E688 - Ruth A Milligan - The Juniper Ridge Trilogy - A Dystopian Science Fiction Thriller Series

Summary

Living The Next Chapter: E688

Ruth A Milligan – The Juniper Ridge Trilogy – A Dystopian Science Fiction Thriller Series

Host: Dave Campbell
Guest: Ruth A Milligan
Date: March 18, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this rich and candid conversation, Dave Campbell interviews dystopian science fiction author Ruth A Milligan about her Juniper Ridge Trilogy—a series that blends action, emotion, and speculative world-building. They explore Ruth’s writing journey, her creative inspirations, the art of constructing a trilogy, and practical advice for aspiring writers. Personal anecdotes, behind-the-scenes details, and a peek into Ruth’s unique writing rituals make this episode engaging for both authors and readers alike.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Ruth’s Beginnings as a Writer

• Ruth shares that her love of books started young; she was always reading and writing as a child.
• Her mother supported her hobby but encouraged her to finish what she started:

  “I’d write a book, and I would get to a point and I would stop and write another one. And [Mom’s] like, ‘okay, so I’m not reading anymore until you actually finish something.’” — Ruth (02:23)

• A diverse reading palette shaped Ruth’s voice:

  “Dean Koontz, I really loved his characters. And, you know, Stephen King... his eerie stuff and his plot twists... Ray Bradbury... the uniqueness.” — Ruth (03:16)

Advice for Aspiring Authors

• Be patient and take your time; writing a book is a marathon:

  “It takes a long time to write a book. Be patient with yourself.” — Ruth (04:19)

• The value of finishing is emphasized:

  “It is beneficial to sit and to actually finish a whole book. When it gets hard, you just kind of have to keep going.” — Ruth (04:28)

• Making writing fun helps with motivation. Ruth gets into character with props:

  “When I started writing Dark Secrets, the characters, they’re scientists... So a lot of times when I wrote, I’d wear a lab coat to make it fun.” — Ruth (04:45)

The Roots of the Juniper Ridge Trilogy

• Dark Secrets was born as a National Novel Writers Month challenge.
• Started as a monster story but evolved when her main character, Adam, “took over”:

  “My character Adam came into play, and when I was done, I was like, that was a really good idea, but it doesn’t work for my character. My character wants me to write something else, so I bagged that idea.” — Ruth (08:37)

• Setting: A small Oregon town in 2072, dealing with waterborne virus mutations.

Building a Future World

• Ruth’s vision for 2072 involves both wishful thinking and practicality:

  “They have spider meds where instead of being injected, the medicine just like absorbs through your skin…things that are less painful, less invasive and safer.” — Ruth (11:05)

Character Deep Dive: Adam Davidson

• Adam is a family man, scientist, full of compassion, and works tirelessly for a cure for the mutants.
• The world is dangerous—mutant containment services police society, unusual tech abounds, and ethical lines blur.

Trilogy Structure and Progression

• The trilogy features three interconnected scientists: Adam (Dark Secrets), Sven (The Serum), and Jesse (upcoming third book).
• Each character gets a focused narrative, with the world’s lore expanding per book.
• The second book, The Serum, follows Sven’s battle against a billionaire seeking a cure for profit.
• The third book, in rough draft stage, will follow Jesse on a cross-country quest for a permanent cure.

Crafting Relatable Characters

• Ruth gives her characters small, unique quirks:

  “Adam eats peanut butter and bologna sandwiches…. Jesse keeps a penny in his pocket for good luck.” — Ruth (25:38)

• Realism and empathy are key—readers have expressed strong emotional connections:

  “A lot of people say it’s really action packed. A lot of people say it’s really kind of tear jerking. They connect with the people that have to go through this crazy life.” — Ruth (25:15)

• Ruth draws inspiration from people-watching at the restaurant where she works.

Life Balance & Writing Practice

• Ruth openly acknowledges the challenge of maintaining life/work/writing balance:

  “He’s really stubborn…so focused in his work that it creates problems in other parts of his life…he has a hard time balancing that.” — Ruth (20:49)

• She usually writes about 5 hours a week and gives herself permission to take weekends off.

The Author Community & Support

• Ruth participates in local writing groups, book signings, and online communities.
• She values the accountability and inspiration of working in community with fellow writers:

  “I’m glad I found them because it’s pretty nice to have writing friends that live in the same area.” — Ruth (29:02)

Publishing & Collaboration

• Ruth’s parents supported her editorial journey with a creative “editing fund” gift (30:28).
• She’s worked with multiple editors and highlights the importance of finding one with a similar vision and genre familiarity.
• Book covers are handled by a designer on Fiverr, tailored to Ruth’s vision with photographic references.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Making Writing Fun
  “When I started writing Dark Secrets… I’d wear a lab coat to make it fun.” — Ruth (04:45)
• On Perseverance
  “It didn’t flow every day... Take a break, go for a walk. Sometimes I grab that book and I read for a while and eventually get back to writing.” — Ruth (23:58)
• On Parental Encouragement
  “For an entire year…they put [money] aside so I can start an editing fund and they gave it to me for Christmas.” — Ruth (30:28)
• On Realistic Editing Relationships
  “They’re just all suggestions… because I’m a self published author.” — Ruth (33:40)

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Key Timestamps

• 00:48 – 02:44 Ruth’s early writing and family encouragement.
• 04:19 – 05:07 Patient advice for new writers & writing rituals.
• 08:14 – 09:20 Genesis of Dark Secrets & shift from monsters to mutants.
• 10:46 – 12:23 The ethics and logistics of a futuristic mutant hospital.
• 13:31 – 14:26 Ideal reader demographic and world location.
• 16:03 – 17:31 How Dark Secrets became a trilogy; structure of each book.
• 17:56 – 18:47 The Serum’s plot overview.
• 20:46 – 21:31 Adam’s struggle for life balance mirrored in Ruth’s own life.
• 23:58 – 24:44 Overcoming writer’s block and maintaining a writing schedule.
• 25:15 – 25:59 Emotional reader responses and character quirks.
• 28:45 – 29:46 Writing community and peer support.
• 30:28 – 31:14 The editing fund—family’s creative support.
• 33:40 – 34:29 Editor relationship dynamics.
• 34:37 – 36:14 Choosing, revising, and personalizing book covers.
• 36:14 – 36:46 Ruth’s website and newsletter—hub for news and updates.
• 37:02 – 37:13 Ruth’s unexpected experience flying an airplane.
• 38:05 – 38:41 Plans for standalones and a novel about a haunted vineyard.

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Follow & Learn More

• Ruth’s Official Website: www.ruthanmilligan.com
  • Book info, news, newsletter signup, event calendar
• Newsletter: Stay up-to-date on Ruth’s writing, upcoming events, and new releases.
• Social Communities: Find Ruth in writer’s groups on Facebook and connect with local author communities.

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Episode Takeaways

• The Juniper Ridge Trilogy is a creative, action-packed dystopian saga grounded in memorable characters, ethical dilemmas, and imaginative world-building.
• Ruth A Milligan emphasizes the power of perseverance, the importance of finishing projects, and finding joy in the craft.
• Real-life quirks, emotional nuance, and community support are central to both Ruth’s fiction and her writing process.
• For aspiring writers: Take your time, finish what you start, seek out community and editorial support—even if it arrives in the form of a Christmas cash box from your parents.
• The third book in the trilogy is expected within six months, and Ruth is eyeing future standalones and a haunted vineyard story—proving her creative journey is far from over.

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Memorable Closing

“Writing is my escape… sometimes they say it’s cheap therapy. They’re not kidding.”
— Ruth (27:19)

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For links to Ruth’s books, news, and newsletter, visit her website (www.ruthanmilligan.com). Look out for Book Three in the Juniper Ridge Trilogy and leave a review to share your thoughts!

Transcript

[Ruth]

Yeah, A lot of people say it's really action packed. A lot of people say it's really kind of tear jerking. They connect with the people that have to go through this crazy life. And yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Everybody. Welcome back to Living the Next Chapter, the Author podcast, where we get to talk to great authors. If you love great stories, Ruth is here today. We're going to be talking about her journey as an authority. Lots of great things for you to fall in love with. Beautiful covers as well for her books, by the way. You gotta go check it out. Go to her website link in the, in the notes and go check out Ruth. I think you're gonna love this conversation today. And not only does Ruth come on the show as a guest, she's actually been listening to some episodes, which makes me so happy. So, Ruth, welcome to the podcast. Glad to have you here.

[Ruth]

Thank you. It's good to be here.

[Podcast Host]

Excellence. It's kind of weird, right? Because you hear the show and now you're on the show and now you can listen to you on the show, which is kind of fun, right?

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Good. Excellent. Tell everybody. Ruth, where are you in this big world of ours?

[Ruth]

I live in Oregon, about half an hour to south of Portland.

[Podcast Host]

Good, Excellent.

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

What do you love so much about that part of the world? Come on.

[Ruth]

Where I live, it's like half an hour from the beach and a half an hour from the mountains. But I still live in a small town, but I'm close to a big city, so it's like the best of both worlds.

[Podcast Host]

And we talked about this before. We record no snow. Really? Where, like where I am. Where I am. Right. So there you go.

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

I'm not anywhere close to a beach or mountains, so you got me beat on both of those. We did have this big hill called Niagara Falls. We have that, but that's about all we got, so.

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

There you go. Good.

[Ruth]

Like to visit that sometime.

[Podcast Host]

You should come here. Yeah, it's great.

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. Let's start with your author journey. Ruth, how did all this start for you? How did you begin writing and telling great stories? How did this all start?

[Ruth]

Well, I fell in love with the books as a kid and so I've always been a big reader and I did a lot of writing in school and it was just always something I love to do. And a lot of times I would, I would write stories and my mom would read them and just for entertainment. She wasn't. Didn't critique or anything, but. Yeah. And it got to the point where she was like, okay, well, What I do is I'd. I'd write a book, and I would get to a point and I would stop and write another one. And she's like, okay, so I'm not reading anymore until you actually finish something. My little word of encouragement.

[Podcast Host]

There you go.

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

So how old were you then when she was giving that challenge to finish a book?

[Ruth]

Probably in high school.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Ruth]

16, 17. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. All right. And then growing up avid reader, did you like to read other authors as well?

[Ruth]

Yeah, I like to read a big variety. Dean Coon, Stephen King, Ray Bradbury, anything I could get my hands on.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. All right.

[Ruth]

Big variety.

[Podcast Host]

Do you feel like that helped influence you as an author as well? For sure, yeah.

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Right.

[Ruth]

Yeah. For different reasons. Like Dean Koontz, I really loved his characters. And, you know, Stephen King, I liked a lot of his eerie stuff and his plot twists and. Yeah, And Ray Bradbury. I like the uniqueness.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Ruth]

My. My friends, a lot of times, if they read like the back of a book cover. Oh, this sounds weird. Ruth would like it.

[Podcast Host]

They know you as well. Okay, good. All right, that's good. Let's talk to the author that's listening. Ruth, They're. They're maybe new to writing, and they see you. They go to your website, which is beautiful, by the way. They go to your website and they see, wow, I wish I even had one book in the world. And here you are just writing and writing and writing. If you could encourage a new author that's listening, what would be helpful from your perspective when you were starting to hear from an author who's further down the road? What can we share to help that author to get out there and share their stories?

[Ruth]

My big one would be to take your time. It takes a long time to write a book. Be patient with yourself.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Ruth]

And it. It is beneficial to sit and to actually finish a whole book when it gets hard. You just kind of have to keep going. And that's. That's the tricky part.

[Podcast Host]

Right.

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

How do you stay motivated to keep writing?

[Ruth]

A lot of times I make it fun. Like when I started writing Dark Secrets. The characters, they're scientists in a different world. So a lot of times when I wrote, I'd wear a lab coat to make it fun.

[Podcast Host]

Oh, wait, really? Yeah, to kind of put you into the character kind of by. By putting on the lab coat. That's interesting. Okay.

[Ruth]

Yeah. And pictures up of the world because, you know, it's. It's 50 years in the future, so pictures kind of brought me there. And then when My family saw me, you know, wearing my lab coat. They're like, oh, leave her. Al

[Podcast Host]

the mad scientist is out there creating our new, new work. I like that.

[Ruth]

Right, good.

[Podcast Host]

50 years in the future. Are you interested in time travel? Is that something that makes you curious?

[Ruth]

It's something I used to read about a lot too. I like reading about time travel. It's really interesting. When I was in school, probably 13 or 14 years old, I wrote a story about. It was called Ashley Long and the Time Travel Machine. And she built a time travel machine in her basement. It's a cardboard box. And. Yeah. And she went back in time and she met her grandparents, but she didn't know they were her grandparents because she was an orphan. So when she came back, her world was totally different because she had changed it.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. It's always the fear, right, that one little misstep or one little piece of conversation or information or whatever could just change the whole world. So if you could go forward or backward any length of time, where would, which, which direction would you go yourself personally? And how far in the past or how far in the future would you go?

[Ruth]

I don't know if I would want to go in the future. I think I would spoil things. Right, right. So I think it would be really interesting to go back in the past, probably way before I was born, just to see what the world was like.

[Podcast Host]

Okay. I interviewed an author today from Switzerland, and his, his book, the, the main character comes from the year 10 million and 2 and comes back to 2022 from 10 million and 2. And I'm like, I'm like, wow. Like, that's a jump. That's a pretty big jump, right? The 10 million and two. Yeah, that's, that's, that's huge. So, yeah, it's. The whole idea of time travel, I think, is really interesting. I don't know which way I would go. I, I would, I'm curious about the future. Right. Kind of that back to the future Marty McFly thing. But I'm curious of what the future would look like. But I would love to go back and, and spend time with past relatives that are no longer around and see them in different contexts. Right. Yeah. I don't know. I, I, yeah, probably go back first, I think. Back to the future. That's what I do. Yeah. That's good. Yeah. Okay, so, so let's, let's get into your stories then. So is, is Dark Secrets the first book for you?

[Ruth]

Yes.

[Podcast Host]

Okay. So when did you start writing Dark Secrets?

[Ruth]

I started as a national novel Writers Month challenge, actually. And it was a totally different book when I started writing it because I'm really into reading, like, vampires and, you know, creatures, werewolves. But I wanted to write something different, you know, a different creature.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Ruth]

So I thought it would be cool to have a scientist that wanted to write about, like, a Frankenstein, but the Frankenstein would be parts of all these different creatures. So I started writing that story, and then my character Adam came into play, and when I was done, I was like, that was a really good idea, but it doesn't work for my character. My character wants me to write something else, so I bagged that idea. And I love this story about Adam Davidson, the scientist that is in this world with all these creatures, and he wants to find a cure for them. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

To talk more about Adam, his character, who he is, you could introduce him at a party or something. He walks in the room, you're like, oh, Dave, this is Adam. How would you explain Adam to me as the first time I meet Adam?

[Ruth]

Adam's a family man. He's, you know, he's in his 30s. He has two kids, and he spends all his time working. He works in a mutant hospital. And this is a time where there's a virus that has been spread through the water, and any animals or even people can turn into mutants. They can grow fins or, I mean, all kinds of weird things, have extra eyes or become really aggressive, become cannibalistic. And so they go to this hospital, and they're not allowed to be killed unless your life is in danger. And since this is a futuristic book, they have all kinds of weapons that, you know, they have paralyzer guns that can paralyze a creature for five minutes, enough to get him restrained, or. So it has some really cool futuristic stuff, too. But what Adam does is he spends all his time at this mutant hospital trying to find cures because he thinks, well, it's not their fault.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Ruth]

He has a lot of compassion.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

How much time did you spend developing what 2072 looks like? Because that's a long ways out. Like, did you just kind of dream that and kind of plan, like, what will life be like in that? Because you need that kind of as context for your story.

[Ruth]

Right, right, right. A lot of my ideas. Since a lot of it is at the mutant hospital, I thought, okay, so now what would be better at a hospital 50 years from now or 50 years from when I wrote it? You know, what would. What would be more convenient? So they have, like, spider meds where instead of being injected, the medicine Just like absorbs through your skin. Oh, yeah. Things that are less painful, less invasive and safer.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Ruth]

And so a lot. Some of it was kind of a wish list. Well, what would be, what would be neat in the future to have?

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Ruth]

And then of course there's. It's very dangerous, so they have to have. They have a danger zone where no one's allowed to go and fence is built up and they have the mcs, the mutant containment services and they're kind of like firemen or. But they come and they take care of the mutants and they take them to the hospital or they kill them if they have to. But yeah, that was kind of fun to create them.

[Podcast Host]

The whole idea of mutants then, like why, why that? Like what captured your attention to have that as such a big part of your story?

[Ruth]

I know. I just wanted to do something that's not as common, I think.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Ruth]

And something where I could be really creative and have a bunch of different types of creatures, different ways to kill them and different ways to cure them.

[Podcast Host]

And. Yeah, it kind of feels like a little bit of, well, an alien kind of comparison, like Men in Black with all these interesting odd things or here on Earth, you know, like. Right. And. Yeah. And yeah. Just the fact that they can change. Change shape and change all their. Their kind of their DNA and who they are. Yeah. You know, but the fact that they're dangerous too, that's. That's kind of scary.

[Ruth]

Yeah. I wouldn't want to live in this world.

[Podcast Host]

No. Right. No. So. Yeah. Okay, that's really interesting. Who do you think your ideal reader is, like age wise and who do you kind of envision who's going to love Dark Secrets?

[Ruth]

I think people that are really into like weird creatures. I would, I would say maybe older. 16, 17 at the youngest.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Ruth]

Because there's like some gore and. Yeah, yeah. People that are into like futuristic sci fi type things and.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Ruth]

Things like that.

[Podcast Host]

Most of the story happened then in within the walls of the hospital. Then

[Ruth]

it happens within this small town in Oregon.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Ruth]

Panacea. And yeah. In the first book it all takes place there.

[Podcast Host]

Okay. All right. Okay. And then so you start, you do Dark Secrets. That comes out and then you start working on the next one right away. Is that kind of how it happens?

[Ruth]

And then I wrote the Serum and that came out in August.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Ruth]

This is the second book.

[Podcast Host]

All right.

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

How's the response been for that so far?

[Ruth]

Oh, pretty good. And it, it centers around another scientist that's a good friend of Adam. There's three of them, there's Adam, Jesse and Sven. And the second one is about Sven and his struggles. And he's in his 70s, so it's a big jump. But he's been working at the hospital since it began.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Ruth]

Yeah. He's one of. He's the only main character that has actually seen the world before the mutants showed up.

[Podcast Host]

Okay. Because of his age too. Yeah. Okay.

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

All right. And he has a relationship with Adam then?

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Ruth]

They spend a lot of time working together. They've been there a long time, so he's almost like this end to him.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

For readers, would it be good to start with Dark Secrets before you read the serum?

[Ruth]

Yeah, I think you would get a lot more out of it. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Really? Okay. All right. Okay. So is there like, is this a trilogy then with the third book?

[Ruth]

Yes.

[Podcast Host]

Coming.

[Ruth]

Okay.

[Podcast Host]

All right. Is it hard? Okay. Because I, I remember I'm not an author, so I don't know the answer to this question. Is it hard to build a world over a three book series? Like, how much planning do you have to have so that you. All the books work together and they, you don't get stuck and you're like, oh, I didn't talk about this in the Dark Secrets, but now I'm gonna need that story for the third book. Like, how do you plan out that kind of three book structure?

[Ruth]

Yeah, that was. The funny thing is, when I was writing the first one, I thought it was only going to be one book.

[Podcast Host]

Oh, good.

[Ruth]

Yeah. And then I was like, this isn't going to fit.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Ruth]

There's just too much. And I wanted each of the, each of the three characters to have their own book.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Ruth]

Because there was just so much I wanted to say. So I'm like, okay, well, I can spread it out into three books. I had enough to say that part wasn't that hard.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. So as we go through it then. So Dark Secrets leads into the serum. What's. I know we're kind of spoiling a little bit, but what's coming up down the road, like for that third one then in the series?

[Ruth]

The third one. The third one is about Jesse and he's the youngest of the group and he is traveling across the United States to find a permanent cure for the mutants forever.

[Podcast Host]

Oh, okay.

[Ruth]

Yeah. So the, the third one was a lot different for me to write than the first two because the first two were pretty much in the same area. And the third one, he's, you know, the two aren't in it as much as Jesse and He's traveling from Oregon to Florida. So the world building was a lot different. And it was a lot different, right? Yeah, but it was really fun.

[Podcast Host]

What's a timeline for the third book then?

[Ruth]

I finished the rough draft.

[Podcast Host]

Good.

[Ruth]

It probably will come out in about six months.

[Podcast Host]

Okay, good.

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

All right. Lots of time for people to fall in love with the other two and get ready for the third one. Right, right, right. That's what we're going to do. We're going to buy them all. Okay, so let's jump into the story for the serum then, like, what is kind of the story arc for the second book?

[Ruth]

So in the second book, Sven loses his wife near the beginning of the book, and there's a new guy in town, and he's a billionaire, and he wants to take over this land because they found perhaps a cure. And at the Tree of Life is what it's called, and he wants to take over the land. He's a billionaire. He thinks he can do whatever he wants. Yeah. And he thinks the money can buy everything. And so Sven wants to go against him. He thinks it's all wrong. And him and his friends, they work hard to, you know, to take him down and try to make the world a better place.

[Podcast Host]

Okay. All right.

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

And then does Adam make an appearance that. In the serum as well?

[Ruth]

Yeah, Adam and Jesse and Sven, they're all really close, and. Yeah, they. They're integral part of all three books, I think.

[Podcast Host]

Are all of them scientists, then? All three?

[Ruth]

Yes.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Ruth]

They all work at the mutant hospital.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

All right. So they have some context and relationships with each other. What. What do you think the. The readers are going to enjoy the most about Dark Secrets as a first introductory to the story? What. What are you excited about? Once the. The people get that copy of the book as are reading, you're like, oh, I can't wait for you to get to this part. Like, what's. What's exciting?

[Ruth]

As the reader starts, I think there's a lot of action in it.

[Podcast Host]

Okay, good.

[Ruth]

You all, you're starting to learn all about the different creatures and how they react to them and the characters, how hard they really, really want to make the world a better place. Yeah. My first book signing was, like, a couple of years ago, and this young girl came up to me and she said, and she had a bookmark about halfway through. And I was like, how are you liking the book so far? She goes, oh, this is my second time reading it. And she was telling me she just really loved Adam because he Cared so much. He cares so much about his patients. I really like him. So.

[Podcast Host]

Okay. Did you wear the lab coat to your book signing?

[Ruth]

Yes, I did.

[Podcast Host]

Of course you did.

[Ruth]

I did.

[Podcast Host]

There you go. You wanted to do the part. That's good.

[Ruth]

Why not?

[Podcast Host]

You're in character. If you could write yourself into the story, how would. How would you relate to Adam? How? Like, would you be kind of like great co workers? Would you be two people that really work well together, or is he really different than you? How would you write yourself into the story?

[Ruth]

I think we would get along really well.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Ruth]

But when I get into a project, I get into a project, and I think I would really want to help, too. He's really stubborn, too. Yeah. He's so focused in his work that it creates problem in other parts of his life. Like, you know, he's not home a lot, and he's got two young kids and. Yeah. So he has a hard time balancing that with everything else.

[Podcast Host]

So that's kind of an underlying part of the story that you're trying to bring forward then, too, like, have healthy balance in your life. Is that kind of the wrestling that he has to do? Yeah.

[Ruth]

Something he definitely has to learn? Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Okay. Is it something you battle with yourself sometimes?

[Ruth]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Right. Because you get into a writing mode and time slips away. You're like, oh, my gosh, I've been doing this for hours. Right.

[Ruth]

I have to sleep sometime.

[Podcast Host]

I have family. I have other things to do. But I just love what I'm doing. Right?

[Ruth]

Yeah. I tell my friends, yeah, I'm going to do this and this this week. And they're like, you can't do that. You don't have enough time.

[Podcast Host]

No, you're not. Yeah, Yeah. I find in podcasting, I'll get caught up in podcasting, and my wife is like, do you ever take a break? Like, do you ever stop and just. I'm like, I just love doing what I do. Right. So I kind of relate to Adam in that, where he's got a higher mission than creating a podcast, but he's helping people. Right. But just being so wrapped up in your work, you know, I think that's definitely not the most healthiest thing. I had a doctor on my podcast, and he wrote a book about sleep. And I said, this is ironic, because don't most doctors work, like, crazy long shifts and sleep on a cot for a couple minutes like you see on tv? He's like, yeah. I said, so you're really not a good example of good sleep, and you're a doctor that talks about. He's like, yeah, you're right. I am not a good example of my own book. And I'm like, oh, okay. So that was interesting. Yeah, we kind of had that moment. Yeah. I just. That whole work life balance. I don't know. I don't know if anybody does it really, really well. Right. You know, it's tricky. Yeah. I'm almost thinking it's like work life harmony, where you, like, when you're at work, you're at work and when you're at home, you're at home. And you don't try to do both at the same time all the time. Right. So that's kind of my, my casual observance of that whole work life balance thing. I think it's more about harmony than, like, how does it work together? Anyways, that's kind of my little, my little soapbox moment, everybody. You're welcome. Yeah. So. So, okay, for, for the, again, the authors that are listening, I just really want to encourage them from your perspective. Was there times where as a writer, you just got stuck in the story and you didn't know where to turn next, or did it kind of flow for you because there's authors listening and they're still wrestling with this whole process? Right.

[Ruth]

Yeah. It didn't flow every day? No, no, it didn't. I mean, there are times when, you know, I had to take a break, go for a walk. A lot of times I'd grab a book that inspired me, but sometimes I grab that book and I read for a while and eventually get back to writing. But yeah. Yeah, that was pretty inspiring. But yeah, there's. There's going to be days where you're not going to sit and write for, you know, hours or.

[Podcast Host]

No.

[Ruth]

Yeah, no.

[Podcast Host]

And then you have your own personal life as well and other things to work on. Right. So how much time a week do you devote to writing? On an average week, I would say

[Ruth]

at least five hours a week.

[Podcast Host]

Oh, good. That's good.

[Ruth]

About an hour a day.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Ruth]

Yeah. I tell myself it's okay to take weekends off, you know, spend time with my family and friends. Yeah, yeah, right. Sometimes a little more, sometimes a little less, but.

[Podcast Host]

Okay. What kind of, what kind of feedback are you getting from readers? We kind of mentioned a little bit of that already. But what kind of things have you heard back from readers and you're reading your reviews and things like that? I always encourage the audience, people listening to Leave Grid reviews. So what are you hearing?

[Ruth]

Yeah, a lot of people say it's really action packed. A lot of people say it's really kind of tear jerking. They connect with the people that have to go through this crazy life and. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Okay. How do you create a very realistic character that people can identify with?

[Ruth]

I think I give them little details, little quirks. Like Adam eats peanut butter and bologna sandwiches. Just little things like that.

[Podcast Host]

Butter Maloney. Okay.

[Ruth]

Yeah, I tried that for research and no, I'm not a fan, but, you know, he is.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Ruth]

Yeah. And little things like that, you know, Jesse keeps a penny in his pocket for good luck. I mean, it's just little things like that that I think makes them relatable and real interesting. Now. They're. They're really real to me. So that play now.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. I had another author on the show too, and they said they like to go out in public and just sit and watch people. Watch people, how they walk, how they talk, how they interact with each other. And then that helps them to shape their characters to be more realistic. So they really try to pull off some of the. The little quirks that people. You talked about little quirks that people have. The penny in the pocket. That's a good example, but. And then they bring that back to their characters to make them feel a little bit more like they stand off the page a little bit more. Right.

[Ruth]

Yeah. Yeah. I work in a restaurant, so I'm around people all the time, so there you go. I'm always paying attention.

[Podcast Host]

That's kind of your job, right? Yeah. That's important. Okay.

[Ruth]

Gotta jot that down.

[Podcast Host]

How does writing help balance you out from working at the restaurant and life like is. Has writing always been something that you. Just helps you and kind of gives you something to focus on other than what you do day to day? Yeah.

[Ruth]

Writing is my. My escape.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Ruth]

And, you know, sometimes they say it's. It's cheap therapy. They're not kidding, you know?

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Ruth]

So it's. Yeah, it's just. I can just sit down in my own little corner and go into a totally different world and.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Ruth]

Yeah, it's nice.

[Podcast Host]

When you get dark secrets out in the world, is it easier to start the second book and start on the serum? Like. Like you have all that done, You've accomplished a book. You finally published. You're an author. Does the next book become a little easier to write then?

[Ruth]

I think so, yeah. And I think after I was done with the rough draft, when I went back, there was less editing.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Ruth]

Because I kind of knew what went into the first one and I didn't have to create as much because it's the second book, so I already had most of my characters. I had some new ones, but yeah. So it made it a little easier for those reasons.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. And then the third. Third book builds on that second book, and off you go. Right. 300 books later here you have your own library. Yeah, I like it. I get. What about promoting your books? Like we. Obviously you're here on a podcast, which is great. I love having you here. What else are you doing to get out there in front of the world and. And talk about your books with your lab coat on?

[Ruth]

Well, I do book signings and I'm a part of some groups on Facebook and we help each other with ideas and things like that. I'm a part of a writers group.

[Podcast Host]

Good one.

[Ruth]

Where I live. I just joined recently, and we actually sell our books together and help each other when we get stuck on things. I'm glad I found them because it's pretty nice to have writing friends that live in the same area.

[Podcast Host]

It's good. Let them know. I'd love to have them on my show. I'm always looking for guests.

[Ruth]

I will.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. Yeah. It's nice to do it in community. I think that's the one thing I understand kind of the. The idea that authors like to write on their own and they secluded cabin in the forest and be by themselves and write. But I think the idea of having the accountability of being with other writers and helping each other when they get stuck encouraging each other, that's a really big thing too. So.

[Ruth]

Yeah, it is.

[Podcast Host]

Right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's good. And. And not only do you get to go and get support, you can be a support for people as well. And then you get to learn from. From other people who are maybe wrestling with their chapter three. They're like stuck on this thing and you're like, well, maybe I give a suggestion of going this way or you can help them and just listening to all the people kind of working through their books. You can take that home with you and then go, oh, I like how they did what they did. I'm not going to steal it. But I love their approach, so maybe that'll help me write my book.

[Ruth]

Yeah, yeah. We all work together.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Ruth]

I have a lot more writing friends now that I started on Dark Secrets.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Ruth]

Since then. Yeah. I actually. A long time ago, when I was talking about my mom, how you wanted me to finish it on Christmas one year, I got this little tiny box and I opened it up and it had a big wad of ones in there, $1 bills with a note. And what my parents have been doing is for an entire year. They said once they had a little extra money, they put it aside so I can start an editing fund and they gave it to me for Christmas. Nice. Yeah. So that's exactly what I did is I went down to the bank and I started saving up for an editor.

[Podcast Host]

That's amazing advice. Wow.

[Ruth]

I know. And, and it's inspiring. It's like they really do believe in me and think that I can, I can do this.

[Podcast Host]

So.

[Ruth]

Yeah. So then I found an editor actually on Facebook, first book coaching. And he kind of taught me all the, all the steps and everything you needed to go within the first book. And. Yeah, so that was really.

[Podcast Host]

That's a great idea for any parents listening. And your kids are thinking about writing. Start that right away. It's a. We're not going to steal that idea. We're going to borrow that idea. I think that's a great idea, Ruth. That's really good.

[Ruth]

Yeah, I made a lot of friends in that group too.

[Podcast Host]

So, yeah, it's, it's encouraging because you've already got a, you've already got a finish line. Then like somebody's kind of gone ahead and thought of that. Right. That's cool.

[Ruth]

Right?

[Podcast Host]

That's smart. I think that'll be. That's a great bonus tip for everybody. We can all do that. Because editors can be. That can be expensive. Right?

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

So, yeah, having a plan would be a good idea. That's good. Have you worked with the same editors for your different books or you change editors as you write new. New books?

[Ruth]

I've worked with a few different editors for my different books. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

What do you. In your mind as an authority, what makes a good editor? Like what, how, how do you know you're working with the right person?

[Ruth]

With someone that has like the similar vision as you, Someone that at least works in the same genre?

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Ruth]

And they kind of get where you're coming from.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. I was always thinking it's interesting because you write the book. It's your words, your story. You're a big idea. And then you give it to somebody else. And I would just be, I'd be nervous as a non author asking the question here. I'd be afraid that they would want to change the book and change the story and change the words because, you know, they might come back and say, well, I think this is a better word. And you're like, I never use that word. Like, that's Not a word. I would. And people who know me, when they see that word on the page, they'll be like, you don't talk like that. Right, Right. So like, so now you start to sound like your editor and I'm like, is it, is it. Do you have control over, over what the editor suggests to you for your book and all that? Right.

[Ruth]

They're just all suggestions.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Ruth]

Because. Yeah, because I'm a self published author. So yeah, I, I send it off and then they say, that's the first thing they say is, okay, well, these are just suggestions, you know, take it or leave it. But a lot of times they come up with things. It's like, oh, I didn't even see that. Oh. Oh, you've had a good point. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

So, okay. Yeah, because it's interesting because it's, it's your little baby, this book that you've created, Right. And you have, right, this kind of attachment to the story. I'd be afraid that somebody want to change it and go, let's just take out chapter three. You're like, what? What do you mean? No, no, no, no, no. Right. So I want to leave that in there. So, yeah, I'd be a little nervous of that as a, as a new author.

[Ruth]

Huh?

[Podcast Host]

Right. That's interesting.

[Ruth]

Yeah. They were pretty kind to me though.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. That's good. Well, you got the right people then. That's good.

[Ruth]

Right?

[Podcast Host]

Talk about the covers. Where, where are you getting your covers done? They're beautiful.

[Ruth]

I found a lady on Fiverr.

[Podcast Host]

Oh, yeah.

[Ruth]

That did my covers Good. She's done a lot of them actually. The Dark Secrets originally was a different cover.

[Podcast Host]

Oh.

[Ruth]

And it just, I don't think it reflected the story as well. I think it looked more horror than science fiction.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. Okay.

[Ruth]

And it just, it just didn't work. So I went and found someone else to do the covers and I was really happy with the second one.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Ruth]

So she's going to be doing all three books.

[Podcast Host]

Nice.

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Good. Yeah, they're beautiful. They're really, really realistic. And yeah, I love on, on the Serum, the Shadow on the Tree, you know, your character. I'm like, that's so cool. Like, if they feel like they're gonna move when you look at them long enough, they're just gonna like readjust themselves or something. So. Yeah, they're very realistic. I love them.

[Ruth]

Thank you.

[Podcast Host]

Did you have this come. When you see the COVID is that kind of what you envision your characters might look like when you're writing?

[Ruth]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. She did really Well, I gave her a description and I found some pictures of people that remind me of the characters.

[Podcast Host]

That's good.

[Ruth]

Yeah, she did really well.

[Podcast Host]

It's helpful. Awesome. Okay, so talk about your website, Ruth. Like, you got your bios on here. You've got news and events and other things as well. Let's. Let's send everyone to your. To your page so they can follow your journey and follow what's coming up for the next next one. But talk about.

[Ruth]

Your website is www.ruthanmilligan.com. and it just. Yeah, it tells you a little bit about me and the books that are out where you can get them and events. I don't have any right now, but as they come up. And you can sign up for my newsletter and then you can find out what I'm working on, what's coming up next.

[Podcast Host]

Okay, good. Yeah. And you love coffee and you also like aviation.

[Ruth]

Yes.

[Podcast Host]

Wait, what's up with that?

[Ruth]

Yes. I've always loved airplanes.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Ruth]

I flew my first airplane and I was in my early 20s.

[Podcast Host]

You flew your own plane?

[Ruth]

I flew my own plane.

[Podcast Host]

Really?

[Ruth]

Yeah, yeah, it was really cool.

[Podcast Host]

Okay.

[Ruth]

I just knew this retired guy that, you know, used to be a pilot, and he was bored, so he's like, I'll take you up. I'm like, oh, you're kidding me. Yes. I'll go.

[Podcast Host]

Come on.

[Ruth]

So, yeah, it was really cool.

[Podcast Host]

And I see hockey on your page, too. You love hockey.

[Ruth]

I. I watch it. I don't play it.

[Podcast Host]

Okay. All right. All right.

[Ruth]

But, yeah, yeah, I really like watching hockey. We have a team not far from their junior team. I really like watching them.

[Podcast Host]

Well, there you go. Like, I talk. Being in Canada. Hockey is kind of a thing up here, too. So I talk to other people and they're like, I love football, soccer or whatever. I'm like, well, hockey's fun, too, so there you go.

[Ruth]

Yeah, hockey is fun.

[Podcast Host]

We got that in common. I like that.

[Ruth]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Good. Awesome. Ruth, thank you so much for being on the show. I'm really excited to see where you go as an author beyond these three. Do you have an idea for, like, a completely new series in the future? Like, where would you like to go? Way down the road.

[Ruth]

Well, after this, I would like to do something I think I'm just going to do, like, a standalone or two. I like to go back and rewrite some of those other ones I didn't finish.

[Podcast Host]

Right.

[Ruth]

And with everything I know now, I think I would just take the basic idea and just rewrite the book.

[Podcast Host]

Rewrite the Books? Yeah.

[Ruth]

Yeah. I'm looking into writing one about a haunted vineyard next.

[Podcast Host]

Okay. Some sour grapes there. Okay.

[Ruth]

There's plenty of vineyards around here. It's inspiring.

[Podcast Host]

You have to do your research and go do have a glass of wine here and there.

[Ruth]

Tribe. Yeah. It'll be rough, but I'll do it.

[Podcast Host]

Okay. I like your commitment. Put your lab coat on when you do that so that they'll be like, oh, somebody official here. We have to treat her really well. That's good.

[Ruth]

It's a good idea.

[Podcast Host]

Excellent. Ruth, thank you so much for doing this again. Thank you for listening to the show as well. I appreciate that, and I'm really excited to have you maybe come back for book three. Would you like to come back and kind of round off the conversation? I think that'd be really fun to have you back again.

[Ruth]

Yeah, I love that.

[Podcast Host]

Excellent. Well, we'll keep that door open and you can fly over here with a glass of wine and a hockey stick, and we'll get together. How's that? Right?

[Ruth]

Sounds good.

[Podcast Host]

That sounds good. We'll do all that together. I love it. Everyone, all information is always in the show Notes. Go and grab all of Ruth's books and be ready sitting there waiting patiently watching your website when book three comes out. Grab that one, too. Leave a great review. I know that Ruth would love to hear your thoughts on Dark secrets and the serum and on and on and on. So please encourage Ruth with your words and your kind comments. Ruth, again, thank you so much for being on the show.

[Ruth]

Thank you.

[Podcast Host]

Excellent. It's really fun.

[Ruth]

It was fun.

[Podcast Host]

Hey, thank you so much again for pressing play. As you've heard, great guests on the show, and one thing you didn't hear in this conversation is what? What did you not hear? Think about it for a second. That's right. Not a single solitary commercial for a mattress or a supplement or whatever you call it. No. Why? Because we don't want to break up the conversation with commercials. So the fact that you're still here means that you are a fan of the show, I'm assuming. So if you want to help to keep the podcast going and to make me feel really happy, all I really care about is. Is coffee. Okay. I just got to be honest. I love coffee. I'm drinking one right now. Starting to get cold. I need. I need to warm it up. Helping us with our buy me a coffee link over at Living the next chapter.com and also in the show notes helps kind of keep the lights on around here. Remember, I'm doing this for free. I. I'm paying for everything, so I would love to have a little coffee donation. You know, even five bucks kind of fills up my cup. And I would love to enjoy a coffee from you. So if you're interested, again, thank you for listening, but you can use our buy me a coffee link and fill up the cup. Thanks for being here.