← Man of the Year - Champions of Friendship
Man of the Year - Champions of Friendship
#130 - #NoRegrets
00:34:49
We all have regrets in life – but we don’t often talk about friendship regret – that falling out you never reconciled, that misunderstanding you never corrected, that old pal you never picked up the phone and called. This week Matt and Karo talk about how to deal with and avoid friendship regret. Also, vasectomies. manoftheyearpodcast.com
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- [00:00]
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- [00:30]
Aaron Caro
Foreign.
- [00:34]
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- [01:20]
Matt Ritter
Man of the Year man of the Year. Men of the Year. Welcome to the number one friendship podcast in the country. I'm Matt Ritter.
- [01:28]
Aaron Caro
I'm Aaron Caro.
- [01:30]
Matt Ritter
Guys, go to the manofthearpodcast.com I think I said it wrong, but it doesn't matter.
- [01:36]
Aaron Caro
Episode 2 and it's just enraging. It's not the manofthearpodcast.com it's just man of the year podcast.com it's been our website for three years.
- [01:43]
Matt Ritter
I'm not capable of saying it that way, but anyway, kid will give you the link. Buy our stuff. We've got some onesies there. Check out our YouTube page. KIRO Today I want to go on a bit of a rant about a new fad. You know, every couple years it feels like people get into new things. You know, some years it's Ozempic, sometimes it's Botox. You know, this. This year there seems to be a trend towards a little something that I think most men are pretty scared of talking about vasectomies. The convo that suddenly has been popping up all over the place. And I just want to go on a rant against. I find it offensive that people are trying to snip our best deference. Best deference.
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Aaron Caro
I don't know.
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Matt Ritter
Yeah, yeah. I find it distasteful and it's just something that I, you know, suddenly I was out to dinner and one of my buddies, like you're thinking about doing this. Another one you think about. I was like. I'm like, who's programming these guys to do this? You know, is this. Are the women conspiring to get the men together to do this? And I started thinking about it. I'm like, first of all, no, I'm not putting a hot laser to my scrotum. I think you have to do them individually, each ball sack at a time.
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Aaron Caro
Wait, laser? I thought it's like a little. Little scissor.
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Matt Ritter
Even worse. I mean, yeah, I thought it was some sort of fishing lure where they. I've seen it. They, like, take the. They take the tube and they. They do some sort of loop to it and twist it around. And then she's like, oh, yeah, it's no big deal. Snip, snip. I'm like, snip, snip to the place nobody ever getting near with a scissor. Or it's just a little. Just a little snip, snip, like of my most treasured prized asset. The other thing that about it that I was thinking is like, everybody acts like it's just this minor thing, but everybody I've ever talked to is like, oh, yeah, it's worse than. It's worse than I. That I thought it was going to be. Like, why did you think it was going to be fine? They're taking red hot poker to your balls. That's a torture method. Most of. For most of history, that was considered a torture method. You know, you want to be Varys, a little eunuch with these little birds, you're going to deliberately do that to yourself. The only thing I could think of, though, I just started thinking, like, all right, let me just look at this objectively. Like, I understand you don't want to have kids anymore. It's. It's. It's safer, you know, Then if the woman wants to go off birth control, I get it. It's a conversation like, oh, you know, it's misogynistic. Why should it be on? The man shouldn't be on either. Okay? If you don't want to do it and you don't want. If you don't want to disfigure yourself and she doesn't want to disfigure herself, then nobody disfigures themselves. That's how I see it. But then I was like, well, maybe there is an upside about it. That's the only upside I could think of, is if you are planning on having a lot of baby mamas. It's. It's baby mama insurance, and it makes you look good to your wife. You're like, hey, I'm doing this for you. But it's also side piece insurance.
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Aaron Caro
Have you ever heard of. It's called pbc as post birth control syndrome?
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Matt Ritter
No. What is that?
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Aaron Caro
So. So when a woman, like you're describing goes off birth control and women have been on for decades. Yeah, decades. They've been on birth control.
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Matt Ritter
Right.
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Aaron Caro
Sometimes it changes your chemistry, your hormones, and then they despise their partner.
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Matt Ritter
Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah, right. They find out they never liked this person. It was the first. It was. It's like a little Dennis Quaid controlling Martin Short in inner space. The birth control was like, oh, yeah, I like that lawyer. No, I hate that. I hate lawyers.
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Aaron Caro
But it's like. It's the genetic. Like you. Your genes hate your partner now. Wow.
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Matt Ritter
Wow. Yeah. I mean, look, I get it, you know, you get off birth control. Jekyll. It's just Jekyll and Hyde. 30 years of Jack, suddenly you get off birth control, Hyde comes out.
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Aaron Caro
So you gonna do it? Never. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I think you're gonna get worn down.
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Matt Ritter
No, Jesse doesn't care. We had this combo last night. I was like, what's going on here? Because then I. And then I texted our Lugers crew to find out if this was a West coast thing. And like, nope. That's all men in their 40s and 50s talk about every single day, whether or not to get the snip.
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Aaron Caro
I love how you thought it would be a West coast thing. What is it?
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Matt Ritter
Well, we're like fad doers. We're.
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Aaron Caro
You're a fad doer. Matt's got his Tamagotchi. He's wearing a friendship bracelet right now. I mean, like, you're so fad forward.
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Matt Ritter
Well, that's why you're. That's why you. You would have thought I would have do. I would do it.
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Aaron Caro
Yeah. Well, I mean, it's been around for decades, but. Yeah. So. Yeah. I mean, that's. Yeah. As I told you, I have a friend who got it, and he said it was pretty bad.
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Matt Ritter
Yeah. Oh, and I don't know if I could. Well, yeah. Why not? It's a shout out to the guy's practice. So I asked our east coast crew, and one of our buddies from New Jersey said, actually, one of the most prominent doctors who does. The vasectomy has the best name for it on Earth. Do you want to guess what it is?
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Aaron Caro
Well, I was. I'm on the chain, so I know what it is.
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Matt Ritter
Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh.
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Aaron Caro
Do you. Did you forget? Because you seem to be searching for it.
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Matt Ritter
No, no, no, no. I'm looking up of something where the name is actually. Do you know what this word is? Where the name of a. Of a job is the person's last name. Right.
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Aaron Caro
Like, there's like. There's like, you know, like a punter name, like James Foote or something like that.
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Matt Ritter
Yeah.
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Aaron Caro
No. What's that called?
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Matt Ritter
Just something I forget and now I'm blanking on. I was trying, you know.
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Aaron Caro
Great, great. This is great content. We're watching Matt Google. Interesting. That's a. That's a. That's an interesting word. Aptitude.
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Matt Ritter
Yeah. Yeah. When your name is your profession. So this guy's name is Dr. Seaman.
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Aaron Caro
I mean, that would be like, if you were Matt Friend, basically.
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Matt Ritter
Right. So go see Dr. Seaman in New Jersey if you want to get snipped. Apparently, he's the best.
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Aaron Caro
How many times per day do you think he has to, like, make a comment or joke or someone visits him, like, per day?
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Matt Ritter
Well, if he has 30 appointments, I'd say 30.
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Aaron Caro
What do you know? I love how you always say that. You know how I. I never understand other people because I just think of it through my own lens, and you're like, people just built different. These doctors, like, colonoscopy, vasectomy, the ones who just churn out 50 a day.
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Matt Ritter
Yeah.
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Aaron Caro
Like, isn't that so boring, dude?
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Matt Ritter
I think they just look at their life as in between. Like, this is the. In between their vacations and their purchases.
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Aaron Caro
Wow. It's actually a really interesting way of thinking about it.
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Matt Ritter
Yeah. Like, this is like. Like, I'm. No. No offense to our amazing obgyn, but in the four minutes that he sees us every two weeks, I'm like, this guy doesn't know or care about us. I'm like. And every month, he's on a different awesome vacation at a different vacation house. And so I think he's looking at life in increments of. Of. Of Airbnb rental properties.
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Aaron Caro
That's. That's amazing. Wait, do you. Do you really feel like he. He doesn't have, like, good bedside manner?
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Matt Ritter
He's got great bedside manner. That's the funny part. Amazing. But I. I see right through it.
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Aaron Caro
Right, Right. Yeah. It's. It's just your appointment is. Is what he calls in between rounds of golf.
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Matt Ritter
That's what I'm saying. Because how could he know me? Every. He gets a four minute. We literally get him for four. Four minutes every couple weeks. And but he's got. He's got. Like you said, it's like 30 of those a day, and they're all the same.
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Aaron Caro
But do you. Do you expect him to know you?
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Matt Ritter
I don't know. I. At first I did. Because it's like the birth of your child is the person that's giving, you know.
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Aaron Caro
Right. Like, that's what's crazy. This is the most important thing that's ever happened to you, and he doesn't care about it at all.
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Matt Ritter
Yeah. He calls you number 742.
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Aaron Caro
You know they have a ticker, like at the deli.
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Matt Ritter
Yeah, like he said, I'm a deli. Counter 49. You got the godmother coming up.
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Aaron Caro
There's also people picking up wings at Fireside. And then you.
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Matt Ritter
That's right. That's absolutely right. Anyway, so where did we come out on this? Are you ever gonna get the snip?
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Aaron Caro
I think, yeah. I gotta use my vast deference before I snip them. You gotta use them.
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Matt Ritter
You gotta use it before you deliberately lose it.
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Aaron Caro
I don't know. I. Luckily I have never even thought about it. But it's also reversible, isn't it?
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Matt Ritter
No, that's the. Oh, that was gonna get to that. No, that's the part where they. Oh, everything. Every time there's a. In any walk of life, anytime there's like a major, major surgery that you know is risky, that we're not even sure has any benefits, there's always like that. That's the argument, oh, don't worry about it. It's reversible. And then when you do any sort of deep dive on the reversibility, it's like, oh, doing it is a minor surgery. Getting it reversed is a major surgery. Getting a reversal of a vast deference is not a snip snip. It's. They're putting you under a major surgery to redo it.
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Aaron Caro
Right, Got it, Got it. Well, I believe this is one of our best transitions ever. Yeah, we started with. We started with vasectomies, and now we're going to talk about regret. Perfect regret. Friendship regret. Specifically because I was reading one of these articles, Matt. I actually always stop on them on tick tock or whatever when like 10 things a hospice patient, you know, hospice nurse says her dying patients say, like, that always interests me.
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Matt Ritter
Me too.
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Aaron Caro
And by the way, I never use it. Like, they're like, do these three things. That's all you care about. Like, nah, forget it. I need to work harder.
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Matt Ritter
Oh, like the things you should have Done in life.
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Aaron Caro
Yeah.
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Matt Ritter
You go, yeah, yeah. I don't buy it. Spend more time with your grandkids. I don't buy it.
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Aaron Caro
And so, interestingly, this was the first one that I saw that mentioned friendship. And this, this, this hospice volunteer, she said she hears one regret over and over from patients letting relationships wither. They wish they had made more plans with good friends or they thought about getting back in touch with an old buddy and they talked themselves out of it and they regretted it. And they're like, last moments. And, you know, I don't know, we've talked a little bit about fomo. We'll get into it. But this is more sort of bigger, existential, which is people regretting what they did or didn't do in their social lives.
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Matt Ritter
Yeah. And I, I think, you know, regret is the, it should be a good motivator. Right. When you, when you read those articles. Right. It should be a good motivator. Like, you're looking at people who are definitively saying, this is what I regret. And here we are sitting in our 40s, going, hey, we could really do something about. And we still don't because it's hard. It's hard. Easier said than done to go, hey, I'm going to like, reach out to a friend that I had a falling out with five years ago and haven't talked to in five years. Like, that's pretty daunting to just be like, oh, I'll just fix that now.
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Aaron Caro
Let me ask you this. I've always wondered this. You know, when you, you, when, when someone has a near death experience. I mean, like they, they're in a car accident or, you know, something traumatic happens and they can, they change. They go, this, these are the things that are most important. I don't care about this dumb nonsense I've been doing. I'm gonna only do the X. Okay, you're, you're.
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Matt Ritter
No, go on, go on. I just have found so many thoughts.
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Aaron Caro
And I'm always like, okay, why can't I just do that now?
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Matt Ritter
Yeah. First of all, I don't, you know, most of the time, like, just from my experience. Well, my dad, I just could like, put myself in the hospital when my dad was 50, at his first heart surgery, quintuple bypass. And he's like, I'm done gambling.
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Aaron Caro
Sorry.
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Matt Ritter
It's like, I'm done. You know, I'm like, okay, well, I'll believe it when I see it. I don't know, I think a lot of people think they have these big epiphanies and they're going to change. But changing a lifetime of behaviors is not that simple.
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Aaron Caro
What is a quintuple bypass?
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Matt Ritter
Okay, that's a great question, because every time I had heard that before, I was like, I thought there were only four arteries.
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Aaron Caro
Yeah.
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Matt Ritter
So you want to. You want to get your mind blown.
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Aaron Caro
Is it vasectomy adjacent?
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Matt Ritter
Yeah. No, it's not. But men, this is what I was told when I was like, hey, quintuple. Isn't that 5? Aren't there 4? The math doesn't work.
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Aaron Caro
Yeah.
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Matt Ritter
Apparently men in their 40s start developing ancillary pathways. They create the body creates. When there's blockages, the body creates smaller ancillary arteries. H. So apparently, like, when you're in your 40s, you have more than four. And he had more than four blockages. So that's what I was.
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Aaron Caro
He grew another passage, then blocked it.
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Matt Ritter
Then blocked it.
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Aaron Caro
Oh, man. So. So. So I. I took us on a tangent, going back to what you just said about not having spoken to friends in a while. And actually, I want to save that because we have a listener question about it. But, you know, why? I guess let's get to the why of it. Okay. You're on your. That last day. Why do you think people say this?
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Matt Ritter
Oh, you mean, oh, why? Yeah, I mean, you know, they always say that people don't regret the things they do, right? They regret the things they don't do.
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Aaron Caro
Yes.
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Matt Ritter
Right. So it's like you've got, like, these things you can do in life, right? There's. You can do anything. Right. But there's. Once you haven't done it right, it's like you don't, like, you know, what it is to do something right. But, like, you don't really know what it's like to have not done it. So I think when you're, like, inventorying all the things you could have done in life, right. It hits you. You're like, man, I could have had all these experiences with that person. Yeah.
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Aaron Caro
Do you think this dovetails with sort of the larger thrust of our entire podcast, which is that the. The friendship is not considered an important relationship to many people.
- [16:15]
Matt Ritter
100%. 100%. You know, I had this thought yesterday when I was thinking about today's record, because I knew the topic, and I was thinking, man, we've been doing this for, you know, whatever, two and a half years, and still I'm so far from where I could be with some of my friendships.
- [16:35]
Aaron Caro
Yeah. I still. In the field, it was gonna say in the field. I still talk to people who are like, yeah, you know, my friendships are lacking, but it is what it is. And, like, I'll deal with it later, or, you know, I don't need friends. I have a partner. Like, there is no later.
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Matt Ritter
And that's the thing.
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Aaron Caro
There's no later.
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Matt Ritter
However you are, unless you're going to commit to the change, that's how you're going to be. Right.
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Aaron Caro
Someone said. Oh, it was Saheel Bloom in our recent episode. He said, later is a. Is a synonym for never.
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Matt Ritter
I like that. I think it's largely true.
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Aaron Caro
Yeah. For most people, especially this kind of change. Like, I think if you and I are like, all right, we'll work on this project later, we actually literally mean it. But when it's a holistic change in your life, which I. God knows I need some. It's either either doing it or you're not doing it.
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Matt Ritter
Yeah. And with friendships, like, you know, especially with friendships, what is going to spur the later? You know, because if it's like a work thing, at least, you know, like, oh, all right, well, I need to make money later, then I got to do this thing or something. But what is going to spur the change later that isn't spurring it now?
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Aaron Caro
Right, right. I think it all comes back to our. Probably our number one tip, which is be the friend, which is that, you know, either you have existing friends that you need to strengthen or you haven't seen, or you're lacking in friends in the first place. The answer to both of those is be the friend. No one's just going to come up to you and make friends with you. What did we say once? Like, no one makes. No one sends you a text and says, hey, want to go play catch in the park? Like, you have to do it.
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Matt Ritter
Right, right, right, right. So, yeah, I mean, look, I think a lot of people are walking around with a lot of friendship regrets, but they haven't really inventory them. They've really just blocked them out for the most part.
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Aaron Caro
Another very important. Like, is it tenant? Tenant, Tenant.
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Matt Ritter
Tenant, Tenant. Tenet.
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Aaron Caro
Tenet. Okay, so what's tenant?
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Matt Ritter
Like a landlord tenant.
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Aaron Caro
Oh, right, right, right.
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Matt Ritter
Person who lives in your. My back house.
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Aaron Caro
So another tenant is. It's never too late. Right. Like, for these people, it is too late because they're dying. But yeah, you know, I forgot who we. I don't know if you were with me, but I was talking to a buddy, and his dad is 80 and his friends have. Many of his friends have passed away and he's like, oh, well, that, that, that's, that's over for me. Friendship's over me. I'm like, no, it's not.
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Matt Ritter
You have 20 years left. Unless you're actually seeing the light. You can still see the light, right?
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Aaron Caro
Go, listen. One way is the light, the other way is your bros. Yeah, yeah.
- [19:26]
Matt Ritter
Run away from the light, Caroline. Remember that poltergeist, come to the light, Carolyn. What is that from older guys, they'd always try and get her to go die. Like the light was death. And they were just like, come to the light, Caroline. So messed up.
- [19:43]
Aaron Caro
You know what, Matt? You know, we've never talked about on this pod or off the pod, do you believe in any sort of like your life, flashing for your eyes, near death experience, seeing your relatives, any of that?
- [19:54]
Matt Ritter
It is odd that people across cultures have had very similar experiences across cultures, across time. So I, I think it's either two things, right? Either there is something that we're, you know, we don't know. And I've always thought, hey, there's definitely something greater than me or just the body shuts down in the exact same way.
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Aaron Caro
Well, the, for the former. I've read that potentially the reason why there's. Everyone has the same experience. Because you've heard other experiences and then.
- [20:27]
Matt Ritter
No, because this cuts across cultures where people have had no access to that knowledge.
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Aaron Caro
But I'm saying everybody in Japan has heard stories about people in Japan who's seeing their dead relatives. So that's what they're seeing.
- [20:39]
Matt Ritter
Right, Right. But some people haven't had that experience where they've had it heard, where they've heard.
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Aaron Caro
Yeah.
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Matt Ritter
That would account for it if it seeped into your mind.
- [20:49]
Aaron Caro
Yeah. I mean, it is obviously life's great mystery. I don't know what I feel, I kind of feel for my entire life, I felt like, that's it, you're dead. The end, end of consciousness. It's over.
- [21:00]
Matt Ritter
Very KO Very KO look, look at that. You're just worm food.
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Aaron Caro
I, I, I, and I'll tell you what, I'll tell you what I've always said I wanted to be cremated.
- [21:13]
Matt Ritter
Yeah.
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Aaron Caro
I just think burying a body in the ground and that, like, we need, it's just insane.
- [21:19]
Matt Ritter
I've told you the coffin stories, so I agree. The coffin, I mean, the coffin story.
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Aaron Caro
Oh, they upsold you.
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Matt Ritter
They really upsell you because they go, oh, you know how much you want to spend. You're like, not that much. Like, okay, here's this paper bag you want to put in there. Oh, God. Don't put them in a paper bag, for God's sakes.
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Aaron Caro
When my. When my. My uncle recently passed away, they took my aunt for a ride.
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Matt Ritter
Oh, yeah. On the coffin you're talking about.
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Aaron Caro
Yeah. The cherry finish, mahogany like you've never seen is beautiful.
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Matt Ritter
She went to mahogany. Yeah. And the. And the special gold plated bolts. Yeah. Was ridiculous.
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Aaron Caro
But.
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Matt Ritter
But anyway, I think lacquer on the inside too.
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Aaron Caro
Oh, yeah. He's gonna be very comfortable. He's very comfortable. The little.
- [22:01]
Matt Ritter
The little H vac unit, the little mini H vac unit in there.
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Aaron Caro
It is insane. The cushioning they have. He's dead. He's dead.
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Matt Ritter
She got the sealy. She went with the sealy.
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Aaron Caro
You know, mattress firm, Posturepedic. I wonder if Sealy should get into the coffin business.
- [22:18]
Matt Ritter
They really should. I mean, why should people be uncomfortable in the afterlife, right? Why should they be on a lumpy bed for all of eternity? Also, I don't know, do people get buried together? Because, like, then the sleep number should get in the game too.
- [22:32]
Aaron Caro
A sleep number. Coffin for two people.
- [22:35]
Matt Ritter
What's your death number? What's your permanent. What's your permanent sleep.
- [22:42]
Aaron Caro
Forgive me if this is too personal, but did you look at your father? Like, open cast?
- [22:48]
Matt Ritter
Oh, yeah. Just his head.
- [22:51]
Aaron Caro
Like, just the top half of the door.
- [22:53]
Matt Ritter
Very cold. It's very cold.
- [22:55]
Aaron Caro
But, but, but in the funeral or in like the morgue?
- [22:59]
Matt Ritter
In the morgue. In the funeral. We kept it closed.
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Aaron Caro
Got it. So what was that? If my. If you don't mind me asking, like, what was it like in the morgue?
- [23:07]
Matt Ritter
It's brutal.
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Aaron Caro
It's the worst.
- [23:08]
Matt Ritter
It's the worst moment of my life for sure.
- [23:11]
Aaron Caro
Lord.
- [23:12]
Matt Ritter
Yeah. Oh, yeah. That's like the. The permanence of it for forever. That's the moment you're like, oh, this is done. He's gone. Like. Because when you're like in the hospital and they just died, it's like.
- [23:24]
Aaron Caro
Yeah.
- [23:24]
Matt Ritter
Kind of like there's like something alive about him. I think there is actually some process. He's still happening. You know, once they're in that morgue, it's just a slab.
- [23:35]
Aaron Caro
Do you regret looking at him there?
- [23:37]
Matt Ritter
No.
- [23:39]
Aaron Caro
No. Yeah.
- [23:40]
Matt Ritter
I would go back in now and look if I could.
- [23:43]
Aaron Caro
Really? No. What?
- [23:45]
Matt Ritter
I'd go dig them up for a peek. Yeah.
- [23:48]
Aaron Caro
Oh, Lord. Wow. This went into a. Into a dark place.
- [23:52]
Matt Ritter
Should we move on to a listener question?
- [23:54]
Aaron Caro
Yes. Let's take a listen to question, guys. We'll be right back.
- [23:57]
Oregon Lottery Announcer
In the summer, all of Oregon is our playground thanks to our incredible park system. That's why it's so so cool that Oregon Lottery gameplay like video lottery or cash pop helps support tons of parks projects statewide, like accessible trails at Silver Falls State park or upgrades to your favorite dog park in Newburgh. It's just one way a little lottery play for many Oregonians can add up to a lot of good the Oregon Lottery Together we do good things. Lottery games are based on chance and should be played for entertainment only. Must be 18 or older to play.
- [24:30]
Wayfair Announcer
We interrupt this program to bring you an important Wayfair message Wayfair's got Style Tips for Every Home this is Stiles Mackenzie helping you make those rooms sing. Today's Style Tip when it comes to making a statement, treat bold patterns like neutrals. Go wild like an untamed animal. Print area rug under a rustic farmhouse table. From wayfair.com this has been your Wayfair style tip to get Keep those interiors superior, way fair.
- [24:57]
Aaron Caro
Every style, every home okay, this is Asking for a friend. If you have a friendship question or ethical dilemma, send it to us on Instagram. It's man of the Year podcast is the actual handle, Matt man of your podcast, and we'll answer on the show. Okay, so this is a good one, Matt. They say dear man Caro, love the pod, but I'm in desperate need of asking for a friend advice. This is from a a guy, by the way. He says, I ghosted my best friend Jake two years ago and I regret it every day. We had a stupid fight about me canceling plans too often, and instead of apologizing I just stopped responding. I told myself I'd reach out when things felt less awkward, but now so much time has passed that I don't even know how to fix it. I see him posting about his life and it kills me that I'm not part of it anymore. How do I even begin to make this right after all this time?
- [25:48]
Matt Ritter
Wow. Such a good question. Such a good question. And it's so. I don't know, it's courageous to do this stuff because it's scary and somebody's got to do it. Otherwise you both just end up never being friends. And that's a shame. Right? And we do blow things up. We blow close friendships up over nothing.
- [26:11]
Aaron Caro
Yeah.
- [26:11]
Matt Ritter
Never talk again. Over nothing.
- [26:17]
Aaron Caro
You know, it's. I mean, I think probably our both of our advice is going to be like, you should reach out. You know, this guy's not going to reach out to you. You ghosted him.
- [26:30]
Matt Ritter
Even so, I want to Back up on that. I want to back up on that. I don't think that we should be encouraging our listeners to abide by those rules. Right. Like, if you were the one who were spurned by a friend, whatever, and you still feel like you want to figure out a way to repair, you can do that. It doesn't have to be, oh, well, because by the way, they're probably both at fault too. Like, this whole idea, like, I definitely did the thing, so I have to repair it. Like, maybe that's not also true, you know, and if the other friend isn't talking to you, it's maybe also because they didn't want to, you know, I don't know. Just. I just want to be like, look, if either of you feel you want to get back in touch, whether or not that person wronged you and they haven't apologized, and you think there's a way to repair it, and you feel like you're missing something, just do it.
- [27:16]
Aaron Caro
You know, I gotta say, I actually, this. This happened in real life. Someone came to me, they. A college friend. So about 20 years ago, these. These two of my fraternity brothers, they had a falling out, like over a girl, and they never spoke again. And one of. One of the guys said to me, I think I'm going to reach out our reunions coming up, like, want to see what he's up to. And he doesn't think the other guys, say again?
- [27:47]
Matt Ritter
20 years.
- [27:49]
Aaron Caro
20. 20 years. Yeah, 20 years.
- [27:51]
Matt Ritter
They haven't spoken in 20 years.
- [27:53]
Aaron Caro
Haven't spoken in 20 years. And I said to him, and I think if you just looked at this objectively, the, the other person was probably the one who was scorned, and maybe my buddy was the scorner. Whatever, fine.
- [28:08]
Matt Ritter
Yeah.
- [28:08]
Aaron Caro
And I was kind of just like, well, why do you want to get in? Like, why do you want to get in touch? And. And it seemed like he actually did not. Like, he's like, well, I just kind of want to see, you know what?
- [28:21]
Matt Ritter
He didn't really have a good reason.
- [28:22]
Aaron Caro
Exactly, exactly. I was lucky. I said, I said, I said, I just think you should leave it.
- [28:30]
Matt Ritter
Leave it. Right? You know, and some friendships are. Are. Are maybe, you know, like, that's the thing. A lot of the times men have these falling outs or falling offs, as we say, and they haven't quite consciously thought it through consciously, but they have thought it through subconsciously. And by that I mean you should listen to your, you know, instincts that made you make this decision, even if you haven't totally processed it on a conscious level, you made a decision to not talk to that person, and maybe that's right for you. But if it's not right for you, then you should be able to figure out why you want to get back in touch with them.
- [29:08]
Aaron Caro
In this instance of the listener question, let's say he decides, you know what? I have my reasons are. Are true. I want to reach out to Jake. Any best practices?
- [29:17]
Matt Ritter
Yes, my number one best practices. We're not going to dwell on the breakup.
- [29:22]
Aaron Caro
Oh, interesting. Yeah, interesting.
- [29:28]
Matt Ritter
I think for, for men, for male friendships, I think the best move is let's. If you're gonna address it, it's got to be quick and move on. If it's going to be about that. It's just. It's just so hard.
- [29:43]
Aaron Caro
But what if the other person wants to dwell on it?
- [29:49]
Matt Ritter
Well, if the other person wants to dwell on it, then you're gonna have to figure out a way to navigate that. Right. If, if they don't. If they come in just like, okay, let's. Moving on. I think you should reciprocate that energy of just moving on.
- [30:01]
Aaron Caro
I think another way to sort of reframe what you just suggested, which I like, is in your reach out. You could say, listen, I, I apologize, you know, but don't dwell on that.
- [30:12]
Matt Ritter
Right. Yeah. Be like, look, you know, I'm sorry things, you know, went however they went. Let's not rehash it. Let's not rel. I don't, I don't want to litigate. We'd love to just hang out, set the terms of the hang.
- [30:22]
Aaron Caro
Yeah, I think the terms of the hang, I, I like an apology. You know, I think it just. This goes a long way.
- [30:30]
Matt Ritter
Yes.
- [30:31]
Aaron Caro
I like saying I miss you. Like, I like you. I like expressing gratitude. Your.
- [30:38]
Matt Ritter
Yeah.
- [30:39]
Aaron Caro
Friendship is important to me.
- [30:41]
Matt Ritter
Yeah. I mean, if you're the person who. Wrong person. Yes, I agree you have to apologize and know, clear the air. But I, I think there's apologizing and then there's dwelling.
- [30:52]
Aaron Caro
You know, what's the vehicle? Phone call, text, email.
- [30:56]
Matt Ritter
I mean, I think text is just easiest. The thing is, is we build up in our head. The longer it goes, the harder it is. Right. So year goes by, it's a lot harder to call somebody. Two years go by, it's feels like impossible to just pick up the phone and call somebody.
- [31:15]
Aaron Caro
Say the last part again.
- [31:16]
Matt Ritter
I think it's just law of a text, like, hey, right. Get together, you know, but yes, you're gonna have to do the apology and that has to be either a phone or in person.
- [31:24]
Aaron Caro
The problem. Listen, I think we both are, you know, a little bit more phone forward. And if. If you recall from, like, whatever the Valentine's Day episode we were talking about calling this girl that I was talking to, the problem with our culture now is that, like, people don't pick up the phone. So especially if it's someone you haven't talked to in two years. Well, you're not. Are you going to leave a voicemail? Probably not. So now you just have a missed call from this guy.
- [31:47]
Matt Ritter
Right.
- [31:48]
Aaron Caro
So then maybe you follow up with a text after that.
- [31:51]
Matt Ritter
When you follow up with a text. Hey, man, we just wanted to catch up. If you, you know, if you're. If you have a minute, love to chat. You know, it's hard because then they're not going to know whether you're doing the apology.
- [32:06]
Aaron Caro
I will. I want to also analyze one part of the question. He said we had a stupid fight about me canceling plans too often. This is Matt's bugaboo. This is Matt's peccadillo. Stop canceling plans so much.
- [32:18]
Matt Ritter
Right, right. That's not a minor thing. Clearly it says you don't respect that person and you're not, you know, you're not invested in their relationship.
- [32:30]
Aaron Caro
Like, social plans should not be fungible. Like, you made the plan. Unless something really came up. Like, stick to the plan.
- [32:37]
Matt Ritter
As I've said, I just put you in another bucket. Like, I don't necessarily kick you, cast you out with the sodomites, but I put you in another bucket. Just that you're not a real high quality friend. You're in the. Whatever. I could take them or leave them if they want to. Come. Come. I'm never going to make a direct plan with just me and you. Where my plans are on the line. Where now my week, my. My night is ruined if you don't show.
- [32:59]
Aaron Caro
Yeah, yeah. It's interesting. I. I recently had a couple interactions. I was with some people and they were like, oh, we gotta hang out. And I was like, no, no, we don't. Like, we're not that close. But then I had. I had another interaction with friends and it was like, oh, we gotta hang out. But we actually meant it. And then we followed up with text, and then I had dinner with them last night.
- [33:25]
Matt Ritter
That's great.
- [33:27]
Aaron Caro
So, like, I think maybe to your point, Matt, the saying we should hang out is devaluing. It's like the boy who cried plants.
- [33:36]
Matt Ritter
Yeah, the boy who cried plans. Love it. Plans.
- [33:45]
Aaron Caro
Genius. Otherwise, no, then. Otherwise, no one knows if you're serious or not.
- [33:49]
Matt Ritter
Right. That term means nothing to me. When people say we should hang out, it means absolutely nothing.
- [33:55]
Aaron Caro
Right. I'm writing this down.
- [33:59]
Matt Ritter
Do we answer it? Do you think we answered yes?
- [34:02]
Aaron Caro
That was asking for a friend. If you have a friendship question, send it to us on Instagram and we'll answer on the show.
- [34:06]
Matt Ritter
Yeah. So just do it. It was our, Was our. The moral decision.
- [34:10]
Aaron Caro
Oh, I thought you were wrapping it to a different thing. Yes, Just do it.
- [34:13]
Matt Ritter
I wanted to say I think you'd be proud of me for something I did, which is, I guess, slightly out of what I think is my character of, like, I don't know, just being too available to people. Yeah. Too available. Too spreading myself too thin. A friend, not even that close, asked me to take a coffee with somebody to, like, you know, mentor who's trying to get into the biz. You know how I feel about the time of the coffee. And it's a, you know, it's a 30 minute commitment. Fine. But whatever, I'm busy. I'm, I could be with my son. I left because they were so late.
- [34:59]
Aaron Caro
Okay, so that's, that's almost a different topic. I mean, I mean, first of all, unacceptable. How late?
- [35:06]
Matt Ritter
16 minutes late.
- [35:09]
Aaron Caro
I mean, for a, for a, for a indirect introduction. In other words, a friend or friend got to be there. 15 minutes early.
- [35:16]
Matt Ritter
Yeah, 16 minutes late. I said, I'm bailing. I gotta go. I have another meeting.
- [35:22]
Aaron Caro
I would also never speak to the friend who introduced you again.
- [35:24]
Matt Ritter
Oh, yeah, yeah. No, I just thought you would be proud of me. I just, that's the first time I've ever done that in my life.
- [35:29]
Aaron Caro
Yes, yes. I, I, I. This is maybe the proudest I've ever been.
- [35:33]
Matt Ritter
I'm feeling good about myself. First, I felt really bad. I was feeling guilty. I'm like, oh, I shouldn't do this. This person, I'm sure they have their reasons. Like, I went through that whole, like, you know, Rolodex of excuses that I make for people.
- [35:47]
Aaron Caro
I mean, did they have a reason? They're just like, I'm running late.
- [35:50]
Matt Ritter
Yeah, just, I'm running late. And then, and then, like, parking's gonna be hard and like, all this stuff.
- [35:55]
Aaron Caro
No, no, they. Were they younger than us. Young, youthful.
- [36:00]
Matt Ritter
Yeah, yeah.
- [36:02]
Aaron Caro
Guys, kids, kiddos. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Lesson learned. And you know what? Maybe that is a good lesson he or she has learned. Like, now I got to show up on time.
- [36:11]
Matt Ritter
And then they were like, next time, I promise I'll be on time. And then I didn't respond.
- [36:15]
Aaron Caro
Yeah, I'm. I'm really proud of you, Matt. Reclaim your time.
- [36:19]
Matt Ritter
Yeah, I reclaim my time. The gentleman from Hancock park reclaims his time.
- [36:29]
Aaron Caro
Oh. All right, guys. I think we covered it. Let us know if you have any friendship regrets or people that you need to reach out to that you've been ghosted or have been ghosted by. Thank you so much for listening. Always remember, be good to yourself. Oh, wait, he's back.
- [36:44]
Matt Ritter
I gotta stop. We need to ask our listeners, please let us know if you have or have not had a vasectomy, a snip and tell us.
- [36:52]
Aaron Caro
Send us your snip snip stories and we will share it on the show. Always remember, be good to yourself. Be good to your friends. Love you, buddy.
- [37:00]
Matt Ritter
Love you, buddy.
- [37:01]
Oregon Lottery Announcer
In the summer, all of Oregon is our playground thanks to our incredible park system. That's why it's so cool that Oregon Oregon Lottery gameplay like video lottery or cash pop helps support tons of parks projects statewide like accessible trails at Silver Fall State park or upgrades to your favorite dog park in Newburgh. It's just one way a little lottery play for many Oregonians can add up to a lot of good the Oregon Lottery. Together, we do good things. Lottery games are based on chance and should be played for entertainment only. Must be 18 or older to play.