Podcast Summary

Podcast: Le Cours de l'histoire (France Culture)
Episode: L’histoire au cinéma 2/4 : Le Nom de la rose, quand le Moyen Âge crève l’écran
Date: February 15, 2026
Host: Xavier Mauduit
Guests: Michel Pastoureau (historian), Simon Hassen-Teufel (medieval historian, Sorbonne Université), archival quotes from Éric Rohmer and Umberto Eco

Overview: Cinema and the Middle Ages—Myth, History, and Representation

This episode, commemorating ten years since the death of Umberto Eco, delves into how the novel and film Le Nom de la Rose (The Name of the Rose) bring the Middle Ages to life for audiences and historians alike. Host Xavier Mauduit convenes celebrated medievalist Michel Pastoureau and younger scholar Simon Hassen-Teufel to dissect the process and implications of historical adaptation for cinema: how films like Le Nom de la Rose mix scholarly research, artistic vision, and cultural clichés to shape popular understandings (and misunderstandings) of the medieval world.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Historians and Filmmakers: Collaboration and Limitations

• Early Memories of the Film Collaboration

  • Michel Pastoureau recalls working with Jacques Le Goff and Jean-Jacques Annaud, providing historical documentation and advice prior to filming (01:15):
    • “J’ai appris beaucoup de choses sur comment on fait un film... Les metteurs en scène posaient aux historiens des questions auxquelles on ne savait pas toujours répondre.”
  • An unexpected challenge: mundane, practical questions filmmakers had on details (like monks’ hoods), whose answers have been lost to history (03:16).

• The Gaps in Source Material

  • Iconography offers static images, but not movements—cinema forces historians to confront ambiguities:
    • “Au cinéma, faut pas hésiter... les historiens du Moyen Âge n’ont que des images fixes.” (02:19)

• On the Value of Multidisciplinary Exchange

  • The necessity of crossing disciplinary and documentary boundaries is underscored—piecing together texts, images, and even consulting real monks, to bridge historical silences (04:59).

2. Invented and Imagined Middle Ages

• Childhood Fascinations and Cinematic Influence

  • Pastoureau shares that a childhood viewing of Ivanhoe (1952) transformed him from a cowboy fan to a medievalist, demonstrating the formative power of cinema on historical interests (08:45):
    • “C’est même un film qui a fait de moi un médiéviste... pendant toute une semaine, j’ai vu le film Ivanhoe.”
  • The film’s color coding left a lasting impression—showing that even Hollywood can sometimes “get it right” on details (10:32).

• Bright vs. Dark Middle Ages

  • A contrast emerges between Éric Rohmer’s colorful, luminous medieval world in Perceval le Galois (1978) and Annaud’s grim, mud-and-shadow vision in Le Nom de la Rose:
    • Rohmer (archive): “Le Moyen-Âge tel qu’on le représente en général n’a rien à voir avec le vrai Moyen-Âge... il a ses côtés qui sont encore extrêmement riants, extrêmement clairs.” (06:08)
  • Pastoureau notes color as key to both films’ ambiance: Ivanhoe’s vibrant hues vs. Le Nom de la Rose’s somber palettes—each choice laden with meaning and (sometimes) anachronism (11:53).

3. The Semiotics of the Middle Ages—Signs and Meanings

• Umberto Eco and the Obsession with Signs
  • The novelist sees his era as a pivotal moment in the evolution of meaning:
    • Eco (archive, 15:13): “Le Moyen-Âge était une époque affolée par la signification, plus que nous... chaque élément de la réalité était lu comme un signe.”
  • Both Eco and Pastoureau stress the layered interpretation in medieval life—nothing is arbitrary, everything is symbolic, which the film attempts to visualize (14:36).

4. Fiction, Truth, and the Obscurantism Paradox

• Authenticity vs. Artistic License

  • Hassen-Teufel identifies a “paradox” in Le Nom de la Rose: Genuine research underpins the film, but Annaud also deliberately leans into modern preconceptions—poverty, violence, obscurantism—to serve contemporary agendas (16:47):
    • “D’un côté, un désir d’authenticité... de l’autre, une interprétation très libre du Moyen-Âge, avec ce projet artistique d’appuyer sur son côté sombre.”

• The Power of Modern Clichés

  • Echoes in modern franchises (Game of Thrones, Ridley Scott’s Last Duel): a consistently bleak medievalism aligns with—and perpetuates—cultural clichés (18:38).
    • “Il y a ce cliché qui fonctionne à plein et qu’on retrouve beaucoup.”
  • The film’s overt “class struggle” is highlighted as anachronistic, yet effective for drama (20:08).

5. Pedagogy: Teaching History with and Despite Cinema

• Distinguishing Historiography and Art

  • Historians must clarify for students and the public: Film is not history—it's a creative work (25:19):
    • Hassen-Teufel: “Ce n’est pas un travail d’historien, d’historienne... c’est un travail d’ordre esthétique.”

• What Makes Le Nom de la Rose a Useful Classroom Tool

  • The film simplifies theological and political debates for viewers, making some facets of medieval thought accessible, but also risks massive anachronisms—such as witch-burning scenes, more typical of the Renaissance (35:46).
    • “C’est plutôt quelque chose qui appartient à la Renaissance, à la chasse aux sorcières. Ce n’est vraiment pas répandu à l’époque médiévale que met en scène le film.”

• The Danger of “Moyen-Âgeux” Label

  • The pejorative “Moyen-Âgeux” persists in French, a daily battle for medievalists aiming to rehabilitate their period’s image (33:54).

6. Social Structures, Power, and Redistributive Nuance

• Complexity of Medieval Power

  • The abbey in Le Nom de la Rose serves as both lord and tax-collector, illustrating the variegated nature of power—not simply monolithic kings and knights (39:21).

• Redistribution and Social Role of Monasteries

  • The film’s depiction of peasants scrambling for scraps oversimplifies reality; monasteries also had charitable functions and their relationships with lay society were more nuanced (41:34).

• The Abbey as Fortress and Metaphor

  • Its architectural isolation in the film underscores themes of knowledge-hoarding and exclusivity—mirroring the broader political subtext against authoritarianism and for open intellectual inquiry (43:00).

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Invisibility of Everyday Medieval Knowledge

  • Michel Pastoureau (03:16):
    “...nous connaissions très bien... la culture matérielle, la vie quotidienne... Mais entre les deux, il y a des zones qui sont un peu obscures...”

• On Artistic vs. Historical Fidelity

  • Michel Pastoureau (08:12):
    “Je lui avais dit surtout pas de violet... il l’a fait exprès. Je ne sais pas.”

• On the Film’s Enduring Influence

  • Simon Hassen-Teufel (16:47):
    “Le film d’Annaud... c’est un Moyen-Âge qui est extrêmement sombre, obscurantiste. Donc là, on est dans les clichés qui continuent d’être véhiculés aujourd’hui.”

• On Medievalism as Political Critique

  • Simon Hassen-Teufel (27:39): “L’Église est vraiment présentée comme une espèce de puissance encadrante, voire de puissance totalitaire...”

• On the Historian’s Relationship to Cinema

  • Michel Pastoureau (46:49):
    “Franchement, parler, non. Il vaut mieux que je regarde des films qui portent sur des époques et des cultures que je connais mal... Sinon, je ne peux pas me détacher de l’analyse.”

Timestamps for Key Segments

| Timestamp | Segment | |------------|--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 00:00 | Introduction—anniversary of Umberto Eco’s death, setting up the film analysis | | 01:15 | Pastoureau on being historical consultant & challenges of historical accuracy | | 08:45 | Pastoureau’s childhood “Ivanhoe” revelation—how Hollywood can foster medieval vocation| | 11:53 | Discussion of color and misérabilisme in Le Nom de la Rose | | 14:36 | Eco and Pastoureau on the semiotics of the Middle Ages | | 16:47 | Hassen-Teufel on the paradox of authenticity vs. cliché in Annaud’s film | | 22:18 | Pastoureau unpacking the film’s adaptation of complex religious disputes | | 25:19 | Hassen-Teufel on distinguishing historical study and artistic intent | | 33:54 | On the burden of “Moyen-Âgeux” as an insult; efforts to rehabilitate the period | | 39:21 | Social hierarchies and the abbey’s role in medieval power structures | | 41:34 | Critique of film’s portrayal of abbatial charity and peasant relations | | 43:00 | Abbey closure as both architectural and epistemological symbol in the film | | 46:49 | Pastoureau on the impossibility of “turning off” historical analysis when watching films |

Conclusion: Film as Portal and Problem

Le Nom de la Rose operates on multiple levels: as a mystery, as an exploration of medieval ideas, and as a vehicle for modern anxieties and projections about knowledge, power, and darkness. The episode highlights both the artistic power and historical risks of cinematic medievalisms:

• Films can ignite scholarly passions and public interest.
• They often perpetuate, sometimes deliberately, modern clichés that echo loudly in today’s pop culture.
• The collaboration between historians and creators is fruitful but inherently fraught—uncertainty and compromise are inherent in translating history for the screen.
• Ultimately, the film’s richness lies both in what it gets “wrong” and what it gets “right,” making it not just a historical object, but an enduring conversation between past and present.

Listen to the full episode for a captivating journey—from smoky medieval towers to the bright colors of Ivanhoe—exploring not only what we know of the Middle Ages, but how we came to imagine it.

Notable Guests:

• Michel Pastoureau: Historian and specialist of medieval symbolism and color
• Simon Hassen-Teufel: Medieval historian, doctoral candidate, specialist on medieval power

For further episodes, visit the full podcast archive at France Culture.