#1120: March 15, 2006

Summary

Knowledge Fight Podcast Summary

Episode #1120: March 15, 2006
Date of Release: February 27, 2026
Hosts: Dan Friesen & Jordan Holmes

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Overview

In this episode, Dan and Jordan journey back to an Alex Jones broadcast from March 15, 2006. They dissect the day's Infowars content, juxtaposing Alex's bombast and paranoia with contemporary perspectives. The episode’s central theme revolves around the internet’s transformation of media, the emergence of social platforms like MySpace, and Alex's self-concept as a “truth-teller" rebelling against globalist media barons. They also spotlight Alex's chronic narcissism, self-mythology, and the shifting sands of his rhetoric about censorship, free speech, and online platforms.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Opening Banter & "Bright Spots" (00:59–10:41)

• Red Alert Running Gag: Begins with a playful repetition of the phrase "Red alert" involving Alex and the hosts, setting a light, parodic tone.
• Bright Spots Segment:
  • Jordan's Highlight: Excitement about the upcoming World Baseball Classic and its diversity of talent, ranging from MLB stars to local amateurs.
    • Notable Moment: Jordan likens the unpredictability of the tournament to a "Royal Rumble" with surprise standouts (03:28).
  • Dan's Highlight: Nostalgic recap of a ‘MacGyver’ episode involving bomb-diffusing plotlines and serialized backstory, leading to musings on the show's continuity and lore expansion (06:54).
    • Quote: “It did everything it needed to do, which is blow up a friend.” – Dan (08:43)
• Transition: Announcement of returning to an Alex Jones episode from the mid-2000s.

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2. Patreon "Policy Wonks" & In-Jokes (10:49–12:37)

• Shoutouts for new supporters, accompanied by recurring in-jokes—e.g., “I’m a policy wonk” and other sampled audio snippets from Alex—and musings on regional pronunciations.
• Serves as a signature, self-aware break before deeper content.

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3. Modern Politics Fatigue and State of the Union Reflection (12:40–16:33)

• Dan’s Reflections:
  • Viewing Trump’s recent "State of the Union" speech triggers disgust and a sense of political exhaustion.
  • Quote: “I’m interested in figures in the media space whose only real function is to lie to everyone, to make it impossible for us to improve anything.” – Dan (13:17)
  • Disillusionment with politics-as-spectacle and the inherent failures of current governance structures.
• Jordan’s Perspective:
  • Ironically laments that past presidents (e.g., George W. Bush) are now recast more fondly due to worsened political standards (15:06).

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4. Dissecting Alex Jones’ 2006 Infowars Content

A. Slobodan Milošević Conspiracy & Saddam’s Trial (17:08–21:14)

• Alex’s Narrative:
  • Promotes the conspiratorial notion that Milošević was murdered and that Saddam was silenced for exposing US wrongdoing.
  • Quote: “I hope they don’t kill me and then claim that I killed myself.” – Alex (17:25)
• Dan & Jordan’s Analysis:
  • Explains Alex’s distortion of facts, how bits of truth serve a predetermined narrative.
  • Highlight: “Alex just pretends the drug was found in Slobo’s system when he died, not months prior.” – Dan (18:16)
• Methodology Observation:
  • Nuanced breakdown of how Alex misleads by connecting unrelated factoids and leveraging audience ignorance.

B. Alex’s Narcissism and Old vs. New Media (21:47–26:40)

• Celebration of Internet Power:
  • Uses a Rupert Murdoch speech as a springboard to gloat about the declining relevance of newspapers and the rise of "truth-tellers" online.
  • Quote: “We are kicking their teeth in… we’re putting the boots to them.” – Alex (23:39)
• Dan and Jordan’s Take:
  • Critique Murdoch’s optimism and recognize that consumer-driven media dynamics have ultimately intensified polarization and click-chasing.
  • Jordan: “The guy who buys the Internet does something with it… the opposite of what he was saying.” (25:43)
  • Analysis of “worshipful companies” as arcane nomenclature, not secret societies.

C. MySpace, Censorship, and the Social Media Paradigm (37:22–45:25)

• Alex’s Reluctance About MySpace:
  • Claims that joining MySpace is tantamount to financial and ideological capitulation to Murdoch’s media empire.
  • Dismisses the notion of ‘free speech’ on platforms run by barons; predicts censorship for dissenters (38:16, 56:22).
  • Quote: “I’ll just be making Rupert Murdoch money and he can take it away from me anytime he wants.”
• Hosts’ Perspective:
  • Contrast to Alex’s later position on Big Tech: now, he claims loss of social accounts is a constitutional crisis, whereas in 2006, he accepted platform rules as owner prerogative.
  • Dan: “He does not actually believe that the first amendment guarantees you a right to have a Twitter account and say whatever you want on it.” (40:14)
  • Musings about the inexorable profiteering and corporate consolidation driving online culture.

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5. Alex’s Faulty Arguments & Audience Manipulation (44:18–51:57)

• Craigslist vs. Newspapers:
  • Alex equates classified ad response rates with media legitimacy (“the media is a hoax” because Craigslist produces more job applicants).
  • Dan deconstructs the flawed logic: “The number of job applicants you get from a certain source has no inherent connection to whether or not the media is a hoax.” (44:52)
• Sales, Demographics, and Media Reach:
  • Alex boasts that he gets more business from being on obscure Christian radio than from mainstream media coverage.
  • Teaches how Alex’s self-aggrandizing math ignores audience demographics, skewing scales of influence and impact.

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6. Paranoia Carousel: False Flags & Conspiratorial Expectation (52:00–55:00)

• Caller Asks About Upcoming False Flags:
  • Alex, true to form, affirms perpetual risk: “We’re in greater danger now since any time before or after 9/11.”
  • Dan notes the cyclical, unchanging nature of the Infowars rhetorical universe regardless of actual world events.

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7. Alex’s Social Media Dilemma and Publicity Stunts (55:15–57:07)

• More on MySpace:
  • Considers making an Infowars MySpace page specifically to test censorship boundaries.
  • Quote: “We are invading MySpace.” – Alex (58:58)
• Hosts Musing:
  • Speculate whether Alex could have successfully built his own social media (he did, but it failed).
  • Recall InfoWars’ attempts at social and dating platforms, now largely forgotten curiosities.

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8. Inviting a Holocaust Denier: Paul Craig Roberts Segment (59:49–62:19)

• Guest: Paul Craig Roberts (ex-VDARE editor, racist, Holocaust denier)
  • The interview is stale, but a standout moment occurs when he says:
    • Quote: “Well, at least Hitler had an agenda.” – Roberts (61:01)
  • Hosts recoil at the grotesque statement, using it as evidence of the disturbing figures Alex features and platforms.

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9. The Limits of Alex’s (Pseudo) “Colorblindness” (62:40–65:32)

• Positive Caller:
  • Praises Alex for not “baiting ethnic groups” and being non-ideological.
  • Alex deflects, claiming he resists the temptation to press hot buttons, which the hosts note is rich considering his record.
• Meta-Reflection:
  • Jordan and Dan discuss whether Alex's behavior is calculated or simply animalistic pre-programming—a kind of media “fish mind” unable to self-reflect.

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10. The Unexpected: Featuring a Women Against War/Code Pink Activist (65:41–76:19)

• Guest: Dr. Rashad Zaidan (Pharmacist from Fallujah, advocate for Iraqi women and orphans, touring with Code Pink)
  • Her message: Bring awareness to the suffering of Iraqis, especially children and women, post-invasion.
  • Alex tries to hijack the focus, equating being a US conspiracy radio host to surviving war (“We’ve been captured too…” - 68:11).
  • Host Reaction: Deeply uncomfortable with Alex’s narcissism and false equivalence, and the way he reframes Iraqi tragedy through his paranoia.
    • “Take time out of your helping orphans’ lives day to give me a little bit of props for how Americans also have it hard.” – Jordan (71:28)
  • Strange dynamic: Alex interviews a Code Pink activist while simultaneously slandering Code Pink as communist stooges elsewhere—exposing his opportunism and lack of principle.
    • “I don’t think they did anything wrong, but tactically, it was a big mistake, I think.” – Dan (74:55)
  • Retrospective sadness: Hosts muse on how unsuspecting, well-meaning advocates were used to provide a fig leaf for Alex’s radical worldview (75:34).

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11. Finale: Empire Analogies and Closing Thoughts (76:29–81:12)

• Star Wars Metaphor:
  • Alex compares the US invasion of Iraq to “Revenge of the Sith,” the Palpatine supervillain playbook.
  • Dan and Jordan find this trivializing and emblematic of Alex’s disregard for real suffering—always centering the story on himself or his audience.
• Culmination:
  • The hosts reflect on the episode’s unpredictability (“You never know what you’re going to see…”).
  • They caution against legitimizing conspiracy-mongers by treating them as standard media figures—a message underlined by historical hindsight and lessons from the episode’s surreal guest lineup.

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Notable Quotes & Timestamps

• On MacGyver’s Lore:
  • “It did everything it needed to do, which is blow up a friend.” – Dan (08:43)
• Alex’s Self-Image:
  • “We are kicking their teeth in… we’re putting the boots to them.” – Alex (23:39)
• On Modern Politics:
  • “I’m interested in how we can organize society better… and I’m sick of what this has become.” – Dan (13:17)
• Statistical Nonsense:
  • “The number of job applicants you get from a certain source has no inherent connection to whether or not the media is a hoax.” – Dan (44:52)
• Dismantling Audience Conversion Myths:
  • “He might be getting a 50% conversion rate on the total 20 listeners on that Christian shortwave station, whereas Vanity Fair has a circulation of 1.2 million…” – Dan (50:00)
• Worst “At Least”:
  • “Well, at least Hitler had an agenda.” – Paul Craig Roberts (61:01)
• Trivializing Real Suffering:
  • “We’ve been captured too. We’re controlled as well. The average American doesn’t even know what’s going on, the average American’s been mind controlled.” – Alex (68:11)
• Hosts’ Ethical Reflection:
  • “Take time out of your helping orphans lives day to give me a little bit of props for how Americans also have it hard.” – Jordan (71:28)

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Memorable Moments

• Running “Red Alert” Gag (00:04–00:09): Playful, tongue-in-cheek opening.
• Star Wars and Political Parallels (76:41): Alex’s use of sci-fi allegory for US policy, hosts’ deep skepticism.
• Code Pink Crossover (65:55–73:05): A leftist peace activist on Infowars—a surreal, revealing interaction.
• Self-Centered Empathy Fails (68:11): Alex reframes Iraqi suffering through his personal persecution complex.
• Paul Craig Roberts’ Atrocious Comparison (61:01): Shockingly poor taste and historical insight.
• Reflection on Platform Dependency (40:14): Watching Alex’s understanding of online free speech evolve with his business needs.

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Conclusion

This episode offered a window into both the stagnancy and the unpredictability of Alex Jones’ worldview circa 2006—and how many of his rhetorical tics, obsessions, and logical fallacies have persisted to the present day. Through sharp banter and deep-dive breakdowns, Dan and Jordan illustrated how Alex constructs his narratives, manipulates statistics, and opportunistically re-centers any discussion on himself, even in the face of genuine human suffering. The parade of oddball guests and unpredictable turns gives the episode an air of tragicomedy and underscores the podcast’s central thesis: don't take conspiracy-mongers at face value, and always scrutinize the arguments beneath the bluster.

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Key Segments:

• (03:28) – Baseball Royal Rumble Analogy
• (08:43) – MacGyver Lore Explosion
• (17:08) – Milošević & Saddam Conspiracies
• (23:39) – Alex Declares Victory Over Old Media
• (38:16) – MySpace and Censorship Paranoia
• (44:52) – Craigslist vs. Newspaper 'Media Hoax' Argument
• (61:01) – “At Least Hitler Had an Agenda” (Worst Take)
• (65:41) – Code Pink & Dr. Zaidan Interview
• (68:11) – Alex’s False Equivalence Narcissism
• (76:41) – Revenge of the Sith Parallels

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Transcript

[Alex Jones]

Red alert.

[Dan Friesen]

Red alert.

[Alex Jones]

Red alert. Red alert.

[Dan Friesen]

Red alert. Red alert.

[Jordan Holmes]

Red alert.

[Dan Friesen]

Red alert.

[Alex Jones]

Red alert. Knowledge Fight. Dan and Jordan. I am sweating. Knowledgebody.com. it's time to pray. I have great respect for Knowledge Fight. Knowledge Fight. I'm sick of them posing as if they're the good guys saying we are the bad guys. Knowledge My fight.

[Jordan Holmes]

Dan and Jordan.

[Alex Jones]

Knowledge Fight.

[Jordan Holmes]

Need.

[Dan Friesen]

Need money.

[Alex Jones]

Andy in Kansas. Andy. Andy, stop it. Andy in T. Andy in Kansas. It's time to pray. Andy in Kansas, you're on the air. Thanks for holding us.

[Jordan Holmes]

Hello, Alex.

[Caller]

I'm a first time caller.

[Alex Jones]

I'm a huge fan. I love your word. Knowledge Fight. Knowledge fight dot com. I love you.

[Dan Friesen]

Hey everybody, welcome back to Knowledge Fight. I'm Dan.

[Jordan Holmes]

I'm Jordan.

[Dan Friesen]

Where a couple dudes like to sit worship at the altar of Selene and talk a little bit about Alex Jones.

[Jordan Holmes]

Oh, indeed we are.

[Dan Friesen]

Dan Jordan.

[Jordan Holmes]

Dan Jordan, quick question for you.

[Dan Friesen]

What's up?

[Jordan Holmes]

What's your brain spot today, buddy?

[Dan Friesen]

I'm looking it up here and tradition tells me that since we're still in February.

[Jordan Holmes]

Oh, that's true.

[Dan Friesen]

You gotta go first.

[Jordan Holmes]

All right, well then I will go first. And my bright spot is about something that's not in February.

[Dan Friesen]

What?

[Jordan Holmes]

My bright spot is about something that is coming up shortly and that is motherfucking baseball.

[Dan Friesen]

Okay.

[Jordan Holmes]

Oh, yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

Oh.

[Jordan Holmes]

World Baseball Classic. World Baseball Classic is playing against the season. Yeah, yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

What is, what does that entail?

[Jordan Holmes]

Well, every few years, I think it's three. For whatever reason, a bunch of countries play baseball in a big tournament called the World Baseball Classic. And it's funny because there are some countries who are really, really good at baseball. And then there's like Great Britain, who is like, we're, we've never even really seen a baseball before, but they all get to play together. It's fantastic. Sure, it's fantastic to watch. Some people get really confused about the rules of the game.

[Dan Friesen]

So I'm. I'm guessing that United States. Probably pretty good.

[Jordan Holmes]

Very good. Probably going to win it.

[Dan Friesen]

Probably some Caribbean countries, tons of them. Very good, Very good.

[Jordan Holmes]

Very good.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah, that's fun. It's. It's kind of like the Olympics.

[Jordan Holmes]

It is, but for baseball. For baseball. For baseball.

[Dan Friesen]

What percentage of the people who are playing in that are also in the mlb?

[Jordan Holmes]

I would say across there's like, I don't know, maybe 24 or 32 teams, something like that. I would say maybe 47 to 60% of them are full on already major league players. If you add like people who've done a little bit of time. People who've had a cup of coffee. I'd probably say about 80. 80%? Something like that. Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

And then what do you say, that the 20% are young up and comers who are going to be in the mlb? Or are they? Here's what I'm imagining. Here's what this.

[Jordan Holmes]

Here's what. Here's what's important.

[Dan Friesen]

Okay.

[Jordan Holmes]

Is right. Okay. Imagine some people who maybe shouldn't play any sports professionally or otherwise allowed to play in this tournament.

[Dan Friesen]

Okay.

[Jordan Holmes]

That's the other 20%.

[Dan Friesen]

Okay.

[Jordan Holmes]

People who are like, you are the best beer league softball player in all of your country, and now you're hitting eighth.

[Dan Friesen]

So it's. It's. It is kind of like the Royal Rumble where there will be, like, surprise entrance.

[Jordan Holmes]

100%.

[Dan Friesen]

Really mix things up.

[Jordan Holmes]

Absolutely. There will be darlings. There will be people. Because the first. The first round is round robin, so you get to play at least a few games. And if you're watching the whole thing, you'll see somebody will be like, I am a fan of that guy, because I don't know if he can run. I don't know if he can do it. He stands very still. Great, though.

[Dan Friesen]

Nice. Yeah. Well, that sounds fun. I'm excited for you. And, you know, baseball season, people starting to play. That means that it's going to be warmer a little bit.

[Jordan Holmes]

It's gonna get warmer.

[Dan Friesen]

That's nice.

[Jordan Holmes]

Fingers crossed.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah.

[Jordan Holmes]

What's your February bright spot?

[Dan Friesen]

Well, my February bright spot is something that might have happened in February. I don't know.

[Jordan Holmes]

Okay.

[Dan Friesen]

It was back in the 80s.

[Jordan Holmes]

All right.

[Dan Friesen]

And that is an episode of MacGyver.

[Jordan Holmes]

Okay. All right.

[Dan Friesen]

I gotta tell you about this.

[Jordan Holmes]

What is about it?

[Dan Friesen]

There's no kissing.

[Jordan Holmes]

Okay.

[Dan Friesen]

But the episode ends so close to a kiss. MacGyver almost kisses a ship captain. And it's real close. It's implied. They might go on a date.

[Jordan Holmes]

That's fun.

[Dan Friesen]

Y. All right, so here's what happens. Yeah. That lady that I said MacGyver might have been on a date with because he's playing the air table hockey thing. I think that's his landlord. And she was back.

[Jordan Holmes]

All right.

[Dan Friesen]

I think she's a recurring character that is going to come up. And she's fun. She's fine. No kissing. MacGyver gets a call from his handler guy who he works for. Unclear.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

There's a bomb on a boat, and there's a guy named the Viking who has planted this bomb.

[Jordan Holmes]

All right.

[Dan Friesen]

And is brilliant. It's such a good bomb. So we got to get MacGyver out there to take care of this bomb.

[Jordan Holmes]

No other bomb diffusers have a shot against the Viking.

[Dan Friesen]

Well, hold on to your hat.

[Jordan Holmes]

All right.

[Dan Friesen]

All right. So they can't get people off this boat.

[Jordan Holmes]

Sure.

[Dan Friesen]

Because they're heading for a storm. Right. So if they put out life rafts, all those people would be dead.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right.

[Dan Friesen]

So they have to stay on the boat.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right. Bad luck. Bad luck. Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

And so they can't airlift people in or out, but they can get MacGyver in. So they're going to send MacGyver.

[Jordan Holmes]

Okay.

[Dan Friesen]

As he's showing up to get debriefed. All right. Who should he run into but his bomb defusing buddy from Vietnam. The two of them served in Nam together as bomb diffusers. Which I did not know.

[Jordan Holmes]

Did not know. That is a huge backstory upgrade.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah.

[Jordan Holmes]

Wow.

[Dan Friesen]

So on the last episode with Robert Englund, we learned that he was in the science club in college.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right.

[Dan Friesen]

And then broke up with his very serious girlfriend.

[Jordan Holmes]

That went straight to Nom.

[Dan Friesen]

No, because that episode, he went to go fuck around on a boat in Greece.

[Jordan Holmes]

Okay, fair enough.

[Dan Friesen]

But somewhere he went to Nom.

[Jordan Holmes]

Okay.

[Dan Friesen]

And was an amazing bomb diffuser guy.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right.

[Dan Friesen]

Along with his best buddy.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

Who he runs into. Okay. Going to the debriefing. They're both enlisted.

[Jordan Holmes]

All right.

[Dan Friesen]

To come onto this ship, to take care of.

[Jordan Holmes]

I'm saying that might be too many cooks in the kitchen. From what I understand, MacGyver works best alone. If anything, partners usually make him work twice as hard to account for them.

[Dan Friesen]

And they don't really last too long. This guy blows up.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah. That's.

[Dan Friesen]

He?

[Jordan Holmes]

Very. Was he wearing a red shirt?

[Dan Friesen]

No.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, but.

[Dan Friesen]

Okay, so you find out they get on the boat.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

They start looking at this bomb.

[Jordan Holmes]

Sure.

[Dan Friesen]

We find out there's two bombs, Right. So the two of them have to split up, one taking care of each bomb.

[Jordan Holmes]

Okay.

[Dan Friesen]

MacGyver's buddy gets a little bit too eager, blows up the bomb.

[Jordan Holmes]

Wow.

[Dan Friesen]

He's dead.

[Jordan Holmes]

Okay.

[Dan Friesen]

Somehow that doesn't impact the boat.

[Jordan Holmes]

I was gonna say that seems very important to the boat's continued survival, but I guess, I guess not only did you need one massive bomb to go off, but you needed two at the exact same spot right. On either side of the ship.

[Dan Friesen]

So, yeah, they're like, we contained the damage. Everything is fine.

[Jordan Holmes]

Why not?

[Dan Friesen]

But also, we lost your best friend.

[Jordan Holmes]

What are you gonna do? What are you gonna do? He blew himself up.

[Dan Friesen]

So now MacGyver's like, all right, I gotta figure out how to take care of this bomb.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

Now it's just me, I guess. And then we find out there's a third bomb.

[Jordan Holmes]

Oh, fuck.

[Dan Friesen]

So now he has to talk. The captain.

[Jordan Holmes]

Oh, no.

[Dan Friesen]

Of the boat.

[Jordan Holmes]

Oh, no.

[Dan Friesen]

Who. I forgot. There's a fourth bomb.

[Jordan Holmes]

Okay.

[Dan Friesen]

There was a warning bomb that went off at the beginning of this episode.

[Jordan Holmes]

Well, that's a polite bomb.

[Dan Friesen]

And that killed the captain of the boat.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right.

[Dan Friesen]

So the captain, who is now the captain was the deputy captain.

[Jordan Holmes]

Sure. First mate.

[Dan Friesen]

Right.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

And so she's like, in over her head.

[Jordan Holmes]

Wow.

[Dan Friesen]

But MacGyver enlists her to deal with the last remaining bomb. The two of them defuse this thing.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right.

[Dan Friesen]

They figure it all out. They save the boat. And it turns out that Viking is the bomb specialist who's at the headquarters talking them.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right.

[Dan Friesen]

He was behind it the whole time.

[Jordan Holmes]

Oh, man.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah.

[Jordan Holmes]

Woof. That's no good.

[Dan Friesen]

No, not really. It was unsatisfying.

[Jordan Holmes]

I bet. I bet somebody in the writers room was like, we're gonna have a lady ship's captain. And everybody applauded. They were like, I can't believe you're so inclusive.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Jordan Holmes]

This is the most inclusive any show has ever been. Ever.

[Dan Friesen]

But are they gonna kiss? Close.

[Jordan Holmes]

Real close. Real close.

[Dan Friesen]

I thought it was a great episode. Yeah. I thought it did everything it needed

[Jordan Holmes]

to do, which is blow up a friend.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. And expand this lore in a way that is becoming crowded fast. That is.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

We have his grandpa.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

Who's good at setting traps and all this stuff. We have that. His college days. Now we have bombs and nom.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right.

[Dan Friesen]

It's. They're not going to be able to keep all this up.

[Jordan Holmes]

I mean, he's. For a guy with as many varied skills as MacGyver, you would expect a varied background. Of course. I don't know how you could fit this much in such a short span of time.

[Dan Friesen]

No.

[Jordan Holmes]

Still a young looking guy.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. He's 35.

[Jordan Holmes]

That's all.

[Dan Friesen]

I don't really canonically. 35. Richard Dean Anderson was 35 at the point when the first season of MacGyver is being shot.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

Which is not old nor young.

[Jordan Holmes]

It's.

[Dan Friesen]

But it's also like, at that point. How old would he have been in nom. Right. Could he have gone to college?

[Jordan Holmes]

Right.

[Dan Friesen]

I don't know.

[Jordan Holmes]

I mean, you don't have to go. Wasn't part of the draft. Dodging is going to college. Is. That would keep you from being on the draft list. So he would have had to enlist himself.

[Dan Friesen]

Yes. But from what we are to understand, he graduated and then went off on that boat.

[Jordan Holmes]

Oh, right, right. Should have gone back to college. Should have gone to grad school.

[Dan Friesen]

But the boat didn't lead to. Maybe it did lead to Nom. I don't know.

[Jordan Holmes]

Did he get kidnapped in Greece and forced to go fight Nam? Was he in the Viet Cong?

[Dan Friesen]

We don't know what side he was on.

[Jordan Holmes]

See this? Oh, no.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah.

[Jordan Holmes]

Because his best friend was also. But maybe they were on the opposite side, so they kind of had a Roman going on. Just a little. Yeah, just a little.

[Dan Friesen]

I don't know. I'm so excited about the lore of this show, though. Like, the backstory is fucking blowing my mind.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

And the quality of it. I'm like, 12 episodes in, and all of them have been good. And one, the villain was ants. It's awesome. So that's my bright spot. That's good stuff, Jordan.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

Today we have an episode to go over. We're going to be talking about March 15, 2006.

[Alex Jones]

Oh, yay.

[Dan Friesen]

We're back in the past.

[Jordan Holmes]

Nice.

[Dan Friesen]

So I'll explain how we ended up here. Yeah. But first, let's take a little moment to say hello to some new wonks.

[Jordan Holmes]

Oh, that's a great idea.

[Dan Friesen]

So first, congratulations to Sarah, spelled S, E, R A, and Tanner on your wedding from Charlotte. Thank you so much. You're now a policy wonk.

[Alex Jones]

I'm a policy wonk.

[Dan Friesen]

Thank you very much. Thank you. Next, Jules makes games developer of the Outbreak story. Thank you so much. You're now a policy wonk.

[Alex Jones]

I'm a policy wonk.

[Jordan Holmes]

Thank you very much.

[Dan Friesen]

Thank you. And get this away from me. I think the computer is scary now. Thank you so much. You're now policy wonk.

[Alex Jones]

I'm a policy wonk.

[Jordan Holmes]

Thank you very much. Thank you.

[Dan Friesen]

And we got a technocrat in the mix, Jordan. So thank you so much. To Dan. Last time I let it go because I was getting caught up on episodes, but it's pronounced Anna, Whack Bear and Bowie. Sorry. Lifelong Texan here who was forced to take Texas history in junior high. Thank you so much. You are now a Democrat.

[Alex Jones]

I'm a policy wonk.

[Caller]

Four star.

[Alex Jones]

Go home to your mother and tell her you're brilliant. Someone, someone. Sodomite sent me a bucket of poop. Daddy Sharp. Jar Jar Binks has a Caribbean black accent.

[Jordan Holmes]

He's a loser.

[Alex Jones]

Little, little kitty baby. I don't want to hate black people. I renounce. Jesus Christ.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah, that's not true.

[Jordan Holmes]

Sure.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah.

[Jordan Holmes]

Works for me.

[Dan Friesen]

No, I mean, like, I'm from Missouri and there's, like, Versailles.

[Jordan Holmes]

Sure.

[Dan Friesen]

Sigh. Or for sales.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, yeah, I don't care.

[Dan Friesen]

You know, there's an X in that word. It's Beck. Sar.

[Jordan Holmes]

Here's what I was thinking. I was thinking Bowie. Nobody's ever going to call it a bowie knife. And then I was thinking, you know what? You should have just been Bowie, you know? And then I was writing out Bowie in my head and I was like, yeah, put a W in there. B, O, O, I, E. That's no good. You don't want to write that out for the rest of your life.

[Dan Friesen]

No.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, but that X, it's not fair.

[Dan Friesen]

So this week, Jordan, I made the interesting choice of watching Trump's State of the Union speech.

[Jordan Holmes]

Oh, God.

[Dan Friesen]

And for a moment, I considered the idea of doing an episode just about that. Yeah, I was pretty close. It was one of the most nakedly hostile and dictatorish displays I've seen in my life. And the spectacle of these hundreds of oh, so serious politicians just sitting by and being part of it was too much to handle.

[Jordan Holmes]

Hilarious.

[Dan Friesen]

It was grotesque.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, I bet.

[Dan Friesen]

Watching it, I had a bit of a realization that may be overdue, which is that I hate what is now politics.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

I didn't come doing this show because of an interest in politics. I didn't study political science in college, but I've learned a fair amount about the subject in the process. And I'm fucking sick of what this has become.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

I'm interested in rights and people being allowed and enabled to live the lives that they want to live. I'm interested in how we can organize society better to maximize that. And I'm interested in figures in the media space whose only real function is to lie to everyone, to make it impossible for us to improve anything. I'm interested in those things. And I think for a while I've had a belief that politics was the most disciplined and effective way to do the work of organizing society in a way that maximizes rights and people's freedoms, to make choices themselves. But watching that fucking State of the Union, I don't know if that feels accurate anymore. Maybe it was never a useful avenue for that pursuit, or maybe things have gotten worse in the past 15 years. I'm not sure and I don't care. But I know that watching that State of the Union made me certain that our structure of government does not have an effective answer for what Trump is doing. Yeah, that was fucking outrageous. Yeah, it was 10 steps past unacceptable.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

Nasty, malevolent creeps have essentially seized the power of our government and are clearly indicating to anyone who's willing to listen that they don't care about checks on their power.

[Jordan Holmes]

Nah, that doesn't sound true.

[Dan Friesen]

I can't imagine what message you're supposed to take away from this, other than we intend to stay in power no matter what.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

Fuck all of you. Obviously, any attempt to stop them from attacking other countries or rigging the economy is gonna be treated as a treasonous attack on American prosperity. Any attempt to run a fair election against them is gonna be treated as an attempted coup. It was screamed from a pulpit at people in this speech. It was horrifying.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah. You know what I was thinking? I was thinking on the walk over here. Oh, man, I wish I was w. That man, he is fucking. His legacy is so saved. Like, this guy should have gone down in history as the single worst president who lied us into a war, who's a fucking monster, a serial killer, a murderer, a horrible fucking person. Now everybody's gonna be like, he wasn't that bad.

[Dan Friesen]

It's almost impossible to rate politicians on a scale that includes this anymore.

[Jordan Holmes]

Well, I mean, it's. It is literally like the guy who did the Trail of Tears and this guy. It's hard to. It's hard to compete, you know?

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. And so when I was watching that, I realized something or something clicked over, and I. I just. I realized that whatever this is is not what. It's like, the place that it's existing in.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

Like the State of the Union, the President, Congress, all this. That is no longer what a politic is.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

It is just. This is a fucking extended, not very interesting Klan rally. Yeah. That some people are humoring. Yeah.

[Jordan Holmes]

I mean, I suppose that my entire political adult life, I felt like I was being gaslit, but now most people feel like they're being gaslit, so I don't feel as alone.

[Dan Friesen]

So.

[Jordan Holmes]

That's nice.

[Dan Friesen]

It's. It. I was. After watching it, I was like, well, we should probably talk about Alex's response to that, but I'm not quite ready to after having taken it in and. And. And sat with it.

[Jordan Holmes]

So I bet he's gonna do. I bet he's gonna do a Darth Vader impression. I know I would. I would definitely do an Emperor Palpatine impression.

[Dan Friesen]

Hey, Palpatine may come up in this episode.

[Jordan Holmes]

Hey, it is crazy.

[Dan Friesen]

So we're gonna start here. And as a familiar topic we've talked a little bit about in the past, we're talking slow bow. Okay.

[Alex Jones]

Meanwhile, they've gotten rid of Slow Milajevic because he was demanding a real trial and had been exposing how Al Qaeda works for the US government and it attacked his country. So he was unceremoniously murdered and the poison was even found in his bloodstream. And the media admits it, claims he did it himself. Sure. I hope they don't kill me and then claim that I killed myself. And they're so good at doing that. Saddam's microphone was cut after he suggests us behind bombings. That's how free his trial is. He's not allowed a defense that's out of the ap. And again, Saddam silence for fingering us in Iraq bombings we know some of them are.

[Dan Friesen]

So this is a great example of Alex reporting pieces of disconnected information in order to promote a larger false narrative. As we've discussed, Slobodan Milosevic's blood sample from two months prior to his death did have traces of a drug in it that could make his hypertension medications less effective. In theory, if he died from a heart attack when this drug was in his system, you could speculate that the drug played a role in making that heart attack more likely.

[Jordan Holmes]

Sure.

[Dan Friesen]

Alex needs to present the image that Slobo was murdered for standing up to the globalists. So the conclusion comes before the evidence. And all information needs to conform to propping up the story that will be told to make the charade work. Alex just pretends that the drug was found in Slobo's system when he died, not months prior. He pretends that this was definitely the cause of death and not a possible non sequitur. Because he's a lazy liar.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right.

[Dan Friesen]

Alex relies on his audience not paying attention or knowing much about the stories he rambles about. Because if they focused and did their own research, as he so often begs them to do, they would start to notice that he does this all the time. Little pieces of accurate information are distorted and misused to make unfounded points and they become load bearing pieces of propping up these outlandish theories. And I think if you pay attention, you notice that over and over and over again. Yeah, as for that part about Saddam Hussein's trial, they didn't shut off his mic after he said that the US is involved in bombings. He was ranting about still being the president of Iraq and trying to rally the Iraqi people to unite against the American invader. So the Iraqi judge transferred the hearing into a private chamber where the press wasn't allowed in. This was a common occurrence during Saddam's trial, he was pretty regularly yelling at judges, giving long, angry speeches, and having his mic cut off. When people are super guilty, they usually recognize that their only option at trial is to try to derail the proceedings and pretend that they're putting the system on trial. Much like Alex did himself in the Sandy Hook case.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, yeah. He is a.

[Dan Friesen]

He knows the behavior.

[Jordan Holmes]

He is a lot like Saddam.

[Dan Friesen]

They have some PR similarities.

[Jordan Holmes]

I mean, it, it is hard not to like. Okay. In, in this era of, of AJ's career, if you're an infowarrior, it makes more sense, I guess, period, to be an infowarrior, but maybe not. But in terms of like Slobodan Milosevic, evil guy should be. Is connected to a bunch of evil other guys, some of whom are what you would consider in the regular world. Right. Of non super evil kill guys. So he should kind of know something about somebody who maybe should want to eliminate him. That makes sense. Right?

[Dan Friesen]

You can easily conceive of him as a loose end.

[Jordan Holmes]

Totally. Yeah, that makes sense. But he was already there for so long.

[Dan Friesen]

True.

[Jordan Holmes]

He was already there for so long. You want to get rid of that guy pretty quick. If you're trying to get rid of a guy.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah.

[Jordan Holmes]

You're not going to be like, oh, well, let's just see what he says for four years or whatever.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. You know, you're either really, really playing it.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

Or you're engaged in one of the silliest negotiations of all time. Like, maybe he won't say anything.

[Jordan Holmes]

I don't know. I don't know. We'll see.

[Dan Friesen]

I've got Patrick Burns talking to him in jail.

[Jordan Holmes]

Let's give him another go. Let's give him another shot.

[Dan Friesen]

It's, it's, it's nonsense. But you can see where the kernels of like, I get how you take the first step.

[Jordan Holmes]

Totally.

[Dan Friesen]

The second, third, fourth, where it's like, absolutely.

[Jordan Holmes]

And if they were gonna, if they were going to do it, you shouldn't have evidence. That should be. Your evidence is like, oh, it didn't. There was no evidence of foul play. See, that's how good these guys. That's the level we're at.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. You really think that blood sample would get lost?

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah. Right. Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

They're capable of all of this shit.

[Jordan Holmes]

Exactly.

[Dan Friesen]

But Alex, a lot of the beginning of this episode I found a little bit tiresome, and that's because he's talking a lot about, like, how popular he is.

[Alex Jones]

Internet means end for media Barons. Says Rupert Murdoch magnet. Hail second great age of Discovery power moving from the old elite to the bloggers. Rupert Murdoch last night sounded the death knell for the era of the media baron. Comparing today's Internet pioneers with explorers such as Christopher Columbus and John Cabot and hailing the arrival of a second great age of discovery. I'm going to get into that. And of course we hailed this several years ago with articles we wrote. I mean when I could start a website in a few months have it be bigger than say the Austin American Statesman one hundred and something year old newspapers website, when I can have websites that now rival the size of the Dallas Morning News and I don't have near the biggest freedom websites, truth telling websites, whatever you want to call them. There are just hundreds and hundreds of gigantic ones bigger than most major newspapers. And these delusional papers are all arrogant and they're aggressive and they've got all these simpering writers who are on power trips and they're a joke. They're a joke. I mean an email we post gets conservatively 5, 10 times the readership of say a letter to the editor in the Dallas Morning News or a hundred times some pathetic letter to the editor in that joke rag, the Austin Chronicle, that nothing. You know, people want reality. They want to hear the truth. They, they already know the truth in their guts it's terrorists run this government. But let me tell you something, we're not out of the woods yet and they're playing possum right now. And all I'm going to break down Internet 2 what they're really planning. And don't worry, they're not about to give up their power without a fight. And if a bombs need to be involved, they will be. Oh yes. Oh yes.

[Jordan Holmes]

Oh yes.

[Alex Jones]

So we'll go over this a little bit, but we are kicking their teeth and we're knocking their teeth out. We're pounding their eyes into their skulls, we're stomping their heads, we're putting the boots to them.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah, A bombs. Cool. So this is a great encapsulation of Alex's sense of what he's doing. He's part of the truth telling media. But. But that media is also super popular because it's telling you what you know in your gut. The truth of what feels right, what you think must be right is far more true than someone reporting about an event that's actually happening. They're trying to lie to you with facts and statistics whereas Alex is telling you the truth through vibes. And this is dumb. Wow. The headline that Alex bases this little riff on is actually, it's a little confusing, but it was just Rupert Murdoch giving a speech at the annual livery lecture at the Worshipful Company of Stationers and Newspaper Makers in London, mostly about how the Internet was transforming media from a business that created a thing for consumers to a thing that catered to consumers demands. Sure. This is mostly discussed in terms of the pivot from newspapers that were primarily print to news outlets that focused a lot on online articles and apps. It comes off as a reassuring speech meant to argue that high quality content will always win the day and that the existing media companies should rise to the challenge that the Internet presents. With hindsight, I read this speech as a deludedly optimistic view. The dynamic that Murdoch is talking about, where the power and influence in the media is held not by the reporters or editors, but by the whims of the consumer, is basically what we're living in now. Media companies, both old and new, have made themselves slaves to the clicks and artificial traffic that social media appears to provide. And in the process, they've allowed a small number of lunatic consumers to have outsized influence on what the rest of us has to live with as our prevailing culture.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yep, pretty much exactly that.

[Dan Friesen]

And that's the opposite of what I think Rupert Murdoch was hoping for in that speech.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, I mean, you know, the. It's tough not to say that when the guy who buys the Internet does something with it. That's the opposite of what he was saying when he was talking about the Internet. I think he kind of knew what

[Dan Friesen]

was up maybe, you know, I don't

[Jordan Holmes]

know, like, he bought a big chunk of the Internet. Did, you know, and then he was like, I can do the pie in the sky thing or I can get your money.

[Dan Friesen]

Mm. Well, I think the goal was to get the money right. And I think the goal was to, like, you know, maximize this new industry in the same way that, like, okay, TV exists now.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

We got to make more money off that than radio. Yeah. Internet exists now. We got to make more money off that than tv.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yep.

[Dan Friesen]

But I think it went bad. I think it went south. I think the dynamics that exist now are not necessarily the ones they wanted.

[Jordan Holmes]

Probably not.

[Dan Friesen]

But it's where profit chasing drives them.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, I, you know, you wonder if it is just like, this is the end of profit chasing and we will have to, as a. As a people, like, decide not to chase the maximum profits. Like, we will have to decide to do that because it seems like this is a function of the system.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. Yep. Yep. Probably.

[Jordan Holmes]

Probably.

[Dan Friesen]

So the organization that, that, that he's speaking at.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

Is this worshipful? Worshipful Stationers, Yeah. And Alex gets hung up on that

[Alex Jones]

media magnet. Nurtures a long held distaste for the establishment. This is such propaganda. But last night confided to one of the few clubs to which he does belong. The Worshipful Company of Stationers and Newspaper Makers. That's actually what it's called, a Masonic title. That he may be among the last of a dying breed. They're worshipful.

[Dan Friesen]

You see, Almost all of the livery companies that exist as trade organizations and guilds in the UK are called worshipful companies. It's an old term that means that they're the best people for the job going back to the late 1300s.

[Jordan Holmes]

They are full. They are worthy of worship.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

It's a weird word to just stumble across in a news story that you're reading. But Alex pretends to be like an expert on the British economic history that the globalists grew out of. So that response seems kind of strange.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah. I mean, in one way you can look at it as a word that signifies that you're in a Masonic Temple. Or in another way you could say that it's exactly like a big sign that says, we have the best pizza.

[Dan Friesen]

So worshipful pizza.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah. I mean, it's basically the same thing.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. The list of worshipful companies is kind of funny because some of them are so fucking specific. Like the Worshipful Company of Needle Makers. Like what?

[Jordan Holmes]

I like it.

[Dan Friesen]

The Worshipful Company of Playing Card.

[Jordan Holmes]

We make the best fucking playing cards. And I don't want anybody coming at me about these other fucking playing cards.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. If it's not signed off on by the worshipful geek, then it's not a playing card.

[Jordan Holmes]

Your playing cards have naked ladies on them. Not worshipful guild material.

[Dan Friesen]

No.

[Jordan Holmes]

Get the fuck out of here.

[Dan Friesen]

So a lot of this interview or this article, this speech that Rupert Murdoch gave. Sure. It has to do with him having bought MySpace.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right.

[Dan Friesen]

And Alex seems to not really recognize that.

[Alex Jones]

I mean, that's all this is. They've been caught. They've been caught lying. They've been caught being on government payroll. They've been caught shelling out America. They've been caught taking billions in Pentagon and government money to put billions to put out lies. Not liberal lies, not conservative lies. World government empire lies. And they tried to give us fake left right paradigms and get us, oh, Rush is real, or oh, Al Franken's real, or these Democrats will save us. And they try to give me these two false Choices owned by the same companies. And it just hasn't worked. People are very discerning, the larger and larger minority. And it will become a majority soon. Has, has developed taste buds, has developed a palate, has developed a nose, has developed an ear, has developed a touch, has developed a sense, name five voices. I don't even have to defend myself when big major publications attack me or when low level cointelpro operatives on the web attack me because people know, they recognize it, they see it. You instinctively know now it's very exciting. And so they're trying to run around and, and they're trying to put a good face on it. They're trying to claim that they've had some victory through their defeat. I mean, Fox is, you know, had, quote, the biggest ratings of cable TV. A few million people at 3 million tops on their biggest show. I mean, old line talk radio makes that look puny. Their media is all fractured. They're trying to supply all the different niches, all the different niches that are out there. And they can't do that. They can't supply thousands of different viewpoints and niches and they have to constantly try to lie and cover up their whole lives. And no matter how good looking the info babes are, no matter how they look at you with sexual desire for the television tube, I mean, how dumb are you folks? Some of you out there, you know, you like Fox News because the info babe sits there, Lori Dew, smiling at you and winking at you, you know, as if she's a real woman there five feet from you who really desires you. It ain't real. It's television. See, it's all Megyn Kelly wants to fuck me. And most people are getting wise to that. They don't want something that's false. They don't want a facsimile. They don't want something that isn't even a prosthesis, something that's just a fraud. People don't want plastic fruit, folks. They want a real apple, a real orange. They want real grapes. And you're going to get that right here. We're going to fill your belly up full of the truth. Full of good information. And it feels good and it tastes good and you know it's real. And you know once you've tasted the truth, you know what they're giving you is a big fat lie. You ate it and it was good. You tasted it, it was good. What they're giving you isn't good. Oh, now I want to get into what their plans are to try to shut us down. What their plans are to try to stop us.

[Dan Friesen]

So eventually there's gonna be a shooting at a school, and then they're gonna sue me over.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right? Like, it is. It is hard to listen to that and not go like, yeah, man, that's what you used to be. That's. That's the rhythm of it. That's the fucking. That is the reason that you got to be the shit pile that you are today is because you used to be able to pull that out.

[Dan Friesen]

Right. You know, and, like, I think that that was exhausting in a way, but it also, like, it wasn't transparently, like, annoying how much that was just about himself.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

That was all just talking about how I'm the only real thing in a sea of fakers, 100%, you know, like. But it's still, like, you could kind of listen to it without to being like, this is a man having a narcissistic fit.

[Jordan Holmes]

No, it's utter, complete nonsense that is propped up by repetition over and over and over again. And then at the end, he's like, we're going to feed you. And you're like, I guess that's fine. And then you move on with your day. That's what he used to be able to do.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. So I'm listening to it, though, and I had read the Rupert Murdoch speech, so I was confused a little bit. Like, why isn't he. Why is he not really getting what the point is because he didn't read the speech? I'm not sure.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right.

[Dan Friesen]

I don't know. But, like, the point of this, if you're Alex and you're a conspiracy theorist, should be the part about MySpace.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right.

[Dan Friesen]

I'm going to read to you here a little bit from his speech. Okay. Quote, the Internet was crucial to that astonishing development, and I'm sure that the web will continue its rapid development as the prime media channel for information, entertainment, business and social contact. One of the reasons I say that is the success of a company we bought last year called MySpace.com. this is a networking site in which millions of people, aged mainly between 16 and 34, talk online to each other about music, film, dating, travel, whatever interests them. They share pictures, videos, and blogs, forming virtual communities. Since launch last just two years ago, the site has acquired 60 million registered users, 35 million of whom are regular users. This is a generation now popularly referred to as the MySpace generation, talking to itself in a world without frontiers. It's just one example of how the media, with its ability to reach millions with information Entertainment and education can use the achievements of technology to create better and more interesting lives for a great many people.

[Jordan Holmes]

Hmm.

[Dan Friesen]

The speech is really Murdoch discussing a new ownership model of the media in the Internet age, where the barons still own these hubs like MySpace and it plays into a larger existing paradigm. He says, quote, caxton's printing press marked a revolution that is with us 500 years later. But the history of that revolution is not one in which the new wipes out the old. Radio didn't destroy newspapers, television didn't destroy radio, and neither eliminated the printing of books.

[Jordan Holmes]

And Internet has destroyed all. All because part of one.

[Dan Friesen]

Well, whatever you think of Hollywood, the film industry is very much alive. Each wave of new technology in our industry forced an improvement in the old. Each new medium forced its predecessor to become more creative and more relevant to the consumer. So your take on it was a little different than his?

[Jordan Holmes]

A little bit different. A little bit different.

[Dan Friesen]

This will eat everything.

[Jordan Holmes]

All of you will just provide content for fake machines to. To think that they're real. That's it. You're nothing. Oh, boy.

[Dan Friesen]

Thank you, Murdoch.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

So on the surface, this might look like a speech and the headline might make you think that it's Murdoch saying that there's a new media that's gonna replace media Barons, but it's really just about him trying to encourage the existing structure to embrace things like MySpace, own them and use them as part of the larger model. It's fascinating to me that Alex could be reading this article and he's covering it. Not like that. Yeah, that's the. Yeah, that.

[Jordan Holmes]

Because the. The take that we's. The take that he's expressing is, you guys better own this shit now, otherwise it's going to own itself and then it'll own us. Right.

[Dan Friesen]

Well, the take that he's having so much on this episode is about, like. Yeah, that's right. We're eating your lunch. I mean, they're tapping on you.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, Murdoch's. Murdoch's idea is, you guys better buy in now, otherwise it's. You're not going to be barren anymore.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, these tools are, you know, the next wave.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right.

[Dan Friesen]

Whatever this thing is, we should own

[Jordan Holmes]

these platforms, which Alex should be like, this is literally the globalist trying to buy up all of our communications.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. And I don't know if he eventually comes to that, like, point, but that is not how he's covering the story through, like, his coverage of the headline.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

I thought that was really strange.

[Jordan Holmes]

That one seems pretty much down the down the pipe. Yeah, to use a baseball analogy.

[Dan Friesen]

And it even, even takes him quite a while to get to like, even bringing up MySpace. Yeah. Which he. Which he does and he doesn't. He's not on there. All right.

[Alex Jones]

Rupert Murdoch bought MySpace. 40 million. It was 38 million a few months ago. Now it's 40 million members. I'm not saying there isn't a lot of cool stuff on there and you guys don't have nice web pages and gee, it's a lot of fun to be part of this big community. The point is, they'll erase your blog if they don't like it. The point is they. You don't own all the stuff you put up there. The point is, is that it's like Internet 2. It has automatic censoring systems that go in and erase keywords. The point is, is that they're trying to contain it. And sure, it's big and it's fun, but it leads into stagnation and destruction. I mean, I've been wrestling with the fact that people keep asking me to get a MySpace blog and sure, we can do that, but just so I can send Rupert Murdoch money and just so Rupert Murdoch can take it away from me anytime he wants. We'll be right back.

[Dan Friesen]

So in 2006, Alex doesn't want to get on MySpace because he understands that him having a page there would be making Rupert Murdoch money and he doesn't want to have to be bound by the terms of service of the website.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right.

[Dan Friesen]

If Murdoch took down his blog, that wasn't an attack on free speech that the president needs to address. That was just Alex not behaving in a way that was consistent with how the owner of the site required customers to act. Well, that's changed a lot.

[Jordan Holmes]

It has changed quite a bit.

[Dan Friesen]

Weird.

[Jordan Holmes]

I mean, it changed in the 10 years since then. So it changed in 2016, but then it changed again in the 10 years since then. It's. It's a crazy up and down world.

[Dan Friesen]

We live in, the lot of evolution.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, it happened real quick too. 20 years isn't that long.

[Dan Friesen]

I have zero problem with giving up on the I would be making Murdoch money angle, because even if we pretend that mattered, Alex would be perfectly fine with his Twitter account making Elon money now. Absolutely. But him understanding that having your blog posted on a website isn't guaranteed by the First Amendment represents a very serious shift. And I think I understand generally what's going on.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

In 2006, Alex was still pretty heavily a radio guy. He's never Been on as many stations as he claims, but he was more widely syndicated at this point, so he didn't have to rely on social media and desperate attention jacking to get an audience. He had a job, and adding a blog would be a nice way to reach people and get the information out, but it wouldn't make or break his gold and water filter revenues. Somewhere along the line, radio became a much less lucrative market to be in, and corporate consolidation started to limit the number of stations he could even be considered for. So Alex over relied on the Internet. That had some upsides, like how he created PrisonPlanet TV, which was making live Internet broadcasts a bit ahead of the curve. But it also had major downsides, like how clearly addicted he is to using social media to promote his bullshit.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right, right, right.

[Dan Friesen]

He does not actually believe that the first amendment guarantees you a right to have a Twitter account and say whatever you want on it. That's just the position he's adopted. So he doesn't have to admit that he's just personally and professionally desperate to not be kicked off again. If all of the cancel culture bullshit we've dealt with in the past years, if all that came from a sincere place, then Alex wouldn't be so dismissive of the idea that Rupert Murdoch can just take down blogs that he doesn't like on MySpace. That would be a violation of the Constitution, not just a choice that makes Alex not want to be on MySpace.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, it is. It's very much like now I have an opinion on the capital gains tax of. Of that kind of thing. Like, I used to think something very different, but now I think something very different. No change in my lifestyle, except for I might owe money this time.

[Dan Friesen]

I now have capital gains.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, exactly. Now suddenly I am worried that they will be taken from me.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. Alex knows, and it's not the case in 2006, he knows now that like, without that shit, no one. No one's coming around. No, I don't think.

[Jordan Holmes]

No.

[Dan Friesen]

Can't promote anywhere.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, man, that is. It's so tough to. It's so tough because in 2006, you know, you see, like, Murdoch is buying MySpace. But it doesn't have to be. It doesn't. That's not the whole Internet, man. Like, it didn't have to be like that. It didn't have to be like what it became. And it's. It feels like that's the echo of every new media. What they're describing is the other side of it. Every echo is these people made this space where they can't get us anymore. You know, this free open space, like when podcasting started, it's this free open space where we're allowed to do everything, and then slowly those rich fucks own it all. They just. But we. We, like, if we had really buckled down, circled the wagons and been like, no, no, maybe we could have pulled it out.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah, I wonder. I wonder about that. Yeah, too. I wonder if that is possible. I think that, you know, in as much as there's something that, you know, you look back at 2006 and you're like, well, Alex is onto something. There is the, like. Yeah. Ushering people onto these platforms and that being your whole Internet existence.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

Like, they didn't do the other thing that Alex was talking about, which is destroying the rest of the Internet. The rest of the Internet exists. It's just that everyone congregates on these things. So you worry that no one will see your shit unless you put it there.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right.

[Dan Friesen]

And that keeps you emotionally trapped there.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

And that's what Alex is talking about. Except the. The. The part where he's wrong is the. This is the only option.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

It's self capture.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, he's. He's describing a, you know, addiction.

[Dan Friesen]

He's describing his own pathology.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right, right. Exactly. Yes, yes.

[Dan Friesen]

So Alex talks about how the classified ads don't work anymore.

[Alex Jones]

Apparently just in the few minutes we've got left in this short segment. Let me get back into what's happening. The old line media is dying. Here's just a local example. We put an ad in the Chronicle, local paper for job applicants to. For a new position that we've already filled here at Infowars, and we got about 10 responses, bad responses at that. We put a free ad on Craigslist and got over 200 by the time we shut it off. And after a few days, we took it down because it was so ridiculous. And these were good responses locally in Austin. See, But. But there's the Chronicle with all these arrogant people working there and all this money they make. Oh, the old library still makes all the money, but. But it's a hoax. It's a hoax. The Statesman. We put ads in the Statesman before. You might get 30 responses, but you do something on the Web, hundreds. Again, the old line media is a hoax.

[Dan Friesen]

So the argument Alex is trying to make can be diagrammed like this. Premise one, if I get more job applicants through using Craigslist than through the newspaper, then the media is a hoax.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yes.

[Dan Friesen]

Premise two, I have gotten More job applicants through Craigslist than through newspapers.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right, Right.

[Dan Friesen]

Conclusion. Therefore the media is a hoax.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yep.

[Dan Friesen]

Logically, this is all valid. The premises are set up in a way that if they're true, then there's no way for that conclusion to be false. And this dynamic is one of the ways that Alex's audience, they just subconsciously end up thinking he's making more sense than he actually is.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

The first premise in his argument is fundamentally flawed. So although this argument can be valid, it can never be sound. It's not possible for the first premise to be true because the number of job applicants you get from a certain source has no inherent connection to whether or not the media is a hoax. When you hear an argument like this, it's a good idea to search for unspoken or implied premises. Sometimes the person making the argument is trying to hide something about what they're arguing, but sometimes they're just lazy and bad at thinking, so they come up with dumb shit like this. I highlighted this example because there's at least one very obvious hidden premise that Alex isn't saying. That he needs for this argument to make sense.

[Jordan Holmes]

Sense.

[Dan Friesen]

He needs to have a premise included that illustrates how getting more job applicants makes something a hoax. Ideally a premise that defines what it even means for something to be a hoax. Yeah. Once you start to tease that question out, it begins to look like the hoax is that the media pretends more people are reading the newspaper, whereas more people actually respond to Craigslist ads. Sure. The hoax is about audience size and that's implied, but not included in his argument.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right.

[Dan Friesen]

So it appears that what Alex is saying is that he's gotten more job applicants from Craigslist than through the classified ads in the newspaper. So he's concluded that the newspapers are far less influential than they claim to be. But immediately it becomes clear how dumb that argument is once you realize that premise is included. Newspapers don't exist solely to post job openings, whereas the vast majority of people who are going to Craigslist are going there for that reason.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

If newspapers were just help wanted ads and Craigslist did more that more effectively, then Alex's argument starts to hold up. But Craigslist didn't do journalism.

[Jordan Holmes]

There is that. Yeah, well, I mean, there's journalism that you could find on Craigslist, but I don't think it's quite.

[Dan Friesen]

Some people wrote some things.

[Jordan Holmes]

I don't think it's the stories that you'd want to. You'd want to hear.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. So I think that when you're analyzing some of these arguments, it's important to fill in some of the blanks that are intentionally being left out because they oftentimes help you realize how kind of stupid this is.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah. I mean, to. To. It's generous to even go along with them to the point where you can parse that the hoax is the media trying to claim a larger readership. Because when you just say the media is a hoax, that is, I mean, a blanket statement of, like, you just can't trust anything they say simply because of job applicants.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah.

[Jordan Holmes]

You know, that's a broad, sweeping statement. So it's like, oh, well, now you can't trust this person saying this thing because I didn't get more than four job applicants from this classified ad. And that makes sense.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah, it's. It's on. It's when you just hear it.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

It can flow by.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

But if you stop for even a second, you're like, only an idiot would say that. Yep. And he's an idiot.

[Jordan Holmes]

I mean, imagine an SAT question that's like, classified ad is to media as fucking responders are to hoax. You'd be like, there's no way for me to have figured that out. Zero.

[Dan Friesen]

You fail then.

[Jordan Holmes]

Zero possible way for me to have figured that out.

[Dan Friesen]

So Alex, he has some interesting ideas about how statistics work. And this continues from that last thought, sort of.

[Alex Jones]

And people all stupid fetch and, oh, get so excited. People send me stuff. Oh, you were in the Washington Post, Alex. Oh, you were in the New York Times. Oh, you were, you know, in Vanity Fair. Oh, don't you feel big? And I'm like, no, I don't feel big. Nobody reads that. My website gets plugged at Vanity Fair three times and I get a few emails and that's about it. But I go on some little local Christian radio talk show in Florida or Alabama or Tennessee, and we get 50 video orders and tens of thousands of visitors to the website. Because let me tell you something, mainstream media people don't trust you and they don't like you. And I don't think you realize just how much we don't like you and just how much we don't trust you.

[Dan Friesen]

The fact that Alex's store gets more sales from him being on a Christian shortwave show than him being in Vanity Fair, that doesn't illustrate that the public hates outlets like Vanity Fair. It tends to suggest that people who read things like Vanity Fair aren't interested in what Alex is selling, whereas Christian shortwave audiences are. Seems pretty obvious the game Alex is playing here. Is he's trying to pretend that all audience reactions are starting from a neutral base just to make up numbers. He believes that if he goes on any show, 5% of the people watching will go buy something from the store.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yes.

[Dan Friesen]

So if he goes on a Christian short wave show and he gets 10 sales but only gets 2 after being featured in Vanity Fair, the only explanation you can come up with with is that Christian shortwave stations have five times the audience of Vanity Fair.

[Jordan Holmes]

Makes perfect sense to me.

[Dan Friesen]

That's where the people are.

[Jordan Holmes]

That's the math.

[Dan Friesen]

They hate the media.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right, right, right, right.

[Dan Friesen]

In reality, he might be getting a 50% conversion rate on the total 20 listeners on that Christian shortwave station, whereas Vanity Fair has a circulation of 1.2 million copies per issue back in 2006. So his two sales would be about a 1 1,000th of a percent conversion. Yeah, he, he doesn't take any of this like it. I don't know if it's intentional.

[Jordan Holmes]

That is, that is the question. Because it seems far too obvious to a guy who is really obsessed with Internet traffic at this time, especially to not understand the demographic difference of the audience being so important towards actually converting into sales.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah, right.

[Jordan Holmes]

He knows that.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. He's, he's made an entire career off exploiting that.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right, right. So. So for this monologue to make sense, he would have to suddenly have forgotten all sales information that he has ever known, the most important thing to him in order to go on this rant.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah.

[Jordan Holmes]

Or he's lying about it and it seems easier than making sense.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. Well, I think the two options that come to me are that he's like lying to hide like his true markety intentions.

[Jordan Holmes]

Sure.

[Dan Friesen]

Or like he just. This is what feels good to him. Like, I mean, yeah, there's a way that this isn't lying.

[Jordan Holmes]

I bet it feels good.

[Dan Friesen]

Soothing.

[Jordan Holmes]

I bet it feels great to the audience too, for them to be like, yeah, you're right. The Christian shortwave stadium group is huge.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah.

[Jordan Holmes]

That's who we are. We're not like those tiny little Vanity Fair people.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. The larger and the broader the audience you get, the lower the percentage of those people are interested in your crazy bullshit. When you have tiny self selected groups of people who are very, very similar to you.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

They are going to respond at a higher rate. Yes.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, that's, that's how it works. You got it.

[Dan Friesen]

Come on, Alex.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, but it feels better to be part of like the movement instead of just we're the 20 creepy people who listen on this short wave stadium that he's in Florida. Yeah. That he's referencing.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. So a caller asks Alex if false flags are coming.

[Jordan Holmes]

Oh boy howdy.

[Dan Friesen]

It's as bad as it's ever been.

[Alex Jones]

Do you feel Alex, that there's going to be some state sponsored attack or

[Paul Craig Roberts]

something that's going to take place? Do you feel that in your gut instincts?

[Alex Jones]

That is a huge shadow that always hangs over us. It's a dark Paul. People ask me what Paul means, you know, do they? A dark mass hanging over our society. And we know state sponsored terrorists real. And we're in a greater danger now since any time before or after 9 11. Clearly the Republican memos that are now been documented say they need a quote 911 style event to jumpstart the globalist agenda. We know that they're in deep trouble on every front. They're losing control. That's why they're so aggressive right now is they know the people are getting wise to their shenanigans, to their machinations.

[Dan Friesen]

Oh man, that sounds exactly like right now.

[Jordan Holmes]

Sounds almost identical.

[Dan Friesen]

Oh yeah, it sounds like this is always the case.

[Jordan Holmes]

Seems like it's been that way for 20 years at least. Yeah, probably longer than that considering how familiar everybody is with how he's going to say this.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah, yeah. This seems very standard.

[Jordan Holmes]

Also the idea of asking the question, do you think there's going to be a false flag? Is insane.

[Dan Friesen]

Right. Because what if his answer was no?

[Jordan Holmes]

Right, that. But the answer can never be no because your belief is that eventually it will happen. So the moment you are losing, the moment you lose vigilance, that's when it's gonna happen.

[Dan Friesen]

Right, Right. If this caller calls in is like, hey Alex, is there gonna be a false flag? And Alex says no, then there's gonna be an attack and there has to be. Finally caught me off guard.

[Jordan Holmes]

Exactly. They finally has to be the way it is.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah.

[Jordan Holmes]

You can't say no. Yes.

[Dan Friesen]

Yes.

[Jordan Holmes]

There's always the possibility of a false flag. Right now, Right?

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. And what if I were to tell you that this clip is actually from 2011?

[Jordan Holmes]

I would believe that, right?

[Dan Friesen]

Yep. But that would be a lie. This is from 2006.

[Jordan Holmes]

Well, it's all right.

[Dan Friesen]

Who knows?

[Jordan Holmes]

Who knows?

[Dan Friesen]

It could be from 2006. But I could be lying.

[Jordan Holmes]

It could be from any date. You'll never know. And there's no reason to find out

[Dan Friesen]

the whole time we've been at as great a danger as we have been before or after 911 at every moment.

[Jordan Holmes]

All right, so you're you're calling in and you're like, oh, man, I love Alex. First time, long time, first time, right. I'm going to ask him my. Be my biggest question. Do you think there's going to be a false flag? Was he curious, or did he just want to see if Alex would go on a.

[Dan Friesen]

You know, he was curious. He also had a question about oil, but this is the second question.

[Jordan Holmes]

Oh, my God.

[Dan Friesen]

So this was, you know, primary reason he called it.

[Jordan Holmes]

Sure, sure, sure. All right, then. I didn't have the full picture of this person that I'm imagining.

[Dan Friesen]

He's not. He's not trying to give him an improv suggestion just to let him roll.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right, right, right.

[Dan Friesen]

He's actually interested in the answer.

[Jordan Holmes]

It feels like that's what you would do.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. So Alex, he realizes, like, you know what I should get on MySpace.

[Jordan Holmes]

I mean, obviously it's been about a

[Dan Friesen]

half an hour since MySpace was brought up, so he's realizing, like, why not?

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Alex Jones]

And people are telling me, I gotta join. I gotta be part of it. Let me ask you, should we have one of my webmasters go build a site, get thousands of friends and members and promote it, and then just have them just take it? Should I go sign a contract with Murdoch saying, sure. I mean, you understand, folks, this is Internet too, where you have. In the future, you'll have to go under them, have to sign a contract with them to be on the web, and then they'll shut you down. They're shutting down most of 911 sites. They're shutting down pro Second Amendment sites. They're shutting down sites that bash Bush. They're shutting down sites that bash News Corps. I mean, it's despicable. I mean. I mean, we all talk about China censoring people. What about Rupert Murdoch? What do you say to that? I mean, what should I do? What. What should I do, James? I mean, Evan, I think.

[Jordan Holmes]

I think you should maybe try another.

[Paul Craig Roberts]

I'm actually setting them up.

[Jordan Holmes]

Up account on tag world.com.

[Alex Jones]

you know, I just figured out what I'm gonna do. I'm gonna have my guys right now, today. We're gonna set up a MySpace. And everybody else should do this. With its whole point being, will Rupert Murdoch shut this down? We're Gonna set up MySpace. Exposing MySpace.

[Jordan Holmes]

Aha.

[Dan Friesen]

Brilliant.

[Jordan Holmes]

That's. That's disqualifying.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah, that's all right, man. How bored are you?

[Jordan Holmes]

All right, we're gonna set up our own Facebook and we'll call it Book Face. How d Mark Zuckerberg we'll get you well.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah, I think that that caller. That was an interesting dynamic because he's like, hey, what should. Should we do this? Should we join MySpace?

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

And the caller is like, I think I'm gonna join something else.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

I'm gonna join an alternative platform.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yep.

[Dan Friesen]

Alex ignores that, and it's like, I'm gonna make a publicity stunt out of joining MySpace.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yep. Yep. Because it's bigger.

[Dan Friesen]

Cool.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah. I wonder if there really was a chance for Alex to just like. Like, catch it, understand it, and then make info Twitter. Right. Then, you know, like, could he have. Could he have leveraged this whole spot into an actual social media.

[Dan Friesen]

No, because he tried. They tried to make their own InfoWars social media.

[Jordan Holmes]

Oh, did they?

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah.

[Jordan Holmes]

When did they try that?

[Dan Friesen]

Well, I don't remember exactly, but yeah, they. They tried to do that. They tried to do a dating site. Like, there was a lot of dating sites.

[Jordan Holmes]

Probably not going to work.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah, but you got. You got to only date people who are woke. No, not woke. Awake.

[Jordan Holmes]

Awake. All right. The opposite of woke.

[Dan Friesen]

Wait, I. Yeah, they tried a lot of, like, kind of new web things that didn't work, and thankfully for him, most of them are forgotten.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, man, the dating site should really just. That should just stay with you, you know, because there's one thing that you know about an InfoWars dating site site.

[Dan Friesen]

It's cool. Full of cool people.

[Jordan Holmes]

Maybe two women ever were on that period.

[Dan Friesen]

It's been years and years. But I did try, and I did see some archived pages on there, and I remember it being cool.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yep. I bet everybody's nice.

[Dan Friesen]

Distant memory.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

So Alex, I think that he really wants to present this as, like, I don't want to join my space. Space. I'm kicking and screaming. Everyone wants me to join.

[Alex Jones]

And they may ignore us, not wanting to give us attention, but I have a feeling they'll just squash us. And it'll be a nice example of how free MySpace is. Okay, you want me to get a MySpace account? We will. We're getting one right now, and we've got squadrons of people. If they shut us down on this one, we'll just keep creating new accounts and exposing them.

[Jordan Holmes]

So the war, that's against the terms of service.

[Alex Jones]

You want me to have a MySpace account? We are invading. We are invading MySpace.

[Dan Friesen]

You really can't do. Like, this is a bad way to start a campaign. Yeah, because if they ignore you, then what? Yeah, we're setting out to prove that they are sensors and they're Gonna just like you have to then keep upping the ante of disgusting shit. Try to get yourself kicked off.

[Jordan Holmes]

Exactly.

[Dan Friesen]

Or else you look like a loser.

[Jordan Holmes]

You gotta, you gotta be more vague. You can't go out there trying to prove something because then you can prove the opposite too. You can't just only prove one thing. That's just not how proving things work.

[Dan Friesen]

Well, I mean, you eventually have to get into like, I don't know, maybe Holocaust denial or something in order to like that'll get you there. To get you kicked off.

[Jordan Holmes]

That'll get you there. There are consequences for that though. And it turns out you won't want to get kicked off YouTube.

[Dan Friesen]

So speaking of Holocaust deniers.

[Jordan Holmes]

Great.

[Dan Friesen]

Alex has a guest on the show.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

He's a noted racist guy.

[Jordan Holmes]

Sure.

[Dan Friesen]

His questions about the Holocaust.

[Jordan Holmes]

Wow.

[Dan Friesen]

Former editor of vdare, Paul Craig Roberts. And I don't care about his interview. It's pretty boring. They have no energy between them. But I'm playing this clip because Alex makes a prediction and as we know, God talks to him.

[Alex Jones]

I like it.

[Dan Friesen]

And he knows when they come true.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Alex Jones]

Where do you see it going in Iraq? I mean, I think they're just gonna try to get us so deep into a war with Iran in the future. Or they're gonna attack Iran and hope that Iran strikes back and then, oh, everybody will be shocked that they fight back and then we're going to be off to the races and I think they'll force us into a full bore mobilization and bring in the draft and everything else.

[Paul Craig Roberts]

You know, I just don't know what their plan is. If that's the plan, it's. It's highly risky, isn't it? I mean, it's the most. I've never known a government to undertake so many extreme risks and for no clear reason. So I don't know whether you keep

[Alex Jones]

using the Hitler parallel. He. He was nuts and started attacking everybody too.

[Dan Friesen]

Well,

[Paul Craig Roberts]

yes, but he at least had an agenda and he may have done.

[Alex Jones]

Okay, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

[Jordan Holmes]

Hold on.

[Paul Craig Roberts]

Bush marches off into Iran. He will have done the equivalent of Hitler marching off, off into Russia. It may be more than they can chew.

[Dan Friesen]

Paul, Paul, that's not good.

[Jordan Holmes]

That is the single worst at least I have ever heard in my entire life. Yeah, I've never heard an at least worse than. Well, at least Hitler had an agenda.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah.

[Jordan Holmes]

That's the worst one.

[Dan Friesen]

How. What do you think about that agenda?

[Jordan Holmes]

That's the worst one. That is the worst one.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. When I was Listening to that. When Alex was like, you use the Hitler comparison and Paul Craig Robertson said, well, I was like that. That's the scariest. Well.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yep. That's no good. Yeah, that's no good.

[Dan Friesen]

That's not the word Alex wanted to hear.

[Jordan Holmes]

Next. Jesus. At least Hitler had an agenda. Wow.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. It's almost not surprising at all that all of these creeps beget what we have.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Alex Jones]

Yeah.

[Jordan Holmes]

It does make sense if you, if you listen to them, like, they mean what they say.

[Dan Friesen]

Mm.

[Jordan Holmes]

It's no good.

[Dan Friesen]

No.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

But, you know, I think that Alex, a lot of people call him a racist.

[Jordan Holmes]

Sure we do.

[Dan Friesen]

It's true. I've called him that a number of times. Yep. But this next caller that Alex gets after he speaks with the guy who

[Jordan Holmes]

thinks, yeah, yeah, Hitler is at least. At least he had an agenda.

[Dan Friesen]

This guy is real thrilled that Alex isn't a racist.

[Jordan Holmes]

Great.

[Alex Jones]

Fred in Philly, you're on the air. Go ahead, Fred.

[Paul Craig Roberts]

Hi.

[Dan Friesen]

I want to.

[Paul Craig Roberts]

I want to tell you that I really appreciate the way that you handle all these issues non ideologically and also that you don't bait ethnic groups and that you don't bait religions, and I think that's very commendable.

[Alex Jones]

Well, those are all hot buttons. A lot of people like to, you know, they stick their finger in it and they think because they got a feeling that that electricity going into them is good and they think as they're getting attention that it's good, but overall it's very, very destructive. And that's what the neocons do.

[Paul Craig Roberts]

Yeah. And I think that it took me several years to get into that mode of thinking, but it's very valuable that he still is.

[Dan Friesen]

I'm proud of this guy from Philly.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yep.

[Dan Friesen]

What Alex is describing, it almost sounds like someone who. I don't know. This is crazy.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, hear me out.

[Dan Friesen]

It almost sounds like someone who would say that you get the most flack when you're over the target.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

You know, like someone using that kind of, like negative feedback as a way to prove that they're on to something.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yep, yep, yep.

[Dan Friesen]

It's very similar to how Alex is saying, like, you press the button, you get a charge of electricity, and you think you're doing something that does feel right. Huh.

[Jordan Holmes]

Seems like. I don't know. I don't know what, you know, like maybe. Maybe the. The question of awareness is actually the question that we should really be dealing with, but not in a way of like, is he aware of what does this mean? Or anything. Like maybe we actually have to get to the fundaments of what the concept of awareness is, because maybe he just does not have it, you know, like, maybe, you know, like whenever you see fucking fish go to where was born. Right. You don't know why that happened. The fit. Does the fish have an awareness of why it happens, but the fish does it. Maybe this is Alex being the fish.

[Dan Friesen]

So. And okay, if that's. If what you're saying, if I'm following you correctly.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's tough to do. It's tough to do.

[Dan Friesen]

We have spent nine years of our lives, a thousand episodes plus, of like, look who's talking now. Putting dialogue into a dog's head. Of like, trying to figure out why Alex is doing any of the shit he's doing. Who cares? He's a dog.

[Alex Jones]

You want to.

[Dan Friesen]

You want to have conscience, intention there, it's just not there. It's Danny DeVito.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah. You know, that probably isn't right, but it's hard to find other explanations for this.

[Dan Friesen]

It's a hypothesis I would have thrown out in the past.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

But now we've got a question.

[Jordan Holmes]

We're a little. Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

So Alex had that shitty guest on Paul Craig Roberts, and then he had, you know, some calls.

[Jordan Holmes]

Sure.

[Dan Friesen]

And I was blown away by his final guest of the show. Yeah. This is a woman from Iraq who is a part of a group who is a Women against the War. She's a pharmacist from Fallujah.

[Jordan Holmes]

Wow.

[Dan Friesen]

And it's strange.

[Jordan Holmes]

This is strange.

[Alex Jones]

Dr. Rashad Zaidan is a pharmacist and works in Baghdad and Fallujah with women and children who are victims of war. She's worked especially with orphans and she works with the Knowledge Society to aid victims of war. And she joins us. She's part of the Iraqi Women for Peace. It's traveling around Code Pink. So set this up. Part of the Women Against War movement in this country. And they have amazing stories to tell. Dr. Zeidan, thank you so much for joining us today.

[Caller]

Thank you. Thank you very much.

[Dan Friesen]

I don't want to play a ton of her interview because from everything I can tell what she is there to advocate for is just bringing attention to the victims of the Iraq war.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

And I think that's sound and good.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yep.

[Dan Friesen]

And I have no problem with it. And Alex, even though he is a piece of shit, platforming that conversation is a voice that it is better people hear than not here.

[Jordan Holmes]

Sure.

[Dan Friesen]

So I don't really have a lot to say about her. Interview outside of crazy. That.

[Jordan Holmes]

How about that? Yeah, what a weird. Okay. All right.

[Dan Friesen]

But yeah, that's not to say we don't have any clips. All right, so I think that there is a pattern that Alex engages in while talking to this woman which is to try and make it all about himself.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, that sounds about right.

[Alex Jones]

Now you come to the United States, now you're traveling with women. Saynotowar.org we have links to it on infowars.com Tell us how you came to the United States, Dr. Zeiden.

[Caller]

Global Peace for saying no to war. They invited us to sharing their activities and we came here just to. To tell the American people what is happening really in Iraq. We just want to tell them the truth, which they don't hear it from the media. We have some pictures, we have some films about what's happening and we hope we can reach every American people in order they know the truth. Because we believe that America is the center for truth and freedom. But the picture now is different. After three years we see everything is different.

[Alex Jones]

Are you aware that America are the average Iraqis aware that we've just been captured too by the same people? And then it's just more sophisticated. See, we've been captured too. We're controlled as well. The average American doesn't even know what's going on. Where the average American's been mind controlled.

[Caller]

I think if they know the truth, our letter is just telling them the truth. And from being captured my country has been gone. And I have to work hard for my children. I have four children and have two to think about their future. So if anything happened to me, I will not be care because all my country are suffering. So no problem.

[Alex Jones]

So you're saying you're willing to. I mean you're doing whatever it takes to stand up for the little ones.

[Caller]

Yes, I will try. I'll do my best.

[Alex Jones]

But I'm sure even through all the pain, is it rewarding to you?

[Dan Friesen]

Jesus. So the thing that he was doing there of the like, we're captured too. We're under the same occupation. That happens a number of times. There's a couple of times where he tries to steer things in that direction and I find that disgusting.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yep.

[Dan Friesen]

This is a person whose home is war torn. Yep. Based on the president of our country's actions.

[Jordan Holmes]

Lies. Yeah, yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

And to like have his weird I can't have my guns or whatever. Oh, FEMA is bad. Yeah, all this stuff. And try to talk to somebody who's advocating for real war torn shit.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

Like it's just insulting. I feel like it's like

[Jordan Holmes]

my two thoughts were this. My first thought was, was, she doesn't deserve this. This woman does not deserve this. There's no way that anybody deserves it, but she especially does not deserve it.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah.

[Jordan Holmes]

And then my next thought was, I don't know if you remember this, but a while back, probably a good while back, now that we're old, there was a football coach who had this huge meltdown, and he's at the end of it, he's screaming like, I'm a man. I'm 40. Because. Because these media people were talking shit about kids. You know, like, they had forgotten that those were kids and they shouldn't be talking like that. And he was expressing that. It's like, no, come at me. Come at me. I'm prepared for this. This is our arena right here. That's exactly how I felt with Alex. Like, don't leave her alone. She doesn't deserve this shit.

[Dan Friesen]

I. I get where that reaction is coming from.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

And the weirder feeling that I have is I wonder if this is his attempt at empathy.

[Jordan Holmes]

I mean, it feels like it's his attempt to, like, relate.

[Dan Friesen]

We are the same. We're.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah. I'm like you. You're like me, but it's. But from him, it's more like, now I want you to be like, yes, you're right, Alex. You guys are captured. You know?

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. To sign off on my weird sovereign citizen paranoia being the same level of oppression.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yep.

[Dan Friesen]

As being having your cities bombed out.

[Jordan Holmes]

Take time out of your helping orphans lives day to give me a little bit of props for how Americans also have it hard.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. It's fucking awful.

[Alex Jones]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

But there is a part of me that wonders if he even recognizes, like, the way in which it's awful. I think it might not be fully malicious.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

It might just be. He's a dog.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah. I mean, no. I mean, I think this is very much, like, consistent with narcissistic psychopath behavior of that. Like, I. Don't you understand? I am reaching out to you. This is us relating to each other. Not like you're clearly having some. Some weird psycho mind game with me for no reason.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

And so we're not gonna listen to too much more of her interview. Good. But she's there with another person. Oh, God, this is weird.

[Alex Jones]

Can we. I'd like to go back to you, Dr. Zidan, but can I speak. Speak to the founder of Code Pink, which is a women's peace activist group, Gayle Murphy here for a few minutes?

[Caller]

Yes.

[Alex Jones]

Okay, thank you. Hello, Gail. Thank you so much for joining us. Can you break down some of the things you guys are doing and where you're going to be and what some of this horrific testimony these women have been giving is like?

[Caller]

Well, it's been very emotional. The women came more or less around the 5th of March and started in New York, where we had a large public event.

[Dan Friesen]

This is really weird. They have a very friendly and cooperative interview. And that's strange because Alex thinks that Code Pink is a communist Soros front.

[Jordan Holmes]

Right.

[Dan Friesen]

And it's not like he started thinking that in 2015 or something. He's thought that for a long time.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah. CodePink was doing shit around 2004 almost immediately. Well, I mean, they've been doing shit before that, but that was whatever.

[Dan Friesen]

They. They.

[Jordan Holmes]

They made big splashes about the Iraq war and all that stuff.

[Dan Friesen]

He uses Code Pink as shorthand for, like, commie women agitators.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah. So, like, hey, Gayle, how you doing? What's going. What's going on, Gayle? Tell me about. Tell me about the future.

[Dan Friesen]

It's really hard to see that and not think that what he's doing is exploiting their advocacy so he can condescend to a woman from Iraq. Yeah. It's hard to imagine him being like a unthinking, unintentioned dog.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

You're talking to someone from Code Pink now.

[Jordan Holmes]

This is insane.

[Dan Friesen]

You're. Yeah, you're a militia guy.

[Jordan Holmes]

You know, you know, you know, you know. You have to know. You have to know. That's what I feel. That's what I feel. Like my entire emotional journey will just be through, you knows, you know, like, you know. No, you know, you have to. You know.

[Dan Friesen]

Come on. You know.

[Jordan Holmes]

You know, you. Oh, my God. You know. You know.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah, you know, and there's something so interesting about this dynamic, which is like, I don't begrudge Code Pink or this woman's advocacy for getting the voices out of people who are victims in Iraq.

[Jordan Holmes]

Absolutely.

[Dan Friesen]

I also don't think there's any way to deny that they're being used and that Alex needs these types of people at this stage in his career, or else he looks like the Nazi that he is.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yep.

[Dan Friesen]

And I. I don't think they did anything wrong, but tactically, it was a big mistake, I think. I mean, to include him in this.

[Jordan Holmes]

It is. It is. To take another phrase from this time. Alex was an unknown. Unknown, you know, like, there was no way for these people to know Fully the malicious level of what Alex was. Because really nobody had done this level of maliciousness before in a way. You know, like, what media outlet could you have thought of in 2006 that would be actively like, oh, I'm going to launder my Nazism through pretending that I am a fair and balanced above the board show, you know?

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. There are very few examples I could ever think of that are as kind of insane as. And how could you be prepared for it if you're somebody who really like, adamantly cares about the Iraq war and the Iraqi people?

[Jordan Holmes]

I'll talk to anybody.

[Dan Friesen]

I just need to get my word out who appears to be a right winger who hates the war totally. Then, yeah, that seems I can get

[Jordan Holmes]

my message to a group of people who would never listen to me.

[Dan Friesen]

Right.

[Jordan Holmes]

It all makes sense. Unless, like, unless, you know, already 20

[Dan Friesen]

years in the future.

[Jordan Holmes]

Exactly. Yeah, exactly. So it's like not. This isn't just a. Hindsight is 20 20. It's like, you can't blame anybody for fucking up like this.

[Dan Friesen]

No. But it's tragic to see.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, it is. It is.

[Dan Friesen]

So we have one last clip and it's after their interview has ended, Alex takes some. Some calls and I just, I resent his perspective. Okay. Eventually.

[Alex Jones]

Oh, yeah, I've said this over and over again. This ought to be the headline on a story we ought to write. America is the target. Iraq is only the pretext we need to explain. And Bush told his biographer this. We're the real target.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah.

[Alex Jones]

They want to destroy our young people. I mean, I hate to use a child's analogy, but Revenge of the Sith, he's a little known senator. He hires people to covertly attack his own planet, says the Senate won't do enough. It's elected chancellor, then attacks his own planets again and again to become emperor, and then knocks out his own forces. This is actually what governments do, you know, children can understand the plot. Adults can't understand it in the real world.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah, man. So he was just interviewing a woman who is dealing with orphans and people whose families are dying in Baghdad and Fallujah. And within a very short amount of time, he's talking with his caller about how like, hey, we're the real targets. This has rank disrespect all over it.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah. I mean, whatever. Whatever ideological differences that you may have with somebody doing that, you know, like what you are, what you should be, what you should be forced to acknowledge is that they're doing the work. You know, like whether or not you agree that it's good work or bad work or that in the long run, it's helpful. Any number of things. Right.

[Dan Friesen]

Right.

[Jordan Holmes]

Alex should be saying you're doing the work and I'm talking on the radio. So we're going to start from a position of I am beneath your level of fucking give a shit. Right. So to, to not come with a, with a humbleness. To not come directly towards them like, hey, man, you're amazing, or disrespectful.

[Dan Friesen]

Or conversely, not to come to it from a perspective of, I don't really care about what's happening to you. I'm the real target.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

And I only care about you dealing with these orphans and all this shit because they're doing that to get to me next.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yep.

[Dan Friesen]

I don't really care about what's going on with you.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yep.

[Dan Friesen]

If it didn't involve me, I wouldn't even be talking to you. Yeah.

[Jordan Holmes]

No. Every time they're. Every true crime show where they are interviewing psychopaths is like, that's their reasoning 100% of the time.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. And I think he should be more insulting to this person or less one of the two.

[Jordan Holmes]

Either one is better than this one. Weirdo.

[Dan Friesen]

Fucked up shit.

[Alex Jones]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

But also interviewing Code Pink. Insane. Insane. Yeah. You know, you just, you go back and you never know what you're gonna see.

[Jordan Holmes]

You really don't, you know, and it, it just reinforces what we've been saying. That and it's, it's. I, I, you know, I don't know if it still means anything, but the. So many times it's like, don't go on these shows. Don't have these debates. Don't have them on your show.

[Dan Friesen]

Show.

[Jordan Holmes]

Don't legitimize any of that shit because even this person is going to be used. Even this person. Of course you're going to be used, you know.

[Dan Friesen]

Yeah. Maybe not. Maybe not. Like every single instance. Don't do it. But be very careful.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

Be a be. People are less careful than they should be about that sometimes.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah. I agree.

[Dan Friesen]

Fucking hell, man.

[Jordan Holmes]

Tough.

[Dan Friesen]

So. So I guess the past is still interesting.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah.

[Dan Friesen]

At least this is a lot of curveballs.

[Jordan Holmes]

It is.

[Dan Friesen]

Alex is mad about MySpace.

[Jordan Holmes]

That's what I mean. I love, I love not being able to think, oh, well, this is the part of his show where he's going to do this, you know, like, that's huge.

[Dan Friesen]

We've been in the past and we've been talking a lot about Milosevic. And now if I asked you, hey, what do you think is going to happen today?

[Jordan Holmes]

No idea.

[Dan Friesen]

Not my.

[Jordan Holmes]

No clue.

[Dan Friesen]

Now he's gonna passive aggressively start up a mice interview.

[Jordan Holmes]

Somebody from Fallujah. Absolutely not what I expected.

[Dan Friesen]

Fucking insane.

[Jordan Holmes]

Now the. And then you also get the. The Emperor Palpatine comparison from the past while we just watched the State of the Union when I mean, what other way is there to describe what happened?

[Dan Friesen]

Well, yeah, yeah. Thanks for the reminder.

[Jordan Holmes]

Yeah, I mean, it's fun if you think about it as the Revenge of the Sith. Right.

[Dan Friesen]

Well, because then a new hope happens.

[Jordan Holmes]

Exactly. Well, I mean back that. Here's the problem, right? Back in the past, you'd go straight from Empire Revenge of the Sith to New Hope. Now you got to go through a full andor and a rogue one before you get to a new hope. We got a ton of stuff to get through.

[Dan Friesen]

We got work to do.

[Jordan Holmes]

We got work.

[Dan Friesen]

So let's get to that. Let's go steal those plants.

[Jordan Holmes]

Let's get some andor some rogue one moving and then we'll get a new hope going.

[Alex Jones]

So we'll.

[Dan Friesen]

We'll get to work on that. But until then, we have a website. Oh yeah. We'll be back with another episode. But until then, I'm Neo. I'm Leo. I'm DZX Clark. I am the mysterious Professor.

[Jordan Holmes]

And now here comes the Sex Robots.

[Alex Jones]

Andy in Kansas, you're on the air. Thanks for holding.

[Jordan Holmes]

Hello Alex.

[Caller]

I'm a first time caller. I'm a huge fan.

[Alex Jones]

I love your work. I love you.