Law Enforcement Talk: True Crime and Trauma Stories

Episode: The Truth Being A Baltimore Maryland Police
Date: December 17, 2025
Host: John "Jay" Wiley (guest appearance)
Interviewed by: Abby Ellsworth, On Being a Police Officer Podcast

Episode Overview

In this deeply personal and revealing episode, John J. Wiley, retired Baltimore Police Sergeant and radio/podcast host, discusses his law enforcement career with interviewer Abby Ellsworth. Wiley provides a candid account of his experiences as a Baltimore cop in the 1980s and 1990s, focusing on the use of force, trauma, and the often unseen impact of the job. The conversation explores law enforcement culture, officer-involved shootings, job-related injuries, administrative challenges, and life after retirement—underscoring both the rewards and difficulties faced by officers. The episode also highlights the urgent need for public understanding and compassion for police and first responders wounded in the line of duty.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Motivation and Path to Policing

• Driven by a desire to serve: Wiley initially considered priesthood but found policing a different route to public service.
  • Quote: "Before that, I really thought long and hard about being a priest, a Catholic priest... but policing was right behind it. Because in my mind at the time, it was doing more the same. Being a public servant, serving people, helping people solve their problems..." (03:45)
• Self-doubt on readiness: He candidly reflects on doubts about being "tough enough" for policing.
  • Quote: "Am I ready for this? Am I tough enough for this? Mentally, physically? I don't know. But that's the reason why. It was just to serve." (04:06)

2. The Realities of Violence in Policing

• Not prepared for the violence: Wiley details encountering more violence than anticipated, both toward the public and officers.
  • "It was far more violent of a job than I imagined. I'm not talking about just violence towards me, violence towards people... domestics, child abuse, children being hurt, children being killed..." (04:34)
• Officer-involved shootings: Wiley describes being involved in four separate shootings, but did not fire his weapon in the first two—countering the "trigger-happy" police trope.
  • Quote: "Most of police I know have been involved in multiple situations where they could have used deadly force and opted not to." (05:27)
• Use of force and media narratives: Wiley describes the pressure not to use force and the heavy toll when it is used.
  • "No one goes into a situation I know of wanting to shoot somebody. And the amount of pressure, the amount of stress... you're the suspect until proven otherwise." (08:47)

3. Unseen Moments and Positive Interventions

• Successes are invisible: Wiley shares stories where he and others helped people in crisis where force was avoided, which rarely become public.
  • Quote: "No one hears about it. What they hear about is... the police who were called to help them shot him. That's what we hear about. We never hear about the thousands of stories where the people are disarmed and they got the help they need at risk of the people that were there." (11:38)

4. Career Progression and Culture Shock

• Baltimore's unique challenges: Adjusting to policing in troubled neighborhoods, with cultural and linguistic barriers.
  • "It was a real culture shock. The language being used, everything else was a totally contradiction of what I was used to." (13:02)
• Path through specialty units: Expertise in violent crime and narcotics led to assignments in drug enforcement and a federal task force. (13:58)

5. Trauma, Injury, and Forced Retirement

Two Key Incidents:

• Gunfight with a murder suspect: A high-speed pursuit that ended in an on-foot gunfight, leaving Wiley physically and mentally impacted (15:25–19:02).
  • Quote: "I realize as I was in the middle street, I'd fired four out of six rounds... I ran up and tackled him. And the guy knew my name. He's like, Sergeant Wiley, you shot me. Like, I did something horrible to him." (18:17–18:54)
• Career-ending hand injury: During another arrest, a violent struggle over a gun resulted in a catastrophic injury to Wiley's dominant hand and wrist, requiring multiple surgeries and leading to medical retirement at 33.
  • "Once we hit that point, between the lawyers, the doctors and everybody else, they said, he's got to retire. His career is over. He can no longer do police work." (24:07)

Emotional Fallout and Administrative Response

• Abrupt, impersonal departure:
  • "I had a meeting... It was about five minutes in a windowless building in city hall and they said, okay, you're now retired, go have a good life. And you're shown the door... There's no parties..." (25:19)
• Financial and identity crisis: Facing increased insurance costs, depression, alcoholism, and marital problems.
  • "Those are really dark days, Abby. Back then it was... extreme anger, there was a lack of identity. What do I do now?" (26:15)
• Lack of institutional support: No contact from department leadership, leading to feelings of abandonment.
  • "Not at the time. And I understand it because of fear this could happen to so and so... we had a saying, suck it up, you're the police." (27:30)

6. Systemic Issues with Care for Wounded Officers

• Officers abandoned by the system:
  • "If you are physically harmed and unable to do your job anymore, you're on your own." (29:54)
• This problem continues today: Wiley cites recent examples of officers with career-ending injuries discharged with little or no support, often losing homes and financial stability.
  • Quote: "They lost everything they have. They lost their house. They lost everything. Literally. If there's a person eating beanie weenies, it's this guy, because he can't do anything and is through no fault of his own." (29:05)

7. Rebuilding and Life After Policing

• Recovery and support: Wiley credits a specialized treatment center and mentorship from veterans for helping him recover.
  • Quote: "I eventually wound up going to a treatment center in Florida that no longer existed for law enforcement only... that began the transformation process for me." (32:20)
• New identity, new career: Found success in radio broadcasting and remarried, building a meaningful post-police life.
  • "Apparently, like one of my bosses is sitting next to me... 'No one's shooting at me. This is pretty easy. It's radio.'" (33:40)

8. Building the Law Enforcement Today Radio Show & Podcast

• Mission: Created to provide a platform for law enforcement, first responders, military, and their families to share stories of trauma and resilience.
  • "I wanted to do a podcast from law enforcement officers, their spouses, their families. And I was very specific about what I want to do. Overcoming trauma..." (35:01)
• Growth: Rapidly syndicated to 81 radio stations and 24 million combined population.
  • "Within three months... a radio station upstate New York heard it... said can you create a version of... Now we're syndicated by a company called Talk Media Network." (36:00)
• Wide range of guests and topics: Includes stories of true crime, trauma, and recovery, not just from law enforcement but from crime victims and their families.

9. Critical Issues Facing Modern Policing

• Media narratives and public misperceptions:
  • "The greatest trick ever played was the devil convincing the world he didn't exist until... the news media and primarily social media, Hollywood convinced people that MS-13... are less of a threat than their police." (37:41)
• Politics and lack of support from leadership: Elected officials are "afraid of optics," leading to demoralization, recruitment problems, and dangerous underfunding.
  • "They're afraid of anything that has optics, that don't look good... I can get a ham sandwich indicted, you can indict the Pope." (40:54)
• Impact of defunding and "reform": Restricting use of force and cutting training leads to more danger for both police and public.
  • "The first thing that gets cut is training... Training is the thing that will keep the incidents that they want to prevent from happening." (42:52)
• Community consequences: Poor, high-crime neighborhoods suffer most when police resources are cut or constrained.
  • "Guess who's depending on the police the most? It's not the people in the wealthy neighborhoods... They would bring people and put them in their bathtub to try to protect themselves from gunfire." (45:24)

10. Use of Force, Public Judgement, and Officer Hesitation

• Complexity of force decisions: Wiley stresses how dangerous "Monday morning quarterbacking" is.
  • "These are human beings, they're trying to do a really tough job. And when they do horrible things, they should be treated accordingly... When they don't, they should be supported and taken care of." (49:20)
• Body cameras and investigative process: Warns that video can mislead the public, and premature releases can jeopardize justice.
  • "All use of force looks bad. None of it looks good, ever... It's better to [resolve] quickly than to grapple, pity pat wrestle people because things get ugly really quick..." (51:30)
• Hesitation and officer safety: Concerns that anti-police narratives may cause harmful hesitation, referencing the death of Chicago Officer Ella French.
  • "Do I think officers are second guessing themselves? Yes. Would I think there's a case we made where officers are not getting involved in on view things? Absolutely." (52:46)

11. Final Reflections: Hope and Integrity

• Enduring values: Wiley calls for officers to remember their calling and maintain honor, hope, and integrity.
  • Quote: "It's important. There's reason why we got into this job. And for most of us, we go in because it's a vocation, it's a calling. We want to serve, we want to help people... Do not lose hope. It's an admirable profession and we need admirable people doing this job. People's lives depend on it. So please be that force for good." (54:45)

Memorable Quotes & Moments

• On violence and compassion:
  • "I call my scars street tattoos and my steel plates body ornaments." (05:03)
• On officer-involved shootings:
  • "No one wants to do that, right?" (09:19)
• On abrupt retirement:
  • "The job will not love you back." (25:04)
• On the reality of law enforcement injuries:
  • "If you are physically harmed and unable to do your job anymore, you're on your own." (29:54)
• On hope:
  • "We joke all the time on my show: I'm damaged goods. But that doesn't mean I'm worthless... I can be damaged, dinged, indented, and still have a productive, happy life." (32:50)

Important Timestamps

| Timestamp | Segment | |------------|------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 03:45 | Wiley explains what drew him to policing | | 04:34 | First experiences with unexpected violence | | 05:27 | Discussing four officer-involved shootings and restraint in use of force | | 11:38 | Positive interventions rarely make the news | | 15:25–19:02| In-depth recounting of life-changing on-duty gunfight | | 24:07 | Career-ending hand injury and the struggle for retirement | | 26:15 | Emotional aftermath, isolation, and alcoholism | | 27:30 | Lack of follow-up or support from the department | | 29:54 | Systemic abandonment of injured officers nationwide | | 32:20 | Attending treatment and the road to personal recovery | | 35:01 | Creation of Law Enforcement Today and mission of the podcast | | 37:41 | National issues: media narrative and political failure | | 42:52 | Training cuts and their real-world impact | | 45:24 | Disproportionate impact on poor, violence-stricken neighborhoods | | 54:45 | Wiley delivers message of hope to law enforcement and the broader community |

Tone & Final Thoughts

Candid, direct, and compassionate, Wiley’s storytelling is marked by humility, dark humor, and a survivor’s resilience. He balances an honest appraisal of policing’s perils and failings with persistent hope for honorable, community-focused law enforcement. The episode is both a cautionary tale and a rallying cry—a call to public awareness, institutional accountability, and genuine support for those who serve and are too often forgotten.

For further listening, connect via LETRadio.com, follow John J. Wiley on Clubhouse or social media, and explore the Law Enforcement Today Podcast wherever you get your podcasts.