Protecting The Lives Of American Law Enforcement Officers

Summary

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Law Enforcement Talk: True Crime and Trauma Stories

Episode: Protecting The Lives Of American Law Enforcement Officers
Host: John "Jay" Wiley
Guest: Retired Special Agent Eric Caron
Date: November 12, 2025

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Episode Overview

This episode dives deeply into the hidden realities of law enforcement, with a focus on the unimaginable emotional and psychological toll faced by officers, especially those investigating child exploitation crimes. Special Agent Eric Caron, a veteran of U.S. federal law enforcement with extensive experience in national security, anti-trafficking, and child pornography investigations, joins host John “Jay” Wiley to talk candidly about the darkest crimes officers encounter, the recurring societal cycles of support and backlash, and the critical need for community and institutional support for those who protect and serve.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Eric Caron’s Career Background

• Start in Law Enforcement:
  • Began as a summer police officer on Cape Cod but shifted to federal law enforcement, not feeling suited for uniformed patrol work.
  • Joined the U.S. Treasury Department, Customs Service in Newark, NJ, working international drug smuggling, child exploitation, WMD proliferation (Iran, Russia, China), and eventually became an Interpol rep.
  • Self-demoted post-9/11 to return to fieldwork, led the National Security Group in Boston, was part of Joint Terrorism Task Forces, and served abroad in Dubai targeting Iranian covert operations and WMD interdiction.
  • Finished as resident agent-in-charge in Rhode Island, deepening appreciation for local/state law enforcement partnerships.
• Reflection:
  • “It made me not just a better agent, an investigator, but it made me a better person and American because I appreciate my freedom that much more here in America these days than I have ever done.” — Eric Caron (03:09)

The Structure (and Dysfunction) of Homeland Security

• Post-9/11 Reorganization:
  • Creation of Homeland Security centralized 21 agencies (FEMA, Coast Guard, ICE, CBP, Secret Service, etc.), but led to splintering and less effective coordination due to decentralization and political influences.
  • Quote: “They broke up agencies... and brought agencies under the Department of Homeland Security that probably should have been kept out of the politics... it just decentralizes law enforcement efforts even more...” — Eric Caron (06:38)
• Public Confusion:
  • Many, including experienced officers, are unclear about the roles of federal agencies due to the complexity and politicization of law enforcement at the federal level.

The Hardest Job: Investigating Child Pornography

• Scope of the Problem
  • Globalization and technology (the "Three T’s": Trade, Travel, Telecommunication) have accelerated the crisis to a multi-billion dollar black market.
  • Child porn—and even more so, infant porn—is an exponentially growing epidemic worldwide:
    • National Center for Missing & Exploited Children: >100% increase in images in a single year.
    • UK: 146% increase; India: 200% increase.
  • COVID-19 pandemic aggravated the issue.
• Categories of Offenders:
  • Collectors & Traders: Store, share, and trade illegal images online (using secure chatrooms and sharing protocols).
  • Producers: Create abusive content, sometimes kidnapping or exploiting children—even infants.
  • Travelers: Offenders who travel to victims (e.g., sex tourism in Thailand) or lure victims across jurisdictions.
  • Quote: “There are images, and I’ve seen them unfortunately, of babies being raped as young as 25 days old.” — Eric Caron (13:52)
• Personal Toll on Investigators:
  • The work is “so revolting” that even seasoned officers struggle:
    • “Just what I experienced in my career have affected me adversely. Everyone I’ve talked to that’s been in law enforcement has been affected negatively. And our society pays a tremendous price.” — John J. Wiley (16:33)

The Reality of Abuse: Closer to Home than We Think

• Statistics on Child Victimization:
  • More than 60% of U.S. child deaths/injuries are perpetrated by someone known to the child: partner, parent, sibling, or close family member—not the stereotypical “stranger danger.”
  • Quote: “Most offenders are people known to the victim.” — Eric Caron (23:31)
• Cycle of Trauma:
  • Over 50% of incarcerated abusers were themselves abused:
    • “It’s a vicious cycle.” — Eric Caron (23:00)

Coping with Investigative Trauma

• Officer Wellness Best Practices:
  • Rotating investigators out of child pornography cases regularly and implementing strong wellness and mental health programs.
  • Providing 24/7 access to counseling and psychological support.
  • Quote: “We ask human beings to perform superhero jobs perfectly. We’re human and sometimes we break.” — Eric Caron (25:28)
  • Caron has witnessed colleagues succumb to the trauma—sometimes leading to suicide. Emphasizes society’s duty to provide real, ongoing support.

Law Enforcement Realities vs. Public Perception

• Media Portrayals vs. Truth:
  • Hollywood’s vision of law enforcement is dramatically exaggerated, often failing to capture either the nobility or the day-to-day constraints (like limited resources, equipment, and chronic emotional fatigue).
  • “Most people in law enforcement worked their entire careers doing the best they could...with no resources and for really unsolvable problems.” — John J. Wiley (32:10)
• Real World Constraints:
  • Local departments have minimal resources—even to the point of barely functional equipment.
  • Officers are physically and emotionally exhausted from constant calls, with little relief.
• The Need for Societal Support:
  • Cyclical swings between anti- and pro-law enforcement sentiments; real change and steady support are necessary, especially regarding officer and first responder mental health.

Living a “Switched On Life”

• Personal Philosophy:
  • Caron’s approach: Being “Switched On” is vital for officers and civilians alike, learning to thrive despite danger, loss, and adversity.
  • Three central principles (taught by his Marine Corps father and which inform his book/website):
    1. Strengthen the Mind through Education: “It’s your ticket to life’s party.”
    2. Strengthen the Soul through Faith: “You’re gonna need it on those dark, lonely, scary days.”
    3. Strengthen the Body through Sleep, Eat, and Exercise: Daily habits for resilience and longevity.
  • Quote: “If you train the mind, the body will follow... It’s about training the mind, the body, the spirit. That’s what I mean about being switched on.” — Eric Caron (38:07)
• Practical Application:
  • Host shares similar habits post-retirement for stability and health (prayer, meditation, regular meals, sleep discipline).
• Resources:
  • Caron’s book “Switched On: The Heart and Mind of a Special Agent,” audiobook edition, and podcast can be found at SwitchedOnLife.com.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On American Freedom:
  • “God bless America. This is the best country in the world. I wish the American people would, quite frankly, support the men and women of law enforcement a little more better.” — Eric Caron (03:17)
• On Law Enforcement Trauma:
  • “We as a society need to provide...the services our first responders need to get through a 25 year career like I did.” — Eric Caron (26:10)
• On the Nobility and Toll of the Job:
  • “We ask ordinary people to perform superhero jobs... We as a society need to do a better job understanding the roles they play, supporting them 110%.” — Eric Caron (32:13)
• On Resilience:
  • “Through love, loss, our hearts take shape and we grow as human beings... If you’re not switched on, it’s very easy to drift to the dark side.” — Eric Caron (35:05)

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Important Timestamps

• [01:26] — Eric Caron’s career overview and international assignments
• [06:35] — Analysis of DHS creation and federal agency overlap
• [10:13] — Explosion of global child exploitation and online crime
• [13:07] — Categories of child pornography offenses explained
• [20:28] — Investigative methods: digital forensics and arrests in child porn cases
• [23:56] — Officer mental health and wellness support; challenges of investigative trauma
• [35:05] — Caron explains his “Switched On Life” philosophy
• [39:26] — Importance of officer health for long, fulfilling retirements
• [38:53] — Information about Caron’s website, book, and podcast

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Summary & Takeaway

This episode pulls back the curtain on the demanding and often traumatic work performed by law enforcement agents, especially those on the front lines of child exploitation investigations. Eric Caron’s frank discussion exposes both the horrors and nobility of careers dedicated to protecting children and society. Recurrent themes include the necessity of robust officer wellness programs, coordinated social support, public understanding of real police work, and the personal discipline required to have a meaningful life and career.

Listeners are encouraged to learn more about Caron’s experiences, access resources for law enforcement wellness, and advocate for stronger community support and understanding for those who stand on the thin blue line.

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Transcript

[A]

He's a retired special agent from the United States government. He's been tasked with investigating weapons of mass destruction, every kind of national security threat you can imagine. And he's here to talk about what he says is one of the most difficult things to investigate in law enforcement. Welcome to the Law Enforcement Talk Radio Show. In the Law Enforcement Talk Radio show we are joined by special guests talking about their experiences, their realities of investigating crimes, plus those who have experienced horrendous trauma. Police, first responders, military and victims of crime share their stories. Hi, I'm John J. Wiley. In addition to being a broadcaster, I'm also a retired police sergeant. Be sure to check out our website, letradio.com and also like us on Facebook, search for the law enforcement talk radio show. Of all the radio stations in the United States, there are no other shows like the law enforcement Talk radio show. And on Facebook there is only one official page. Do a search on Facebook for the law enforcement talk radio show and be sure to like the law enforcement talk radio show Facebook page. Calling us from Boston, we have retired special Agent Eric Caron on the phone. Eric, thanks so much for being guest on the show. Very much appreciated my brother.

[B]

It's always a privilege and an honor to speak with you sir.

[A]

Before we get into the conversation, Eric, tell us briefly your career in law enforcement from start to finish.

[B]

Yeah, so you know I became a, a summer police officer on Cape Cod, did that for one summer, about three months. And I did it enough to know that boy, that uniform just didn't feel right on. And so I went on to Northeastern University and I wanted to pursue a career in federal law enforcement and I did just that, became a special agent for the United States Treasury Department, United States Customs Service in beautiful Newark, New Jersey and did that for a bunch of years doing everything from drugs, international drug smuggling, to child porn to proliferation of weapons and technology that were being acquired by countries of concern such as Iran, Russia and China. And then went on to headquarters. Did my headquarters stunt, bunched around there, I was Interpol representative. Then after 911 I actually self demoted myself believe it or not, and went back to the field as an agent street agent in Boston and then ran the National Security Group in Boston working with the Joint terrorism task forces around the country and then went overseas, did an overseas tour in Dubai. I was the attache doing all kind of neat covert operations targeting the Iranians and preventing the importation of WMD materials into the US Via.

[A]

I feel like I'm talking with James.

[B]

Bond here without the accent and Great, you know, great experience overseas. I loved it. Hard work, actually, as much as, you know, it sounds interesting and it was, don't get me wrong, but it's a 24, 7 position, but it was great. It made me not just a better agent, an investigator, but it made me a better person and American because I appreciate my freedom that much more here in America these days than I have ever done. So God bless America. This is the best country in the world. I wish the American people would, quite frankly, support the men and women of law enforcement a little more better. And I understand the threat and the threats and what law enforcement officers go through at the state.

[A]

That's part of what we do or why we do what we do with law enforcement. Today's show. And by the way, a lot of what you're saying about lack of support, I was saying, and my co workers were saying in Baltimore in 1980, 1981. It's a lot of what we're going through now, and I don't want to beat this into the ground. A lot of we're going through now is a rehash, the same thing that was going on in the 60s, the 70s, 80s, little bit in 90s, and maybe 2010 to 2020. So this is a cycle and we will go through anti law enforcement swing and then I'll swing back to pro law enforcement. But in the meantime, everybody's still got a job to do. And it's a shame that it takes so many people to have to go to work and live in other countries to appreciate the freedoms we have.

[B]

Yeah. You know, I finished my career as the resident agent in charge in the state of Rhode Island. That was the rack, as they say in Rhode Island. And again, it gave me a deeper appreciation for local law enforcement officers because without local law enforcement officers and state law enforcement officers, the partnership is so critical because as we know, there's only so many good guys versus the bad guys. And we have to collaborate on a lot of different cases and help one another. And that really gave me a great experience working with our state and local partners involving everything from drugs to child porn to human trafficking to counterfeiting, you name it. And so I have a special place for local law enforcement officers. My dad was a sergeant in the city of New Bedford, Massachusetts, and he taught me everything I know in life. And I dedicated my book, Switched on the Heart and Mind of a Special Agent to my dad and all Leos out there.

[A]

Well, thank you for that. Thank you for your service. And I'll be honest with You. I don't know what a lot of the federal agents do. I know what the DEA does because I was detailed of them for about almost two years. I have some idea what FBI does. I have some idea because I've guessed on from Secret Service what they've done. And I actually did some work in the field with them involving counterfeiting, customs I have very little information about, and immigrations even less. And Homeland Security is a total mystery to me. And to be honest with you, all those agencies, Homeland Security, Immigration, cbp, Customs, they seem to become wrapped up in some great big huge political ball of wax. And I don't think it actually represents what they do.

[B]

Well, you know, brother, you know, I got to tell you that after 9, 11, the administration, the president, the White House had to do something. And I think there was a rush to do something and not necessarily the right thing because they broke up agencies, as you know, and brought agencies under the Department of Homeland Security that probably should have been kept out of the politics of creating the Department of Homeland Security. And so, yeah, you're absolutely right. The Department of Homeland Security has 21 different agencies under it, from the Coast Guard to ICE. And under ICE, there's Homeland Security Investigations, HSI, which I was part of. Of course you have CBP, Customs and Border Protection and Border Patrol is under them. So it becomes decentralized, splintered, and it creates, you know, creates. How do I say this? It just decentralizes law enforcement efforts even more and it's a bigger problem in my eyes. So I hear you. Homeland Security is a. One of the largest departments in the government. And you know, you know, I'm hoping that it gets better in the days and years ahead as far as coordination.

[A]

So we really couldn't say, hey, what's Homeland Security do? And expect, you know, a five or 10 or 20 word explanation because it's a lot of different things. There's a lot of moving parts, a lot of different agencies under that umbrella. Am I wrong?

[B]

Yeah, absolutely. We got fema, right? We have FEMA under the Department of Homeland Security. We have the Coast Guard and the Homeland Security. We have Secret Service under Homeland Security. We have ICE under Homeland Security and CBP and, and all the, all the.

[A]

Letters of the Alphabet. This is a law enforcement show. We are talking with Eric Karen. He is retired special agent. He's also a podcaster and author, and he's got so much he's into. When we return, we're going to talk about one of the most difficult aspects of his law enforcement career. Don't go anywhere. We'll be right back. One of the questions I get all the time is how can I show my support for law enforcement. We're all busy, we've got busy lives. But there's something oh so simple you can do with our Facebook page. Search for law enforcement talk radio show Facebook page and when you see a post you agree with that resonates with you, share it, especially episodes of the podcast. To do all that, just search for us on Facebook, look for law enforcement talk radio show and be sure to click like return Conversation with Eric Karen. He is a retired special agent for United States government. A lot of different agencies. It's not a secret stuff that you think, although there's some bi stuff going on that quite frankly is above my pay grade. I've always wanted to say that by the way, but you and I have talked before the interview and one of the things that we talked about in your career is that you guys handled lots of things. But one of them is by far without any doubt one of the most difficult things to investigate. Both emotionally gathering evidence, prosecuting in court and that's child pornography. I don't know how you guys did that.

[B]

Yeah, difficult, very difficult. And let me just way of background. Globalization is great. You know we saw that after the fall of Soviet Union and opening up trade, I call it the three T's John Jay, three T's Trade, travel, telecommunication that exploded during after the fall of Soviet Union and globalization. Trade, travel, telecommunication, all great things, all great things. But bad guys exploit trade, travel, telecommunication. And so the Internet as you know and I know is that it's exploding these days and even getting bigger and bad guys in the area of child porn. And I'm going to say infant porn, infant porn that I've seen it has exploded into a multi billion. That's what it be billion dollar industry. And it's an epidemic not just in the US but globally. Child porn, infant porn is an epidemic. And unfortunately with the pandemic it's even worse. Much worse. And you know the numbers are staggering. The national center for Missing and Exploited Children has seen an increase of over 100% of images in the last year. The UK authorities, police have seen 146% increase in cases relating to child infant porn. India 200% increase in the increase in child porn cases in India. And so it is an epidemic and I've seen it firsthand and you know there's different categories if I may say of child porn and we can get into that if you, if you wish.

[A]

I'll be honest, I don't know if I want to. I really, I'm not trying to interrupt your conversation here, but this whole subject is so revolting that I want to. Literally, if I was in a room with the bad guy that had lots of child pornography, I think I'd have a hard time keeping my hands off of them.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, you know, I've seen it, brother. I, I've seen that. And you know, most, you know, we check one another and I've seen that.

[A]

Well, see, I'm a father. I have two daughters, adult daughters. And even for they were born, I think most police have a sensitivity towards children, infants, those who can't protect themselves, the elderly. So, and I'm saying this not to be overly dramatic, but there are still images at pop in my head from stuff I experienced when I was in my 20s involving children as a police officer. That just doesn't go away.

[B]

Absolutely, absolutely. So what we have, we kind of have, and I'll put it into three categories, if you will, broad categories. You have those individuals and mostly men, but there are some women, but mostly men who possess, collect and trade child porn, okay, Via mostly the Internet, right? No longer getting the magazines from the UK or Europe, what have it. This is all Internet related, online possession, collecting and trading with one another. And you know, there's chat rooms that you have to get into and you have to share images with one another. So possession collector, collectors, traders, right? And then we have, then we move on to the production, right? Those folks, those bad guys who actually produce child porn in the US and around the world. And there they are, they are snatching, in some cases children, babies and producing child porn where there are images, and I've seen them unfortunately, of babies being raped as young as 25 days old. And so you have the producers of child porn. And then the third category is travelers, right? You have the travelers who either travel to the victim or entice the victim to them. So via interstate or international. So you have folks who are going to Thailand on these sex trafficking kind of visits, if you will. You have, I've seen it multiple cases that I've been involved in where you have individuals from, let's just say Massachusetts, entices a girl, you know, mentally challenged, handicapped girl, maybe 14, but operating, if you will, at the age of eight to the library, and he takes her from the library to Rhode island and assaults her and rapes her overnight. So we have those travelers who travel internationally or domestically to find and assault children as well. So you know, those are the three kind of broad areas. If I had to put bad guys in, those who possess and collect and trade, those who produce in, those who travel and somebody, you know, bad guy could do all three of them. Right.

[A]

And someone unfortunately has to investigate this because it's a reality life. And as much as I hate this conversation, as much as I find it revolting, and everyone I know is going to have the same reaction. This is horrible stuff. It's a fact of life. It happens. And we have predatory people that do these things and they do things like that to the most defenseless members of our society, our children. And somebody is tasked with investigating and somebody has to enforce that and get them off the street. And that was you when your crew.

[B]

Yes. Yeah. And you know what, brother? And you, you probably know this, but I've had actually bad guys tell me during, you know, interrogations they like the younger the better. You know why?

[A]

I don't know if I want to know why. I really, I want people to think that I'm some big tough guy. I really do. I want them think, you know, you look at me and I say this all the time. Some people don't look like police. I do when I'm 85, pushing a walker down the street with the tennis balls under the front of it, they'll say, oh, there's a five zero. I look like that. I look like a knuckle dragon Neanderthal street cop. And I don't say that as an insult. That's how I look. But the truth is so many of these things are so horrifying that just what I experienced, my career have affected me adversely. Everyone I've talked to that's been in law enforcement has been affected negatively. And our society pays a tremendous price. And the people who really suffer are the youngest, the most defenseless among us, our children. This is a law enforcement today show. We're talking with Eric Caron. And we return, we're continue on with how does one go about investigating child pornography and keeping their sanity? Don't go anywhere. We'll be right back. Don't you hate when they do the bait and switch on you when they tell you, check out a website and it's free to go there. And then there's hidden charges. You won't find any of that nonsense at our website, letradio.com it's free. It's always been free and it costs you absolutely nothing. There's no hidden tricks. Letradio.com check it out today. You find episodes of the show as available as a podcast after airing on radio. They're always free, always have been and always will be again. That's l e t radio.com where it's always free.

[C]

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[A]

Back to our conversation with Eric Karen on the Law Enforcement Show. Eric is retired United States Federal agent, special agent, and part of his career involved investigating and enforcing and arresting bad guys involving child pornography, which will return that conversation. A moment. Since retiring, he has written a book. He's also a podcaster. His website isswitched on life.com. go there, check out his shows, check his podcast and check out his book as well. Eric, before we went to break, we're talking about investigating child pornography and yeah, how revolting it is just to even talk about it. It's like talking about one of the foulest things I can imagine. But I had to do it. You had to do it. Fortunately for me in my career, I didn't have to do that much of it. And I never understood physical abuse of children. There's a lot of things I don't understand, I can't comprehend, and it's revolting to even think about it. But when you have a crime that you've got to investigate, and I tell people this, that the principles are the same, first you try to look at the crime scene. In your case or in this case, it might be photos or videos or whatever it might be, you look at the crime scene, see which evidence you can gather from that crime scene, protect the crime scene, and then start investigating where the evidence takes you to who's involved. Is it pretty much the same with child pornography?

[B]

Yeah, pretty, pretty much. Yeah, pretty much exactly. You know, I it brings me back to at least one case you Know, I ran and managed was a case similar to what you're saying. We hit a house in Boston and there was an image of a little girl in bed naked, with a sign on her back and that basically the bad guy was trying to pimp her out. And, and that image, our tech guys were able to, to bring that image to the home where that image was done at, which was in the state of Rhode island. And so within 24 hours were able to execute a search warrant, get into that house where that image was taken, go right into that bedroom. I was in that bedroom where that image was taken, saw the bedding, saw the clothes, saw the toys and got the bad guy and got the hard drive and looked at the hard drive and sure enough, you know, we were able to prosecute the individual for child porn and happened to be the boyfriend of the mother. And the mother was of course horrified because she would go to work at night.

[A]

Her child that this happened to.

[B]

Correct. And her boyfriend, as she worked the midnight shift, he volunteered of course to take care of her child.

[A]

A big part of my response that is, I'm not shocked. I wish I could be shocked because unfortunately that happens far too often where the stepchildren are horribly abused by a step parent. And I don't want to get into that because let me clarify this. I had someone asked me to go on their podcast and they want to talk about a national child ID program to protect children from the scary guy in the car offering candy or help me find my kitten type deal. And I was like, yeah, I'd be more than happy to go talk to it. But you realize that more than 60% of children in the United States who are horribly injured or killed are killed by loved ones, by people are very close to him. It's not the boogeyman down the street. It's the, the, the boyfriend, the girlfriend, the mom, the dad, the uncle, the brother that we got to be concerned about.

[B]

That's right.

[A]

And the sister as well.

[B]

And you know, if I may say, it's a cycle. Right. In that more than 50% of those incarcerated brother, you know, they themselves have been abused. They get out and abuse others. And so more than 50% of men and women in the can have been abused themselves. So it's a vicious cycle. And you're right, most offenders are people known to the victim.

[A]

Absolutely. So before we get into how do we protect our children, I want to talk about the obvious. The, the 900 pound gorilla in the corner of the room of the radio studio right now. How do investigators investigate something as horrendous as child porn and keep their sanity or not become so emotionally scarred that they become a problem themselves?

[B]

Great. It's a great question. You know, so what I did as a manager was cycle, quite frankly, cycle investigators through, after so many years of doing it and made sure that a wellness program was working properly for these agents and investigators, that they were able to speak to a counselor or psychologist or psychologist. Psychologist or psych guy. Doctor, counselor anytime they want. 24, seven. And so basically, it's really up to the agency and the managers to manage their investigators, making sure that they got the proper help and support they needed. And quite frankly, at the end of the day, after so many years on the job, I try to, you know, get them out of those types of cases and expose others, if you will, to child porn investigations, a rotation so.

[A]

That someone doesn't do it too long. And that includes you.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, exactly. It did include me. And I, and you know, as a, as a manager, I had to manage an entire office and I had at least two, two full time agents doing nothing for the most part but child porn. But all those cases went through me as far as vetting processes and signing off on reports and of course search warrants and arrest with the U.S. attorney and. Yeah, so. And I had to see all that, all the evidence on all the cases. So, yeah. Did it take a toll on me? Sure it did. I'd be lying to say, you know, it didn't. Because you know what, John Jay? We ask human beings to perform superhero jobs perfectly. We're human and sometimes we break. And you know, I get it. I've seen it. I've seen people go to the dark side. I've seen people commit suicide. And it's unfortunate. And that's why I'm a big proponent of getting the holistic help that local, state and federal law enforcement officers need. Because they may not be taking punches to the body every day, but they're taking punches to the brain every day based on what they see and what they do. And we as a society need to provide, when I say society, our politicians, our local mayors and governors and president, even at the presidential level, need to provide the services. Our first responders need to get through a 25 year career like I did.

[A]

Absolutely. We have to, we have to do that. We have to get better. And there's also a very selfish reason behind this. And I say this all the time in the United States. We're very fortunate in most parts of this country, if you have an Emergency, you call 911, someone will be there. Let's just say it's, it's a physical emergency, your uncle had a heart attack or something like that. You call 911 and the person that's usually first there is usually a law enforcement officer because there's more in them. They're mobile, they're out and about. They might be in your neighborhood at the time of the call. Firehouses, it takes a while to get there. So when I call 911 for an emergency, I want the very best of the best to show up. I want people on their A game to show up.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

You know, I don't want someone who is so traumatized that they become part of the problem. I don't want someone that says, look, I've done this for eight years. I'm really good what I do, but I can't handle anymore. I'm leaving. And we're going to have the B team come in and fill the spots. So we don't want that. It's our community doesn't deserve it and our first responders don't deserve it. And by the way, this depression, post traumatic stress suicide has been an epidemic problem in our first responder community in the United States for decades and it's not letting up. We need to do something different. This is the law enforcement show. We'll return to our conversation with Eric Caron in just a few moments. Don't go anywhere. We'll be right back.

[C]

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[A]

Why?

[C]

Because we put you first. Lower fees, early paydays, financial guidance and service second to none. As a member owned cooperative, we love Washington as much as you do. From the Olympic mountains to the rolling Palouse. Join us and discover how much we care about your financial well being. Because what we really do best is invest in you Stop by, say hi, we're wsecu. Let's credit union. This is the story of the one. As a custodial supervisor at a high school, he knows that during cold and flu season, germs spread fast. It's why he partners with Grainger to stay fully stocked on the products and supplies he needs. From tissues to disinfectants to floor scrubbers. All so that he can help students, staff and teachers stay healthy and focused. Call 1-800-GRAINGER Click grainger.com or just stop by Grainger for the ones who get it done. What do you think makes the perfect snack?

[A]

Hmm.

[B]

It's gotta be when I'm really craving it and it's convenient.

[C]

Could you be more specific?

[A]

When it's cravinient.

[C]

Okay.

[A]

Like a freshly baked cookie made with.

[B]

Real butter, available right down the street.

[A]

At am, pm or a savory breakfast sandwich I can grab in just a second at am, pm.

[C]

I'm seeing a pattern here.

[B]

Well, yeah, we're talking about what I.

[C]

Crave, which is anything from am, pm.

[B]

What more could you want? Stop by am pm where the snacks and drinks are perfectly craveable and convenient. That's cravenience. Am, PM Too much.

[A]

Good stuff. Back to our conversation with Eric Caron on the Law Enforcement Show. He is a retired special agent, he's also an author, he's a podcaster. We'll talk about his book, his podcast, his website is switched on life.com and Eric, you started most of this after retiring from your service in the federal government, correct?

[B]

Yeah, you're absolutely correct, sir.

[A]

But this started, this transition for you started before retiring.

[B]

Yeah. So I, as I, as I retired, I knew that, you know, my mission was to, to write a book and to dedicate it to men and women, law enforcement. Because I wanted people to understand the good of law enforcement and the not so good of law enforcement. Because most people don't understand what the job's all about. And I wanted to give them a glimpse behind the badge.

[A]

And most people have no idea because they take what Hollywood puts out there and they take that as the truth. And I'll just give you an example. You look at police movies or television shows in the United States produced by Hollywood, they're gonna have at least one or two characters in there who are knocked down, drag out drunks that take pills that have been divorced five times, they've never seen her kids. They're salty, they're angry, they're grumpy. Then you have the idealistic man or woman and then you have the burnouts in between. And while some of those are true, it's the exception of the rule. The most people I know in law enforcement worked their entire careers doing the best they could 99.9% of the time with no resources and for really unsolvable problems.

[B]

Amen. You know, you know, I'm sure at the local level, if you mentioned resources, you know, I think most people would be shocked to hear that most police departments in America have just enough bullets and resources to go out and qualify once a year. And fortunately on the federal level we're, you know, quarterly qualifications and we had to go out and train. But most local law enforcement officers who are, who are on the front line have limited resources and limited personnel. And again, we ask ordinary people to perform superhero jobs and perfectly and it ain't going to happen. And we as a society need to do a better job understanding the roles they play, supporting them 110%.

[A]

Right.

[B]

And we haven't done that in the last year.

[A]

We have not. And we expect them to do the best job possible. And it's good for our community. We demanded and as a sergeant I had to make sure they did everything by the book, the best they could and they were taken care of. So it was a balancing act all the time. However, the old joke is in our department and we didn't have take home cars, we changed shifts every eight hours and the cars ran for 24 hours a day. And when I first started, we had two by fours holding up the driver's seat in the back because they were all broken. Every one of them was broken, they barely ran. And we, if you think the equipment was barely functioning, the same thing started happening to the men and women doing the job because it was non stop call after call after call and you couldn't even get a lunch break.

[B]

Yeah, I hear you. And most people, you know, I like you. I've had the opportunity to work around the US from, from Newark, New Jersey to Washington D.C. to the Bronx to Manhattan. I've seen Baltimore, I've seen Chicago, I've seen parts of Boston, I've seen parts of Providence. You know, it's a tough these parts of these areas. Philly, it's a tough world out there. And you know, there are some neighborhoods that you know, you got to have your trigger, your finger on the trigger at night at a 2:00 clock a.m. surveillance because you see some things that you can only imagine at 2am in some of these cities I mentioned.

[A]

Absolutely.

[B]

And so you know, we, we, we see we see the devil, you know, and it's a, it's a tough world out there.

[A]

It is in, we developed, we had some sayings that we used to use all the time. One was, and I still hear it is head on a swivel all the time. No matter where you are, even when you're off, you're off duty, you keep your head on a swivel because bad stuff will happen when you least expect it, and it happens in good neighborhoods. To this, this myth that people have. I live in the suburbs, a nice area, and I always go, hey, bad guys steal cars and they drive to your neighborhood. So you're not. So part of that's got to be similar to your whole philosophy of a switched on life.

[B]

Absolutely, John Jay. It's absolutely, you know, it's being switched on. Life's journey is filled with hills and valleys, right? And broken dreams and promises and of course, death. And if you switched on, you'll understand and appreciate that through love, loss, our hearts take shape and we grow as human beings, as police officers. You know, we see, we see so much tragedy all around us. And if you're not switched on as a police officer, let alone a human being, regular civilian, it's very easy, very easy to drift to the dark side. And I learned, I learned what it means to be switched on from my Marine Corps father.

[A]

That kind of sounds like what back in the day, Joseph Wambaugh, who used to write a lot of books, I believe he's a retired LA cop. And yes, his whole premise was in policing, you see people at the worst and you deal with the worst of society and eventually you wind up becoming part of that society and you become one of the worst of the worst if you don't find a way to look for other things beyond your job.

[B]

Absolutely. So the three core principles. Jay, if I may. John Jay, if I may share with you in the audience the three core principles my Marine Corps father, sergeant, police officer, taught me and that serve as the really principles of what it means to be switched on in life. You need these three core principles, and the first one is strengthen the mind through education. It's your ticket to life's party. Without it, you're not getting in. Strengthen the soul through faith. You're gonna need it on those dark, lonely, scary days where your mom died, your father died, your brother died, your sister died. You're going to need faith and strengthen the body through sleep, eat and exercise every day. Those are the three core principles that I live by today and I live by as an agent to help me get through those dark, scary days that I face, and I'm sure you face, and we all face in life, because without it, I may not be speaking with you today.

[A]

Absolutely. It sounds like really far fetched principles, but the truth is I do those three things now. I do them every day. Look, I retired at the age of 33. Had to learn a new career. I began to pursue radio. Then actually was the early days of podcasting which got me started. Now I'm heavily in radio and podcasting and Internet and social media. Things that someone my age shouldn't do. I pray and I meditate every day. I. I try to eat around the same time every day. I try to go to bed around the same time every night and wake up the same time every day to make sure I get enough sleep. Because my body was an absolute battlefield for so long with the ups and downs, the highs, the lows, the adrenaline, the crashes.

[B]

Yes, sir. And he tr. He believed, my dad and I believe as well, if you train the mind, which is the most important muscle, I know it's not, it's technically an organ, but if you train the mind, the body will follow. If you don't train the mind, potentially, you get hurt in many different ways. Emotionally hurt, physically hurt. So it's about training the mind, the body, the spirit. And that's what I mean about being switched on. You've got to get switched on in life if you want to lead a healthy, safe, successful life and to have.

[A]

A good long retirement afterwards. Let's talk about your website. What's on it, what people can find there.

[B]

Let me just say that Switched On Life is the website and you know, the, the book is out. I love the audiobook that just came out for those who like audiobooks. So the book is there, the Switched On Life podcast is there, where I have great guests on talking about what it means to be switched on. There was. There's more to follow in the coming days and weeks and I just want people to live their best safe life, quite frankly.

[A]

Absolutely. I want people to have the best of the best. And nothing bothers me more than hearing about someone who did 20, 25 years in law enforcement or a firefighter or military, and within two years after retiring, they drank themselves to death. Eric Karon, thanks so much for being guest on the show. Thanks for all you do. It's all very much appreciated.

[B]

Thank you, sir.

[A]

A huge thank you for listening to this episode of the podcast version of the law enforcement talk radio show. By the way, which is a nationally syndicated radio show. If you like our show, there's two simple things you can do. Go to our website, ldtradio.com add your favorites. Check it often. You can find episodes of the show right there. And the second one involves our Facebook page. It's so easy to find great content, including past episodes of the show. And when you see something that you like that resonates with you, be sure to share it with your friends. We'll be back in just a few days with another episode of the Law Enforcement Talk radio show and podcast. Until then, this is John Jay Whiteley. See ya.