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I Banned My Family From My $2M Farm - And Business Has Never Been Better | Seth Boakye-Dankwah
01:09:35
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- [00:00]
A
Must family always be the people to run your business? No, thank you.
- [00:04]
B
No family member of mine will be employed in Modikai Farms. No. My daughters? Yes. My wife? Yes. Anyone related to my wife? My cousins, my brother. No way.
- [00:13]
A
Why?
- [00:16]
B
If you fool around in my company, I fire you. I'm a Christian. But no, no, I don't waste time. This is the property of the God I serve and I have to manage it. Well, you can't destroy that. No, I'm not permitted to do that. I was in Japan. I was in the stock market. The only black person over there.
- [00:30]
A
When did you move to Ghan? You really could have come home earlier, right?
- [00:34]
B
I could, but yeah, I was making more money.
- [00:41]
A
A man going on retirement is more concerned about losing their money than their life. How much investment did you put in?
- [00:47]
B
About 2 million plus dollars.
- [00:50]
A
That's high risk appetite.
- [00:52]
B
Yeah. At this age, how long am I going to live? I have a wife, my daughters are there. Yes. I'm going to get grandchildren. What am I leaving behind for them? What am I using the money for? So if I'm not around, the workers will have jobs to do jobs. Jobs.
- [01:06]
A
Your motivation for starting the farm was money.
- [01:09]
B
Of course I have to make money, but I don't have to squeeze money out of my people. If I can make decent profit selling it at 100, why should I sell it at 150? But to set up the catfish farm
- [01:21]
A
you need is catfish farming. Based on your research and based on what you do, is it profitable enough for a company that started off just over 2.5 million doll USD? What's the turnover?
- [01:34]
B
The turnover now is.
- [01:41]
A
You're welcome to Connected Minds podcast. My name is Derek Abayte. My guest today is the founder and CEO of Modaya Farms, the award winning farms of 2025. I have the CEO here and today's conversation is really going to be talking about what it takes to be a farmer yourself. Now he's fully into aquaculture. He's had years of experience where he worked over 27 years in corporate, you know, across South Africa, Japan and he's moved back to Ghana and he's doing this for a living. I really want to understand the decision making, the trajectory that his life was really taken before he made that decision and a switch to do business. So stick with me and don't go anywhere. Now if you don't also know you can search Connected Minds podcast on Apple and Spotify and also listen to this conversation when you're running, cooking, driving, on your way to work. Whether you're busy in the streets of Nairobi or in Accra somewhere, you can listen to us. So stay tuned. You're welcome to my studio. Mr. Seth, how are you?
- [02:47]
B
I'm very well, thank you. And then I also want to say hi to your, your audience and people who will be watching you.
- [02:54]
A
Yeah, thank you so much.
- [02:55]
B
I appreciate you privileged to be here.
- [02:57]
A
Yeah, I appreciate you coming. Two people out of the team really wanted you to be here.
- [03:02]
B
Okay.
- [03:03]
A
You know, we were searching, we watched some of your videos as well, and we saw the amazing things that you're doing. And for those of you that will get to the end, I have a special product as well that Mordecai Farms brought to connected minds. And I'm going to show you that, so stick with me. Now, you've invested a lot of money into your farm and the project that you're doing. But before we even talk about how much you invested and the thought of starting Catfish Farm and now you do vegetables as well. I really want to understand that for someone who lived abroad for that many years. When did the decision to start your business come in?
- [03:41]
B
I was in Japan. I was in the stock market, the only black person over there. And I saw how Japan rose and the bubble burst. The banks collapsed, companies were having issues. And as a foreigner there, I told my wife things were very hard. What's going to happen? What are we going to do? But luckily, fortunately, maybe by the grace of God, we survived. We went through that turbulence. The company I was working for was acquired by Mitsubishi UFJ Bank. Our parent company was acquired by a team led by SoftBank Masayoshison to become. So the brand brought a consortium from the US and took over that bank at Long Term Credit bank of Japan. So we were taken over by Mitsubishi UFJ bank. And I worked there as an analyst and an equities analyst. And I became popular in the year 2000. With the year 2000 problem, yeah, I became very popular. I was one of the, okay, the only black analyst who was actually nominated by Nikkei as maybe the top 15 analysts in Japan.
- [04:53]
A
Okay.
- [04:53]
B
So around that time I got a call from a company called Zurich Scada Investments, a US based company. So I moved from, from the sell side to the buy side. Now when we talk about the sell side, it's actually we say investment banking companies. Like, I would say, okay, like Data Bank, Gold coast securities, we call them investment banking bankers. They have access to the stock market. On the buy side. We receive money and then we invest in stocks for our clients. We create Portfolios and invest. So that's the difference between the buy side and the sell side. We send them orders, we pay them commission, they buy the stocks for us and we keep them. So I move from the sell side to the buy side. And on the buy side you actually put money. You don't just recommend them and stay away if it goes up. Oh, I'm a good analyst. If the stock falls, you hide. You don't want to take your calls. But on the buy side, you put in actual money there. If it falls, the client is going to talk to you. So I covered several industries and when I was there, I knew that one day I will come back to Ghana. As I was working there, I knew in my mind I would definitely come back to Ghana. I will come and live maybe my final days in Ghana. What am I going to do? So a lot of things went on in my head and my wife and myself, we discussed a lot of businesses. So what I'm doing now is part of what.
- [06:36]
A
So you always knew that even though you're working corporate is fantastic, you are eventually going to come to Ghana and do something?
- [06:44]
B
Yes.
- [06:45]
A
Huh. But it could have been in line with what you did in corporate.
- [06:52]
B
I know. I actually toyed with the idea of coming back to Ghana, setting up my own asset management company. But look at the Ghana Stock Exchange. Now this was set up 1999. 1980, sorry, 1989, 1980, around that time. But if you look at the trading value, the trading volume is dominated by probably one company, mtn.
- [07:12]
A
Right.
- [07:13]
B
Followed by probably gc Ghana Commercial. So when as a portfolio, when I was in South Africa as a portfolio manager, I was. It was very difficult to get a stock to buy in Ghana.
- [07:26]
A
Okay.
- [07:27]
B
The liquidity is not there. If you find an interesting company, you don't get data on those company financial data of the company. And sometimes you wonder why the stock exchange allow those companies to be listed when they are not providing their financials.
- [07:42]
A
But you could have also been an advisor.
- [07:45]
B
No, my energy is focused on the money my client has given me. I need to create value for them. Ghana is not the only country in Africa. So you move to Nigeria, move to Kenya, go to Egypt, Morocco, Uganda. You know, Ghana is. Everything is politics. I'm not, I'm not a politician. So. So who is going to listen to me?
- [08:08]
A
Right.
- [08:09]
B
So I come in, I see it, I just move away and go back to my base and then I focus on, on my client. But back to your question. Yes, I had aquaculture in my mind. I had things like, okay, setting up a fitness club in my mind, I had a setting up a garage in my mind because I came here, I saw, I went to some of these garages. I'm not going to mention the names. And you see Ghanaians are fixing the cars and you see foreigners counting the money. So if Ghanaians are fixing the cars and the foreigner is counting the money, why can't I do it? It's just a question of getting the spare parts, getting somebody to look after the warehouse very well and the Ghanaians doing it and probably giving them shares in whatever you set up. So why aren't Ghanaians doing it? I don't know.
- [09:10]
A
That's probably a question for my audience,
- [09:14]
B
the million dollar question for Ghanaians. So a lot of those things went on in my mind. I said, okay, there are a lot of opportunities here. You see the country as maybe risky, blah blah, blah. And I don't know, you send a question about risk and all those kind of things. The risk concept in Asia is different from what we are taught here. When we say something is risky, oh, it's dangerous, you lose money. No, that's not how they think about risk.
- [09:41]
A
How do they think about risk?
- [09:42]
B
Okay, so if you look at the Chinese characters for risk, there are two characters. There is pronounced kiki. The first character is danger. The second character is opportunity. So you see danger and opportunity. So when you see risk, you don't run away. Is it very dangerous? So danger is here, opportunity is here. Is the opportunity bigger than the danger? So I would say I grew up there, I live with them, so it became part of me. So when I look at my country, yes, yeah, it's risky. But wherein lies opportunity? Where is the danger?
- [10:26]
A
When did you move to Ghana?
- [10:29]
B
2021.
- [10:30]
A
Okay, so you've worked many years in corporate. I'm sure financially you are doing great. I mean the type of job you had. But my question is that if the thought of risk versus opportunity or danger versus opportunity became part of you, then you really could have come home earlier, right?
- [10:49]
B
I could. But yeah, I was making more money.
- [10:54]
A
Right.
- [10:55]
B
So yeah, I mean I work for capital. Yeah, they paid me very, very well. They paid me very well. Moving to South Africa to join Mazi Asset Management was actually a huge pay cut for me. But I would say that my aim was that we wanted to set up a black owned asset management company in South Africa. It's called Mazi Asset Management. Okay, so I went in, I joined them, I was head of research and then I was also senior portfolio manager for, for A mandate in Africa, excluding South Africa.
- [11:26]
A
So during all these times, I mean, for me, my thinking is that if you've gotten, you really understand how Africans, or may I say Ghanaians, approach risk, now you understand how the Asians, may I say, understand risk or danger and opportunity. So I would have been expecting you to really come to Ghana once you got there. Aha moment.
- [11:52]
B
It doesn't work that way.
- [11:53]
A
Okay, talk to me.
- [11:55]
B
Nobody knows. Said I'm nobody. So you tell somebody working at, okay, okay. Gcb, adb, whatever that, hey, this is how you should, you should consider risk. They tell me to go away. I don't want any conflict. But you can let your light shine and people will see what is actually happening to you. No need to shake anything up here. No, but we do our own thing and then people will see, we see what we are doing, and then you just increase your knowledge. That's all.
- [12:32]
A
While we were speaking earlier, you know, I, I, I was telling you that I saw a video on the Internet.
- [12:39]
B
Yes.
- [12:39]
A
Of I think about five Americans. But these people were quite elderly, like I think from 75 to about 85.
- [12:47]
B
Yeah.
- [12:48]
A
And they were talking about how they regret not investing while they were working in corporate and not thinking about their finances when they were much younger. Because now they've gotten to the stage where money has become so important and you know, they are struggling. In fact, one of them was even doing Uber and she, she's like in her 70s, doing Uber just because she wants to survive for you, working in corporate, made a lot of money. You've made such an amazing decision, right? To really do something with, with the money that you made. But I really want you to talk me through the mistakes you think people do when they are climbing the corporate ladder, especially as Africans.
- [13:29]
B
Well, that's a tough one. Mistakes people do. Investing is afraid, graduates. I just went into the investment world so I could see how we grew people's money. Okay. If you are in Japan and the U.S. you have mutual funds, other things to put your money in. And you see it growing because the market is, the stock market is rising. Some of the mutual funds will hold shares in Europe, America, Japan, maybe Korea. So that when, when there's a shock in Japan, you know that, okay, America will support you, Europe will support you. This will support. So your money is kind of okay. Okay? But the mistake people make here probably is they put all their money in the bank. There's a huge, huge savings in the bank. You get peanuts from the interest the bank is paying because the bank, the deposit you put there is a liability for the bank, it needs to pay you interest. So they use the money to, to invest in Ghana government bonds which gives them sometime they will get 25, 30 return. The spread is so low, is so high they use it to maybe pay their workers and get their fact checks. And you'll be walking around, you think you have 2 million in a bank, but they are living on your, on your, on your savings. And I think people don't have that idea. No, even in finance there's something called the rule of 72. So if the interest rate, I'm just taking an example. If the interest rate is 24%, you divide 72 by 24, that's 3. So you divide 72 by the 24% which is 24, the absolute number 24, you get 3. So if you are able to invest in an asset which is giving you 24% per annum and you are also able to reinvest the interest you get at 24%, your money will double in three years. So when Ghana was the treasury bill rates were about 30%. People could have doubled their money if they knew that that was the Bible says that for lack of knowledge my people perish. But probably a lot of people don't know and I'm sure that's the reason why people, the banks will come to you and say oh yeah, borrow this money to buy your, to buy your house. They bring these pretty ladies and then when it's time for collection they bring the macho men to collect their money. Because they also understand the rule of 72. If you borrow from them after so and so, yes, it's going to double. If you're not able to pay, they take over your house, you are in trouble. So I think financial education should be paramount in our country. People don't know anything about finance. I think everything is confined to Accra. If you go to my village in Bukanche, they don't understand. So yes, we need to be more practical with the teaching of economics and finance and all those kind of things.
- [16:40]
A
But then people like you have the, the knowledge, the understanding of financial literacy, how to invest double your money, grow your money, whatever it is. But a lot of the information is also not being shared by the likes of yourself that have, you know that understanding, right?
- [16:58]
B
Yes. You see there are, there are rules and I have to be careful whatever I, I say here. I see it's not, I'm not recommending for anybody to go and buy this, this or that. So yes, privately I can talk to My friends. Oh yeah, this looks interesting. You can do this, this and that. But maybe in a forum like this to say that oh, this company is good, somebody will go and buy, they lose money, I'm going to be in trouble.
- [17:26]
A
Right, right.
- [17:28]
B
Yeah.
- [17:28]
A
It becomes like a bad prophecy. Yeah.
- [17:31]
B
Those prophets. Yes, yes, yes, false prophets, a bad prophecy. But yes, you win some and lose. You don't get it right all the time. I just want to be right maybe 51, 52% of the time. And my client will make money 51
- [17:47]
A
to 52% of the time.
- [17:49]
B
Yes.
- [17:49]
A
That's just over half.
- [17:51]
B
Yes. If I can do that. I mean you have so many companies under your. Okay, I have so many companies under my coverage. I'm looking at consumer electronics. Okay. So if I buy two companies there and I mistakenly maybe buy Sony and Panasonic and forget about Samsung and Samsung goes up, Sonny stays there, I lose relatively, client is going to be upset. Why, why didn't you buy, why didn't you buy Samsung? Why did you stick with Sony? I have to explain myself to him right now.
- [18:28]
A
Let's talk about. Okay, the reason why you are in Ghana. The reason why a lot of my viewers and my listeners are listening which is that they also want to go into agriculture. They want to do some farming. But my first question on the farming project is how much investment did you put in?
- [18:45]
B
My balance sheet now is about 12 million Ghana cities. But if I put, if I, if I actually look at the money I have not wasted, invested in this is about 2 million plus dollars. I work for very good companies. I was paid very well, I saved a lot of money. So when I was coming back to Ghana, I had, my plan was ready, I had my business plan ready. I knew what I was going to do. I knew the returns, projected returns, everything is on my computer. This is what I'm going to do. Before I came to Ghana, I brought a lot of equipment from overseas. After Covid, shipping rates just shot up. So that really pushed up my investments, my cost. So I came to Ghana, I had a lot of issues with customs which I can't go through here. It's very sad, very unfortunate, but that's what you have to go through. And my brother in law gave me four, three acres of land. I told him no, what I'm going to do, the yield is going to be very high, but I don't need a lot of land.
- [20:00]
A
Okay.
- [20:01]
B
Because I didn't want people to be working in earthen ponds. I see people. Yeah, ponds are all over the place. And then he has 10 acres and about maybe 50 ponds. No, I didn't want anything like that. So I did a lot of research and realized that. Okay. Settled on recirculating aquaculture system.
- [20:22]
A
Okay.
- [20:23]
B
And then said, okay, I'm going to do my fish. Breed my fish in tanks. So I'm breeding the fish in tanks under a tunnel. Okay, greenhouse. So the workers can go in anytime. They can do whatever they want, walk around even when it's raining. So that was the first thing. And then I said, okay, I need a constant supply of fingerlings, so I want to have my own hatchery. So the hatchery is part of it. But my aim was, I'm going to process this fish because if I sell the raw fish, I can make some money. But no, I can't make a lot. I need to. The return should be high. So I brought in machines to dry the fish and package them. And that's what we are doing. Now to do a project like that, first of all, you. You have to look for off takers.
- [21:22]
A
Okay.
- [21:23]
B
Before you start something like that. But because I was not living in Ghana, I couldn't do that. I should. I shouldn't say I couldn't do that. I didn't do that because I didn't trust people who were going to do that research for me. There was nobody to talk to. You see, the industry is so fragmented. Everybody does, oh, I'm doing thousand catfish. I'm doing 500 this, I'm doing 5,000 this. And you see a lot of lies on YouTube and people are getting conned thinking, oh, if I buy thousand catfish and do this, this and this, I'm going to get this, this, this amount of money. No, it's not. It's not. It's not like that. And unfortunately, people are falling for such advice. But what can you do? It's a broad thing, and people should just tell us the truth. Yeah. So I came in, did that, and I told myself, okay, energy cost is very high in Asia, where I worked. I didn't check in South Africa. But in Japan, electricity for industrial use is actually cheaper than electricity for consumer housing.
- [22:33]
A
Right.
- [22:34]
B
Singapore is even cheaper. Now when you come to Ghana, it's like, so how do you grow industries with this higher cost of power? Well, that's for some people to think about. So I decided to go Solar. We have 100 kilowatt solar on my farm. It powers everything. And then ECG is backup. I have two generators as backups. So initially I wanted to do something called aquaponics.
- [23:04]
A
Okay.
- [23:04]
B
Where you have fish and then the fish, the water from the fish, the dirty water from the fish will flow through floating beds and then you plant lettuce, all those kind of things on, on Styrofoams on the, on the floating beds.
- [23:19]
A
Okay.
- [23:20]
B
And then the plants will pick up the nitrates, nitrites in the water, so they filter the water for you. Of course, the water will also have to go through another filtration process before going back to the, to the fish.
- [23:31]
A
Right.
- [23:31]
B
But if you do that, you don't use, you don't waste a lot of water. You top up the water. Maybe, maybe every three months or. Yeah, maybe every three months you top up the water and you can, you can harvest a lot of vegetables. Unfortunately, I, for me, I made it. I decided that organians don't eat vegetables. So let me forget about aquaponics. So I converted everything into, into tanks. Now I'm stuck with wastewater. What do I do? EPA will come in. How do you dispose of this wastewater? Some people will just flush the water out into gutters. So I said, oh, I can build greenhouses. So I'll just direct the wastewater into tanks and use it to irrigate the greenhouse. So that's what we are doing right now. We're producing red and yellow bell peppers. We were doing tomatoes, cucumbers. I bought three greenhouses from SM bank, which will be installed very soon and then we'll have six. And then we know what we're going to do. Just have to optimize my revenue. So I have to go back to the computer and see which products, vegetables we have to grow.
- [24:50]
A
You know, an old friend told me something funny, that a man going on retirement is more concerned about losing their money than their life. Now, for you, you've invested a lot of your money into this.
- [25:06]
B
Yes.
- [25:07]
A
That's high risk appetite.
- [25:09]
B
Yeah. At this age, how long am I going to live? I have a wife, I have, I have. My daughters are there. Yes. I'm going to get grandchildren. What am I leaving behind for them? What am I using the money for? So, you know, setting up Modikai Farms is a kind of generational wealth creation.
- [25:28]
A
Okay.
- [25:28]
B
Okay. So if I'm not around, my wife will not suffer, my daughters will not suffer, my grandchildren will not suffer. The workers will have jobs to do jobs, jobs. What my aim now is to structure it very well so when I'm not here, this business will be able to. And that's what I'm doing right now. That's my focus, to structure it well, when I'M not around, people are going to have jobs.
- [25:56]
A
But was the thought always with you to create something that will live beyond you when you are working actively?
- [26:02]
B
Yes.
- [26:03]
A
Okay.
- [26:04]
B
Yes. Okay. So this is when you look at Japan, look at Toyota, look at Panasonic, look at Sony, study the history of Honda. Suzuki, one guy started it, took Toyota. The guy who started Toyota, his son became the boss of Toyota, but the structure was there listed. His grandson became the boss and I'm sure he's. I don't know who is the CEO now, but there was something around it. If you look at Suzuki, I think Suzuki, when I was living Japan, he was still alive probably. Maybe he's passed away now. Honda is gone. But you see what they did. The family has interest, but because the structure is there, the company survives. How many companies you can mention A lot of Ghanaian set up great companies. So my wife is from Akropon. A lot of people from Macrophone set up companies. Yeah, in Ghana. Now when they pass away, where are the companies? Because maybe the structure wasn't great. I'm just speculating. Maybe the structure wasn't great. So when he passed on, he passed away, somebody took over and said, oh, I'm not going to do this. And gone. The company is gone. Workers are in trouble. They don't have jobs. They need to find jobs somewhere else.
- [27:26]
A
Mr. Bochedankwa, when we talk about this structure, what do we mean by that? Let me stop you here for a minute. So if it's your first time watching Connected Minds or you have been here before but still have not subscribed, do us a favor because majority of the people that watch our videos have not subscribed. This doesn't help us grow beyond what we expect. So help us by hitting the subscribe button. Thank you. Now let's get back to the conversation.
- [27:59]
B
No structure. Okay. I would say management, who controls the company.
- [28:03]
A
Okay.
- [28:05]
B
Is it a one man show that if I'm, I'm not here, Mr. S cannot do it? We need to move away from this one man show thing. Because knowledge, wisdom doesn't reside in only one person. You put together ideas. Even at Modikai Farms, we meet. I meet the workers and we talk. Hey, what should we do? Don't be shy. Just tell me what we should do. Sometimes they don't want to talk. I call them one by one to my office and they give me wonderful ideas. These are not graduates. These are junior high school. They're from the village. I said, yeah, okay. Because it's basically selling. And selling is not rocket science. You don't have to have a university degree to sell.
- [28:57]
A
But the real machine right behind the business is more than the selling structure that is needed to keep the business beyond.
- [29:05]
B
Yeah, right. Yeah. I have two graduates with me there. So you need to have. Okay, who is managing the business? What are. What is the vision? The vision is clearly sold to them. They buy into the vision. This is where we want to go. This is what I. I want Modikai Farms to be. When somebody comes here and insults you, don't respond. Don't get upset. Just say, yes, Mom. Yes, dad. Let them go and come and complain to me later. People should learn ethics. They should know where the company is going. They should know what you stand for.
- [29:38]
A
Okay?
- [29:39]
B
They should know why you are. You are. They are doing what they are doing right now. Are they just working for money? But you have to let them feel that, okay, I'm not only working for money.
- [29:53]
A
Is that enough to keep a business for more than three generations?
- [29:59]
B
That is not enough. You need to have results. If you. If you have all those, and then you're not making money.
- [30:07]
A
What if they say that they are not interested in the business that you're doing? As young people are growing up, there are new ideas that are coming. There are better ways of making money, faster ways of making money, and, you know, different types. So they may say, I don't want to be in the farms, you know, I want to trade.
- [30:24]
B
Sure. No, no, no. They can do that. But you let them go and bring. Bring on new people who will buy into your. Your idea.
- [30:34]
A
Must family always be the people to run your business?
- [30:37]
B
No, thank you. No. No family member of mine will be employed in Modikai Farms. No. My daughters? Yes. My wife, yes. Anyone related to my wife? No way. My cousins? No way. My brother? No way.
- [30:57]
A
Why?
- [30:58]
B
Because when you are not there, in your absence, they will come. Oh, because, oh, I'm the brother. Do this. Meanwhile, it's not something I recommend. I don't underline what he's saying, but for that fear that, oh, he's the brother of the CEO or the boss, they will do it. And then they will pull your company down. I want people who are outside that sphere. So the big domain is there. But that domain excludes anybody related to Kwame Buache, with the exception of my daughters and my wife.
- [31:38]
A
But why is that so important?
- [31:40]
B
It is important because they can undermine me. It is important because they will come in and the workers will be afraid. Oh, yeah, he's my uncle. Therefore, do this. I Want this? This is going here. He told you to send it to Mr. X. But I'm saying send it to Mr. Y. He's my uncle. I'm saying it. I'm going to talk to him. And you don't want that. I personally don't want that to happen.
- [32:04]
A
I sat here and had conversations with honorable Kenneth Japon, and he said that, you know, if you live in this part of the world and you want your business to thrive, don't work with family.
- [32:14]
B
Yeah, he's right. I agree with him.
- [32:17]
A
Is it just with us Africans or.
- [32:20]
B
I. I don't know. But if you, if you. I would also take you back to. Yeah, the best one is maybe you go to Japan and look at what the Japanese did. People are talking about China, but all these Asians, they looked at Japan and Japan was a model for them. So you go to the source and see how they were able to bring up their companies. And of course, yeah, culturally, yeah, the ethics there are very different. I never heard of somebody say, okay, I'll not let my uncle work here, blah, blah, blah, in Japan. Okay, but so I look at my country, I look at how we are, and then I have to make that decision.
- [33:00]
A
What's your view of the Ghanaian?
- [33:02]
B
We have good Ghanaians and bad guy. Somebody will see me as a wicked Ghanaian. Somebody will see me as a kind Ghanaian. If you fool around in my company, I fire you. I nip it in the bud. I don't waste time. I'm a Christian. But no, no, I don't waste time. So. So I look at Mordecai Farm. It's like, okay, this is the property of the God I serve, and I have to manage it well. So you can't fool around there and see me sitting down watching you. No, you can't destroy that. No, I'm not permitted to do that. So that is my concept. If you're not a Christian, you will not understand. But that's okay. You can have your own views, but that is how.
- [33:44]
A
So this is always the issue I have at founders, right? They have so much passion when they start the business and running the business, but the people they leave it to don't have that passion.
- [33:53]
B
You have to get people who buy into your passion, right, to grow your business. But if the passion is just with me, it stays with me. It doesn't percolate the other guys around me. And so when I'm not around, they have to find a way of moving this business forward. But if I'm able to sell my passion into them or I'm able to infuse my passion into them even if I'm not around, they know, no, this is how this business should be moving. And people will come with different ideas, new ideas, but the passion is there. And then the business will grow.
- [34:40]
A
Let's figure out a way to talk about the profitability of catfish farming.
- [34:47]
B
Okay.
- [34:47]
A
Currently in Ghana.
- [34:49]
B
So we, our business started in 2023. Yeah. We're not making profits, but I see revenues are going growing. Okay, why? Because maybe I have a lot of assets which are being depreciated and all those kind of things. So, yeah, depreciation is a lot. It's heavy for me. Now, the catfish business, some people come and tell you, oh, I started with 500. I made this amount of money, no problem. That's okay. That's a story. I'm not challenging them. However, if you look at the cost variables, you're going to buy fingerlings. If you don't buy good fingerlings, you might lose them. So give yourself maybe 5% mortality rate. You lose 5%, you retain 95% of that. You have to buy feed. If you look at your total cost of production, the feed is about maybe 70% of your total cost.
- [35:49]
A
I see.
- [35:50]
B
Now you can't reduce the price of feed because the company making the feed wants to make money. You don't control them, Consumers don't control them. So that's what they sell to you. Now, how do you make money when the feed cost is 70%, so you're left with, okay, maybe 30% to play around with. Okay, you have to pay your workers getting the feed to your farm. You need to transport the feed to your farm. So the big one, Some people will say, okay, I'm going to make my own feed. If you're able to do that, yes, you will. You make, you can reduce your feed cost and make money. So feed cost is one. Number two is if you are not processing your fish and you're selling it fresh, you feed it. It gets to a certain point, somebody comes in to buy and then the person tells you, yeah, I'm not going to buy it at 1 kg for 40 cedis. I'll give you 30 cedis. You say, no, yeah, he goes away. He comes by the next, the next, the next day or maybe a week later, I'll give you 30 cities if you are lucky. If you are very lucky. He, he will stay at 30. He might even go down. But you are buying fee to feed this fish. So out of desperation, some of them will Sell and then they cry at night. Now how do you go about this? Okay, in my view, I decided to process the fish. People go to Makola, they go to Kajitia market, whatever market to buy catfish. I mean, it's a staple in our, in our diet. So I decided to dry the fish and package it. So if I dry and package, I become more competitive. I don't rely on, okay, point and K people coming to buy my fish. If they don't come, I'm in trouble. If they come, they buy it at a lower price. My price realization is not that high. But if I do, I do packaging, I'm okay.
- [38:04]
A
But don't you then have to worry about selling it? You know, marketing and then selling.
- [38:08]
B
Yes, that is where the marketing, something
- [38:10]
A
else to worry about.
- [38:11]
B
That is where the marketing comes in. Okay, now that is where it gets a little bit complicated. Okay, I shouldn't say complicated because I also covered advertising and all these companies in Japan. So you hear about the four P's. I think it's product, product price, something in place. They talk about 4Ps. I've forgotten. Maybe those people, those listeners. Maybe if you are, if you've done marketing, you heard about 4Ps. But I think before the 4Ps, you need to do some kind of research. What is the demand for your product in where you are?
- [38:49]
A
Okay, where the farm is.
- [38:51]
B
Where the farm is.
- [38:52]
A
Right.
- [38:53]
B
If you're located in Kintampur and you want to sell in Accra, you are in big trouble.
- [38:57]
A
I see.
- [38:58]
B
So if I'm in Kintampur doing this, I have to look at, okay, what do they need in Kintapur? How do they want their fish to be in Kintampo if I have to bring it to Accra, that's expensive. So you do that kind of research. Consumer preferences are also very different. So you need to look at, okay, what do these people want?
- [39:20]
A
It may not even be in as beautiful packaging as this.
- [39:22]
B
Exactly right. And then you have to target, because you cannot be jack of all trades. You have to target the market. So if I'm in Accra, do I have to send it to Makola maybe? No, but if I go to, I come to East Lagoon, there are people who are going to buy it. So you can do direct marketing. You can come in and say, okay, this is what we are going to do. Or I can go to Koforidia and say, okay, I divide Coforidia into segments and go in there. And then I know that, okay, people here want this. I create a WhatsApp group. For them, for me and them. Whatever you need, just put it on the WhatsApp, I see the order and then we bring it to you. So we have to be very innovative. Yes, innovative, very tactical about how you market your products.
- [40:19]
A
But like for me, that's a whole lot of work. Right. You are not just farming, worrying about what is happening in a farm. Now you need to go and sell it. Either you're using distributors or you're using consumers directly.
- [40:30]
B
So I tell the workers, if we don't sell, you don't get paid. No, I pay them. But I tell them if you don't make revenues one day you come back and I will tell you, I go home, we're closing down. So the ultimate goal is to sell. We have to sell. How do you sell? Sit down and think about it.
- [40:49]
A
And at the moment your plan is what you just described. Just dry it, package it and then take it to the market.
- [40:57]
B
Yeah. So this year our strategy is marketing, marketing and marketing. Cutting costs. Yeah, we try to control our costs. But I don't have that managerial resource to be thinking about making my own feed.
- [41:14]
A
Okay.
- [41:16]
B
Because, yeah, to make your own feed, yes, you need to buy maybe maize, soybeans, blah, blah, blah, methionine, all those kind of things. But I'm thinking about my fish. So if Ranan or Beacon Hill can provide me with feedback, I'll buy from them. Then how do I lower my cost? It's just scale. You need. You need the scale. If you're doing thousand, you're going to be in trouble. But if you're doing 10,000 tons, if you're doing 50,000 tons, you have leverage over these feed companies because they know that you're going to buy from them.
- [41:54]
A
Right.
- [41:55]
B
So that is where in my old profession we. There's something called operating profit or profit profit and then asset turnover. So when you multiply your operating profit margin by asset turnover, you get the profitability return on assets. So you look at retailers, the margins are slim, the turnover is very high. You look at a company like maybe Fanuc, Tokyo Electron. Fanuc makes robots. So the robots are. They are not going to produce 15,000 robots per annum. No. Maybe 50. So the margin is very high, but the turnover is very small. 0.50. But look at retailers, you see that the margin is maybe 2%, 3%, but the turnover is maybe 2, 3, 4 times because we buy it every day. So when you multiply this, you realize that their profitability is high. So scale is very important in our industry.
- [42:52]
A
If you had not Invested so much at this point. Would you have been profitable if you had scaled it all the way down?
- [42:59]
B
If I had not invested. But if so, you invest because take for example. Yeah.
- [43:04]
A
At the moment I'm sure you're using some serious machines to you to do. To dry.
- [43:08]
B
Oh yeah. It's simple. Yeah. It was expensive. Very expensive.
- [43:12]
A
Right. Whereas other people would be using the local way to dry.
- [43:15]
B
Yes.
- [43:15]
A
And then take it to the market. Not with this sort of packaging.
- [43:18]
B
Yes.
- [43:18]
A
So my questioning is that somebody may not have 3 million USD to start at a scale unit.
- [43:25]
B
Sure.
- [43:25]
A
Right. But maybe they may have, you know, 20, 000 cities to start. Would you say it to be a profitable business?
- [43:31]
B
No, no. You can, you start, you start small. Right. And then you, as you move up, you can upgrade your, your equipment. I know the Europeans are worried about something they called, they call a polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons. So the PAH is a UI chemist. So maybe you know, pa. The p. I think pah. Okay. When you smoke the fish with firewood, it sticks on. It gets stuck on the, on the, on the, on the, on the skin of the fish.
- [44:00]
A
Right.
- [44:01]
B
So when they take it to Europe, they use a swab to. They just take some samples and test and say, oh, the level is too high. So if you're taking it to Europe in commercial quantities, they might not allow you to, to bring it because they, they think it causes cancer. No, I read about that before coming. So I decided to use this machine to try it so that if they test it, they might find something, but it might not be lethal.
- [44:27]
A
Right.
- [44:28]
B
So you start small, but as you make money from the local market, you upgrade yourself and then you always don't have to narrow yourself to Ghana. Okay, Ghana is my market. West Africa is my market. And then the whole world is my market. But we go through this step by step by step.
- [44:50]
A
You can join the entrepreneurs community on tribe. So I'm going to put the link in the description where you can just click and join the connected minds connected Academy entrepreneurs community. So we can have course twice every month, have discussions around business. You also have access to courses and access to premium content as well. Episodes that we don't release on YouTube. You get access to that as well. Now there's a huge population of my audience.
- [45:18]
B
Yeah.
- [45:18]
A
That are young people from the age of, I think 25 to 35. These people, as I said, don't have 3 million. Right. The one question is, is catfish farming, based on your research and based on what you do, is it profitable Enough?
- [45:32]
B
Yes, it's profitable. It is profitable. Okay. Tilapia is very popular.
- [45:38]
A
Yep.
- [45:38]
B
If you go into tilapia, I don't do tilapia. But just looking at, what is it, any corner you, you, you turn in Ghana, you see a bancoo joint. A banco joint with tilapia.
- [45:51]
A
That's right.
- [45:51]
B
Banco joint with tilapia. So imagine the volume of tilapia we consume every day, every, every, every week, every month and even per annum. Now, catfish is unlike tilapia, catfish. And then Nigerians have taught us that, oh, you can actually grill catfish. So that has cotton. And then people have all these grills, fancy grills, and people are patronizing. But in the diaspora, people want catfish, dried catfish, to make their benkweit, to make soup. You miss that. So if you look at tilapia and catfish, catfish is just a niche. However, I think Ghanaians are waking up to the fact that, yeah, it has a lot of meat. It's not as bony as tilapia. So, yeah, the demand is actually growing. The demand is actually growing. So if somebody wants to get into it. Yes, I will say, yes, go into it. However, we have rules in Ghana.
- [47:06]
A
Okay.
- [47:08]
B
Yeah. To go into catfish, like, okay, you need to do your, your, your, your, your Japanese, you do your background research. Okay. This is where I want to have my catfish farm. This, I've done research about this area. I use Kintampo as an example. Kintampo people don't get upset with me. But to set up the catfish farm, you need permits from the Fisheries Commission. I see. Yes. The Fisheries Commission has to give you a permit to, to, for the grow out and also to produce seed, like at the hatchery. So there are two permits. Okay. And then you also need a permit from the epa. They do environmental, blah, blah, blah. These are not free. But the Fisheries Commission permits, I think it's cheap.
- [48:03]
A
What sort of cost are we looking at?
- [48:06]
B
No, Fisheries Commission. Yeah. Pay about probably, maybe about thousand cities.
- [48:11]
A
Okay.
- [48:11]
B
Per annum. EPA. Yeah. You get into probably 20,000.
- [48:16]
A
Okay. Per annum.
- [48:18]
B
Yeah. Not per annum, maybe. So you need to get somebody to do that research for you. And that's a lot of money.
- [48:24]
A
Okay.
- [48:25]
B
You know, to write that report, send it to them and then they see what you are doing. So based on the capacity, they are going to charge you. Yeah, it's not cheap. I don't want to bash, I'm not bashing the epa, but I had my experience with them. Everything is okay now. And then Water Resource Commission. If you're using Ghana water, your water bills are going to go up. So you, you pay. Now if you're using boreholes, the Water Resource commission is in charge of all the water bodies in Ghana. So they're going to charge you for the water you're drawing from, from, from the ground because you're using it to, to, to make money.
- [49:05]
A
Okay.
- [49:06]
B
So you have to pay. But I don't think they, they are able to see all the farms using boreholes because. Okay, my farm is just by the road, so you can see the Modikai farms and they walk in and yeah, you have to comply. Okay. Now the minister, the Minister for Fisheries and Aquaculture, Mrs. Emilia Atta, when she came, they're trying to streamline these regulations because we had to deal with several regulators and it was really cumbersome and also very expensive. So they want the fisher's commission to be a one stop shop, which is very welcome for us. Okay, so you have to go through all those before you set up your aquaculture farm. And you have to make a decision whether you're going to use tanks or ponds, earthen ponds.
- [50:04]
A
What's the advantages and disadvantages of both?
- [50:07]
B
I can't talk about advantages, disadvantages, but I use something called the recirculating aquaculture system. Ras. Okay. Okay. So, so I can, I can, I can talk about rust. Let's go. Okay, so in recirculating aquaculture, so the water comes into the, into the tank, I feed the fish. So just focus on recirculating. So I feed the fish, it gets dirty, they poop into the water. Now this water conventionally will be flushed out into gutters. Yep. Okay. But in recirculating aquaculture, I move this water into a mechanical filter where the solids are filtered and then it goes through a biological filter. Okay. Where any bacteria is, is eliminated. And then it goes into a sump and then it goes back to, it pumps back into the, into the, into the fish stack so the water is completely filtered. So the water that came in, I filter it and it goes round, round, round, round. In my case, maybe every 35 to 40 minutes, the water around the fish would change. Okay. Wow. And then when we come in in the morning, they test for the ph, they test for total dissolved solids. We test the temperature, we take the temperature to see how things are going compared to the previous day. Then during the week, maybe three times a week, we check for ammonia, we check for nitrates, nitrite, sulfates, and if they are above the parameters we set, we flush all the water out and the water will go into Tanks that are used to grow vegetables and fresh water will come from the reservoir. So that is recirculating aquaculture. Yeah. And then in the ponds. Yeah, the water is there, the fish is there. I think they drain it. I'm not sure. So probably I don't have to talk about this. Otherwise I'm going to, I'm going to pollute people's minds. But this is what I think happens. So, you know, they have outlets for the water to go. They bring water, fresh water in. If they use tanks, they fill it with water and then flush this water out. So. And that's what they do. But in my case, that's why we use a lot of electricity. I see the motors are on 247 nonstop motors in the sample are on to pump water into the tanks. So my biggest cost would have been electricity. Yep. So. But I invested in solar and they are actually helping me a lot.
- [52:53]
A
Traditionally, we've been sold the education path.
- [52:56]
B
Yeah.
- [52:57]
A
That could explain also the reason why a lot of Ghanaians are not so versed in investments. Do you believe that farming could be a way of building wealth in Africa?
- [53:08]
B
Yes, it is. I mean, we eat every day, okay. In the stock market, we call something of consumer staples, food. When the economy is bad, we put all our money. You. So I was a portfolio manager. So you shift, you, you, you, you buy food companies because the economy is bad. The technology companies are not going to do well. So you don't want to be overweight there. You want to be overweight. The food companies, because everybody will eat. The pharmaceutical companies, because people will get sick, they need to buy medicine. Hospitals are not closed. But when economy is booming, yeah, people are going to eat. But I get more upside. So I move this way. Okay? Now look at us here. We lack a lot of things. So many things. So that's why this will bring me back to the Kiki danger and opportunity. So why are the Chinese here doing Galamse? Why are they here doing Galamse? Why? Okay, why are even some Ghanaians doing Galamse? They don't have that kiki in mind. But there's a danger that, hey, the authorities will get you, arrest you and you'll be in trouble. But they see this opportunity here, okay? So they don't care. However, if the danger were something like, we can we get you, we're going to shoot you, you're going to be killed. It's not going to happen. Yeah, I'm sure the Chinese know that. Okay, I come to Ghana, I get the gold, they arrest Me. And they put me in jail for two years. I go back, I have my money. So. So the danger versus opportunity. The opportunity is always here.
- [54:54]
A
Right?
- [54:55]
B
So, okay, I may be wrong, but that is, that is the way I. I personally look at it. Okay? Now we don't have roads. Bayre in the north is ready. By the time it gets to Accra, it's rotten. He bought it at 100 cedis. He comes to Accra, maybe 30% is rotten. He needs to recoup his 100 cedis. So the remaining 70% should be sold probably at 100. Plus the price will go up. But if we had a railway or Nice transport bringing it overnight to Accra, prices could go down. No, that's an opportunity there.
- [55:38]
A
Okay.
- [55:39]
B
But you cannot, an individual cannot create a railway in Ghana. You cannot do that. You cannot build a railway. So you need to find a need. You find a need and try to. To meet. Okay. Find a solution to that need.
- [55:58]
A
Right. I mean, if you're saying that farming is, is a way that our people can build wealth, how come a lot of farmers traditionally have not been rich like that?
- [56:11]
B
Yeah. This is not to look down on anyone, but most of our farmers don't have the knowledge maybe your average listener has or maybe the knowledge that I have. Okay, I did. I did a Greek. Okay. At Premier College. I did a Greek. Mrs. Glimme taught me a Greek at Premier College. I'm sure she's still alive. And I didn't take agricultural science to all level. But when you have education, you can read and understand.
- [56:42]
A
Okay?
- [56:43]
B
People should read. People should go for knowledge. God is not going to put things in our mouth. No. He's created everything for us and he's giving us knowledge. We need to use it. You are a university graduate. People are hungry in Ghana. We have a lot of forest land, great lands. I mean, look at eastern region. A lot of land. The weather is superb.
- [57:11]
A
I'm sorry, but something just popped up in my mind and I have to ask. Let me stop you here for a minute. So if it's your first time watching Connected Minds or you have been here before but still have not subscribed, do us a favor, because majority of the people that watch our videos have not subscribed. This doesn't help us grow beyond what we expect. So help us by hitting the subscribe button. Thank you. Now let's get back to the conversation. Did your parents ever do farming?
- [57:42]
B
Yes.
- [57:43]
A
Why did they not push you into farming?
- [57:45]
B
Because the thing was. Okay, I want Kwambuachi to Be a doctor. I want him to be an engineer.
- [57:52]
A
Yep. But you are back to it now, yes?
- [57:55]
B
No, I started school in, in Bru and Ahafu. Yeah, yeah. My grandparents were cocoa farmers, big cocoa farms in in Ahafu area. That was where I grew up. So I don't come from a rich family. Okay, okay, okay. Not a poor family, but yeah, it's a cocoa farming family.
- [58:13]
A
So sir, this, this makes me understand that we have left farming for the people who quote, unquote, cannot read and write. Even those people, they push their children to be. To become a crutch for end. There you go. So farming to the average person, young person, is not something they look at as. It's a path to societal respect or dignity.
- [58:45]
B
Yes, and that has to stop. No Minister of Agriculture will send these Agriculture Extension officers. I mean, you're going to advise somebody who is working on maybe one acre or one plot of land. He's a peasant farmer feeding his children. Probably the nation should start thinking about large scale farms. But our history with government led operations, not that great. Okay, not that great. But we can create something. Like some people can come together and say, hey, we're going to do this.
- [59:29]
A
So I mean, retrospect to what we've discussed about parents pushing children into education and them not seeing farming as a job, that will give the person respect because they want to really speak to their friends and say, sure, my son is a doctor, you know, my daughter is a pilot. Right. Or an engineer. What advice do you have for the young people?
- [59:51]
B
Education is very, very important. We need to probably revamp the way we teach people. When I was growing up, they punish you and they ask you to go and weed. So you grew up thinking, okay, weeding is a form of punishment. Farming is a form of maybe exaggerated punishment. So I'm not going to do it. People have farmed and realized that, okay, I'm not making money. He's on a cocoa farm. He cannot even send his son to school. However, if we are able to revamp the way we teach and the way we explain our Greek to people, people will get to know that, hey, I can be a BSc, a PhD and till the ground and make lots and lots of money. I mean, you were in the uk, you can. There are farmers there. Oh yeah, milk and cows. I was in Japan. A lot of the rich people are farmers. You go to the, we go to the usa, maybe Brazil, the same thing. Why have we pushed a Greek to the background? We talk a lot. It looks like, okay, I came to Ghana and then I realized that okay, there's an industry on talking about our problems. There's a big industry about talking. Every day you hear people talking about problems. This is what we are going to do and nothing is done. We need to move from there, put things on the ground. Everybody can identify the issues we have, but are we actually tackling them? No food. Bringing tomatoes from Burkina Faso, 100 million per annum, that's an opportunity for the youth. If we can buy $100 million worth of tomatoes from Burkina Faso, what are you doing in Ghana? Why can't you target 1%? That's 1 million. Yeah, this is not the government spending money there. These are custom entries. The cash is moving from Ghana to buy those tomatoes or whatever from Burkina Faso or from whatever. So why can't we set up farms and then supply these ladies who are going to Burkina Faso to buy tomatoes. The thinking should change from yeah, that is an opportunity. Now how do you harness that opportunity? So that is the issue because for a 25 year old guy, where is he going to get 50,000, a hundred thousand to do that kind of work?
- [62:19]
A
So this is the major problem and
- [62:21]
B
the banks should be able to come in, which I don't see. I see the banks just doing their traditional way of business because they get high returns from government bonds. So instead of investing, co investing with these guys who come with these ideas, they are not prepared to do that. It's risky for them. But the banks could help. I don't know the banking laws here, I can't go back and read them. But yeah, I mean this is a company, fledgling, coming, struggling. Okay, I'm going to put money in this company, help you grow and it becomes equity in the company. If the company becomes bigger, the equity you put in, you put in maybe 100 is become 300. The bank makes money. But I don't know if our banks are thinking about that. Anytime you raise this issue, they tell you yeah, it's risky, you put the money in and then the proprietor will just run away to the UK or the US and you lose your money. Yeah, they also have a point. But there should be a radical change in all of US Corporate Ghana and then citizen Ghana.
- [63:30]
A
So just something I've got to ask.
- [63:34]
B
Okay.
- [63:34]
A
It's a difficult ask which is are you willing to have only three of my audience who are willing to just come and observe what you do at Modaya Farms simply to ask you questions and also learn.
- [63:48]
B
Just let me know.
- [63:49]
A
Thank you.
- [63:50]
B
And then I will take them around for them to see what we are doing, there's nothing hidden there. I, my, my, my vision is if this can be replicated, because I cannot. Moday Farms cannot supply the whole of Ghana. I wanted to be peri urban and then to target Accra because demand is here. Like I told you, if you are in Kintampo and you want to sell into Accra, you are in big trouble. It's a recipe for disaster. So you need to. If I'm doing it in Kumasi, I know. Okay. These guys like this, this, this. So I have to.
- [64:27]
A
Right, you've got to be in a Cashman area.
- [64:29]
B
Yes, that area. Okay. But yeah, what we've done, I think it can be replicated anyway. Yeah.
- [64:36]
A
So if you are that person that wants to learn from Mordecai Farms, you can drop a comment right here. But we're going to start from our community on tribe IO. At this point, I want to show you some of the products that they have. This is what we do here. So I think this is oven dried.
- [64:55]
B
Yes.
- [64:56]
A
Catfish, sliced. And this is curled catfish.
- [65:00]
B
Okay. So if you go to the market, you see the curled ones. Yeah. But the, the sliced one. This was an idea that came to my, it came to my mind that you're growing up and your mothers will be. Our mothers will be, will finish their soup and they will be dividing the fish. And it's hot. They have to go through that. So I said, okay, if I'm able to slice this fish, make it easier, it will be easier for them to give kwesi akuya akojo this. Maybe the big guy will get a curled one.
- [65:29]
A
Yeah.
- [65:30]
B
The father will get the curled one, which is what we do here. So I came up with that. Yeah. Initially it was, what is this? I don't like this. I took it to Kumasi. There was no head in it. Somebody asked me, where is the head? And I said, oh, I took out the head. So. Yeah. But how do I know this is a snake?
- [65:49]
A
Fair point.
- [65:50]
B
Yeah, fair point. You need to listen to them. So now we include the head and. Yeah. People come and say, yeah, we want, we want the slice one.
- [65:58]
A
I see. So what's the best advice you've ever received? Yep, this will get you to think.
- [66:07]
B
The best advice I've ever received. Yeah. My father told me to study. He said, study. If you study and you do very well, you can do whatever you want.
- [66:20]
A
You know, I was reading somewhere that you said your motivation for starting the farm was money.
- [66:26]
B
Of course, it's not a philanthropy. I have to make money. But I don't have to squeeze money out of my people. If I can make decent profit selling it at 100, why should I sell it at 150 or 200? Now I have my targets and I know where the business is going. And I know that if I make this amount of money I can, the company will be more than Right. I tell the workers, you are here not for a salary. This salary is. But if we make money in this company, Kwambwaji is not going to just keep it to himself and then his family. No, we're going to set up a bonus system because I know they live around. I mean, it's a village. So if you get a huge, I mean a sizable bonus, if we make money, you get a sense of. I'll see to you that you buy blocks.
- [67:27]
A
Right.
- [67:28]
B
Start building something and start building something. Yeah, No, I tell them, I say I'll come and see. No, this is your, your family. You just build. Build something here.
- [67:37]
A
Yeah.
- [67:38]
B
I mean, you can use it to do something. So. So yes, I want to make money.
- [67:46]
A
Yep. But for, for a company that started off just over, say, 2.5 million USD,
- [67:53]
B
what's the turnover currently the turnover now is okay. Because we're doing this and it's not like I told you, I, I need, I needed off takers. Yeah. We make revenues of maybe750,000 cities.
- [68:10]
A
That's yearly.
- [68:12]
B
So.
- [68:12]
A
Right.
- [68:12]
B
But we started. Okay. Started 2023. 2023 was virtually. Okay. Zero. 2024, 2025. But it's growing up right now. We're getting more people coming in. So people are patronizing now. So I think 2025 will be good for us.
- [68:30]
A
What has been your biggest channel for growing the business in terms of marketing more individuals?
- [68:37]
B
I see we sell to Max Martin, East Lagoon.
- [68:41]
A
Okay.
- [68:42]
B
Migmat made in Ghana. Gusto Migmat in East Lagoon. Migmat Laboni Poco Trading in Kumasi. But I think they haven't placed any order. And then someone in Kumasi also came and said, I want to sell your products. So those are the people we're selling to. And recently we've got people coming from Canada. I'm getting calls from Europe, Belgium and Germany. And then the Ivory Coast. Yeah. There's an order there for to be. To be taken to the Ivory Course right now as I speak.
- [69:14]
A
Thank you so much. I really appreciate you for coming in. I've enjoyed the conversation. And if you did make it to the end, can you leave a comment and let me know? How did you find this conversation? Did you get value out of it? I'd love to know in the comments. My name is Derek Abite and I'm out. Stay connected.