#147 - Friendship Dry Spells

Summary

Podcast Summary: Man of the Year – Champions of Friendship

Episode #147: "Friendship Dry Spells"

Hosts: Matt Ritter & Aaron Karo
Date: September 2, 2025

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Matt and Aaron tackle the phenomenon of "friendship dry spells"—those periods when social connections dwindle, and you realize you haven’t spent time with, or even talked to, your friends in a while. Drawing from their own lives and comedic friendship expertise, they dissect what constitutes a dry spell, why they happen (especially among men), and offer advice on recognizing and reversing these spells. They also answer a listener’s thought-provoking question about the fleeting nature of many adult friendships.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Concept of "Friendship Dry Spells"

Starts at [07:29]

• Definition and Misconceptions:

  • Traditionally, “dry spell” is associated with dating, but Aaron reframes it for friendship: "You look around for a minute and think, oh, I actually haven't seen my friends in a while or made a new friend in a while." [07:51]
  • Matt adds, "It's a bit fallow...I actually haven't seen a friend or spoken to friends or made a new friend in a really long time." [08:32]

• Why Dry Spells Matter:

  • Aaron notes, “Especially our men are like, oh, I haven’t seen my buddies in six months. That’s fine. No, it’s not fine.” [08:52]
  • The hosts stress that regular, deliberate maintenance is crucial—even a few months without social connections can have an emotional impact.

2. Quantifying a "Dry Spell"

Starts at [10:12]

• How Long is Too Long?

  • Matt and Aaron debate what qualifies as a dry spell:
    • Aaron: "30 days." [11:02]
    • Matt: "Six months." [11:04]
  • They agree: Not seeing a single friend for 30 days may constitute a dry spell; for group hangouts, six months might be the mark.

• Quality vs. Quantity:

  • Aaron suggests a deeper dimension: perhaps six months without a truly meaningful interaction is significant. [12:06]

• Consistent “Social Fitness”:

  • Matt: "The idea is we want you to consistently be thinking about your social fitness so that you’re never in a dry spell." [12:20]

3. Preventing Friendship Dry Spells

Starts at [12:45]

• The “Snack” Approach:

  • Aaron draws an analogy between maintaining friendships and healthy eating: "Instead of three meals, eat little snacks throughout the day." [12:45]
  • Matt promotes "low key hangs"—short, informal socializing that fits a busy adult schedule. [12:57]

• The TCS Rubric:

  • Matt outlines a practical approach:
    • Text once a week
    • Call once a month
    • See your friends once a quarter (every three months)
      “If you haven’t done that, then you’re in a dry spell with your friends.” [13:33]

4. How to Break Out of a Dry Spell

Starts at [14:51]

• Inventory Your Social Universe:

  • Aaron’s tip: Write down or mentally recall who your friends are, especially those local to you. "Friendship requires watering. ... We like to use friending as a verb." [15:40]
  • Matt: Regular inventories (birthdays, New Year's, etc.) help combat the mistaken sense that you “have no friends.” [15:40]

• Activate Dormant Friendships:

  • Pick a few (even just one) friends you miss and reach out: "Just this made me think of you. Send a meme, send a pic, send a place you guys were at together." [16:51]
  • Make hangouts easy to say yes to—be specific and work around their schedule. [17:36]

• Overcoming Cognitive Barriers:

  • Addressing the fear of rejection:

    • Matt: "These are the narratives that you have created in your head. These limiting beliefs that people don’t want to hang out with you." [17:50]
    • Aaron (in jest): "I know for me I’m like, slow down!" [18:13]

  • If the first friend is unresponsive, try another: “If that's the case, find somebody else.” [18:50]

5. Listener Question: Are Friendships Supposed to Be Temporary?

Starts at [21:33]

Listener writes:
They’ve had many “deeply meaningful but also temporary” friendships tied to life phases or events. They worry about their ideal of a lifelong inner circle—is it outdated, or is modern adult friendship inherently more “modular”?

Notable Discussion Points:

• Friendship “Seasons”:
  Matt: "There are seasons for friendship...you replace your close friends every seven years, half of them, so it’s normal." [23:23]
• Core versus Circumstantial Friends:
  Aaron: "There’s no law that says you can’t hang out anymore." [24:32]
• Self-Awareness:
  Matt: "Hey, am I the one who's running the fluidity ship here, the temporary friendship ship?" [26:20]
• Modern Realities:
  Aaron: "Modern adult friendship is more fluid because now everybody moves and people go to Abu Dhabi for a year." [28:10]
• Meaningful Connections Still Matter:
  Matt: "The standard bearer of what a good friend is, is somebody that I think you want to keep around long-term." [30:44]
• Friendship “Flings”:
  • It’s okay to have “friendship flings”—temporary or situational connections. But, as Matt says, "You’re not looking for the one. You’re looking for a one." [29:14]
  • Nonetheless, don’t disregard rekindling more lasting connections from these flings.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Social Maintenance:
  "Friendship requires watering. ... We like to use friending as a verb." – Aaron Caro [15:40]

• On Inventorying Friends:
  "When we're saying, you do have friends, you do have friends, you just go look in your phone. They're there." – Matt Ritter [15:40]

• On Texting Old Friends:
  “These are the narratives that you have created in your head. These limiting beliefs that people don’t want to hang out with you.” – Matt Ritter [17:50]

• On Friendship FOMO:
  "Well, you can make a day one friend, starting today, and then in 40 years, you’ll be as friends as long as me and Matt." – Aaron Caro [27:25]

• On “Friendship Flings” vs. Lifelong Friends:
  “You're not looking for the one. You’re looking for a one.” – Matt Ritter [29:14]

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Timestamps of Key Segments

• Baseball Rant & Segue to Main Topic: [01:43–07:29]
• Defining “Friendship Dry Spell”: [07:29–09:24]
• Quantifying a Dry Spell: [10:12–12:20]
• Maintenance & Prevention Tips: [12:45–14:51]
• Friendship Inventory & Activation: [14:51–19:04]
• Listener Question (Temporary Friendships): [21:33–32:26]
• Final Thoughts & Personal Check-ins: [32:45–33:57]

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Final Takeaways

• Friendship dry spells are common but not a fate to accept; they’re an opportunity to check your “social fitness.”
• Stay proactive: Short, low-pressure social interactions (texts, quick hangs) help maintain bonds.
• Inventory your relationships regularly, and don’t be afraid to reach out—even if some connections have gone dormant.
• Modern friendships may be more fluid, but meaningful, long-term bonds still matter and are within reach—if you nurture them intentionally.

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Hosts’ Sign-off:
“Always remember: Be good to yourself. Be good to your friends. Love you, buddy.” – Aaron & Matt [34:16]

Transcript

[Unknown Speaker A]

What do you think makes the perfect snack?

[Matt Ritter]

Hmm, it's gotta be when I'm really.

[Unknown Speaker C]

Craving it and it's convenient.

[Aaron Caro]

Could you be more specific?

[Matt Ritter]

When it's cravinient. Okay. Like a freshly baked cookie made with real butter, available right down the street at am pm. Or a savory breakfast sandwich I can grab in just a second at a.m. pM.

[Aaron Caro]

I'm seeing a pattern here.

[Unknown Speaker C]

Well, yeah, we're talking about what I.

[Unknown Speaker A]

Crave, which is anything from AM pm.

[Matt Ritter]

What more could you want? Stop by AM PM where the snacks.

[Unknown Speaker E]

And drinks are perfectly craveable and convenient. That's crazy. Cravenience ampm Too much good stuff.

[Unknown Speaker C]

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[Aaron Caro]

Man of the Year. Man of the Year.

[Matt Ritter]

Man of the Year.

[Aaron Caro]

Welcome to the number one friendship podcast in the country. I'm Aaron Caro.

[Matt Ritter]

I'm Matt Ritter.

[Aaron Caro]

And make sure to go to manotherpodcast.com to grab our merch and watch our episodes on YouTube. Matt, have a little rant. We actually have spoken about this on the pod before. It's been about a year, but we've got a lot of new listeners. Our mutual great friend visited la. He invited us. Go to a Dodgers game. You guys are Mets fans. Mets, Dodgers. You couldn't go. So me and him are going to the Mets Dodgers game. He goes, where do you want to sit? I'll get tickets. And I go, I don't care as long as there's not going to be a foul ball or a home run coming at us. And he goes, what do you mean? He's like, I just. I won't sit anywhere where there are balls flying into the stands is too dangerous. He goes I goes, what are you talking about? You'll catch it? I'm like, what do you mean you'll catch it? We're going to be drinking beers. We're not paying attention. We don't have gloves, even if we had gloves. He's like, I've never heard that before. I'm like, I just saved your life. Just the idea that we. We still have a baseball stadium, that now there's more nets that you can just get destroyed with a foul ball. I'm telling you, someone we know is going to pass away. I hope it's not someone that we like, because it's insane that we have a system like this. It's just insane. It go. It comes at 100 miles an hour. You can't catch that.

[Matt Ritter]

So, two things. One is, I thought you were saying that you don't want to sit in the home run territory because it's too far and the seats aren't expensive enough for you.

[Aaron Caro]

No, no, no. I. He. He got good seats, but they're right behind the dugout. I'm like, that's where you die.

[Matt Ritter]

Right? Well, because I was going to say that's kind of like a good high low that you were, like, writing off. You're like, don't want to get hit because it's too close, but also don't want to be too far, because I think you're right. I'll give you this. I fully agree. First base, third base. I don't want any part of it. Home run, by the time the ball lands to you, that can't kill you.

[Aaron Caro]

That. That's fair. I mean, it can kill you if you're not. You're probably paying attention if a home run gets to you.

[Matt Ritter]

Unless it's. Unless it's like Yankee Stadium line drive, and you're sitting, like, right there because that's 3:14 right down. Like, you could take that one in the chest, in their face, and like, boom. But the arc, the angle, like a Pete Alonso moonshot that comes down 400. You're sitting there, it spills your beer, and maybe you get a little bruise, but you're not getting, like, you know, this isn't like coconut kills you falling out of a tree.

[Aaron Caro]

I mean, if it hits you in the head, it could kill you, but maybe.

[Matt Ritter]

Maybe. Yeah, but I. Look, I'm definitely scared. I've been to a hockey game where my mom and I were there, and this woman's face exploded right in front of us. I always tell that story because I'm always just like that. Was sort of like, why I never like the sports that I play. I'd rather get hit by another person. Like football, like physical, like take. I'll take a tackle versus like somebody hitting me with a high velocity hard object.

[Aaron Caro]

Yeah. And they've extended. I did, I did extensive research. They've extended the nets of stadiums. Yeah. Which.

[Matt Ritter]

So other nets in front of the first base and third baselines now that. It can't really go. Go there.

[Aaron Caro]

Yes, it kind of goes. It kind of like it goes past the dugout now. So it goes farther than it used to go. Like, like you remember in the movie Major League this, the, the fans are dancing on the dugout when they win. Like you can't get out anymore.

[Matt Ritter]

Oh, really?

[Aaron Caro]

Yeah.

[Matt Ritter]

So. Yeah. How many fans have been struck and killed by baseballs in history?

[Aaron Caro]

Is that what you're asking me?

[Matt Ritter]

Yeah. All right.

[Aaron Caro]

I, I bet you it's pretty low in. I mean, baseball's been around for 150 years, but I'm going to say seven.

[Matt Ritter]

So according to this book, there's been 850 fan deaths in all levels. MLB down to little League ever.

[Aaron Caro]

From getting hit by balls.

[Matt Ritter]

Yeah. The most recent foul ball death or. I don't. It doesn't necessarily say. I think some people fall over the railing, but there were. It doesn't necessarily say there were six fatalities between 2019 and 2014.

[Aaron Caro]

Yeah, I mean, there's just.

[Matt Ritter]

It's. It's shark bite. Territory shark, you know, Know.

[Aaron Caro]

But not a lot of people die. By shark, you mean.

[Matt Ritter]

Right, Right. So this one's comparing all spectator sports.

[Aaron Caro]

Well, no one's ever died at a basketball game, so we know that.

[Matt Ritter]

Right. Foul ball, 39% fall 27%. Stray bat, 15%. Violent assault, 6%. Yeah, that's the breakdown of death at baseball games. 39. Foul ball, 27 fall 15. Straight baseball bat, 6%. Violent assault.

[Aaron Caro]

Yeah, I mean, you're. You're likely to get dressed, beat by the guy next to you then, Right? Yeah.

[Matt Ritter]

People forget about that being an option too.

[Aaron Caro]

Yeah. I mean, I just, I just, I want to die in a normal way and a long time from now.

[Matt Ritter]

Right. Yeah, I'm with you. I, I don't want to go that way.

[Aaron Caro]

Yeah. So anyway, I just wanted to share that. Like, anyone who sits. I mean, is there a counter argument? Like, oh, you catch foul balls and that's fun and cool and whatever is.

[Matt Ritter]

There is. It is foul. It is cool and fun. If you're the type of person that. That's cool and fun too. Right.

[Aaron Caro]

Yeah, well, okay. There's no real transition to our. To our topic, but I want to talk about dry spells, the old dry spell. So, you know, you. Often we would talk about dry spells in sort of a romantic sense, like, oh, I haven't gotten laid in a while. I haven't been.

[Matt Ritter]

You have something you want to tell us?

[Aaron Caro]

No, no, absolutely not. Although I did think. I think I wrote an episode of a column of ruminations about dry spells and maybe the early aughts. But you and I were talking offline about four friendship dry spells. When you look around for a minute and think, oh, I actually haven't seen my friends in a while or made a new friend in a while and how. And you had a good point of how that can be misdiagnosed. But just starting from the top, friendship dry spell. You. You. You have. You can. You have go through blood sugar drops. That's different than a dry spell, I would assume.

[Matt Ritter]

Yeah, I go through the emotional feelings of it, but I think what we're talking about with a friendship dry spell is, hey, I actually haven't seen a friend or spoken to friends or made a new friend in a really long time. It's a bit fallow.

[Aaron Caro]

You said your crops have. Have. Have lain fallow.

[Matt Ritter]

Yeah, Lane fallow.

[Aaron Caro]

Yeah. And I think, well, a couple of things. One, when you're going through a friendship, I think a lot of people are going through friendship drive spells. That's why we have an entire podcast about it. It's something that I think we need to be on alert for, because especially our men are like, oh, I haven't seen my buddies in six months. That's fine. No, it's not fine. And what to do about it? Because I think a lot of people go right to. Well, I don't have any friends to see in the first place.

[Matt Ritter]

And we.

[Aaron Caro]

We also know that that is not necessarily true.

[Matt Ritter]

I just had a good laugh internally just when you said dry spell and just. You were talking about dating dry spell. We all know the remedy for getting out of a dry spell. The classic.

[Aaron Caro]

Is it a rebound? Oh, a slump buster. A friendship slump buster.

[Matt Ritter]

That means any port in the storm.

[Aaron Caro]

Well, we did an episode about friendship rebounds.

[Matt Ritter]

Yeah, similar.

[Aaron Caro]

Yeah.

[Matt Ritter]

Maybe you just need any sort of level of socialization to get yourself out of a friendship dry spell.

[Aaron Caro]

Right? Yeah. Yeah.

[Matt Ritter]

Should we define. Hold on, let's back up. Should we define friendship dry spell? Like. Like put some. Put some quantification on it.

[Aaron Caro]

Yes. Okay. Now, do you think it's more about making a Friend or actually seeing your friends?

[Matt Ritter]

Well, we could do both categories. Right. So what is a Haven't made a new friend? I mean, or if you have a lot of friends, you don't need to necessarily make new friends.

[Aaron Caro]

Right. Let's stick with seeing or seeing your friends.

[Matt Ritter]

Yeah.

[Aaron Caro]

Or interacting with your friends. Oh, God, how long. This is. This is. Feel like we're like the international. What is that, like weights and measures? Well, they have a brick that's exactly one pound. And, like, think in your head. Don't say it out loud. You think in your head how long you have to go without seeing your friends to. To pick. To be a drive. Sp. I have a number. You. You. What do you say?

[Matt Ritter]

Okay. One, two, three. Six months.

[Aaron Caro]

30 days.

[Matt Ritter]

Wow.

[Aaron Caro]

Six. Wow. Wow. So Matt said six months. I said 30 days. I thought you were going to go lower.

[Matt Ritter]

Well, I mean, if we're going to start, like, saying, hey, I'm in a dry spell, I mean, what are we saying? You haven't seen anybody?

[Aaron Caro]

Well, I mean, you've seen your family.

[Matt Ritter]

Just, like, haven't seen a single. I haven't seen a friend at all. Well, yeah, if you haven't seen a friend at all. Sure. 30 days.

[Aaron Caro]

Well, what are you. You're. Listen, we can.

[Matt Ritter]

I just meant, like, oh, if you haven't, you know, like, are we talking about one particular friend or just any friend? You're saying haven't seen a single friend? I don't know, Matt. We're. We're.

[Aaron Caro]

We're in charge. We're the friendship experts.

[Matt Ritter]

All right, so if you haven't seen a single friend, I'd say 30 days. But if you feel like you haven't, like, you know, really hung out with your friends, quote, unquote, as a group. Six months.

[Aaron Caro]

Yeah.

[Matt Ritter]

Like, collectively, you know, if you're like, I have a. I have a good crew. Been six months. I haven't seen any of them collectively. I don't know, maybe that is long.

[Aaron Caro]

Or maybe it's six months without a really deep interaction and 30 days.

[Matt Ritter]

Yeah. Just for us to, like, start being like, I don't want people walking around going, I'm in a dry spell. I'm going to dry spell every. Every month.

[Aaron Caro]

I don't know. Maybe we do.

[Matt Ritter]

Yeah, but maybe we do. Maybe we do. I mean, look, the idea is we want you to consistently be thinking about your social fitness so that you're never in a dry spell, that you never find yourself in a position where you're like, man, I really haven't talked to any of my friends. I mean, you're not supposed to live like that. Your. Your existence should not be set up so that you haven't talked to a friend in such a long time that you're going, man, oh, it's been a long time.

[Aaron Caro]

Well, you know how, like they say, oh, instead of like three meals, eat little snacks throughout the day.

[Matt Ritter]

Yeah.

[Aaron Caro]

Like, I wonder if that's an easier pill to swallow not to mix metaphors.

[Matt Ritter]

Well, that's why I'm a big proponent of low key hangs. Because for as you get older and your families and work obligations and things just get out of control for their schedule, when you feel your calendar slipping from you, the low key hang is. Is a simple way to go. I don't have to have an event to see this person. You want to take a walk, you want to do this. But again, like, we should be all right. We should be using our TCS rubric. Text, call C. Text once a week, call once a month, See, get eyes on once a quarter. That's every three months. If you haven't done that, then, yeah, you're in a. You're in a dry spell with your friends.

[Aaron Caro]

I think even just like Loki hangs aside. One hour. A. One hour beer. One beer.

[Matt Ritter]

Yeah. Do you think it's a good idea to start vocalizing this to your friends? And if so, like, are we saying individually? Like, you're gonna say, like, hey, I feel like our friendship is in a dry spell. How do you feel about that?

[Aaron Caro]

Well, depends on the situation. If they're like, you haven't been able to get. I don't know if it means as much when you're saying it to another person.

[Matt Ritter]

Right, Right. This is just our own internal. This is your own internal clocking.

[Aaron Caro]

Because I think you're. It's more like, hey, I haven't seen you in a while.

[Matt Ritter]

Right. Right. Let's not end up in a friendship dry spell.

[Aaron Caro]

Right. Right. You know, I mean, I think a lot of it is just guys don't think it's important.

[Matt Ritter]

Right. Right. The consistency or I think is. Is the big part, though. They. If you're consistent, you won't end up in friendship drive spells. If you're using our advice and you're just thinking about this stuff, you're not going to end up in a friendship drive. But I think we should talk about what do you do if you find yourself in one? Right.

[Aaron Caro]

Well, we often start with social universe, which is like, who are your friends? You know, I. I write it down, but you don't have to do that. You know, if you're new to the podcast, take a minute. You could use a notes app or just in your head, who are my friends? Who are my. Start with the friends who live in your city. There's Jim, there's Bob, there's Lisa. Like, just make a mental note of who they are. And it could be two, it could be 20, we don't know. And then you're like, well, have I seen any of that? Like, have I spoken to any of them recently? Have I texted with any of them recently? Like, friendship requires watering. Not just like. Like, you know, a friendship is, is. Is. We like to use friending as a verb. You know, you got to do. You got to do something.

[Matt Ritter]

I. I do like the idea of doing the inventory regularly because Cairo does it on his birthday, which is a fine time to do it. New Year's, whatever. But that whole idea of, like, I have no friends, right? When. When we're saying, you do have friends, you do have friends, you just go look in your phone. They're there. They're all there. They're all in your phone. There's plenty of people that, if you go through the phone one by one, is this a friend? This is not a friend. Is. I mean, there's a lot of people who are randos that are not your friends in your phone, too. Yeah, let's be clear. But your phone is filled with people that are your friends. And if you are like, hey, well, these are the. Why don't you just. Here, let's go take it one step further. Inventory your friends. Have I seen? Have I not seen? Let's pick three that you want to see more frequently than you're seeing. Or the three that you're really in the friendship, you know, dry spell with that you don't want to be in a friendship drive spell with. And let's just activate those three.

[Aaron Caro]

Yeah, I mean, I would even, you know, I would even pick one. Start with one. I mean, if you want. Yeah. And what do we mean by activate?

[Matt Ritter]

Well, we can always go with, you know, it's been a while. You know, we're just thinking about you. Text. Just this made me think of you. Send a meme, send a pic. Send a place you guys were at together. But we also mean activate is put something on the calendar and make it easy for that other person to say, yes. Look at your calendar. Be prepared when you're doing this, right? If your goal is, hey, I want to get this person back in my life, just make it easy. Go, hey, I'm free Tuesday night, Cleared the calendar, got the wife buy in, come meet me for a drink.

[Aaron Caro]

All right, Matt. So let's say I'm a, I'm a listener. And I'm saying, yeah, Matt, I. I mean, I could text my buddy Bob. I haven't talked to in a while, but like, I don't. He. He probably doesn't want to hang out.

[Matt Ritter]

No, you're wrong. He does want to hang out. We say this all the time on the pod. These are the narratives that you have created in your head. These limiting beliefs that people don't want to hang out with you. Who flip it. When do you not like getting that text from somebody saying, hey, was just thinking about you. It's been a while since we hung out. Love to see you. I love when I get those texts.

[Aaron Caro]

I know for me I'm like, slow down.

[Matt Ritter]

Yeah.

[Aaron Caro]

Like there's a reason we. We haven't hung out.

[Matt Ritter]

No, but that could be. Listen. But no, you're joking. But you're also not joking. No, you are joking. But that could be accurate. Like, again, if you're assessing the friendship, like, hey, do we both like each other? Are these feelings mutual? Is this dry spell just a accident or circumstances? Or neither of us are good at like, putting in the time and effort and we're both kind of lazy about it, or is it like this, a one sided friendship? I text this person, they never text back. If that's the case, find somebody else.

[Aaron Caro]

Right, Right. Certainly you want to pick someone you've got a good feeling about that you've hung out with before.

[Matt Ritter]

Yeah.

[Aaron Caro]

And obviously I was just joking. Most, you know, most, most incomings. Everybody likes an incoming text like that thinking about you. Let's do something.

[Matt Ritter]

J RO goes delete.

[Aaron Caro]

Oh, man. Should we take a listener question?

[Matt Ritter]

Let's do it.

[Aaron Caro]

All right, we'll be right back.

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[Aaron Caro]

Is asking for a friend. If you have a friendship question or ethical dilemma, send it to us on Instagram and we will answer it on the show. Our handles manofthearpodcast ok, okay, this is. This was a good one. Matt Dear Matt and Caro, As I look back on the past few years, I realize many of my friendships were deeply meaningful but also temporary. So some lasted a a season of the year, others a work project, a personal crisis one of us was going through or a shared stage of life. And I'm struggling to reconcile the value of these friendships with the sadness of their fading. I've always believed in the idea of a tight knit inner circle, a a group of friends who know the real me and most importantly, who last. But lately I started to question whether that ideal is. Well, that whether that ideal is realistic or just something movies and nostalgia have taught me to want. What if modern adult friendship is meant to be more fluid and more modular?

[Matt Ritter]

Great question, Juicy. So much to unpack. Can I start by saying there's no right answer to this one because for each person, their own values of what they want in a friendship are going to be different and you're going to want to line those up with other people that feel that way and that changes over time. So by that I mean some people just want to have the same crew, consistent, long term, same friends for their entire lives. Some people are changing and are fluid and want that. And I believe there are seasons for friendship. I fully like agree with that. And I think friends should moving out. We just did, we just saw this study that said you replace your close friends every seven years, half of them, so it's normal. So just know that that's normal. But I do think our desire to have long term friends is paramount. Like, I don't know if you agree or disagree. I think our desire, all of us, is to have the friends that last.

[Aaron Caro]

Well, my interpretation of when you often say there are seasons for friendship is that these are long term friends that you sometimes fall in and out with as opposed to people you just friends with for one year and then you never really talk to them again.

[Matt Ritter]

Both, I might, I would say I'm both. I think usually I say that in reference to people that are going in and out of your life for certain times that you're, hey, I'm too busy at work so can't really spend a lot of time or hey, you moved to Texas. Oh, you moved back. Now we're back on. Right. But I also think there are seasons for friendship of like, hey, you know, your wild and crazy friends were your 20s. If they're still wild and crazy, they're not the guy for you. Now if you're a stable family man, whatever the case may be, that doesn't mean you don't love them or you don't treasure what that friendship was and what it did for you. It just doesn't mean that you have to stay in it actively.

[Aaron Caro]

But I would also let's, you know, let's poke at the premise of the question. These friendships were temporary. Why? You know, we've all, if you had a close work buddy and you worked on a project for six months and then the work project ended, there's no law that says you can't hang out anymore. You know, if there was a personal crisis, says personal crisis, I have no idea what that is. But you know, something happens with a buddy, so they're sick or they have a illness in the family and you get super close and then they don't need you as much anymore. Get it. I get that. But doesn't mean you can't extend the friendship. So I'm, I, I'm, I'm wondering, I'm, I'm musing out loud. Matt, is it possible this person is, you know, treating these friendships more modular than they actually are?

[Matt Ritter]

Hmm. Right. Right. But I, you know, I guess it's a question of, like, is it being kind of presented to them or are they presenting it that way? Right. Because it's like, hey, if people are drifting out of their lives when these things end, then you're right. It's like, well, you can make the choice to keep those friendships going beyond whatever the circumstances are. Right. Like, you move, you can stay close to that person in a different way. It's definitely going to be a different relationship, you know, if you move cities, but, you know, or if you take different interests, like, hey, I'm not doing CrossFit anymore. Are you still friends with those CrossFit people? Some of them. Right. Some of them you're probably not going to be as close with.

[Aaron Caro]

But if, if, if he's describing, he's describing several different friends in several different situations that have all become temporary.

[Matt Ritter]

Yep.

[Aaron Caro]

You know, the, there's one consistent thing here, and that's you.

[Matt Ritter]

Right, Right. No, it's a very valid point for this person to have a little self, you know, awareness check of, like, hey, am I the one who's running the fluidity ship here, the temporary friendship ship here? Or also, are you putting a little bit of a spotlight on those ones? And are we not counting all the ones that don't fill this bucket? Are, you know, are you telling me that there aren't any that are lasting? Because if there aren't any friendships that seem to stick, then yeah, maybe we do have a problem.

[Aaron Caro]

And, and I will say, you know, because we've gotten this question before. He says, is that, is this something from movies or nostalgia? You know, Matt, we got a question a couple episodes ago of, like, well, you and Matt have been friends in second grade, so how, how can I ever have a lifelong friend? Well, you can make a day, one friend, starting today, and then in 40 years, you'll be as friends as long as me and Matt. So just because you don't have the tight inner circle you see in Super Bad today doesn't mean you can't have it tomorrow.

[Matt Ritter]

Yeah. And, and again, like, there is no right way to friend. You need people that, you know, make you feel good, that support you, that you can be yourself around and that, you know, you can celebrate things with that will be there to sit with you when things aren't going great like that, share your values or outlook. But they don't necessarily have to be spending time with you every day or every week. I mean, all that stuff can be toggled based on circumstances of life or your needs. But I do agree with Cairo. Like maybe you're, maybe you're seeing it as more fluid than it needs to be.

[Aaron Caro]

Right. I mean, you know, he says, what if modern adult friendship is meant to be more fluid? By the way, modern adult friendship is more fluid because now everybody moves and your people go to Abu Dhabi for a year. I don't know why I chose that as an example. But people, you know, used to never leave your hometown. So it is more fluid.

[Matt Ritter]

It is.

[Aaron Caro]

You know, like if, if there's someone that you count as a good friend after, like a work project or some sort of shared thing, you both have your kids and mommy and me or parent in me. There's no reason. These friends bring them back. I think you need to circle back to these people.

[Matt Ritter]

Right. I think that's what, that's what they're saying. Right. So I think if you're going to use the dating analogy, I think this person's having a lot of friendship flings and they want to know if that's okay. And I think it is. It's definitely okay. But what we're saying is that you can do that, but you can also make some of those flings a steady long term friend. That's the best thing about friendship. You're not looking for the one. You're looking for a one.

[Aaron Caro]

You know what we call a friendship fling? We call it a one night stand. No, I, I pitched it. I pitched a show called One night stand maybe 20 years ago.

[Matt Ritter]

Yeah.

[Aaron Caro]

About a guy. It's a quantum leap where he goes back, he goes back to each of his one night stands.

[Matt Ritter]

I think I remember.

[Aaron Caro]

Yes.

[Matt Ritter]

Yeah.

[Aaron Caro]

And it made no sense and it, it also didn't sell. But yes, friendship flings. What's, what's interesting is that clearly this guy wants something deeper. So it's kind of interesting that he's having so many flings because usually I think that our, our listeners who want something deeper feel like they haven't found anybody.

[Matt Ritter]

There's a little bit of the, you know, Goldilocks thing too that could be happening. This friend's not right. This friends too. This, this friends do that. I'm looking for a friend who's just right.

[Aaron Caro]

Right. And I, as I Can tell from experience. And I'm sure Matt will say the same. You're never going to find that perfect friend. There's always gonna have. They're always going to be qu. Quite flawed.

[Matt Ritter]

Quite.

[Aaron Caro]

Quite. Quite flawed.

[Matt Ritter]

Quite flawed.

[Aaron Caro]

So I think our. If I would summarize our advice, I would say take a. Take a moment to be introspective and then also take a look at your flings and be like, is this. Why did this die. Die out? And can I revive it?

[Matt Ritter]

Yeah. But in answer to the overall question of, like, is modern friendship more conducive to not having permanent fixtures in your life? Yes and no. I think that's the answer. Yes, it's more fluid. Yes, people are moving around. Yes, you've got people that can come in and out of your life more easily, but no, the standard bearer of what a good friend is, is somebody that I think you want to keep around long term.

[Aaron Caro]

And by the way, at the beginning, he says, I realized many of my friendships were deeply meaningful. Well, also, take a couple wins there, you know, I mean, that's great, right?

[Matt Ritter]

And. But if they're deeply meaningful, you don't just throw them away.

[Aaron Caro]

Right.

[Matt Ritter]

You know, and the other thing about friendship is it requires time to really build trust and vulnerability and the depth of knowing you and knowing the other person. So I think it's hard to say that, hey, modern friendship is supposed to be just, you know, a little bit more disposable with it. Like, I think you can have some of that. And again, like, part of my philosophy is, like, you know, there are levels of friends. We talk about that all the time of, like, not everybody needs to be your bff, but that's a different rung. Right.

[Aaron Caro]

And we also recently did an episode about 24 hour friends. When you meet someone over a weekend and you become, yeah, you know, good friends of that.

[Matt Ritter]

I mean, when we talk about the friendship pyramid, where it's like, you know, you need your core friends as your main, you know, as your. As your sustenance, but you also need those, you know, casual friends.

[Aaron Caro]

The dude pyramid.

[Matt Ritter]

The dude pyramid.

[Aaron Caro]

Right. You need a base.

[Matt Ritter]

The.

[Aaron Caro]

The friendship pyramid. I don't know.

[Matt Ritter]

Yeah, we called it the dude pyramid. Yeah. I don't know why.

[Aaron Caro]

All right, do we answer that?

[Matt Ritter]

I think so.

[Aaron Caro]

All right, thank you so much. That was asking for a friend. If you have a friendship question, send it to us on Instagram, manage your podcast, and we will answer it on the show. All right, Matt, any final thoughts about dry spell? You have two kids now. So are you still feeling your three o' clock lonely spell?

[Matt Ritter]

No, because I'm in the office with Dan. So we're. We're on Larchmont, schmoozing. I don't go home anymore till the work day's done. I'm there all day.

[Aaron Caro]

Wow. Your work. You're a working man again.

[Matt Ritter]

Yeah, I'm a working man. Well, it's really just because it's. It's impossible to not want to spend time with Brenner and it's impossible for him not to, like, see me and know I'm there.

[Aaron Caro]

Yeah.

[Matt Ritter]

So it.

[Aaron Caro]

You're both there every day.

[Matt Ritter]

What's that?

[Aaron Caro]

You're both there every day.

[Matt Ritter]

Not every day. Not both of us every day. But, you know, three, three, three, three day, four day overlap. It's good.

[Aaron Caro]

You guys are basically. You guys are like having an entire, like, friendship in like a, you know, like, supercharged thing. You know what I'm saying?

[Matt Ritter]

Totally. But, you know, you know, my philosophy is you gotta level up. We. We always say, you got to do it quick. Level up quick. If you really want to get close.

[Aaron Caro]

Yeah. I mean, we've never discussed for our lumos level up moments, you know, meet the parents, take a trip together. We never discussed get a small office and work next to each other for a year.

[Matt Ritter]

Get a tiny office.

[Aaron Caro]

Tiny. Both of you at the top of your lungs.

[Matt Ritter]

Yeah. We also have a conference room for when we're both screaming.

[Aaron Caro]

All right, guys, let us know if you've ever been in a friendship dry spell, what you did to get out of it. And if you have any tips to share with the rest of the group. Thank you guys for listening. Always remember, be good to yourself. Begets your friends. Love you, buddy.

[Matt Ritter]

Love you, buddy.

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[Matt Ritter]

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[Matt Ritter]

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[Aaron Caro]

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[Matt Ritter]

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