A (2:33)

Okay, let's do a channel check.

B (2:35)

Okay.

A (2:35)

I've been dying to do this because I just. I gave you so many wrecks of, like, things to look at. But I want to hear, like, what is on your radar for spring? What's really working for you right now in retail?

B (2:46)

So first, I'm going to start with the definition of a channel, which is a very insider baseball term. Also, it goes by the term of store visit or comp shopping, meaning, like, competitive shopping.

A (2:57)

Okay.

B (2:58)

So for a channel check, what I want to do is I want to see how busy is the store. Are people at the register? Are what are the sales associates doing? Are the displays kept nicely? Or is it so busy that they can't even keep filling it in? Is there enough merchandise in the store? Or does it feel like the stores are not getting enough shipments in? Are they not managing things right? I want to see what's on sale. Are they running sales, all of those things? What is the markdown situation looking like? Are people carrying the bags in other stores and walking around with them? So channel check gives me a really good sense on not just what the brands are saying in PR or what they're putting on social, but what is actually happening and what's resonating. So a great example of that was when I was walking around the track before my son's recent flag football game. We had been noticing for a while that, like, leggings were becoming less and less. But recently, seeing how many easy pants, like, I wouldn't even call them sweatpants. It's the Ruti barrel leg tech pant. And then Aloe yoga also has their version of this tech pant. The Vori tech pant, like all of those, plus also, just like an easy Kyoto Lisette pant.

A (4:24)

Yep.

B (4:25)

The Donnie has their version, like, a looser pant. And that was everywhere. And I see it the first time I walk around the track. I see like, two or three. Then I'm doing another loop, and I'm seeing like five, and it just keeps multiplying. And that, to me, is like a channel check in the wild of, like, that's what everybody's walking out the stores with.

A (4:45)

Why do you Think people aren't wearing leggings as much.

B (4:47)

This is so interesting because also I say this and I feel so funny when I say this or I write this because I am wearing leggings every day.

A (4:55)

So do I.

B (4:56)

Because that's what I work out in.

A (4:57)

Right. When I started seeing, there was like a news story that leggings were, like, decreasing in popularity and I was like, that's so interesting because I feel like I wear leggings every day. I love them with a T shirt. I love them to work out. I love them with knee high boots. But I also think it might just be a west coast symptom.

B (5:14)

I think.

A (5:15)

Are we west coast? Are we too West Coast?

B (5:17)

I know still to this day, I haven't found anything better to run in like, than a legging. Right.

A (5:23)

What's your go to legging and what's your go to work pant?

B (5:26)

Okay. My go to leggings. I stocked up on these very early in the pandemic. The Girlfriend collective luxe line.

A (5:36)

I've never even tried them.

B (5:37)

It is the one legging that fits me. Right. That also does not pill at all. And I like that there's no logo on it either. So if I end up, for some reason leaving the house and still wearing them, I can easily put a sweater with it or something and it has like the right amount of compression work pant. I am wearing my high sport, you know, in my Big Fat Greek Wedding where they were like, like the Windex.

A (6:06)

The greatest movie of all time.

B (6:07)

Yes.

A (6:08)

So let's just quickly put that there.

B (6:10)

The answer to everything was Windex. Spray Windex on it. The answer to what am I wearing is my high sport pants.

A (6:17)

And I know it's your Windex.

B (6:19)

It's my Windex.

A (6:20)

I get it.

B (6:20)

I know it became a hot. Like, they were called the newsletter pants and everyone.

A (6:25)

They were called the newsletter.

B (6:26)

Yes, they are. Yes, yes.

A (6:28)

But for a good reason. Things don't end up that way with, you know, because they're not working.

B (6:32)

I wear these. I think one, it fits my personality and, like, who I am. I have the short pant. I'm five foot two. I need a short pant. This also happens to be the type of silhouette and pant that you can't hem because of the knit material.

A (6:45)

Right.

B (6:46)

I do have the regular length and it fits me fine. But I love the look of the short one better because you get like the ankle aspect. So this pant is an everything pant for me. I know it is more expensive. I love the Alison Borenstein idea of the cookie. Like, if you want a cookie, don't go for like the snack. Well, 100 calorie version. You're never gonna be satisfied. Go for the cookie.

A (7:13)

Go for the cookie. Yeah, I totally agree with that. If it's something you're gonna wear every day.

B (7:16)

Yes.

A (7:17)

Like, do it right.

B (7:18)

So this, these pants have not let me down. I wear them multiple days of the week. They hold up. Nothing else, like, fits me personality wise and what I need to. Also what I need to do in my work life. This works well.

A (7:33)

What stores are you walking into right now? And you're just like, yeah, this is. They're knocking it out of the ballpark.

B (7:38)

I had so much fun going into Mohawk General store and Beloved in la.

A (7:44)

Yes, Beloved.

B (7:45)

And I will explain why I loved it because they had brands that I love. One of them, Totem, but a very specific edit, they did not have the whole collection there. And the way that they chose the items that they had there. Even though I feel like I know the whole line sheet of Totem, I know every product on the site, there were. I was like, oh, this is a really interesting pant. I hadn't seen this one up close before because they highlighted it by not having the whole entire brand there. Then they also have Dries and other brands that somebody might. It's another brand that I like, but for a very different reason. And then they also had this brand that my cousin had told me about. She'd pulled out this brand. Hope I'm pronouncing it right. Valescu. These mini handbags out of Berlin, Germany, I believe. The cutest little bags I had. Hadn't seen them in person before. I'm also going to visit the store Earl irl.

A (8:52)

Yes. Laurel Panton store in Beverly Hills today. Yay. I'm glad you're going.

B (8:56)

And I've heard that she also has this brand, so I'm excited to see it there. But it is an item. Like it's that discovery moment in a store. Also, that is a handbag that is retailed I think right around $200.

A (9:08)

Like incredible.

B (9:10)

It becomes this special piece, but also a reason for it. And it doesn't feel like it has to be a thought out purchase or an investment for some people. And I love that. And it's like little pieces of candy. The ready to wear was merchandise by brand, but the shoes are all kind of like laid out almost like how you would have shoes in your closet.

A (9:30)

I love that.

B (9:31)

So that was a fun moment for me and I really Enjoy looking at stores like that.

A (9:36)

What's the best retail experience you've ever had?

B (9:39)

I think it's the right balance of being able to discover some things on your own, but also having the right sales associate who can step in and help in those moments and the follow up after is also really fantastic. I feel like in this age of retail, whether you're doing it online or in person, you have learned something about your shopper. And in order to get that information, you then have to use it in the right way. So if I am filling out my email online or giving you my birthday or some information, use that to make the experience better. So that's what I'm really looking for in a retail experience. As a consumer, I'm trying to think of mine.

A (10:30)

1. I love an outdoor mall. Let's put that there.

B (10:32)

Yes, but I. We're also in California.

A (10:34)

No, I know, but like, even I was in Dallas and like, I went to the Highland park mall for the first time.

B (10:39)

Yes.

A (10:40)

And I was really. Well, first of all, the fact that you can just like walk into Chanel at the Highland Park Mall, and I'm like, do you have these ballet flats in a size 7? And then they're like, they're like, sure, I have them in every color.

B (10:49)

I'm like, is that still because every department store.

A (10:52)

What is this place like? What does this happen for Chanel?

B (10:55)

Every department store store that has a Chanel boutique in it also seems to always have the velvet rope right. Set up.

A (11:03)

No, but you can walk in the Highland park one. You can just walk right in. Yeah. It was incredible. Today's episode is presented by Depop. If you know me, you know I am big on a closet reset. I genuinely think that when your closet feels organized, your brain and life does too. So how many things are in your closet right now that you have loved when you bought them? Maybe you wore them once or twice, but now they are just. Just sitting there. Here's something that I have realized. That random vintage blazer or dress that you bought for that birthday or dinner, someone is searching for that exact vibe right now. And that's why I love Depop. It's a resale app where you can buy and sell fashion. But what makes it feel different is how easy it is to actually list something. You literally snap a photo and their AI powered listing fills in the details. It gives you smart pricing suggestions. You can accept offers, boost listings, and. And it takes what feels overwhelming and makes it feel like a very low lift. Also, no seller fees. So if you're clearing out one bag, five pairs of jeans or doing a full closet edit. What you earn is actually yours. So download the depop app and list one thing that you're not wearing today. You might be surprised at how fast it finds a new home. But also I was in Japan last year and Japan was probably the most unique retail experience I've ever had. Maybe not in like, like the customer service is great. Like everyone was so friendly and very accommodating and but just in the way that like things are taken care of and presented and there's so much archive, so much vintage.

B (12:28)

Yes.

A (12:29)

And if I wasn't shopping for that, I was in these like very unique multi brand stores where I was just like overcome by the feeling of discovery, like finding all these new things like and just having so much fun. And I agree with you. I think it's a marriage of both.

B (12:43)

Yes. Because there's a, there's been. This is from my consumer packaged goods experience. But if you know when you go into a grocery store and they have like a taste test, if they have like 10 jams out, nobody is going to buy them because there's too many choices. It's when you give them three or four edited choice, it makes it easier to make that decision.

A (13:03)

Oh my God. Tell that to the Internet. Like every retail e commerce platform. The endless scroll needs to stop.

B (13:09)

Yes, I.

A (13:09)

You want to know what I do? Because I get so the endless scroll makes me so anxious. I go to the end because I just want to know what, how the book ends.

B (13:16)

Right.

A (13:16)

Like I want to know what's at the end of the story and I'll be like, okay, I guess I'll start at the beginning now.

B (13:21)

Well, it's led people to believe that there's always something else.

A (13:24)

That's my problem. Take me to the end, right. And then I can be calm and go through one through five calmly. Yeah, it's really overwhelming for me. I'm definitely someone who like loves a very, very curated experience. And then if I don't feel satisfied, okay, I'll go find something else. But end the endless scroll, please. While we're on that subject, do you think this reminds me. It makes me think of like the mall brands. All those brands right now that I feel like are like bubbling under the surface of trying to make a comeback. Like the Abercrombie's even. I feel like Claire's like brought in a new cmo. Do you think we're really going to see those brands that come back in a big way?

B (14:01)

It's interesting because when I think of that, I'm also wondering where you want to go with like Aritzia. So do you consider Aritzia a mall brand or is that something different to you?

A (14:11)

Ah, that's a great question.

B (14:13)

Sorry to put you on the spot.

A (14:14)

No, it's true. I don't consider Aritzia a mall brand. But also I'm not Canadian. It started in Canada and it might have been considered a mall brand in Canada. So I don't know, maybe like my first experiences with it were in New York, not in a mall setting.

B (14:30)

Right.

A (14:31)

So I've never considered it a mall brand. But here in la, it's in the Grove. But also now it's about to be where Fred Siegel is. So I think they're trying to very intentionally not be a mall brand. But I think of a mall brand as like the Abercrombie, the Hot Topics, pacsun. What do you consider?

B (14:50)

I think of a lot of those brands and there's a couple of nuances in there. So there is the idea of, I think of like PacSun mall brands that are the teen mall brands. I think of more as like teen brands.

A (15:03)

I'm so curious what listeners are thinking right now because I bet you every person listening has a different idea of their mall brand is.

B (15:09)

Yes. And that's the thing is that we used to have one shared language and then maybe it was as D2C came and came into the world of like shopping online. And then if it doesn't even have a store for a while now they we've gone back to Omnichannel, which means you can buy it everywhere. So it's online, but it's also has their own store. Maybe they also sell multi brand. So we have different definitions. Whereas in the early 2000s we had fewer categories of retail. And so it's easier to define things.

A (15:44)

Right? Yeah. We only had one way in.

B (15:45)

Yes. Yeah. So I do think these mall brands still exist. There's also when I talk to one of my favorite analysts, Simeon Siegel, he will remind me these brands are still, I mean Lululemon is still doing $11 billion. Gap, Abercrombie, they are doing billions of dollars of business. So even though we might not feel like in every category and for every consumer, they're as important as they once were because there were a lot less choices and everybody was buying acupants at Gap. It's just changed some, but they are still doing billions of dollars of business.

A (16:27)

Okay, I want to talk about what people are actually buying because you do have a lot of that data.

B (16:31)

Yeah.

A (16:32)

I love the Puck shop. My partnership. I think it's the most genius thing ever.

B (16:36)

It's very fun. I very much put on my merchant brain and I am seeing across all of Shop My what's working.

A (16:43)

Yep.

B (16:43)

And so it's from all the substacks, it's from all the retail outlets or editorial outlets that also use Shop My and Instagram and out there. And it is a really good cross section of where the clicks are actually happening.

A (16:59)

So for those of you who haven't seen it every month. Right. On Puck, you guys have like this really cute chart that goes live of the top 10 things that are being sold across everywhere, as you mentioned, and it's all pulled from data and you can see exactly what the most popular 10 Things of the month are. I think it's so great. And I'm always like, pleasantly surprised by what's on there. But. So tell me what some top sellers are right now for spring.

B (17:23)

We do this the second Friday of every month and you're looking at the month prior. We recently did the February look back. So the last one that I looked at for February sales, we were still, I mean, a lot of the US was actually closed for quite a few days shopping because of snowstorms and ice storms across the country. So we were still very much in a cold aspect. I am so excited to look at April because I think we're going to see the first changes of spring. And the jacket going from the leather jackets, which leather and fur jackets. For months there has been that on the shop my top 10 list. I think we will maybe see what is our next jacket. Seeing the Solomon sneaker was popping up last month for the first time.

A (18:11)

Rosie loves a Solomon. Our producer loves a Solomon.

B (18:15)

So it's a great shoe. But it hadn't been on that Shop My list. And so. And again, whenever people say things are dying, nobody's wearing this anymore. And then you're like, oh, but yes, they are.

A (18:26)

That's always why I love this list.

B (18:28)

Yes.

A (18:28)

Because in my mind, I don't wear a Salomon. Maybe it just doesn't go with my personal style. But then I see this list and I'm like, wow, it's tracking.

B (18:35)

Yes, it is tracking. So I think we are going to see the start of people building their spring wardrobes and maybe it'll be building up their essential white tees again and stocking up on, you know, a fresh stack of T shirts. Maybe it is that lighter weight pant. Maybe people are Starting to buy their first spring dress, and we're going to see what silhouette is going on there. And sandals. I'm sure we will start to see that soon, too.

A (19:05)

What's one thing that you've seen on there, like, consistently over and over again?

B (19:09)

The Laleen Colby pant has been on the list, I think, three or four times in a row. And, you know, we will see if they make it a fifth time and keep going. But that is the one that just keeps coming up over and over again.

A (19:26)

It's amazing because I feel like it's a relatively. It's not a small brand, but, like, you know, it's not maybe one that everyone's talking about every five seconds.

B (19:35)

Right.

A (19:35)

It's like the testament to the fact that you really just have to have one good product.

B (19:39)

This pant is marketed as it is the airplane pant. So I feel like the airplane outfit, that whole is a genre. It is the mom playground to work pant. That is a whole marketing genre. So you have made it very easy for whether they're influencers or creators to go out there and explain this pant to everybody. And once somebody hears, oh, this is the airplane pant, I've been looking for the most comfortable pant to wear on the airplane.

A (20:06)

The airplane pant is one of the most genius fashion marketing tactics of all time.

B (20:11)

Yes.

A (20:11)

Because if you say to me, this is the perfect plane pant for you to wear, like, from the airplane to a meeting, I'm buying it.

B (20:17)

My favorite genre, like, if I was to go on Pinterest and look up categories, it's airport fits always. I just think it's so. I love the way those looks or put together. And so that definitely, I have said before, if you're writing a sub stack or an article and you're calling it the best outfits to wear on the plane, I'm reading it.

A (20:37)

I love articles.

B (20:39)

I love the airplane fit.

A (20:41)

I'm always in, like, the Enzacosta Twill pants. I love those.

B (20:44)

There's also the Rogala pant.

A (20:46)

Right.

B (20:46)

And I know people have different versions that they love of this pant. And. But there's something about the Laline Colby. They also. They have it in silk, they have it in crepe. They. I think they have, like a sweatpant material. They have a linen and a chambray that looks almost like a denim. It's very much like in beauty, how they have a whole category around, like, shape. Tape became a whole thing. The Glossier bomb.com became like a Whole aspect. So it's all these, like, categories. So the Laleen Colby pant became, like, its own.

A (21:23)

Own thing externally. I don't think it will ever over. Saturate. Saturate. Everyone will always need an airplane, an airport. Yeah, always. Is there a brand on there or that you hope to see come in that's under the radar that you're excited about, that you want more people to be paying attention to?

B (21:38)

So one brand that has been popping up there a lot lately is still here, the denim brand.

A (21:45)

They just came out with a very cute collection today. I just. I've seen it all over my feet.

B (21:49)

Pink pant or they have one in.

A (21:51)

It's like, I've seen the pink. I've seen, like, the rust pant with the matching top. Really cute. That brand's doing good things.

B (21:57)

Denim was showing up, like, two or three times different silhouette. So that's, like, another thing that's like, oh, this isn't just one item. And then I reached out to the brand. I met the founders in their Madison Avenue store. Just very fun store. It was great hearing their story, and I just think they're doing retail really interesting. And that, to me, was a fun brand to, like, learn about.

A (22:21)

Yeah. I love their stuff, and I love that they're expanding silhouettes. I feel like they became very well known for that one pair of pants. It's the drawstring. I love when a brand hones in on, like, one amazing thing and then is able to expand from there. And I think that they really nailed that.

B (22:35)

Yes. And that wasn't even when I met with them. I learned that their first pair of denim was this style called the Tate, and is a really fantastic fit, too. And it's like, well, that wasn't even what was on my radar. Yeah.

A (22:48)

What do you think is the price point right now that people are shopping the most?

B (22:51)

This is one of those things where it all depends on, like, what consumer you're looking at. And we're also, like, in a very interesting economic, I don't know, tornado right now, what it is. So there are different price points that are still popping. And. But I do think this element and a lot of the brands that we've been talking about fit into this. Of this, like, 300 to $500, maybe up to $800 for, like, outerwear is a really interesting place right now. And it has always been this kind of, like, muddy middle. But I think there are enough people at that price range that some people see that as trading up. Some people who are at the higher end. See that as these are my basics that I'm mixing in, and so that becomes like an interesting playground. But it's also takes an interesting marketing angle to make that fit. Another topic we have not even gotten into, which is one of my favorite categories of shopping and of reporting in retail, is resale. And that layers in something really interesting, too.

A (23:57)

I mean, I only shop on the RealReal.

B (23:59)

Same.

A (24:01)

We're talking about all these, like, physical retail places. And then at the end of the episode, we're like, sorry, guys, we only shop on the RealReal. All I hear all the time is, I'm not gonna buy that at full price. I'm just gonna wait till it's on sale.

B (24:12)

Yes. Yeah. Well, it's also, if I love an item, I will love it forever. And so if I do not buy it the season it comes out, it'll still be there, and it'll be there for me later. I also very much believe the. You take the new car off the lot, and it depreciates in value immediately. So the same thing with the clothing. And to me, it's not just appreciating value because I'm a hoarder. I never get rid of things. If I love it, I'm gonna love it for life. I don't resale stuff. I think of it as the first time I wear it. It's. Something's gonna happen. Like, my clothing looks lived in, so I don't need to have it when it's that pristine. Took the tag off moment.

A (24:55)

Completely agree. I think the best Birkins in the world are the one. The ones that look a little totally, you know, stomped on.

B (25:01)

Yeah. Loved.

A (25:02)

Don't actually stomp on them, but, you know, they've no.

B (25:04)

Or do they. Loved a little. Yes. You know, have that. It looks worn. And I. I'm not a neat person in terms of, like, my items look worn, so.

A (25:15)

No. Fashion is meant to be worn.

B (25:17)

Yeah.

A (25:17)

Don't leave it in the box. Doesn't need to be foreseen. Wear it, love it.

B (25:21)

Yes.

A (25:22)

That's my mantra with all the things. I want to hear a little bit more about how you became a retail expert, because I actually think that at any given point, you can look at the state of retail in the world and it can be a really great snapshot of, like, where we are in society, what we're paying attention to, what's important to us, how we're moving about the world, how we interact with other people.

B (25:41)

I knew what I wanted to do in some head of things since I was very little. So starting in fourth grade, I started just sketching dresses. By the time I'm in seventh grade, I'm writing to, like, FIT and GAD and Parsons and being like, can I get your course catalog? Just because I was curious about that world. And at the time, growing up in southeastern Virginia, Virginia beach, all I knew was through magazines, we did not have great malls around where I was. So that became, like, my sole focus. So when it was time to actually apply to college, all I knew was that I wanted to be a fashion designer, but I wanted a rah rah college experience, love. So I ended up at Syracuse University, and that was where they had an excellent retail program. And I didn't even know retail was a career until I got there. And that's when I was like, oh, retail is actually my thing, so I can love fashion. So I studied fashion design, Majored in fashion design, but minored in retail so I could construct a garment. Like, all of that became really helpful. Like, in my early days, going to appointments, you'd see the FIT model trying things on, and so you would know, like, did a brand actually construct things? Really nice. Would this sell well? But the idea of right and left brain figuring out everything from the retail side of things was what really clicked for me and I really enjoyed. So I have never had a job that wasn't either related to working in a store or working in retail. Like, that was me a hundred percent.

A (27:24)

I love that. And I think it's what made you perfectly primed to start your newsletter. You were really early to the newsletter game, and that eventually ended up getting acquired by Puck, and you're there now. So tell us a little bit about that journey and starting one so. So early when it's now such a big thing.

B (27:41)

Yes. I actually started it on mailchimps. I had been working at this startup for, like, two and a half years, and each week I would send out weekly recaps that were all the numbers. And then at the end, I'd be like, but these other companies are doing really interesting things. And it was often back in the fashion world. So when I left that job, I missed spamming people with articles and talking about what was going on in the industry. And I was like, I'll do a newsletter. Fast forward to 2022. I realized there were so many great fashion newsletters out there that I. All of a sudden I was like, I'm actually reading a lot of substacks. Like, Hilary Kerr's was one of them. And I was Like, I should just move to this platform. It took me six months. I don't know why. Just because I thought it was going to be a big thing to do, and it was the easiest thing. And as soon as I went over, there was definitely. It started to pick up like before. I think the newsletter had been at a couple of hundred people who were reading it. It just became this other world. And then it opened up the opportunity for me to play in other spaces, which was affiliate marketing. So in my retail career, I was often the person that the marketing team would come to and be like, what products should we see to influencers? Should we create a TikTok shop? And if so, which products would you put in there? So I was helping merchandise, but I was never owning that relationship. And I saw it really taking off. And I loved following influencers. Just found that so interesting and seeing that as a way to learn about retail. And so I was like, let me try this on my newsletter.

A (29:21)

So when did Puck find you?

B (29:23)

I have followed Lauren Sherman's work since her early days. She would do these weekly, like, webinars with Business of Fashion. I was signing into all of those and my substack had taken off and to the point where there was one day where she linked to it. And I still remember I was sitting at the orthodontist with one of my kids, and I was, like, looking around the room, I was like, there's nobody here that will understand if I tell them how major this is. But it was so major, and it was just, like, such an odd feeling. But I was so excited. And so then we met up, and at that point, she let me know that they were looking to expand Line Sheet, wanted somebody to cover retail. And even before that part of the conversation, I was like, if there's ever a chance to work with you, I would love to. I didn't know what that meant. And that's when she said, we're looking to expand Line Sheet and acquire a newsletter. And I. I was so excited. I was like, let's explore this. Like, all I want to do is talk about retail. And I was at the point in my career where you would be working at one retailer and be deep in that retailer, but there were so many other retailers I wanted to look and talk about. This is a great opportunity because all I get to do is research and talk about retail and dive into it.

A (30:44)

You're such a good example of, like, one thing that I love, and in just the Internet world right now of people who have such strong POVs. Who then get brought on by other publications to fall in that lane. It is like my modern Carrie Bradshaw of just all the things. I think of people like you now at Puck. I think of people like Teffy Pessoa, who was brought onto the cut to write a relationship column. I think it's so smart and it's my favorite kind of content to consume because I know that I'm going to that person for one thing. But also people who are, like, deeply, deeply passionate about it and have found such a specific lane to follow.

B (31:23)

Yes, it's great that we can enjoy our niches and also recognize that other people enjoy those niches too.

A (31:30)

I'm such a believer in niching down. When I first started, everyone was like, don't have a niche. Talk about everything, do everything. I mean, the original of this podcast was like an entrepreneurship podcast. Like, we had everybody on from designers to like, I think I had a dentist on once. I was just curious about, like, people's journeys and how they made it. I was in my early 20s and I was like, desperate to just learn. But as I got older, I was like, no. Like, I. I know how to talk about one thing really well.

B (31:57)

Right.

A (31:57)

So like, let's just, let's all come together on that. But I think it's an interesting shift in media today. It's like, I think it's important to niche down. I stand ten toes down on niching down.

B (32:08)

Yes. It.

A (32:08)

I mean, find your people.

B (32:10)

Yes.

A (32:10)

Looking to the future, I want to hear your insights a little bit on where you think. Obviously, AI is a huge conversation right now. How are we going to see that take shape in retail? How would you, as someone who's an expert in the space, like to see it take shape in retail?

B (32:24)

There are different aspects where I think AI can be really helpful and I do think on the back end and logistics, figuring out. I mean, when I worked at one company, there was an aspect where we wanted to know what was the perfect box of consumer packaged good products like we were designing. So I was creating a merchandising experience where people would put things in their box, but I wanted that box to be filled. And so using AI to figure out space and logistics and how to pack things, that is great. Back in search, it used to be that, you know, right now you're wearing a beautiful yellow V neck sweater. The material of it, all of those things need to be tagged in the back end. So when somebody goes to a website and searches V neck, that would pop up, pale yellow sweaters that would pop up and maybe the brand, it pops up. Somebody human had to tag all those things and then also the misspellings of them. So now with AI it just can figure that part out and I see that as making the shopping experience better for everybody. I don't think we're there with a lot of things yet for like styling because also people don't have the language to say always what they want in something.

A (33:48)

I've been working with like a lot of different AI styling apps and like AI shopping apps and it's close. Not quite, but I do think in the next few years it will be spot on.

B (33:58)

Yes. And I love it for the inspiration. The nuance is if I type into a search term I want to dress like Sofia Coppola style. They don't know what I mean about her style. Is it that it's classic? Is it that she is kind of casual but with like a little bit of luxury in it? Is it that what colors she typically wears? It's only inside my brain that I know why I typed that in. It just is still missing that extra layer and that's what's kind of missing in AI styling. I think the other thing that I've seen where AI doesn't always work in retail is it could predict and this is even going back to the beginning of my career. There would always be platforms coming up that would say we know when you're going to be sold out of an item as a merchant and will tell you when to either order more or to mark it down so that you'll eventually be out. But now we've got these TikTok algorithms or trends that things pop up and you don't know if it's going to pop up and be an easy airport pant Colby Laleen that's going to be a thing for who knows? This could end up being their next 10 year item. Or is this like a one and done season seasonal item and so AI can get you there if it follows a pattern that it had followed before. And as we know in life things never follow the same pattern.

A (35:23)

I'm having a hard time seeing how I like it like in real life as well. I don't know if I like the ref like high tech experience.

B (35:31)

I am assuming when you say that you mean going into a store, there's only one of each. You are clicking on the computer screen which items you want and you can't see everything. Yep, I get that. And I think also for like a self service shopper that becomes a little frustrating.

A (35:46)

I don't love it.

B (35:47)

Right.

A (35:47)

You know, like, I not. I understand it will probably end up being the future, but I think it needs to be refined a little bit. And, like, I hope that stores stay as as much of a human experience as they possibly can. Shopping is joyful. Like, I love IRL shopping. I want to, like, go in store and have an experience. I don't want it to be like a computerized thing.

B (36:08)

Right.

A (36:09)

I'll do that online if I want.

B (36:10)

Right.

A (36:11)

That's the difference for ref.

B (36:13)

I would love to know if they have done a store without that and seen the difference of their metrics. That is the merchant analytical brain in me. I want to know, did we just

A (36:26)

find your next story?

B (36:27)

Right. Maybe.

A (36:29)

I would love to read it. Please do that. I would love to know. I'm curious.

B (36:32)

Yeah.

A (36:33)

Yeah, I'm very curious.

B (36:34)

Yeah.

A (36:35)

To close out, I'm curious for you, as someone who is looking at all of this all the time for people listening, who are overwhelmed by just shopping, places to go, things to do, what's your best advice for the sift? Like, what should. How should they be able to hone in on where to shop, what to look for for the right things for them?

B (36:51)

I think find what they like. I mean, there's also people out there who don't enjoy shopping at all, and maybe they still want to look great. Great work with a personal stylist and shopper, and that could be a joyful moment. I also try to do don't yuck somebody's yum. And I know what I love, but I also love seeing what works for other people, and I think that's great. I mean, my style is also not for everybody, but as long as, like, I'm comfortable. And so I think people just have to find that aspect of things. And I also think this is just another industry and it's just a business. So there's part of it to look at there, and then the other part of it is to have fun and enjoy it. Okay.

A (37:36)

We do. We close up the show with a new series called let's get you dressed.

B (37:40)

Oh, my gosh.

A (37:41)

It's very fun. We ask our audience on Instagram to submit, like, scenarios or events that they're going to and then bring them to the pod for me and a guest to answer. So one that I got that I thought would be perfect, perfect for you and me to answer is, what is a good investment piece to celebrate and wear to a big first business meeting?

B (37:59)

A first business meeting. Okay. This is also good for me because I Feel like I dress. So like. Like, corporate wear is more my category.

A (38:08)

Weirdly. Same. Like, I love, like, a great skirt. I love a good blazer.

B (38:12)

I love a good blazer. So I would say.

A (38:14)

That's what I would say.

B (38:15)

Like, yes, I would say fine. Whatever blazer shape you. You like. I mean, of course I'm gonna say, like, black or navy in it, and either one of those is great. And I think you could buy it as part of a suit and then sometimes wear the pants or sometimes not or all of my blade. I don't have any suits like that anymore, but I did for one part of my corporate life. So it depends on how corporate this person is. But otherwise you're wearing it with jeans. Like what? You know, you can wear it over a dress. So finding that great blazer. And then again, it's investing at whatever price point you're at if you can do designer. But you can also do designer via the realreal.

A (38:58)

There you go.

B (38:59)

And you can find tons of great ones there. There are plenty of. Again, we've said we don't know where things fit in the mall brand. Is Veronica Beard a mall brand. But they have great jackets too.

A (39:11)

Not a mall brand. I don't think.

B (39:13)

They are probably more like specialty retailers,

A (39:16)

but they do make great blazers.

B (39:17)

Yes.

A (39:18)

I also, like. So guilty. Recently tried one of the Kate jackets that are like. It's like a blazer leather jacket, and it fits so nicely. And I like. You don't buy full suits anymore. I'd rather buy, like, a really cool specialty black jacket and then just wear it with, like, my, like, tailored alc or totem pants.

B (39:35)

Right.

A (39:35)

Because I just feel like I get more wear out of that jacket. But the. The. Any of, like, the Kate jackets, they fit so nice. They look so good on. I put it on and I was like, shoot.

B (39:44)

Right?

A (39:44)

Why did I do that?

B (39:45)

Why?

A (39:46)

They are doing well because people want to buy these. It looks really nice. So if you can invest in that, I would say do that or find one on the realreal.

B (39:54)

Yes.

A (39:54)

I think the ultimate blazer, though. And this is like. This is like, when you say an investment, it's like, silly because it's the most expensive jacket ever. But the Dior bar jacket is next level. I'm. And they're not on the realreal. I looked for everybody, by the way.

B (40:07)

So re. See, re has them.

A (40:10)

You're so right.

B (40:11)

But this is. This is also, like, the joy of shopping is you put it out into the world. Like, okay, I would love to find a bar jacket in black. Classic.

A (40:21)

It's like an hourglass shade.

B (40:22)

Hourglass shade.

A (40:23)

Pull from it.

B (40:23)

Yes. And like say in your mind what your price point is. That would feel right. And then start the hunt.

A (40:30)

Yep.

B (40:30)

And you put it out into the world. That sounds very woo woo. But it's more like you put it out in the world that you're going to have fun shopping for this item. You will go into vintage stores, you will look online, you will have ebay alerts and it will come to you. At some point you will find that one that is perfect and then you'll have this story to tell about how long you were looking for it.

A (40:53)

Love, thank you so much for coming on. I'm so glad we finally got to do this. I again love your work. I love everything you do for your fellow fashion shopping obsessed people. So I'm really glad we got to have you on and just kind of talk about all the fun things for spring.

B (41:07)

Yeah, I love that there's a community to talk about style, fashion, the business side of things. All these areas of retail. Sat.