Let's Talk Off Camera with Kelly Ripa

Episode: "Heather Gay: Bad Mormon to a Good Time Girl"

Release Date: September 17, 2025
Host: Kelly Ripa
Guest: Heather Gay (Real Housewives of Salt Lake City)

Episode Overview

This episode brings together Kelly Ripa and Heather Gay for a candid, unfiltered conversation about Heather’s journey from devoted Mormon to outspoken reality TV star and author of Bad Mormon and Good Time Girl. They dig into the complexities of Mormon culture, religious secrets, reality TV drama, and Heather’s evolution into embracing a "good time girl" persona beyond her church upbringing. The episode is rich with insider stories from the Real Housewives of Salt Lake City, revelations about Mormon practices, and personal moments about motherhood, divorce, and starting anew.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Heather’s Departure from Mormonism

• Documentary: Heather is filming a new documentary on Mormonism with the team from Leah Remini’s Scientology series. (09:15)
  • Kelly: “You are so getting banished from the celestial kingdom. Are you afraid of that?”
  • Heather: “I used to be, but now I hope to be banished because I do not want to be there with the people.” (09:29)
• Fear of Backlash:
  • Heather describes being terrified at first to reveal church secrets—especially the temple ceremony.
  • “We make vows in the temple that we’ll never reveal any of it, or we’ll basically disembowel and cut our throats. So you’re not allowed to ever retell what we wear or what we do.” (12:14)
• Secrecy and Rituals Inside Mormon Temples:
  • Clothing: Head-to-toe white, green fig leaf aprons, veils, men with caps tied to their shoulders—accompanied by secret handshakes, tokens, and oral rituals. (13:20)
  • Heather: “It is so secret. It is the greatest, biggest kept secret in the Mormon Church. Until I went and physically saw everyone dressed like that … It is a shell shock for every member.” (12:54)
• Cult Comparisons:
  • Heather now believes the LDS Church is cult-like, citing the zealotry and secrecy.
  • “It’s the church in its entirety. … We look so normal and mainstream, but what we do in secret … no one would realize how absolutely allegiant we are.” (15:13)

2. Navigating Life Post-Church: Ostracism & Family

• Social Fallout: Heather is still surrounded by practicing Mormons (family, friends, customers), but “I’m not invited over for Sunday dinner.” (17:12)
  • “They won’t read the book, they won’t watch the show, they won’t acknowledge anything that’s any value that I’ve garnered from being on TV or from writing the books, whatever that has holds no currency where I live.” (17:19)

3. Mormon Wealth, Culture, and Purity Fixations

• Perceptions of Wealth: Kelly notes that Mormon communities, at least in Utah, are often affluent – “That’s the rich religion, Jan.”
• Church’s Wealth: Heather: “The church is worth $260 billion. … It’s a huge, huge institution.” (18:41)
• Sexual Loopholes:
  • Soaking: Described as “insertion with no movement, no thrusting, just soaking.” (19:20)
    • “If the penis were a sponge and the vagina were a bowl of water … just place it in and no motion.” (19:20)
  • Jump Pumping: Heather says she never saw it and thinks it’s an urban legend—no third-person bouncing in BYU dorms! (20:11)
  • Soft Swinging: A way for married Mormons with no experience to “dabble, but not be adulterers.” Usually, it’s discussed and agreed upon (24:21).

4. Getting Cast on Real Housewives of Salt Lake City

• Casting Story: Invited through Lisa Barlow, originally thought she’d just refer names—not join herself. (26:29)
• No Family Warning: Heather hid her involvement from her family, understood they’d disapprove and fear excommunication. Her bishop advised her to carry a glass of milk at events so no one suspected she was drinking alcohol. (27:26)
• Faking It vs. Authenticity:
  • Considered hiding her real lifestyle for the show, but realized, “I knew I could pull the wool over the church’s eyes … but you cannot fake it with the viewing audience.” (29:49)

5. Mormon Garments Demystified

• “Sacred Garments”: Essentially, a T-shirt with boob cups and bike shorts, mandatory for active members.
  • “It’s like wearing an outfit underneath your outfit … They got so hard, cumbersome.” (32:42)
  • One-piece options exist—with a “butt flap.” You need a barcoded card showing good standing to buy them. (33:24)

6. Dishy Housewives and Franchise Secrets

• Jen Shah: Heather hasn’t talked to her since she entered prison; doesn’t expect to run into her unless Jen visits her business. (34:53)
• The Black Eye Incident: Heather didn’t know how she got the black eye; “I was protecting myself and protecting her … I didn’t have much to go on … I was just that drunk.” (35:45)
• Monica Garcia: Was shocked anyone stayed friends after her deception.
  • “There was no world that she would have been in our world and been our friend … How are we supposed to process friendship with someone that was never our friend to begin with?” (37:37)
• Cast Friendships:
  • With Bronwyn: “I really love these women. I love fighting with them, but I love getting along more … I am a go along to get along girl.” (38:45)
• Lisa Barlow:
  • “What people might not believe is that she’s exactly the same off camera as she is on. … There is no persona.” (49:36)
  • “I believe it’s smart, emotional intelligence to learn who you can push and who you can’t.” (48:55)
• Salt Lake City Housewives Bond:
  • “We are all each other’s got in Salt Lake City. … I no longer can kiki with my Mormon friends. … We are all each other’s got in Salt Lake City and I think that makes us a unique friend group and possibly a unique franchise in reality TV.” (51:35)

7. Personal Life, Motherhood & the Future

• Motherhood and Dating:
  • Heather prioritized raising her daughters over dating post-divorce, but is now stepping into single life as an empty nester.
  • “Now that the girls are leaving, I’m really going to change my focus, and I’m excited about it.” (54:21)
  • Kelly: “You are a stone cold fox. … Guys, we’re going to have to form a perimeter at the house.” (55:20)

8. Religion and Belief—Universality and Absurdity

• The conversation turns to religious beliefs more generally:
  • Heather: “All religion has something almost unbelievable unless you’re a believer.” (46:06)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Mormon Fear of Hell:

  • Kelly: “So if you’re banished celestial kingdom, is that the same as burning in hell?”
  • Heather: “We Mormons give everybody three chances … then outer darkness, which would be equivalent to burning in hell. But we just believe you’re floating in eternal blackness with no progression and no hope or joy or no family.” (09:52)

• On Writing the Book “Bad Mormon”:

  • Heather: “There’s no way I would ever put my face with Bad Mormon in front of it. … I was just so entrenched and still loyal. But then, things happened—fame mostly. Fame and independent income.” (10:54)
  • Kelly: “Independent income. They won.” (11:59)

• On Temple Secrets and Rituals:

  • Heather: “We wear head to toe white, but then we wear a stark Kelly green fig leaf apron over our loins and we veil our faces … priests’ robes and nylons and slippers. … We do secret handshakes, … secret rites of passage.” (13:20)

• On LDS Church as a Cult:

  • Heather: “It’s still like, chokes my throat to say the church is a cult … but if you want to call us a church, then we are religious zealots.” (14:29)

• On Soaking/JUMP Pumping:

  • Heather (on soaking): “Insertion with no movement, no thrusting, just soaking." (19:20)
  • Kelly (on third person): “So does that require a third person in the church or a coin operated bed?" (20:12)

• On Housewives Camaraderie:

  • Heather: “I just really love these women. I love fighting with them, but I love getting along more…when it’s good, I want to keep it good.” (38:45)

• On Lisa Barlow’s Consistency:

  • Heather: “What people might not believe is that she’s exactly the same off camera as she is on. … If it is a persona, it runs so deep that I’ve never seen anything otherwise.” (49:36)

• On Living Authentically:

  • Heather: “I would have done it if I thought I could have managed it, but I knew that the audience would have seen through it, and that was something I didn’t want to deal with.” (29:49)

• On Readjusting to Single Life:

  • Heather: “I really thought having a great love just wasn’t going to be part of my story … but I think there’s still an opportunity.” (54:21)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [09:11] Heather joins; discusses new Mormonism documentary
• [10:54] On publishing “Bad Mormon” and fear of backlash
• [13:20] Secrets of LDS temple ceremonies and clothing
• [14:29] Is Mormonism a cult?
• [17:04] Social and community consequences after leaving the Church
• [18:41] Discussion of Mormon wealth and Church finances
• [19:20] Explaining “soaking” and sexual loopholes
• [24:21] “Soft swinging” in Mormon culture
• [26:29] How Heather was cast on Real Housewives
• [29:49] Faking faith, authenticity, and why she ultimately left the Church
• [32:25] Mormon sacred garments explained
• [34:53] Update on Jen Shah and cast dynamics
• [37:37] Monica Garcia mole drama and betrayal
• [38:45] Current feelings about the cast and friendship philosophy
• [49:36] Lisa Barlow’s true persona
• [51:35] Unique bond among the Salt Lake City Housewives
• [54:21] Heather’s new chapter: being an empty nester and dating again

Episode Tone

The conversation is irreverent, warm, and full of sharp wit, with plenty of laughter, inside jokes, and reality-TV references. Both Kelly and Heather blend humor and vulnerability, keeping the discussion both “unhinged” and deeply honest.

This episode is indispensable for Real Housewives fans, those interested in Mormonism, or anyone curious about how faith, fame, and forging a new life intersect. Heather Gay’s candor shines—and Kelly Ripa ensures it’s a very good time.