Trusting God’s Truth to Live a Life of PURPOSE

Summary

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Living Influence with Bill Thrall and Scott Boyd

Episode: Trusting God’s Truth to Live a Life of PURPOSE
Date: September 18, 2025

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Episode Overview

This episode of Living Influence explores the transformative power of trusting in God’s truth to understand personal identity and purpose. Bill Thrall, Scott Boyd, and guest contributors reflect on how living from a place of spiritual freedom—rooted in God’s view rather than self-limiting beliefs—enables a life rich in meaning, fulfillment, and authentic influence. The hosts challenge cultural and theological misconceptions about personal worth and godliness, sharing personal stories and scriptural insights to illuminate a path toward genuine freedom and purpose.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Scriptural Basis for Freedom and Purpose

• Galatians 5:13 is central: "For you were called to freedom..."
  • Scott: “As I read that, I think, now, why does Paul say, only do not use your freedom as an opportunity for the flesh?... Because we’re really free.” (00:29)
• Freedom isn’t about self-indulgence, but rather the opportunity, through love, to serve one another; this is the context in which true purpose flourishes.

Freedom Versus Bondage: Living From New Identity

• Bill: Raises the pivotal question—“Am I experiencing freedom or do I function from a position of bondage?” (01:43)
  • Identifies a pattern: People return to shame or bondage “because it’s familiar.” (02:12)
  • Challenges listeners: “What if I could begin to trust who God says I am and what Jesus has done for me?” (02:25)
• Living from a new identity means letting go of condemnation and embracing the possibilities God has for each person.

Quote:

“But what if the way out’s already been provided? What if I now got to live into the possibilities of God for me?”
— Bill Thrall (04:35)

The Experience of Purpose and Focus

• Bill's personal story (03:54):
  • Describes his conversion at 17 and a profound encounter at 19, where he received a sense of “destiny.”
  • Advocates asking God to “begin to reveal… the possibilities that you have for my life.” (05:03)
  • Living in purpose gives the “freedom to say no” to distractions, focusing on God’s intended path. (05:17)

Quote:

“For many years that focus has given me the freedom to say no to a lot of stuff because it doesn't fit the purpose that God has for me. That’s... freeing.”
— Bill Thrall (05:21)

Breaking the “Worm Theology”

• Bill critiques the mindset that devalues personal worth (“worm theology”):

  “Lots of Christians are trapped in it. It’s like: ‘woe is me, there’s nothing good about me, God can’t use me.’ That’s all garbage. That’s not who you are.” (06:17)

• Instead, God sees great value and capability in each person. Living into that identity is honoring to God.

The Freedom to Risk, Say Yes, and Experience Joy

• Grace: Uses the metaphor of the lion who stays in his cage even after it’s opened (08:06):

  “He stays because that's what he's comfortable with. That's what he knows... I want to step out of that cage.”

• The call is to risk embracing freedom, saying “yes” to the unknown—participating in God’s endless purposes.

From Striving to Trust

• Scott: Bondage means “always working on trying to be better,” leading to indecision and joylessness (09:02, 09:17)
• Grace: Invites starting from the assumption that the Holy Spirit is active: “Shouldn’t I just start with the assumption God is talking to me? ... What if it’s God’s and maybe I should act on it?” (09:32)
• Embracing grace leads to both more purpose and energy, as opposed to self-generated striving.

Quote:

“It brings the joy of the Lord as your strength… It’s so much more than when you’re trying to self-generate it.”
— Grace (10:05)

Living Outwardly and Changing the World

• Bill: Instead of focusing on sin management, look outward:

  “The early church... changed the world. You want something to do, try that…” (10:12)

• God’s purpose is not small or restrictive, but expansive and world-changing.

Personal Growth: Moving from Performance to Enjoyment

• Scott shares a personal story of moving from anxiety and self-consciousness around his spiritual heroes to relaxed enjoyment:

  “I just was… comfortable. I wasn't worried about what I was going to say… I was just enjoying…” (11:49)

  • This transformation came through freedom from performance and trust in God’s acceptance.

Enjoying Life in Christ

• Bill: God’s freedom includes enjoying everyday life:

  “We play gin rummy a lot... We fish together... We enjoy life. Could we just break the bondage of stereotyping godliness and let godliness be the freedom of who we are?” (12:22)

• Authentic godliness is not restrictive but abundant and joyful.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Scott on risking freedom:

  “Freedom is where we begin to risk… That’s where we discover he has changed our heart.” (01:20)

• Bill on shame and transformation:

  “When I see myself in my shame, it’s because I’m convinced my heart is evil. But what if your heart were new?” (07:15)

• Grace on the lion’s cage:

  “The lion... finally released… stays because that’s what he's comfortable with… I want to step out of that cage. Then it’s endless. The purposes of God are vast and endless and full of meaning.” (08:06–08:36)

• Scott on living from freedom:

  “When I’m in freedom, I just make decisions.” (09:17)

• Bill on practical godliness:

  “We’re enjoying the freedom we have in Christ because we have the freedom to do things we like... could we just break the bondage of stereotyping godliness?” (13:22)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:29 — Freedom explained: scriptural grounding and practical impact
• 01:43 — Bill’s central question: freedom vs. bondage
• 03:54 — Bill’s story of destiny and purpose
• 05:21 — The freedom to say “no” and focus
• 06:17 — Dismantling “worm theology”
• 08:06 — Grace’s lion-in-the-cage metaphor
• 09:02–09:37 — From self-improvement to trusting God’s work in us
• 10:12 — Purpose beyond managing sin: changing the world
• 11:49 — Scott on moving from performance to true enjoyment
• 12:22–13:22 — Redefining godliness: enjoying freedom in Christ

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Conclusion

In this episode, Bill, Scott, and their guests urge listeners to step out of familiar patterns of shame and striving, embrace the freedom Christ offers, and live boldly into the unique, meaningful purposes God has designed for each one. They invite self-reflection, risk-taking, and a joyful pursuit of God’s possibilities—anchored not in performance, but in the unshakeable truth of who God says we are.

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Transcript

[Bill Thrall]

Freedom.

[Scott]

Welcome to living Influence. I tell you what, this is one of my topics that I love. Galatians 5, 13. For you were called to freedom. Brothers only do not use your freedom as an opportunity for the flesh, but through love, serve one another.

[John]

Amen.

[Scott]

As I read that, I think, now, why does Paul say, only do not use your freedom as an opportunity for the flesh? And it's because we're really free.

[John]

Amen.

[Scott]

And so this I can. That we've been talking about, right?

[Bill Thrall]

It.

[Scott]

It really fits. It really matters. We are free.

[John]

Yeah.

[Scott]

And because we're free, let's live life. Let's enjoy life. You know, the, The. The kids or the guys in the class, the young people in the class of. Of teaching grace. And they go, well, you mean I don't have to do anything? That's their response. Because everything they've been doing has been trying to stop sinning.

[Bill Thrall]

Exactly.

[Scott]

And it's like, well, no, actually, you just get to begin to live life.

[John]

Amen.

[Scott]

By loving, by living, by enjoying the gifts God gives us.

[John]

Beautiful.

[Scott]

Freedom is a fun concept to me. Freedom is where we begin to risk. When we begin to risk trusting what God says is true about us. And we act in freedom. That's where we discover he has changed our heart.

[John]

Amen.

[Bill Thrall]

Well said.

[John]

Amen. Amen.

[Scott]

So where would you take this bill from? From there.

[Bill Thrall]

Thank you. I guess it just. It causes me. I kind of use my hands, but it kind of causes me to real ask something. The question I ask is, am I experiencing freedom or do I function from a position of bondage? Do I do that?

[Scott]

Yeah.

[Bill Thrall]

Now, if I'm experiencing freedom, it's because something's true about me.

[Scott]

Right.

[Bill Thrall]

I no longer feel condemned.

[Scott]

Yeah.

[Bill Thrall]

In our last episode, I talked about my guy being jail. He knows he's in bond, he's in jail. Well, let's say he gets out of jail, he's free. He no longer has to live in jail. Now, there's a statistic on how true it is, But I think 70 or 80% of all inmates return to jail. It's such an ugly picture. But you know what? We return to shame because it's familiar. But what if I could begin to trust who God says I am and what Jesus has done for me? So I want to review that with us. How much am I convinced Jesus is capable of doing for my benefit? Am I really convinced that he took upon him my shame? Is that true of me? Or is. Is it because it's so familiar to me that I keep returning to it? Or is there a new way for me to see who my reality. What. What if I began. You've said this a couple times, Scott. What if I began to actually live out of who he says I am? That would be freedom. What if, gosh, without having to practice it, it was a natural thing for me to act with love toward others. There's a freedom in that. Yeah, a huge freedom in that. What if. What if I begin to. To imagine that God actually chose Bill Thrall for eternal purposes? What if I believe that, you know, if I believe that there's a freedom.

[Scott]

In that, there's a lightness to life?

[Bill Thrall]

There is. I like that. There's a lightness to life. I became a Christian. I was 17 and, and I'll never forget sitting at my brother's couch in Wisconsin, Milwaukee, and, and praying a prayer, a 17 year old young person's prayer. But I remember my prayer was almost this verbatim. I'm inviting the God of the universe into my heart. It must make a difference. When I was 19, I had this almost profound sense. I was at Bible college at the time. A profound sense of a meeting with God in which I had. I left that meeting with just a profound sense of destiny. I got in touch with what I believed was the possibilities of God for me. Could I say to all of us, wouldn't it be a wonderful way to break the bondage of this nonsense if we had the freedom to say to our God, would you begin to reveal to me the possibilities that you have for my life? See, when you're in bondage, there's no possibilities. You just want a way out. You don't know, you don't think beyond that. But what if the way out's already been provided? What if I now got to live into the possibilities of God for me? And living into the possibilities of God for me has given me an incredible freedom.

[Scott]

Yeah, yeah.

[Bill Thrall]

You know, it's interesting. One of the freedoms it gave me almost as a side gift, but a freedom it gave me is. It caused, it gave me a focus. And for many years that focus has given me the freedom to say no to a lot of stuff because it doesn't fit the purpose that God has for me. That's. You can't believe how freeing that is. Just the freedom to say no. Yeah, just the freedom to say no. Imagine God designed us to not only declare this the true about us, but to give us the ability to live in it by trusting him with it. And then we read that earlier about Ephesians, but What if my heart really believed that because of now who I am in Christ, I can. Listen carefully. I can honor the Lord by living into who he says I am. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. What? You can honor the Lord by living into who he says you are? Absolutely. Teasingly. I call a theology a worm theology. Lots of Christians are trapped in it. It's like, woe is me. There's nothing good about me. Oh, God can't use me. That's all garbage. That's not who you are. That's garbage. That's made up theology. That's what man wants you to think about you. That's what God. That's not what God thinks about you. God has some amazing value in you, and he's given you the ability to can. To do it beyond anything, beyond anything I could have ever dreamt. I have experienced amazing. The purposes of God in me. And God's done things, taken me places I met with people, et cetera, et cetera. Now, last time we were together, I made a statement and I want to repeat it right now. When I see myself in my shame, it's because I'm convinced my heart is evil. But what if your heart were new? And in a new heart you could see yourself clearly, see God clearly and trust God with who you are? Huh? That's what I think of Audemars when you ask me that. It just. That's what triggers in me. All of that's triggered in me.

[Grace]

One of my favorite books, and I've told you both this many times that you wrote. It's called the Ascent of a Leader.

[John]

Yes.

[Grace]

I love that concept because at the end, it's about stepping into the purposes God has for you.

[Bill Thrall]

Absolutely.

[Grace]

Destiny.

[Bill Thrall]

Absolutely.

[Grace]

As an idealist, just who I am, my personality. I'm always craving meaning.

[Bill Thrall]

Yes.

[Grace]

And purpose. And God's purpose and the freedom that comes from that. This image has been in my mind the last few minutes of the lion who's in the cage, right. At the zoo or whatever, finally released. Like the shackles are off, the doors open. And he stays. Yeah, he just stays because that's what he's comfortable with. That's what he knows.

[Bill Thrall]

That's what's familiar.

[Grace]

That's what's familiar. He may go check it out. I was like, no, I'm going to go back. I want to step out of that cage.

[John]

Amen.

[Grace]

And then you have that. Then it's endless.

[John]

Yeah.

[Grace]

The purposes of God are vast and endless and full of. Full of meaning.

[Bill Thrall]

Absolutely.

[Grace]

And then what you were just saying too. And then he gets to just take your giftedness and focus you.

[John]

Amen.

[Grace]

But it starts with that saying yes, saying yes to freedom.

[John]

Amen.

[Bill Thrall]

I love that. I love that imagery.

[Scott]

Yeah. The amazing thing is when, when you're in bondage, you're always working on trying to be better.

[Bill Thrall]

Yeah.

[Scott]

You know, always that's, that's the bondage you're in. Right. Is I'm always working on trying to be better. Because I'm always working on trying to be better. Any thought that I have, I have to think about. I have to analyze, is it right?

[Bill Thrall]

Is it okay?

[Scott]

Is it right? Yeah. It truly slows me down. It keeps me from making decisions. And when I'm in freedom, I just make decisions.

[Grace]

Well, you've said this so well. It's like if the Holy Spirit lives inside me.

[John]

Yeah.

[Grace]

Shouldn't I just start with the assumption God is talking to me?

[Bill Thrall]

Right. Yeah.

[Grace]

It's his thoughts.

[Scott]

If I'm having this thought, what if it's God's and maybe I should act on it? And so for me, to the person that says, well, with grace, what do you mean, what do I do? Is there anything for me to do? And it's like, oh my gosh, there's going to be more for you to do than you could imagine because you're going to step into what God has for you.

[John]

Yeah.

[Scott]

That's going to come with, well, maybe, maybe you should do this. And so you act on that and.

[Grace]

It brings the joy of the Lord as your strength. You talking about the energy that you can have when you have freedom. It's so much more than when you're trying to self generate it.

[Bill Thrall]

Think of the early church. The person who asked, well, what would I do? Well, here's something for you to be challenged with. I'll tell you what the early church did. They changed the world. You want something to do, try that change. No, I want to work on something. As what? As minor is the sin you do. Wait a minute, you got the perspective all screwed up. That's a little thing. Why don't you turn out to hear and look at this world out here?

[John]

Wow.

[Bill Thrall]

God wants you to be a vehicle in his hands to change the world. That's what they believed.

[Scott]

And there's another area that just as significant because it, it fuels you. But so I read your book the cure probably in 2009 and I started teaching the book, I started using it, my men's group, like I've talked about before and whatnot. And so then at one point I started to engage with your website, and then you had a class that you could take on your website. I took that. And then I took it a couple times. And then you, the people that were running that portion of that website, invited me to be, you know, a facilitator. And. And then, lo and behold, I'm in Phoenix and I meet you and John for the first time. And oh, my gosh, what am I going to say to these people that are, like my heroes? And I'm fumbling on my words and I don't. You probably don't even remember it, but I'm, like, trying to say something witty and good. So they're going to. And I just remember all of that stress from wanting to perform. Well, I was reminded of that, like, three months ago, we were doing some podcasts in Phoenix and. And I went to dinner with you and Grace and John and Stacy.

[John]

Right.

[Scott]

And I just was. It was just so comfortable.

[John]

Wow.

[Scott]

I. I wasn't worried about what I was going to say.

[Bill Thrall]

Read illustration.

[Scott]

I was just enjoying what was being said. I wasn't worried if it was being said by me or by John or who, you know, I wasn't worried if I was in the conversation or listening to. I was just enjoying it. And so this. It's this life that this faith can bring to you.

[John]

Amen.

[Scott]

When you can let.

[Bill Thrall]

Stop performing, you can enjoy.

[Scott]

You can enjoy.

[Bill Thrall]

Yeah.

[Scott]

So, yeah.

[Bill Thrall]

Thank you, Scott. That's really, really helpful. I want everybody to know that these two guys spent a lot of time together. You know, we enjoy. I know you want to think, well, we just. All we do when we're together is we just talk about Jesus. Well, actually, sorry to disappoint you, but we actually played Jim Rummy a lot. We've been playing Jim Robbie. We have a running total, unfortunately. He's 2, 000 points ahead of me. But we do that. You know why we do that?

[Scott]

This. 2, 600, okay.

[Bill Thrall]

Excuse me. 2, 600 points. Do you know why we do that? Because we enjoy life. We fish together. We're going to go fishing this year way up in Alaska. We'll have a wonderful time. What?

[John]

You.

[Bill Thrall]

What are you guys talking about? I thought you were godly men. You mean you. You guys have the freedom to go fishing? Oh, my gosh.

[Scott]

And we're getting Voldemort to play golf.

[Bill Thrall]

Yes, we're getting Voldemort.

[Scott]

Watch out.

[Bill Thrall]

Watch out.

[Grace]

I'm coming.

[Bill Thrall]

Yeah, so he.

[Scott]

He's going to be good.

[Bill Thrall]

So.

[Scott]

So what if not good yet? But he's gonna.

[Bill Thrall]

Oh, he's such a good athlete. He's gonna be beating us soon.

[Scott]

I know. I know. It's gonna be bad.

[Bill Thrall]

That's good.

[Grace]

I like that.

[John]

Yeah.

[Bill Thrall]

The reality is that is life.

[John]

Yeah.

[Scott]

We're doing.

[Bill Thrall]

We're enjoying the freedom we have in Christ because we have the freedom to do things we like. It's like, could we just break the bondage of stereotyping godliness and let godliness be the freedom of who we are?

[Scott]

Yeah. For freedom, Christ has set us free.

[John]

Amen.

[Scott]

Stand firm and do not submit again to a yoke of slavery.

[John]

Amen. Amen and amen.

[Scott]

We appreciate you joining us. Gonna remind you to subscribe to share this podcast with others, but we're really happy that you're here. Thanks.

[Bill Thrall]

Thank you.

[Scott]

Thank you for listening to the podcast. We're really glad that you're here. We'd love to know that you're here. And so if you could leave a comment, we would appreciate that. But more importantly, if you know someone that should listen to this or hear it, we would love for you to share it with them. Thanks again.