W. Kamau Bell, Rick Steves, and Edna Vázquez

Summary

Live Wire with Luke Burbank – July 31, 2026

Episode Overview This lively edition of Live Wire, hosted by Luke Burbank, brings together comedian and commentator W. Kamau Bell, beloved travel writer and TV host Rick Steves, and acclaimed singer Edna Vázquez with a youth mariachi ensemble. The episode blends humor, insightful commentary about contemporary culture and travel, and a celebratory musical performance—delivering both levity and depth to listeners seeking connection, perspective, and a good laugh.

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The Best News We Heard All Week (02:00–07:37)

Highlights

• Elena Passarello (announcer): Shares the story of a 76-year-old Floridian, Nancy Dello Stretch, who received a randomly generated license plate reading “SQZ S55” (“Squeeze Ass”)—and decided to keep it after her sons’ encouragement.
  “She changed her mind … her sons couldn’t stop laughing. I think that’s hilarious. Anyone who doesn’t like it can kiss my A55.” (B, 04:26)

• Luke Burbank: Celebrates Seattle’s latest viral sensation—Jimothy the raccoon, who, due to short spine syndrome, looks like a “perfect circle.”
  “The city did a proclamation making it Jimothy day. The Mariners added Jimothy to their mascot race. People are getting tattoos of Jimothy.” (A, 06:23)
  “It’s the perfect Seattle animal. There will be at least four bands this summer called Jimothy.” (A, 07:34)

Memorable Quote:
“This appears to be the story and the sort of animal that we needed this summer. Not just in Seattle, but everywhere.” – Luke Burbank (A, 06:52)

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W. Kamau Bell: Comedy, Conversations, and “Who’s With Me?” (07:37–26:39)

Launching the New Podcast (08:53–11:45)

• Kamau talks about his new podcast “Who’s With Me?” on Pushkin Industries.
  • The show is an extension of his Substack and a platform for deep conversations with guests he chooses.
  • Podcast gives him autonomy; inspired to work with Justin Richmond (aka “Black Judgment” from his Denzel Washington podcast days).
  • Kamau comically notes the void left by Marc Maron:
    “Somebody needs to make male led comedian podcasts great again. … We can’t let Joe Rogan take it over.” (C, 11:31)

On Interviewing and Podcasting Style (12:53–14:53)

• Kamau admits to getting nervous, even with friends like Delroy Lindo:
  “I don’t want people to feel like I’m wasting their time…” (C, 13:02)
• Goes the extra mile for guests (fetching pineapple juice for Lindo, coffee for Kristen Kish).
• Family responsibilities influence his hospitality.

From United Shades to Navigating Toxicity (14:53–17:14)

• Addresses his reputation for interviewing controversial figures (e.g., the KKK):
  “I talked to the Klan because I was a guy without a job, whose wife was pregnant with our second kid and I needed a job.” (C, 16:13)
• Clarifies he prefers intentional conversations, even with disagreement, but wants to shift toward allies:
  • “We really know there’s a lot of people in this country who are against us. And I want to know who’s with me. We may have nuanced disagreements, but I just want to know if you’re with me, we can figure it out.” (C, 17:01)

Stand-Up, Family, and Being Funny at Home (17:14–21:02)

• Kamau returns to stand-up after 5 years and brings his daughters into shows—one gives on-stage feedback and even negotiates “joke rights” for candy.
• “If there was no such thing as white supremacy and racism in America, I would be an only child stand up comedian.” (C, 17:46)
• Daughters think he’s funny (“They don’t think I’m cool, but they will laugh at me… I’ll take the laugh.” – C, 19:33)
• Shares family anecdotes, including his cousin, author N.K. Jemisin (“I let her know I was funny and I gave her all her ideas for her books.” – C, 20:53)

Comedy’s State: Roasts, Streaming, and Cancel Culture (21:02–25:01)

• On the Netflix Kevin Hart Roast:
  • Criticizes the mean-spirited, attention-focused platform shift:
    “Netflix … just wants your attention. They don’t want your respect.” (C, 23:59)
  • Lampoons Tony Hinchcliffe: “Fair. Who has never told a legitimately funny joke in his life.” (C, 23:37)
  • Laments the move away from the Friends-roasting-Friends spirit.
  • Observes that cancel culture is overblown: “Cancel culture is not real. If we needed more proof…” (C, 21:37)
• Links cultural coarsening to broader political tides:
  “This is coarsing our culture and it’s no accident that’s happening under the Trump administration.” (C, 24:36)

On American Cycles and the Future (25:01–26:39)

• Challenges the idea of natural cultural cycles, instead linking decline to rise of fascism and loss of international standing.
  • “You know, people go to visit Rome for the ruins… eventually America might be a place like, ‘remember when that was a thing?’” (C, 26:20)
• Jokes about being ready to apply for “group refugee status” as a Black American when the time comes.

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Rick Steves: The World Is His Classroom (27:43–44:49)

Recent Travels and Filming (28:51–30:52)

• Rick highlights recent projects:
  • Four one-hour TV specials on Europe’s “greatest cities”: London, Paris, Rome, Istanbul.
  • Most decadent show: gourmet barge tour through Burgundy, France.
    “You can get out and walk or bike about the same speed as the barge…” (D, 30:03)

The Realities of Travel TV (31:22–33:56)

• Meals for the camera are always cold:
  “I don’t, I can’t remember eating one of those beautiful looking meals still hot… you get really good at savoring what used to be hot food because the camera’s on…” (D, 31:22)
• Travel shows require intense, creative work and a reliable, tight-knit team.
• “It’s a big garden to take care of when you’ve got guidebooks for all of Europe…” (D, 33:24)

Audience Feedback and Guidebook Philosophy (33:56–35:48)

• Rick writes with a practical, efficient mindset—Americans have limited vacation time.
• Prioritizes experiences that are truly essential:
  “I do not do things that don’t make the cut for the first 30 days in that country.” (D, 34:39)
• Goal is to inspire Americans to use their passports and “become a friend with the world,” gaining dual citizenship in global citizenship.

Pop Culture and Unexpected Fame (35:48–37:41)

• Rick is referenced in the dystopian show Pluribus as a symbol of lost “normal life”.
• Humble about his notoriety:
  “People have so much fun traveling, they want to thank somebody for it… even if I don’t write about it, they’ll thank me for the idea of travel.” (D, 37:41)

American Image Abroad & Navigating Divided Times (38:45–41:42)

• Despite U.S. political turbulence, Rick finds Europeans are “confused, curious, concerned” but not hostile to American tourists.
• Advocates for “dual narrative tourism”:
  “You can’t visit a place with a wall and have any valid opinion about that wall unless you’ve talked to people on both sides…” (D, 40:26)
• Applies the idea metaphorically to divisions in America, urging engagement and empathy.

Travel Philosophy & Political Act (42:34–44:49)

• Though Rick’s favorite countries include India, Indonesia, Japan, and Sri Lanka, he remains dedicated to helping Americans explore Europe.
• Champions travel as transformative:
  • “The idea that you can learn more about your home sometimes by leaving it and looking at it from a distance.”
• Invokes wisdom:
  “Don’t tell me how educated you are, tell me how much you’ve traveled.” (D, 44:49)
• Encourages experiencing “culture shock” as a positive, formative experience.

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Musical Performance: Edna Vázquez & Mariachi Tradición (47:13–50:51)

Performance: "Lindo Colima"
Feat: High school ensemble Mariachi Tradición from Forest Grove, OR

Segment Highlights

• Edna introduces the traditional Mexican song:
  • “Lindo Colima, which speaks about a region, the beautifulness of a region… Colima is in the west coast of Mexico, near towards the Pacific Ocean.” (D, 47:13)
• Performs with energy and pride alongside talented youth musicians.
• Closes with gratitude:
  “Thank you so much. This is Forest Grove High School Mariachi.” (D, 50:39)

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Notable Quotes

• W. Kamau Bell:

  • “I wanted to work with Black Judgment again, as we all do… so it’s not what you know, it’s who you know and who you called Black Judgment when they were a UC Berkeley student.” (C, 10:11)
  • “I can’t just call Ted Danson, be like, ‘Hey, man, you want to talk for an hour?’ I don’t know him like that yet.” (C, 11:14)

• Rick Steves:

  • “There’s only one guidebook that outsells my Rick Steves Italy book, and it’s the guidebook to Disney World, and it’s really good for La La Land. But I write for a smaller market. It’s called Reality Travel.” (D, 34:53)

• Elena Passarello:

  • “Anyone who doesn’t like it can kiss my A55.” (B, 04:26)

• Luke Burbank:

  • “This appears to be the story and the sort of animal that we needed this summer…” (A, 06:52)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Best News: 02:00–07:37
• W. Kamau Bell Interview: 07:37–26:39
• Rick Steves Interview: 27:43–44:49
• Edna Vázquez/Mariachi Tradición Performance: 47:13–50:51

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Tone & Takeaway The atmosphere is warm, witty, and thoughtful. The guests each offer comfort, practical wisdom, or a necessary challenge—whether through humor (Kamau), practical travel advice (Rick Steves), or music that uplifts and bridges generations and traditions (Edna Vázquez). The episode encourages listeners to seek connection, laugh at life’s absurdities, and remain open—whether in art, politics, travel, or community.

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Transcript

[A]

Hey, there. Welcome to Livewire. I'm your host, Luke Burbank. This week on the show is gonna be like hanging out with some of your best buds, or at least some of our best friends here on Livewire, including W. Kamau Bell, the comedian, TV producer, writer, Jeopardy. Champion. And now he can add podcaster to the list. He's got a new show called who's With Me? Wherein he talks to all kinds of notable folks about life and politics, and he basically tries to figure out, like, who's in his corner. Then we're gonna talk to the legendary travel writer and TV host Rick Steves. Rick was on the show, and then he heard we were coming back to Seattle, and he said, have me back on the show. And we did, and it was wonderful. Hey, speaking of things that are wonderful, our friend Edna Vasquez is gonna play us a song featuring high school students playing mariachi music. Don't go anywhere. It all gets started right after this.

[B]

From prx, it's live wire. This week, comedian and podcaster W. Kamau Bell.

[C]

We really know there's a lot of people in this country who are against us, and I want to know who's with me. We may have nuanced disagreements, but I just want to know if you're with me, we can figure it out.

[B]

Travel writer Rick Steves.

[D]

There's only one guidebook that outsells my Rick Steves Italy book, and it's the guidebook to Disney World, and it's really good for La La Land. But I write for a smaller market. It's called Reality Travel with music from

[B]

Edna Vasquez and our fabulous house band. I'm your announcer, Elena Passarello. And now, the host of Livewire, Luke Burbank.

[A]

Thank you so much, Elena Passarello. Thanks to everybody for tuning in from all over America to our little radio show for you, We've got a great one in store this week. First, though, of course, we gotta kick things off the way we like to with the best news we heard all week. This is our little reminder at the top of the show that, in fact, there is good news happening all on the planet, and sometimes you just gotta look hard for it. And we have, and we have found those stories, and we're presenting them now. Alayna, what is the best news you heard all week?

[B]

Oh, this. This is good news. Just because it makes me laugh. I have always wanted a driver's license vanity plate. Have you ever had one? Luke Burbank?

[A]

No, but I was in Ohio recently, and I drove by someone Whose vanity plate was Ebola. Bold choice.

[B]

Yeah, Ebola choice.

[A]

I seriously, I don't know what. I as a kid, of course wanted like a cool vanity plate, but then I bec an adult and honestly, I never looked up how to do it.

[B]

Yeah, I think it's expensive in all but like there's like one state where it's free or something. Not free in Florida. But plenty of people in Florida get vanity license plates. There's even a monitoring body that checks Florida license plate vanity plate applications for lewdness or inappropriateness. But there is a hole in the monitoring system and that's the randomly generated license plates, the regular free license plates.

[A]

Just the like, roll of the dice.

[B]

Yes. Unmonitored or loosely monitored or they haven't figured out the program to properly scan it. And that is how 76 year old Pompano beach resident Nancy Dello stretch ended up with a license plate that says sqz. So squeeze a 55. And I, I saw a picture of this license plate and the fives, the particular typeface or font or whatever of Florida's license plat. Those fives really do look like S's. So the first clip I saw was a very, very lovely, very proper seeming older woman kind of telling a news crew that she just like, she says something like, how am I supposed to go around my retirement community with a license plate that says this?

[A]

Squeeze a 55.

[B]

Squeeze a 55. She reported it and it. I do think that the Florida department of transportation was happy to issue a free replacement. But the best news I heard all week is that she changed her mind.

[A]

She's keeping it.

[B]

She. She says her sons couldn't stop laughing. And then she decided that it might be fun to get a few extra honks. You know, when she's driving around, she's got like a red Hyundai. And you know what? More power to her. I think that's hilarious. And anyone who doesn't like it can kiss my A55.

[A]

Yeah, you gotta have some fun in life. I'm glad that she's embracing it. The best news that I've seen this week. Three words for you, Elena. Hot jimothy summer.

[B]

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

[A]

You up on jimothy?

[B]

I am on board.

[A]

I was raised in Seattle, so I feel a particular sense of pride about this raccoon named Jimothy that has completely lit up the Internet of late. A woman in Seattle named Kiana hall saw this raccoon running through the yard and took a video of it and said, like, what am I seeing here? Put it on Instagram. Because Jimothy has what they think is something called short spine syndrome. And what he basically looks like. If you are one of the few people on earth who hasn't seen Jimothy yet. Almost like a beach ball or something. He's almost like a perfect circle.

[B]

Yeah. And he's missing. His tail is short. Right. So it adds to the circleness.

[A]

It is quite uncanny. It almost looks cryptozoological.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Looks like he should be tagging along with Sasquatch in grainy footage in the distance in the. The woods of Washington. But he's been in the neighborhoods. And one of the things that's really cute is it seems like Jimothy is doing just fine, even though he's got this kind of spinal thing going on with his family. Some accounts are that the family does not tend to go in trees because it's tough for Jimothy. So it sounds like the family is making accommodations for Jimothy. The city of Seattle did a proclamation making it Jimothy day. My alma mater, the University of Washington, gave Jimothy an honorary doctorate, which, honestly, they haven't done that for me.

[B]

Yeah, that's a lot for a young raccoon.

[A]

The Seattle Mariners have this, like, mascot race where they have different kinds of fish and salmon run in a race. They added Jimothy to the race.

[B]

So did they make a Jimothy costume?

[A]

They sort of modified an existing raccoon costume. I kind of wish that the person playing Jimothy would have gotten down on all fours, would have been a little bit more lifelike.

[B]

The gate is very. That. The gate is very hands and knees kind of a thing.

[A]

This appears to be the story and the sort of animal that we needed this summer. Not just in Seattle, but everywhere. I mean, people are getting tattoos of Jimothy just like, fully embracing hot Jimothy summer. And again, it just seems like one of those things that everything else going on in the world that feels not great. This little guy, Jimothy thriving. And again, having the name Jimothy. I don't know if any of this would have happened if his name was Randy.

[B]

Right. Jimothy just kind of presses your funny bone a little bit. It's so funny.

[A]

It absolutely does. And I just love it. And again, I love. It's like the perfect Seattle animal. Being from Seattle, I tell you, there will be at least four bands that are formed this summer that are called Jimothy.

[B]

Jimothy and the short spines, that's going to be.

[A]

That's going to Be the new hot name in Seattle. Anyway, Jimothy out there thriving and making our summer a little better. That's the best news that I heard all week. This is Livewire. Okay. Our first guest's resume is really, really impressive, I'm going to be honest. He's a Peabody award winner, four time Emmy winner, two time New York Times best selling author, official ambassador of the band Fishbone, self proclaimed number one Bruce Lee expert in the non Asian division. The thing though, he's also done that really, really just eats me up with jealousy. He won Celebrity Jeopardy. You might also know him from his CNN docu series, United Shades of America. And these days he's launching a weekly podcast called who's With Me? Take a listen to our friend, W. Kamau Bell, recorded live at the Patricia Research center for the Arts in Beaverton, Oregon. Kamel, welcome back to the show. You got a new podcast, who's With Me? Also the name of your substack that I subscribe to.

[D]

Did.

[A]

Did you approach the producers of this, the Pushkin Industries? Did they approach you? How did this podcast happen?

[C]

So I've had many, many podcast lives. I was most recently the host of the ACLU's podcast At Liberty. Before that, I had politically reacted with one horikondabolu.

[A]

Yes. Friend of the show.

[C]

Yes. This is his area of the country. And I had a podcast with my friend Kevin Avery. Denzel Washington is the greatest actor of all time, period.

[A]

Yep.

[C]

Which is just a true statement in a podcast. And so, but this is the first time I've ever had one that was my own. And so I really just started from, I want to have something where I can do what I want to talk, do I want to do. I'm an only child. This is perfect. Actually. A guy, Justin Richmond, who actually hosts one of the main podcasts. Oh, good, great clap. Yes.

[A]

Justin Richmond, head's in the house.

[C]

Yes. Who I met when he was at UC Berkeley. He was actually just like a radio engineer going to school at UC Berkeley and became a character on my Denzel Washington podcast. We called him Black Judgment.

[A]

No one's ever called me that.

[C]

No. And they will not.

[A]

All right. Not.

[C]

Not on my watch. So. So Black Judgment. And it has worked with Malcolm Gladwell for years. So really I was like, I want to work with Black Judgment again, as we all do. And he works with Malcolm Gladwell. So it sort of is. It's not what you know, it's who you know and who you called Black Judgment when they were a UC Berkeley student.

[A]

You have thank you.

[C]

One person with a good laugh.

[A]

You have done all these other podcasts, so, you know, kind of the world of podcasting, but I mean, did you have a moment of thinking, like, okay, another podcast added to the discourse. How am I going to try to make this something that's interesting for you to do, interesting for the listeners, somehow do something that's not being done out there?

[C]

I mean, here's the weird thing about me, because I'm an only child, I don't really care about you people.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

I know it's weird for a stand up comic. I'm not really worried about the audience. I mean, I like to check in with them, you know, But I really was like, I want to have. Well, here's two things. One, I wanted to have conversations with people I care about. We've done a bunch of them so far. They came first. One was Delroy Lindo.

[A]

Yes, the legend.

[C]

Second was my congressman, Latifah Simon. Next week is Ted Danson. These are all people who I care about, want to talk to, who either I know a little bit or know a lot. And so it's really about. These are conversations I wouldn't have unless I booked them for a podcast.

[A]

Right.

[C]

I can't just call Ted Danson, be like, hey, man, you want to talk for an hour? I don't know him like that yet, but. And then as I was sort of getting into the mulling it over, I realized Marc Maron had retired and somebody needs to make male led comedian podcasts great again. All right.

[A]

That's right.

[C]

Somebody needs to step into the hole that Mark Marin left behind. We can't let Joe Rogan take it over.

[A]

So nature abhors a vacuum, right?

[C]

Nature abhors a sensitive, liberal male vacuum.

[A]

There you go. And you're here to fill it.

[C]

A progressive man with jokes.

[A]

We're talking to W. Kamau Bell about his new podcast here on Livewire this week. We're at the Patricia Reeser center for the Arts in Beaverton, Oregon. We've got to take a very quick break, but stick around much more. Livewire coming your way in just a moment. Welcome back to Livewire from prx. We're at the Patricia Reeser center for the Arts in Beaverton, Oregon. We're talking to W. Kamau Bell about his new podcast, who's With Me? He's also got a substack titled who's With Me? That's really, really great. A good read. You are just starting to release some episodes of the show and as we mentioned, the Actor Delroy Lindo was one of your first guests. Do you get nervous before talking to somebody like that?

[C]

I mean, yes. I mean, I get nervous all the time. I'm just a nervous person.

[A]

Really? You don't seem. When in my knowing you, you don't come off as nervous. Are you hiding it?

[C]

I mean, I'm 6 4, so people just get nervous around me so they don't see my nerves. But inside I'm like, yeah, yeah. I mean, I don't want people to feel like I'm wasting their time. Is really. That's. I don't want. So Delroy Lindo, I'd met him a couple times. We sort of became friendly but not friends. And I'm the kind of podcast host who, like, I text you go, if what do you need to drink? And he was like, pineapple juice. I'm like, I don't have pineapple juice. So I ran out and ran to gas station, to gas station to find that man some pineapple juice.

[A]

That is a very random backstage drink request.

[C]

He's Delaware Lindo. He's the Academy nominated actor. If he wants pineapple juice, yeah, we're

[A]

getting him pineapple juice.

[C]

I'm cutting out my swears.

[A]

Thank you.

[C]

No. So like, like, I had Kristen Kish was a guest on the podcast, and I got a text from her assistant saying Kristen wanted a coffee. And I brought the coffee and I gave it to Chris. How's the coffee? She's like, wait, you got the coffee? It's like, you wanted coffee. I had to go get the coffee.

[A]

So I'd like to point out that backstage here at the Reaser, when I went into the green room, Kamau was also filling the coffee maker with water as a guest here. You are really on the ball with the coffee.

[C]

That's also a function of being a husband. And if there's no water in the coffee maker in my house, I get. That's my problem. So my wife will not stand for that.

[D]

So.

[C]

Yes.

[D]

Are you.

[A]

One of the things that I've noticed about how you were introduced often for interviews and other things is that they're like, W. Kamau Bell. He'll just talk to anyone. He'll talk to the kkk. He loves it. It's his favorite thing.

[C]

He loves it.

[A]

He gets more power from talking to people that have horrible points of view. Are you like, Are you kind of like, ready? Have you taken a break from that? Is it nice to talk to people that you actually like, are excited to talk to versus someone that you're gonna have to have almost like a, you know, I don't know, a sort of verbal cage match with.

[C]

I do like intentional conversations. I don't mind conversations where we might have, like, actual disagreements, as long as they're legit good faith disagreements. And I think with the kkk, they really don't like black people. So that's a good faith disagreement. They're not pretending. They're not pretending. So. That's a very. That's a very Oregony Portland area response right there. I know we're not Portland proper, but, you know. Yes, it's a very. So. But the funny thing about that specifically is that. So we did the first episode of United, shades of me talking to the clan. And I would say every season we were on for seven years, every season. The top of every season, CNN would be like, so you think you might want to talk to the Klan again?

[A]

I know, right?

[C]

How about the Klan? I was like, what are we doing? Where are they now? Klan edition.

[A]

Is that what we're going to do?

[C]

I think they're still clanning. Some of them are in Trump's cabinet.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Too soon. What was that?

[B]

Too right now.

[A]

But I mean, are you then like, I don't want to say annoyed with, but are you. Did you ever mean to take on the reputation as the guy who goes and talks to people who have politically and culturally very toxic opinions?

[C]

No. I talked to the Klan because I was a guy without a job, whose wife was pregnant with our second kid and I needed a job.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

If I had said if I thought country club was gonna give me the job, I would've talked to golfers at the country club.

[A]

Right, right.

[C]

I was pretty sure that at the time. Here's the bar. It was Bourdain at CNN who was doing all kinds of things. It was Lisa Ling who was an actual journalist. And it was like Morgan Spurlock who was really doing these deep dives into people. I was like, I got to find a move that they're not going to do.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

And so really it was like, I suggested the Klan. And I don't. I mean, I talked to like, people, people. Islamophobes. I talked to anti gay people. I talked to lots of people. But it's not about putting myself in. People give me a lot of credit for myself in dangerous situations. And I think. But I. It was. I don't want to do that.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Really. At this point, the whole idea behind who's with me is like, we really know there's a lot of people in this country who are against us. And I want to know who's with me. We may have nuanced disagreements, but I just want to know if you're with me, we can figure it out.

[A]

Yeah. Did you get your start in stand up comedy? Was that your first? Kind of. Because you do a bunch of different things. But I still think of you because back when I met you, you were doing stand up a lot.

[C]

Yeah, I did get, it's funny to say my start. I was so bad for so many years. Yes, I did. I wanted to be a stand up comedian because of Eddie Murphy on Saturday Night Live. And I actually took a break for five years, but I came back last year. At the core of all of this is actually a stand up comedian. So if there was no such thing as white supremacy and racism in America, I would be an only child stand up comedian.

[A]

You got three daughters and I've heard you've been bringing them on stage. Sometimes when you do stand up or they're like performing with you, how does that work?

[C]

Yeah. So my oldest daughter, who just turned 15, sings and plays guitar and is a very, like, artful and popular person, which is weird for me. Cause I wasn't. So sometimes I'm intimidated by her. She's very like, easy in the world and thinks everybody likes her all the time. And they do. I don't know how to deal with her. My middle kid is like a little bit like me, where she's in her head all the time. So I would. But she wants to. She would want to come to the shows. And so I'd bring her to the shows and she would sit in a booth above the stage. And sometimes I would check in with her, like, how was that joke? Was that good? And she would talk back and. And then sometimes she would correct me. And then one time I told a story, she's like, that's not how it went. And so she finished it and it was funnier that way. So then we moved to a bigger theater at the Berkeley Rep, which was like several hundred people. And I was like, you need a seat on stage. And so she had a seat on stage where she had a spotlight and she had her notebook. Cause she would count every time I swore. And then she would come up and do a couple bits with me. I mean, it's the greatest thing ever. I mean, it's just like, you know, these kids like to eat every day. They might as well help make the money, you know what I'm saying?

[D]

Do they?

[C]

And it puts musician of not Being the stand up comedian who leaves his family goes to stand up comedy.

[D]

Right.

[C]

Because that always end up with the special. Like, well, I'm divorced now and so I don't really want to do that special.

[A]

Do your kids think that you are funny?

[C]

Yes.

[A]

That's.

[B]

Congratulations.

[C]

Yeah, there's. I mean, first of all, I am funny. I don't like the question.

[A]

Really. Well, I was hoping that you were going to say no so that it would make the fact that my daughter has never thought I was funny. Just what kids, you know. But you're saying no.

[C]

If you're objective, they don't think I'm cool, but they will laugh at me.

[A]

At you or with you?

[C]

I'm a comedian. If it's at. I'm taking the laugh. I'm owning the laugh. I did that on purpose. Thank you for that. No, they will laugh. No. And then they will do things that I'm like, can I borrow that and do that on stage? And then I have to negotiate. My seven year old, I have to. Every time I want a joke, I have to take her to the candy shop and she gets whatever she wants. Yeah, yeah. So no, we are a funny family.

[A]

Were you a jokey kid? Were you using comedy as some sort of, I don't know, way to get more allowance from your parents or stave off bullies or whatever?

[C]

No, no. Again, I'm an only child. I was mostly raised by my mom. I mean, my dad was around, he was in Alabama, but it was mostly a single parent home. I was a really quiet kid and didn't. I would make my mom laugh, but if other people came in, she'd be like, do that thing. I'd be like, no. And so she'd be like, but yeah. The biggest laugh I ever got from my dad for years was when I told him I was doing stand up comedy. He was like, but you were never funny. You're not. He told other people, like, I don't know, Kamau. They were like, I don't know what you're talking about. He told my cousin Nora, his niece, that I was doing stand up comedy. She goes, yeah, Kamau's always funny. Nora professionally goes by N.K. jemisin.

[A]

Oh, wow.

[C]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. N.K. jemisin is my cousin. Like, we grew up together, so.

[A]

Oh, wow.

[C]

And I let her know I was funny and I gave her all her ideas for her books. Anyway, let's talk about how funny is she? She's not that funny. She's very serious.

[A]

We're talking to W. Kamau Bell On Livewire this week. Speaking of comedy, or what is currently passing for a version of comedy, Netflix has really gotten into these celebrity roasts. They had the roast of Tom Brady, and they recently had the roast of Kevin Hart, which involved a number of white comedians making jokes. And if you didn't see it, first of all, congratulations. But this is on Netflix. White comedians making jokes about the murder of George Floyd and about lynching and things like that. I mean, I guess we can agree that cancel culture is not a real thing, because those comedians are not.

[C]

Once again, more proof. Cancel culture is not real. If we needed more proof. Yeah, more proof.

[A]

I mean, what. What do you make of the sort of state of comedy, at least as it relates to that story and what's going on with that?

[C]

First of all, I'm just curious because this is a very Oregon room. How many people here know the Kevin Hart roast? Watch some piece of it by applause? That's what I was expecting. Okay, so Netflix is a platform. Okay. So you remember tv. So I would say the bigger story for a room like this is the idea that, like, there was a time when TV wanted our respect, and it was about making good things that you wanted to see and prestige and prestige. Television was a big thing. Now the thing that used to be TV just wants your attention. And so Netflix, which is the biggest platform in the world, will just do things to get your eyeballs. So the biggest indicator that they don't care about whether or not you like the Kevin Hart roast and is that it was nearly three hours long. Yeah, you don't need three hours of anything that is not like, doesn't have Martin Scorsese's name at the end of it or something. You know what I mean?

[A]

And sometimes not even that.

[C]

Not even that. Yeah. It's just the fact that three hours of comics saying the meanest things they can say about each other. And the roasts come from the Friars Club back in New York City, when it used to be a private invitation only affair with friends, and you all make fun of your friends, and it was a thing that happened in a room. Then in the 60s and 70s, Dean Martin had a roast show that was on TV, but it was still like this rat Pack group of friends making fun of each other. But roast jokes are always gonna be crass and racist and sexist and homophobic. That's just what they do. But then Comedy Central took them over, and they became about who's the biggest celebrity we can get and what. Comedians are just good writers at being mean and Then you get to the Netflix thing where there's now just a group of roast comedians who show up to say the meanest things, whether. And there's no spirit of like we're friends or there's anything happening. And then you have at the center of that is a comedian named Tony Hinchcliffe.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Fair. Who has never told a legitimately funny joke in his life.

[A]

And he's got this thing out of Austin called Kill Tony, which is this like very, very.

[C]

Which is. He turned an open mic into content. It's just open micrs going on stage. Yeah. And then they make fun of the open micrs, but again, because it's like a car wreck, Netflix is like, we'll air it.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

So because Netflix doesn't want. They want your attention. They don't want your respect. And that's the same thing with cbs. They want your attention, not your respect with the Bari Weiss and the Ellison's. So for me, part of starting the podcast was like, I want to find the small audience of people who still feel like I respect them and they want my respect too.

[A]

Yeah.

[C]

Because right now, the Kevin Hart roast has proven that it's not about even, even having talented people in a room doing what they do best. It's just about creating a car crash that we all can't look away from

[A]

and then talk about with all this earned media. Like, I mean, in a way, we're doing them exactly what they want also.

[C]

But I think we need to pay attention because Netflix also had Mike TYSON BOX A 20 year old. You know what I mean? Like, it's just like the biggest things they do is it's live and it lasts for hours and hours and I will be at home be like, it is on for free right now. I did already pay for the Netflix. I will cut and so. But I think we have to really be aware that like this is going to. This is coarsing our culture and it's no accident that's happening under the Trump administration.

[A]

Do you think this stuff is cyclical or comes in waves? In other words, we had a moment a few years ago where we were having meaningful conversations about like, hey, jokes matter. And again, nobody was really canceled. Louis CK sells out Madison Square Garden all the time. But there was.

[C]

He's got a Netflix special.

[A]

There was a conversation in the public space that was like, hey, when you say stuff on stage, we are allowed to respond to what you said on stage. That was a conversation that was happening. Some people were calling that wokeism or language police or whatever. Really, it was just a moment where there was some room to respond to what people were saying. And now we have white guys telling jokes about the most sort of inappropriate things, it would seem to me on Netflix. Are we gonna work through that cycle and get back to a discourse, or are we just. I mean, is this thing just gonna continue to go off the rails?

[C]

We're not gonna work through it if we don't work through fascism.

[A]

Okay.

[C]

Like, if we don't work through the fascist takeover of this country. I mean, Trump is literally having conversations about putting himself on the $250 bill.

[A]

Yes.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

And.

[C]

Which I was like, that's not even a thing. They're gonna invent a thing to put his face. So I think that's why I wanna connect it to the broader conversation. Cause I think there's this idea that in America, we go back and forth and there's like a pendulum. But, you know, people go to visit Rome for the ruins.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Wow.

[C]

And I don't think that. I don't think it's too much to say that eventually America might be a place like, remember when that place was a thing? Anyway, here we are in whatever the next place is. And I will happily be a refugee, whoever that is. I'm putting in my status. I'm a black people in America. I feel like we should be group refugees to wherever the next place is. We'll bring you culture and invent a new musical style.

[A]

You heard it here first. W. Kamau Bell, available to come to your country asap. Yeah, no, the podcast and the substack is. Who's with me? W. Kamau Bell, everybody. That was W. Kamau Bell recorded live at the Patricia Research center for the Arts in Beaverton, Oregon. Make sure you check out his podcast, who's with me? Wherever it is you cast your pods. Hey, special thanks this week to John Hopp of Sacramento, California, and. And Sigrid Casey of Portland, Oregon. John and Sigrid are part of the Livewire member community, and they are generously supporting our show with a donation each month. And that is a very big deal because it's literally how we are able to keep Livewire going is folks like Sigrid and John. So thank you so much for keeping Livewire in business. You're listening to Livewire.

[B]

All right.

[A]

Our next guest might be the most famous traveler since, I don't know, Gulliver. Although as far as we know, he has not been tied down by an army of tiny people yet. If that did happen, though, we'd hear about it on his wildly popular TV show, Rick Steves Europe. Or maybe on his public radio show or in one of the many guidebooks that he writes. Since 1973, he's spent at least a third of every year exploring Europe and bringing us all along with him. We consider him Livewire's official travel correspondent. This is the one and only Rick Steves recorded live at Benaroya hall in Seattle. This happened last year when we had you on the show was the closest thing to having, you know, Neil diamond or something people were throwing.

[B]

It's like a Tom Jones show.

[A]

Thank you. That's an even better comparison. Rick, welcome back to the show.

[D]

Thank you. I think the welcome is there's a lot of travelers in this room and this is a great traveling city.

[A]

Okay, so what have you been up to? Where in the world have you traveled since you were last on the show? About a year ago, I think a

[D]

year ago I was all excited about producing four one hour shows on what I consider the four greatest cities in Europe. We do 40 different itineraries with all the tours that I take around Europe. And there's four cities that get a one week tour dedicated just to them.

[A]

Okay, and what are those cities?

[D]

Three are predictable. London, Paris, Rome. And the fourth would be Istanbul.

[A]

Oh, wow.

[D]

I absolutely love all those cities. And it takes, you know, what we've done for 30 years on public television is make half hour episodes in a great city like that. It's very frustrating because you can't do the city in. If you try to do it in half hour, you're going to want to come back and do it again. And it's just all discombobulated. It needs an hour. So we went over to Europe and worked very hard filming in those cities and it was so much fun. And we did that. And that's just airing all over public broadcasting now. And we filmed the most decadent show I've ever made, which is a gourmet barge tour. Floating in a canal through Burgundy, past the best vineyards in the world.

[C]

Wow.

[D]

And it's just a boutique little hotel on a former industrial age barge that's turned into a two bedroom hotel. And there's a crew of three. The captain, the first mate and the chef. And you can. The cool thing about a barge tour is you can get out and walk or bike about the same speed as the barge. And you just tell the crew, I'll meet you three locks up the way. And a lot of people don't realize you could go from the Mediterranean to the Atlantic. Across France on canals because they got all these locks and they have a continental divide at the very top. I understand there's a long, long tunnel and then it just locks all the way. Stair stepping back down. You could go all the way to Moscow on rivers and barges from Marseille. I wouldn't want to do that. But you can.

[A]

You know, my mom, Susie Burbank is very envious of your job. Like when she's talking about that, the best job to have, she regularly mentions you because she's like, he's eaten this great food. He's in all these beautiful places. And I, as a person who also dabbles in some amount of television making. I try to explain. Yeah. But it is not as much fun as it looks when you're making the television versus when you're watching it on tv. What do people not understand about being Rick Steves when you're working in Europe making the TV show in particular?

[D]

Well, every show we've ever done has a great meal in it. That's sort of a requirement. I love that. But I don't, I can't remember eating one of those beautiful looking meals. Still hot. You know, it takes a while to shoot that. And you've got to get really good at just savoring what used to be hot food because the camera's on. You know what it's like when the camera's on and you're, you know, you're worried about stupid things like not stepping on the other person's lines. I'm really good at stepping on a quote. Rick, stop stepping on her lines. You know. Well, it's because I'm excited to talk. And when you converse, you step on each other's lines. That's kind of fun. But for TV you shouldn't do that. And you shouldn't do a lot of things when you're just trying to look natural while you're enjoying a great cold meal.

[A]

Yeah. And invariably you're posed in a really awkward position that you would not be in in regular life. But it looks better for the camera. It somehow is, you know, presenting better. Yeah. It's obviously a dream job, but it is work, right?

[D]

Oh, it's so intense work and I absolutely love it. It's a creative challenge. You can never get it done. It takes six days to produce a half hour show. We've produced 150 of those. And every time you see me on my show, I always with a local guide. Here's my friend and fellow tour guide, Alfio, or my friend and fellow tour Guide Christina. And people wonder how I know all these people and have all these friends, but I'm just paying them to be my friends, you see. And it's one of the great things is to hang out with these wonderful people who are so smart. And guides are big personalities. They love their work. And I just. That's the delight for me is to be able to, over there, work with my crew. We have a real small crew, the cameraman, the producer and me. And then usually one guide with us. But then on top of that, there's writing the guidebooks and updating that material. And that's my favorite part of my work. And I do it alone, except for the guide I'm working with in that space city. And it's just a big garden to take care of when you've got guidebooks for all of Europe and you gotta go and make sure everything is just right, pull out all the weeds and make sure the flowers are all together and so on. And you get a lot of feedback from people. I'm lucky. I get work where I get direct feedback from people who are enjoying what I'm doing or not. And I hear about it, and I just love that work. So I could stop doing that if I wanted to now, but I just. It's the most enjoyable thing for me.

[A]

Do people reach out to you if they went somewhere that's recommended by you, either on the TV show or the guidebook, and then they don't have a good time. Do they tell you, like, you should take that out of the book more often?

[D]

They'll tell me, why don't you do this? I see that I went to and I didn't have a good time, and it's not in my book. And people think, if I do Spain, I should have Valencia, or if I do Italy, I should have Bologna. Those are two great cities. But my rationale is Americans have the shortest vacations in the rich world, and we've got to cut through the superlatives and understand how to use our vacation time smartly. And I do not do things that don't make the cut for the first 30 days in that country.

[A]

So you're really thinking about this in a practical way of like, you would like. I know this about you. More Americans to travel abroad more and experience. Experience more of the world. And if you can, advise them in a way that is efficient for them and that encourages that happening, that's what you're trying to do.

[D]

Yes. The typical American, when they travel, they go to Orlando, they go to Vegas they go to Cancun, they go to Mazatlan, they go back to Orlando. There's only one guidebook that outsells my Rick Steves Italy book in the whole publishing world in the United States, and it's the guidebook to Disney World, and that is La La Land. And it's really good for La La Land. But I write for a smaller market. It's called Reality Travel. But my challenge is to get people just go to a country that speaks a different language, use your passport and have a good time. If they don't have a good time, they'll go back home and never try it again. But I think a good traveler is going to find a way to go again and again and again, and pretty soon they become a friend with the world. They have this dual citizenship, a keener appreciation of what it means to be an American as well as kind of a global citizenship. And I think that makes the world a better place.

[A]

We are at Benaroya hall in Seattle, Washington this week and we are talking to Rick Steves. I have been watching this show called Pluribus lately. It's a big hit show and they keep mentioning you. I'm wondering if you've been hearing about this. Do you know that you're being mentioned on Pluribus a lot?

[D]

It's the weirdest thing, because if you haven't seen Pluribus, it's a dystopian, horrible world where everybody has become, like, robotic except for 12 people.

[A]

Yes.

[D]

And there's only one little glimpse of normal, what we consider happy go lucky life. And it's Rick Steves travel guidebooks now. I have no idea. I'm not into that whole world. I don't know. Somebody writing that script must have thought there's a lot of options we could choose from. What random person are we going to include in this crazy script? And of course, people are starting to tell me about it. And it's a cool show.

[B]

So you had no idea?

[D]

I had no idea. Wow. I mean, because, you know, you get in, you get in on Jeopardy, you get in the New York Times crossword puzzle, you get Luke Burbank show. But to be in a dystopian nightmare where they only have one little memory of the life they once had and it keeps coming back to a hotel they went to because of my guidebook. Yeah, that's weird.

[A]

Which is, by the way, I don't even know if it's a hotel you would have recommended. It's like an ice. Like a crazy ice hotel.

[D]

That was the funny thing, because that's the last place I would recommend. So they didn't really know. They probably didn't travel on my guidebook, but they figured some people have.

[A]

You don't seem like a person who's particularly obsessed with yourself or certainly obsessed with being famous, and yet you've found yourself a really known person, at least in a lot of places.

[D]

Well, I absolutely love it. It's a compliment because they've enjoyed their travels. I get people, just. People have so much fun traveling. They want to thank somebody for it. And even if I don't write about it, they'll thank me for the idea of travel. Just the. Yeah, I don't know why. And it's people. People need encouragement to get out there. People need, you know, people want to have somebody to cut through the superlatives. That's a big part of the job, is you only have a month in England. You should not go to Oxford and Cambridge. You should go to one or the other. And then how to make that choice. I get so tired of hearing people say, you could spend a lifetime in Florence. Well, of course you could, but I'm an American. I have 1.5 days now. How should I use that time? You see? So I've really made a point of trying to understand the fears and apprehensions of my travelers. And I speak only English. And I think that's a real plus for me because I know what it's like to be confused in Estonia.

[A]

Well, I'm wondering if you've detected a shift at all as an American traveling in Europe when our current government has done so much to really alienate other countries and really change the image of America in the world. Is that something that you can feel palpably in the experience of being in America and other places?

[D]

You know, I go around the country giving a lot of talks, and that's on people's minds. They're nervous about going to Europe. And you would think you should be nervous about going to countries that have been our friends for generations. And suddenly, for no apparent reason, well, for no logical reason, we've turned our backs on these friends. They're somewhere between disappointed and betrayed. And when we go over there, you'd think they might be upset with us. But I'll tell you, we take 30,000Americans around Europe on our tours every year. I've got 150 European guides that do these tours for us. And I'm in close touch with the people that trust us with their vacations and these guides. And I've not heard a peep about anybody who's angry at a particular American because of what our president is doing to our brand of America. Around the world, Europeans are confused, they're curious, they're concerned. All of them almost have had a chance where they elected somebody that was kind of buffoonish or embarrassing.

[A]

Right. Because they're older countries. So they've just have a longer life cycle. And they've almost all of them had somebody like this who somehow got the reins at some point.

[D]

But Luke, very few have done it twice. So it really saddens me. It's complicated for our guides in Europe to because there's a divide. There's a metaphorical wall in our country, just like there's a wall in Belfast and there's a wall in Jerusalem and so on. And we have in travel and tourism, there's a very up to date notion of quality guiding. It's called dual narrative tourism. You can't visit a place with a wall and have any valid opinion about that wall unless you've talked to people on both sides of the wall. Talk to a Catholic community person, talk to a Protestant community person and then you understand what's the dynamic in Belfast. Go to the Holy Land, talk to an Israeli guide and talk to a Palestinian guide. Then you can have an opinion of that wall. And there are metaphorical walls all around the country and we've got one in our country, too. And we need to make a point of having that dual narrative approach so we can understand the baggage of other people and their worldview. And I think it's very constructive and it's a beautiful challenge.

[A]

You're listening to LIVEWIRE from prx. We are talking to the travel writer Rick Steves. We've got to take a quick break, but don't go anywhere. Coming up, more conversation with Rick where he will actually reveal his favorite countries to visit. Doesn't like to do that. He's going to do it for us here on Livewire in a moment. Stay with us. Welcome back to livewire. I'm your host Luke Burbank, here with Elena Passarello. We are talking to the travel writer Rick Steves, recorded live at Benaroya hall in Seattle. Let's jump back into that conversation now. Is there anywhere left on planet Earth that you would really like to visit and haven't?

[D]

There are so many places I would like to visit that I haven't. But when I have to make a decision about where I'm going to go, it's a very strange thing. If you write Guidebooks or make TV shows or take tours. And people like what you do. You feel burdened in a beautiful way. You gotta play the responsibility to do it better. So Europe is my beat, even though my favorite countries would be India, Indonesia, Japan, Sri Lanka. But I go to Europe because it's a big market. It's the wading pool for world exploration. I'm well connected there. I've got a degree in European history, I've got friends and tour guides all over. And I can help Americans venture beyond Orlando. And it's just, I never get tired of it. Every year or two I find new frontiers in travel fun in Europe that I didn't even consider before. And it's good news because a lot of people try to see everything in one trip. And I say that's folly. You're just going to be frustrated. Enjoy what you can. Be efficient and don't go too slow and don't go too fast. You can cover a lot of. But you'll never exhaust Europe for what it has to offer. And that is a blessing. The idea that you can learn more about your home sometimes by leaving it and looking at it from a distance. The Same reason Mohammed 1400 years ago said, don't tell me how educated you are, tell me how much you've traveled. That's the pinnacle of travel. That's what I call travel as a political act. And that's the theme of my talk when I go around the country. And that's what I encourage my European guides to enjoy sharing with their Americans to help them embrace culture shock. A lot of people try to avoid culture shock, but it's a constructive thing. It just needs to be curated, you see. And that's what really is raising the bar for a guide. Because the default is fun in the sun and duty free shopping and just go to the beach. And that's okay. But that's being a tourist. And then you can be a traveler and you can be a pilgrim. You can see the road as playground, the road as school, or the road as church or mosque or synagogue. And the good thing is you don't have to do all of any of it. You can mix it up any way you like. That just carbonates the travel experience.

[A]

That's incredible news. Rick Steves, thank you so much for coming on Livewire. That was the legend the goat Rick Steves recorded live at Benaroya hall in Seattle. You can find out what Rick is up to, and he's always up to something. [e-mail]. You are listening to Livewire. Before we get to this week's musical performance from Edna Vasquez, a little preview of what we are doing on the program. Next week we are going to be talking to Livewire royalty. That's right, the one, the only Paul F. Tompkins is going to stop by. You probably know Paul from his many, many podcasts including Spontanea Nation and Comedy Bang Bang. He's also got his live variety show that he tours around. It's called Varietyopia. It's incredible. We're going to hear about that and also we're going to have a little surprise during the program. It involves glitter which this interview with Paul was recorded a good while ago at this point. And I will tell you this, I am still finding pieces of glitter in my laptop computer from this event that you are going to hear next week on the show. Then we're going to hear some music from our friend Macleet, the singer songwriter who blends jazz, soul, folk and influences from her East African roots in Ethiopia. It's going to be a corker of a show next week. Don't miss it. In the meantime, our musical guest this week was born in Jalisco, Mexico, which is the birthplace of mariachi, which is going to be relevant in a moment. She was immersed there in traditional Mexican folk music from childhood. As a teenager she relocated to Portland and since 2017 she's toured internationally as a special guest singer with Pink Martini, performing at Carnegie hall and Royal Albert hall among many other places. Her debut album of traditional Mexican music, Te Esperaba, is out and available right now and she is the rare woman leading a traditionally male dominated mariachi ensemble. She's been inspiring people to follow their musical dreams, including some young folks from Mariachi Tradicion, which is an ensemble of high school students from Forest Grove, Oregon who joined Edna Vazquez on stage at Revolution hall in Portland, Oregon. Listen to this Edna. What song are we going to hear?

[D]

We are going to hear Lindo Colima, which speaks about a region, the beautifulness of a region. So Colima is in the west coast

[A]

of Mexico, near towards the Pacific Ocean

[D]

in the middle of the Mexican Republic. Soft maker.

[C]

Ay la. Thank you.

[D]

Thank you so much. Thank you. This is forest girl high school mariachi.

[A]

That was Edna Vasquez and the kids from Mariachi Tradicion recorded live at Revolution hall in Portland, Oregon. Her latest album, Te Esperaba is out and available right now. That is gonna do it for this week's episode of Livewire. A huge thanks to our guests w Kamau Bell, Rick Steves and Edna Vazquez, plus Mariachi Tradicione.

[B]

Lara Haddon is our executive producer and Melanie Savchenko is our producer and editor. Eben Hoffer is our technical director, Trey Hester is our assistant editor and Ashley park is our marketing manager.

[A]

Our house sound is By D. Neal Blake and our house band is Ethan Fox Tucker, Sam Pinkerton, Al Alves and A. Walker Spring, who also composes our music. This week's episode was mixed by Eben Hoffer and Trey Hester.

[B]

Additional funding provided by the Marie Lamp from Charitable Foundation Livewire was created by Robin Tenenbaum and Kate Sokoloff.

[A]

This week we'd like to thank members John Hopp of Sacramento, California and Sigrid Casey of Portland, Oregon. For more information about our show or how you can listen to our podcast, head on over tolivewireradio.org I'm Luke Burbank for Elena Passarello and the whole Livewire team. Thank you for listening and we will see you next week. Hey, if you appreciate the work that Livewire is doing to amplify riveting and unexpected voices to a national audience, and I gotta tell you, it's a big audience these days, please, please, please consider offering some monthly support by becoming a member of our league of Extraordinary Listeners. Here's how it works. Membership starts at just five bucks a month and there are great perks at every level, including a special shout out on the broadcast. Impress your friends by being shouted out on Livewire. It means the world to us and really does make it possible possible for us to do the show. So please, if you can help, support us by visiting livewireradio. Org memberships.

[B]

From prx.