The art and pleasure of writing a letter

Summary

Life Kit Podcast: The Art and Pleasure of Writing a Letter Hosted by Marielle Segarra | NPR | Release Date: April 15, 2025

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Introduction: Rediscovering the Timeless Practice of Letter Writing

In the April 15, 2025 episode of Life Kit, host Marielle Segarra delves into the enchanting world of letter writing with Rachel Syme, a writer for The New Yorker and author of Syme's Letter Writer. This episode explores the multifaceted joys and benefits of penning heartfelt letters in an increasingly digital age, offering listeners expert guidance on fostering meaningful connections through the written word.

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The Enduring Magic of Letters

Marielle opens the conversation by reflecting on a poignant moment from Jane Austen's Pride and Prejudice, where Mr. Darcy theatrically delivers a letter to Elizabeth Bennet. She shares her own emotional resonance with the scene:

"When I tell you the anticipation I felt as she opened the envelope, the way I got butterflies in my stomach the first time I read this letter, I felt like I was her."
— Marielle Segarra [00:17]

Rachel Syme echoes this sentiment, highlighting her lifelong fascination with stories centered around correspondence:

"I loved the idea of letter writing."
— Rachel Syme [01:10]

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Why Embrace Letter Writing?

Rachel elaborates on the intrinsic joys of letter writing, emphasizing its ability to build and sustain deep relationships:

"It's enjoyable, that it's fun... you're building a relationship, you're building an archive, you're building a body of work."
— Rachel Syme [01:39]

Marielle adds that letter writing not only hones one's writing skills but also fosters unique and intentional connections:

"It's also a way to stay in the practice of writing. And it can help you form and nurture relationships that are unlike any others."
— Marielle Segarra [02:06]

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Getting Started: Initiating the First Letter

For those intrigued by the prospect of writing their first letter, Rachel offers practical advice on approaching potential recipients:

"You have to couch it in a little bit of like a silliness. I just got the most beautiful stationery and I've been dying to use it and write a letter to somebody."
— Rachel Syme [06:25]

Marielle reinforces this by suggesting reaching out to friends, family, or even strangers, and offers creative ways to find pen pals through programs like Rachel’s own Pen Palooza, which now connects over 10,000 members globally.

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Choosing Your Medium: Handwritten vs. Digital

A pivotal aspect of letter writing is the choice of medium. Rachel passionately advocates for handwriting letters, despite its challenges:

"I have kerpal tunnel now from doing such a thing... I have a really beautiful fountain pen that I use that's very smooth writer and doesn't require much of my wrist strength."
— Rachel Syme [09:45]

She encourages writers to explore various types of stationery, from Florentine paper to vintage hotel stationery, emphasizing that the medium should reflect personal style and creativity.

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Unlocking Creativity with Writing Prompts

To overcome the initial hurdle of knowing what to write, Rachel suggests using prompts. Marielle shares insightful examples from Rachel's book:

• "Write a series of letters while sitting on public benches at the park."
• "Describe the dogs that trot by."
• "Write a detailed account of the last time you got food poisoning."

Rachel adds that even mundane topics like the weather can become engaging narratives:

"A lot of people begin their letters with what's going on in the weather... there's like, a great thrill in writing about the seasons and the weather and detail and sensual experience."
— Rachel Syme [12:49]

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Enhancing Letters with Embellishments

Letters offer a unique canvas for artistic expression. Rachel dives into the world of mail art, encouraging writers to adorn their letters with:

• Collage and stickers
• Origami-inspired envelope folds
• Ephemera like dried flowers or vintage photographs

"Letters are a great opportunity to mail anything flat that excites you."
— Rachel Syme [17:39]

Marielle summarizes this creative aspect:

"Embellish the heck out of this thing. You gotta put some stickers in there and then include some tiny flat treasures like pre-wrapped tea bags, ticket stubs..."
— Marielle Segarra [17:39]

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Navigating Common Challenges in Correspondence

Letter writing, while rewarding, can present obstacles such as maintaining momentum and managing expectations. Rachel advises starting small to prevent feeling overwhelmed:

"If you don't feel prepared to write a big long letter to somebody, send a postcard."
— Rachel Syme [18:19]

She also emphasizes the importance of radical kindness, suggesting that if a correspondence fizzles, it's perfectly acceptable to let it drift or gracefully transition to other forms of communication.

"Letter Writing is a hobby, after all, and it should be something you're both enjoying."
— Marielle Segarra [20:12]

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Personalizing Your Correspondence: Signature Sign-Offs

Adding a unique sign-off can imbue a letter with personal flair. Rachel shares her creative sign-offs:

"I often call people kids. So I'll say, you know, until the next letter, kid."
— Rachel Syme [21:22]

Marielle suggests crafting original sign-offs that resonate personally, providing examples like:

• "So long, sweet pea."
• "See you in the mailbox."
• "Catch you on the astral plane."

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Key Takeaways: Embracing the Art of Letter Writing

1. Start Writing: To receive letters, begin by reaching out to friends, family, or even strangers through programs like Pen Palooza.
2. Use Writing Prompts: If unsure what to write, utilize prompts from Rachel’s book or create your own inspired ideas.
3. Embellish Creatively: Enhance your letters with stickers, drawings, or small flat treasures to add a personal touch.
4. Maintain a Hobby Mindset: Keep letter writing enjoyable and stress-free. Allow correspondences to evolve naturally and be kind to yourself and others.
5. Create a Signature Sign-Off: Develop a unique closing that reflects your personality and adds charm to your letters.

Marielle concludes the episode by encouraging listeners to explore other Life Kit episodes on related creative endeavors, such as writing memoirs or crafting playlists.

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Final Thoughts

Writing a letter is not just an act of communication; it's a craft that fosters deep connections, preserves memories, and allows for artistic expression. Whether rekindling old friendships or igniting new ones, the art of letter writing offers a timeless avenue for meaningful human interaction.

"I hope people write letters and find joy in this practice."
— Rachel Syme [22:09]

Embrace the pen, choose your paper, and let your thoughts flow—one heartfelt letter at a time.

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For more insights and episodes, visit NPR Life Kit.

Transcript

[Sierra Club]

This message comes from the Sierra Club. Protecting national parks and public lands for over 130 years and defending everyone's right to a healthy planet. This Earth Month, all gifts are matched to make twice the impact. Donate now@sierra club.org podcast.

[Marielle Segarra]

You're listening to Life Kit from NPR. Hey, everybody, it's Marielle. There is a scene in the Jane Austen novel Pride and Prejudice where the main character, Lizzie Bennet, receives a letter from her. Will they, won't they hate you? Love you, Sexy Crush Man. Mr. Darcy. He actually hands it to her in person. It's really dramatic. And when I tell you the anticipation I felt as she opened the envelope, the way I got butterflies in my stomach the first time I read this letter, I felt like I was her. That obviously says a lot about the immersive magic of a good book, but also about the potency of a well written letter. The drama, the intrigue, the focused attention that it drums up in the recipient. Rachel Syme and I are kindred spirits in this way.

[Rachel Syme]

I loved reading, like, novels that turned on a letter. I loved, you know, watching you've Got Mail and the Shop around the Corner and all these sort of films about correspondence and reading Jane Austen novels. You know, I just loved the idea of letter writing.

[Marielle Segarra]

Rachel is a writer for the New Yorker and she just published a beautiful book called Syme's Letter Writer. It is a guide for how to get into letter writing. And she says there are a lot of reasons to go down this rabbit hole.

[Rachel Syme]

I think the first one that is really simple and kind of broad is just that it's enjoyable, that it's fun, that it is a way to spend your life and spend your time that actually has tangible results attached to it and that you're building something with someone else. You're building a relationship, you're building an archive, you're building a body of work. Not a lot of people can say that about something they do that's just past the time.

[Marielle Segarra]

It's also a way to stay in the practice of writing. And it can help you form and nurture relationships that are unlike any others.

[Rachel Syme]

In your life because they are sort of divorced from time and expectation in a way that pretty much no other relationships are. Like my friends. I'm in group chats with them, text with them. They're constantly available. I'm constantly available. We're pinging each other all the time. I'm calling my family all the time. I'm checking in all the time with work people. The thing about the people that I write letters to is that. I mean, it's like the slow cooker of friendship. You know, I'll write a letter to them. Maybe it'll arrive at their house, you know, given the vagaries of the postal system, in two weeks they'll read it. And I know that it will be read intentionally. And I have found that to be such a delightful rhythm when it is sort of contrasted against everything else that's bombarding us.

[Marielle Segarra]

Rachel is uniquely qualified to teach us about the pleasures of letter writing because a few years ago during the pandemic, she was looking for a way to spend less time on screens and more time connecting with people. So she went on social media, I know, ironic, and said, basically, does anyone want to be my pen pal?

[Rachel Syme]

I got like 300 responses. And I realized, oh my gosh, I can't possibly write a letter to all these people, but there's some kind of need here or desire. So I have to find a way to connect all these people to one another so they can get writing to each other.

[Marielle Segarra]

Rachel started a program called Pen Palooza, which now has 10,000 members from more than 75 countries. And she met some of her best friends this way. So today on Life Kit, how to write letters to your friends, your family, that person who changed your life, your lovers, and even strangers. We'll give you some writing prompts, talk about stationery and embellishments, and how to use this practice as a creative opportunity.

[Sierra Club]

Support for NPR and the following message come from Betterment, the automated investing and savings app. CEO Sarah Levy shares how Betterment utilizes tech tools powered by human advice.

[Rachel Syme]

Betterment is here to help customers build wealth their way and we provide powerful technology and complete human support where technology can deliver ease of use and affordable and the people behind that technology can provide advice and guidance.

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Learn [e-mail] Investing involves risk performance, not guaranteed. Support for this podcast and the following message come from Indeed. You just realized your business needed to hire someone yesterday. Indeed's Sponsored Jobs helps you stand out. According to Indeed data, Sponsored jobs posted directly on indeed have 45% more applications than non sponsored jobs. Speed up your hiring right now with Indeed and get a $75 sponsored job credit to get your jobs more visibility@ Indeed.com LifeKit terms and conditions apply. Hiring Indeed is all you need. This message comes from ServiceNow. People should do the creative work they actually want to do, not boring, busy work. Now, with AI agents built into the ServiceNow platform, you can automate millions of repetitive tasks in every corner of your Business, it, HR and more. So your people can focus on the work that they want to do. That's putting AI agents to work for people. It's your turn. Get [e-mail] AI agents. This message comes from Charles Schwab with their original podcast, Choiceology. Choiceology is a show about the psychology and economics behind people's decisions. Download the latest episode and [e-mail] podcast.

[Marielle Segarra]

Okay, well, let's say. Let's say I'm curious.

[Rachel Syme]

Yep, you're letter curious.

[Marielle Segarra]

I'm letter curious.

[Rachel Syme]

Correspondence curious.

[Marielle Segarra]

I'm thinking about sending my first letter.

[Rachel Syme]

Yep.

[Marielle Segarra]

What language do you use when you are trying to. I'm not even gonna say level up. I'm gonna say go down this other avenue with a friend and you wanna start writing letters to them, what do you actually say?

[Rachel Syme]

I mean, in this day and age, I think you have to sort of couch it in a little bit of like a silliness. So you have to say something along the lines of, I just got the most beautiful stationery and I've been dying to use it and write a letter to somebody. Would it be interesting to you if I wrote to you? Or, you know, say, I'm interested in writing more? I'm trying to get more intentional about my writing. I think one way to really sell it to people is say, I'm trying to get off the Internet. I'm trying to do less being on my Instagram at 2 in the morning and instead hanging out with my fountain pen and do more sort of purposeful, slow communication with the people that I care about. I'm making an active effort to do it and I would love you to be the recipient of this attention.

[Marielle Segarra]

You can also write to strangers, right? How might you find strangers to write to?

[Rachel Syme]

So social media is probably. I mean, I hate to say go there because I'm trying to tell everybody to get off of there in order to write letters. But I think to find somebody to write a letter to is a great place. If there's anyone that's sort of like you're mutual on Instagram or that you've been following for a while and they've been following you, you can always try to write them a direct message and say like, hey, I'd love to write you a letter again. I'm doing this thing where I have beautiful stationery and I'm trying to write letters to people. You'd be surprised how far that sort of approach will take you. There's also other pen pal exchanges online that you can find there. There's a great site that's been around since I think, the 90s called postcrossing, which I love, which is, allows you to send postcards to anyone in the world. And you can, you know, you'll get a bunch of people to send postcards to, but you can always include your return address and say, like, I'd love to keep this exchange going. I often, yeah, there's, there's great websites where you can write letters to prisoners. You can write letters to, you know, you could join a mentorship program where you're, you know, if you're an old woman writer, there are younger women who want to become writers and need mentors. And often those relationships are based in correspondence or in epistolary communication. I feel like it's kind of like a law of attraction thing. It's like once I started writing letters, I found a lot more people to write letters to. It just became so, like, part of my life.

[Marielle Segarra]

Okay, takeaway one. If you want to receive letters, start writing letters. You can reach out to friends and family. Ask if anyone's interested in getting a letter from you. You could also send a letter to someone who made a difference in your life. Your third grade teacher or that person who showed you kindness in a moment. You really needed it. And if you want to write to strangers, there are programs you can sign up for. Or you could send some fan mail. Rachel talks about that in the book too. Write to an author. Tell them how a certain passage in their book has woven its way into your soul. How you felt alone in the world until someone else put your exact feeling into words. That kind of thing means a lot to people. Okay, let's move into the very tactile part of this. Choosing your paper.

[Rachel Syme]

Yep. Very personal.

[Marielle Segarra]

Yeah. How do you start to decide, first of all, like, are you handwriting or using a typewriter or even printing off the computer? And then what paper are you going to use?

[Rachel Syme]

Well, I think you should do whatever you want. It's a free for all, really. But I write my letters by hand. For the most part though. I have kerpal tunnel now from doing such a thing. And I mean, I have a really beautiful fountain pen that I use that's very smooth writer and doesn't require much of my wrist strength. But whatever way you choose to actually get the words on the page, totally up to you. If you do want to go down the rabbit hole of handwriting and pens and fountain pens and calligraphy ballpoint pens and, you know, going to the pen store and going nuts I mean, you can go so far down that rabbit hole. It's endless. And very addictive in terms of paper. I mean, again, so personal. I have sort of so many different types of stationery at this point that I change my mind every single day. Sometimes it's, you know, a beautiful piece of Florentine stationery. Some days it's a note card. Some days it's a postcard. Some days it's vintage hotel stationery. Some days it's onion skin paper, because I love the way that that feels. Some days it's this pink notepads that I write on because I learned that Jacqueline Suzanne, who wrote Value the dolls, always wrote on pink notepads. And for some reason, I just, like, had an instant craving for pink note, like, legal paper, and then ordered, like, a hundred of them. A lot of people I know, you know, collage their letters, do watercolor, sort of create their own stationery. I mean, I have people who I know who have personalized letterhead. I have other people that will write on found paper napkins, the back of other things, you know, recycled other printouts from work. It really is so open that there are no rules. Mm.

[Marielle Segarra]

I'm opening up to the page where you give writing prompts.

[Rachel Syme]

Oh, yeah.

[Marielle Segarra]

Because I think it could be hard if you're just writing a letter for the first time, unless it's to congratulate someone on something or whatever or thank them to know what to say.

[Rachel Syme]

Like, if this whole book is one big writing prompt is how I saw it, basically.

[Marielle Segarra]

Yeah.

[Rachel Syme]

Yeah.

[Marielle Segarra]

But then specifically, you have some that I like. I'm just gonna read a few of them. Sure. Write a series of letters while sitting on public benches at the park. Describe the people who walk past inside a museum. Describe the art you see while sitting down outside a coffee shop. Describe the dogs that trot by. I mean, it sounds like description is a great way to go. Like.

[Rachel Syme]

Yeah. I mean, I think that literally, if you don't know what to write about, write about what you did that day. I mean, I think I start the book with a section that's called how to Write about the Weather. Because a lot of people begin their letters with what's going on in the weather, and they apologize for it. They go like, I'm so sorry I'm boring you, because I'm talking about how it snowed today. And my contention is that there's. There's like, a. Can be a great thrill in writing about the seasons and the weather and detail and sensual experience and the way you move through the world. And a lot of people don't do that.

[Marielle Segarra]

Write a detailed account of the last time you got food poisoning. Do you know what the culprit was? Did you have that sinking feeling that eating three day old shrimp was a terrible idea? Go into the gory timeline.

[Rachel Syme]

Oh, yeah, it's very generative. Everybody remembers and they. They will never eat that thing again, whatever it was.

[Marielle Segarra]

Mm. You do have a section in here about how to write a love letter.

[Rachel Syme]

Mm.

[Marielle Segarra]

And that is something that often involves imagination, as you note. Like, if you were here, I would do this to you. That's like a pretty classic formula for sexting steamy. So with love letters, any particular tips you want to share?

[Rachel Syme]

I think that you know a love letter. First of all, you can write a love letter to anyone in your life, not just somebody that you're in a romantic relationship with. I think what it has to be about is an act of noticing, an act of sharing certain specific details about the person. I think that the most well received love letters and the ones that really stick with people are just memories and specifics and a sense of what you really. The small details about this person that you've noticed that only somebody that loves them would notice. And cataloging those. Often love letters contain poetry. Often they'll contain waxing about your future or what you hope that will look like. And sometimes it's about the past. It's odic. You have to think of yourself as a poet a little bit like, what am I singing a song of about this person? And sometimes it can be like the smallest things that you notice. You know, it can be like a freckle. It can be a day that you were together and they said something and it's always stuck with you. And you can again write these kinds of letters to anyone in your life that has had great meaning.

[Marielle Segarra]

That's beautiful.

[Rachel Syme]

Oh, thanks.

[Marielle Segarra]

Get so creative with this. A letter can be about anything. You want some more prompts from the book. Make your own mad Libs. Take polaroids of your life for a week and drop them in an envelope with a message on the back of each one. And draw a map of a stroll you often take through your neighborhood with pinpoints and descriptions of your favorite memories at each spot. Okay. You also have an idea in here to mail recipes.

[Rachel Syme]

Love mailing recipes.

[Marielle Segarra]

Yeah. What is so magical about that?

[Rachel Syme]

I think it's like we're going back to this sort of hand honed tradition, a thing that was passed down through generations. As much as I love, like, I love recipe Books. I love family recipe books. So if you have your own recipes that you can pass along. I think of letters in many ways as creating an archive. And what's funny is like you can't really see the archive you're creating unless you get together with the person you wrote letters to and said like, let's pair our letters and they'll be in one archive forever. Although in the book, I encourage people to take pictures of the letters you're sending so you have copies of what you've done in case you ever want your side of the correspondence. But you are creating an archive of your work out there somewhere in the world. And I think recipes are the product of, you know, trial error, generational secrets passed down. And so sending it along to somebody else, it's like very intimate too.

[Marielle Segarra]

Okay, let's talk about embellishments.

[Rachel Syme]

Sure.

[Marielle Segarra]

We want to give our letter a little pizzazz.

[Rachel Syme]

Yep.

[Marielle Segarra]

What would you say are the do's and don'ts here?

[Rachel Syme]

I think that letters are one of these places where you can really express unbridled creativity. I mean, in terms of like what we'll actually get through the postal system. I mean, there's a lot of sort of if you glue a bunch of stuff on googly eyes and you know that it won't make it at least through the traditional mail system. So there's, you know, flat things you can mail, ways you can embellish with collage and stickers and how to make mail art. I mean, I'm obsessed with mail art. Mail art was kind of an art movement that really had a sort of a heyday in the 60s and 70s, which was where a lot of artists were actually expressing themselves by making really ornate envelopes and seeing what they could move through the mail system. But it's still going strong. There's TikToks devoted to it, there's Instagrams, there's tutorials on YouTube devoted to mail art. How to make something look really beautiful, ornate, lots of interesting sort of origami type envelope folds, lots of ways you can sort of add ephemera to both the outside and the inside of your envelope. I mean, I think letters are a great opportunity to mail anything flat that excites you.

[Marielle Segarra]

Takeaway 3. Embellish the heck out of this thing. You gotta put some stickers in there and then include some tiny flat treasures like pre wrapped tea bags, ticket stubs, ornate wine labels, vintage photographs, iron on patches and dried flowers. Just make sure your recipient isn't allergic first. So if you get into writing Letters, I could see that things might just fade away sometimes. Like, you might fall out of the habit, or maybe somebody stops answering you back. Or like, what are some of the common letter writing? Or like correspondence snags that people hit?

[Rachel Syme]

Well, I think people become quickly overwhelmed because it's not something that they're used to. Right? So it seems really novel and fun when you first get a letter and then you go, oh, my God, I have to reply to this. It's a muscle like any other thing that can be worked out, but, you know, so I think that. I think starting small is really, really good and really healthy. I think that if you don't feel prepared to write a big long letter to somebody, send a postcard. I also think that a short letter is better than no letter in so much as you might think, oh, gosh, if I don't have the time to respond to this in such a major way, I'm going to be doing this person a disservice. But the truth is they just want to keep the volley in the air. And so often, if somebody sends me a really long letter and I don't have the bandwidth, I'll send a postcard or I'll send an interim kind of short letter. Being like, loved your letter, it moved me. I'm gonna get back to you soon, but in the meantime, here's a silly, you know, vintage hotel thing. So there's, I think you can hit snags of being so overwhelmed that you just stop. And I think maybe the idea is just to keep the ball in the air is really useful. I think also just sometimes correspondences run their course. I think that I have several people that I started writing to at the beginning of this project, for example, that I'm still writing to, but some people have fallen away, or some people, our relationship has changed. It started as an epistolary friendship and then we got really close writing letters and then started texting and calling. And that's more of our friendship now than letters. And we constantly say, like, we gotta get back to writing letters, you know, But I think they can change. And honestly, if something like this fizzles out, it's okay. It's okay. I think in general, you should practice kind of like radical kindness in this letter writing game. Because the truth is, it's really. It's a hobby. It's something that people should be doing for fun, for connection, for delight. If it's not delighting you, then why do it?

[Marielle Segarra]

Okay, so takeaway 4 Be gentle with yourself and other people. Letter Writing is a hobby, after all, and it should be something you're both enjoying. If not, let this correspondence fizzle pair up with somebody else. You know, There are about 8 billion people in the world. Okay, you have a page in the book about signature sign offs.

[Rachel Syme]

Yeah.

[Marielle Segarra]

My favorite from Zora Neale Hurston in a letter to. Is it Alain Locke or Alan Locke?

[Rachel Syme]

La la. I don't know. It's French. Forgive me, French speakers.

[Marielle Segarra]

Okay, so in a letter from Zora Neale Hurston, she says, so long, old cabbage. I just freaking love that.

[Rachel Syme]

I love that, too. I mean, I think in. In France, you know, people call each other little cabbage Monchu or whatever for as a sort of, like, term of endearment. But yeah, I think it's cute. I think you should. Everybody should come up with their own signature sign off. I think that's a really. That's a great eccentricity to have.

[Marielle Segarra]

Will you tell me yours?

[Rachel Syme]

Yeah, I mean, I have different ones that I use for different people. I often call people kids. So I'll say, you know, until the next letter, kid. Right back, kid. I also say, see you in the mailbox.

[Marielle Segarra]

See you in the mailbox.

[Rachel Syme]

Yeah.

[Marielle Segarra]

That's cute.

[Rachel Syme]

It's cute. Love to be cute.

[Marielle Segarra]

Okay, our final takeaway is come up with a signature sign off, one that is uniquely and unmistakably yours. Here are some that I'm workshopping. So long, sweet pea. Bye bye, cutie pie. See you in my dreams, darlin'catch. You on the astral plane. Y asta luego.

[Rachel Syme]

Wapo.

[Marielle Segarra]

Okay, Rachel, thank you so much.

[Rachel Syme]

Thank you. I hope people write letters and find joy in this practice.

[Marielle Segarra]

Okay, letter writers, it is time for a recap. Takeaway 1. If you want to get letters, start writing. Letters reach out to friends and family, to old acquaintances, and even to strangers. Takeaway two, if you don't know what to say, start with a writing prompt. We've shared some here, and you can find more in Rachel's book and also online. Takeaway 3, embellish. Give that letter some pizzazz. Takeaway 4. Letter writing is a hobby. Do not turn it into work. Have fun with it and go with the flow. And takeaway five, come up with a signature sign off to rival Zora Neale Hurston's very cheeky so long, old cabbage. For more Life Kit, check out our other episodes. We have one on how to write a memoir and another on how to make a really good playlist. You can find [e-mail] life kit and if you love Life Kit and want even more. Subscribe to our [e-mail] LifeKitnewsletter Also, we love hearing from you, so if you have episode ideas or feedback you want to share, send us some fan mail. You can email [e-mail] this episode of Life Kit was produced by Sam Yellowhorse Kessler. Our Visuals editor is Beck Harlan and our digital editor is Malika Garib. Megan Keane is our Supervising Editor and Beth Donovan is our Executive producer. Our production team also includes Andy Tagle, Claire Marie Schneider, Margaret Serino and Sylvie Douglas. Engineering support comes from Zoe Vingenhoven and Gilly Moon. Fact Checking by Ida Porosad I'm Mariel Segarra. Thanks for listening.

[Sierra Club]

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