In this intimate and deeply thoughtful conversation, climbing legends Tom Randall and Ollie Torr dive into the often unspoken realities behind long-term progression in climbing. From failed redpoints and painful finger joints to redefining success in the face of stress and burnout, this episode is a masterclass in psychological resilience and personal growth.

Tom opens up about one of his hardest trips to date, the shifting goalposts of elite performance, and how a mindset of "letting it brew" can lead to more rewarding outcomes - even in failure. Ollie brings his coaching lens to the table, unpacking how climbers can adjust training and expectations when life throws curveballs.

Whether you’re navigating injuries, balancing life and climbing, or just need a reminder that growth isn’t linear, this one’s for you.

Key topics include:

The psychology of projecting routes
Why letting goals “brew” improves performance
Pain tolerance and aging in climbing
Balancing sponsorship with personal struggles
Finding joy in the process, not just the send

Tune in to hear how two of climbing’s most influential voices navigate the long road, and why the best projects take time.

The Lattice jingle is brought to you by Devin Dabney, music producer of the outdoor industry who also hosts the American Climbing Project.