Fire Alarm: We Have to Change The Game

Summary

Knowing Faith Podcast: "Fire Alarm: We Have to Change The Game" (June 18, 2026) – Detailed Summary

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Episode Overview

Purpose & Theme:
In this special episode, host Kyle Worley sounds a “fire alarm” for the church, urging pastors, leaders, and laypeople to recognize and address the widespread biblical and theological illiteracy infiltrating Christian communities. Through the vivid metaphor of an actual fire alarm incident at home, Kyle underscores the urgency for deep discipleship and comprehensive scriptural understanding, inviting listeners to shift from passive participation to active engagement in the life and health of the church.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Fire Alarm Metaphor

• Personal Story:
  • Kyle (Host) begins with a personal anecdote about waking up to the sound of a fire alarm, caused by his daughter attempting to make buttered toast in the microwave.
  • This disorienting and urgent event is used as a metaphor for the crisis in the church regarding biblical illiteracy and discipleship.
  • Quote (Kyle, 02:45):

    "Nobody wants to wake up to a fire alarm ... But there are a few fire alarms going off in the life of the church. And the truth is, we have to change the game."

2. The Crisis: Biblical and Theological Illiteracy

• Overview:
  • Repeated studies show that many Christians lack a fundamental understanding of the Bible and core doctrines—despite regular participation in church activities.
  • The issue is not just isolated ignorance but a systemic lack of deep engagement with Scripture.
  • Quote (Kyle, 04:25):

    "Study after study is telling us the same thing. People do not know their Bible. People do not know the fundamental tenets of basic orthodox Christianity."

  • Emphasis on Practice over Knowledge:
    The episode challenges the superficial markers of faith—like familiarity with worship songs or small group attendance—if not paired with doctrinal knowledge.
    • Quote (Kyle, 04:26):

      "They may be able to sing a whole host of contemporary songs... but they do not know basic Christian doctrine."

  • Jen Wilkin's Influence:
    • Kyle references co-host Jen’s oft-repeated maxim:
      • Quote (attributed to Jen via Kyle, 04:56):

        "The heart can't love what the mind does not know..."

3. Mission: Changing the Discipleship Culture

• Goal:
  • The mission is not just to highlight the problem, but to offer concrete solutions at every level in church life.
  • The podcast and its associated resources aim to make biblical illiteracy “unignorable” and to equip leaders with practical, system-changing discipleship tools.

4. Solutions: Deep Discipleship Program & Ministry Cohort

• Deep Discipleship Program:

  • Kyle, JT, and Jen have taught this structured program in their churches for over a decade.
  • Now widely available through Lifeway, it’s designed for all church contexts, from individuals seeking depth to entire leadership teams.

• Ministry Cohort Online Course:

  • A flexible, self-paced online resource for any church leader seeking to overhaul church discipleship from the ground up (07:51-11:05).
  • The course replaces the previous in-person cohort format, making deep discipleship widely accessible.
  • Quote (Kyle, 09:09):

    "We've seen hundreds of churches come through this and never, not one time have the leaders...been able to say, 'Yeah, we have a centralized shared definition of disciple.' We will guide you through how to define this and how that definition will shape the rest..."

• Practical Questions for Leaders:

  • Kyle lays out a practical litmus test:
    • Can all leaders at your church give the same definition for 'disciple'? If not, the course is for you.
  • The course aims to:
    • Help define 'disciple' for the entire leadership
    • Shape ministry systems and structures around this definition
    • Provide homework, multimedia learning, and is suited for onboarding and team development
  • Quote (Kyle, 10:11):

    “There is an alarm going off and we have to get serious about changing the game.”

5. Call to Action

• Summer Planning:
  • Kyle suggests summer as the optimal time for leaders to reassess and plan for new discipleship initiatives before the next academic/church ministry year.
• Clear Appeal:
  • Move from “consumer” to “contributor” in church life.
  • Final Charge:
    • Quote (Kyle, 11:05):

      "You have heard the alarm, now let's respond to it. Hope you enjoy the discussion. Grace and peace."

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Memorable Quotes & Speaker Attribution

• Kyle Worley (02:45):

  "Nobody wants to wake up to a fire alarm...But there are a few fire alarms going off in the life of the church. And the truth is, we have to change the game."

• Kyle Worley (04:25):

  "People do not know their Bible. People do not know the fundamental tenets of basic orthodox Christianity."

• Kyle Worley, quoting Jen Wilkin (04:56):

  "The heart can't love what the mind does not know."

• Kyle Worley (09:09):

  “Never, not one time, have the leaders...been able to say, 'Yeah, we have a centralized shared definition of disciple.' We will guide you through how to define this and how that definition will shape the rest..."

• Kyle Worley (10:11):

  “There is an alarm going off and we have to get serious about changing the game.”

• Kyle Worley (11:05):

  "You have heard the alarm, now let's respond to it. Hope you enjoy the discussion. Grace and peace."

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Key Timestamps

• 01:55 – Opening story: The fire alarm and the urgency it represents
• 02:45 – Establishing the metaphor for church alarm
• 04:25–04:56 – Diagnosis: The problem of biblical and theological illiteracy
• 05:37 – Explanation of the Deep Discipleship curriculum
• 07:51 – Launch of the Ministry Cohort online course
• 09:09 – Litmus test: Does your church have a shared definition of 'disciple'?
• 10:11–11:05 – Call to action for church leaders; details on next steps

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Tone and Language

• Conversational and urgent
• Educational, accessible for a broad church audience
• Framing of the issue as “ours to solve”—emphasis on communal responsibility, practical steps, and hope

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Conclusion

This episode is a rallying cry for church leaders and members recognizing the “fire alarms” in their communities—a lack of biblical and theological literacy. Through story, practical diagnostics, and specific resources, the hosts offer both a sobering challenge and a path forward, inviting listeners to respond and “change the game” for the health and mission of the church.

Transcript

[A]

This episode of Knowing Faith is brought to you by Crossway, publisher of the ESV Study Bible. Designed to help you understand the Bible in a deeper way, the ESV Study Bible features a wide array of study tools, including extensive study notes, 200 full color maps, 40 full color illustrations, charts, timelines, articles and introductions, making it a valuable resource for serious readers, students and teachers of God's Word. Listen, this is me speaking now, not just the ad read. And I have to tell you, the ESV Study Bible was my first study Bible and it remains my favorite study Bible. If you're looking for a study Bible, I would start with the ESV Study Bible. You can pick up a copy of the ESV Study Bible wherever Bibles are sold or visit Crossway.org ESVStudyBible to learn how to get 30% off. Are you one of the millions of Christians searching for a path from anxiety to assurance? If so, Overflowing Peace by author and Bible teacher Tara Dew should be your next read. This verse by verse. Exploration of Psalm 23 reveals the complete, total and matchless peace only found while walking with our Good Shepherd. Perfect for personal reading, small group study, or as a gift for anyone longing for peace in turbulent times. Visit overflowingpeacebook.com to get your copy today. Prayer can often feel mysterious or like a formulaic transaction. But in the Lord's Prayer, Jesus offers something deeper, a framework that reshapes how

[B]

we think about God, ourselves, and the world around us.

[A]

At in the Word with Jen Wilkin, you'll explore the Lord's Prayer with fresh eyes and renewed purpose. Through Teaching, worship with Sandra McCracken and Reflection, you'll walk away with a deeper theology of prayer and practical tools to transform not just how you pray, but why you pray.

[B]

Bring a friend, bring your Bible, and

[A]

join Jen Wilken in the Word.

[B]

Hey everyone, this is Kyle, and today's episode is a little bit different. Let me tell you a story. A few months ago, I was napping and my daughter, my oldest daughter, was playing in the living room at the time while I was napping. And I woke up to a fire alarm going off. And I don't know if you've ever woken up to a fire alarm going off, but particularly if you have kiddos or Littles in your house, you know how disorienting it can be because you're trying to spot where's the danger at? You're trying to spot like what's going on and you want to make sure everybody's safe. And so I I wake up to this fire alarm going off, just blaring. And I look through my bedroom door and I see smoke in the kitchen. So I am deeply concerned. I run out and I run into the kitchen, and there's not. I can't see a fire, but there is smoke billowing out of the microwave.

[C]

Okay?

[B]

And the microwave hasn't shut off. It's still, like, counting down. The microwave's still on, but smoke is just coming out of the microwave. And so I run over to it and I just pop open the microwave door to, you know, get the microwave to turn off. And when I do that, there's just like a gust of black smoke. And as the smoke began to clear, I noticed that there wasn't a live fire. But in the middle of the little microwave dish, there was what looked like a black hockey puck just sitting there, something burnt to a crisp. I couldn't make out what it was. And I asked my daughter, who was in the living room at the time. I said, sweetheart, did you put something on the microwave? And she said, yeah, I wanted to make buttered toast. And so I put it in there. I said, for how long did you put it in there? She said, for five minutes. So she, in her hunger, had gone to the microwave and decided, you know what I'd like? I'd like some buttered toast. And so she put the piece of bread and some butter on top of it, set the microwave for five minutes, and then just let it run. I really commend her for her independence, and I'm glad that she felt confident enough to go make herself a snack. We had to have an important lesson about the best way to make buttered toast and the safest way to make it. Nobody wants to wake up to a fire alarm, and nobody wants to hear fire alarms. But there are a few fire alarms that are going off in the life of the church. And the truth is, we have to change the game. We have to begin to take these alarms seriously. The church has an alarm going off, and we all hear it. But there are too many people that are still ignoring it. And study after study is telling us the same thing. People do not know their Bible. People do not know the fundamental tenets of basic orthodox Christianity.

[A]

They may be able to sing a

[B]

whole host of contemporary songs. They maybe have involved in the same small group for the last 10 years, but they do not know basic Christian doctrine. In the upper room, in Jesus's discourse to the disciples on the night of his betrayal, he teaches them how they're to live in his world. And then he says, if you know these things, blessed are you if you do them. You know, as Jen often says, the heart can't love what the mind does not know. We have a problem, and the problem is biblical and theological illiteracy. And this is a significant issue. And the alarms are going off. Study after study after study is telling us the very same thing. And so much of the work that animates this show as a podcast and the resources that Jen, JT and I are building is we want to make this problem unignorable, but we don't want to just be people who are sounding the alarm and saying, oh look, there's smoke, there's smoke. Where's the fire at? We want to be first on the scene to provide resources for every layer of the life of the church to address this issue of biblical and theological illiteracy.

[D]

Are you tired of shallow discipleship in your life, the life of your church or small group? God is inviting you into deeper places. Real participation in his story, real understanding of who he is and what he has done, and a more meaningful practice of following in his ways. For the last 10 years, JT, Jen and Kyle have been teaching a program called Deep Discipleship in their local churches and they have now worked with Lifeway to make this available to everyone everywhere. Whether you're an individual looking to go deeper, a church leader looking for an accessible way to invite your small groups, classes and student ministry, or a homeschool family looking for curriculum for your high school students, go check out the Deep discipleship [e-mail] Deep Discipleship.

[C]

Have you ever wondered if God delights in women? Do you struggle to untangle the mixed messages you receive about what the Bible says about women? Then check out Very Good, a new seven session Bible study by Jen Oshman to discover the freedom, security and joy of living as a woman made in God's image. As you study passages about women from Genesis to Revelation, you'll see that God's Word tells a beautiful story about women full of dignity, purpose and delight. Come discover how very good it is to be a woman. Learn [e-mail] Very good.

[A]

What does it mean to follow Jesus when it cost everything? In May 2024, the world saw headlines out of Haiti. Davey and Natalie Lloyd and their friend Jude were killed while serving as missionaries. Three believers who gave their lives in faithful obedience to Christ. Strong to the End shares the story of their lives marked by quiet faith, steadfast trust and a love for others that endured even in danger. Written by Davey's parents, David and Elisa Lloyd, with Dean Merrill. This account invites us to trust Christ and count the cost. Let their faith strengthen yours. Order your copy of Strong to the End today, wherever you find your books.

[B]

And so you've heard us talk about this, but if you are a ministry leader who wants to be a change agent, if you want to address this issue, we have created a course, an online course that is built for leaders. Whether you're a youth minister, a Bible study teacher, you're a lay leader, you're an elder, you're a pastor, you're a deacon, your, you know, whatever range of leadership you have in the life of the church, if you go to ministry cohort.com for years we ran a cohort and we saw hundreds of churches go through it that was geared at building deep discipleship. And not just running the deep discipleship program, which you've heard us talk a lot about, but re engineering the whole culture of their churches, their camp ministries, their college ministries, their parachurch ministries to have a clear goal for deep discipleship. And the feedback was so overwhelming that we decided we have to remove the barriers of entry for people to participate. This used to be everybody would fly from around the country. They came to came to the same spot. They'd buy plane tickets and hotel reservations and rent cars. It was time away from their home churches and their families. And we just said we gotta clear all the barriers away. So what we have done is we have created an online course. It goes at your own pace. It's for you and your leadership team there on the ground. And if you go to ministrycohort.com, we want to give you the first two sessions for free. We want to give you the first two sessions. You can sample it. You fill out your email@ MinistryCohort.com, you fill out your email there, you put some contact information down and we will give you the first two sessions for free. And then after that, we want you to consider what it would look like for you and your leadership team to go through this together. We've been told that churches are beginning to use this, even with new employee onboarding, so that everybody has a shared goal together. Let me just give you one kind of litmus test if you're a leader, to kind of discern whether or not you need this. Do you think every ministry leader at your church could give you the same definition for disciple? Do you have a shared definition of disciple that is anchoring your ministries? We've seen hundreds of churches come through this and Never, not one time have the leaders that church been able to say, yeah, we have a centralized shared definition of disciple. We will guide you through how to define this and how that definition will shape the rest of how you think about building out ministry system that is built for discipleship. You'll hear from jt, you'll hear from Jen, you'll hear from me. There's homework. It is self paced and self guided. So you can do it at low cost right from your home church and wherever you're at in the organizational leadership of your ministry. I wanna encourage you to go check this out. There is an alarm going off and we have to get serious about changing the game. Summertime is the best time to get to the ledge to pan out and say how are we going to move towards this next academic year, fall and spring, with a purpose of making disciples that may be able to launch in the fall or you may use the fall to get ready to launch new initiatives, new structures, new programs, new plans at the new year. Wherever you're at, we encourage you to go check this out.

[A]

We want to give you the first

[B]

two sessions for free. Go to ministry cohort.com, we'll put this link in the show notes as well. I really hope you check check this out and get in the game with us. Move from being a consumer to being a contributor. We need people in the trenches addressing this issue with one another. You have heard the alarm, now let's respond to it. Hope you enjoy the discussion. Grace and peace.