do two huge appeals.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Haley Paige]

They found basic property law can be applied to a social media account. So unless the account was transferred or sold or written into a contract to transfer over, it belongs to the original holder and opener of the account.

[Chloe]

Thank goodness.

[Haley Paige]

And so I got.

[Chloe]

Congratulations.

[Haley Paige]

And then I was.

[Chloe]

So you did get your account back.

[Haley Paige]

I did. I got it back.

[Chloe]

Gosh. I'm like, at this point, screw those people. Not your account, but the people that stole. I'm like, this is crazy. I want everything back.

[Haley Paige]

But it was also so funny, cuz I had all these DMS where, like, you'll see a DM from, like, 2021, and it's like, like, I'm give her her account back, and then the next one is, like, four years later, and it's like, hi, sunshine. Oh, my gosh, I'm so glad you're back.

[Chloe]

I'm so happy you're back. The duality of it, but also just to see how everyone rallied for you. And, like, so many of them are people you don't know. And it's so incredible. Like, I. Sometimes social media can get really overwhelming, but then other. There's so much good to it as well. How did it make you feel to use your name for the first time after you won all your lawsuits and you were able to be creative and free of all of what was going on?

[Haley Paige]

It was a bit indescribable, I bet. I immediately thought of my parents, because Mimi and Jeff, you know, they felt like they had done something wrong. Right?

[Chloe]

Yes. Mimi and Jeff.

[Haley Paige]

Should we have. Yes. Should we have given them a lawyer? And I think the fact that they named me, and here I was doing something where some people were like, oh, well, you sold your name. And it's like, no, I got a job. This was a big problem that happened. Yes. I admit the mistake. I shouldn't have signed the contract. But getting the name back and feeling like I got to discover who I was without a name, I got to find out. Yes. I love that my identity is wedding dresses, but it's also so many other things.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Haley Paige]

And so I learned so much in that journey. And so now when I say my name, it comes with this just real gratitude and humility and, like, fortitude, because, like, I fought for it and got it back.

[Chloe]

And this is my name.

[Haley Paige]

Yes.

[Chloe]

But it's just crazy that this could even happen.

[Haley Paige]

It is.

[Chloe]

It is nuts to me. I keep going back there.

[Haley Paige]

You sign a contract and basically sign away your constitutional rights. And that's what people don't realize is, like, you believe as a human, you have these rights. Right. But there can be contracts where you actually sign your rights away without even knowing it or if it's interpreted a certain way.

[Chloe]

Right.

[Haley Paige]

And so it's just good to take a beat. It is as much as you want the opportunities, just to know that you're at least giving yourself a fair chance to not be in a situation like

[Chloe]

that, going through all of this. Was there anything you did for yourself? Like, what were things that you would do? Because I've gone to trial, I've done court. I've been sued, and it's horrible. Is there anything that you would do to, like, get you through your days? Did you start, like, I'm someone. I work out all the time, and it's a release for me. It's not about the scale. It's mentally. I need that release. Is there something that you did?

[Haley Paige]

You'll appreciate this because movement was far more profound in my ability to deal with my situation than manifesting.

[Chloe]

Yeah.

[Haley Paige]

Or just motivation, even. It was. Okay, I'm not feeling great. I'm gonna go on a walk. Okay. I'm gonna go for a workout. Okay. I'm gonna go jump on a trampoline.

[Chloe]

I'm happy you were able to do that, because some people get really depressed and stuck, and they just don't. Can't do anything.

[Haley Paige]

It's something I would encourage people to almost force and start small. You know, like, do 10 squats in the bathroom. And, like, notice how your physiology just changes.

[Chloe]

Yeah.

[Haley Paige]

And it's also really a good distraction of discipline because you feel productive when you're working out. And I. I'm sure you have, like, your routine. You know, you get up, you get your workout in, and you just feel like you're starting your day ahead.

[Chloe]

It sets the tone.

[Haley Paige]

It does. And, like, it is so up here. It's great for your body, but it is up here where all that. That work is actually being done.

[Chloe]

I tell people that all the time. And I know a lot of the times it's easier said than done. You don't need a trainer. You don't need a private gym. Because people are like, must be nice for you to say. I'm like, okay, well, you can go on a walk outside, especially, like, the sunlight. Or just. And like, you said, 10 squats in the bathroom. It's not even about running a marathon. Sometimes you just need to move your body a little bit and your blood flow. It's so silly and simple. Like, we don't need all these extras, but it works wonders. It's changed my life. And it's not about, like, now. I'm like, ooh, I have a tricep, which I never had 10 years ago.

[Haley Paige]

And so.

[Chloe]

And those things are sense of accomplishment for me. Cause I. It's proven my determination and dedication. So for that. But what it does for me psychologically is so much more than I've ever understood until I started living it.

[Haley Paige]

It's a total game changer.

[Chloe]

Now that you have your name back and you did have Chevelle, do you still have Chevelle?

[Haley Paige]

I do.

[Chloe]

You do, yes. And. And where do they merge? Under one fashion house.

[Haley Paige]

We are trying to figure that out right now, actually. And because you're a branding mogul, you know, oh my gosh, I can figure your brain. But it's one of those things where. Okay. Dedicated all this time to a small business. We were manufacturing the shoes. We were start to finish and it was just me and one business partner. And so it was a heavy lift.

[Chloe]

Good for you. That is interesting.

[Haley Paige]

You've done shoes because those are so hard.

[Chloe]

Shoes are so different because all the sizes, size runs.

[Haley Paige]

You're guessing.

[Chloe]

And don't tell me you're doing widths too.

[Haley Paige]

Of course.

[Chloe]

Because for wedding you have and then

[Haley Paige]

like tens, elevens, twelves, and then people want custom shoes and you're like, I, I don't even think I can do that.

[Chloe]

Are you doing the three widths?

[Haley Paige]

We are. We only did one width for a while and then we cut down to like full sizes. But like, I don't think what people realize is you have to buy your inventory.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Haley Paige]

And you're okay, how many size 8 and half am I going to sell? Well, I don't know.

[Chloe]

Like, that's why so. And people don't realize why so many people don't do half sizes or don't

[Haley Paige]

go all the way up to. Yeah, because of the, just differences in inventory.

[Chloe]

So much money too. And then storing, like there's so much. The minutiae that goes all into.

[Haley Paige]

And then people want the turnover because they want new stuff and like what

[Chloe]

I want to do with all this other shit.

[Haley Paige]

I know. But it really, I learned so much about business. Obviously it was great. But then when I got the intellectual property back and I was like, okay, well, I'm going to bridal. Like, I'm full speed ahead. Like, we're going back into bridal. I basically just gave myself permission to say, this is a small business with very dedicated, loyal customers. I don't need to be this right now. I just need to maintain so that I can go over here and get back what. What I love the most and then find a way to kind of brand them somehow. And we did do a number of shoes that feel very bridal that you can pair with the dresses. But, you know, I'm just managing it the best I can and trying to make sure that I'm giving my best effort because I do feel like I want to make up for lost time a little bit, especially in bridal. And so we've got great Shoes on the collection. And so at least right now, it's just about maintaining it and then figuring out how we can scale at some point.

[Chloe]

What part of your, like, creative identity do you. Do you find the most fulfilling? Right now?

[Haley Paige]

I still very much lead with love, which is such a cliche thing.

[Chloe]

Oh, I love that.

[Haley Paige]

But it is, like, I just love it so much, and I love that I get to do it again, and I love that people love that for me. And so it's just this loop of real security in my life of, okay, I fought it, I got it back, and here we are again, you know, Isn't that crazy? There's, like, that reunited. It feels so good. Yeah, for sure. But I. I feel like I didn't lose my whimsy through the wicked parts. And you can, like, life will beat it out of you. And if. If you just pay attention to who you really are in those moments where your identity is being tested or really circumstances are working against you and reach for what that is, even when you're in your lows, you can still hold onto that, keep that pilot light on. For me, that was creativity and creating things for women.

[Chloe]

So I think people need to hear that more than ever right now. So that's beautiful. This is silly, but what is one bridal trend that you're loving right now?

[Haley Paige]

I love a good Basque waist. At first, I was. I don't know, because sometimes with the Basque waist, so that's when you have, like, this really deep V in the front. It's very weathering heights, very, like, renaissance, very, like, pirate core. We have very designer terms over here. But I think it is super flattering on proportion, and it gives you this room to play with your hip shape and get that hourglass shape. So for me, I'm so straight up and down a bit. And I've always wanted, like, that curvy, like, beautiful, like, snatched waist. And I think the Basque is something that gives you that proportion. And I love that the tighter corsets are coming back and tighter corsets. Yes.

[Chloe]

Snatch the waist.

[Haley Paige]

So I'd say that. But color is also super fun. A lot more brides are open to color options, which I think is.

[Chloe]

What do you think the top? Like, three colors are that aren't white,

[Haley Paige]

blush, blue, and champagne.

[Chloe]

Oh, blue's interesting. I've actually never. I don't think I've seen a blue wedding dress. Yes. No. But I get. I'm like, duh. I get it.

[Haley Paige]

Like a soft powder blue. Yes.

[Chloe]

What was the fastest turnaround for A dress, a wedding dress that you've been asked to do.

[Haley Paige]

Oh, has to be my sister's.

[Chloe]

No.

[Haley Paige]

Yeah. So she had a surprise wedding.

[Chloe]

Oh, my. Who surprised her?

[Haley Paige]

Well, she surprised every group. Surprised. We're getting married.

[Chloe]

I'm like. I'm like, wait. This is, like, so crazy.

[Haley Paige]

That would be epic, actually. That would be. No, she.

[Chloe]

She surprised you guys. Got it. I'm like, that's a risky game. He's.

[Haley Paige]

Yes, she surprised all of her guests, and no one knew except me and basically my parents and the groom. But she and I.

[Chloe]

Surprise, honey.

[Haley Paige]

Both went through divorces. But the going back to it, she was like, okay, I'm getting married in two days. And so it was kind of similar

[Chloe]

to your situation because you obviously love her.

[Haley Paige]

What can you do for me? And as a designer, I actually think it's this fun challenge because you're like, okay, let's go, you know, get the scissors. Let's figure this out. And so she did pick something from the existing collection because it's really hard to whip up a full dress in two days. But we did tailor it to perfection, and she. She loves Rod Stewart. So I did, like, a hand embroidery of a Rod Stewart lyric on the inside of it.

[Chloe]

That is so cute.

[Haley Paige]

Still made it special, but it was a. That was a pretty quick turnaround.

[Chloe]

If you can design anyone's wedding dress, who would it be?

[Haley Paige]

Yours.

[Chloe]

Thank you. What would you design for me? Oh, like, do you design? Yeah. What would you design for me?

[Haley Paige]

Oh. Oh, gosh. You would look so. I mean. Okay.

[Chloe]

And that's on the spot.

[Haley Paige]

My brain. I hate spinning.

[Chloe]

No, no, no. People ask me things like, what's your favorite?

[Haley Paige]

I'm like, really love a Basque waist for you. I think we need something that's a bit more moody and structured, but, like, has, like, an architectural vibe to it, but, like, a hint of whimsy. I would want to, like, really push up the neckline, like, give that sexiness talk to me. And, like, we have to show off the triceps.

[Chloe]

Oh.

[Haley Paige]

So I.

[Chloe]

Okay.

[Haley Paige]

I would go strapless, but I want some, like, really fabulous seam work in the bodice.

[Chloe]

Love.

[Haley Paige]

And then I think this skirt, we go a little bit more dramatic, like, still structured, but I think I want to see you in, like, more of a ball gown.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Haley Paige]

Yeah. Okay. Corset back.

[Chloe]

I love corset. Here's.

[Haley Paige]

We need a veil.

[Chloe]

Turning it on, I don't know. We would feel like you're flirting with me.

[Haley Paige]

We need, like, five Lux.

[Chloe]

Sure we do. And I sort of want them all really different.

[Haley Paige]

Yes. Eclectic.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Haley Paige]

Oh, for sure. You are versatile. Have you seen you?

[Chloe]

I mean, I just wear a trash bag.

[Haley Paige]

Which we won't put you in.

[Chloe]

Okay. Sure. No, just kidding.

[Haley Paige]

You look amazing.

[Chloe]

I like to just try. Sort of anything and everything. It's just fun.

[Haley Paige]

Yeah. We gotta play dress up for you.

[Chloe]

Veil or no veil?

[Sponsor/Ad Read Voice]

Veil.

[Chloe]

Yeah, Right.

[Haley Paige]

Every time. Because it's just a moment. Anyway. So have it.

[Chloe]

I don't understand why people don't wear a veil. It's your wedding.

[Haley Paige]

It is like a nu. A. A nuisance sometimes. Like, if you're outside and it's windy and you gotta get the weight right.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Haley Paige]

But I just think it's the drama. It completes the look.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Haley Paige]

And, like, go big or go home.

[Chloe]

I love the drama.

[Haley Paige]

But you're asking. Yeah. Wedding designer.

[Chloe]

Big wedding or intimate wedding?

[Haley Paige]

Oh, gosh, both. I would say do one of each.

[Chloe]

Yeah. That's my girl. Okay. Yes. Classic dress or dramatic dress?

[Haley Paige]

Dramatic.

[Chloe]

I know that answer. That's silly.

[Haley Paige]

I can't not.

[Chloe]

Okay. Do you want a first look or an aisle reveal?

[Haley Paige]

Aisle reveal, right? Yes.

[Chloe]

And then do the, like, your fake first look photos after.

[Sponsor/Ad Read Voice]

Yes.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Haley Paige]

Skip the cocktail hour. Let your guests get to know each other, and then come into the dinner.

[Chloe]

I agree. Ah, I love the aisle reveal.

[Haley Paige]

Yeah.

[Chloe]

Destination wedding or hometown wedding?

[Haley Paige]

Destination.

[Chloe]

Really?

[Haley Paige]

Yeah. I think it is really fun to give your guests because people are gonna be flying in anyway, but to make it feel like a bit of a vacation, like a retreat. And, like, that's their gift to you or, like, their gift to you for coming to your wedding.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Haley Paige]

We're not gonna register or anything because I feel like making people travel, it's like, y.

[Chloe]

And I think that's so kind. When people press about that gift, I'm like, you just flew to Italy? No.

[Haley Paige]

Oh, we're doing Italy now. I love this. Oh, yes.

[Chloe]

We're going to Italy.

[Haley Paige]

Perfect.

[Chloe]

We're going to Italy. How's it like planning your own wedding?

[Haley Paige]

It's a bit chaotic because we're like. I'm still in transition of designing the collections. Our new collection's coming out in, like, four days.

[Chloe]

Oh, my gosh.

[Haley Paige]

And we just did the first one in Palm beach six months ago. And then I'm designing for my wedding.

[Chloe]

Right? Your personal. Yes.

[Haley Paige]

So there's a lot of overlapping layers. And I would say one thing that's great is while I do care about the details, I have so many great service professionals, like wedding planners. Sam Coma is, like, insanely cool. And Talented. And I can just be like, you've got this.

[Chloe]

So you're not a big bridezilla.

[Haley Paige]

I don't think I'll. I don't know.

[Chloe]

I was super chill about mine, but it was more bridechilla. Yeah. It was more. My mom, like, needed to have a wedding for us, one of us. And I was like, yeah, you.

[Haley Paige]

Like, I could see that happening.

[Chloe]

Knew it. I got this. She's like, I got this. And I loved that. Me thinking about napkins, or I'm like, what the. I don't even. I can't process all that. I just wanted to get married.

[Haley Paige]

Yeah.

[Chloe]

So I would have showed up anywhere. I would have done a courthouse wedding. I didn't care about that. I'm so happy I had my wedding. I love it. But I don't think I could have handled the planning. There's too many questions.

[Haley Paige]

But you're so detail oriented.

[Chloe]

I know.

[Haley Paige]

I know. You're like a little ocd, because so is my fiance. And, like, I feel like you have just a detailed brain.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Haley Paige]

And so, like, caring about that stuff just is such a good thing, you know?

[Chloe]

It is. But I think I would care too much about everything. So I was like, you know what you do you girl. What's next for you? I mean, you just told me 15 things that you're doing, so I don't think for sure. Yeah, look, I don't have time to think about this.

[Haley Paige]

We definitely need to get on our save the dates. Cause we're getting married this year. We were like, seven years, and then all of a sudden, I'm like, send out.

[Chloe]

You didn't send out your save the dates yet?

[Haley Paige]

No.

[Chloe]

Okay.

[Haley Paige]

I'm a professional, I swear. But in this moment. But no, I do feel I want to be careful, to be super mindful right now and, like, present. Because there's a part of me that has felt like I've been on the hamster wheel running and running and running for my life, you know? And then now I'm, like, rebuilding, and I want to get this back out there, and I've got this small business, and now we're getting married.

[Chloe]

And so, like, doing a lot at one time.

[Haley Paige]

Yeah. And I get nervous that I'm like, okay, am I. Am I here right now, Present. In this moment? Because a lot of times I just feel like, what's next?

[Chloe]

What's next?

[Haley Paige]

You know? So I would say, what's next is that I need to just be like, yeah, present.

[Chloe]

Yeah, I get that. Do you see yourself expanding from the bridal world into a different category. I know. Keeping shoes. Keeping bridal.

[Haley Paige]

Yes, I. I would, I would.

[Chloe]

That's amazing.

[Haley Paige]

But I would also want to take advice from people that have really learned how to brand properly. Because I think for me, I've just been really focused in the bridal world. And then when I started my small business, like, I really understood my own limitations and what I needed to learn. And it's so important to bring people into your atmosphere that are really good at what they do.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Haley Paige]

And that you can trust and that they can handle the job, you know. And like right now I have that with my bridal company. I still independently own it, but I have this amazing manufacturing, distribution, sales team with Madi Lane Bridal. And so I want that if I was to do anything else where it's like you've got this amalgamation of specialty people doing what they're good at and

[Chloe]

what they do their whole career.

[Haley Paige]

What about you? Is there an area that you've been wanting to go into? Because, I mean, you've. Your branding is so beautiful and so many different categories that are all different.

[Chloe]

Thank you.

[Haley Paige]

But is there one that is tapping you on the shoulder a little bit that you've not gone into yet?

[Chloe]

Not right now. So I turned 40 almost two years ago. I can't believe that. And I started this podcast and I didn't real and all these things, like, you know, contracts we were talking about. I started this podcast fragrance and my snack food brand cloud. They all came out at the same time, but that was never the intention. And I am just. I love each one of them. They're all so different and I love each one of them, but I don't want to just be like, okay, and now I'm gonna do this and I'm gonna do that. I really, really wanna marinate with each one. And I think that is important because I love each one. And I've never done snacks before, so I'm like, I have to really engross myself in this field because I don't know a lot about it. I go to food expos and do these things to.

[Haley Paige]

That sounds like a dream. You get to try snacks and stuff. Yes.

[Chloe]

You go around to different booths and you do things like that, but things that I've never done because I didn't have a reason to fashion. I feel like I know really, really well either from the buying side, from owning a clothing store and so the, like podcasting, I was like, what the hell am I doing here? Like, I had to learn more about it, right in season one, our format was a little different than season three because we had to try things to see what stuck and even what I like out of it. And so a lot of right now, I feel so fulfilled with everything I'm doing, but they're all babies, so I still have to watch my babies right now.

[Haley Paige]

Yes. Vertically integrate.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Haley Paige]

Yes.

[Chloe]

And so maybe in a few years, if you ask me, I'll have a different answer. But right now, I'm like, no, I'm kicking ass, trying to educate myself more about all of these different fields that I love so much. And it's exciting because not that I was ever bored with what I was doing before, but there was so much that I just know it's autopilot, and I'm like, tv, I got this. Clothing. I got this. And I'm like, so now doing different things that are newer. It is, like, this new surge of energy that I have and passion.

[Haley Paige]

Yeah. And there's, like, a tendency for people to think, especially with somebody who is so visible, you know, and just, like, has this amazing community behind her, that it's like, oh, she's going into this and hit it and quit it, you know? And it's like, no. Like, so much goes into these launches. So much goes and perfecting it. And, like, again, being OCD or very detailed, like, I can imagine you're like, you know, so, like, the care that goes into it is so important.

[Chloe]

Well, I feel like you're a lot like me because you keep talking about your audience, and I care so much about ever giving out, like, wrong information. So I do my best to realize. Sometimes I forget, like, oh, people are watching this. Like, it's not just the people in here.

[Haley Paige]

It's not just you and me.

[Chloe]

No. Like, it's so. I'm so used to this that sometimes I can forget. So I'll say, like, silly things are inappropriate, but, like, I genuinely want to believe in anything that I'm doing because I know how much that matters to the people that are rallying behind me. And I know how hard it is to make money. I know how hard people work, and I never want to take advantage of that. And so I'm always really, really thoughtful. I try to be with what I'm doing and what the messaging I'm putting out there, because I know how much it matters and how, especially in today's day, we, like, want hope and something to hold on to. I'm like, I hope I'm giving the right messaging and putting the right energy out there, because it does make a difference. And you're. I can tell you're like that too. And it's important because so many people just frivolously do things.

[Haley Paige]

That's so wonderful, Chloe. Like, it's very inspiring.

[Chloe]

Thank you.

[Haley Paige]

To hear that. And special because it. It reminds people that no matter, like where you are in your life, caring about how people receive you, you know, that's. That's the real karma. That's the real stuff.

[Chloe]

Yeah.

[Haley Paige]

That matters. That over time.

[Chloe]

Yeah.

[Haley Paige]

You know, because. Because fortune can change. But.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Haley Paige]

Who you are, like, that's something to build on.

[Chloe]

Yes. Well, thank you. I want you to remind everyone about your nonprofit and your app.

[Haley Paige]

So the. The nonprofit is called a girl you might know.

[Chloe]

Yes.

[Haley Paige]

Foundation. So with little cheeky fun playoff of that phrase. And yeah, it's a girl you might knowfoundation.org where all the information is. And then haleypage.com is the main bridal. And then I have Ms. Haley Page back, which is the Instagram. We fought hard to get crazy and so. But now I have like 100 Instagrams because I like all these other ones.

[Chloe]

Don't you wish you could, like, somehow merge them? I know.

[Haley Paige]

Cuz I don't want to fatigue my audience too.

[Chloe]

Or yourself.

[Haley Paige]

Yeah. Or that I'm like.

[Chloe]

It is exhausting. Yes. Even just going from like Instagram to Tik Tok. I'm like, oh, I can't do you. I'm a millennial. No, no, same.

[Haley Paige]

I am like, how do I tick the talk?

[Chloe]

Like, well, and because they're. They're different. It's different content, different.

[Haley Paige]

It's very raw. And I'm like, I want.

[Chloe]

No, this isn't raw.

[Haley Paige]

To be camera ready.

[Chloe]

Yes. No, we're not raw. So I. I'm not.

[Haley Paige]

Yeah, no, the heart.

[Chloe]

Yeah, the heart. But this is. I'm like, this.

[Haley Paige]

This is glam.

[Chloe]

I do not wake up like this match the.

[Haley Paige]

So yeah, it's. It's tough. But other than that, that's where they can find me in. In stores now. So bridal stores.

[Chloe]

And don't you have an app or did I make that up?

[Haley Paige]

Yeah, I do have. So I actually do have an app.

[Chloe]

Oh. I was.

[Haley Paige]

It's called Holy mattress emoji, which is a. It's a emoji app. And it was actually, I was inspired

[Chloe]

by Kim's the Kimoji. Oh my gosh.

[Haley Paige]

The holy master Emoji.

[Chloe]

I love that. That is so cute.

[Haley Paige]

But now you can like make an app like that in ChatGPT in like five minutes, and it took me, like, two years to create the vectors.

[Chloe]

No, I know, it's crazy.

[Haley Paige]

It's kind of obsolete, but. And then we do have she is Cheval, which is the brand, so.

[Chloe]

Well, you are busy. You are busy, girl. But I'm so happy for you. Everything is so positive, and that is your karma, because you deserve all the positive and all the love and all the success. And I'm so happy for you.

[Haley Paige]

Yeah.

[Chloe]

Thank you for being here, and thank you for all that you do for these young men and women, both of them. But you help so many people and letting them just feel like there's light or at least a place, place they can go to if they have questions or feel like they're struggling themselves or not getting themselves in bad situations. So thank you so, so much.