← Law Enforcement Talk: True Crime and Trauma Stories
Law Enforcement Talk: True Crime and Trauma Stories
Is 19 Too Young To Be a Police Officer?
00:36:47
Is 19 Too Young To Be a Police Officer? A Florida, USA Perspective on Trauma Impact and PTSD. Special Episode. At just 19 years old, Michael A. Laidler was already wearing a badge and responding to some of the most intense calls a police officer can face. Sworn in as a police officer in Tallahassee, Florida, USA, his early entry into law enforcement placed him on the front lines at an age when most of his peers were still navigating college life or their first civilian jobs.
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- [00:00]
WSECU Announcer
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WSECU Announcer
Because we put you first. Lower fees, early paydays, financial guidance and service second to none. As a member owned cooperative, we love Washington as much as you do. From the Olympic mountains to the rolling Palouse. Join us and discover how much we care about your financial well being. Because what we really do best is invest in you. Stop by, say hi, we're wsecu. Let's credit union.
- [00:32]
Grainger Announcer
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John J. Wiley
He's a career law enforcement officer. He started in police work at the age of 19. A couple very very traumatic incidents had a profound impact on him, his personal life and his career path. Welcome to the Law Enforcement Talk Radio Show. In the Law Enforcement Talk Radio show we are joined by special guests talking about their experiences, their realities of investigating crimes plus those have experienced horrendous trauma. First responders, military and victims of crime share their stories. Hi, I'm John J. Wiley. In addition to being a broadcaster, I'm also a retired police sergeant. Be sure to check out our website letradio.com and also like us on Facebook search for the Law Enforcement Talk radio show. You can find us on Facebook. Look for and like the Law Enforcement Talk Radio show Facebook page. Calling us from Texas, we have Michael Laidler on the phone. Michael is a career law enforcement officer. He has been in the business since he was 90. Yeah, he started as a police officer in Tallahassee, Florida at the ripe old age of 19. Michael, thanks so much for being guest on the show. Very much appreciated.
- [02:10]
Michael Laidler
Thanks for having me.
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John J. Wiley
Jay, before we go into your career, I want to thank you for your service but I also want to let people know a little bit about you. Michael has gone into federal law enforcement. He is a speaker. He has a book coming out. Go to his website michael aladdler.com it's spelled L A I D L E R. Michael first of all the thought of going into police work at the age of 19 kind of blows my mind.
- [02:37]
Michael Laidler
Yes. I actually had the passion from when I was a young man in the 90s and I saw the O.J. simpson trial and that's kind of where all of it started out for me. It was something about that chase, something about the trial that just made me want to become actually an detective for the LA Police Department. And I didn't really know what that meant as a kid. But as I grew older, I continued to look at a career in law enforcement. And ultimately at the age of 19, I was given that opportunity to do it.
- [03:06]
John J. Wiley
I can't even tell you what I was doing at 19. For number one is so long ago, I don't remember. Number two, I guarantee it wasn't worthwhile. I wasn't doing anything great.
- [03:15]
Michael Laidler
Yes. But I do believe that when the opportunity came up, it was the right time. I did not know I was going to be a police officer at 19. I planned for, you know, the average age. I think it's between 22 to 24, give or take. Usually when someone finished college or they went through two other careers, they do it. But I got really lucky and I was fortunate to have that chance at that time. And since then it's been an amazing lifestyle just being in law enforcement.
- [03:39]
John J. Wiley
Many states, they have different requirements. In my state, Maryland, you had to be 21. So I was 21 in the academy, turned 22 when I hit the streets and you know what, I thought I had it going on. I thought I knew everything, like most 20, 21, 22 year olds, and really I was not prepared for what was heading my way. I thought I knew, I thought I had an idea of how violent it was going to be, how much trauma is going to be, but I really did not understand the impact and how much and how severe it was going to be.
- [04:11]
Michael Laidler
Yeah, Jay, I think for a lot of us, especially at the younger age, I know me being 19, although I was raised in a busy city like Miami, Florida, I still did not know and understand the pressure of being a law enforcement officer until I actually put the uniform on and hit the streets at 19. And no matter how much training I got at the time, it just didn't seem like enough maturity, life experience, just navigating all that through life. It was definitely a challenge for me and I can still see it being a challenge for anybody anywhere at that young age. Just because it's hard to explain it in the book or I'll tell you.
- [04:49]
John J. Wiley
I think it's a challenge for anybody, regardless of their age. And the more you do it, I think that the more of an impact it takes on you, the more of a toll it takes on your, for lack of better words, your humanity, your psyche, all those things. Seeing the worst of people, what they can do to each other all the time, you can't help but be dinged up.
- [05:08]
Michael Laidler
Yes, it does take a big mental toll. And I think as I've grown older, I've learned how to train myself and develop my skill set in that area of getting beat up mentally and taking all the dings and the bruises. And I'd say for anybody, you just got to really train yourself and understand that there are problems you're going to see. It's just you got to know how to handle them before they happen. Because if you don't, that's where you suffer at.
- [05:33]
John J. Wiley
Well, I'm glad you brought that up because I look back, as you was saying, Hindsight is 20 20. I look back on my career and I can see when I began to change. I can see when the things, as I say, began to crack a little bit. And before things got really bad at that time, I couldn't see it. So I want to go back. You start your law enforcement career in Tallahassee, Florida. You're 19 years of age, you think you're prepared for this and you go out there and like most people, you do the job because you want to do good stuff to help people.
- [06:06]
Michael Laidler
Yeah, that's definitely always the goal, to protect and serve and to build our community up. And although I thought I was ready, there was experiences that I went through that kind of showed me I wasn't ready. Fortunately, I didn't take those experiences to a level to where I would harm myself or harm somebody else. But some of the responses wasn't as positive as they would be now. But back then, without any kind of training and minimum life experience, it was definitely tough looking at some of those events that are high stress.
- [06:39]
John J. Wiley
And the truth is, you still sound like a very young guy. I know you're not as young as you sound, but about how old are you?
- [06:45]
Michael Laidler
Oh, right now I'm 36.
- [06:47]
John J. Wiley
I'm going to tell you right now, you're a puppy compared to the guys like me. I'm a. I'm officially a geezer. I never thought I'd be this age, Michael, if you'd asked me when I was 22 year old street cop, hey, what's going to be like when you're 60s? What? Forget about it. So to be where I'm at now and to have this conversation with you and to look at it from someone in their 30s and to go back to your late teens, early 20s, it's kind of enlightening, and I'm looking forward to the conversation. Would it be safe to say that in a department like Tallahassee, which is in Florida, the capital of Florida, and there's also a big college town, was it more violent than you thought it would be, more traumatic than you thought it would be?
- [07:29]
Michael Laidler
I think for anybody that comes in a town of even size of Tallahassee, where, you know, it's the capital, a lot of colleges, I think that there's more violence than what people realize that's on our streets. And we're not like a Chicago or Miami or la, but there is a lot of risk for anybody in any city that puts it on. And once you put that uniform on, you actually see the violence. So, yes, there is a lot of violence. There's homicides, there's robberies, there's sexual assaults, all the things you can think of in a place like Tallahassee. And at times they. It was said that the crime rate was higher per capita in places like Tallahassee, but it's hard to tell because it's not a big city.
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John J. Wiley
Well, see, one of the big misconceptions even I had is the big cities have rather large departments, so the smaller cities have less manpower. And you want it being subjected and exposed to just pretty much the same amount of violence, same amount of trauma. And people need to remember cities like Tallahassee, even further east, like Lake City, Florida and Gainesville, Florida, there was a serial killer named Ted Bundy who preyed on lots of people in that area. Just because it's a smaller city doesn't mean it's immune from violent crime. We're talking with Michael Laidler. He's a career law enforcement officer, started at 19. When we return, we're going to talk about a couple of really traumatic incidents that had a big impact on his career and his career path. Also, be sure to check out his upcoming book and more details about him online at. Michaelath. This is the Law Enforcement Show. We're going to take a short break. We'll be right back. Of all the radio stations in the United States, there are no other shows like the law enforcement talk radio show. And on Facebook, there's only one official page. Do a search on Facebook for the law enforcement talk radio show and be sure to like the law enforcement talk radio show.
- [09:24]
WSECU Announcer
Facebook Page WSECU isn't just one of Washington's best credit unions. We're the only credit union to be on the Forbes Best in State list five years running.
- [09:33]
Grainger Announcer
Why?
- [09:33]
WSECU Announcer
Because we put you first. Lower fees, early paydays, financial guidance and service second to none. As a member owned cooperative, we love Washington as much as you do. From the Olympic Mountains to the rolling Palouse. Join us and discover how much we care about your financial well being. Because what we really do best is invest in you. Stop by, say hi, we're wsecu. Let's Credit Union.
- [09:57]
Grainger Announcer 2
If you're the purchasing manager at a manufacturing plant, you know having a trusted partner makes all the difference. That's why hands down, you count on Grainger for auto reordering. With on time restocks, your team will have the cut resistant gloves they need at the start of their shift and you can end your day knowing they've got safety well in hand. Call 1-800-GRAINGER Click grainger.com or just stop by Granger for the ones who get it done.
- [10:30]
John J. Wiley
Return Conversational Michael Laidler on the Law Enforcement Show Michael is a career law enforcement officer. He's in his 30s. He's a young guy, but he's been at this since he was 19. So when you look at the scope of it, it's a long period of time. Check out his website, michaelaladeler.com is spelled L A I D L E R, and details about his upcoming book will be there as well. So you started in law enforcement. First of all, you're raised in Miami, correct?
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Michael Laidler
Yes sir.
- [10:58]
John J. Wiley
And then you moved into a career in law enforcement in Tallahassee. And Tallahassee must seem like the Sleepy south in your mind compared to Miami.
- [11:07]
Michael Laidler
Absolutely. You definitely, when you look at the map, you don't usually look at Tallahassee outside of it being the capital because you have other large cities such as Miami, Orlando, Tampa, Pensacola, Jacksonville. So when you hear of Tallahassee, you just don't give it the same credit that you with the big cities. But there are a lot of things that go on in Tallahassee just like the other ones.
- [11:27]
John J. Wiley
There sure are. And for people who are not familiar with Florida, it's a different state. I live in Florida, I love Florida. I live in South Florida on the east coast and I call it south yorkadelphia because you've got a heavy New York, Boston, Baltimore, Philadelphia influence. On the west coast you've got Chicago, Detroit, Upper Midwest influence. Then you go up to like above Gainesville and Tallahassee and that is the Deep South. So it's kind of reversed.
- [11:56]
Michael Laidler
Yes, it's definitely different because when you, when you just look at it, you're like, oh, I, that's. There's no way that something can be going on here. But then you get into the environment, you kind of see the day to day activity, especially from a police officer stance. You're like, oh man, I do have a lot of things that are going on that I see the bigger cities going through and kind of preparing your mind just has to be as similar because like we said before, it's less officers, but the same amount of calls, same amount of ratio of violence.
- [12:24]
John J. Wiley
Exactly. So let's talk about a couple specific incidents. We did talk a little bit. You have two things in your career in particular you want to talk about. Let's talk about the very first one.
- [12:34]
Michael Laidler
Perfect. Jay. Yeah, it's. It's something that is probably 15 years ago at this point. I was about 20, 21, 22, and that age range right there. And I remember I was working the 4 to 2 shift in Tallahassee. That was one of the common shifts. We called it swings. And we got a call about a traffic crash, which is not uncommon. And it was on Appalachia Parkway, which was a major road in Tallahassee. We heard it was a traffic crash with injuries. So we go there, lights and sirens, try to get there quickly and safely. And as soon as I pull up, I see a van that slipped on its side and it slipped on this driver's side. And I get out. And then the other officers that are in my area, they get out too. So there's about four to five of us. And we all kind of look around like, well, we're here, the fire department's not here, paramedics aren't here. What do we need to do? And when we're looking around, they look at me and say, well, you're the young guy, you're the lightest of us. So guess what? And I'm looking at them thinking, what do you guess what? What? I was like, hey, we're putting you through the window. I was like, what do you mean you're putting me through the window? So needless to say, within about 10 seconds, I started my. All my gear on my, my standard poly, yes, polyester uniform, my vest, my belt. And they lifted me up and put me in through the pasture window, what was open. And as they held onto my legs, they dropped me down as long as far as they could. And my responsibility was to stop the bleeding. There was a woman that was trapped in the vehicle because when it flipped, her arm was outside of the window.
- [14:07]
John J. Wiley
Oh, no.
- [14:07]
Michael Laidler
So she couldn't go anywhere. As I'm using towels and whatever they can hand me to apply pressure to her arm so she wouldn't bleed out. I vividly remember her pulling out a son, or, excuse me, pulling out a photo of her son and just saying, ayurme. Just saying, help me, help me, my son. And all she wanted to do was live long enough to go see her son. She didn't know what was next for her. I didn't know what was next for her. So as we sat there waiting for the medics to get there and the firefighters, my partners, they do what they do best next. They try to break the window out, and they're trying to do that. And a few minutes passed, everybody started to show up. All the other emergency responses, and they get the window out, we get her out. But based on what we did that day and that time, me getting to the vehicle, my partners, Keith, me, and there, me applying pressure, we were able to save her life. She had. She did have to have her arm amputated, but we allowed her opportunity to go see her son. And at that time, I didn't realize how much of an impact it would have on me. I didn't have any children at the time, but I can only imagine if I had a son at the time or if I had any kind of kids, or if I was around a lot of kids, the kind of impact it would have had on me, like, as a parent, but just as a person. Just like all she wanted. All she wanted to do was survive. And it was between me, that towel and her arm on what was going to happen next. And it was a real impact that I really didn't know how to handle. Besides, just nobody talked to me about it. We didn't debrief about it. It was one of those, like, okay, next call. Even to this day, I think about that call.
- [15:48]
John J. Wiley
What I gotta ask you is. And I wrote something for social media, for the law enforcement radio show, Facebook page about. I lied many times as a cop. And I'm not talking about in court. I'm not talking about nefarious reasons or corruption. I lied to people that were dying. And quite often, the last thing that someone saw was a face of, in my case, a Baltimore police officer. And we're lying to them. Hang in there. Help's on the way. You're gonna be okay. It's not that bad. I know you had to have the conversation with her, whether it was a different language or not, you had to be able to convince her that she had a chance. How difficult was that for you to do that?
- [16:29]
Michael Laidler
Thinking about it now, and even back then, that was tough because I didn't know what was next for her. I didn't know I had to display a level of confidence just for me to believe, for me to give her enough energy for her to believe. Because if I didn't give her that reassurance, who knows how she would have reacted? Who knows how she would have behaved just based on that? Because we know panic really sets in for a lot of things. And, I mean, she couldn't go anywhere, like, physically, she could not move. So I had to reassure her. And, I mean, I was very optimistic about it. I couldn't have been confident because I don't even know. I didn't know if they could get her out or not. I didn't know. I didn't know if we were gonna save her life or not. We did, but it was very tough convincing myself to convince her on something that I didn't know.
- [17:14]
John J. Wiley
Plus, you're inside the van in a very unnatural position trying to administer aid. Look, I know that you were trained in first aid and emergency response like, we were a lot of things, and over the years, they've gotten better. But one thing that we didn't get taught how to handle the aftermath. And one of the things that I used to do, Michael and I try to explain to people, you get a hot call for whatever it might be. Let's just say it's an armed person or it's a shooting or a rape in progress, or in your case, a really bad accident with injuries. And you start going through a mental checklist in your mind of things you got to do when you get there. And first and foremost is get there. You said it. Get there safely. Get there in one piece, and don't create another situation. I'm sure that that checklist went through your mind as well.
- [18:01]
Michael Laidler
Oh, absolutely. Yes, I. Once you've done it, and although I was still young, I was a pup. I was all that stuff. I was a rookie so many ways. After you've been driving continuously, you go through the training you go through in service training, you go through all the things you gotta do. Okay, could I blow through this light to get there, to go save this person's life or to see what's going on? I can. But like you said, Jay, if I do the wrong thing, I create another hazard. Then I Create an accident.
- [18:28]
John J. Wiley
Absolutely. We can't have that. This is the law enforcement show. We are talking Michael Laidler. Be sure to check his website. Michael A. Laid Out. L A I D L E R dot com. We'll take a short break. We'll be right back. One of the questions I get all the time is how can I show my support for law enforcement? We're all busy. We've got busy lives. But there's something oh so simple you can do with our Facebook page. Search for law enforcement talk radio show Facebook page and when you see a post you agree with that resonates with you, share it. Especially episodes of the podcast. To do all that, just search for us on Facebook, look for law enforcement talk radio show and be sure to.
- [19:12]
WSECU Announcer
Click like WSECU isn't just one of Washington's best credit unions. We're the only credit union to be on the Forbes Best in state list five years running.
- [19:21]
John J. Wiley
Why?
- [19:21]
WSECU Announcer
Because we put you first. Lower fees, early paydays, financial guidance and service second to none. As a member owned cooperative, we love to Washington as much as you do. From the Olympic mountains to the Rolling Palouse. Join us and discover how much we care about your financial well being. Because what we really do best is invest in you. Stop by, say hi, we're wsecu. Let's credit union.
- [19:45]
Grainger Announcer 2
If you're the purchasing manager at a manufacturing plant, you know having a trusted partner makes all the difference. That's why hands down, you count on Grainger for auto reordering. With on time restocks, your team will have the cut resistant gloves they need at the start of their shift. And you can end your day knowing they've got safety well in hand. Call 1-800-GRAINGER click granger.com or just stop by Granger for the ones who get it done.
- [20:18]
John J. Wiley
This is a law enforcement show. Return to conversation with Michael Laidler. He's calling us from Texas. Federal law enforcement officer. He's been in law enforcement since he was 19. Be sure to check out his website, michaelaladeler.com it's spelled L A I D L E R. And get detail about his upcoming book. First of all, I want to thank you for your service and secondly, thank you for taking the time to talk about these things. I know it's not easy going through it and also realize it's not easy talking about it especially on the radio to someone you never met. I can tell you this, I've been through so many of these life and death calls and there are people you thought would make it that didn't. And it's devastating. There's people that you thought they were goners and they made it and you're quite shocked. But they all take a toll on you, I do believe, to some degree or another. So thank you for helping save that lady's life. In Tallahassee. There was another incident you went through that also had a profound impact on you. Can you talk about that one?
- [21:19]
Michael Laidler
Absolutely, Jay. And coincidentally, this second incident was in the same exact week as the first incident as the traffic crash, where I had to perform life saving measures to help this woman survive. Same shift, different day, but I can remember hearing a call, medical emergency, about a infant that had stopped breathing. So first thing in my mind, I had to get there as quickly as possible. That's my goal, to go there and help save a kid's life. And myself and my partner at the time, we both get there around the same time. We get there before EMS or firefighters get there. And it's a single family resident. As soon as we get out, the front door is open, so we know we're at the right place. We get up to the door, we can hear screaming and yelling and emotions in people's voice. Not anger, but a fear. We walk into the house and there's probably five to ten people just frantic. And as soon as they see us in a uniform, they hand us a baby. Baby is maybe three months. And as soon as they hand the baby to me, I just, I look at the baby's face and it looks lifeless. I didn't know how to respond to them because now they're looking at me for help and there's nothing really I can do. We start doing CPR the best we can on a three month old baby. But we knew at the time that that baby was no longer with us. And given the excitement or I guess the energy that was in the house from that, it was, it was really tough for us to manage. We had to hold on to keeping everybody together until firefighters came in. I can remember maybe a few minutes later, it wasn't a few seconds, but a few minutes later, firefighters walked in and immediately they took the baby and continued on with cpr. But even the look on their face was similar to ours and similar to the family. So that incident stuck with me as much as the first one. Because once again, being in law enforcement, we're not just there to put a bad guy in jail or to do right tickets or anything like that. We're going there to save people's lives. And I failed at My job that day, there. There was nothing I could have done differently. But the fact that I could not save a life, a baby's life, is that at. That was really tough. And we didn't respond the way we should have. Once again, we didn't have a debrief at the time. We. I mean, we wasn't given any kind of full process like a. This is how you process the death of a child. I was fortunate in my way because I didn't have any children. But I know my partner. I mean, he was real close to his younger siblings and stuff, and he took it as hard as I did. And it was a really tough experience because we trained for a lot of stuff, but not necessarily for that. That's not what you see in a training like you're going to go pick up a lifeless baby.
- [24:17]
John J. Wiley
Well, the other part is you really can't train for that. We train for every scenario you can think of. And most of these scenarios come from past experience of other law enforcement officers. And that's where the training comes from. You can't predict everything. You said something very, very important, I believe, Michael. You said I failed. You didn't fail. I get it. I wanted to be Superman. I wanted to be the guy you ripped a shirt open, There's a big ass on your chest. And I'm gonna make things right. I'm gonna save people. But I'm not God. I'm only human. And you said another point is very, very important. You knew right away that child was gone. It didn't prevent you from trying. But I take you to task. You didn't fail. You tried.
- [25:00]
Michael Laidler
I agree. And with any law enforcement officer that listens to this show or any other lady that puts on a uniform whenever. We can't do something like that. I know we always have that in us. I know I couldn't do anything different. I couldn't have prevented it. I couldn't have. I couldn't have brought the baby back to life at that point. But I knew that in my mind there was something I wish I could have done more of because that was a very hard time for me and my partner. I know that for sure.
- [25:26]
John J. Wiley
We also. And I did this. I can't speak for you. I also critiqued myself. What could I have done better? What did I learn from that incident? What could I have done to de escalate? And that's, by the way, a term used a lot nowadays that we were doing in the 80s. I want to take people to task. It's not a New thing. What could I have done better? How could I have handled better? How could I save this life? All these things. And that's how you get better, what you do. And there are also senior officers that talked to us, that trained us, said, hey knucklehead, don't do this. Next time, do this. And that was part of the maturing process. Did you critique yourself harshly after that?
- [26:04]
Michael Laidler
I critiqued myself to the point to where later that night my friend and I, or my partner and I did probably what some of his law enforcement do too often on instances like that, we went and had alcoholic beverages and crab legs and we both very sick the next night. And as I looked back at that, that was not the healthy way to handle that. That wasn't the way that is good for our mental mindset. And I wish at the time I knew, like, hey, something like that happens, you need to go debrief, you need to go see somebody, you need to get yourself in another positive environment in order to uplift yourself. Because that night could have been a lot worse for us because of the way we handled it. But luckily we got through it. We know there could have been other ways that could have went wrong.
- [26:54]
John J. Wiley
And unfortunately you and the family had to go through that. And when I say, and it sounds trite when I say, you know, you all are my thoughts and prayers, it's one of the things I say. The first responders that go to these calls, that go to these incidents, people don't realize the impact it has on them and it's quite often harsh. And by the way, back in the day we didn't have, I love saying that back in my day when I was a rookie, we didn't have critical incidents, we didn't have officer involved shootings, we just had shootings. We didn't have it. What quite often we would do after really bad shift and really bad stuff happen is we go to a parking lot, get a case of beer and we talk and drink. The negative part of it was the drinking became excessive for many of us. The other part of it was spending time with other people that been through it can help you put in proper perspective, can be beneficial. But that's the, that's how we handled everything. We didn't have anything else.
- [27:52]
Michael Laidler
Yes, I agree. And over time, what I would like to see more of are the positive sides. Hey, let's get together. We don't have to drink because not everybody can handle that. And I've Learned that through 17 years of being in law enforcement, not everybody can handle that and do it safely. But talk to people that kind of know your situation, especially people that are there with you and talk to them. And then definitely you never want to handle it by yourself. That's never the right way to do it.
- [28:20]
John J. Wiley
And by the way that alcohol can become a problem for a lot of people, that's the reason why I've been sober 30 years. As we're talking with Michael Laidler. He started law enforcement at the age of 19. He's a career law enforcement officer. We're going to talk about the next phase of his career. Be sure to go to his website, get more details about what he's doing about his upcoming book. Michaelaladeler.com is spelled L A I D L E R.com this is law Enforcement Show. We take a short break. We'll be right back. You know we used to have an app and it was very popular app and then guess what? We couldn't hold a candle through our Facebook presence. How many people have the mobile Facebook app already installed on their phone? How many people use it on their computer? Make sure you follow us, make sure you like us on our Facebook page. Just search for law enforcement talk radio show and podcast and be sure to send us a comment to one of the posts. Best of all, it's 100% free.
- [29:19]
WSECU Announcer
WSECU isn't just one of Washington's best credit unions. We're the only credit union to be on the Forbes Best in State list five years running.
- [29:27]
John J. Wiley
Why?
- [29:27]
WSECU Announcer
Because we put you first. Lower fees, early paydays, financial guidance and service second to none. As a member owned cooperative, we love Washington as much as you do. From the Olympic mountains to the rolling Palouse. Join us and discover how much we care about your financial well being. Because what we really do best is invest in you. Stop by, say hi, we're wsecu. Let's Credit Union.
- [29:50]
Grainger Announcer 2
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- [30:24]
John J. Wiley
Conversation on the Law Enforcement show with Michael Latler calling us from Texas. He is a federal law enforcement officer. He's been in law enforcement since 19, started with the Tallahassee, Florida Police Department, and we were talking about a couple of very traumatic incidents you went through a couple years into your career, 21, 22, 23 years of age. Would it be safe to say that those incidents and others, the trauma, the violence impacting your decision making and this career in law enforcement, you said earlier it's a career you really wanted. You didn't realize it until you started doing it, how much you loved it. Now you are in the federal law enforcement field. Were these incidents having to do with driving your decision making?
- [31:08]
Michael Laidler
Jay Absolutely. I think every experience that we have, especially when we reflect and look how they build us, put us on a path to where we're at and where we're going. And as I have grown in the last 17 years, I have learned how to actually build myself off of these experiences. Not just letting them be experiences that are untapped or not looked at, but try to figure out the learning lessons I get from each of them. And from early part on in my life, especially being a police officer, there were a lot of experiences, especially the two that we talked about earlier, that really helped me understand where I need to be at. And I'm not going to lie, I did not know what some of these experiences were going to mean back when I was in my mid to late twenties. But as I grew my own self development and I was able to understand my own awareness, I started to realize the direction that my life was taking me. And that's what kind of led to me going to another agency, that being Border Patrol, and then getting to settle corrections shortly thereafter. But all the experiences that I got through all these careers have really pushed me to the level of thinking differently because I think if I just stayed in one agency, I would only thought one way. But the fact that I had the different agencies now under my belt, it really helped guide my mind to think differently.
- [32:33]
John J. Wiley
It's a different mission statement, a different mission with Border Patrol than there is city policing. A lot of similarities, but a lot of differences. And by the way, for those who are not aware, Border Patrol is really getting a lot of unnecessary units, unneeded, unwarranted heat, primarily from politicians and the news media. I'm not going to belabor that point, but the whole whipping with the horses was a lie to begin with. That went too far. I don't really understand a lot of what Border Patrol does, and I don't think a lot of Americans really get what they do. In a nutshell, what would you say would be the one thing that people don't understand about their mission?
- [33:14]
Michael Laidler
First and foremost, for anybody that's in Border patrol or that aspires, it's an amazing career, guys. I love my brothers and sisters that are still there and due to certain family concerns, that's the only reason I left. When it comes to what they do on a day to day basis is they prevent terrorists and drugs from coming in. That's the number one goal. Now, I know there's a lot of media that talks about illegal entries and criminals coming in, and that's what Border patrol tries to do. But when you look at the numbers game in the big picture of what goes on, there's just not enough people, there's not enough agents for the amount of land that's covered. I can remember times where I was following a group of illegal aliens and there would be 20. I knew there were 20 because I would see 20. By the time I got to them, there were four. And that's the reality of life. Anything we do try to perform on there has to be a bigger picture. So a lot of the stuff I see in the news now, it's been happening since at least I was in Border Patrol. It just wasn't popular back then. So some of the things that are hurting Border Patrol are some of the new laws. And I think the numbers are increasing, but they're kind of going back to late 90s, early 2000s numbers where people are just trying to get here as quickly as they can. But Border patrol has a job that nobody knows about. You're out there by yourself a lot. It's a little indifferent from when I was a police officer because I can call on the radio, say I need some assistance and I will get somebody in a minute. As border Patrol, you're out there and there's miles between you and your partner. You're on different terrain, you're in different land. And it's just a different feeling when you're trying to handle what you're doing out there. But their main goal, which they, they do a great job of, is preventing terrorists and drugs from getting into the country.
- [34:57]
John J. Wiley
And it's non stop. That's the thing. These guys, these men and women, they do a phenomenal job. They do the best they can with what they have all the time. And they're never perfect all the time. No matter how hard you try, they're going to not stop. I'm talking about cartels south of the border that with human Trafficking with narcotics, with weapons, with explosives, whatever it might be. They're not going to stop because that's their livelihood. They're going to find ways to penetrate. What I find to be difficult to understand, Michael, to be totally honest with you, something you said. But when you work as a city police, like you and I did, help is a short distance away in the Border Patrol. You could be out in the middle of the wilderness absolutely by yourself at night, and you've got 20 or 30 people that are all committing some sort of crime that you've got to try to confront and apprehend.
- [35:49]
Michael Laidler
Yes. And that's a whole nother mindset in itself, because there's been times when my radio didn't work because I was so far out, and I would approach a group of illegal aliens or people that were carrying drugs, and I had to make a choice. Is it worth my life to get that or not? And sometimes when you're. When you're not in the role, you don't understand it as much, but you don't have help. So you really have to decide on what am I going to do? Is this worth my life? Is this worth what's going to happen next? And if you decide that, then you have to carry it out. And a lot of the border agents that I've worked with, they were great. They pushed that level because they didn't want to see bad people coming into the country. They did not want that. So they do put their lives on the line just as much as any other law enforcement officer in the country.
- [36:40]
John J. Wiley
What's the old saying? Discretion is a better part of valor. And quite often, I'll be honest, I didn't have that discretion. I could not, not pursue someone. And that put me in hazardous situations, and it put other people in hazardous situations. And fortunately, everybody worked out well for everybody. But there was a toll we talked about earlier, that exposure to that kind of violence takes on someone. So when I went to New Mexico recently to speak at a law enforcement event, a community event, and it was in Alamogordo, New Mexico, and that environment, flying into El Paso and then driving was a total shock to me. Coming from the east coast, it is not like what you. It's almost like you're driving on a different planet. And I was talking to this group and I said, I could imagine being on Highway 54, 30 miles from anybody, and having to a traffic stop. And traffic stop, let's just say it's a van, and it winds up having five people in there, and things go south. You Are on your own. There is no help for a long way.
- [37:43]
Michael Laidler
Yeah, you really had to make your decision. I know in border patrol, kind of like highway troopers, it's usually you against a lot more people at that point. And your tactics have to be strong. Your verbal judo has to be strong. Yeah, your. Your ability to kind of use your communication has. It has to be there because it is just one of you and multiple of them.
- [38:06]
John J. Wiley
And sometimes, by the way, that harsh language is what people take offense to. Oh, that cop was so rude. I love the term verbal judo. We'll have to talk about that in length at a later date. One of the things that you have done in your part of your career, you've really begun to transition into speaking. You got a book coming out, you've got all these other things you do. What is that?
- [38:28]
Michael Laidler
So one of the things that I've really grown myself on and really pride myself on in the last five years or so was working on my self awareness and my leadership development. And based on that, I actually opened up a speaking business back in 2017. Now I took a couple of years off for a number of reasons, but what my focus is is building up those areas in law enforcement officers. Law enforcement officers are my brothers and sisters and I want to see them grow. I want to see them succeed. Because it's one of the areas that I feel, at least as being in this field for 17 years, that's undervalued when it comes to personal growth and development. We have so many other things that we have to train on that your mindset and personal growth is usually on the back burner. My book will be launching next month. It's actually called Greatness beyond the Badge. And in that book I'm talking about self awareness strategies that anybody specifically law enforcement officers can use today. Who makes. Who are you as a person? Why should you develop yourself? And how do you go about developing yourself in a manner to be successful? And these are things that I've learned because I actually studied other industries, I went to college, I read a lot of books because I. I feel like this is something that's really needed for what we do as law enforcement officers.
- [39:48]
John J. Wiley
And I agree with you 100%. We are running out of time. The name of your book and where can people get more information about you.
- [39:53]
Michael Laidler
And what you offer as greatness beyond the batch. And you can check my website out, which is www.michaelalater.com or if you're looking to get the book and kind of pursue it when it comes out greatness.michaelamatler.com.
- [40:10]
John J. Wiley
Workbook Michael, thanks so much for being guest on the show for all you do. It's all very much appreciated.
- [40:16]
Michael Laidler
Thank you.
- [40:16]
John J. Wiley
I'd like to thank our guests for coming on the Law Enforcement Talk Radio Show. The Law Enforcement Talk Radio show is a national syndicated weekly radio show broadcast on numerous AM&FM radio stations across the country. We're always adding more affiliate stations. If you enjoyed the podcast version of the show, which is always free, please do me a favor and tell a friend or two or three. I'll be back in just a few days with another episode of the Law Enforcement Talk Radio show and Podcast. Until then, this is John J. Wiley.
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John J. Wiley
Why?
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WSECU Announcer
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John J. Wiley
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John J. Wiley
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- [42:24]
Michael Laidler
If you like the show, please take a moment to rate, review and subscribe. It really does help the show to grow. Thank you for listening. Foreign. To give your host a gift, consider subscribing, rating and reviewing the show this holiday season. It really helps the show grow. From all of us at Believe. Have a Merry Christmas everyone and a happy holiday.