← Making Space with Hoda Kotb
Making Space with Hoda Kotb
"Dwyane Wade on Retiring from Basketball and Relying on His Village "
00:37:47
Dwyane Wade is one of the greatest NBA players of all time. The thirteen-time all-star player won three championships during his time in the league. In the six years since his retirement, he's focused on his family and philanthropy, working with the Wade Family Foundation to support communities in need. Wade opened up to Hoda on how he fell in love with basketball, his decision to retire, and his battle with cancer.
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- [00:00]
Hoda Kotb
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- [03:19]
Dwyane Wade
Tell me.
- [03:20]
Hoda Kotb
I thought Dwyane Wade could have had one chapter in his life and it would have been a beautiful book. It could have been the basketball chapter and you would have ended your life. At your eulogy, they would have said, wasn't he the best player, the best teammate, the most competitive? But you didn't choose to have that kind of life. You chose to have a multi chaptered life. Did you design your life or did it just keep kind of revealing itself to you? Yeah.
- [03:48]
Dwyane Wade
First of all, thank you for saying that. When I was a kid, I just. I just wanted to be a basketball player. I didn't even know what else really existed. You know, I didn't know what else was really an option for me, but I knew sports was an option. Right. That's what was kind of positioned to us, you know, in the inner city. It was like, this ball is football, there's basketball, there's baseball, and, you know, once you start getting exposure, once you start getting exposure to people, you start getting exposure to life, you start seeing the other things that are possible. And so once I got to college, it changed everything for me.
- [04:17]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [04:17]
Dwyane Wade
You know, I started being able to meet people from different walks of life, you know, get a chance. And so I've always been curious. And so I always ask questions to people and always seeing that, okay, like, I play a sport and people think it's great, but, like, I think that's great.
- [04:30]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah. You know, like, what do you got going on?
- [04:31]
Dwyane Wade
Yeah, like, I think broadcasting is great. Like, and so for me, I was just like, if I ever get the opportunity, if any doors ever open for me because of, you know, growing up and seeing the way that my family was when I was little. Not a lot of opportunities were knocking at the door. Not a lot of opportunities was presented.
- [04:46]
Hoda Kotb
I think what's interesting about you is you said you grew up and you liked basketball, but you actually didn't like it initially.
- [04:51]
Dwyane Wade
Yeah.
- [04:51]
Hoda Kotb
In the very beginning, your dad was like, like, you're playing basketball, but you didn't want that.
- [04:56]
Dwyane Wade
No, I didn't want to know. I mean, I actually love football.
- [04:58]
Hoda Kotb
Did you?
- [04:59]
Dwyane Wade
That was actually my first love.
- [05:00]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [05:01]
Dwyane Wade
I don't know what about it, but, you know, I was just sitting down watching the game. It's different when you sit down and watch a football game. There's only a few of them. And so I was a Chicago Bears fan, and I was like, oh, I'm gonna be a wide receiver. I'm be a football player when I'm doing it.
- [05:14]
Hoda Kotb
But your dad insisted. A lot of kids resist what their dads insist. Your dad's like, play basketball. You're like, no, thank you, but nah.
- [05:20]
Dwyane Wade
My dad was militant. Like, he's from the military. Like, my dad was six' I wanted to be like my father. Like, as a kid, I'm looking up at this guy who got these big, broad shoulders, this beautiful body. Like, you know, he's really statuesque in his movements. And he played all the sports. And so my dad would take me along with him. So I did want to be like my father, but he played all the different sports. And so basketball wasn't the one that he was the best at. And so it wasn't the one that I was kind of, you know, gravitating towards until, you know, he kind of made sure he forced us to play a little bit.
- [05:53]
Hoda Kotb
How'd you fall in love with the game? What was it?
- [05:55]
Dwyane Wade
Chicago Bulls.
- [05:56]
Hoda Kotb
Oh, that's it.
- [05:56]
Dwyane Wade
Michael Jordan.
- [05:57]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah. You just saw him and said, yep.
- [05:59]
Dwyane Wade
I was like, oh, that's. That's who I want to be. Like, now move over, dad. Like, move out the way, pops. Yeah, yeah. Once I saw Michael Jordan and just his grace, you know, his. He defied, like, just the way he stayed in the air. It was just graceful and winning. Like, once the Bulls won a championship in 1990, 91, I felt like a winner. Being a kid in Chicago, they gave my family and I something to celebrate. And we didn't have a lot to celebrate at that time. And when the Chicago boys won that first championship, I was like, now that's what I want to. That's the feeling. That's what I want to do for the rest of my life.
- [06:35]
Hoda Kotb
Okay. Now, seeing something like that. Cause a lot of us grew up seeing, like, oh, I want to be Barbara Walters, or I want to be whatever. But the road from being a kid, seeing someone you admire and actually becoming that is a long one. I mean, why did you think you could. Like, who said you could?
- [06:53]
Dwyane Wade
Everybody said I couldn't.
- [06:55]
Hoda Kotb
Could not.
- [06:55]
Dwyane Wade
Okay. I knew that they was like, well, you know, you should think about doing something else.
- [06:59]
Hoda Kotb
Who said you couldn't?
- [06:59]
Dwyane Wade
Well, just. It's just the talk, you know, it's all the day they said it. You know, whenever you go and you listen, whether you go to camps or you hear someone speak, and it's not wrong because, you know, I. I know a lot of kids that got a lot of hoop dreams. And I look like that's going to be tough.
- [07:14]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [07:15]
Dwyane Wade
Not saying that you cannot do it, but I look at it and be.
- [07:17]
Hoda Kotb
Like, that's it's going to be tough.
- [07:18]
Dwyane Wade
You know, now that I know, yeah. Like, there's only a few slots to get to the NBA is only a few greats in the games. And so, like, if I tell somebody, yeah, I'mma have a statue and I'm going to go down as one of the greatest to do this and that, they're going to look at me and they're going to be like, oh, precious kid. You're so precious, you know, aren't you.
- [07:36]
Hoda Kotb
So glad you didn't know the odds? Because if someone had told you, Dwayne, at that stage in your life, the odds of you making it just based on life. And like you said, a couple of slots is 100,000 to 1. Yeah, could have been that. But because you didn't know the odds, you didn't know what you were up against. You just played.
- [07:55]
Dwyane Wade
I did not know what I was up against. I mean, first of all, when I first started playing the game, even though I fell in love with it watching Chicago Boys, I didn't know nothing. It wasn't about money. I didn't know what kind of money they were making. I just knew that I, you know, me and my brothers would run to the TV because it was a. We just loved it and we would play it. I go right in my backyard, we will play it all day long. So for me, it was just the only thing that I really loved. Like, you know, when you're a kid, you're going to school, you go home.
- [08:20]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [08:21]
Dwyane Wade
And I was like, well, I don't really love school, but I love gym, I love recess, right? And so I was like, I love this. And I just played it from the passion, I just played it from the love. Like, that's what my family and I, when we would actually get together, you know, all my uncles and everybody, big barbecues, like we in the backyard hooping. And that's what I fell in love with. More so than, you know, obviously, what it became a job.
- [08:42]
Hoda Kotb
How proud was your dad when you made it? Like, how proud was he to see what his.
- [08:47]
Dwyane Wade
I can't even imagine. I can't even imagine.
- [08:49]
Hoda Kotb
I mean, my God, he believed, though blindly, he did.
- [08:53]
Dwyane Wade
I guess he did believe I don't know if he thought, you know, my dad would tell you. He didn't think I would be a good basketball player. Like, I wasn't good when I was young. Like, I was less than average, to say the best. And then at some point, it all came together for me. And so. But, you know, my dad is a. He's a guy who went to the military at 19 years old. But my dad was a very good baseball player. He actually felt that he was gonna go to the major leagues. Right. And some things happened in his. That took him another direction, which he wound up going to the military because of his best friend wound up getting killed in front of him. And he just. He stopped playing baseball, and he went and did something else. And some other things happened. And so he channeled his love of sport into his son. He channeled it into me, and he took me, like, literally everywhere with him. And so I fell in love with sport. I fell in love with competition. I fell in love with camaraderie. And so I fell in love with the things around the game, and then I fell in love with the game.
- [09:45]
Hoda Kotb
What has basketball given you?
- [09:48]
Dwyane Wade
Opportunity. It's given me opportunity. And I think that's the thing that we all want. We all just want an opportunity to be heard, to do the things that we want to do. And so, you know, when you're a kid and you don't feel like no one sees you and you're not being heard, your community has not been heard, your voice has been muted or whatever the case may be, you want that opportunity to show somebody that, you know what? I can be great. I can do this. I wanted to be the kid to get his family out of the ghetto or the hood or whatever we call it. I was like, I'm gonna be him. I wanna be the one that did that.
- [10:19]
Hoda Kotb
You're him. And then some. I mean, you know, in the hall of Fame, like, you have all the things I mean, and you happen to walk the beautiful fine line of being so incredibly talented beyond. And also, you seem to have, like, the most beautiful. I don't know if it's humility or just, like, you have it in perspective somehow.
- [10:41]
Dwyane Wade
Yeah.
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Hoda Kotb
Often when success comes quickly, any of us will get like, oh, I lost my way again.
- [10:47]
Dwyane Wade
You did, definitely. Along this journey, I definitely lost my way. I had to check myself. You got to constantly check yourself. You got to constantly look in the mirror, you know, especially when so many people are telling you that you're everything. Yeah. You have to be the realest with yourself, because most people will not, and most people don't know you. Like, you know, you. You know, you. You know, your insecurities. You know, the things that, you know, people see me, they see all confidence. I have a lot of insecurities. Right. I have a lot of moments that I'm not as confident. I know that you don't know that. And so I think one of my strengths has always been real with myself, first and foremost. And then from there, I'm able to be real with others. Or, you know, my college coach always say that. It's like, you know, you're real with you, and then that allows you to be a leader and be able to be real with others.
- [11:29]
Hoda Kotb
You're also a student. I feel like you're always learning, like, no matter what, just the way you are with everybody, the way you were just now. You worked with Jenna all week, and you showed up early on the Zooms. You take the notes, you're paying attention, you're watching tape. Like, you treat these opportunities like it's game day.
- [11:49]
Dwyane Wade
Yeah. These opportunities are not just passed around. You know what I mean? Like, you. Thank you for allowing that seat to open up, because that seat ain't just open. And so, you know, when you able to get opportunities, obviously, outside of the game of basketball, I was thankful for that opportunity. But when doors are open, you know, I'm curious. I want to see what's behind that door, and especially if I'm able to get inside that door and be able to get in there and be able to ask questions and learn. And then, you see, once you get in there, and I think Barack said it best, is you sit at the table with some people that has all these accolades and certain positions, and they're not no smarter than you. They're not necessarily better than you. They just have the opportunity before you. And so for me, when I get a chance to get in a room, I'm like, okay, what can I learn from you? What can you learn from me? I know when I walk in a room, I'm walking in knowing something that you don't know, just like, you know, something that I don't know. And so I can provide something to you just like you can for me. It's just I. I need to get in that room. And so because of the game of basketball, I've been able to get in those rooms a little bit. And so I want to take full advantage.
- [12:50]
Hoda Kotb
I love it. I love that you just show up early. What's your whole thing with showing up Early.
- [12:54]
Dwyane Wade
It's just always been like my dad didn't play that. My dad was militant military.
- [12:58]
Hoda Kotb
So you had to be on time.
- [12:59]
Dwyane Wade
My whole life. Like I. My father would get up every day at 5:00am wow. And I would have to get up every day at 5am with him because he would make me iron his clothes before he went to work. And once I got close to of age, like 12 years old, I would have to drive him to the train station, drop him off. I had to drive back. 12 years old.
- [13:15]
Hoda Kotb
Wow.
- [13:16]
Dwyane Wade
Because nobody, nobody else could do it. I don't know if no one else can do it. My dad saw something.
- [13:21]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [13:21]
Dwyane Wade
And he was putting something in me and a lot of responsibilities on me. And so I've been getting up at 5am since I was like 9 years old.
- [13:29]
Hoda Kotb
So what do you do at 5 that's for you now that life's about you now?
- [13:34]
Dwyane Wade
Yeah. So many different things. I think the first thing I try to do is I try to get up and work out. And the way I feel, if I don't feel good, then everything else is off. So first and foremost, I want to get in there and I want to. I get right to the gym soon as I wake up. And then from there I go to the sauna after I go to the gym. I'm a sauna guy.
- [13:49]
Hoda Kotb
I love it.
- [13:50]
Dwyane Wade
But I do a lot of things. I'm always into learning mode, so I'm meditating a lot. I'm trying to have moments of peace. I'm trying to understand that once I pick that phone up, once my family wakes up, you know, I'm on once that happens. So I get two, two and a half hours of just, just you, just me. And like I said, I have to know me, I have to learn me and I have to care for me. Self care is so important to everybody. If you don't care for you, no one else is gonna care for you like you do.
- [14:15]
Hoda Kotb
Someone I was talking, I interviewed Martha Beck, who's written a bunch of books on just life. And she was like, you know what I say to myself in the morning? She was. I said to myself, hey, girl, you seem like you might need a little lemon water. I'm gonna get up and get that for you. It's like you're speaking to yourself the way you would speak to a trusted friend, the way you'd care for somebody else. But it's really for you. What do you get out of meditation? What does it give you?
- [14:38]
Dwyane Wade
I feel like it centers me. Yeah. You know, it Allows me to put my feet on the ground.
- [14:42]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
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Dwyane Wade
Sometimes, you know, we. I'm levitating.
- [14:44]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [14:45]
Dwyane Wade
You know, I'm not. I'm feeling. I'm levitating. I'm all over the place. I'm doing so many things. I have to be so many different things and so many people for different people. And sometimes I just need to let my feet fill the ground.
- [14:54]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [14:55]
Dwyane Wade
And when I meditate, it allows me to put that phone down and not worry about what's going on in the world. Whether it's 10 minutes, 15 minutes, 20 minutes, whatever the case may be like. It allows me just to be at peace with me and allow my brain and my mind to start thinking about the things that I want to do, the things I need to do, all these things. So I just feel like it's so needed. That moment of solace is so needed.
- [15:19]
Hoda Kotb
More with Dwyane Wade. When we come back.
- [15:28]
Dwyane Wade
Amazon Pharmacy presents painful thoughts. 20 more minutes to kill in the.
- [15:34]
Hoda Kotb
Pharmacy before my prescription is ready.
- [15:37]
Dwyane Wade
Maybe I'll grab some deeply discounted out of season Halloween candy.
- [15:42]
Hoda Kotb
Hmm. I never had a chocolate pumpkin with raisins before.
- [15:47]
Dwyane Wade
Those were raisins, right? Next time, use Amazon Pharmacy. We deliver. And no, those were not raisins. Amazon Pharmacy Healthcare just got less painful.
- [15:59]
Hoda Kotb
When you think about your future, you know what calls to you? Meaningful work, happiness, growth. And sharing these values with others.
- [16:08]
Dwyane Wade
But how will you find all of that?
- [16:10]
Hoda Kotb
There are many paths forward, including one you may not have considered.
- [16:14]
Dwyane Wade
The military provides countless opportunities to pursue.
- [16:17]
Hoda Kotb
Your calling where you can be part.
- [16:19]
Dwyane Wade
Of something bigger than yourself while still being yourself and having the future you want.
- [16:24]
Hoda Kotb
You have a calling. We have an answer. Learn more@todaysmilitary.com Substance Use Disorder and addiction is so isolating. And so as a black woman in recovery, hope must be loud. It grows louder when you ask for help and you're vulnerable. It is the thread that lets you know that no matter what happens, you will be okay. When we learn the power of hope, recovery is possible. Find out how at start with hope. Shatterproof.com brought to you by the National Council for Mental well Being. Shatterproof and the Ad Council. I mean, you're so. You're very introspective, which I find incredible. And I feel like I'm a person who believes. Like, when your karma bank is full, like you're giving.
- [17:16]
Dwyane Wade
Say something.
- [17:17]
Hoda Kotb
When your karma bank is full, abundance comes. It just works that way. I feel like, you know, some people are waiting, like, why didn't I get the promotion why didn't I get the job? Why didn't no one call? Why didn't we get the deal? It's like when you're in those moments, it's sort of like you think about what I've given out there. And as I look at your life, you've spent your lifetime giving things away privately. Like, who knew you were doing all this stuff? Is that part something that was ingrained in you as a young child?
- [17:44]
Dwyane Wade
Yes, it was. We was a family who didn't have much, as I continue to say, but we still had more than certain other families and other people. And so my grandma always, you know, she always instilled that in us that if I had shirts that I wasn't wearing, we giving these shirts away.
- [17:59]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [17:59]
Dwyane Wade
You know, we got pants and we got toys that we're not playing with. We giving this away to someone else that you know is not as fortunate as us to even have these things. And so I'm not really, I'm not tied to anything. Like I have material things because of that. I'm not tied to anything material. Like we can get up and go right now if that's the case. Right. My family is what's important. My loved ones, my village. As long as I got my village with me, we can be anywhere in the world. And so I'm really not ties to anything. And it really started at a young age with my grandma making sure that we understood the importance of what we have and understanding that everybody's not even as lucky and have the benefits that we have to have the things that we have. And so I take that, I take that and I try to pass that down to my kids as well, to let them know how fortunate that we all are.
- [18:40]
Hoda Kotb
Uh huh. I love by the way this conversation has been dominated with talk of your family. I hardly even ask about them, and yet here they come. Because that's your North Star. It's obvious and clear. Who taught you how to parent?
- [18:56]
Dwyane Wade
Life, lifetime? My father.
- [18:59]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [18:59]
Dwyane Wade
You know, and you forget this a little bit along the journey. You know, my dad had some times we didn't even speak. Right. But my dad was an amazing father. And how so? Well, just he was there, he showed up.
- [19:10]
Hoda Kotb
That was it.
- [19:10]
Dwyane Wade
He showed up. I mean, you know, he instilled things in us. Like I said, he was very militant. So a lot of ways that I am, a lot of that comes from my dad. Like make your bed, like wash the dishes. We had, like, we had chores. Right. We had things we had to do before we go Play basketball. But also too, it wasn't just me. You know, I have stepbrothers. My dad will have other kids from the neighborhoods. They'll spend the night at our house. And we didn't have much. And so I watched him be a parent to so many people. But outside of that, it's just been life. You know, you learn from your mistakes, you learn from others along your journey. But the most important thing for me is I've been learning from my kids when I was a young parent and I didn't know how to do it. And so I say, was I here? I'm like, bro, if I messed up in any way, I apologize because I.
- [19:53]
Hoda Kotb
Was 20 years old, you didn't know.
- [19:55]
Dwyane Wade
I didn't know. And so we learned together. But I learned to listen, I learned to watch, I learned to have patience because I did not know. And so I think that's, you know, those are some of the principles you need, you know, to be called a good parent.
- [20:08]
Hoda Kotb
That's so interesting. I remember Will Smith said I was interviewing him about his book and he said, kids are perfect seeds. All you need to do is throw some water on them and give them some sunlight and get out of the way and don't try to manipulate their branches. Let them grow the way they want to grow. Because they all have their own kind of lives, the patience and the listening part. Because often we want to guide our kids.
- [20:29]
Dwyane Wade
Yeah. And we have to do that.
- [20:30]
Hoda Kotb
We have to do that too.
- [20:30]
Dwyane Wade
1,000%. Yes.
- [20:31]
Hoda Kotb
So what has fatherhood taught you? Like, how has it changed you, especially now because you're a different parent today than you were. Oh, yeah.
- [20:39]
Dwyane Wade
Yeah. My kids be on me about that. I think, like, what I like I always tell people, like, I'm in love with my kids. Right. And I feel like when I, when I see them, when I watch them, I see all the, all of the best versions of myself. Right. Like, I think that's what we see in our kids, the purity. And then we see the. The best versions of who we are in them. And so I feel that it's my responsibility. They didn't ask to be here.
- [21:04]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [21:05]
Dwyane Wade
It was a choice that was made. And so it's a responsibility that I have. And so I take being a parent very seriously. And all my kids and different parents that I have to be because of different situations. But I take it very seriously in the moments that I have to parent and be a father. And when I can't hands on do it, I take being a model to them very seriously.
- [21:23]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [21:24]
Dwyane Wade
And also, too, when I make mistakes, I take having a conversation with them very seriously about my mistakes.
- [21:28]
Hoda Kotb
Because you do.
- [21:29]
Dwyane Wade
You talk to them. I'm not perfect. I will make them. And I sit and I talk to them about it.
- [21:33]
Hoda Kotb
Are you permissive as a parent? You let things roll or do you.
- [21:36]
Dwyane Wade
Yeah, I let things roll for a little while.
- [21:38]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [21:38]
Dwyane Wade
Yeah. You know, I'm not a. Stop it right away. No, you gotta allow for it, to allow space. Allow space.
- [21:44]
Hoda Kotb
You learned a lesson late in life, which is often scary. Diagnoses come on a phone call or in a doctor's office. You know, I find life so weird. I was diagnosed years ago, like, probably 15 years ago. But I remember that Tuesday I was fine, and Wednesday everything was turned upside down, and I was like, how? I'm still sitting here. How did you get the news that it was confirmed that what you had was, in fact, cancer? And what did it do to you? Like, what did those words, how did they land?
- [22:19]
Dwyane Wade
I mean, cancer shakes you to your core. You know, my primary care, my primary doctor, you know, I got on a phone call with her, and, you know, after you do your exams and your MRIs and your blood testing and all those things, you don't want to hear from your doctor after that unless it's, hey, everything's great. If it's not, everything's great. Now you're concerned. And so I just. I heard uncertainty in her voice when she called me, and she was like, would you come in? I'm like, not to come in.
- [22:44]
Hoda Kotb
Oh, no.
- [22:44]
Dwyane Wade
You can't tell me over the phone. And so I knew, and I didn't want to right away. I didn't tell anybody. I just went in without telling. Without telling anybody. I just went in. And then when I went in, I talked to her, and she was giving me some information about the mass that they saw on my kidney, but, you know, was like, but let's. We're going to go in and get you another MRI so we can make sure. And then I was like, all right, cool. I'm still not gonna tell anybody. And so I went in to take another mri.
- [23:08]
Hoda Kotb
Why didn't you mention it?
- [23:09]
Dwyane Wade
I. I don't know.
- [23:10]
Hoda Kotb
You wanted to wait and see if it was something.
- [23:11]
Dwyane Wade
I wanted to make sure that it was. It was for real. Before you start, you know, getting everybody worried and concerned, one thing I know, in my family, I'm the rock, you know, I'm the rock of the family. And so, you know, if something happened to me, everybody's like, yeah. And so I started getting concerned once the second MRI came back, and she was like, I want to send you to especially. Is that a doctor friend of mine? I was like, okay, there's something there.
- [23:33]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Who was the first person you told?
- [23:36]
Dwyane Wade
My wife. Yeah, My wife. We both have the same primary care doctor, so she knew I was going in and stuff of that nature, but I just kind of, like, tried to soft land it to her too. Like, you know, they say it might be something. I'm gonna go check it out and we'll see. But once I found out, once the doctor told me that they believed that it's a possible cancer, but they still wasn't 100% sure. But they did know that it was. That they was concerned. They was concerned with. You know, it was like 3 cm. The area that it was in was a very tough area to really get to see it. And doc was like, well, we're gonna have to go in there and we're gonna have to get it. But he made me so comfortable because he walked me through every step of how it would work.
- [24:14]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [24:15]
Dwyane Wade
So then I came back and I told my wife. I was like, I gotta. I'm gonna have to make a decision. Either I allow this to. To see if it grows, or I get it now. Right. That's a decision I have to make. And obviously we made a decision as a family to make sure that the whole goal is to live a full life, to live a long, healthy life, as much as I can control it. And now that I know, I can't sit and be thinking about something that's going on in my kidneys.
- [24:38]
Hoda Kotb
Did you tell your kids or.
- [24:40]
Dwyane Wade
Eventually. Eventually. We sat down. The kids. We told the kids. My way of telling them is probably like, real. Like a no look past.
- [24:47]
Hoda Kotb
It's nothing. Yeah.
- [24:48]
Dwyane Wade
You know, I'm a no look past guy. Right. So it was probably like a, yeah, I gotta go do this thing. And. But it was tough because, you know, you don't want your kids to be overly concerned and worried, you know, about the.
- [24:58]
Hoda Kotb
I thought it was interesting that when you went in for the surgery, you were only allowed to have one person take you in, and who that person was, who you chose, because at that moment, you're probably at your most vulnerable. It is before. It is right before everything happens. You chose your dad.
- [25:15]
Dwyane Wade
Chose my dad?
- [25:16]
Hoda Kotb
How come?
- [25:17]
Dwyane Wade
He's the guy for me.
- [25:18]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [25:19]
Dwyane Wade
He always been in it. And it's crazy because I'm a mama's boy, you know, all those things, but my dad has Been there. When I close my eyes and think about who's been there, you know, not since I've been married and all those things, but just in my life. But also, too. My dad shared with me when he was going through prostate cancer, and we got. I think we got closer through that process because I started, you know, obviously concerned about him. We was all very concerned, but we started communicating more because this was something that was a part of our genes as men in our family. And so we started being able to, like, share personal things. Like, I would call my dad after I left the hospital, like, yo, I just got a prostate exam, Pops. And she. The doctor did this. And he. He'll laugh and say, oh, yeah, that's nothing. It's a whole nother one. She just wanted to do this. We just got close when he. When his prostate cancer. And from there, you know, I just thought about actually who I wanted to see him in my most vulnerable state. Right. And it was my dad. You know, I wanted my wife to see me when I woke up. I wanted her to be the first person I saw.
- [26:13]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [26:13]
Dwyane Wade
But in my most vulnerable state, when I was probably the scared as I've ever been, I wanted my dad to be there. You know, I was like, I need my dad.
- [26:20]
Hoda Kotb
You know, it's funny, because strong guys like you and a lot of people who feel that don't like the sad eyes that you get when someone don't.
- [26:27]
Dwyane Wade
Like him at all.
- [26:28]
Hoda Kotb
No.
- [26:28]
Dwyane Wade
No.
- [26:29]
Hoda Kotb
And, you know, it's love, but it doesn't matter. Cause you don't want to be looked at that way.
- [26:33]
Dwyane Wade
Not at all. Not at all.
- [26:33]
Hoda Kotb
Poor thing.
- [26:34]
Dwyane Wade
I'm so prideful. I'm so prideful. It sucks. Sometimes I wish I was a little.
- [26:38]
Hoda Kotb
Less, you know, but how did you deal with it? Cause once people knew, I'm sure they were like, you okay? You all right? You sure? You know, which makes you feel kind of, you know, sick. Even though they've gotten it out.
- [26:50]
Dwyane Wade
I walk to the airport now, everybody be like, you know, get well. I'm like, I'm. Well, you know, it was happening in 2023.
- [26:57]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [26:57]
Dwyane Wade
But first of all, it's, you know, it's love. You know, people. You could tell, people care about you. When people even know what you're going through, whether it's, you know, personal, your family, or people that you do not know. And someone come up to you and say, you know, get better and this, and that they care enough. Right?
- [27:10]
Hoda Kotb
It's love.
- [27:11]
Dwyane Wade
It's love in that sense. So, you know, I Just try to take it all the same way. And one thing I learned as an athlete is to be even keeled. Never be too high, never be too low.
- [27:20]
Hoda Kotb
Oh, that's good.
- [27:21]
Dwyane Wade
And that's how I approach life. I try to approach life very even kill. So, you know, with my wins, we gonna celebrate. And with our losses, hey, we ain't gonna get too down. We're gonna do what we gotta do so we can get back to the celebration.
- [27:34]
Hoda Kotb
More to come with Duane. Stay with us. Amazon has everything for every kind of Mother's Day. Whether that's a massage gun for an at home spa day, or new shoes for her favorite salsa class. Or gifts like a biker helmet to unleash her inner daredevil. From hot stones to helmets, shop everything for Mother's Day on Amazon. Listen, as Silenia tells us why she chose to vaccinate her daughter. I definitely felt like the pros far outweighed the cons. The diseases that I am protecting my child against, they're still here. And at the end of the day, it's my job as a mother to keep my child safe. Talk to your child's doctor and learn more@yvaccines.com brought to you by Merck. Substance use disorder and addiction is so isolating. And so as a black woman in recovery, hope must be loud. It grows louder. When you ask for help and you're vulnerable. It is the thread that lets you know that no matter what happens, you will be okay. When we learn the power of hope, recovery is possible, find out how@startwithhope.com brought to you by the National Council for Mental well Being Shatterproof and the AD Council. So when you decided it was time to leave the game of basketball, and I'm not equating this at all to what happened with me, but I just had a sensation when I. So it was my 60th birthday here on the plaza and they threw this big party.
- [29:33]
Dwyane Wade
Yeah, I saw it.
- [29:34]
Hoda Kotb
Oh, thanks.
- [29:35]
Dwyane Wade
It was amazing, by the way.
- [29:36]
Hoda Kotb
And I felt like in that moment, I was on top of the wave. It was cresting. I could feel it. I was like, this is the top. It doesn't get better. This is it. Cause people often want to repeat the thrill of what this high feels like. But someone I interviewed once described them, life is like a series of waves. Sometimes you're on a huge one, but it never does last. It's beautiful. But then you paddle back out and what's my next wave? I'm catching. Am I going to catch a medium wave? Ooh that one looks fun. I don't know what it's like, but it looks like it's going to be a crazy ride. I'll take that one, you let some pass and you catch the next one. But I knew with all of my heart on that day that was it.
- [30:19]
Dwyane Wade
You felt it on that calm, calm.
- [30:22]
Hoda Kotb
I was crying the whole time. Not because I was, I mean it was emotional, but because I knew and I felt it. So just I guess a way of asking like when and how were you sure? You know, because yeah, the moment was time to.
- [30:36]
Dwyane Wade
I'm trying not to get teary eyed. The moment I knew once I left Miami, I went to Chicago and it was like one of the best years of my life because that was when my daughter Ziya found the confidence to come out to our family being in Chicago because of the teacher she had and also to my agent who passed away. That was his last year of life. And I got a chance to spend that last year with him about being in Chicago because he couldn't travel or anything. So, you know, for my personal life that that moment was great. But I then went to Cleveland and I got a call, I was in practice and I got a call. I knew my agent was sick and I got a call to fly to Chicago to be with him so I could say, you know, my goodbyes. And when I got there, I remember the family allowed me to go in the room and just have, you know, 15, 20 minutes just by myself with him. And he was the first person at that moment I felt the same thing you felt. I felt like he was the first person I told that I'm, I don't want to do this no more. That the love that I have for the game of basketball is not there anymore. That I'm ready to do something else. And also too, he was a big part of my journey and I was losing him too at the same time. And I just was like, I want to do something else and I'm scared, you know, I'm scared to do something else because this is all I know.
- [31:46]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [31:47]
Dwyane Wade
And I told him in the room, I told him that I was going to retire. I was going to retire that year. I didn't tell anybody when I walked out of the room, but I wanted him to hear those last words from me that.
- [31:55]
Hoda Kotb
Did he communicate back or.
- [31:57]
Dwyane Wade
He didn't communicate back. He was non communicative. But I know he can hear me. You know, you can see him still moving and trying. And so I said it for the first time, I Finally said it to someone else and not just myself. And it wasn't that I couldn't still play basketball a little bit. It's just that I didn't have that no more. So once I said it to him, I freed myself. And then eventually I got traded back to Miami that year, and I was like, okay, here go the bow.
- [32:23]
Hoda Kotb
This is perfect.
- [32:24]
Dwyane Wade
Where I started, everything happened. This is it. And I told my team. I was like, that was it for me. My last game, it was in Philly. I started my career in Philly. My first game was in Philly. My last game was in Philly. I was like, this is it.
- [32:38]
Hoda Kotb
Chills. Yeah.
- [32:38]
Dwyane Wade
And. But someone told me along the way, they said, if you think you're ready to retire, than play one more year. And so after going through conversations with so many people and getting some confirmation about how my last year could possibly be, I decided to, you know, give the fans, give my family, give everybody that last year so we can all prepare ourselves for the future. And so I played one more year after I knew I was ready to retire the year before.
- [33:00]
Hoda Kotb
Were you glad that you played the year, or do you wish you had just retired?
- [33:04]
Dwyane Wade
I was glad I did.
- [33:05]
Hoda Kotb
You did.
- [33:05]
Dwyane Wade
Yeah. I went out good. Hold up. I went out like you. I went out with a steel. Love me. Top of the wave. Yeah, it was great. You know, I always talk about it. I was like, man, you know, you try to figure out how to land your plane. Once you've been playing and you've been a great player and you're not as great. You gotta land that plane at some point, or if you don't, they will land it for you. And you're not gonna like the way that they landed. And so I was like, all right, I gotta. I gotta get out of this, you know, before they land this plane for me.
- [33:28]
Hoda Kotb
Y.
- [33:28]
Dwyane Wade
And so I was able to. A smooth, smooth landing.
- [33:32]
Hoda Kotb
Love it. Oh.
- [33:33]
Dwyane Wade
Oh, I love it.
- [33:34]
Hoda Kotb
Just the way you wanted it.
- [33:35]
Dwyane Wade
Just the way I wanted it.
- [33:36]
Hoda Kotb
All aspects of your life, I feel like, are getting full. Like you're filling your cup. You went on a retreat for men, and it was a life changer for you.
- [33:44]
Dwyane Wade
I did the retreat. It was my wellness. It was your wellness retreat? Yes, I put the retreat on.
- [33:48]
Hoda Kotb
Wait, what?
- [33:49]
Dwyane Wade
Yes, yes. It was my first wellness retreat that I did.
- [33:51]
Hoda Kotb
And what was it like? And why did you feel that that was necessary?
- [33:55]
Dwyane Wade
Well, coming off of the kidney cancer, the scare, and we know just. Even wellness in general is just the conversation around it has been, you know, more talked About. And, you know, I just. I know that we all are dealing with things, right? Like, we're all dealing with so much, and we don't have a lot of positive outlets. There's a lot of outlets out here, but a lot of positive outlets, you know, to. To gravitate towards. Well, that we know of necessarily, or, you know, because some people look at all therapy, that means I'm weak. And, you know, I don't know what a life coach is like. It's a lot of confusion around what to do around wellness. And so I decided to bring 30 men together, this getaway for days. We had an amazing group of individuals put together. We had different assignments and different things we were gonna do, different conversation moments we were gonna have. And I don't know about everybody, but it's very rare to get 30 men in one place to be very vulnerable and open up.
- [34:48]
Hoda Kotb
They opened up.
- [34:49]
Dwyane Wade
Oh, open up. We were pouring out. And I know we shared things in that room that our wives and our parents or other significant others, whatever the case may be, our kids, they don't know because we don't. We're too. We don't open up like that. W. Yeah, we called it a timeout. You know, it was to take a timeout sometimes. Sometimes it's like when the team making a run on a basketball court, coach run out the timeout, timeout.
- [35:10]
Hoda Kotb
Slow it down. Everything.
- [35:11]
Dwyane Wade
Slow this down. And so it was amazing. It was what I needed. That's when I actually. I filmed my show. You know, I have a digital show as well, and I filmed it, and that's when I actually didn't think I was gonna do it. But that's when I told everybody about my kidney cancer. And I held the tape because it was on our network. And then eventually I put that out, and it was in my own words and my own voice. But just being in that environment, in that wellness environment with those men, with those group of individuals, it gave me a safe space. And a lot of times, Hoda is man, we feel that we don't have the safe space to be weak, to be vulnerable, to be whatever it is that the adjective is. But I felt it in that moment, and so I shared it.
- [35:48]
Hoda Kotb
Are you going to be doing more of those? Because it sounds like you should.
- [35:50]
Dwyane Wade
I would love to. I'm looking for some sponsors. Anybody out there want to assist this?
- [35:54]
Hoda Kotb
Where'd you guys do it? Is it.
- [35:55]
Dwyane Wade
So I live in California. We did it up in San Diego.
- [35:58]
Hoda Kotb
Beautiful.
- [35:58]
Dwyane Wade
So a lot of guys came in from San Diego. Some Flew in. We put together an amazing group, and this was when I knew it was going to be amazing. I didn't know. You don't know. So I remember when we were meeting for the first dinner, we were all going to meet, and we had to all meet in the lobby. Everybody came in at different times. And as I was getting off the elevator, I heard this soundtrack of men, voices of laughter, of conversation. It was one of the most beautiful soundtracks I've ever heard. And I was just. I was walking, smiling. I was like, yeah, I love it. This is gonna be a success.
- [36:27]
Hoda Kotb
Love it. Love it. So we call this podcast Making Space, because it's all about what you do when you do have time and space. So if Dwyane Wade had a day all for himself, you had not one commitment on your calendar. Nobody needed you, nobody wanted you. You could wake up when you want, do what you want. The day was yours with a bow on it. It's Dwayne's day. What would you do with that?
- [36:52]
Dwyane Wade
I've had a lot of those days.
- [36:53]
Hoda Kotb
Have you? All right, tell me how you started.
- [36:54]
Dwyane Wade
I create those days for myself, by the way.
- [36:56]
Hoda Kotb
That's smart.
- [36:57]
Dwyane Wade
Yes. It's called chapter of my Life, and certain moments of my life is called Self.
- [37:00]
Hoda Kotb
Self.
- [37:01]
Dwyane Wade
Yes. I really create moments for myself, and I have the family that understands that. So I have a lot of those insights.
- [37:06]
Hoda Kotb
Tell me. Okay, so what do you do on a day like that? I want to hear.
- [37:08]
Dwyane Wade
Well, it depends. I think, you know, one of the things I love to do is I love to golf.
- [37:11]
Hoda Kotb
Okay. Love it.
- [37:12]
Dwyane Wade
When I get to say, all right, guys, I'm golfing all day. That's great for me. But I think. I think probably the most fulfilled I am when I'm able to do it is if I can create something, it would be to create a day of vulnerability. Just a space, a safe space to feel vulnerable. When you feel like you able to dump everything we hold a lot. When you feel like you're able to be free and dump everything and just be vulnerable. And even if you gotta go scream, if you gotta go cry. You know what I mean? These are things that we don't want to talk about because it's not. You feel like you're gonna be less than. No, we need that. Sometimes I gotta go somewhere and scream, Just yell. Just get it out. But sometimes I need to go and shed a few.
- [37:47]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [37:48]
Dwyane Wade
And so if I could, in my perfect, you know, on one of my perfect days, it would just be able to create an environment where I Can be vulnerable by myself. Get it out, dump it, and then get ready for the next day.
- [37:58]
Hoda Kotb
That is beautiful. And Gabrielle Union, your wife, do you guys. Couples that do well, like you guys do well, as they grow together, it's not like one person's stuck because you're constantly growing. She's constantly growing. Is that kind of why it continues? The relationship continues to be so amazing and fruitful? Because some people get stuck and they're like, you're not the guy I met. You're like, yeah, I'm better, I'm different, I've changed. Or.
- [38:23]
Dwyane Wade
Yeah, well, first of all, you got to have patience.
- [38:25]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [38:26]
Dwyane Wade
You know, you got to have patience because you can't rush someone's journey.
- [38:29]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [38:29]
Dwyane Wade
You know, you can talk to them and tell them what they should do, but you can't rush the journey. And so my wife has had to have a lot of patience with me. I've had to have a lot of patience with her. And ultimately, because we choose to. Right. We continue to keep. Wake up every day and we choose each other. And so just, I think just, just have patience with it. And, you know, we know one of the hardest things in this world to do is to be married. I think we all see the statistics. This is. This is very tough. It's tough for me to be by myself sometimes. So to be with my wife, I'm sure I get on her nerve all the time. But we know we choose to be together. We've been together 17 years. We've been married 10 years. And it's a choice every day. And some days you'll be like, I don't want you on my nerve. And then you, you come back and you be like, okay, I have to sit, I have to listen. I have to understand that we are in different places in life. My wife is 10 years older than me.
- [39:16]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah. So she's in a different spot.
- [39:17]
Dwyane Wade
She's in a different spot. I just retired from basketball. I've only been done six years. I'm just finding myself. My feet is just touching the ground.
- [39:23]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah, you are.
- [39:24]
Dwyane Wade
Yeah, I'm in a whole different spot. And so she's had to have patience with me as well. And so the growth, the village, our friends, you need good friends. You need a good village around you to help you. And we both have that individually and collectively. And so all those things is needed. And it saved us to this point where we can even talk about being in a ten year marriage. And, you know, and being, you know, Dwayne and Gab, because without all of that Deuces.
- [39:50]
Hoda Kotb
It's over.
- [39:51]
Dwyane Wade
Yeah, I'm sure I'm tough to be with.
- [39:53]
Hoda Kotb
You know what? Lastly, before we go, one of my favorite pieces of video was that commercial that I saw where they were describing how you were trading jerseys during your last year. I could not contain myself as I was watching, watching women with jerseys who've lost loved ones. But what it showed me was all of the goodness you're putting out in the world, like the woman whose house burned down and thank you and scholarship and. Anyway, I just want to say you're such a treat. You do so much good stuff that no one ever hears about. But it was nice to know through that commercial, like, wow, I felt like I knew your life. And 30 seconds, like, right there, that's you. Your parents did good, by the way.
- [40:37]
Dwyane Wade
Thank you. They. Yeah, they. They did all right. I just hold it to me is just about, you know, I leave with love.
- [40:43]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [40:43]
Dwyane Wade
You know, and ultimately, you know, we. We know what temperature of the world we live in. A lot of times, a lot of. It's a lot of hate out there.
- [40:49]
Hoda Kotb
Yeah.
- [40:50]
Dwyane Wade
It's a lot of ugliness out there. Disguise is something else at times, but, you know, I feel like love wins always. And so, you know, when I'm no longer on this earth, when you talk about legacy, see, when you talk about leaving something, you know, I want to leave that behind. I want to leave the scent of love behind.
- [41:04]
Hoda Kotb
Ooh, the scent of love. Yeah.
- [41:05]
Dwyane Wade
The scent of love behind.
- [41:06]
Hoda Kotb
Okay. Would you make that cologne? Because we could buy that, too.
- [41:09]
Dwyane Wade
I just made that up.
- [41:12]
Hoda Kotb
We. We coined it here. All right, Dwayne, thank you.
- [41:15]
Dwyane Wade
Thank you. Appreciate you.
- [41:16]
Hoda Kotb
Awesome. Oh, so good. Hey, guys, thank you so much for listening and for coming on this journey with me. If you like what you heard, and I hope that you do, please give Making Space a five star rating and review on Apple Podcasts. And make sure you tell your friends. Follow us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you're listening right now. Making Space with Hoda Kotb is produced by Alison Berger and Alexa Casavecchia along with Kate Saunders. Our associate audio engineer is Juliana Masterilli. Our audio engineer is Kicked Katie Lau. Original music by John Estes. Bryson Barnes is our head of audio production. Missy Dunlop Parsons is our executive producer. Libby Leist is the executive vice president of Today. And lifestyle. Substance use disorder and addiction is so isolating. And so as a black woman in recovery, hope must be loud. It grows louder when you ask for help and you're vulnerable. It is the thread that lets you know that no matter what happens, you will be okay. When we learn the power of hope recovery is possible, find out how@startwithhope.com brought to you by the National Council for Mental well Being, Shatterproof and the AD Council.