Pirro Pressure

Summary

Lovett or Leave It – "Pirro Pressure" (August 5, 2026)

Episode Overview

In this lively and irreverent installment of "Lovett or Leave It," host Jon Lovett brings his trademark mix of sharp political commentary and comedic flair to the latest headlines. Fresh off a new season, Lovett dives into the week’s wildest political developments, with a particular focus on former TV judge Jeanine Pirro’s ill-fated involvement in the reflecting pool "vandalism" scandal, and the ongoing chaotic maneuvering in the Trump White House. The show also features interviews with Poorna Jagannathan (HBO’s Lanterns) and Elliot Glazer (author of "The Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad Gay"), games, rants, and confessions—balancing hard-hitting critique with vulnerable, personal moments.

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Main Segments & Key Discussion Points

1. What A Week: Political Monologue

[01:51–13:00]

• Lovett skewers the week’s political absurdities, focusing on:
  • The exoneration of former Olympic canoeist David Hearn over alleged vandalism at the D.C. reflecting pool. Lovett roasts the notion that “stealth antifa ninjas” attacked the pool, and the uncritical acceptance of this story by U.S. Attorney Jeanine Pirro, calling out Trump’s disappointment in her and the bizarre inner workings of the current administration.
  • The politics and optics around Trump’s endorsement of a controversial $1.8 billion "slush fund" for insurrectionists and IRS immunity, with Senators Cornyn and Tillis caving and Trump effectively ending their careers.
  • RFK Jr. launching his web series "The Real Food Show" and pushing anti-vax talking points, with Lovett calling out the ridiculousness of blaming the Mennonites for measles outbreaks.
  • Trump’s new White House diet advisor who promotes steak and sauerkraut, describing bowel movements as “nearly orgasmic”—anecdotes that Lovett gleefully lampoons.

Notable Quotes:

• "[Jeanine Pirro] folded like an umbrella. No, folding is what she did when she prosecuted an innocent 67 year old man. Because you demanded it. Jeanine Pirro has now unfolded also like an umbrella." (Lovett, 04:10)
• "The fund stated that it may be modified only with the written agreement of the parties, which include Trump, his sons and the Trump Organization. And like Tiffany's birthday card, this thing doesn't have a Trump signature anywhere fucking near it." (Lovett, 05:37)
• "You don't have to be a lawyer to understand why this is bullshit. You just have had to try to cancel a membership at Planet Fitness." (Lovett, 06:25)
• "[RFK Jr.] both sounds like and eats like a garbage disposal." (Lovett, 09:36)

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2. Midterm Mobilization & the Crooked Dozen

[13:00–20:00]

• Lovett introduces the Crooked Dozen—12 vulnerable Republican House members targeted by Vote Save America.
• Special focus on Ohio Congressman Max Miller, accused of severe domestic violence, and the Democratic effort to defeat him.
• Urges listeners to sign up at votesaveamerica.com, highlighting the power of grassroots action.

Notable Quotes:

• "If Gelato the Kitten can learn to walk again, we can learn to win. Look at him go. Breaking news. RFK Jr. has eaten Gelato the kitten. RIP Gelato the kitten." (Lovett, 19:30)
• "No matter where you live, you can help defeat Max Miller and the rest of the Crooked Dozen. If we win the House, we shut down Trump’s legislative agenda. We have subpoena power." (Lovett, 15:56)

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3. Michigan Democratic Primary Analysis

[20:18–24:00]

• "Future Jon" reports on the razor-thin victory of Dr. Abdul El-Sayed over Haley Stevens, analyzing what it means for the progressive-moderate divide, Super PAC spending, and implications for the Senate.
• Lovett gets earnest about the Democrats’ ongoing struggle with “electability” arguments and the urgent need for genuine political vision.

Notable Quotes:

• "If he had ever asked me to hang out outside of work, I would have. But he’s intimidated by me, probably." (Lovett, 20:53)
• "Over and over again, voters choose 'or else.' Because your promises don't mean much when no one trusts you to deliver." (Lovett, 22:38)
• "We can win the House. We have a chance of taking the Senate. And that matters so much more than whatever internecine battles we've had." (Lovett, 24:12)

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4. Interview: Poorna Jagannathan—From Typecast to Lanterns

[25:47–38:31]

• Poorna discusses breaking out from typecast doctor roles as a South Asian woman to playing multi-dimensional characters in shows like HBO’s "Lanterns" and Hulu’s "Deli Boys."
• Insights on Comic-Con fandom, the depth and gritty style of "Lanterns," and humorous stories about researching villainy via "Real Housewives."
• Jon and Poorna play a game about bizarre DC Comics superpowers.

Notable Quotes:

• "Starting my career, there was a lot of stereotyping going on. Now, a lot of creators of color are reimagining the Indian woman as more three dimensional." (Jagannathan, 27:23)
• "For any small thing, there’s violence, which is how the character Lucky really is. Any small thing, her first instinct is to choose violence." (Jagannathan, 34:17)

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5. Interview: Elliot Glazer—‘Very Bad Gay’

[40:15–56:01]

• Elliot Glazer talks about his new book, feeling like a "bad gay" for missing cultural cues, and coming out during the late 90s.
• Discussion of generational gaps in the gay community, the shifting meaning of queer identity, and tongue-in-cheek commentary on “partner” as relationship jargon.
• Lovett and Glazer swap confessions in "Is It Just Me?", revealing their aversions (poppers, loud venues), pop culture thoughts, and the divides between looks-based and personality-based gay dating scenes.

Notable Quotes:

• "I feel like I missed day one of gay 101. Like I missed the syllabus. And that everybody seems to understand." (Glazer, 41:30)
• "Normalize earplugs. I have them all over the place. I’m always wearing earplugs." (Lovett, 54:52)

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6. Rant Segment: I Don’t Care, I Love It

[58:09–66:22]

• Each host/guest shares an unpopular opinion they proudly endorse:
  • Elliot: Addicted to “brawl videos” and public meltdown/security cam content for the "primitive and real" catharsis. (58:31)
  • Poorna: Evangelizes for Japanese toilets, marveling at their daily joy and technological wonder. (62:16)
  • Lovett: A newfound obsession with anchovies—"unpeeling the tins" and speculating about hidden nutritional cravings. (66:22)

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7. Second Thoughts & Regrets

[68:11–71:49]

• Lovett and guests humorously reflect on things they regret saying during the show (e.g., vivid Trump/Biden anatomy jokes, skipping Bluetooth puns, romanticizing house arrest dating).
• They also comment on cultural shifts in the gay community and the nuances of gendered behavior and “feminine” identities.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "Cheryl Hines is a lucky woman. Yes, RFK both sounds like and eats like a garbage disposal." (Lovett, 09:36)
• "If Gelato the Kitten can learn to walk again, we can learn to win." (Lovett, 19:30)
• “Imagine a Samuel Alito who plays Minecraft and uses the R word in opinions.” (Lovett, 23:07)
• "For any small thing, there’s violence, which is how the character Lucky really is." (Jagannathan, 34:17)
• "Normalize earplugs. I have them all over the place. I’m always wearing earplugs." (Lovett, 54:52)
• “I just use the basic button, but [the Japanese toilet] has so many different permutations, combinations.” (Jagannathan, 64:20)
• "Because you're in there, you're screaming. It's like nobody can see what I'm selling here. I'm not. What I'm offering requires silence." (Lovett, 55:41)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [01:51] What a Week: Political Monologue
• [13:00] Crooked Dozen & Ohio Race
• [20:18] Michigan Democratic Primary
• [25:47] Poorna Jagannathan Interview
• [40:15] Elliot Glazer Interview
• [58:09] "I Don’t Care, I Love It" Rant Segment
• [68:11] Second Thoughts & Regrets

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Overall Tone

Lovett maintains a playful, irreverent, and at times vulnerable tone, blending political satire with personal anecdotes. His guests match his energy—wry, self-deprecating, and always game for a tangent or gag.

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For Listeners Who Missed the Episode

"Pirro Pressure" delivers exactly what "Lovett or Leave It" fans crave: pointed, hilarious jabs at American political chaos, comedic deep-dives into the oddities of pop culture, and candid explorations of identity and modern life. This episode offers an especially sharp monologue on political absurdity, thoughtful reflections on factionalism and hope in the Democratic Party, as well as genuinely funny interviews exploring comics, sexuality, and the joy of good plumbing. Whether you’re a political junkie or just need a laugh, this episode is packed with insight and wit.

Transcript

[A]

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[B]

Save America and Pot Save the World. Last year, 2,500 people joined us at CrookedCon for conversations with some of the smartest organizers, least annoying politicians, and most interesting voices in politics to talk about how to fix this mess. Even President Obama made a surprise appearance. We're doing it all again November 5th to 7th in Washington, D.C. with even more podcasts, panels and workshops. Plus there'll be drinks, which we'll need after the midterms. No matter which way they go, get [e-mail] if you're a friend of the pod, you get a discount too. See you there.

[A]

Welcome up Los Angeles. Welcome to Love it or Leave It. Live from Hollywood, I'm Jon Lovett. And like that movie where people only have sex one night a year. I only have sex one night a year. We've got a great show for you, but first, let's get into it. What a week. Federal prosecutors dropped the vandalism charges against former Olympic canoeist David Hearn. After contending for months that he had destroyed part of the reflecting pool's new lining. They finally got The DNA test results back. And it turns out David Hearn is not algae. The U.S. attorney's Office for the District of Columbia, led by former TV judge Jeanine Pirro, said that it had charged Hearn and three others based on, quote, less than fulsome information from the Interior Department and conceded that the damage was the result of a botched installation and not vandalism. This was obvious from the beginning, of course. The claim, which apparently Jeanine Pirro took at face value, was that the hastily applied line was floating up to the surface in little chunks across 8 acres of reflecting pool all at once because stealth antifa ninjas were stabbing at it with knives, which never made any sense. This is America. If somebody wants to fuck up the reflecting pool, they'd shoot it with their dad's gun. Trump, if you can imagine, was not pleased with Pirro. Frankly, I think she choked. And I was disappointed with Jeanine Pirro. Really disappointed with Jeanine Pirro. She, she folded like an umbrella. No, folding is what she did when she prosecuted an innocent 67 year old man. Because you demanded it. Jeanine Pirro has now unfolded also like an umbrella. Interior Secretary Doug Burgum, unhappy with his reputation as the least affair, his cabinet official doubled down on the claims of vandalism, saying, quote, the evidence is clear. Vandals have repeatedly caused damage to the reflecting pool while saying he has video to prove it. You actually can't see anything though because there's this random canoe blocking the camera. So Trump reportedly summoned both Pirro and Burgum to the White House for a meeting on Monday that many speculated could result in one of their firings. But who would Trump choose? The tall rich guy saying exactly what Trump wants to hear or the 75 year old woman he assumes is on her period? Rumors intensified when Piro was spotted leaving the West Wing hauling a large white box. But that was just Epstein documents for the weekly shred. No. On Tuesday, CBS reported that the box contained the documentation she brought to show Trump what actually caused the damage to the pool. Oh, you brought evidence to change Donald Trump's mind. What is this, your first day and also your last day? You think he wants you to show him proof that what he's been saying is obviously stupid and ridiculous? Why not just show Trump a picture of his weird little penis next to Joe Biden's dangling Delaware hogan? Speaking of weenies flopping in the breeze, two Republican senators, John Cornyn and Thom Tillis, had threatened to block Trump's Attorney general nominee, Todd Blanche over Trump's proposed $1.8 billion taxpayer slush fund for insurrectionists and Trump's settlement with the IRS that promised to never audit his family or businesses ever again. Unfortunately, standing up to Trump is like having sex with Trump. It doesn't last long and he's the only one who gets what he wants. Then, after you are offered a On Sunday, Blanche announced that he'd rescinded the anti weaponization fund and narrowed the IRS immunity so that it only applied retroactively. Yes, Blanche's declaration is meaningless. The original terms of the agreement creating the fund stated that it may be modified only with the written agreement of the parties, which include Trump, his sons and the Trump Organization. And like Tiffany's birthday card, this thing doesn't have a Trump signature anywhere fucking near it. You don't have to be a lawyer to understand why this is bullshit. You just have had to try to cancel a membership at Planet Fitness. It's over when they say it is. But this phony assurance was enough to satisfy John Cornyn and Thom Tillis, two men who believe the strippers actually really like them. Trump personally ended their political careers by endorsing their GOP primary challengers. They are about to leave the the Senate. Why not go out in a blaze of glory, or at the very least a blaze of not licking your executioner's greasy taint. We debated whether that was too much, whether or not greasy taint was extra. Here's what Cornyn had to say when asked if he was concerned about Trump's statements, some in just the past few days praising the fund. Well, there's nothing we could do to to rein in the President when he said he likes the fund and he wishes still exists. But the fact of the matter, it's dead. And that's all we could do under these circumstances. But that's not true at all. That's not all you could do under the circumstances. In fact, the circumstances had previously included an actual bill, an amendment that he could have voted for that would have enshrined in law a banning of this fund and this ridiculous settlement. Remember Congress and it used to pass laws to constrain the executive. Tillis and Cornyn voted against this amendment. Their two votes would have taken it from 49 votes to 51 votes. It would have been law. But they stopped it. They are so full of shit even now when they don't have to be full of shit anymore. You are free. You don't have to do this like gorillas who were released back into the wild but only feel sleeping in a Fucking cage. Speaking of people who should be released into the wild, HHS Secretary RFK Jr. Has officially launched his own web series, the Real Food Show. Here is the actual trailer.

[C]

Hi, I'm Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. Your HHS secretary. Welcome to the Real Food Show. Thanks to President Trump, we flipped the food pyramid and put real food back where it belongs, at the center of the American plate.

[A]

Let's take a look at the new pyramid for a moment. So the tiny point at the bottom is the whole grains, while the large trapezoid on top is literally every other kind of food. What are we fucking do? What are we doing? What are we doing here? Maybe there's a reason the ancient Egyptians didn't build pyramids pointy side down. Also, the food pyramid was killed 15 years ago. I don't know why we're bringing it back at all when we already got rid of it. But of course, that's also what we said about measles.

[C]

Meanwhile, I'm traveling across America, connecting with renowned chefs to show families how to cook delicious, nutritious meals with real ingredients, all at affordable prices. America, it's time to eat real food.

[A]

Let's get cooking for decency. We cut off this clip right before Kennedy reaches into a cooler and pulls out a flattened skunk. RFK Jr. Has said that the recipes on the show will include fermented items like. Like kimchi, sauerkraut, and yogurt. Also, an ingredient I'm not familiar with called pickle. Jimothy. Oh, no. Here's a fun moment from RFK's publicity tour for the show. So what's the most exotic food that you've eaten?

[C]

The most exotic. I will literally eat anything because I don't have reflex. Let me put it like that.

[A]

Cheryl Hines is a lucky woman. Yes, RFK both sounds like and eats like a garbage disposal. Speaking of garbage, when pushed by CNN's Dana Bash on the recent measles outbreak in the U.S. kennedy offered this explanation.

[C]

The communities that are suffering from measles are almost all religious communities that just don't vaccinate. The Mennonites have not vaccinated since 1796, since Edward Jenner invented the smallpox vaccine. It's hard to blame that. I mean, as much as you want to blame.

[A]

No, I don't want to blame you. I'm asking you because you have a very powerful voice on these issues. I want to blame him. We're seeing the worst measles outbreak in 35 years because more and more people aren't vaccinating Their children? Has the Mennonite population exploded? Are people flocking to the fucking horse and buggy? If not, I'm not sure we can blame the Mennonites, many of whom actually have received vaccinations. Also, it's a convenient people to blame because, you know, they won't see this. Where are the remaining Epstein files? Oh, we gave them to the Amish for safekeeping. Kennedy did ultimately concede that he wants people to get vaccinated for measles. Do you want people to get the MMR vaccine?

[C]

Yeah, I said that already. Okay, so I know you're flustered now, and it is.

[A]

I don't. I'm not flustered at all. I am frustrated and honest. The reason I'm. I'm not debating this view.

[C]

Of course you.

[A]

No, because I'm not debating this.

[C]

All you gotta do is repeat things that people told you and say, trust the expert.

[A]

Yeah, man. That's how this works. We can't all individually go conduct our own vaccine studies. I've tried. Turns out injecting people at the office with mystery liquids is, quote, against union rules. And now we turn from the inbox to. To the outbox. On Tuesday, the New York Times talked to Sean o', Mara, the doctor advising Trump's cabinet to eat a diet almost exclusively of steak and fermented foods like sauerkraut. And I wanted to read you this part about the doctor himself. At one point in our conversation, he pulled up the Bristol stool chart, which ranges from type one separate hard pellets to type seven watery, no solid pieces. Omara is consistently delivering type four smooth, soft, like a snake, with pointed ends, indicative of healthy rectal function. He told the reporter, when you start eating healthy, you don't need toilet paper. He claimed animals in the wild have no residual stool on their anus. We actually have a clip where we're going. We don't need toilet paper. Perfect. The article continues. He describes a proper bowel movement to the reporter. This odorless, wipe free, over in three to seven seconds, and nearly orgasmic. I could have a bowel movement behind a sheet at a dinner party in the corner of the room, he said, and nobody would know. But what's weird, added Dr. Sean, is no one ever invites him to dinner parties. He can't figure it out. Listen, and I'm sorry, this guy is dropping clean logs day after day after day, whatever Scientology promises people to get them to sign their life away, this is that for me. And I'm in luck, because on his website, Dr. Sean sells a $50,000 biological optimization plan called Alpha Global Protocol, which includes a full body MRI scan from, quote, brain to legs. And while 50,000 does sound like a lot, it comes with what is described as indefinite membership in the private Alpha Leadership Network. So come meet fellow travelers who all share two things in common. They got a loose $50,000 lying around and their farts could clear an airport terminal. Speaking of satisfying expulsions, the midterms are upon us and Vote Save America is launching the Crooked Dozen. We are focusing on 12 of the most vulnerable Republicans in the House. Not emotionally vulnerable. These people are pretty walled off. But electorally, we can fuck them up. At the top of the list is Ohio Congressman Max Miller, who has been accused of horrific domestic violence by his ex wife, Emily Moreno, daughter of Ohio Republican Senator Bernie Moreno. Miller is accused of throwing boiling water on her, holding a gun to her head, and breaking his daughter's collarbone. We have no jokes about this. So you guys see this kitten who got a wheelchair made of rulers and toy cars because he was too small for a regular wheelchair for cats? The kitten's name is Gelato. Senator Moreno finally spoke out against Miller this week, posting on Sunday. As he has admitted privately, Max Miller needs serious psychological help. He is a danger to my daughter. I hold my breath every time he has custody of my granddaughter. He should not serve in the House of Representatives. This has been a horrific experience for my entire family. My daughter lives in constant fear of this man. I'm sorry, I just think this stuff is important and people need to hear about it. Gelato. The kitten is 4 inches tall. Here's another photo of him in his new 3D printed wheelchair. Adorable. Despite this, Max Miller has not dropped out, saying in a defiant interview with Jake Tapper he plans to run and win in November. What a nightmare. Where's his district? Widow's Bay? Look, Miller is an absolute piece of shit. And not a typeface on the Bristol stool chart either. One of the bad ones. And Miller's Democratic opponent is Brian Poindexter, a union ironworker endorsed by Bernie Sanders. That's right. It's yet another crucial race with a manly progressive and a guy who's awful to women. But this time, exciting twist. Not the same guy. No matter where you live, you can help defeat Max Miller and the rest of the Crooked Dozen. If we win the House, we shut down Trump's legislative agenda. We have subpoena power. We can launch investigations into corruption and lawlessness. We can take that gavel out of Mike Johnson's hand even though he holds it too tightly and in a vaguely sexual way. We have less than 100 days, so please grab your friends and go sign up to help defeat the crooked [e-mail] we have done the work for you. This is the way to make a difference this fall. And if Gelato the Kitten can learn to walk again, we can learn to win. Look at him go. Breaking news. RFK Jr. Has eaten Gelato the kitten. RIP Gelato the kitten. And we've got a great show for you tonight. We'll be right back with porno Juggernaut. Hey, don't go anywhere. There's more of Love it or Leave it coming up. Love it or Leave it is brought to you by Zebiotics. I have to tell you about this game changing product I use before a night out with drinks. It's called Pre alcohol. You basically just have it and then if you're gonna have a couple drinks, you'll just feel so much better the next day. Sybiotics Pre Alcohol Probiotic Drink is the world's first genetically engineered probiotic. It was invented by PhD scientists to tackle rough mornings after drinking. Here's how it works. When you drink, alcohol gets converted into a toxic byproduct in the gut. It's a buildup of this byproduct, not dehydration, that's to blame for rough days after drinking. Pre Alcohol produces an enzyme to break this byproduct down. Just remember to make Pre Alcohol your first drink of the night. Drink responsibly and you'll feel your best tomorrow. I had Zebiotics at our wedding. I'm always using it. It's a great thing to take because if you know you're going to have like a couple drinks, it just helps make sure that the next day you feel better. Mondays don't move for anyone. Pre Alcohol works overnight so you can have a real weekend and still show up sharp. Go to zbiotics.com love it use code love it for 15% off. That's zbiotics.com love it code love it love it or Leave it is brought to you by Bombas. Summer's here and we are all living for things. Outdoors. I'm always outside, I'm walking the dog. I'm going for runs. I'm, you know, living life, you know, summer. And I'm always in my Bombas. I love Bombas. I wear them all the time. They're the best socks. I wore them to the gym this morning. Just the, the, the kind of vintage athletic socks, they're Great. They look great. They're super comfortable. They have great socks with the grips if you want to do like Pilates. They're the best. I got a pair of socks from another brand because I got them for free honestly. And they were terrible and it was a big famous brand. And the Bombas are so much better. They've got a whole line of pro level sports socks for golf, yoga, the gym and every kind of runner. Plus they're airy, sweat wicking and your feet will feel as good at the end of the day as they did at the start. Bombas also makes the best soft and supportive compression socks. They're perfect for all your summer travel and they actually look amazing. And for every item you purchase, an essential clothing item is donated to someone facing housing insecurity. One purchase equals one donated with over 200 million donations and counting. I love Bombas. As I said, I truly wear them constantly. They're the best socks. They just are. Head over to bombas.com love it. Use code love it for 20% off your first purchase. That's B O M B A S.com love it. Code love it at checkout. And we're back before we're joined by our guests. As we were recording this on Tuesday night, we are getting results from the Democratic primary in Michigan. So we now go to the future tomorrow where it is now today and we have the results here to tell us about it is me from tomorrow. His now reporting to you yesterday which is R now. Thanks John and thanks for not turning off the TV until after midnight. Totally worth it that we're exhausted today. On Tuesday, after a bruising primary, Michigan's Democratic voters chose the progressive Dr. Abdul El Sayed over the Schumer backed moderate congresswoman Haley Stevens. An actual doctor too, not like whatever Jill Biden is. This despite Abdul being outspent by as much as 10 to 1. AIPAC and other outside groups dropped some $60 million by some estimates into the race to boost Stevens and smear Abdul in attack ads that ran non stop. Not sure AIPAC got much out of those ads on the sphere though. But by the end they were running out of places to spend the money. In the closing days, polls suggested that Abdul was up by as much as double digits. But with 95% of the vote in, Abdul is up by 1%. That's 15,000 votes out of roughly 1.5 million cast. We know not to trust the polls, yet somehow we fall for it every time. It's like the polls are a super hot sociopath Stop love bombing us, Emerson. This meant that on Tuesday night, both candidates addressed their supporters when the outcome was unknown. And both Abdul and Haley talked about the importance of getting behind the eventual nominee, regardless of who that would be, however much we might disagree with our Democratic opponent. There is so much more that unites us than divides us. Tomorrow we begin to mend fences. Whatever happens tonight, we have a responsibility to assure that we unite to make sure that Mike Rogers never sees the inside of the U.S. senate.

[D]

We'll know soon who our nominee is going to be. And whoever wins is going to go and take on Mike Rogers. Republicans are going to do everything they can to throw all the dirt, all the mud, the kitchen sink at us because they want to keep the US Senate red so Mike Rogers can keep rubber stamping Donald Trump's ridiculous agenda. Friends, we are not going to let that happen.

[A]

I'll just be honest with you. I know, and I really like Abdul. He hosted a show on our network. I donated to his campaign. If he had ever asked me to hang out outside of work, I would have. But he's intimidated by me, probably. I have my differences with him. And on Pod Save America, I was pretty open about some of my frustrations, especially when I felt like Abdul reflected a style of politics on the left that seems more interested in winning factional battles within the Democratic Party than uniting to feed Trump and the Republicans. But he also overcame an unprecedented onslaught by inspiring voters to believe in a politics that actually delivers for people, that breaks with the lethargy and lack of imagination of the Democratic establishment. And we all have an interest in proving that super PAC ads cannot decide who wins and loses our elections. Ads should only influence what medicine we demand from our doctors and how fat our children get before they're ultimately prescribed Ozempic. I also actually worked with Haley Stevens on the Hillary campaign in 2008, and what I saw reflected the person I knew then. A hard working, practical, goofy, kind person. But the actual campaign she led was pretty bankrupt, where she's smiling and turning cranks on a factory floor while her allies are doing the dirty work of trying to destroy Abdul, and rarely directly. AIPAC isn't running ads explaining why Abdul is wrong to call Israel's conduct of the war in Gaza a genocide. AIPAC is running ads taking quotes out of context to smear him on unrelated issues. I am worried about the damage these ads have already done. And if the polls overestimated Abdul's support against Stevens, they might be overestimating his support against Rogers. Which means we now have an uphill climb in a race that could determine control of the Senate, which could decide whether or not Trump can replace Alito or Thomas with younger and somehow more extreme versions. Imagine a Samuel Alito who plays Minecraft and uses the R word in opinions. Too often the Democratic establishment has gotten behind figures that aren't exciting or inspiring, who reflect a status quo people despise while arguing the alternative is, in one way or another, unacceptable. Vote for us or else. And I'm not comparing these candidates, obviously, but the pattern Janet Mills, Andrew Cuomo, Haley Stevens, even Hillary Clinton versus Trump. Sorry to lump three qualified women in with Andrew Cuomo. Three delivered bad messages, one delivered bad massages. The point is, over and over again, voters choose or else. Because your promises don't mean much when no one trusts you to deliver. And your electability threats don't carry much weight when no one trusts that you know how to win. Given that we have lost the White House, the Senate, the House, and most governorships and legislatures, you're the boy who cried wolf. If that boy also had a pet wolf who kept getting loose and terrorizing the town. It is absolutely true that to win in states like Michigan, Democrats have to bring in more moderate voters that take issue with unpopular left wing views. And look, I'm not afraid to say it. I don't think trans people should get special priority on OpenTable. I also don't think there should be one big communal popcorn bucket at the movie theater that everyone reaches into. But how about we try doing politics? Republicans are going to call Abdul a communist and a terrorist. That is not an exaggeration. That's what Trump and Mike Rogers did today. They want to make this race about anything other than the actual stakes. Whether or not we will have a Senate completely enthralled to Trump, his tax cuts for the rich, cuts to health care, corruption, immigration crackdown, the wars, or whether we can have a Senate that holds Trump accountable while beginning the long and hard task of imagining what comes next. In which we should all be glad to have a Abdul's voice. That ought to excite all of us. It ought to inspire all of us. And if we can make that case, we can win. And I think we should try that. So if you want to be involved in this midterm election, go to votesaveamerica.com, i'm once again asking you to sign up. Take all that energy, your worry, your concerns, your hopes, and put it into actually getting involved in this campaign. We can win the House. We have a chance of Taking the Senate. And that matters so much more than whatever internecine battles we've had. So thank you. Back to you, John, you beautiful son of a bitch. And we're back. Thank you, future John. You still got it. Now back to the show. We'll have Poorna Jagannathan out in a moment. But first, if you haven't gotten tickets to Crooked Con yet, there are some exciting new faces joining us at Crooked. We believe the answer to rising right wing authoritarianism is a big, welcoming, fun, pro democracy movement. We invited some of the biggest voices online to all day CrookedCon. At CrookedCon you'll have the chance to meet creators and new media personalities who make sense of the news with humor and hot takes. They'll be bopping around the D.C. convention center hosting happy hours, Q&As and workshops for attendees. They'll also be making content because what happens at CrookedCon ends up online for every political person and nerd to see. Check out which creators are joining us so [e-mail] and grab your tickets today. We will see you in dc. All right. Let those who worship evils might beware my power. And my next guest from HBO's Lanterns, please welcome to the stage Poorna Jagannathan.

[D]

Hi.

[C]

Hi.

[A]

Thanks for being here.

[D]

Nice to have you.

[A]

Come on through. Hi.

[D]

Hello, John.

[A]

In Green Lantern comics, the lanterns can create anything into existence and the fights are still close.

[D]

Why such a good question.

[A]

Shouldn't it not be close? Is that all it is?

[D]

I think so.

[A]

Is it? You have to imagine the things.

[D]

You have to have a massive and out. Imagine the other person.

[A]

Right.

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, I understand there's a lot of sex scenes in the show.

[D]

There's just a couple.

[A]

And do you have any tips? Because I plan to do a lot of sex scenes soon.

[D]

I do. If it's hbo. Take it all off, John.

[A]

Sure, yeah.

[D]

Depends on the network. You know, I would like. Literally, my only advice is to have a great intimacy coordinator, but.

[A]

So you'd mentioned that your Lanterns sex scenes were a point of pride at 53 years old. Now, we were looking through your IMDb and we noticed that you had been asked to play a lot of doctors.

[D]

Correct.

[A]

You've been over and over again. And I think this is something that

[D]

South Asian women, the doctors are not having sex scenes.

[A]

There's fewer sex scenes for the doctors. A lot more stat.

[D]

Right, right.

[A]

But it feels like you're at this moment where you're getting like you're in parts that are much more kind of. I Don't know, a wider range of performances. Like in Deli Boys, you get to be a villain and Lanterns, you're banging it out. You know, that must be nice.

[D]

It's great. It's great. I mean, I think, you know, starting my career, there was a lot of like stereotyping going on. Right. And they didn't see Indian women as anything beyond like a doctor's role or a lawyer's role. And I think that's what's really shifted. Like now a lot of creators of color are reimagining the Indian woman as more three dimensional character. And in Lanterns, I not only have sex is not the only thing I do.

[A]

No. And I know that.

[D]

Yes.

[A]

Well, I haven't seen the show yet, but I instinctively knew that.

[D]

Yes, yes. But, you know, and I said that the question really was what? It was something that you were really proud of. It was really something I was terrified of. So. And I, you know, it happened and it, it looks great on screen, but I was terrified of it.

[A]

Now you talked about this at Comic Con. This is your first time going to Comic Con. Now Damon Lindelof was on this show.

[D]

I love him.

[A]

And this was. He had just mentioned lanterns and he made a joke about dropping the word green. And he had. And he made a little. He made like a light hearted comment about the green being stupid. He then months later, when I think the show was getting some more press, he faced such a backlash from such a passionate online.

[D]

You go to Comic Con and you understand why. So we were in a place called Hall. Have you been to Comic Con?

[B]

Mm.

[D]

So do you know Hall H. The big one? Yeah. 7,500 people. And when you're sitting on the panel, you can see the end of. You can see the end. Right. It's just this cavernous and it's full. But I would say 80% of the audience was dressed as Green Lantern, you know, and like it is just people who are so insanely proud and into it and know every minutiae of everything. It's a point of pride to them, you know, so first of all, there's so much green in the show. But they even in the trailer, like they felt there wasn't enough green in the teaser. And they came after, you know, they came after hbo. They wanted to be as close to their version of as close to their love as humanly possible.

[A]

I feel like we went through this phase on comic books where. And it was part of the culture around movies and television generally, which is people really didn't want heroes they wanted anti heroes. And what was popular on television was sort of everything from, you know, Tony Soprano to Don Draper to Walter White and Breaking Bad. And then the superheroes had to be grittier and more real. And that meant, like, kind of draining out some of the color, making it a little less earnest. But it feels like we're coming back a little bit towards, I don't know, like, Spider man is, like, a more earnest character. Like, how. How does this fit into that? Right? Like, let's say from the. You know, on the scale of from Superman to Watchmen, is Lanterns more towards the kind of, like, Spider Man, Superman, old school, or is it more like the kind of Watchmen style, like, new take on it? Like, where does Lanterns fit in?

[D]

I think it's totally. It's, you know, within the world of Damon and Chris and Tom, which is very much in the Watchmen. It actually feels much closer to a true detective than anything else. You know, it's cool. It's not so much a buddy cop story because they're antagonists in the show, but it feels. I don't want to say. Look, I am not really. I haven't indulged in the comic book genre since I was a teenager. And then when I read the script, it was so hugely relatable. It's a very human script. And, you know, it's an old guard, new guard story. It's a power struggle story. And it's gritty. It's not what you think. And the twists and the backstory and the turns and the writing and the. The greediness is insane. I remember reading something, and I just. You know, I had. By mis. Not by mistake. Cause it's what I do. I take, like, a 5 milligram gummy. And then I read the script, and I time it so that I'm ready to, like, you know, sleep after it. Like, it doesn't hit me. And I remember I'd taken it, and I read the last page, and I was like, did I do acid by mistake? Like, the reveals and the twists and the turns. Hi, Tom. The twists and the turns were just unbelievable.

[A]

I once had an edible, and I took too much of it and then went to Korean barbecue. And then halfway through the meal, I said, I need to go home and write an apology email because I screwed something up several years ago.

[D]

And did you?

[A]

I did.

[D]

Ready to go? There you go.

[A]

You also in Deli Boys?

[D]

Yes.

[A]

And you said that you watched Real Housewives of Orange county to research being a villain.

[D]

That's right.

[A]

What is it? About what is it about the. What are you drawing on from the world of Real Housewives?

[D]

Okay, I'm gonna rephrase that. It's not so much villain. I felt like the character is a very physical character and there's a lot of physical comedy. And I was looking through and, you know, she's powerful. She's like a cocaine queenpin.

[A]

Right, right. Some would say that that's not good, but yeah, okay.

[D]

Correct.

[A]

You have to see them as a hero. You're playing this person as a hero. But presumably a cocaine kingpin is like, sort of on the wrong side of the book.

[D]

Totally. And I describe her as, like, not having any exes, you know, because none of them are alive. Like, she just. And you know, she'll shoot someone before she. She. Like, it's just an instinct. Right. She's just very violent. But it's a very physical character. And two things happened for season one. I was really looking through the Housewives and I landed on Orange County. They seemed the most physical of them all. And like, you see Lucky, like, doing a lot of this and slapping people and throwing stuff a lot. So that's what it was for season two. Their storyline is that one of her kind of surrogate sons is in jail. So I pivoted to Housewives of New Jersey. Did you ever see the episode with Teresa where she goes to jail?

[A]

I'm familiar with it, but it's not my culture. I've been in New York and Atlanta and Beverly Hills, but I haven't yet been in New Jersey.

[D]

I heard Rhode island is the best.

[A]

Rhode island is fantastic.

[D]

You've seen it.

[A]

Oh, my. It's fantastic.

[D]

How is it different from Orange County?

[A]

Well, it actually harks back to the kind of old school Orange County, New York style, because they really seem to. They really know each other. There's not a cast. These feel like friends and people that are in each other's lives the way it did, I think a little bit more when you had people that were kind of just felt. When it was more documentary style. So that's, I think, what makes it sort of more intimate. And they'll have a fight at a child's birthday party for sure, which you gotta have. That's what you gotta have. Yeah, I see the.

[D]

That's it. Like, for any small thing, there's violence, which is how the character Lucky really is. Any small thing, she'll. Her first instinct is to choose violence.

[A]

The other thing about the Housewives that I've thought about, I remember when I was in politics There was. I'm gonna anonymize this story a little bit. But there was a person who had a non compete at a private firm. And they were offered a very exciting opportunity to come work for the government. And their boss, who they'd worked for forever, had a close relationship with, said, no, I need you at the company right now. And he said, but I've been loyal to you forever. I'm owed my chance. How could you do this? I'll never forget this. And the boss said, you're mad, and you'll always be a little mad, but no matter what you do, you'll be less mad over time.

[D]

It's true.

[A]

And it was this moment of someone just saying, I'm gonna just do the worst thing because it's useful to me right now, and I'll deal with the consequences later. Or maybe I won't.

[D]

Wiser words have never been spoken.

[A]

Yeah. Also the villain in that story.

[D]

That's so treacherous.

[A]

Yeah, not great.

[D]

So treacherous.

[A]

Now, because you're in Lanters, you're part of the DC Comics universe, you're in good company, but you're also in some interesting and surprising company. Which is why we're gonna quiz you now in a game we're calling Superpower Bottoms. Here's how it works. We're you a superpower. You tell us if this is an actual power of a superhero or villain from DC Comics.

[D]

Okay, you do know. I don't know much about this genre.

[A]

Let's see how you do. All right, first up, is this a real or fake superpower? Can eat anything they want.

[D]

Fake.

[A]

It's real. Matter Eater Lad was an alien from the planet Bismol named Tenzil Chem, who can eat any material known to man. Created by Jerry Siegel and John Forte.

[D]

That's right.

[A]

He first appeared in 1962.

[D]

Cool.

[A]

Next up, heads fall off so they can beat people with it.

[D]

Definitely true.

[A]

No, that one's fake. There is a superhero whose arms fall off so he can beat people with it, which is cool. My power will astound you. Observe as I detach my limb. I think that's cool.

[D]

I feel like I could write a comic book, frankly, after seeing these examples.

[A]

What do you think his the name of this character was? One guess. First thing that pops to your mind. Arm fall off boy.

[D]

Was that actually his name?

[A]

Yes. Arm fall off boy tried to fail to become a member of the legion of superheroes.

[D]

Did he make it?

[A]

No.

[D]

Got it.

[A]

Next up, a character that shoots various condiments at people.

[D]

Yes.

[A]

Yes. It's real Condiment king.

[D]

What condiment?

[A]

What Condiment king? Created by Bruce Timm for Batman. And Paw, created for Batman the Animated series. A parody of Silver age DC supervillains. He shot all sorts of condiments from his condiment guns.

[D]

That's a true Indian superhero.

[A]

In the world of the comet, the condiments could be fatal if they triggered anaphylactic shock. So you had to get someone who was allergic to relish.

[D]

Turmeric. Yep.

[A]

Next up. Containing thousands of disgusting diseases to infect her enemy with.

[D]

100%.

[A]

That's real.

[D]

Yeah. Yeah.

[A]

The infectious lass, an alien superhero.

[D]

That's amazing. This really reignites my interest in comic books. Oh, she was a woman.

[A]

That's right. Infectious alien superheroes can be women now. I'm surprised you don't. I'm surprised.

[D]

I'm surprised by that of it all.

[A]

Okay, next up, being a fire breathing dachshund.

[D]

True.

[A]

Yeah. Hot dog.

[C]

Ha.

[A]

Cool.

[D]

No, that's someone who's real.

[A]

Yeah, that's Dachshund, the fire breathing dog named Hot Dog.

[D]

Wow.

[A]

You've won the game.

[D]

I've won it.

[A]

Lanterns premieres on HBO Max August 16th. Deli Boyz season one and two are on Hulu. Portal will be back at the end of the show and we'll be right back.

[D]

I can't wait. Wait, what's my present?

[A]

Oh, just the job well done. Way to go. And can we fly in a T shirt? We'll get you something.

[D]

Thank you.

[A]

We'll be right back. Hey, don't go anywhere. There's more of Love it or leave it coming up. Love it or leave it is brought to you by Helix. I have a Helix mattress. I have the Dawn Luxe. It's super comfortable. I'm really glad I have it. Sleep on it every goddamn night. You know, like at the end of the day, especially, like if you've had a long day, you've just been running around. It's like the great moment when you, like, you sort of get into bed and you have to go, ugh. And then you can stream until your brain shuts down. And part of that is my super comfortable Helix mattress. How do you know which mattress is right for you? You take the Helix sleep quiz and it will match you with the perfect mattress based on your personal preferences and sleep needs. They have over 20 mattress models so you can find the perfect model for you. Helix delivers your mattress right to your door with free shipping in the US the happy with Helix guarantee makes trying your new mattress completely risk free. Enjoy A customer first experience with seamless returns and easy exchanges so you can truly rest easy. Plus, Helix offers a 120 night sleep trial and limited lifetime warranty. I'm a huge fan of Helix. Go check it [e-mail] love it for 20% off sitewide that's helixsleep.com love it for twenty percent off site wide. Helixsleep.com loveit hey, it's Tommy from Pod

[B]

Save America and Pot Save the World. Last year, 2,500 people joined us at CrookedCon for conversations with some of the smartest organizers, least annoying politicians, and most interesting voices in politics to talk about how to fix this mess. Even President Obama made a surprise appearance. We're doing it all again November 5th to 7th in Washington D.C. with even more podcasts, panels and workshops. Plus there'd be drinks, which we'll need after the midterms. No matter which way they go. Get [e-mail] if you're a friend of the pod, you get a discount to see you there.

[A]

And we're back. My next guest is a bad gay, but I have a feeling I'm worse. Please welcome to the stage Elliot Glaser. Hi. Thanks for being here.

[E]

Thank you for having me. Ooh, I love this couch.

[A]

So you have a new book out. The Terrible, Horrible, no Good, Very Bad Gay. You seem like a perfectly normal gay to me. What makes you a bad gay?

[E]

I just seem to have missed a lot of cues. You know, there's just a lot that goes on in the sort of homo normative space. Oh, that. I just feel like I've missed these cues for 20 or so years. I'm not tantruming, I'm just observing. Yeah, I'm observing.

[A]

I mean, you seem like a perfectly normal gay to me, and I might

[E]

even say that, but I think for the purposes of the book, there needs to be a flashy title.

[A]

Oh, I think you should lean into it a little harder than that.

[E]

Okay. I'm so bad at it. I'm so total failure.

[A]

What is it about, though? Here's what I always felt when I was young and gay and then older and gay is it's like, who. When did you all figure this out?

[E]

That's exactly the point.

[A]

When did you all kind of. Was there a meeting I missed?

[E]

That's what I. That's the point. The book is essentially about how I feel. Like I missed day one of gay 101. Like I missed the syllabus. And that everybody seems to understand. And I know not everybody feels this way. But at the very least, I feel like people are good at pretending that they can. And I just can't do.

[A]

Was. Yes. I just can't do it. I would walk. I was like, how did. What did I. Like, what happened? What were you doing in high school when I was in mock trial and doing speech and debate, when you were cracking all of these sort of secrets? I just had no. I felt I was flummoxed.

[E]

I was baffled, Completely baffled. And that genuinely is the flow of the book, is trying to figure that out from youth and high school to adulthood. But the irony, of course, is that, you know, I came out at, like, 20 as a college freshman thinking, I'm ready. I'm gonna take this on. I'm gonna. I really was academic about it. I was reading books about being gay. I was trying to intern, and I be in that part of, like, nightlife.

[A]

Never occurred to me to read a book about it.

[E]

Well, that was my. I mean, that was my first instinct, is to, like, do something bookish and really try to follow the rules of an actual guide that I'd ordered, that I'd been gifted, actually, and I failed every chapter one by one.

[A]

Now, in high school, you talked about working at Talbot's.

[E]

Yes.

[A]

And you had to hide your sort of. The homosexuality. I was sort of poking through the. Poking through the.

[E]

How well can you hide being gay when you're working at Talbots in high school?

[D]

Right.

[A]

How did. How did you hide it?

[E]

How did I hide it? I deflected. You know, there were certainly a couple of my lovely co workers who were trying to, like, you know, get the dirt on, like, what girls I was into. And I'm like, do you see where we.

[A]

Do you see where we are?

[E]

Like, this is the missy section of Talbots, and I am selling cardigans and dusters to you.

[A]

I feel like we're contemporaries, and I feel like we were growing up and realizing we were gay at the last period of time where people could sound the way that we do and people would still not think of it. You know what I'm saying? It was just like, oh, yes. I remember being asked over a girlfriend. Listen to how I'm talking. Look at what my hand's doing when I say this.

[E]

Right.

[A]

You know what I'm saying? But there was still. There was still, like, a kind of generation that just. It was just not. It wasn't even that they were pretending to not think about it. They truly weren't thinking about it.

[E]

Yeah. I mean, even I was watching the Rosie o' donnell Show. And I was like, she just hasn't found the right guy yet.

[A]

I really was just like, she really liked Tom Cruise.

[E]

She loved Tom Cruise. But I mean, genuinely. I also, you know, obviously it was my own secret, you know, in Y2K 90s era where I was just guarding it with all my life. But I don't know, at the same time, like, I just also wasn't thinking it about everybody else. And they think that was the last bastion before Glee, basically.

[A]

Yeah, before Glee changed it all.

[E]

Glee world.

[A]

The world of Glee, Post Glee world. Yeah. You know, AG we live in it's year set. It's year 21 AG.

[E]

After Glee.

[A]

After Glee, we start again. We started again after that super bowl where they put that Glee episode on in the craziest programming decision in all of human history. Like, you know what people are gonna want after the Super Bowl?

[E]

Glee.

[A]

Whatever the fuck this is.

[E]

Glee.

[A]

Glee. I also, I have found in thinking back to that period where I was figuring it out what it. Figuring out what it is to be gay is. There was very little to me in the conversation or in just what I knew about it that had to do with gender. Like, gender was not part of it at all. Like, being gay was. Maybe you could be effeminate and that's just. Was a quality of being gay. But you were. But really what it was was you are attracted to men, and that is the secret. But all the other aspects of it that are clearly associated with being gay were either seen as incidental or a separate matter, which is basically having the qualities of your female friends. Did you find that, like, were your friends girls in college? Like, was that part of what it was for you to be? Or were you sort of more like, have you become, I think, more feminine as you become more comfortable being gay? I think would be the question.

[E]

That's a good question. I mean, I still feel like a dope most of the time. Like an oafish dope often, but. Oh, thank you. But I think at the same time, like getting older, there is a joy to like letting loose a little bit. And I don't know if the word's like feminine, but just like. Yeah, like care less, you know. But back then, I mean, back then it was a different story. But I also feel like, at least, yeah, when we were young, you were just gay and like queer wasn't really even a term that would cross my path at any point. Whereas now it's. I use that. I identify as that. And you know, the spectrum is so wide. And it feels like weird to not acknowledge that to a degree.

[A]

You tell a story in the book about accidentally dying one of your teeth blue. Can you walk us through it?

[E]

Sure. There was a summer where I had to get my front tooth replaced and I didn't realize for some reason I thought that they take the tooth out and then put a new one in right away. And the dentist was like that's not how that works. You have to take it out, put a post in your gum grows around it and then they put the new tooth in. So yeah, I didn't know that either. So basically I had to wear a flipper for several months which is basically like a kid adheses to the adheres to the top of the roof of your mouth and then it's just like a fake tooth right here. And so I was basically at. I was seeing a gentleman who lived like two hours south of la. He was under house arrest. Because I make my choices. Uh huh.

[A]

And you know where he is though. It's kind of cool.

[E]

What's that?

[A]

You kind of know where he is?

[E]

I do at all times. It's like a.

[A]

Kind of like. It's like pre. Find my. And you don't have to worry about Find my.

[E]

He doesn't have to track.

[A]

The government has found him.

[E]

He's being trapped.

[A]

He's been found. You. Yes, says the government.

[E]

Yes. I was his chauffeur. Sometimes like the times that we were allowed to. He was allowed to go out. I would take us on excursions to Trader Joe's and all the sexy spots. But I had my flipper with me basically and I forgot my. Is this really interesting?

[A]

I think the fact that you drove two hours to see someone under house arrest is sort of interesting. Whether for us or a therapist. Somebody's interested. I'm a little. I. I would say that I'm concerned. Concerned about the choices you're making.

[E]

That was because I was like I will go anywhere to find a guy who's like, like reads, you know, like I just felt like I couldn't.

[A]

I got nobody in the tmz.

[D]

Huh.

[E]

This was just. This was what. He was lovely. Except for the house arrest thing.

[A]

Well, sure. Other than that Mrs. Lincoln, et cetera. But we believe in rehabilitation. Shame on all of you.

[E]

Fully.

[A]

And so I mean I would say this just sorry to sort of introduce some nuance. No problem that you're seeing somebody under house arrest. No problem that you're driving two hours to see somebody. I think my main concern is you're driving Two hours to see somebody under house arrest.

[E]

Right?

[A]

That, to me is where you're sort

[E]

of like, well, when that, when that, when he was out of house arrest, when he was done with his sentence, I was like super excited for him to come up to LA and see, like, my world. And he didn't.

[A]

Wow.

[E]

He ghosted. I was like, cool, cool, cool, cool. This is great. But you want to hear how the tooth got.

[A]

Yeah. What happened with the tooth?

[E]

Basically, Long story short, I was at his place and I didn't. I forgot my, like, tooth cleaner or whatever. So instead of putting it in like a normal denture cleaner, I soaked it in Listerine, thinking that did the same thing. And so by the time I woke up and I had to rush back to LA to get to a Sunday audition of all things, my tooth was smurf blue. But I fell in love with him, like deeply, chemically fell in love with him because as I was panicking, I found him in the kitchen, like hunched over the sink, brushing it with like, bleach. He was like a real, like, clean freak. And I was like, I'm getting married. This is. We are getting married. He's my betrothed. This is it. But no, but, no, but, no, but

[A]

there was a real connection there.

[E]

Exactly.

[A]

And he couldn't come to yours.

[E]

My what?

[D]

Home?

[E]

No, no, that didn't happen.

[A]

Now, speaking of being a bad gay, you also have a sports podcast called you'd Think youk Can Sports with Tracker Justin Hartley and Charles Barkley's producing it.

[E]

That's cool. Yes.

[A]

Do you know of sports?

[E]

So the podcast is. Yeah, it'll be out in a few months. It's called so youo Think youk Can Sports. And the point of it all is that I know absolutely nothing about sports.

[A]

That's a relief. That's a relief to me.

[E]

I know nothing. And so. And Charles is the EP and Justin Hartley is the ep. So it's some real, like, big man CIS dude sports energy. And I'm just sitting down with world class athletes as the dumbest human being they have ever met.

[A]

I'm jealous of the full sports experience because, like, the energy that comes off.

[E]

Oh, my God.

[A]

Oh, my God. It's like every. There's a finale of their favorite show every Sunday. That's so cool.

[E]

It's a drug that they're on at all times that they can. There's community. There's community clothing, places to go, things to eat, cities to visit. There's so many things that go into that sports fan identity that I would love to inherently have that. And yet I couldn't care less.

[A]

I know. And there was a drag.

[E]

Oh, but wait, have you seen the Savannah Bananas?

[A]

Yes, I've seen the Savannah Bananas.

[E]

I'm into that. Cause they're hot. But also they are hot. It is fun.

[A]

They are hot. When my parents were here, there was somehow the Savannah Bananas came up and my dad just kept saying over and over, and it's great baseball.

[E]

Just so you know.

[A]

Elliot, inspired by your book.

[E]

Yeah.

[A]

We thought we'd both share a few ways in which we are bad gays in a segment we're calling Is it just Me? I'll go first. I struggle with the term partner.

[E]

Yes, partner. Oh, sorry, the question.

[A]

No, I'm here. Go for it.

[E]

Yeah, the term partner. I feel like that's been co opted by straight people now. So, yeah, the onus is less on us. But it always felt like I'm not in a law part. You know, I don't practice law. This is my boyfriend or my husband. It just felt too formal and almost like, I don't know, stodgy.

[A]

Yes, there's something dusty. Cause I remember there's a part of it comes up in the film American Beauty. Fantastic performance by Kevin Spacey. The rest doesn't hold up as well,

[E]

of course,

[A]

but Scott Bakula and his partner and that introduced himself as partner. And once I'm a lawyer, I'm a periodontist. And that always stuck with me of what partner was. And I'm married now, but my spouse, who I alternate between husband, spouse and partner because they're non binary. And like, partner sucks. Husband doesn't feel right. Spouse feels like we're doing last will and Testament, you know? Sure, sure. There's no good word.

[E]

There's no good word. And also it feels like it does feel co opted in the sense that when straight people do it, they're doing it as a way to keep you guessing. And it's like, I know what's going on here.

[A]

Well, yes, it is a way. Yes, yes, it is. The keeping guessing.

[E]

It's like they want to kind of be cool like us. Mysterious.

[A]

Yeah. It's like this is our word. And also we don't want it anymore.

[E]

We don't want it anymore. That's right.

[A]

Now you in the book, you talk about not liking poppers.

[E]

Yeah, I don't want that. Makes my head hurt. It makes me dizzy. And again, it's another thing that I feel has been co opted by straight people. But I'm like, God bless, like Take them. I don't really understand them. I know they're for your, like, butt. But, like, then you get.

[A]

You do understand them.

[E]

Oh, I do. I understand.

[A]

Because that's it.

[E]

I understand that they're for your butt. I don't understand, like, why do them while, like, dancing or something?

[A]

Yeah, sort of. I think people like it as a kind of, like. It's like, almost like a. What's that thing people would do? Whippets. It's almost like a whippet. Yeah.

[E]

But it lasts so short, and I don't know, it's just. It just makes my head hurt.

[A]

Yeah, I agree with that. And I'll do one more, which is. Everything's so loud.

[E]

Too loud. Too loud. The idea of. I don't know. This took a long time to admit, but it's like the idea of being like, let's go out. You know, we are going out. It's like, to a loud thing again. There's so many loud things. And I just. I would love a gay, like, library. A gay sound bath. You know, something.

[C]

Shh.

[A]

I used to wear earplugs when I

[E]

went to

[A]

very rarely. There was this one big club people go to in D.C. when I lived there, and I would just put in my earplugs and go, there you are.

[E]

That is golden to me.

[A]

And then one time I forgot my earplugs, and it was so loud and my ears hurt. And I swear to God, I believe that the day before, if I was passed by a fire truck, I would have to cover my ears thereafter. And I think that one night without the earplugs had an impact. Is that crazy?

[E]

I believe you, and I support that. And I also think I do. I love the idea of earplugs at the club or whatever.

[A]

Normalize earplugs. I have them all over the place. I'm always wearing earplugs.

[E]

But, like, I guess I also don't understand the idea of, like, going out with the purpose of, like, meeting other guys but needing to, like, scream over music for it. It's like, this is. Let's go to the library or a park or something.

[A]

Because here's. Here's what I think. I. Because I think this is the tyranny of, like, if people have different arrows in their quiver. Like, I feel like if there's a. Everyone's on a spectrum that runs from, I'm out here, 100% looks all the way to 100% personality.

[E]

Yeah.

[A]

And basically, it's a kind of, like, tyranny of the good looking and the. And the appearance based community on the personality and charm based community.

[E]

Exactly that.

[A]

Because you're in there, you're screaming. It's like nobody can see what I'm selling here.

[E]

Correct.

[A]

I'm not. What I'm offering requires silence.

[E]

I need quiet to sell this.

[A]

Yeah, like let's. Does anybody want to talk about politics?

[E]

I mean, I imagine it's different in D.C. though.

[A]

You'd think.

[E]

No.

[A]

Thank you, Elliot Glaser. Thank you. The Terrible, Horrible, no Good, Very Bad Gay hit stores on August 11th. And we'll be right back. Hey, don't go anywhere. There's more of Love it or Leave it coming up. Love it or Leave it is brought to you by Thrive Market. The best thing about Thrive Market is that it takes the chore out of grocery shopping rather than wandering through crowded stores. You can customize your shopping experience online. Filter by your personal health goals and dietary needs to find exactly what you need in seconds. No stressing over labels or googling. Every additive, every product and brand is vetted before they ever hit the site. The IN app barcode scanner finds a healthier swap for almost anything in your pantry right now. Member pricing up to 30% off plus weekly sales plus free gifts plus price matching plus free delivery on qualifying orders, all in the membership. 90 plus filters mean you're only seeing

[B]

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[B]

Hey, it's Tommy from Pod Save America and Pot Save the world. Last year, 2,500 people joined us at CrookedCon for conversations with some of the smartest organizers, least annoying politicians, and most interesting voices in politics to talk about how to fix this mess. Even President Obama made a surprise appearance. We're doing it all again November 5th to 7th in Washington D.C. with even more podcasts, panels and workshops. Plus there'll be drinks, which we'll need after the midterms, no matter which way they go. Get [e-mail] if you're a friend of the pod, you get a discount too. See you there.

[A]

And we're back. Like a gorgeous Bluetooth glimmering in the sea of normal white teeth. It's the most beautiful things that are the least appreciated, which is why we must celebrate them in a segment we're calling I Don't Care.

[C]

I love it.

[A]

Let's welcome Poorna back to the Back to the stage. Welcome back.

[D]

Thank you.

[A]

Join us here.

[E]

Hello.

[A]

Here's how it works. We're each gonna rant about a topic that's something that we love, that maybe other people don't like or might criticize us for loving. Elliot, do you wanna kick us off? Yes.

[E]

Yes, I do.

[B]

Do I?

[E]

Just go.

[A]

Just go.

[E]

Okay. What I love and maybe other people don't love currently is brawl videos on YouTube. I am obsessed with watching people get into fights at crab buffets, at big box stores, parking lots all over America, all over the world. Quite honestly, people have the shortest tempers and the tiniest fuses. And I just love watching people lose it. I don't know, there's something primitive and real about it and I imagine myself in that situation, but I couldn't imagine actually doing the things that they're doing. It's sort of.

[D]

What? What are they doing?

[E]

They're just getting the way that the amount. The way that people get so mad at a drive thru is bonkers. People lose their minds waiting for fast food in the drive thru line. And there's violence, there's gunplay. It is. It's wild. There's a show called TV show in particular called Customer Wars. There's a whole franchise of wars, Customer wars, road wars, neighborhood wars. I think Christmas Wars. I am obsessed. I can't get enough.

[A]

What does it do? What is it about the conflict? Is it that there's an aspect of the justice to it? What is it that is coming? What is it satisfying when you say it's primitive, what is it hitting?

[E]

So my sister has always called me street justice because I have this. I'm generally like a nice and polite person. You might even say conflict avoidant. But when it comes to somebody doing wrong by my friend or family, I become a pit bull.

[D]

Wait, how about like a stranger doing it to me? No. If you see someone wronging a stranger, will you get into it?

[E]

Really? I don't know. I kind of have to split the difference.

[A]

If they're doing it to a woman,

[E]

I am in, but I don't know. I feel like it's. I just. It is. There is a Catharsis there, because I am yearning for that. That sense of justice.

[A]

Do you feel. Because part of it I do think, like, I see. I get fed a lot of this kind of stuff, and I think everybody does, whether it's like, people arguing or street stuff, road rage stuff. And I do think it's because we kind of. Maybe there's like a. I think it's because, like, I feel like, oh, people are being kind of more ruder. More rude or more insensitive or more kind of oblivious in public.

[E]

And then, like, I mean, now than ever before.

[A]

Yeah. And like, I'm just. And I just sort of huff and I get annoyed. And then you see these videos where it's like. Like coming to some sort of peak. And there's something satisfying about that in an unhealthy way, I think.

[E]

Absolutely unhealthy. People are uncaged. And it feels like a very post 2015 kind of behavior. And so watching it unfurl, I mean, it's a guilty pleasure in the sense that it's terrible for my brain and my eyes.

[A]

Because you must be getting a little mad. You're getting activated, as the therapist might say.

[E]

But it's so engaging.

[A]

Do you do this right before bed?

[E]

I try not to, but. Oh, my God, I can't turn away. I can't turn away. I mean, I feel like we used to have Worldstar Hip Hop, that site where they would have all these brawls and public fights, but I never.

[C]

I don't know.

[E]

That wasn't just for me, but this especially. I mean, it's a lot of COVID era stuff. It's a lot of that. And there is some sense of, I don't know, the Karen video era. It's a lot of that. And the way watching people misbehave on airplanes fills me with some sense of disgusting, puerile joy that I just can't shake.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. It's because it's a public execution. Yes, I agree. I feel the same. I'm not judging. Poorna, what is your. I don't care. I love it. That took a very serious turn.

[D]

Mine is so stupid.

[A]

That's perfect.

[E]

We love stupid.

[A]

It needs to be.

[D]

But I would really appreciate some riff on it. It is a Japanese toilet.

[E]

Oh, it's like a Toto.

[A]

Ah.

[E]

Oh, my God, you love it.

[D]

Obsessed.

[E]

How fancy is your toilet? Are we talking bidet? Are we talking way more? I mean, I know, obviously.

[D]

I mean, it doesn't talk, but literally does everything else.

[A]

If this toilet could talk, what would

[D]

it Say the stories, the judgment. I will. I. This is hard because I, I, Yeah, I understand how people don't have them in their homes when it is an option.

[A]

When you go once you. So they have the, like the little. And I'll say. I say this as an advocate. I buy these as gifts. Just so you know, I'm a.

[D]

You buy what is gifts?

[A]

I buy the. To the. The kind that you can add to an already existing toilet and it's cheap. Or the Toto washlet.

[D]

It's not.

[A]

It's not crazy. It's not crazy. And I give it as a gift sometimes because I am a true believer. I will never go back because people think, oh, it must be nice.

[D]

No, no, it's not nice. It's not a nice to have.

[A]

It's not that it changes. It makes every day a little bit better. And that's great. But here's what it can also do. Yes, it can take what would have been a bad day and turn it into a forgettable day. It can turn a bad day into a normal day, not just a normal day into a better day. It can make a day that would have been terrible into something fine. You know what I'm saying?

[D]

Thank you so much. You know what I'm saying? So articulate. But it's also. In the middle of the night, you go to the bathroom and the seat is so warm.

[A]

Oh, yeah.

[D]

It's like, oh, my God. It's delightful to take a shit. You know what I mean? Not in the middle of the night. That's not what I'm.

[C]

Middle of the night.

[D]

No.

[A]

That's exciting.

[D]

But it's delightful. And it has so many buttons. I don't know. I just use the basic button, but has so many, so many different permutations, combinations.

[E]

You need to experiment. You need to press those buttons.

[D]

Good with technology. I gotta say, I'm not great. I should really go for it, though.

[E]

Go for it.

[A]

There's only so bad wrong. You can go in there. You know what I'm saying?

[D]

I mean, there's a. My remote has about eight buttons to it. I have no idea. I just use one.

[E]

There are seven very interesting paths you could take.

[D]

Like, what are you guys, Japanese? Like, what are the other buttons doing? There's a front and back. Like, I know that you've got it.

[A]

I think, you know, I think you know the ins and outs of this thing.

[D]

I've never used the air dryer.

[E]

I would try that. Why not?

[D]

Yeah. What else is there?

[E]

Yourself.

[D]

Okay.

[A]

Tonight, there's the Button that calls the hospital

[D]

the emergency. Like, you just. Like, you just fly off.

[E]

You flew through the ceiling.

[D]

Yeah, but it's really, like, sometimes I don't even want to leave my house. It's so wonderful.

[E]

And does it raise and close by itself? Yeah, that's elevated.

[D]

Like, come on.

[E]

That's sophistication.

[D]

So downstairs we have the cheaper version, but upstairs in the master bedroom, upgraded, that shit costs, like 3,000 bucks.

[E]

Yeah.

[A]

The Lambo. The Lambo of the toilets. It's a. You know, we got all the best. You get all the bells and whistles.

[E]

Oh, God.

[A]

But you know what? You know, that's when you think about rooms you're gonna spend a lot of time in. There's a reason they call it the throne.

[E]

And also, I mean, I think as a gay guy, I can say.

[D]

Tell me.

[E]

Yeah, I feel like at this point, it's pretty.

[D]

Wait, do you have one?

[E]

Yeah, I'm almost. I would. At this point, I feel like 8 to 9 out of 10 gay male homes have. Or.

[C]

Yeah.

[E]

Yes, of course.

[A]

Yeah, of course.

[D]

Well.

[A]

Cause, you know, you know. Cause, you know, you know, because, you know.

[D]

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, a lot of South Asian homes still don't have it, which is bizarre to me.

[B]

Mm.

[A]

Probably the gay South Asians homes do have it.

[D]

They do 1,000%.

[A]

All right, I'm up. And mine is gonna be anchovies.

[D]

What?

[A]

Anchovies. I have become. I don't know what's going on. I. I love them. I love them. And I feel like I'm gonna, at some point be diagnosed with some sort of deficiency because something's going on where like. Like, I'm, like, ripping into, like, I'm adding them to eggs in the morning.

[E]

Yeah.

[A]

Like, something.

[D]

The vitamin situation for anchovies. Like, what do they give you?

[A]

I think fish oil.

[E]

Yeah.

[A]

For jointly. Omega fatty acids, as they say.

[D]

Got it.

[E]

Are you doing the tins?

[A]

Tins?

[E]

You're unpeeling the tins?

[A]

I'm unpeeling the tins.

[E]

I feel like in the past few years, a lot of people I know around our age range have gotten into tinned fish.

[A]

Yes.

[E]

And especially the idea of anchovies and eating fresh anchovies. It is funny because it feels like both a healthy choice and a very, like, old Jew choice.

[A]

Yes.

[E]

Because I'm used to that from my grandparents.

[D]

Yes.

[E]

You know, I never would have expected those things to meet that Venn diagram to happen.

[A]

When you were a kid, did your grandparents eat herring?

[E]

Herring.

[A]

Herring and onions. Herring and onions and cream. Do People know about this food? Do people know about this?

[E]

It is so gnarly.

[A]

Herring with onions. No, in cream.

[E]

Yes, in cream.

[A]

In thick cream. It was everywhere.

[E]

I remember it like. And I love my grandparents and miss them dearly, but I remember it specifically in the folds of his mouth.

[A]

Yeah, for sure.

[E]

A white, creamy fish substance.

[C]

Yeah.

[E]

So we've met. But anchovies feel classy sometimes.

[A]

You know, history rhymes. Joe Biden said that. Quoting a poem. Joe Biden quoted a poem once that said that. We'll be right back. And we're back. Well, now it's time for us to really dig in to some second thoughts. Here's how it works. To close out the show, my producers have given me a list of things they wish I hadn't said or done during the show. If you have things you regret from tonight, you can share it as well. This is an opportunity to wonder if

[D]

there are things, regrets.

[A]

If you have any regrets or things you wish you had said differently or any questions you have about things you talked about. This is the place where we talk about it. Mine are. My first. Second thoughts are from the monologue. I made us picture both Trump's weird penis and Biden's dangling hog. I referred to a greasy taint. A lot of audio of RFK Jr. S voice in this episode. Lot of auto, it says. And then really quite a bit of RFK audio. Let's see. I gave Porna not one second to get comfortable before asking about sex scenes. Indeed, I romanticized dating someone on house arrest.

[E]

Mm.

[A]

Didn't make a single Bluetooth joke.

[D]

And you regret that?

[A]

Yeah, I think that's right. It was right there.

[E]

Yeah, it's the title of the book.

[A]

You had to connect when you took it back from it. You had to connect to your Bluetooth.

[E]

Yes.

[A]

You know, for example, that was just sitting there. Got a big laugh, obviously. And then I somehow told an earplug story two shows in a row.

[C]

Really?

[A]

But it's a different earplug story, so I think it's fine. And I don't regret it.

[E]

It's charming.

[D]

Are they telling you what you should be regretting or do you actually. Yes. Oh, okay.

[A]

These are their suggestions.

[D]

Just a judging point.

[A]

And just so you know, they can sometimes give me what is called a kudos.

[D]

Oh, that hasn't come your way.

[A]

Not today.

[C]

Okay.

[A]

No kudos from me today. From the team.

[D]

Okay.

[A]

Someone in a different pen clearly grabbed this paper and wrote, we may have started a toilet based class war. To be clear, the $3,000 toilet is not the one that doesn't cost a lot. I just want to make sure that we're making that distinction.

[D]

How much is it? Just tell me.

[A]

I feel like the higher end one for the. Just the one you add to this could be $200. But there's ones that I think are between a hundred and two hundred.

[E]

Come on.

[A]

And for. Given that, just amortize that across every poop you take over two or three years. That's pennies. Yeah, that's pennies. Depending on your situation. And honestly, the more poops.

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

The more you need it. Any regrets or thoughts before we close?

[E]

I do think it was like, funny when you said that you have like girl brain or that you kind of alluded to the idea that you're like. That you couldn't hide being gay. Cause you're so girly. And I just never would have thought of you that way.

[A]

Well, I think that there's parts. I think like there's like. I think that the. I picture it as almost like whatever is like your personality. Like there's different parts that are more feminine and more masculine and they're. And. And I think the assumption that the ma. That men are, I think fairly probably right. Most cisgendered men are mostly masculine in the ways men are mostly masculine. And so that means that at a gay bar, most of the men have a masculine relationship to sex. It is built around that relationship to sex. But there's a. I think a sizable group of men, probably more than in the straight male community. Because by nature I think we are more feminine and whatever that correlation mean that there are probably more gay guys that have a more feminine, traditionally considered feminine relationship to sex. And I am one of those people. But there was no space to talk about that or think about that or feel normal because of that. Because the expectation is you can go on Grindr or just meet somebody, and if that's not for you, it's hard to find your people because it's fewer of them, I guess.

[E]

Yeah.

[A]

And you're already in a smaller group of people because gay.

[E]

It's small, right?

[A]

Is it gay because it gay?

[D]

I regret not being here during Alia's segments

[A]

and we regret that you weren't here too.

[E]

Interesting.

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

That's our show. Thank you so much to Corner Jack and up and Elliott Glaser. There are 90 days until the midterms and we will be back in your feeds on Friday with a brand new episode. Thanks everybody. Love it or leave it is a crooked media production. Our show is produced by Kendra James, Bill McGrath, Kelsey Gante and me, John Lovett. Our production team includes Hallie Keeper, Sarah Lazarus, Raman Borsalino, Peter Miller, David Towles, Claudia Shang, Jay Beggar. Thanks, Gavin Purcell and Matt De Groat. And our staff is proudly unionized with the Writers Guild of America East.

[B]

Hey, It's Tommy from Pod. Save America and Pot Save the World. Last year, 2,500 people joined us at CrookedCon for conversations with some of the smartest organizers, least annoying politicians, and most interesting voices in politics to talk about how to fix this mess. Even President Obama made a surprise appearance. We're doing it all again November 5th to 7th in Washington, D.C. with even more podcasts, panels and workshops. Plus there'll be drinks, which we'll need after the midterms. No matter which way they go. Get [e-mail] if you're a friend of the pod, you get a discount too. See you there.