Episode 640: Heinrich Himmler Part IV - From Atlantis to Auschwitz

Summary

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Last Podcast on the Left – Episode 640: Heinrich Himmler Part IV – From Atlantis to Auschwitz

Overview

This episode explores the pseudo-history, occult ideology, and bizarre myth-making that Heinrich Himmler embedded into the Nazi regime, particularly as the SS was shaped in his image. The hosts—Marcus Parks, Henry Zebrowski, and Ed Larson—chronicle Himmler’s efforts to rewrite German history and spirituality, blending ancient myths (Atlantis, Aryans, Hyperborea), pseudoscience, and esoterica with the machinery of genocidal fascism. Through gallows humor and sharp commentary, the episode reveals how the Third Reich weaponized delusion, rewrote reality, and orchestrated atrocity beneath a veneer of mythical destiny.

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Key Discussion Points

1. The State of Nazi Germany in 1934–35

• By 1934, Himmler had consolidated control over the SS and Gestapo. The Night of the Long Knives wiped away Nazi internal dissent and gave the public the illusion of stability. ([04:25])
• Nazi policies were now free to follow the most deranged racial and mystical doctrines, grounded in fabricated Aryan myths.

“With Germany firmly in Nazi control, Himmler and the rest of the Nazis were free to reshape the country in their own image without opposition, using a framework that was directly inspired by the pseudo scientific and pseudo historical authors that Himmler and Hitler had loved so much.” – Henry [04:00]

2. The Aryan Myth and Nazi Race Ideology

• Nazis fetishized the image of tall, blonde, flaxen-haired Aryans, claiming they alone had gifted civilization to the world. ([05:05])
• Details behind the myth were invented—literal fan-fiction appropriated for state policy. This myth drove purges within the SS itself, as Himmler cut 60,000 “not Aryan enough” men, keeping only his personally idealized elite.
• The boys club atmosphere and obsession with beauty, fitness, and ritual permeated the SS. Outward physical superiority masked inward insecurity and neurosis. ([09:55])
• Discussion includes the irony of unfit Nazi leaders, the constant need for ceremonial affirmation, and even the notion that “Aryan” did not always mean white—contradictions that Nazi logic ignored or twisted at will. ([34:01])

"Heinrich Himmler used his main guys, the SS, as a sort of petri dish to game out a lot of the ideas put forth by his favorite right wing pseudoscientists and pseudo historians." – Henry [07:52]

3. Himmler’s Occult Obsession and Wewelsburg Castle

• Wewelsburg Castle was remodeled as the "Camelot" of the SS, a Nazi Arthurian retreat, and a physical anchor for their occult fantasies. Slave labor enabled its transformation. ([16:56])
• The Grail Room, modeled after Holy Grail mythology, exemplified Himmler’s belief that ritual, regalia, and myth would spiritually bind SS men.

“Himmler and his followers were obsessed with King Arthur… They considered them the pinnacle of white people.” – Marcus [23:05]

• These rituals—rings, daggers, cultish weddings, and pseudo-Christian festivals—prepared SS men emotionally to commit atrocities for the Nazi state.

“It only bound Himmler’s men further to the SS, making them far more amenable to carrying out the atrocities that Hitler would ask them to commit in just a few short years.” – Henry [26:29]

4. The Nazi Campaign to Replace Christianity

• Himmler, raised Catholic but deeply anti-Christian, sought to fully “de-Christianize” Germany, replacing Christian feasts with sun-worshipping solstice events and new, racially exclusive rituals. ([34:36],[35:33])
• Nazi pseudo-religion fused bad folklore, sun worship, and Hitler-worship, imposed through secret society induction and SS ritualized life events (marriage, birth).
• The hosts compare Himmler’s methods to cult leader tactics, noting the slow replacement of old belief systems with new symbols, ceremonies, and “saintly” figures of Nazi lore.

“This is what Himmler wanted: a state religion that sprang from the forests of Germany… a Nazi religion.” – Henry [34:46]

5. The Construction of Alternate Histories: The Ahnenerbe

• The Ahnenerbe (“Ancestral Heritage Society”) was established in 1935 as Himmler’s think tank for manufacturing a grand Aryan past.

“Its mission: find new evidence of the great deeds and accomplishments of the Germanic people—evidence sneakily hidden or destroyed by the Jews.” – Henry [50:32]

• Staffed by academics (some terrified, some true believers), the Ahnenerbe sent expeditions worldwide—seeking Aryan “roots” in Tibet, seeking a German Stonehenge, searching for Atlantis evidence, fabricating connections between Aryans and ancient Greeks, Romans, even Tibetans.
• Nazi history erased facts, asserted fantasies, and justified annihilation of others in the name of “ancestral lands.” Academic dissenters risked concentration camps.

“If it’s not reality, we’re going to make it a reality.” – Marcus [55:17]

6. Pseudoscience, Homophobia, and Eugenics

• The Ahnenerbe was also tasked to provide “scientific evidence” for Nazi social policies—such as the persecution of homosexual men (Himmler claimed it was contagious) and the valorization of “Aryan blood” as a literal magic elixir. ([55:34],[61:37])
• Crackpot theorists and fringe occultists dominated Nazi research. The podcast features the story of Carl Maria Willigut (aka "Wise Thor"), an institutionalized lunatic who became Himmler’s “Rasputin,” “channeling” Aryan history in a state of delirium. ([73:02])
• The Nazis borrowed and expanded American eugenics practices, launching the Lebensborn program to encourage “racially pure” births and facilitate the kidnapping and re-education of Aryan-appearing children. ([109:17])

7. Contradiction, Bullshit, and the Fascist Method

• Nazi mythology required cognitive dissonance: contradictory “histories,” irrational cosmology (the “world ice theory”), and a willingness to believe anything, so long as it justified Nazi goals.

“It's not necessarily about what is true, as much as about what can be true… Just so long as it feeds back into the movement.” – Henry [95:33]

• The hosts draw contemporary parallels: how authoritarians use propaganda, spectacle, and victimhood narratives; how cult behavior and “feels right” intuition are manipulated on a mass scale.

8. The Path to War: Expansion, Appeasement, and Collaboration

• The last segment details how Hitler, emboldened by inaction from Britain and France, escalated annexations from Austria to Czechoslovakia to Poland—each new victory feeding Nazi myth and public mania. ([124:21])
• Himmler’s SS, meanwhile, prepared rituals, uniforms, and the machinery of genocide to launch in the conquered East.
• Corporations (including BMW and Mercedes) supported the Nazi apparatus, funding Ahnenerbe projects in pursuit of favor and contracts.
• The episode closes by warning listeners—which the hosts stress is not mere “Hitler derangement syndrome”—of the real dangers in normalizing fascist logic and propaganda today.

"Just know these guys burn out. Remember that, little Nazis out there—your job isn’t safe." – Marcus [127:42]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

On Nazi pseudo-spirituality and myth-making:

“Heinrich Himmler used his main guys, the SS, as a sort of petri dish to game out a lot of the ideas put forth by his favorite right wing pseudoscientists and pseudo historians.” – Henry [07:52]
"This is all a part of an indoctrination process." – Marcus [28:12]

On Nazi rituals and their absurdity:

"If you joined after number 2000, you could earn a ring by becoming a leader in the SS. And earning that spot usually meant that you had done or were willing to do horrible shit.” – Henry [26:26]
“Marriage ceremonies in Himmler's new religion would start with quotes from Hitler speeches, followed by…a handshake to commemorate a commitment to a shared life ... and the SS anthem of loyalty." – Henry [39:13]

On Carl Maria Willigut, Himmler’s batty spiritual advisor:

“He believed that he could see into the past … the racial soul, the collective unconscious only for white people.” – Marcus [74:31]
“Yeah, Carl, I fucking hate you. Shut up.” – Marcus, on Willigut’s obsession with polishing rocks [75:45]

On Nazi pseudoscience:

“Himmler believed that if the Ahnenerbe could somehow crack the code of synthesizing pure Aryan blood…that blood could heal all illness, transform those of mixed blood into pure blooded Aryans and produce superior livestock. It's an all in one.” – Henry [61:37]

On the cult-like dynamic of fascism:

“It’s not necessarily about what is true, as much as about what can be true, just so long as… it constantly feeds back into the central ideas of the movement… So it all just gets added up and up until nothing is true and everything is true.” – Henry [95:33]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Introduction / Taylor Swift SS necklaces joke: [02:40]
• SS Aryan purity, absurd rituals: [09:55 – 16:56]
• Wewelsburg Castle & Nazi Grail Room: [16:56 – 23:05]
• De-Christianizing Germany, Nazi pseudo-religion: [34:36 – 38:24]
• Ahnenerbe founded, Nazi alternate histories: [50:32 – 55:17]
• Pseudoscience, Aryan blood, Carl Willigut: [61:37 – 73:02]
• World Ice Theory, contradictions: [91:23 – 96:15]
• Expansion and annexation—Austria, Czechoslovakia, lead-up to WWII: [124:21 – 127:28]
• Lebensborn & Nazi eugenics: [109:17 – 113:12]
• Outro / Contemporary warnings: [126:15 – 128:13]

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Style and Tone

• Hosts balance exhaustive research with irreverent, biting humor (“Cabbage Patch doll with half a shaved head…”; “Wise Thor,” and absurd riffs on Nazi failures).
• Commentary is both darkly comic and sharp in its historical analysis, drawing pointed parallels to contemporary political events and the mechanisms of cult thinking.
• Regular reminders that the myth-focused, ritualized, pseudo-academic Nazi worldview was both dangerous and, at its core, utterly ridiculous.

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Bottom Line

This episode deftly illustrates how Himmler’s obsession with myth, ritual, and pseudoscience shaped the SS and Nazi policy, setting the stage for the Holocaust and the horrors of World War II. The hosts dissect how delusion, ritual, cult thinking, and systemic lies can bring about catastrophe—while never losing sight of the importance of facing such histories with clarity, dark wit, and vigilance.

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End of Episode Summary

Transcript

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[Marcus Parks]

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[Henry Zebrowski]

There's no place to escape to. This is the last on the left.

[Marcus Parks]

That's when the cannibal started. What was that? Oh, today. I just want to say, before we even begin, thank you to Voton.

[Henry Zebrowski]

No.

[Marcus Parks]

For allowing me to have the white strength in order to do this show. If it wasn't.

[Ed Larson]

He's the bootleg transformer.

[Marcus Parks]

That's actually. It's a big bone of contention. It's a big bone of contention because he. The one thing he does not like being at all is unified with anything.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

So Votan is really does not enjoy the whole pageantry of the other racial monsters that show up to create him.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

Yes. But Votan, what up? Thanks again for making me pink. It's nice to be on your planet. Earth. And man, oh man, I sure hope you put another Christ out there for us to destroy as a puppet of your unwillingness to sacrifice yourself.

[Ed Larson]

Well, once Greta becomes a man, she will be that Christ.

[Marcus Parks]

My sweet Votan's bride.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Welcome to the last podcast on the left. Ladies and gentlemen, my name is Marcus Parks. I'm here with Voton's number one boy, Henry Zabrowski. That's me.

[Marcus Parks]

I'm looking for all the greatness in every rock that might look like an ox. That's a deep cut. We'll talk about what that means.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Deep cut. I know exactly what you mean. I don't. And with us, the man who knows nothing, Ed Larson.

[Ed Larson]

That's right. I am Votann's 420th man.

[Marcus Parks]

Taylor Swift is definitely Hitler's grand niece, right?

[Ed Larson]

Yeah. Who are great grand niece.

[Marcus Parks]

I believe there's no way. She's not. She's selling new SS necklaces.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Is she?

[Marcus Parks]

Have you seen this thing?

[Henry Zebrowski]

I have not.

[Ed Larson]

She took them off her website. They're lightning bolt necklaces.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Double lightning. Two double lightning bolt necklaces.

[Marcus Parks]

They're next to each other.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

People are upset about it, but eight.

[Ed Larson]

Pointed star and lightning bolt necklace.

[Marcus Parks]

Himmler would have so many notes for this necklace that to be honest, I think Taylor Swift should be ashamed.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, yeah. Because him. Oh, that's. Yeah, that.

[Marcus Parks]

I don't know. It's loose.

[Ed Larson]

I don't think it is.

[Henry Zebrowski]

I think it's.

[Ed Larson]

I think, I definitely think it's a mistake. But man, you got to, you got to check your notes.

[Marcus Parks]

No, exactly. Him. Or would look at this and be like, how about the doubles him up?

[Henry Zebrowski]

I mean, I'm willing to bet that the person who designed this was far more inspired by both than Himmler. But looking at it, holy shit. It looks like Nazi jewelry. It looks. That looks like something that's like in the German museum in the bad section.

[Marcus Parks]

The only thing that we just can count on is the lack of education of the zoomers. And that's what has led to this.

[Henry Zebrowski]

So here we are for Heinrich Himmler Part 4. So when we last left Heinrich Himmler, the year was 1934. And everything was very unfortunately going Himmler's way.

[Marcus Parks]

Everything coming up.

[Ed Larson]

Himmler, you'll be swell. You'll be great. I got the whole Reich on my plate.

[Marcus Parks]

That's fun. Starting here. Starting now, honey. Every. Jews counting.

[Henry Zebrowski]

The concentration camps were becoming an essential feature of the Third Reich. Those were of course, Heinrich Himmler's creation. The Gestapo was under Himmler's direct command. That's the German secret police. And the Night of the Long Knives had both destroyed any internal opposition within the Nazi party. And it had tricked the German people into thinking that the Nazi chaos had passed. And so, with Germany firmly in Nazi control, Heinrich Himmler and the rest of the Nazis were free to reshape the country in their own image without opposition, using a framework that was directly inspired by the pseudo scientific and pseudo historical authors that Himmler and Hitler had loved so much.

[Ed Larson]

So if they were doing it in Himmler's image, it would be a Cabbage patch doll with half a shaved head.

[Marcus Parks]

Yes, it would look like a hungover worm.

[Henry Zebrowski]

According to the Nazi leaders very selective reading of history, only one race fit into the category of the so called founders of culture. These founders were the entirely fictional creation of various fever brained German racists. They were the tall, willowy flaxen haired Aryans of northern Europe. But going off those feverish fictional accounts, Hitler and his ilk believed that only the Aryans had the genius necessary to create civilization and its byproducts like music, literature, agriculture, architecture. It was the Aryans, according to the Nazis, who had single handedly advanced all of humankind with their unparalleled brilliance.

[Marcus Parks]

And that honestly really kind of speaks to the fact that I left several one star reviews on every single the weekend album because it never featured a tuba.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

And I don't really know what music is without a tuba.

[Ed Larson]

That's all they have is tuba.

[Marcus Parks]

This is also.

[Henry Zebrowski]

And the accordion.

[Ed Larson]

Beautiful noises.

[Marcus Parks]

You see, you say selective reading. I'm actually now my last little jump into this whole fun world of this ideology. It's more of, and I hate to say this, Marcus, they were lying about a lot of stuff. They made up a lot of things, Marcus. They saw stuff on walls and cave walls and just kind of said it was giant Aryans versus the Jews. Whoever, whatever it was.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah, yeah. If you think that Aryans built the pyramids.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, dude. Without SPF 100.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Now Heinrich Himmler of course believed in the Aryan myth as well. But the difference between Himmler and Hitler is that Adolf Hitler's belief in all this ship was more surface level. Hitler liked these ideas because they were useful for his ultimate goal of restarting the Great War. So the details didn't really matter. In fact, for Hitler the details could be kind of embarrassing.

[Marcus Parks]

Oh yeah. Because guess what? The details found out. It's all brown people.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

Every single thing you wished white people did, it was done by brown people first.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. And all of the details of the cosmology, the details of, you know, Atlantis and all that. Like, like Hitler has to go and like hang out with the King of Italy and impress him as a commoner and he doesn't want to carry all this baggage like. And also did you know we're from Atlantis? That's great, right? Yeah. Like he.

[Marcus Parks]

I had flippas. Yeah, Flippers. And then people take it from me.

[Ed Larson]

It is crazy because Atlantis famously failed.

[Marcus Parks]

It existed.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, that's the thing, is that there's a reason why Atlantis failed and it's a big part of the Holocaust. Himmler, however, as opposed to Hitler, he was all about the details. In his deep, unassailable belief in the myths created by the aforementioned Volkish movement. They informed his every decision. Inspired by these beliefs, Heinrich Himmler used his main guys, the ss, as a sort of petri dish to game out a Lot of the ideas put forth by his favorite right wing pseudoscientists and pseudo historians. This was all in service to expanding his long held fantasies in which Germany was destined to grow into a race of purebred Aryan warrior farmers who would eventually rule the globe.

[Ed Larson]

This Bible fan fiction is so annoying.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Honestly, beyond that, it's way beyond the Bible. In fact, it's too Jewish. Yeah, Bible's way too Jewish. Yeah. I mean there is definitely some things that they take from the Bible. Like the Great Flood is a really big part of it. Like the antediluvian, like that's, that's a very big part of it.

[Marcus Parks]

Do you want me to get into positive Christianity? Oh, no, the whole thing. We'll figure. Honestly, it's not this episode, it's a later episode, unfortunately.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Now Himler's never ending obsession with racial purity was especially on display in the way that he developed the ss. And it actually prevented him from making the SS as large of an organization as it could have been. After Himmler took on a fair amount of Ernst Rome's SA men after the Night of the Long Knives, Himmler purged the SS of some 60,000 men for not being Aryan enough. Which brought the ranks of the SS down to what Himler believed was an elite group of 200,000 Aryans. Now these men were expected to be first and foremost Aryan perfection when it came to surface level looks. Because Himmler was obsessed with surrounding himself with beautiful blonde young men who met his very fussy standards.

[Marcus Parks]

Big pink nippled, golden.

[Henry Zebrowski]

You ever see, I don't like the small nipples on the man. I think that Aryan should have the big puffy nipples.

[Marcus Parks]

Puffy nipples, like beautiful drum and breast. Have you ever seen blonde pubes?

[Ed Larson]

No.

[Marcus Parks]

Right?

[Ed Larson]

No.

[Marcus Parks]

That's how you know you're Aryan. If you have blonde pubes, like literally like, like not to be like this Marilyn Monroe in your pants that is going to like. It's so hard. If your pubes have a sheen and a bounce to them, your Aryan material all the way, baby.

[Ed Larson]

Die.

[Marcus Parks]

You shave them? Yeah, you shave them. They come back different every time.

[Henry Zebrowski]

But these men in the SS were also expected to be physically fit. This was merely an extension of the overall Nazi milieu because physical fitness had become a nationwide obsession.

[Marcus Parks]

When you go a little bit through more like, you know, the Volk like lifestyle. Did you ever hear about the paintings of Fidus?

[Henry Zebrowski]

I did not.

[Marcus Parks]

The paintings of Fidus hung in many, many rural German like homes. And it was one of those proto super racist things that now we Know is a massive dog whistle.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

Like if you had it in your home, you would eventually become a Nazi. Ostensibly.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Sure.

[Marcus Parks]

And Fidus loved painting naked German boys worshiping the sun. And so it's this idea of a free flowing, blonde, locked, naked boy being caressed. His buttocks, his tender buttocks, his little prepubescent penis and balls being caressed by the light of the sun.

[Henry Zebrowski]

This really has nothing to do with what I just said, but it's about.

[Marcus Parks]

This idea of physical fitness. They view. They view. This is all of the. Taking it back to the homeland. The pure body. The pure body of the. The German man. The Germanic person was just like he was taught. And he jumped from tree to tree.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yes.

[Ed Larson]

And Goring showed that with his physical fatness.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yes.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, that's what was ironic about all of this, is because the Germans were obsessed with health and obsessed with physical fitness and obsessed with presenting this ideal body. It's ironic when you consider the physical shape of the Nazi leaders. Hitler was dumpy and disheveled. Goebbels was a fucking living skeleton. And Goring, he looked like a fucking pig that had been turned into a human by a witch's curse.

[Marcus Parks]

Unfortunately, I'm becoming a bit of a Goring head.

[Henry Zebrowski]

And he.

[Marcus Parks]

What a fashion sense, though.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Oh, man.

[Marcus Parks]

Wow. When he wore that periwinkle blue suit for all those Nazis, Wow. He must have been. That's bravery.

[Henry Zebrowski]

He looked like Otho and Beetlejuice. Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

Yes. I don't even realize that.

[Ed Larson]

So did they ever get all the generals together and tell them they were too fat?

[Marcus Parks]

No. No, they never had the balls. No, they never did.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Now, Heiner Kimmler was of course, no different from the rest of the Nazi leaders in his lack of physical fitness. Himmler was a nerd, a bookworm. But he nevertheless tried to keep up with the jocks that made up the majority of the ss. See, Himmler instituted strict physical requirements for SS members. And the SS officers who were at the top of their game could earn a special SS sports badge by completing a grueling physical routine. Himmler actually once tried to run the routine himself.

[Marcus Parks]

Lift me up to me to my sides, officers. Up the road they go.

[Henry Zebrowski]

But his pigeon shaped reader's body performed so poorly that his assistants had to eventually just tell him that he met all the necessary standards, just so Himmler would stop humiliating himself. Because your boss is in front of you struggling to get through an obstacle course. You have to go like Heinrich. Heinrich. And also, by the way, do you know what Heinrich? What? The English version of Heinrich Is.

[Marcus Parks]

It's Henry.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. Yes. Oh, yeah. Oh, I know.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

Heiney Heineke, please.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Just cool it.

[Marcus Parks]

I'm sucking this trash can.

[Henry Zebrowski]

And you know what? Being stuck in the trash can is the way you win the brat. Here you go.

[Marcus Parks]

I know I'm the meanest, best Nazi in the whole virus.

[Ed Larson]

Thank you. It's like just running, trying to do it. And everyone's like, hey, you did it.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

Congratulations. You did it.

[Ed Larson]

I can't believe you completed it so fast.

[Marcus Parks]

That's what's great about not really giving a shit about anything, is that you'll take that as a win.

[Henry Zebrowski]

The Aryan appearance and physical fitness of the SS was merely the base requirements for Himmler's ultimate fantasy involving his men. But it must not be forgotten that the ss, even through all this goofy shit, they were some of the cruelest, most brutal people to ever walk this earth. See, Himmler envisioned the SS as a group of medieval knights who were both deeply religious and chivalrous, dedicated to the goals of conquest and conversion. Men like the Knights of the Crusades. For his own part, Himmler was obsessed with being the leader of these Teutonic knights, the Grand Master.

[Marcus Parks]

Do you not believe that there is part of this is a function of ruling over people that are. Would be considered your physical superior?

[Henry Zebrowski]

Perhaps.

[Marcus Parks]

I actually sometimes wonder if that's a part of what you see, which is that Heinrich Himmler likes the power position of telling built, vicious men what to do. And then he gets a little extra hard being able to do that and they. And they can't do anything at him because he's the leader.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. I mean, well, Heiner Kimler always did want to project himself as this sort of manly man, you know, he wanted to be amongst the tough boys in Germany. Like when we talked in the first episode about the fencing. Yes. Like, we didn't quite get what it actually was, what fencing in Germany at the time actually was, what it involved.

[Marcus Parks]

It's the dumbest shit you've ever seen.

[Henry Zebrowski]

It's so incredibly stupid. I mean, it really just involves Germans cutting each other's faces.

[Marcus Parks]

They slap each other with. With swords, with sharpened rapiers. This is why at first we didn't bring it up.

[Henry Zebrowski]

I thought it was just fence, like Olympic fencing.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah. But then it turns out this style of fencing was entirely different. And it was. It was a shallow exercise in getting men face scars so that they can look tough later on, which is why so many Nazis had facial scars. Because they purposely got facial scars in their fencing schools in order to look scary.

[Ed Larson]

Oh, it's like when a rapper gets shot for cred.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Exactly. Exactly what it was like. And during these fencing competitions, they would actually have the like quote unquote competitions. They would actually have doctors on site to make the scars worse because they wanted to look tough. That's why so many Nazis are covered in scars.

[Marcus Parks]

Dude, have you seen and then the doctor come in. I was watching footage of one of these actual old fights. And then the doctor's the scariest man you've ever seen, cuz he's covered in fencing scars. And he seemed coming up going like.

[Henry Zebrowski]

You know what I mean?

[Ed Larson]

Like, is there another guy? Do we have another guy?

[Marcus Parks]

His eyes like on backwards, you know, and he's just like, yeah, they're good.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. So yes, I do think there is definitely something with him or wanting to be considered a man. Like he is the leader of the manly man without having to actually do any of the things that it requires to actually be a quote unquote manly man.

[Marcus Parks]

Because they're very hard and very dangerous.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yes. But concerning Himmler's fantasies, in the end, what night fantasy is complete without an actual castle? So to complete the dream, Himmler found his Camelot at a castle named Wewelsburg. Located in an out of the way location in northwestern Germany. The foundations of Castle Wewelsburg dated back to the 14th century. But its isolation made it easy for Himmler to use slave labor from a nearby concentration camp to accomplish the incredible amount, amount of remodeling that the place needed. After Himmler's vision was realized, he made Vevelsburg the place where he could truly let all of his occult fantasies run wild.

[Marcus Parks]

Like, that's when I go to Club Met.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

That's what I do. Yeah. Lots of candles, lots of sage. Werg is a. It's an interesting thing because this is a thing that Nazis would do. The Nazis would take old buildings and they would turn them into kind of like new strongholds. And then now we're also seeing the advent of like Albert Speer doing the giant religious style. Like this idea of we're going to live in eternity.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

Because that's the key here, is that the castle connects the Nazis to ancient times. But then the castle will stand, quote unquote, forever to bring the Nazis into future times.

[Henry Zebrowski]

The thousand year, Right.

[Marcus Parks]

Yes. And so that's what the, all of this stuff's always about, is building a thing that is so hard to destroy that it'll be there forever. Yeah.

[Ed Larson]

And they always put it on the top Of a mountain.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Right, right.

[Ed Larson]

Like closer to God type of thing.

[Marcus Parks]

Well, this one was already on one.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. I mean, it's. It's a lot of. It is building on the foundations of what's already there. But Hitler's his retreat. The. The Berghoff or something like. I think that's what it was called. Yeah, it was on top of a mountain as well. That's where all the Nazis would go to hang out and, you know, have their fun weekends together where nobody sits.

[Marcus Parks]

To talk about the Jews.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Because they give us a break, actually. Well, no, they. They thought it was g. To talk about the final solution when they were on vacation.

[Ed Larson]

Oh.

[Marcus Parks]

I mean, yeah. It's worse work.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

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[Henry Zebrowski]

Now Himmler's castle was run as a sort of monastery where privileged SS men, Himmler's top knights, so to speak, could use it for retreats. Unfortunately for the SS men though, these retreats were all planned by Himmler who would force his men to participate in weekends that were half larping and half pseudohistorical study.

[Ed Larson]

Oh, I hate when a nerd owns the timeshare.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Right?

[Marcus Parks]

Gotta go to school. I thought we were drinking Natty Lights and finding.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, I guess we don't have to do what I want to do. It's just, you know, I paid for it, you know, it's fine, you know, if we, if the group doesn't want to, it's just, you know, it's absolutely fine.

[Marcus Parks]

It just seems that it would be a total waste of the Grail Room.

[Henry Zebrowski]

But.

[Marcus Parks]

That is fine.

[Henry Zebrowski]

The things that Himmler did in the end create a perfect atmosphere to make all of his bullshit seem real. In the remodel, Himmler had the entire castle complex adorned with runic designs that would set the MO but the castle centerpiece was the Grail Room. See, Himmler and his followers were obsessed with King Arthur. It's not just an Indiana Jones thing. That shit was real.

[Marcus Parks]

Can I also say why? It's because they were, they considered them to be like the pinnacle of white people.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

And so they assumed that the other pinnacle of white people, according to them of the, the height of the, the dynasties of the of England and UK would be some has to connect to Nazis.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

So they looked up to the Brits in a way. In a way, the old white people, they looked up to the Celts.

[Henry Zebrowski]

And it's about separating the medieval from the modern. You know, it's like, because they can always say. They can always kind of put a. A point, a stop point on anything and say. And that's the moment when the Jews took over that country, and that's the moment when the races became too mixed. And so they can. Can pick a moment whatever moment they want and say, everything before that was great, and we love it, but that's a moment. Now, I don't like that.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, because they didn't like the fact that they had built a whole thing that they were. That white aliens from space came down animals here and made Jewish people and black people. Like, that's kind of like one of the big things. And that's. That was one of the big issues when Earth went wrong.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah, yeah, I. I mean, I agree.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, Himmler's followers believe that the Holy Grail was a magical stone of light that had fallen from the jewele headband of an ancient sun God. If one were to merely look upon this stone, Himmler believed that man would live forever.

[Marcus Parks]

The power of immortality.

[Ed Larson]

It's such a lazy way to become immortal.

[Marcus Parks]

Hey, you want to be an immortal? Look at this rock.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Got you. The Himler was counting on his assumption that the Grail would be found once the war finally began. So he constructed a room in his castle with a large rock crystal in the center, illuminated from the bottom with electrical lights for a effect. This would be with the Grail would one day be kept and utilized by only the most select of SS men.

[Marcus Parks]

Vberg will never reach full potential, and largely it's because of how the war turned out. But you also. We got to remember every single time they do something like this. The reason why Himmler's doing this is not for now, it's for after.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

This is for. This is supposed to be for after the war, when Nazism has conquered every everything. Yeah. And now this is the capital of Nazism.

[Henry Zebrowski]

And today, Wavelsburg is one of the largest youth hostels in Europe, which means it's just full of people of every single race, color, and creed. Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

People just cornholing each other, doing whippets.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Since Himmler had, in effect, built a secret clubhouse for the ss, it was only logical that the clubhouse would be followed by all the rituals and accoutrement that go along with most secret societies.

[Marcus Parks]

Because why. Why are you doing it in the first place if you're not gonna have the cool?

[Henry Zebrowski]

Exactly.

[Ed Larson]

It's a frat house.

[Marcus Parks]

Yes.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. These trappings of course. Only. Well, I would actually say that the concentration camps are closer to frat houses than. Than Wavelsburg is. Like. Wavelsburg is more like.

[Marcus Parks]

Well, they have a lot of ice loses. I did a lot. Yeah, they have.

[Ed Larson]

Jagger.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Was like. I was talking about last week in Dachau. Like, there was the frat boy atmosphere. That was the concentration camps. Yeah. Werg was, I guess, more of a Bohemian Grove type thing. Like it was where you went to do very serious.

[Marcus Parks]

It was Vatican City. It was the heart of the holy part of the Nazi empire.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. Vatican City. That would be a great comparison.

[Ed Larson]

Club 33.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

Thank you. To translate to the Disney adults.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, these trappings, the accoutrement and the rituals, they only bound Himmler's men further to the ss, making them far more amenable to carrying out the atrocities that Hitler would ask them to commit in just a few short years. As it goes with secret societies, it also gave the men in the lower ranks of the SS a gold to work towards. For example, every SS man with a membership number less than 2000 had been gifted a Death's head ring by Himmler, which made them all feel very cool and very special. But if you joined after number 2000, you could earn a ring by becoming a leader in the ss. And earning that spot usually meant that you had done or were willing to do horrible shit. To further drive home that violence was at the heart of everything, Himmler also presented SS leaders with ceremonial daggers. Every noble. November 9th, my mom's birthday. Wow. Good couple. And then two days.

[Ed Larson]

Let's get her a dagger.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Henry Zebrowski]

The day before my wedding anniversary as well.

[Ed Larson]

Two days after Tootsie's birthday. We could do this all day.

[Henry Zebrowski]

November 9th is also the anniversary of the founding of the SS. Wow.

[Marcus Parks]

Happy birthday, Mom.

[Ed Larson]

I know what I'm getting her this year.

[Henry Zebrowski]

And during the presentation, Himmler would say this.

[Marcus Parks]

I confer on you the sword of the ss. Never draw its without need. Never sheath it without honor. Preserve your own honor as unconditionally as you are committed to respecting the honor of others and to acting chivalrously. To defend to the fenceless.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. Means nothing. Yeah.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

Because they don't defend the defense. It's all horseshit. He's saying a nightly thing to them to again. This is all a part of an indoctrination process.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. And this whole idea of like, you're defending the defenseless is in Nazi ideology. And the way the Nazis look at the world and the way they look at Germany is that they're all defenseless and that they've all been put upon and they've all been attacked for thousands upon thousands of years. They have this persecution complex because that's the only way that works.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah.

[Ed Larson]

It's so contradictory. Because if they're defenseless, then why are they the master race?

[Marcus Parks]

Well, the idea is they carry. It's holding the two in your hand. Part about fascism is that it does not have to make sense.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Ed Larson]

Also, I think I made some sense out of the rings, I'll tell you that much.

[Marcus Parks]

2.

[Ed Larson]

First 2000 get rings. He started was like, oh, we're running out of rings. You got to do something special if you want to.

[Marcus Parks]

Let me see if I have any around.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

To like merch, maybe. It's like beer koozies.

[Ed Larson]

The whole thing's merch.

[Henry Zebrowski]

It is, it is. But concerning, you know, the. The. The whole mass. The thing that, like, seems like it's a contradiction with the master race. It's not. It's actually. It's a feature of it. But. Because the idea. Because the thing is about the Nazis, I think I said earlier, is like, there is an engine, there's a motor within every Nazi and especially within Hitler and within Himmler, is that, yes, we are the master race and we've got to do everything we can to get back on top because we've been knocked down. And those people over there, the Jews, they're so powerful that they have even managed to knock the master race down. But we got to get back up again and we got to do it as fast as we possibly can. We can never stop moving. We can never stop working towards end the. That goal. So, yeah, feature. Now, Heinrich Himmler was obviously taking a lot of inspiration from the Crusades with his night fantasies, which the Crusades were a decidedly Christian undertaking.

[Marcus Parks]

Yes.

[Henry Zebrowski]

But that did not mean that Himmler was inspired by or was even tolerant of Christianity itself. In fact, just like fellow top Nazi Joseph Gerals, Heinrich Himmler absolutely despised Christianity.

[Marcus Parks]

And we did talk a little bit about some. So, yes, there was obviously, obviously a lot of Christianity in Germany. And yes, Martin Luther came from it. We were trying to even talk about is the idea that what Germany had specifically was a bunch of nomadic cultures that all had their own set of folk beliefs mixed in with whatever Christian stuff that's also sort of mixed in. Yes, there were Christian enclaves, but the heart of the Germanic people was kind of still this vaguely up for the. Up for grabs. Kind of like it fa. A lot of the Christian stuff failed And a lot of it succeeded. So it' really just where you found yourself, but you're also sitting next to all of these like magical, ancient Germanic things that you're supposed to then consider.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, and I. Yeah, and I'm very, I'm well aware of course, that, you know, Austria was a very Catholic country. Going to get to that later, but if you listen to what I actually said, perhaps I can say it again, is that the Germans did not take to Christianity as much as the others. The others? Yes, like the Italians or the English.

[Marcus Parks]

But that's what left a wide. This is why we're even talking about the angle of the Nazis again, is because they took that gap and filled it. Because that was an extremely important part of the lore for the thing to last for 3,000 years. The key here is that Nazism's supposed to last forever when this is over. Nazism supposed to. Once Nazism hits the world, they believe the whole world is going to be so excited to accept Nazism. So they think that this is just the beginning of a new thing. Yeah, they're building something.

[Henry Zebrowski]

It's the beginning of like the shit that people say like to and have even been saying for the last few decades is like, you know what, you're just thinking it, I'm actually saying it. And that's what the Nazis think, is that like once they think, once they get to America, they're like, oh shit, look at how racist America is. They're gonna love us once we get there. Like, we just have to get through a few people who. We have to get rid of the communists and the Jews. Then once we do that, then America's. The whole world's gonna love it. Yeah. Well, Himmler's vision for the future of Germany was a completely de. Christianized country that had ancient ties to both the lost continent of Atlantis and the mythical to Tibetan civilization of shambhala. That is 100% true.

[Marcus Parks]

Yep.

[Henry Zebrowski]

These advanced civilizations, Himmler believed, have been destroyed or corrupted by the Jews. And the Nazis were the only remnants of their bloodlines left because there's always.

[Marcus Parks]

White people in the Indian Ocean and there's always white people in the mountains of Tibet because they believe that during the flood that was the only high ground.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, but that's the other thing too. You're also making, you're making a logical fallacy here is that Aryan does not necessarily equal white.

[Marcus Parks]

Correct.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Like that is in the, in their view, Aryan does not necessarily mean white.

[Marcus Parks]

But they're looking for white seeds.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Definitely looking for that.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, they Want it Because had to.

[Ed Larson]

Say that to get the Japanese on board.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Sure.

[Marcus Parks]

I guess that's actually one of those things that I know very little about and we will one day do because I do feel like that's the whole, the Jap, the Japanese side of it. I only know so much about it. I don't really know how everybody got in bed together.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, that's for another time. Yeah. But as to why that bloodline did not continue indefinitely, the bloodline from Atlantis and Tibet, Himmler partly blamed that on the Teutonic conversion from paganism to Christianity, which was considered by Himmler to be history's greatest sin. In his view, even though Charlemagne the Great had begun the first Reich with the founding of the Holy Roman Empire, Charlemagne's Christianity had prevented so called Germanic virtues from unfolding to their full potential during the medieval age. Now, Himmler was born and raised Catholic, but once he learned that Christianity had its origins in the Middle east and that Jesus was logically a dark skinned Jewish man, Himmler chose, chose the ideas of the Volkish pseudo historians over his childhood faith.

[Marcus Parks]

He just had to wait a little while and then they would make Jesus into a Nordic Amorite that was a wizard that destroyed other rabbis.

[Henry Zebrowski]

You could do that too.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah. That's all you got to do, buddy.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah.

[Henry Zebrowski]

But Himler was Himler. That's the thing. I will say this principled, you say you can say nothing else about Hyru Cameral. Extraordinarily principle stuck to his guns.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, yeah.

[Henry Zebrowski]

And additionally, once Himmler began forming his own internal morality, he found that the core tenants of actual Christian humanity, charity, compassion, brotherhood, equality in the eyes of God. These were completely antithetical to Nazi ideology in every way.

[Marcus Parks]

This house chooses racial purity. This home embraces hyperborean qualities. Our Jesus is white.

[Henry Zebrowski]

On Himmler's mind, there was no way to square Christianity with Nazism because Himmler, as I said, was far too principled to use the Project 2025 method of ignoring or twisting anything in the Bible that was inconvenient to his own goals. So inst of using mental gymnastics to fit Christianity into his own morality, Himmler adapted volkish ideas to create a religion that in the words of one author, sprang from the forests of Germany. Under Himmler's guidance, Nazism would have a state religion and a God that had ideally been worshiped by the ancient tribal Germans, which is.

[Marcus Parks]

There wasn't one.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

It was all over the place. Paganism is.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. Now Himler was smart enough to know that he couldn't just come out and tell the men of the ss like, hey, we're worshiping the sun. Now give it the program.

[Marcus Parks]

Everybody shuts up and play volleyball. That's what they're doing. New sports.

[Ed Larson]

Volleyball.

[Advertiser]

Yeah.

[Henry Zebrowski]

I mean, remember, like, Zeno doesn't come into Scientology until you're ota. You can't start with the hard.

[Marcus Parks]

You got to be stuck on that line.

[Henry Zebrowski]

So to slow roll first his men and eventually all of Germany into his new belief system, Himmler wrapped the rituals that he created in Christian clothing in order to wean the SS off their Christian. Christian faith. For example, Himmler believed that he could use sun worship to replace Christian rites, like Easter and Christmas. For the summer, Himmler planned a solstice festival to celebrate life, while the winter would be marked with a similar solstice festival to remember the dead and honor their ancestors.

[Ed Larson]

It's like playing a game of the child, and they just keep changing the rules so they win.

[Marcus Parks]

A lot of times that child can't send you to a concentration camp. What if it could? I know. Oh, don't tell me. If you put a bunch of children together and told them they were in charge, the children would become Nazis. I know that they would. Have you ever seen children on a playground in elementary school?

[Henry Zebrowski]

You know, they actually do describe when the pogroms first began in Germany and in Czechoslovakia. Like, they described the children as some of the most terrifying people around when it came to, like, they would, like, you would see a pack of children chasing a Jewish man down the street so they could take. And they would, like, overtake him. Like, fucking. Like just like a bunch of fucking animals to overtake him. Like, Ian, stab him. They would have sticks and just didn't just beat him.

[Marcus Parks]

I started watching a thing, but I knew I wanted to wait till the end of the series. But talks all about that, about the deprogramming of the children of Nazi Germany is actually very interesting.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Ed Larson]

You couldn't just beat them.

[Marcus Parks]

You know, I. That was the first go.

[Henry Zebrowski]

But that's what made. That's what led to it in the first place. That was the whole. That was how the Germans were so inured to violence was because they had been beaten their entire childhoods, and they were like, oh, yeah, violence is fault. Fine.

[Ed Larson]

What if we put them in camps?

[Marcus Parks]

But they're day camps and we do things like we take canoes and. And they play javelin and they make. They make friendship bracelets.

[Henry Zebrowski]

The problem is a little thing called denazification. You can actually listen to our series of the no Dogs in Space series on Cannes for more on that. We actually went quite deep into denazification, but it's a. Yeah, it's a whole thing now. Once the ritual train got rolling, Himmler drew upon his Catholic heritage to come up with a whole host of customs and practices that would replace Christian rituals that surrounded birth, marriage, and death. These rituals were then forced upon Himmler's men in the ss, who practiced them dutifully and proudly. Marriage ceremonies in Himmler's new religion, for example, would start with quotes from Hitler speeches, followed by quotes from Friedrich Nietzsche's Thus Spake Zarathustra and a short speech from a local SS leader.

[Marcus Parks]

Wow, that's so romantic.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Oh, you think that's romantic?

[Marcus Parks]

Did you not like it when I read the Power of the Will at your wedding? Did you not like that when I read the student Garden at your wedding?

[Ed Larson]

So Himmler's basically a comedy booker these days. He already looks like Joe List if he didn't eat vegetables.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, got his fucking ass. Got the poorest one. Eddie, you just roasted the poorest one of that whole pack. All right, Joe.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, if you think all that's romantic, the bride and groom would then light a candle as a sign of the commencement of a new Germanic bloodline.

[Marcus Parks]

That's why I did not do the candle ceremony, actually, in yours. I was going to do it, and then I found it had some bad roots.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Thank you. I appreciate that. Thank you for cross referencing. Referencing that. But at the end, instead of a kiss to seal the union, SS marriages would be marked with a hearty handshake.

[Marcus Parks]

I gotta say, wife, it's been a great time and I can't wait to kill some Jews with you. Put her there.

[Ed Larson]

I love you, Marga.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, the handshake was to commit themselves. It would commemorate a commitment to a shared life that worked solely towards the furtherance of the Nazi Nazi state. Once the handshake was done, the marriage ceremony ended with everyone present signing the SS anthem of loyalty. And if Heiner Kemmler deemed the marriage important enough to attend, he would gift the couple a pair of silver goblets.

[Ed Larson]

Boring.

[Marcus Parks]

So much merch.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Now, once that newly wedded SS officer impregnated his wife in an act of functional Aryan sexual congress, the Nazi couple.

[Marcus Parks]

Can literally see be one of those where he has to put, like, the thermometer in her to see if, like, if she's ovulating and stuff like that, you know?

[Henry Zebrowski]

Oh, yeah. The Nazi couple would begin preparations for the inevitable birthing ceremony.

[Marcus Parks]

Yay.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Instead of A Christian baptism. A child would have a name consecration ceremony at an altar draped in a swastika flag under a picture of Hitler in a room decorated with black SS flags in Nordic runes. Nothing says baby like runes. The child would then be laid before the altar and those present would speak excerpts from Mein Kampf aloud. Although the Nazis, by this point, and actually this isn't, this was a new piece of information for me. They had actually started working excerpts from Mein Kampf into song. They had started making their own Nazi, basically their own hymns. And once finished with the Mein Kampf, whether it was spoken or song, where.

[Marcus Parks]

Hermler should have come in, because you've been like, oh child, that's not how you sing song. That's not how you sing a song. You gotta see, you got to clap your hands down.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Once finished with the Mein Kampf, the consecrator would say, we believe in the.

[Marcus Parks]

God of the universe and in the mission of a German blood that grows eternally young from the German soil. We believe in the nation, the bearer of this blood, and in the Fuhrer whom God has given.

[Henry Zebrowski]

That sounded just like praise music. That sounded like Christian. It sounded like a Christian song.

[Marcus Parks]

Now Chad, now you're praising the Lord. That's a nice singing. That's how I like to get you to move your feet back and forth, find the rhythm of the bass drum.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Then at long last, Heinrich Himmler himself would step in and present the baby with a silver cup and a silver spoon. Here's your cup, here's your spoon. Along with a large blue sash to commemorate the occasion.

[Ed Larson]

If the kid was Jewish, he'd be like, what, no fork?

[Marcus Parks]

This is my VR. Shall we ate the rice?

[Ed Larson]

I'm just saying if it's just a spoon, it's not like I have soup for every meal.

[Marcus Parks]

I also will say in this audience.

[Henry Zebrowski]

I'm like, what kind of person you think I just eat matzo ball soup every meal? No, I have many different things. It's a very. It's a varied and wide menu for the Jewish people. Jesus. Now, Himmler's hatred of Christianity and its brown origins were not his only motivation to create a Nazi religion. There was also of course, his hatred of the Jews and the ever important concept of Lebensraum. Himmler, however, had very cleverly worked out a way to link these two things together. In fact, it was essential that he linked these two things together. See, to Himler, Hitler and the rest, the Jewish people. The Jewish people were the so called destroyers of culture.

[Ed Larson]

Fuck, they are culture.

[Marcus Parks]

I Know, understand, like, we know this, but not. Nazis do a thing. You have to remember, it's. It seems vaguely familiar right now. They say things that are opposite. They do it specifically. Think about Joy Division. Think about these things that they do to make you think you're doing something good. They call it something good. So you're saying good words, you're saying National Socialist, you're saying these things that would make sense. They make sense in other concepts in another context. They remove the context, they change the context, and now you're a different person.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah, I just can't listen to that hippity hop music.

[Marcus Parks]

Nope.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, yeah. And the Nazis are also. And this is, you know, very much, I guess, inspire or influenced by Himler's just general way of being, is that the Nazis, once they get into power, they become the arbiters of culture. They become the ones who say, what is culture and what isn't? Like, there was even, I think, Goebbels put on like an exhibition that was a. A. What did he call it? Like a. It was something not deviant art, of course.

[Marcus Parks]

Goebbels was the one taking all the deviant art and hoarding it and doing all the. It was like Picasso and all those things. All the Impressionists.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, all the. Like Max Ernst, like. It was. Yeah. I can't remember what it was, but yeah, they. They came in and they said, this is what culture is and this is what culture isn't. And it just so happened that a lot of the culture that they hated was created by Jewish people. Yeah. Or people who were just groovy.

[Marcus Parks]

Well, they just assigned. Or they just decided they had too much Jew thought in them.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yes. That was also something that would be talked about. Well, the Jewish people were seen as the eternal foil to the Aryans. And the Nazis believed that the sole aim of the Jews was to undermine and corrupt the culture of other races, simply because that was the nature of the Jew. In fact, the Nazis looked at the whole Jewish question from a natural perspective, which is extremely important to understand because it allowed the Nazis to speak about the Jewish people in terms that they believed were reasonable. Nazis would very coldly and condescendingly say, you cannot blame a snake for being a snake. I think that you would use the word basilisk, but you would also not allow a snake to live in your home.

[Marcus Parks]

Some people have lots of stuff.

[Henry Zebrowski]

I know snake people. Well, if you were to say that, then they would say, well, if you were in a hotel and the bed was full of bedbugs, you would not Take a single bedbug and say, this is a good bedbug. You would merely exterminate all of the bedbugs.

[Marcus Parks]

I just have a hard time finding bed bugs.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, now you're just arguing with me for the sake of arguing.

[Marcus Parks]

Going, well, no, I'm arguing with a Nazi.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah. And I will say, say like since time has gone on, there's plenty of people with swastikas that have snakes in their house.

[Marcus Parks]

They do really see the media.

[Henry Zebrowski]

They really do. No, now that you, now that you mention it. But the point is, is that they were trying to use nature as a way to say that all Jews were dangerous. You can't say this Jew is one of the good ones. You cannot take an individual one. They all must be eliminated because they are all fundamentally the same, just as all snakes are fundamentally the same. But the flip side of that is that the Nazis also looked themselves from a natural perspective and from an animalistic perspective. But once you make yourself an animal and you make everybody animals, you're very much prone to do some very awful to other people.

[Marcus Parks]

Well, the. Also it's having the veneer of civility.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yes.

[Marcus Parks]

Every single time they have an opportunity, it's having this idea that we are having a civil science based conversation about all things. Everything must be. And that's why when they say the destruction destroyers of, of culture or the creators of culture, they're legitimately creating the culture. Like they are just saying that they're doing the opposite. They're destroying the other culture and creating a new culture.

[Ed Larson]

What if the snake was uncircumcised?

[Marcus Parks]

Again, this is a, this is deeper, this, a longer conversation. You got to get to episode seven, which now we're going seven episodes.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Now, naturally, not everyone in Germany was comfortable with the whole exterminate the Jews thing. So the Nazis did not embark upon the final solution immediately upon entering office. Instead, it was done in fits and starts throughout the 1930s so as to not totally freak people out. And also they're really relatively. As far as like the population goes, Jewish people made up like 1%. Yeah. Of the, of the entire German population. So if they started disappearing little by little, people aren't really going to notice. See, even though Hitler had been saying in interviews as early as 1922 that he wanted to see the streets of Munich lined with the rotting corpses of hanged Jews.

[Marcus Parks]

He said that funny.

[Ed Larson]

Nice place they want. They love cleanliness. They love making.

[Marcus Parks]

It's cuz it's funny, it's comedy. He's just, he's Just rattling cages, man.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, he's just rattling cages. Yeah. But there were many average Germans who didn't take him seriously, or they were at the very least willing to risk that Hitler was being serious if he gave them what they wanted. It's like how people who have half supported Trump over the years justified the awful things he said and done by claiming that Trump, Trump is just quote unquote, playing to his base.

[Marcus Parks]

You're the base.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. And while these people aren't necessarily bad, they're ignoring, they're ignoring the troublesome stuff because they're hoping that he's eventually going to get around to their wants and needs because they believe they're a part.

[Marcus Parks]

Of a selected subclass that will be treated special by the authoritarian government.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

And they don't understand that everybody, when everybody's a Nazi, everybody gets treated like a Nazi.

[Henry Zebrowski]

And Germany worked much the same way during the 1930s in the lead up to World War II. But what the German people didn't know was that they were being deliberately slow, rolled into accepting the worst of the Nazis goals little by little. Now, by the mid-1930s, Heinrich Himmler had spent years workshopping his ideas and beliefs within the SS. So in 1935, it seemed like Hitler felt like his beliefs were ready to be taken to a wider army audience. See, besides just creating a new religion for Germany, Himmler wanted to create a whole new history. This to me seems like the far more important task when it came to getting the average German on board with concepts like Lebensraum, in which Germans would take the land of others as their own because it was their ancestral right and it wasn't actually, wasn't that too far off for what World War I was? And if Himmler could create an atmosphere within Germany in which he could twist the truth to create proof that the Germans had lived in a region prior to the current occupants, then he could make, make the Germans believe that they were totally justified in eliminating said occupants. People like the Jews, the Polish or the Russians, and bigger and bigger.

[Marcus Parks]

And you had to create a fake past because the real past was that Germanic, the Germanic various tribes ran different city states in all this like very complicated, like mountainous region. And they all kind of believed in semi different things. And then the spread of Christianity kind of half worked. And it's kind of all this big mishigash of stuff like it's not. There is no central culture also just wasn't that impressive. No, it's not. They're, they're mountain people. They're Just. They're just people. They're just. They're. They're. They aren't. I'm sorry, Eddie, I know that you were worried about this, but Aryans are not the super menes that we thought. We were creating the whole world in their image.

[Ed Larson]

How dare you. I will say all the research and documentaries I've been watching and Germany does look beautiful.

[Henry Zebrowski]

It is.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah. It's beautiful country.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Absolutely gorgeous country.

[Marcus Parks]

It really is, but see, but we'll talk right now. It's actually feature. It works in. It works into the mythology perfectly well.

[Henry Zebrowski]

To replace Christianity and to justify the concept of Lebensraum, Heiner Himmler founded an Institution in 1935 with the goal of creating a new reality for not just the ss, but for the German people.

[Marcus Parks]

At large and then the world.

[Henry Zebrowski]

This institute was called the Anenerbe, and Himmler founded it with himself as superintendent. Basically, the mission of the Anaerbe was to find new evidence of the great deeds and accomplishments of the Germanic people. Evidence that had been sneakily hidden or destroyed by the Jews. This evidence would then be conveyed to the German people through the media, social events and scientific conferences. The idea was that if the lie in the legend was told enough, backed by pseudoscience and pseudo history, that felt right to the German people, because that's very important. It has to feel right.

[Marcus Parks]

That's the key.

[Henry Zebrowski]

That is the key. It has to feel right. And if it feels right, then the Germans would be far more. More amenable to all of the horrible that Himmler had planned. Unfortunately for millions, this turned out to be a very good bet on Himmler's part. Now, unlike Himmler's secret SS castle, the Anenerva was set up to be a respectable institute in the eyes of the German people. Its offices were in a nice villa in one of the wealthiest neighborhoods in Berlin, outfitted with all the latest technologies.

[Marcus Parks]

He wanted it to look nice and legit.

[Henry Zebrowski]

But Himmler also made sure that the ANBA had that mysterious occult edge that he added to almost everything, save for concentration camps. The halls in the Ananba offices were decorated with photos of arcane carved wooden symbols, and plaster casts of ancient runestones were scattered throughout so staff members could consult them before making big decisions. Now, this makes it sound like the Anarba was just a bunch of kooks, but there were plenty of supposedly legitimate scholars who participated in Himmler's nonsense. Partly these people participated because they were too scared not to. Partly. But some of them very much wanted Himmler's alternate history to Be true.

[Marcus Parks]

Because if it's all true, then everything can be excused and everything can have an actual rationale instead of what seems to be a giant, maniacal global madness that they are caught up in.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, we're not even there yet.

[Marcus Parks]

Oh, yeah.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Like, that's the thing is that like we're like, at this point, it's the beginning.

[Marcus Parks]

It's just heating up.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. It's bubbling at this point. It's not about justification at this point. It really is. And it can cannot be stressed enough. It's about feeling better. Because the German people feel like shit.

[Marcus Parks]

Were butthurt after what happened in World.

[Henry Zebrowski]

War I. Super butter.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah. And they wanted to not be butthurt anymore.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. After losing World War I and the treaty of Versailles and all the things that came afterwards, everyone's feeling real bad about themselves and they. And what the German people want more than anything else. To feel good about being German again.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah. They want to feel better. They should stop eating so many carbs and pork.

[Marcus Parks]

Well, that's what we learned, Eddie, but that took emotional maturity for us.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, to make all that happen, the staff of the Anna Neba wrote new histories of Germany that made people feel good about themselves while erasing the histories that made people feel bad, which is the same thing that's been happening across America for the last few years in our educational system.

[Marcus Parks]

They went around looking for German Stonehenge.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

They were obsessed with finding a German Stonehenge, something like that. Because they loved Stonehenge.

[Henry Zebrowski]

They did.

[Marcus Parks]

Himmler loved Stonehenge. And he was so jealous of Stonehenge. And all he ever wanted was a German Stonehenge. So he sent out guys to go look for the German Stonehenge. And so what they do, every single time they found a weird looking rock, they would take a picture of it and say, ancient white people put this here. Yeah. And they would go like, look at this rock. Obviously it's the shape of a lion. This was carved in stone by the ancient white people that used to live here. And the only ones who ever would have done it. Even though it's just a rock. Yeah.

[Ed Larson]

Also you look at the pyramids, you look at the stuff down in the Aztecs and the Mayans, white people had to do it. Yeah. The stone edge kind of lame.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Ed Larson]

There ain't really much going on there. Sleep in it.

[Marcus Parks]

Because. You know why? It's because.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Rain. It rained sideways.

[Marcus Parks]

It's because Jews in the night came from the sky and knocked down the super complicated parts of Stonehenge. Buddy. That's only the tip of Stonehenge, buddy. That's the button head. That's the penis top.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

Of Stonehenge, dog.

[Ed Larson]

Truth is, the Jews built pyramids.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

What the.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, the anaeriba. They had the assistance of the Gestapo, the German secret police, who would steal materials from universities and other institutions that would support either the creation of new history or the erasure of reality. Those in academia who refused to cooperate with the Gestapo risked being sent to the camps, while those who willingly participated in the onenerba were often given high ranking positions in the ss. As far as those who refused went, Himmler would replace their positions in academia with SS officers. So the Nazi version of history could extend its tentacles into every aspect of education, from literature to the sciences.

[Marcus Parks]

If we're. If it's not reality, we're going to make it a reality.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Now. When it came to Hitler using the Anenerba to warp the past to fit his goals and beliefs, one of the biggest stretches concerned homo homosexuality.

[Marcus Parks]

They loved was big there. They liked every second of it.

[Henry Zebrowski]

They did not.

[Marcus Parks]

Oh, weird.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, as we said last episode, Himmler considered male homosexuality to be a blight on society because gay men didn't usually have kids. That was the whole reasoning behind it. Fatherhood was considered to be one of the most patriotic duties that a German man could perform, especially in Nazi Germany, because, you know, they'd lost a lot of people in the war and they had to refill those population coffers somehow.

[Marcus Parks]

Oh, yeah. The idea was they were going to kill all those pesky people there in the the first place, and they were going to fill it with German people, and that required lots and lots of big German babies.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yep. But Himmler also truly believed that you could catch being gay.

[Marcus Parks]

You can, buddy. Yeah. Oh, you can. And guess what? It's great.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah, it's a catches, man.

[Henry Zebrowski]

It looks great.

[Marcus Parks]

It's awesome, dude. Suck dick, don't ask questions, Move on. Mistake. Move on.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Oh, yeah. Himler believed that male homosexuality was a communicable disease that would infect all. All of Germany if the Nazis didn't nip it in the bud.

[Marcus Parks]

Set coming from the capital of leather daddies, which I think is amazing, Berlin is literally where I saw the most human male ass. Oh, yeah, on the street, man. Yeah. They're making up for. For time there.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Very much so. And so Himmler went to the Anerba and told them to find historical or scientific evidence to support the persecution of gay men particularly. Nothing, of course, was found, but researchers did offer some speculation that A group of Iron Age Germans had maybe once executed their fellow tribesmen for homosexuality. One time. Now, that's thin gruel for evidence, but it was more than enough for Himmler. He expanded upon that speculation and announced that the Ahnenerbe had found hard evidence that ancient Germans had drowned homosexuals in swamps. As a matter fact, of. Of course. Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

And we did this the old fashioned way by putting new bronze tint into the bottom of the swamps. And the gay men couldn't help themselves. They jumped in to find it. You know, they are it. Homosexuality didn't even really exist as a concept until, like, modern times. It literally was a. Alexander the Great was homosexual.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, we were really. I mean, that's. Yeah, they're wrong.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Dude, you're brave.

[Henry Zebrowski]

They're wrong. You're.

[Marcus Parks]

No, you're brave. No, you're brave.

[Henry Zebrowski]

No, you're brave.

[Marcus Parks]

You're brave.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Thank you.

[Ed Larson]

The Greeks were gay before God.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, dude. The Greeks were so gay, they became Italian.

[Henry Zebrowski]

No, once. Himmler's belief doesn't mean anything. No, it doesn't. It means nothing at all. Because Italians, I believe, are famously homophobic.

[Marcus Parks]

I have no idea, dude. It just fucking. It was an. It was a patter.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. Uhhuh.

[Marcus Parks]

It followed a pattern.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Now, once Hemler's beliefs about homosexuality were quote, unquote confirmed, he began sending gay men to concentration camps where they were forced to wear the infamous pink triangle badges.

[Marcus Parks]

It's really kind of hard now, you see that because you like, obviously this very, very serious thing. And then we had that song Pink Triangle on a sleeve.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, I know that because. You know that song. No. What, this? But that's. Well, the pink triangle. I quit. I quit the show. I'm done.

[Ed Larson]

Just like.

[Marcus Parks]

He jumped right in, baby.

[Henry Zebrowski]

But just like LGBT people today have been used as the vanguard for bigotry in this administration, gay men were actually among the first group to suffer Nazi human experimentation. This was all so the Nazis could see if they could turn gays into straights. And they did so through a variety of horrific methods, including, but not limited to, chemical castration. Reportedly, 15,000 gay people were sent to concentration camps, and 60% of them either died there or were killed during the course of the experiments.

[Marcus Parks]

Is that another track on that Weezer album?

[Henry Zebrowski]

It's not. Not at all. Not at all the song. Because the gay people, like, they took the pink triangle, you know, as a thing of power, and then it's all about Yogi'. An idiot. An idiot was an idiot.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah. I understand. Yeah, I'm lesbian.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Great. Well, Himmler put homosexuals, people with biological defects, and women who got abortions all in the same criminal category. They were all people who were actively working towards the destruction of Germany because they were not making more Aryans.

[Marcus Parks]

We would put them in the category of groovy cats that must be destroyed.

[Advertiser]

Destroyed.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Arresting these people, Himmler said, was a preventative act. But most chillingly, Himmler made it very clear that this mission would never end. As Himmler put it in public, thinking that all this would be over in years or even decades was quote, reckless and erroneous. In other words, just like it is today with say, these new leaks from the young Republicans where they're all talking about, I want to burn people, I want to gas people.

[Marcus Parks]

That's just traditional funny stuff amongst kids.

[Henry Zebrowski]

They are saying exactly what it is they're planning and exactly what they believe out loud. It is, however, ultimately the responsibility of the average citizen to take these people at their word when they say it, as opposed to say, sweeping it under the rug again because you're annoyed at how fucking expensive milk is. Get your priorities.

[Marcus Parks]

Nazis tell you exactly who they are and you need to listen. If you are, and I can't say this fucking strongly enough, if you have the strength to stand in front of a SWAT swastika based flag. And you need to think about that because swastikas are a no go in the United States of America. And I don't give a what you think about it.

[Ed Larson]

Man, I'm so sick of these interviews with the guys from the south calling them swastikas.

[Marcus Parks]

All over the place. It's all gone. Yeah, just a fun looking eggs.

[Ed Larson]

They just think it's five pot stickers.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Now the Nazis had a thing for blood in both the metaphorical and literal senses. But under Himmler's direction, the Ahnenerbewed Aryan blood as an actual magical elixir. In another example of Himmler getting an idea and telling the Ahnenerbe to figure it out, he believed that the blood that flowed through his Aryan ancestors veins was what had supplied them with their heightened powers of creativity and intelligence. Himmler therefore believed that if the Ahnenerbe could somehow crack the code of synthesizing pure Aryan blood, then that blood could heal all illness, transform those of mixed blood into pure blooded Aryans and produce superior livestock. It's an all in one.

[Marcus Parks]

You mean there's something that could finally make me white?

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. Actually I do believe that this, that would the turning someone of mixed Blood into pure Aryan blood. I think that's why Himmler wanted it so bad, because he knew deep down that he was not in any way Aryan. He did not have any army Aryan features whatsoever. And I think he thought that if he found his magic potion, he could drink it and he could somehow be that beautiful blonde boy that he wanted to fuck so bad.

[Marcus Parks]

Can someone please Photoshop me an image of Heinrich Himmler taking the Aryan blood and turning him into a giant titted, beautiful blonde Aryan woman with the mustache. Like if he could look like a beautiful big titted like beer wench like that. And then he's just like, oh no, I used the wrong blood. And then all of a sudden we got a Nazi Freaky Friday.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, actually.

[Marcus Parks]

Well, you want a man?

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, it's. It's Freaky Friday meets Weird Science meets Zone of Interest.

[Marcus Parks]

Wow. Yeah, write it down.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Pitched, copyrighted, mailed it to myself.

[Marcus Parks]

Done.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Now again, this sounds ridiculous, but in Himmler's eyes, the discovery of pure Aryan blood was one of the Third Reich's greatest works. And he recruited scientists, anthropologists, music ecologists, zoologists, astronomers, doctors and folklorists to try to make it happen.

[Ed Larson]

All the Aryan blood though, is at the bottom of the ocean.

[Marcus Parks]

If you've been Atlantis, if you believed it.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, it's about synthesizing it. It's about figuring out what it is. First you figure out what it is and then you figure out how to make it.

[Ed Larson]

And Germans love synthesizers.

[Henry Zebrowski]

They top shelf bud, top shell.

[Marcus Parks]

They do now.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Himler's actions surrounding homosexuality and Aryan blood. These are just two examples of the cornucopia of insane tasks that were undertaken by the AN erba. They're also very much on the tamer side of things when you consider the An Erba's logical conclusion. See, when the Allies finally raided the An Erba offices in 1945, there were definitely a lot of questions like, hey, where'd all these skeletons and skulls come from? You guys have a lot of skeletons and skulls around?

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, thank you. Yeah, it's kind of a thing here, you know, it's kind of a moat.

[Henry Zebrowski]

It's like, where'd you get them?

[Ed Larson]

Inherited them from a man that I murdered.

[Marcus Parks]

I've never heard of this place. Spirit Halloween.

[Henry Zebrowski]

There was also quite a few questions about the Anarbis correspondence with a so called doctor working out of Poland named Joseph Mangala.

[Marcus Parks]

Mangala.

[Henry Zebrowski]

But unfortunately.

[Ed Larson]

You don't like him, you.

[Marcus Parks]

Don'T like it anymore. You know, it does, it does rub.

[Ed Larson]

Me the wrong way a little bit.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, there's that smiling guy, that Jack o' Lantern of a. Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

What was he doing? Let's continue.

[Henry Zebrowski]

But unfortunately, the full extent of the Ana Erba's works are still a mystery. 961 volumes of Anan Erba files survived the war, but this was only a fraction of what they had before they started burning files during the final Allied advance. That's how many files they had, that's how many files. And that really shows you the scope of the Anenerba, the scope of the Holocaust, scope of the concentration camps, the Gestapo. All of it is that the Germans. There were so many Germans who could see the Russians coming, could see the Americans coming, knew that the war was over and were just constantly burning shit, constantly trying to get rid of it, and they didn't even come close to getting rid of all the evidence.

[Marcus Parks]

Yes, Well, I actually feel like, especially with the Anna of all of them, to be honest, I think a lot of it was gobbledygook horseshit. Like, I think most of it was them with various skulls. Because, like, one thing, one big project of the Anna Nerba was to go to Tibet and measure the skulls of every single Asian person that they met, because they were desperately looking for any form of Nordic sign inside of these. These cultures. And they would go meet, which should have been. That's an interesting movie of the Nazis that went to Tibet and they said they earned the trust of the Tibetan people, so that they lived amongst them, ate with them, hung out, some stayed. They literally fell in love with Tibet. But then they measured everybody's heads and they were so excited by these new people showing interest in them. They fed them, they gave them all these, like, celebrations and they went and they literally, like, made all these plaster casts of all these different types of Asian people.

[Ed Larson]

Oh, they should do. It should be called to bet your ass for all Nazis.

[Marcus Parks]

Well, I mean, you got.

[Henry Zebrowski]

You have kind of half of the story there, is that. Yeah, they did go, and the Tibetans were like, oh, you love the swastika. We love. That's great. Yeah. And. And then eventually, like, someone. Well, eventually someone from, like, outside showed up and like, hey, what are you doing hanging out with Nazis? And, like, what are Nazis? They're fine. It's like, you know, what. What they do, right? Like, what. What they're. And then they told the Tibetans, like, all of the. That the Nazis, like, okay, so we need to stop hanging out with these guys now. Yeah, you should probably stop hanging out with these guys.

[Ed Larson]

Manson and the Beach Boys.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, it's so funny though, because they went and there's like, how do you say, like there's a teaching moment here.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Guys.

[Marcus Parks]

Guys. But guess what? They found nothing.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Now, while much of the more nefarious experiments of the Ana N Erbo were lost, the work they did rewriting history was a matter of public record before the war even began. See, there were two big question marks when it came to buying the concept of a history in which the ancient Aryan Germans were the superior race. And I'm not even just talking about worldwide. I'm talking about just, just in Europe.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah. You're not talking about Africa? Middle East.

[Henry Zebrowski]

No. Or South America. Those question marks were Rome and Greece. See, it was already well established that while the Romans were building the Coliseum, the Germanic tribes were struggling to make a piece of pottery that didn't look as if it was crafted by a very gifted child.

[Marcus Parks]

And the Germanic tribes sorted at the thing where they burned Rome down as a collapse. And that led us to a little thing called the Dark Ages, which was a, a period of time in which we don't know exactly how long it lasted in which there was no communic education across the country. So it kind, that was also kind of their fault in a way.

[Henry Zebrowski]

The Gothics a little bit. Yeah, well. Oh no, not the vandals.

[Marcus Parks]

The vandals and they. All of the barbarian clans.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Or to sidestep all of these inconvenient truths, the Germans changed history itself by claiming that the accomplishments of Rome could be traced back through time immemorial to blonde haired migrants from the north. It's got to be Northern Europe.

[Marcus Parks]

It's got to be.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, Northern Europe. The Nazis claimed we was too damp to properly cultivate the genius of the area. Too wet, too cold.

[Marcus Parks]

Get me. I'm like that. I'm like that. I can't, I can't be wet. I can't be wet.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

I need to think.

[Henry Zebrowski]

I need to think.

[Marcus Parks]

I need to be dry to think.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. So the Aryans were forced to migrate to the Mediterranean where the weather was better. And then once they got a little sun, once they got a little bit of just like, oh, this, I got it so nice here. They founded Roman Greece. But the mixing of the races eventually diluted their Aryan blood, which is why the Roman Romans and the Greeks were no longer Aryan.

[Ed Larson]

There were snowbirds.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yes, permanent snowbirds. Yeah, yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

See, white people just, they love to move and they go to all set and they just love to help. So they go to places and they just help. And that's what they do. And then they just ran away. And it's not like being out of existence is like it just seems to be if every single time an Aryan tribe arrives and then fucks itself out of existence, maybe we need to learn something from that as well.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well the argument, the counter, the Nazi counter argument to that we have learned something. And that something is we must kill every Jew on earth.

[Marcus Parks]

Yikes. And that's why I say, oh child, that's not what you're supposed to think, child. You need to have yourself a nice plate of pasta, child. In Italy.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, and, but that, but seriously, that, that is the idea is like it's. This keeps happening again and again and it will keep happening unless we kill all of them now. Incredibly, the German people ate this shit up. As far as far as reasons go, one of the biggest motivators for believing all this was that many Germans, like I said, desperately needed to feel better about themselves after the humiliation of losing the First World War. In some ways many Germans lost their minds after World War I. Just as many Americans were utterly broken by 9 11. And people stuck in this frame of mind will do and believe just about anything if it makes them feel better about their national humiliation. We all know somebody who was never right again after 9 11.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah, yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

Matt Lauer.

[Henry Zebrowski]

But the other side of why these people believed in the alternate histories was because the Nazis crammed all this down people's throats through propaganda and Nazi controlled media. So called historical articles that rebranded history through a Nazi lens were a regular feature in the official SS newspaper, SS Guidebook. As an aside though, these Nazi newspapers were fascinating artifacts. According to one writer who studied SS Guidebook, it combined dime store pulp, hardcore political doctrine, sexy photos of Frauleins in swimsuits, quotes from Mein Kampf, and even a dear Abbey style column that offered tips to SS men who were looking for suitable Aryan brides.

[Ed Larson]

Have you thought of just taking them?

[Marcus Parks]

You know it's very interesting is that they're obviously they had a very good for marketing and tone.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

So one of the things they understood was kind of keep it almost on an entertaining, hyper optimistic like way. Right. This idea of all these horrible things are happening but when you are listening and talking and reading Nazi content, it's entertaining, positive, it's extremely positive. It's very like. And well obviously it's talking about violence but in a positive way. It's like it wants you to get all like, like gummed up for it. It wants you to go. And then they also have the Ability to completely cut off all the spigots of any other type of information coming in. You know, there's no Internet, there's nothing coming. There' no way for you to know that this is ain't really just an ever pervasive reality necessarily. And then they are starting to make stuff look really intense.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Now, while Heinrich Himmler certainly had a lot of ideas, he did not create the foundation for all of these narratives. As we said in the first episode, many of these concepts came from books Himmler had read in his 20s. But as he gained more power in Germany, some of the authors of those books. And this is just. This is your dream. Yep. They became Himmler's collaborators.

[Marcus Parks]

It's like, oh, I was such a huge fan and I can't believe I get to work with you, Mr. Willigott.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Ed Larson]

I'd be like, if we got Schecter on the show.

[Marcus Parks]

Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, it's such. When Himmler began rewriting history and science with the Anenerba, he included some of those writers. And while there were some real crackpots in the institute, none were more cracked than Carl Maria Willigut Willigutt.

[Marcus Parks]

This guy.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. Born in 1866. Carl Maria Willigutt. Or I guess it's Billy Goot. Yeah. It was like really good. Carl. Carl Maria. Really good. My name's Carl. Really good. How you doing?

[Marcus Parks]

Oh, look at how happy is in his uniform.

[Ed Larson]

He does look like a good old boy.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. He was a World War I veteran who claimed to have genealogical links to both the Norse God Thor and to a German tribal chief who had slaughtered three Roman legions in the year 9. Carl was also an occult author who had been an early influence on Heinrich Himmler's own occult beliefs. But just like many people in Himmler's inner circle, Carl was also certifiably insane.

[Marcus Parks]

Largely the. The craziest one.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. After fighting on both the Italian and Eastern fronts During World War I, Carl retired from military service after spending 40 years fighting for the Austro Hungarian Empire. Of course, after World War I, no more Austro Hungarian Empire.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah. What do you do then?

[Henry Zebrowski]

You become bitter.

[Ed Larson]

All my credits for this also hunger.

[Henry Zebrowski]

And so he joined his local Austrian right wing paramilitary group and became a violent, unpredictable alcoholic who always killed, carried a loaded revolver. Carl was also a suspected incestuous pedophile who was so inappropriate with his daughters that his wife had locks installed on their doors to keep Carl away.

[Marcus Parks]

Hey, at least she did something.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, yeah. She could also like, you know, stabbed him in the throat while he slept, but at least he put locks on the doors.

[Marcus Parks]

He's daddy. He's also like Paul Atreides because he believed that he could see into the past. He believed that he had access to every single white person memory. And he was attached to a thing called the racial soul. And the racial soul. Soul was what the. Essentially, it's a collective unconscious only for white people.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

And it's for white people history. And he could look into the past at any time and confirm anything that Himmler said because he could see it.

[Ed Larson]

These fat. They just make up anything to make them sound cool.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. Yeah. Eventually, Carl became so out of control that his wife had him committed to an insane asylum sometime during the early to mid-1920s, where he told anyone who would listen that he had single handedly defeated every comic communist there ever was. Whilst committed.

[Marcus Parks]

Good work, Carl. Wow.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Whilst committed, Carl also obsessively collected pebbles and very small rocks which he carried in his pockets at all times in his room, Carl would polish and arrange these rocks. Thousands of them lined up in rows. He would give each rock a representation like, that one's a snake, that one's an eagle, that one's a really big dick. And other times, he would give a stone a larger, more abstract meaning. Like this stone represents the battle between the forces of light and darkness. Very important stone.

[Marcus Parks]

Carl. Carl, I fucking hate you. Shut up.

[Ed Larson]

Carl, stop polishing your rocks.

[Marcus Parks]

If I was polishing them, I would be putting them in the caps.

[Henry Zebrowski]

After a few years in the insane asylum, Carl was finally released in 1927.

[Marcus Parks]

He was done.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. And he immediately found himself drawn to the growing volkish and Nazi movements.

[Marcus Parks]

Wow.

[Henry Zebrowski]

There he found like minds and began. Began calling himself Vice Thor, which just means wise Thor.

[Marcus Parks]

I would love for anybody to go onto Tick Tock and take stills from Trad hashtag TradWife content, make it black and white and put it of pictures next to the volkish movement and tell me if you can see the difference. I really would like you to see if you could see the difference between the two of those.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Within the Nazis, Carl found a group who would actually honor his request to be called Vice Thor.

[Marcus Parks]

I mean, he kept insisting.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yep. That group was of course, Himmler's ss.

[Marcus Parks]

Always go where you're welcome.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah.

[Henry Zebrowski]

But rather than just humor the old man, they encouraged his claims. Himmler and his SS men actually believed Carl when he said that he could channel ancient Nordic figures by entering seizure. Like trans.

[Marcus Parks]

I'm like, I'm pretty certain it was seizures.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, yeah, it could have been. And they listened carefully when he would come out out of those seizures and recite primeval adages, sayings and proverbs that he claimed to have received from the ancestors.

[Marcus Parks]

Jew is like the rotten turnip God.

[Ed Larson]

You're a wise Thor.

[Marcus Parks]

It is always brown in the wrong places.

[Ed Larson]

Also, this just shows. Never hang out with people that let you pick your own nickname.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Never ever, ever, Never, never.

[Marcus Parks]

You should. You can't tell anybody. You're like, oh, who does that bit? Isn't that Eddie Desert who does a bit about Sting? No, that Dana Carvey does. Hey, Gordon.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, yeah. There was also a whole Seinfeld episode. Episode about it. T Bone. Yeah. And he gets nicknamed Coco. Well, again, all of this sounds ridiculous, but Carl Willigut attracted a large following in the volkish German scene. And by 1933, he had become a friend to none other than Heinrich Himmler, who was somewhat of a village villigut fanboy visa guthead. Carl would bring Kimler old books and manuscripts bound in pig leather that, according to Carl's claims, contained all his accumulated occult knowledge.

[Marcus Parks]

And the first part is, if you're hungry, you can fry it. Yeah, Yeah.

[Ed Larson]

I love a book you can suck on.

[Henry Zebrowski]

And the great thing is, this is how you keep the Jews from reading it. I can't touch it. Using these books and Carl channeling techniques, Himmler and Carl made decisions as to where to place SS training camps and headquarters in locations that were most magically suitable. At least magically suitable. According to the ancestors.

[Marcus Parks]

We, you know what we are.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Very important decisions were made based on Carl Villigutz, you know, seizures.

[Marcus Parks]

We are also. We're discounting Hitler here because, yes, Hitler only had shallow belief systems and at any. In any aspect, but Himmler also knew to pitch Hitler, you needed a full storyline. Like, if you're going in there to pitch Adolf Hitler.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

You better come really ready to talk about the whys and where's of what you want to do. Because Hitler was like that. He did no work, but he wanted to know everything. Yeah. So you'd show up and you'd need reasons. So I think partially with village, it gives again, gravitas the decisions we're making over here. Yeah.

[Ed Larson]

You got to know what's going to happen in season five.

[Marcus Parks]

Yes. Literally. Yeah.

[Henry Zebrowski]

And Himmler's other technique with Hitler that worked extraordinarily well is that Himmler would go in and basically be him, like Hitler's bitching post. Like he would go. Like he would wait until Hitler was very angry. And then he would go in and he would let Hitler scream at him for hours upon hours on end and he would just take it and like, yes, yes.

[Marcus Parks]

And then finally misunderstood. Yeah, don't listen to you and they don't get you.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. And then finally when Hitler got tired himself out, that's when Himmler were going like, oh, hey, I got this idea. And like Hitler's like, yeah, yeah, whatever, fine, fine, get out of here. Just go, I'm tired. And it worked again and again and again, you know. And that also brought Hitler closer to Himler.

[Marcus Parks]

Himmler was his smee.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Now the problem with Carl V Gud and him and Heinrich Himmler's working relationship is that while Himmler was a vivacious and excitable 33 year old Nazi, Carl was already 66 and getting, getting quite tired by the time they started working together. So to keep Carl going, Himmler supplied Carl with drugs. Now, we don't know exactly what Himmler gave Carl, but considering how just about everyone in Nazi Germany was on meth during this time, Carl was probably gacked out of his skull.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah, he was able to do cartwheels and.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, dude, that's a man getting that IV meth when you're an old man. Sign me up, dude.

[Henry Zebrowski]

But the winning man, well, the Nazis. It was a little pill, I can't remember what it was called, it was like PP or something like that. But yeah, it was a little pill that was made and every, everyone got it. That's how the blitzkrieg worked. Like that's how they were able to blitz Krieg France because every single one of them were on meth and they didn't have to sleep and so they just went for days upon days on end.

[Marcus Parks]

But then I was reading that blitz book and they talk about how then they burn out.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

Then the when the burnout hit, that's like when the Nazis started hardcore losing. Like literally watch an entire army get burnt out.

[Ed Larson]

Sucks because they're taking all that meth. They would have loved being gay.

[Marcus Parks]

Right, right. And with the haircuts too. The haircuts looked like they look every bear.

[Henry Zebrowski]

And weho well likely hopped to the gills on speed. Carl claimed to channel ascended masters of the occult, just like Madame Blavatsky had claimed to do. In reality, Carl had probably just stolen Blavatsky's ax, of course. But as opposed to Blavatsky, Carl's ascended masters only had apocalyptic visions which made Himmler believe with even more fervor that the Nazis and Specifically the SS needed to wipe the Earth clean of all bad influence in advance of a future planet wide catastrophe.

[Ed Larson]

Couldn't even wipe his own ass.

[Marcus Parks]

You don't know, he might have loved wiping his ass.

[Ed Larson]

He was a rag on a stick man.

[Henry Zebrowski]

While Carl was on Himmler's wavelength ideologically, Carl obviously did not have what you'd call an administrative mind.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's basically a rambling homeless man that smelled like a barn. He literally was this disgusting, rambling, insane.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Old man his family had abandoned.

[Ed Larson]

Himler just happened to find him hilarious.

[Marcus Parks]

Well, he, Himler used him as like it's his Rasputin. Yeah, it's his mysterious source of all his ancient knowledge that no one can really cryptically understand. Only Himler can. And he's the only one who can translate to everybody.

[Ed Larson]

Also, when he stands next to him, he doesn't look as fat, honestly.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, Himler has the fattest head of a skinny boy I've ever seen in my life. It's just so incredibly weird.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, he's got the, he's got that Adam Scott head.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah, yeah, he's skinny, but he's like, like, but he is fat. Like that's the thing about Himmler. Like he's got a little pouch.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, it's called. He's in management.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, yeah, just out of shape.

[Ed Larson]

The Killsberry Doughboy.

[Marcus Parks]

That's hilarious.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, Carl Billy Gut was a great ideas guy. He didn't really have the wherewithal to actually run something like the Anenerba. And Himmler's duties with the rapidly expanding concentration camp system and the Gestapo, that was all that was taken up quite a bit of his time in the mid to late 1930s. So Himmler stepped down from his position as superintendent of the ANA and created the position of president for a 50 year old prehistorian named Herman Ver who if you look at him, had the appearance of an old timey scientist whose explosions constantly blew up in his face and covered him in soot.

[Marcus Parks]

And that kind of gave him cred.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, he looked, he looks like somebody the Daffy Duck would chase after.

[Marcus Parks]

Oh, look at that mustache.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah, he looks.

[Marcus Parks]

Oh nice loot.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah, he looks like a confederate. Like a confederate soldier.

[Marcus Parks]

I do man. But I will say I'm really getting, having it up to here with these Nazis.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah, yeah, they're pain in the ass.

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[Henry Zebrowski]

That's not to say that Herman Verst was not an ideas guy as well, because everyone in the on an Airbnb was, shall we say, full of ideas.

[Marcus Parks]

Full of ideas.

[Henry Zebrowski]

See, Herman was very much into the idea of creating an Aryan religion and he told Himmler that he had a treasure trove of ancient sacred texts written by the Nordic race. Texts that Herman himself had, quote unquote discovered. Herman's motivations for Creating the religion, however, were more in line with your average German. See, Herman had become disillusioned with Western civilization as a whole. After Germany later lost World War I, Herman believed that civilization was spiraling towards an inevitable collapse. But he also believed that he could prevent this collapse if he, quote, recovered the truths of the past. To Herman, his work with the ANBA was not just important, but existential. And the fervor with which Herman spoke and wrote about ancient Aryans led people to call him the Hitler of German scientists. Which is one hell of a nickname.

[Marcus Parks]

Hell yeah. You know what? I'd say you're the Hitler of. Of research podcasts.

[Henry Zebrowski]

I don't want that nickname.

[Marcus Parks]

I'm the Hitler of sideman comedy.

[Ed Larson]

Oh yeah. And I just struggled in the bathroom.

[Marcus Parks]

You're the cockler of the downstairs bathroom. Because we have obviously, as you know, downstairs is the in bathroom, upstairs is the piston bathroom.

[Henry Zebrowski]

That's right, man.

[Ed Larson]

Cuz it goes down.

[Marcus Parks]

Yep.

[Ed Larson]

Trickle down effect.

[Marcus Parks]

It's closer. It's closer to the river.

[Ed Larson]

Do you think that Herman was trying to convince everyone? It's like, did you know that it used to be called Hermony?

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, I don't know.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Herman.

[Marcus Parks]

Are you used to be Herman.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Now, by the time Heinrich Himmler had established the ANANBA in the mid-1930s 30s Hermann Wirth's star was on the wane. He was nearly bankrupt and inching towards debtors prison. So Himmler used SS funds to bail Herman out, thus creating another loyal man who owed Himmler his life. Now, Herman was partly hired to lead archaeological expeditions outside of Germany, because any and all attempts made by Anenerba researchers to find evidence of past Aryan superiority within their own borders had only produced a lot of shitty Iron Age pottery. So under Herman's guidance, the ANBA began making expeditions all over the world. Although Himmler was smart enough to give Herman orders that you do not discuss politics with anyone outside of Germany.

[Marcus Parks]

So f fascinating because it shows that he knew that there was a problem with it.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yes. But using Herman as his frontman, Himmler could fully explore his growing obsession with Tibet. Now, Himmler's interest in Tibet was not original amongst occultists who subscribed to the Aryan myth. As we mentioned, Madame Blavatsk had kicked off the idea that Aryans had originated in Tibet, and countless other crackpots had run with it. As such, Himmler believed that the Aryan race had built an empire in Central Asia. The mythical Shambhala. And using a particularly Nazi brand of circular reasoning, Himmler believes that the symbol of Aryan Shambhala had to have been the swastika.

[Marcus Parks]

It had to have been because it's here now.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, I.

[Marcus Parks]

It's the swastika.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

You know that there's a swastikas up in ter. Bet you know what's happening under sure out there, man.

[Ed Larson]

I don't use no brown sauce with my swastika.

[Marcus Parks]

Hey, you know what they say. Swastika, Mark's spot.

[Ed Larson]

Right, right there is where I get my bratwurst.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Shambhala was not a metaphor to Himler, nor was it even a myth. He truly believed that Tibet was the last refuge of the Aryan root race. That there were still, Even in the 1930s, Aryans tucked away somewhere in the Tibetan mountains.

[Marcus Parks]

They are sitting there with their wondering, where is the fatherland?

[Henry Zebrowski]

So Himmler tasked onenerba researchers with finding these remaining original Aryans. Once found, the Nazi researchers were instructed to leave behind a radio transmitter so the Aryans could make contact with Berlin. And once the bond was established, the ancient Aryans could teach the Nazis how to mine substances to prolong their lives and how to build psychic conductors to reach higher states of consciousness. Because Volkish writers had told them that's what ancient Aryans knew how to do.

[Marcus Parks]

I will say it's a big Hail Mary pass. It seems like that little trip's going to wrap up a lot of stuff. He's like Zen once it goes. If he gets a machine, somebody gets the. The hidden elements. And see Asia mountains that make a super powerful Zen. They're good. We just got to dishes. We just need XYZ to happen, as it were. Good. Yeah.

[Ed Larson]

If you go there, you go to Tibet, you find me a yodeling monk.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, please. You'll find me the man stuck on a plateau with wooden shoes. And he has no idea why he is there. White as hell.

[Henry Zebrowski]

This expedition, however, almost didn't happen because the guy they put in charge of it accidentally shot and killed his wife during a duck hunting trip right before they set off.

[Marcus Parks]

Sure, yeah. I mean, tell me about if I've heard that excuse nine times.

[Ed Larson]

Could you put this duck on your head?

[Henry Zebrowski]

The researcher, however, pulled himself together after eight weeks of grieving. They then set off for Tibet, but nothing, of course, was found. Now, Nazi theories about the past didn't stop with the creation of the races and where they originated. Nazis even had their own ideas about how the Earth itself was formed. And amongst the Nazis, the most widely accepted creation story was the World Ice theory. Now, the creator of the World Ice theory was a man who was An Anheuser Busch. No, it was not. He was a man who was regarded as a complete idiot by legitimate astronomers. And that is a quote. This man was an Austrian with the absolutely terrible name of Hul. John's whore Bigger. I'm.

[Marcus Parks]

Sore. Yeah, everything's cold at first.

[Ed Larson]

That's like a guy. It's like a fat man who orders a prostitute. I need my Bigger.

[Marcus Parks]

Obviously more to be frank. And more specifically, I need my whore Wider.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Horbiger had the reputation of being an idiot because he openly bragged that his world ID Ice theory involved no actual math or science.

[Marcus Parks]

Best part is there's no thing to.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Write down because math and science were quote, too Jewish and deceptive.

[Marcus Parks]

What is the number 4? Is it found in nature? What is the number 7? Is it found naturally amongst the trees?

[Ed Larson]

I love how there's becoming truth to Hitler on ice.

[Henry Zebrowski]

As you can imagine, his theory was indeed moronic. But it did serve as an important piece of the history that Himmler was constructing with the Onenerba.

[Marcus Parks]

Well, it's more rhyming doctrine with the past. This idea that there is the Hyperborean island. Right. There's Hyperborea, which is the icebound island that white. The. The mystical white people first sprung from. Right. That went down that where Eastland would be. Right. So that's Iceland. Yeah. And Iceland does not like the fact that Nazis retconned a lot of their lore.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, yeah, they. But they're taking the po Poetic Edda and saying that, oh, this is actually the history of the area. No, they don't. They don't enjoy that.

[Marcus Parks]

They don't like.

[Henry Zebrowski]

They really don't enjoy. The Poetic Ed is a beautiful work of literature, but they.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, they don't like it. They just turn it into whatever they wanted it to. So these guys are all doing. So that's another rhyming thing to the ice world that they all came from.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, basically the world ice theory held that the Earth had started with six moons made of ice. And I'm really taking this down to its basics. Yes.

[Marcus Parks]

Because this is just an anime. Yeah, what you're describing.

[Henry Zebrowski]

One by one, these moons were pulled down to Earth through gravitational.

[Marcus Parks]

For we must defend the Earth from the forces of negativity. Yes. I in charge of kissing, I have the energy of hugging, I have the energy of whistling.

[Henry Zebrowski]

These caused incredible destruction and change each time. That's one of the things that they would say about the Bible. One of the only true things about the Bible is that the flood did happen, but it was because A moon made of ice fell into the ocean. But what was important to the Nazis.

[Marcus Parks]

Do you know the first Jews were snowmen.

[Henry Zebrowski]

But what was important to the Nazis was that the fifth moon had come down 11,000 years ago and it had been this moon that had destroyed Atlantis. Now you might be saying that this totally negates their other belief that Atlantis was destroyed by the Jews. We talked about, I think in episode one or two. Yes. That Atlanta, it was the Jews and the Slavs working together that had sunk the city or sunk the continent of Atlantis. Well, you'd be right.

[Ed Larson]

Space laser melted the ice moon.

[Marcus Parks]

I don't think you understand. You're right. I actually don't think you understand. Understands that the first space lasers were natural from an invading Jewish star. And that's where you're incorrect. Where the space lasers were then built by modern Jewish cabals in order to. In order to compare to the ancient Jewish star that destroyed the six moons of white ice.

[Ed Larson]

I'm so sorry. Thank you for the clarification.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, you'd be right for pointing out those contradictions. But an essential part of being a Nazi and an essential part of being a part of any fascist system is that you had to be to hold a lot of contradictory ideas in your head all at the same time while never questioning said contradictions. See, it's not necessarily about what is true as much as it's about what can be true, just so long as what can be true constantly feeds back into the central ideas of the movement. Like, oh, yeah, does that make sense? Yeah, I could see that. Yeah. And it just goes on and on and on. It all just gets added up, up and. Until nothing is true and everything is true.

[Marcus Parks]

At the same time, you're also being. You're physically frightened.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

And so you now know that to cut the physical fear of being inside of the fascist machine, you have to say yes. And that's just most of those things because we. Everyone makes a big talk of when the Nazis come, you're going to fight. But actually it's like very uncomfortable to fight them. Oh yeah, because they send you to concentration camps.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, it's not. I mean, just think of it on a very human level. How many times have you been in a conversation with somebody and they say some really awful off the wall shit.

[Marcus Parks]

And you gotta laugh your way through it.

[Henry Zebrowski]

And you have to laugh your way through it because you know that this. You know that the person you're talking to is violent and unstable. And if you say something or if you push back Even a little bit. They're gonna beat you half to death.

[Ed Larson]

Yep.

[Marcus Parks]

Yep.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Everyone has done it. Oh, yeah. In their life.

[Ed Larson]

I've done it multiple times.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

I do it several times a day.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Ed Larson]

And it usually starts with. I know, dad.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Now, in keeping with fascist tradition, Horbiger and his Nazi followers doubled down with this horse.

[Marcus Parks]

Too big. I need a whole smaller.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Now they doubled down. When actual scientists said that the world ice theory, also called glacial cosmology, was really fucking stupid. Instead of backing down, Himmler sent a German novelist named Edmund Kiss to the. To the Bolivian Andes to see if Edmund could prove the world ice theory. And the only reason why he sent Kiss was because Kiss had written novels about Atlantis. Nothing, of course, was found, but that did not temper Himmler's admiration of novelist Edmund Kiss. Himmler so loved Edmund's work that he actually had a special edition of one of Kiss's novels made with a leather cover. And Himmler gave this special edition to Hitler himself as a Christmas gift.

[Marcus Parks]

I must say this Heiny, only you get me. I wish that you were pert young. Let's try this alien blood again to see if it makes you into my school to be wise.

[Ed Larson]

Please go look for the lost city of Atlantis. Where? The top of a mountain.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Gotta see him, Lagann. He gives me these fucking books every year and I don't want to fucking.

[Marcus Parks]

Cause it's so long.

[Henry Zebrowski]

It's like giving someone a fucking homework excitement. It's not as good. I have to read it because if I don't read it, then he gets fucking butthurt. When he asks me about it in.

[Marcus Parks]

February, I thought he was this guy's guy, but he gives me his gay. Like it's reading sick. And I'm sick and tired of this garbage. Do something. Take me to a strip club. Do something fun with me. I'm a man.

[Henry Zebrowski]

We.

[Marcus Parks]

We're men. Let's experiment. Have funism. We men have fun now.

[Henry Zebrowski]

As the years went by and the German people became more and more inundated with the bullshit being spewed by Himler's Onenerba, a large number of Germans came to believe that the old Norse myths were actually the secret history of the Aryan race. This is where. Where they looked at Iceland's Edda and said, oh, that's real.

[Marcus Parks]

That's us.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. For example, the most fervent of Nazis thought that Thor's hammer Mjolnir was an actual thing that could be found and used. But Himmler believed it harder than anyone.

[Marcus Parks]

And I know I'll be able to pick it up just like when Captain America picked it up. But I can do it. I can do it.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Himmler thought that the thunderbolt imagery in ancient Norse art and literature was evidence of an ancient advanced weapon that could be recreated and wielded by the Nazis. A modern Mjolnir that was capable of unleashing the power of the gods.

[Marcus Parks]

It was lightning.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

That's what they were drawing.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

Was the lightning itself. Well, yeah, because it was an impressive natural formation that they couldn't understand.

[Henry Zebrowski]

We also use that as evidence that the ancient Aryans had electricity for everyone else.

[Marcus Parks]

Lightning does come from the sky. It is electric.

[Ed Larson]

How can you be so evil and so annoying?

[Marcus Parks]

Because that's again, it's a feature now.

[Henry Zebrowski]

The ANBA's first president, Herman Ver, fell out of favor with Himmler in 1937 when Herman dared to make the suggestion that ancient Nordic civilizations were matriarchies ruled by priestesses.

[Marcus Parks]

I could feel the. Ooh, that room.

[Henry Zebrowski]

What did you say? This was a grave affront because in Himmler's world, women were, in the words of one author, little more than compliant baby factories. That's what women were supposed to be.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah. If that they just. If they could have made women just the uteruses they were, have been very happy to.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. And when these so called dangerous ideas made their way to Hitler, Hitler publicly denounced the president of the ana.

[Marcus Parks]

I was just about to do that.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. Luckily for Herman, though, he'd already done enough to prevent a trip to the camps, and he was instead busted down to a ceremonial position. But as it was with Dachau, Herman's replacement, a man named Walter Voost, was far more dangerous. See, prior to joining the Nazi Party, Voost was a professor who had become accustomed to teaching classes to handfuls of bored students who were barely paying attention to what he was saying. But with the Nazis, Voost found an incredibly motivated audience. So he jumped at the opportunity to mold the minds of thousands of men in Himmler's ss. Men who would then force those ideas upon the rest of Germany.

[Marcus Parks]

It's really been a thing with men, huh? This idea of you just go where anybody will sing your praises, no matter what it is that you do. There's something about that, the idea of, like Nazism, the, the constant motif that constantly is the mediocrity of the people involved. Or how when the Nazis came up, they created a world in which they were venerated. In the previous world, they were considered an idiot.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, if you're if you are considered mediocre, then what you do is you change the definition of mediocre.

[Marcus Parks]

Well, that's what the Nazis did because on the whole they were entirely mediocre, as we could see. Like you even just kind of come trying to come up with some fancy version of their past. You could tell that they were just some, they're just a normal group of people. They're just people and it's just very. I, obviously it's a feature, but it.

[Henry Zebrowski]

It just comes up a lot now. By 1937 the Anenerba had 38 full time researchers, but not all of them were what you'd call respectable. Guys like Carl Maria Viligut were still knocking around the building.

[Marcus Parks]

Call me by my full name, Maria Guy. My bodies call me Maria.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Call Maria Vaisto Viligat. That's my name, that's my name.

[Marcus Parks]

But he got, he also became the MC from Cabaret.

[Henry Zebrowski]

So Walter Voost as the newly minted president, got to work replacing crackpots like Carl with scholars who were actually respected in their fields.

[Marcus Parks]

This was a much worse thing than having kooks involved.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yes. But the catch that these very ambitious scholars had to deal with was that they had to be comfortable with bending or breaking the truth to fit the Nazi way of looking at the, the world. Tragically, this view was becoming quite a bit more popular by the late 1930s. See, Hitler's reign since the Night of the Long Knives had been rocky to say the least. But just like another modern leader I could name, Hitler always managed to pull himself out of a popularity slump with a big gesture. Whenever Hitler's popularity began flagging because of the chaos the Nazis caused or because the economy was in the shitter, which it constantly was, Hitler always managed to, to produce a big foreign policy victory. Something that made the average German feel good about themselves.

[Marcus Parks]

But it was something he constructed, it wasn't something he actually like did. Right.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Things he did. There was very much things he did, but yeah, but there was. I mean usually all he had to do was violate something from the Versailles Treaty.

[Marcus Parks]

That's kind of what I mean in terms of like he just constructs it in terms of it being like, oh, look at that, we're gonna, we're gonna them, we're gonna make a huge army no matter what the they say.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Exactly. And, and the regular people would be like, well yeah, well why wouldn't, why shouldn't we have an army? And even people in other countries would be like, yeah, yeah, we went too far with the Treaty of Versailles. Why shouldn't Germany have an army? Like, everybody's got an army. Why shouldn't Germany have one and used it wrong?

[Ed Larson]

Because their memory is fucking short.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, when Hitler did something like that, you know, like, for example, like, he expanded the military, even though the Versailles Treaty prohibited the Germans from having a force larger than 100,000 men. When Hitler did something like that, even the Germans who didn't really like him would say the same shit that I've heard people say today again and again. Again, they say, like, Phil, like, I don't really like him, or like this there things that he says, but he's getting stuff done. So, like, just stop being so hysterical. It's like you got like, Hitler derangement syndrome or something.

[Marcus Parks]

Well, it's the. It's the belittling of the. Of the thing. I get it. You know, we're in very different set of circumstances than Germany was at the time. But, you know, again, what we just said, it just. We should really be super on the ball about it getting even remotely close.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, yeah. And when you just see the. The same. Like when you have, like two or three things, coincidence, like 20 or 30 things, that's a comparison.

[Marcus Parks]

And we're pointedly pointing them out just to show you that, again, it's not that the current administration is Nazis. No, they want to be Nazis. And that's an entirely. Something different. There's a different thing that we're dealing with.

[Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Ed Larson]

Even just one fucking thing needs to be stopped.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Sure it is. Well, it's just. It's sort of the thing that we talk about, about, like with cults, like how over and over again, you know, cult leaders somehow, like, instinctively know how to form a cult, how to. How to control people. There's just something about it. And that's sort of what's happening again.

[Marcus Parks]

Is like the gears of a cult. They understand when to slow down, speed up. Slow down, speed up.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, they're just seeing people notice how humans respond to things. And if you're of a certain mind, then things will go in a certain way. And this is how. This is what we're looking at now. It's like. It's like minds doing the same thing.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah, they're not Nazi Germany, but they are the worst.

[Marcus Parks]

Correct.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Now, under Walter V Leadership, the ANARBA doubled in size in just two years. They moved into a massive mansion in Berlin and increased the amount of staff and researchers dedicated to alternate histories and Nazi religion to just over 100. As far as who paid for all this? Himmler set up a foundation using Taxpayer money. But the Einene also depended on donors, supposedly respectable corporations who wanted to stay on the Nazi good side. Just like today's corporations make donations to the current administration to curry favor or.

[Marcus Parks]

Fire people in order to get the president to say hello, like, you know, to acknowledge them, which we've never dealt with before.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, yeah. Or you know, do what people in the administration say to do in order to get deals, you know, pushed through.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah.

[Henry Zebrowski]

But back in Nazi Germany, like these were big companies that gave money to the onenerba companies that still exist today. For example, tens of thousands of Reichsmarks were donated to, to an ARA research by BMW.

[Marcus Parks]

Oh yeah, yeah. They made a bunch of the cars too. Yeah. One of the saddest and a lot.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Of I, I believe. Didn't BMW also make like a ton of like engines for the planes? Or was that Mercedes Benz?

[Marcus Parks]

I don't remember, but one of the two. God, it is just sad to watch Himmler just driving those. Just beautiful Mercedes Benz just driving around and I'm just like. And you're like, it's a good whip Siemens, right?

[Ed Larson]

Didn't they get involved with the Nazis too?

[Marcus Parks]

Probably a lot of seamen in there.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, the point of all this is that German society was accepting Heinrich Himmler's anener as a respected establishment. Therefore its ideas and theories were beginning to inform how Germans began to act. For example, Himmler published an article where he openly called upon the German race to preserve their heritage through violence. Because that preservation was so incredibly important, you had to kill for it. And the people of Germany, after years of consuming anenerba propaganda in the media, they were inclined to listen. In this article, Himmler fully acknowledged that his black uniformed SS officers were causing fear and anxiety in every corner of Germany. But Himmler maintained that the SS was necessary. They were quote, a merciless sword of justice that would guarantee the survival of future Germanic generations.

[Marcus Parks]

They also were told amongst themselves, so the SS would be frightening in the front, but the SS would, with the way he would lead them is to be like when you go out, your frame of mind is you're helping.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

When you arrive, you help. SS help people. We're helping the German people. We're helping people. We're reminding people what makes you a good Aryan is by, by doing these.

[Ed Larson]

Things, you know, and if they continually could pair Jews to snakes, why did they name them after something? A snake.

[Marcus Parks]

And that's why we still got one. It's always good to have.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, yeah, I did want to kill him. But now every Time.

[Marcus Parks]

He makes me chuckle.

[Henry Zebrowski]

He got six more days.

[Marcus Parks]

You keep this going and you'll be.

[Ed Larson]

The talent in front of the showers.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Concerning the survival survival of the German people. Lebensraum was not the only Leben Himmler was obsessed with. There was also the infamous Lebens born program, the so called Fount of Life. Founded in 1935 and inspired by the American Eugenics movement, this secret group had the goal of greatly increasing the number of children who met Himmler's exacting standards for racially pure and healthy Aryan boys and girls.

[Ed Larson]

You sure said the labias born.

[Marcus Parks]

No man, they got it. Got to trim them back and get the proper blonde curls. Unfortunately. Yeah, they trim the lips cuz the curls actually form when the head's first out of the. For what? The foyer? The vagina. The mud room of the vagina.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Hey, how you doing? Welcome to the Roast Beef Curtain Club.

[Marcus Parks]

That's where I'm dancing at the Rose Beef Club.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Amongst other duties, Lebensborn provided unmarried German women who became pregnant with assistance by moving them into maternity homes run by the ss. These women were, let's say, encouraged to give up their children to racially pure Aryan parents, often SS officers who would raise their children instead. In this same spirit the SS also ran orphanages that would foster Aryan children out to quote unquote worthy families. But these children were often not orphans. Many times these kids have been kidnapped from their biological homes, families and quote unquote re educated before being given over to an SS couple.

[Ed Larson]

And what, their parents would get sent to the camps because they hid somebody or something.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Either because they hit someone or they might have been communist, they might have been leftist, they might have been just killed.

[Marcus Parks]

You know, they might have just not looked correct. Literally. They were a shame on their own child and they just didn't want him there anymore.

[Henry Zebrowski]

This happened a lot in Poland. You know it was, it was happened a ton in Poland.

[Ed Larson]

A lot of blondes in Poland.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Ed Larson]

How do they feel about redheads?

[Henry Zebrowski]

Fine.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

It depends on where you're from.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, it depends on where you're born. It's more. Actually a lot of it is more about the shape of your skull than it is about the color of your hair.

[Marcus Parks]

It's a lot of that. The exact. Well that's who. That's how you decide who's perfectly Aryan.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. Like phrenology.

[Marcus Parks]

That's when you get into the real. The nuts and bolts of who was an SS officer.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. Lebensborne, however, did not just concern itself with births. They were also the only people in Germany who could legally perform abortions. They performed forced abortions on those who were deemed unworthy of the Aryan race, while all other abortions in Nazi Germany were strictly illegal. But on the more proactive side of the program, women who gave birth to the most Aryan children were given awards by the state. And in 1936, Himmler announced that every SS man would be given a special Nazi brooch to present to their wife life after they gave birth.

[Marcus Parks]

Wow. Women be broaching. Yeah, women love a brooch. When I want to get my dick sucked, I know I come home from the brooch store.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah, yeah, dude, I love hanging out my brooch.

[Henry Zebrowski]

This attitude, however, got far more serious in October of 1939.

[Marcus Parks]

Same as mine.

[Henry Zebrowski]

This is. This is, of course, just before the Nazis invaded Poland. And this inspired Himmler to issue an order that all SS men had to conceive children before going into battle. But the strangest part of the Lebensborn story, and I'm only saying this to avoid a flood of did you know? Emails, is that one member of the legendary pop group ABBA was a Lebensborn child born to a Norwegian mother who had been impregnated by one of Himmler's loyal SS men. So we got that out of the way. Right?

[Marcus Parks]

And honestly, it's why, you know, ABBA's pretty good.

[Henry Zebrowski]

AB is incredible. I'm actually. I'm actually a very big ABBA fan.

[Marcus Parks]

I love abba. Ed, guess which one's the daughter of the Nazis.

[Ed Larson]

Is it the. The lady up top?

[Marcus Parks]

Ye. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's that lady with the mustache. They make them different in Stockholm.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Now, one of the things that's essential to keep in mind is that almost every single thing that the Nazis were doing here, from Lebensborn to the Ahnenerbe, it was all about either preparing the German people for war or making sure that there were plenty of people willing to fight and die in war as such. At the same time that Himmler was managing Anenerba expeditions all over the world, he was also taking orders from Hitler to prepare his men in the SS for the inevitability of total war with the Western powers. Because at this point, Hitler's still. There's still a lot of people in the Vermock, the regular German army, who are like, no. Like, no war. We can't win. We can't do it.

[Marcus Parks]

We just did this.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, we just did. Well, it's. There's still a bunch of treaties and there's still like a bunch of, like, trip wires. Like, you invade this person, then you got both France and Britain on your ass. We can't beat them both at the same. And it's just. There's a lot of guys, but Himler is one of the guys that's like, yes, yes. War. War. Let's do it.

[Marcus Parks]

Let's do it.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Let's go. I'll do anything.

[Marcus Parks]

And he knows it's going to take a lot of bodies.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah. By March of 1938, Hitler was pressing for the invasion and annexation of Austria. And Himmler, never one to let an opportunity for a new outfit pass him by, he got to work designing special gray SS uniforms to mark the occasion.

[Marcus Parks]

Hey, you know, different seasons, you got to. You got to try. You got to change it up.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Is there any reason for it? No, he just liked. He just thought, like, oh, my God, it's going to be so cool. I want a new uniform. We got just be watching black uniforms. Everybody's seen us in Z so many times. Just get some gray ones.

[Marcus Parks]

Lrh understood this explicit, implicitly. And he understood this, which is idea of, you could make a loser feel amazing by putting them in an amazing uniform.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

And you can make them. And so what he did is like, these are all. Again, they seem. Everybody talks about this. It seems very shallow and dumb. Right? It seems very like. But no, it's all a part of the plan. When you give him a new uniform, it's a new ritual. It's a new re. Up.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Up.

[Marcus Parks]

It's a new commitment. Every single time you give him a new piece of merch and meth.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yes.

[Marcus Parks]

Literally every single time you give them a new piece, it's a new.

[Ed Larson]

All right.

[Marcus Parks]

I kind of. I still like this.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah. I like this. Okay. Yeah. New uniform. Cool.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Ed Larson]

Okay.

[Marcus Parks]

New boot. Goofing.

[Henry Zebrowski]

But uniforms were not the only thing that Himmler had done to pave the way for Germany to invade and annex Austria, which, of course, was number one on Hitler's to do list in the coming conquest of Europe. First, you take Austria, then you get Czechoslovakia, and then we'll talk about Poland. See, during the early 1930s, Austria was ruled by a chancellor with the incredibly ridiculous name of Engelbert Dollfuss. And I really don't know if I can come up with a better roast other than he very much looks like a guy named Engelbert Dollfuss.

[Marcus Parks]

Oh, my God. Oh, my God. It's simple. Jack is odd. You're uneven. Oh, my God.

[Ed Larson]

It's definitely looks easy to Conquer.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, he's the character that's I am Sam.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah, you just give him a box of yo yos and you're in.

[Marcus Parks]

Oh my God.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

He looks Mickey Rooney from the Milky Life.

[Henry Zebrowski]

He looks like a man named Engelbert Dolphus. Like that. Whatever you're picturing, that's what he is.

[Marcus Parks]

I wish you could see this picture because this is the voice. You like my hat? Mad I dropped it on some feathers. Yeah, that dumb gum on it.

[Ed Larson]

He literally has a feather in his cap. Cuz he only eats macaroni.

[Marcus Parks]

I got a little sticky stuff on my head that has a feather on it. It's like my hand's a bird.

[Ed Larson]

God, he looks like tiny sloth.

[Marcus Parks]

Hominy Engleberg. You can call me by my. Well, my friends call me Englebird.

[Ed Larson]

No wonder Hitler didn't want to be be Austrian.

[Henry Zebrowski]

No, Hitler wanted to be German more than anything.

[Ed Larson]

That's probably why he wanted to take over Austria first, because that was his hometown.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, it was where. It was where he was from. Well him.

[Marcus Parks]

Well, Hitler happens when Taylor Swift takes over Kansas City.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Oh yeah. Well, Hitler was born on the border of Austria and Germany on the Austrian side. His father was a border agent. So Hitler had always seen himself as racially German. Like even though he was Austrian. Austrian, you know, but he also, like, he never could shake the Austrian thing either. Like that would, you know, they. I always said they called him a jumped up corporal. Like really what they would say he was jumped up Austrian corporal. What's he doing here in Germany? So Hitler very much had the motivation to take Austria because if he took Austria, then he's not Austrian anymore. He's German because Austria is now a part of Germany.

[Marcus Parks]

I find it interesting, all these people like wake up and they're like, I'm not Aryan, but I feel Aryan. Like it's this idea of like. But I. I should be though, right?

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, that's what I mean. It's. It's all about what feels right and that. And that's what all this entire episode is about. That's the theme of this episode. It's like whatever feels right, that's what the truth is. And that's what we're going to run with no matter what happens.

[Marcus Parks]

True scruvy.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Now Engelbert Dollfuss was doing some real weird shit in Austria as leader. Yeah, I bet he'd been inspired by Italian fascism to form a kind of Catholic corporatist movement where the Catholic church had control over both the government and Austria' Businesses. This alliance, Dollfuss believed between the Catholic Church and Austria could be used to resist the Nazis, because he did actually, in fact, hate the Nazis. But little did Dollfuss know that Heinrich Himmler was making plans to take him down without taking down Austria as a whole. See, it's long been debated how much the Austrian people really wanted to be a part of Germany, because we've all seen the newsreels of Hitler rolling into Austria through throngs of adorned crowds. You have women throwing flowers, people are crying. But this was actually a Nazi tactic. It's a sort of pufferfish move where they would use intimidation, threats and propaganda to give the impression that far more people supported the Nazi party than they really did. Which made the people who didn't support them feel like resistance was hopeless, which it wasn't and it isn't.

[Marcus Parks]

And again, it was much easier to do that stuff without the Internet. The Internet shows you, right, because like, you know, how many times we, you know, I don't want to keep bringing it up, but now we have the Internet that can actually, actually show you the truth of what someone's saying. And it's just hard because now it's about whack a mole, right? It's all about constantly fighting it with misinformation. But we at least know you can see the truth on the Internet if you'd like to.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah, you could see how many people showed up to the birthday parade.

[Marcus Parks]

Exactly. If you'd like to.

[Henry Zebrowski]

But even though the annexation of Austria was ultimately accomplished without warfare, it was not done bloodlessly. See, regardless of how many average Austrians wanted Nazi rule, Austria did have a sizable Nazi population. Through the ss, Heinrich Himmler had been supplying weapons and dynamite to the Austrian Nazis so they could engage in a campaign of terror by blowing up railways, power stations and government buildings. And that's not to mention the straight up murder of Austrians who supported Chancellor Engelbert Dollfuss. But while Engelbert Dollfuss was feeling reasonably secure.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, I got a good new seat.

[Henry Zebrowski]

I got a new lock on my door. But the problems I keep are getting a loc. Keep.

[Marcus Parks]

Cuz sometimes I locked it from the inside and then I kick it out. I climb out the window.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Don't do the nuts about that though.

[Marcus Parks]

Look at this man, look at this.

[Ed Larson]

It looks like someone's holding ice cream in front of him.

[Marcus Parks]

Why you just give that to me. Why you didn't order. Why you not eating it? You give it to me. Give it to me.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, Engelbert Dolfus didn't know about a concept that has in the years since been referred to as working towards the Fuhrer. And this is a very important concept with the Nazis, a very fascinating concept. So as I said in the last episode, it really can't be stressed enough how incredibly lazy Hitler actually was. And I'm not just talking about lazy intellectually. Like he didn't want to read briefings. He'd rather just read his newspapers all day. Hitler slept in until noon almost every day.

[Marcus Parks]

That's the life.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Slept through D day. It's boring because nobody wanted to wake him up to tell him, hey, the Allies have invaded France, we need to get our together. And that was something that he should have known.

[Marcus Parks]

Well, it's because the office culture was toxic.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yes.

[Ed Larson]

I never knew that Hitler slept through D day.

[Henry Zebrowski]

He did. He was actually. He was up in the Berghoff in his. Was on vacation in his retreat and you know the D Day, the Allies landed on the beaches of Normandy and Hitler was here. And they're like, well, we can't wake him up. Don't wake him up. Cuz he's going to be. He'll be really grumpy. He's going to be really mad if you wake him up. And then when he woke up, he went like they told him, and he went like, it's fine, and then walked away. Didn't.

[Ed Larson]

Didn't they know we were coming?

[Henry Zebrowski]

No, absolutely not.

[Marcus Parks]

That was it. We won all that. That's actually. I love the story of that. It's four. Another podcast, a military history podcast, but it's actually very interesting because we got them good.

[Henry Zebrowski]

We got them good. They had no idea. It was a complete and total surprise. We. It was one of the greatest. There's a reason why there's millions of books and TV shows and movies made about it. Yeah, it really is. The thing is about Hitler's laziness is that it greatly informed how the Nazi party worked. Since Hitler was so lazy, Nazis often took matters into their own own hands and did things that they thought Hitler would want done. Working towards the Fuhrer, as it were. And it's very likely that the Austrian Nazis were working towards the Fuhrer in the years prior to the invasion. In July of 1934, a relatively small group of Austrian Nazis, like seven or eight guys, they stormed the Austin Chancellery and shot Engelbert Dollfuss to death during an attempted coup.

[Marcus Parks]

You guys here to take me to the park? Hey, what you guys doing? You guys look all empty. You say there's chocolate in this tube? Yeah. Wrap your lips around it. You just stuck on it.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, the coup of course failed. But after Dolfus was killed, Hitler ordered the Nazi leaders to accelerate the German war machine to full production because Hitler could feel that the time for war was approaching. That was 1934. By 1935, Hitler expanded the size of the German army to half a million men in the aforementioned defiance of the Treaty of Versailles, which in theory should have been stopped by the other great powers of Europe. But since they were still traumatized by World War I, Britain and France merely grumbled and they did not act. They also did not act when Germany moved troops to the French border, again in violation of the Treaty of Versailles. Now, Hitler would have absolutely backed down and he would have been humiliated if France would have moved just one unit in opposition. The Nazi troops were actually under orders from Hitler himself to retreat if this happened. But again, France did not act.

[Marcus Parks]

They like, seriously, they didn't take him seriously.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Well, no, they didn't. It's not that they didn't take him seriously is that they didn't want to do anything that could bring them even an inch closer to returning to the war. Then that was what it was all about, is that they did not want in any world to return to the trenches. And what they had just gone through, everyone remembered it and everyone hated it. They similarly, the governments of Europe again huffed and puffed when Hitler annexed Austria, but nothing meaningful was done to stop him. In fact, England all but facilitated Germany's subsequent annexation of Czechoslovakia in September of 1938 with the Munich Agreement and Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain's now infamous proclamation of peace for all time. When he got out, you know, you know him at the fucking airport holding up the piece of paper like he just averted everything.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, because he gave Hitler a lot of. He basically said we won't do anything.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah, maybe he's talking about peace, as in piece of paper.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, peace of our diamond. Took two hours of my time to receive this worthless piece of paper.

[Henry Zebrowski]

What all this added up to was that Hitler was starting to see that nobody was going to stop him. He could rearm Germany, he could amass troops on Germany's borders, he could annex countries, he could do anything he wanted to the German people and the rest of the the world would do little more than give him a stern tut tut. This is of course very good news for Heinrich Himmler, who was waiting in the wings with the rest of the SS for the inevitable invasion of Poland, where Leben's realm would finally be put into practice. And to ensure that Eastern Europe was well and truly cleared of all so called undesirables, Heinrich Himmler would deploy perhaps the most evil group of men to the, to ever walk this earth. They called them the Einsatzgruppen. And it's with their incredibly harrowing story that we'll continue our series next week.

[Ed Larson]

Man, it's crazy that they took over Austria and Czechoslovakia and no one cared. But when they went into Poland, everyone's like, all right, this is too much.

[Marcus Parks]

Well, well, there's military reasons. Yeah, yeah, well, they know.

[Ed Larson]

But Austria, Czechoslovakia, probably like what no one gives a.

[Henry Zebrowski]

About us. Well, I mean with, with Austria, like there was, like I said, like, you know, they said like, okay, fine, we'll do it. Because Austria thought like, okay, we're going to be a part of Germany. But what Austria didn't realize was that what the real motivation for annexing, Annexing Austria was and for annexing Czechoslovakia. Resources. Because the German economy is in the shitter. They don't have the resources. They need the, you know, they need food from Austria, they need Czechoslovakia's factories. Like they need these things. So they say like, yeah, you're going to be a part of Germany, Germany. And then once, you know, Austria is in, you know, in Germany and part of Germany for, you know, like really just within a few months, they're like, oh no, we're not a part of this at all. We're, we're, we're, we are subject, subjects to, to these Nazis. Like we're, we're here. We're a feedback. We're not a part of this at all. Me, this is a really bad idea.

[Ed Larson]

Did they turn a lot of them into soldiers too?

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah, oh yeah, a lot of them too.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah.

[Marcus Parks]

Just know that whenever a Nazi offers you a job, it's not going to be stable. Unless you're a horse.

[Ed Larson]

And then you better get bigger.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Truly.

[Marcus Parks]

Because if you look at a lot of administrations, right. It was recently, for no reason, I was reading about Pol Pot just to laugh. And it, that was only five years and this was only a certain period of time. So just know these guys burn out. They do burn out. Just remember that little Nazis out there, your job. Is it safe with the Nazis? Nazis, because they're gonna, they fire you too. And then when they come for you, they're gonna be just as mean to you as all the other people you were mean to as well.

[Henry Zebrowski]

The Thousand year Reich lasted 12 years.

[Marcus Parks]

Yep. And we're still talking about it.

[Henry Zebrowski]

And the last few Years were quite awful. It's not like the last couple. Like, it's not like 1943 to 1945.

[Marcus Parks]

We're fine.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Good.

[Marcus Parks]

Yeah.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah.

[Henry Zebrowski]

There weren't like fun times to be in, I don't know, Dresden.

[Marcus Parks]

Oh, yeah. Same thing. When you go to Cambodia. It's because for some reason these guys don't want to let go. Y and to me, that's my. That's the reason why I go to Better Help because teaches me how to let go. Got to get your get, get your help there now. If you know Nazi, send them Our code for LastPod50@betterhelp patreon.com Last podcast on the left. Pay to watch us talk. Pay to watch us flop. You're gonna love it. And you see last podcast, last stream in the Left live every Tuesday at 6pm PST.

[Henry Zebrowski]

That's right. And thank you very much to to Carolina Hidalgo for her help in story editing on this one and helped me to put together this massive amount of information into something that is legible. And you can also interact with us live on the chat during the stream every Tuesday. If you are a Patreon supporter, you can also follow us at lp on the left for TikTok and Instagram and all that stuff to see fun clips from the show and to see where we're going to be playing next year to see all of our dates. And Eddie, let him know what's happening tomorrow.

[Ed Larson]

We're in Oakland.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Fuck yeah.

[Ed Larson]

So come fucking party. Oakland. We are ready for your goddamn asses.

[Marcus Parks]

I love sweet, sweet Oakland. Come on out.

[Ed Larson]

Yeah, man, Bring me some goddamn food too, you piece of. Then November 29th, we're going to be in Akron, Ohio. December 12th and 13th, Portland, Oregon. January 31st, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. February 28th, Austin, Texas. March 13th, Indian, Indianapolis, Indiana. And April 25th, Cincinnati, Ohio. I can't wait for all you nasty natties to come out and see me. May 29th, Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. June 27th, Grand Rapids, Michigan. July 17th, Tulsa, Oklahoma. And July 18th, Oklahoma City. And also, I gotta say, Henry and I are doing the Crime Wave Cruise in a couple weeks and I added shows in Florida before and after. So on a November 2nd, I'm gonna be in Miami. And November 8th, I'm gonna be in Orlando doing the Disney show again. Dead men tell some tales. So go find tickets to that.

[Marcus Parks]

And that's a great show. Except what? They're being able to be Walt Disney.

[Ed Larson]

So, yes, you won't be Disney at this time unless I make you record a bunch.

[Marcus Parks]

We'll see we shall see. Go on YouTube. LBNTV, some places underneath. Forward report. No Dogs in Space, all those shows.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Can I please let me go sleep?

[Ed Larson]

Yes, it's time to go to bed.

[Marcus Parks]

You go to the camp. Hail Satan.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Good night, everyone.

[Marcus Parks]

Oh, go game.

[Ed Larson]

And hail hell. Waterloo, I guess.

[Marcus Parks]

Hey, we're not with them.

[Henry Zebrowski]

I'll give you a go in hell. Sophie Sh and the White the Sophie Sh and the White Rose.

[Ed Larson]

Sophie. Sophie Sh and the White Rose. Who are they?

[Marcus Parks]

Amazing punk band that are out of Bristol, Connecticut.

[Henry Zebrowski]

We might talk about them here in a couple episodes. The resistance movement within Germany was behead a teenage girl beheaded by Heinrich Himmler.

[Ed Larson]

Oh, see, now I'm not gonna have anything to hail next episode.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Oh, yeah, well, that'll probably be episode six.

[Ed Larson]

Hail Kamazi Washington.

[Henry Zebrowski]

Yeah, he's great. Yeah, love Kamazi. Foreign.

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[Marcus Parks]

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[Ed Larson]

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[Marcus Parks]

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[Henry Zebrowski]

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[Henry Zebrowski]

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