← Marketing Beyond with Alan B. Hart
Marketing Beyond with Alan B. Hart
30: Building billion-dollar brands with purpose: Insights from Mars Wrigley North America & Global Ice Cream President Anton Vincent
00:37:02
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A
Today on the show, I've got Anton Vincent. He serves as president of Mars, Wrigley North America and Global Ice Cream. Since Joining Mars in 2019, Anton has led the acceleration of value creation for one of the world's largest and most iconic consumer brand portfolios. Prior to joining Mars, he was the CEO of Greencore, the leading Co Packer Copan company. He spent 20 years at General Mills before that building award winning brands and leading three divisions as well as help execute the $10 billion acquisition of Pillsbury Co company on the show today we talk about just the sheer size and breadth of the Mars portfolio that spans pet care, pet services all the way through CPG brands like M&MS. And Snickers. We talk about the talent that needs to power those brands and how he thinks about it as well as the combination of creativity and technology and how those things need to work together. That and much more with Anton Benson. Are you ready to go beyond the basics of marketing? I'm Alan Hart and this is Marketing beyond, where I chat with the world's leading chief marketing officers and business innovators to share ideas that spark change and inspire you to challenge the status quo. Join us as we explore the future of marketing and its endless potential.
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B
Foreign.
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A
Welcome to the show.
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B
Oh, Alan, thanks for having me. I've been really looking forward to having a good chat with you.
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A
Yeah, me too, me too. Now the one thing I, I was prepped a little bit and the one thing I heard is that I should never take you to school on the basketball court.
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B
Well, there's probably some truth in that, Alan. I will say, you know, I was fortunate. You know, I was an athlete most of my young adult life and I had a very, very influential high school coach, legendary high school coach. That really was a big part of my life and I think helped me develop just as a human being, as a man, as an athlete, as a person and you know, taught us some pretty fundamental principles around competitiveness, you know, setting a standard and really putting effort in under pressure. So I think those things have really helped me in my life, my business life, personal life, so on and so forth. So I, I, I, I count back to my athletic days very full fondly and I think I'm still living off the learnings that I think I was able to acquire.
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A
That's awesome. That's awesome. Well, one of the things, you know, people that know me are going to laugh when they hear me say that in particular because I'm also like on a good day, On a good day. Anton, five Six and probably. So you got probably a foot on me. I'm guessing just by the fact that.
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B
You play D1, but just the opposite. So I'm 6 foot 5, so. Okay, I got a few on you.
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A
Yeah, yeah. You, you do, you do. I mean, my, my daughter plays bat, so my wife is almost six foot tall.
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B
Oh, wow.
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A
Okay. My, my daughter ended up in the middle and she plays basketball and she laughs because she can put her hand out and then I can't reach her. You know, like, it's a really funny. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I'm. I'm the only male in my house and, and, and you know, so, so it is what it is. Yeah.
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B
So you have high self esteem. I know.
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A
Yeah.
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B
So that doesn't, that doesn't.
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A
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, I mean, I get to walk around with these two tall women all the time, so it's, it's great.
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B
It's great for me.
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A
Great for my ego. But. No, well, I, you know, sports can teach us so much, you know, and, and I, it sounds like this was a pretty impactful part of your mindset, how you approach life.
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B
It's.
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A
Is that true? I mean, is that.
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B
Yeah, it's very true. Because, you know, like I said, in the younger part of my life, it was sort of dominated my, my, my life, my time, my energy, my mindset. And I'm always amazed at student athletes now because it, it is, it's tough. You need to be a student first. I still believe in that. You're an athlete second. But you know, you're representing a university, you're representing a community, a school. And it's, it's, it's a tremendous amount of pressure, but it, it was probably the most rewarding times, I think, in, in my life from that perspective. Just a tremendous amount of development. And like I said earlier, I just think it helped provide me with some foundational principles and mindset that I think have propelled me professionally. And I think those things that I still sort of, sort of really lean on till to this day.
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A
Well, you are now the president at Mars Wrigley North America and over Global ice cream. Where did you get your start? What were some of the chapters along the way?
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B
Yeah, no, it was really interesting. You know, when I was in undergrad, I was a finance major. Undergrad. And for the longest time I wanted to be, you know, on Wall street, like do the stock broker, stockbroker thing. Old language now. But, you know, I didn't go to one of those schools where those kind of people came to Recruit. But that was sort of always my, my intent. I was fortunate. My first real job out of out of college, I started work for Fidelity Investments, who happened to have a big regional investing center in, in North Dallas and was really able to reach my dream. There was only one downside, Alan. I, I, I came out of my training. My first day on the floor, as we call it, was October 17, 1987. If you know your financial history, that was still the largest percentage market crash in US history. So yeah, and so it was one of those things. It was like the absolute fabulous job at the absolute wrong time. And so I was there. Yeah, we, you know, I made it through the end of the year And I think two months later, probably February, it was probably 300 of us that came in. They usually hire a lot of finance types in what we call tax season investment, which is really last three or four months of the year and probably 90% of us got called into a room and it was, it was over. So, and it wasn't as devastating as it may sound, but it was one of those things like, wow, I was right there, I was literally right there that I did my dream job. But it's funny, I look back on that very fondly because I actually learned them out a lot in a short period of time. But also it actually set me up for the rest of my career. I went from there to go to MCI Telecommunications, which for those of you who would sort of know a history about the telecommunications industry, was essentially the person that opened up what we call open competition and telecommunications industry in the United States. And so I was able to sort of be my words, sort of the Google of his time in this case, sort of fighting at and T and sort of, you know, sort of set the modern day telecommunications industry up as well. And then from there, you know, went to grad school, interned at Kraft Foods. It was a fantastic summer. And that really sort of locked me in in terms of wanting to be in the brand management CPG space and came out, worked for General Mills, had a great 23 year career there. I ended up running three of their big divisions. Left at the end of 17, did some private equity work and have been at Mars since 2019 and it's been quite the whirlwind, to be honest with you. I came to Mars in 2019 and one of the things I think we're really good at, particularly for senior leaders, is really helping us to understand the culture and to really try to onboard in a very proper and a very intentional way and So I think I took that time and six months later, Covid hit.
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A
Oh man, you have impeccable timing. What is up with this?
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B
It's either great or horrible. You know, one of those things. But it was interesting because, you know, in times of stress, you know, you do one of two things, you know, you unite, you get through it, or you break apart. And I must say, the culture at Mars, we really united. I think our first thing was making sure that our associates were treated right. We helped them to get through it all associates all around the world. And it was a tremendous understanding of how our principles kick in from an internal perspective and being able A, to take care of our associates, B, to successfully navigate and thrive through Covid and really set ourselves up. So sort of a big post Covid world as well, which has really been interesting. So it's, it's been six years in May, which is interesting for me to say because it sort of went by very fast. But we've been able to be tremendously successful, to really sort of lock in what we're about at Mars and still advance our economic model globally and continue to grow and develop and be very purpose driven because we think we can do both of those things so we can grow our business, we can drive purpose, and we don't think those things are in conflict with one another. And so I think we're very, very focused on making sure that general concept is executed at scale. You know, I think that's what makes us different.
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A
No, that makes sense. And most people will know Mars and Mars Wrigley the name, but it wasn't until I was looking at your portfolio, I mean, the scope of the brand portfolio is very large. Could you give us just a sense of like some of the things that other people, you know, the household names, everyone would know.
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B
Yeah, so let me, let me go back a little bit. You know, Mars is a company that's over a hundred years old. It's probably one of the true great American entrepreneurial stories that you would sort of study in terms of Clarence Mars way back in the day. People know us from our primary business, which is confections, which is a beautiful business, been around for a very, very long time. We've been able to grow that business over time, been able to add brands, buy brands, so on and so forth. We actually been in a pet food business since the 40s or 50s. And so we've always been a business that's sort of built on multiple pillars and we've been able to answer those pillars over time. So Today we are the largest confectionary company in the world, with the largest pet care company in the world, which includes a whole pet care universe from nutrition to services to vet services to diagnostics, you name it. Of course, we have a version of what we call food and nutrition business as well. And so those are sort of three pillars that we stand on. And we're north of $55 billion today. And we do business in most legitimate countries around the world as well. And so it's quite a significant economic engine. But a little bit like I said earlier, yes, we're a business. We have to make money in earnings and those types of things. But I think we do it with a very, very intentional purpose that runs right alongside that economic model. And sometimes that's not easy to do. Al you know, those really be hard to sort of achieve those two concepts. But as leadership, as management with the family, that's what we're uniquely charged to do, is to be able to advance both of those things with some level of integration. And so we don't want to do things economically don't make sense, want to grow our business, but also we don't want to do things going to harm the earth or do things to our communities that don't make sense as well. So we're always trying to uplift on both sides. The economic side, the purpose side, the community side.
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A
No, that makes sense. That makes sense. And I didn't realize the breadth that you talked about. The pet care side as well as the confectionery and the food side. Some of the storied brands that everyone knows in my, in my world, in my household, to be honest, is M&M's Snickers. One that I was looking down the, down the trail of brand names was Hubba Bubba. That was my go to bubble gum back in the day. Like, yeah, that, that sustained me in middle school and elementary school.
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B
For some of us, it still sustains. Yeah.
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A
Well, I do. I don't know if you call it like I aged into more the orbit and the extra side of the game. But. But yes. Yeah, Hubba Bubba is. There's still some. When I see it in the store, I think about buying a pack and then I think about what my wife's going to say when I'm like chomping on the, on the big. The big hub of.
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B
Yeah. Anyway, it is interesting because, you know, I think one of the things that, that sets us apart and you know, while we are a big mars sort of family of brands, but you know, we Just have just iconic brands. I mean you talk about the chocolate party side which is the M&M's, the Snickers, the Dove, the Twix, so on and so forth. And of course the gum portfolios. You know, we would have acquired that back in 0809. We bought the Wrigley company which is a fantastic set of market leading, global leading gum brands that has really helped us add to our confectionary portfolio as well. Now as we get into pet in terms of nutrition and pedigree and get into the vet health services and things of that nature, so we have an interesting construct in terms of having a big CPG business, confection side on a pet nutrition by side. And then we have a very significant service based business, essentially an animal healthcare system on the pet care side as well. And so very large businesses, very scale business but, but very different businesses as well. And so we get, we get a bit of a portfolio effect with those different verticals as well. So you can imagine a person coming into Mars just, I mean literally the world is at their feet. You know, you can be marketing to pet parents one day and you'll be, you know, marketing to, you know, a range of consumers on, on the chocolate side and the confection side. But also we have a center of the plate food business that is very unique, very high quality, very premium and you know, has some, some very, very distinctive brands on that side as well.
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A
You think about the scope, we're talking about just the brand portfolio and the services and the products. How do you think about like as a company scale versus independence of those businesses or brands?
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B
Yeah, I get this one a lot Ellen, because you know, the question I usually get is what is your favorite? Of course we love all of our children, right?
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A
Yes.
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B
And by loving all your children, you need to invest in your children, you know, from that perspective. So I think as, as resource allocators really at our level, you know, it's important for us to understand that those brands have their own individual consumer groups, their own individual communities as well. And so we have to stay true what I call vertically to that brand universe that we've built over time. At the same time these things sit on platforms as well. They usually compete in the context of categories and have a very, very rich competitive set as well. And I think the one thing that really sort of runs through all of our brands is that you know, we, we have an understanding around how do we want to present those brands to the world. Even those, those things are different from a product And a service portfolio. We also have a marketing code that suggests that we won't do certain things right. And so there again, you see purpose showing up even in how we articulate and communicate and present our brands and services to the consuming public as well. So there's a thread that runs through that. But I say at the end of the day, you know, we are brand marketers, we invest in those brands. We want to get more people into our franchise, we want to grow that globally as well. And then again, that all sits on top of a very foundational purpose in terms of how we do that. Because again, we want to do it very intentionally, very purpose driven. And we still think we can get good economics and doing it in that way. And we certainly have proven that over the last 100 plus years.
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A
And you know, you talk about the brand management philosophy and the brand managers that are running these brands and businesses. How do you think about you're building brands, but how do you think about building the people and the thoughts that you have in terms of like, what does talent for you look like as you go forward from here?
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B
No, it's a really, really good question and it's interesting. I don't, I don't think the precepts have changed over time. You know, one of the things we want to do is we want to go in and, and really recruit great people, great human beings. And we want great human beings that have great capabilities. And so we put those two things together, we can now expose them to some of the biggest, most iconic brands in the world. Right. And so it's almost a perfect setup. You bring great talent in, you put that talent to work against great iconic brands. And then I would sort of say the thing that supports that is that we have to train and develop them. Some of that is pure training and development. Some of that is making sure that they have access to very, very differentiated experiences as well. One of the things that we're getting better at, I think we'll see that more in the future is while we do have these three big verticals, the real value is how do you sort of move people across those verticals. How do I sort of say, hey look, you got pedigree. You know, one of the biggest brands in the world we have today that is all about pet parents and animal nutrition. And how do we switch that person over to maybe to an M&M's? Very, very different consumer set, very different brand objective, but still a big iconic brand. And now we got the whole extension of services which is again, is Running essentially an animal healthcare system we call the ecosystem that just allows great talent to give very, very differentiated experience potentially on a global basis. So as a person that's coming to an organization, there is tremendous opportunity in that for growth and, and development, capability building right here in Mars. You don't have to leave to go and get something in some cases significantly different from a professional experience.
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A
As you think about taking these brands to market, the ecosystem of marketing has been evolving, right? And it continues to evolve. You got creators and new media formats, other things in terms of new partners potentially to work with. How do you think about that evolving marketing ecosystem as it applies to growing your business?
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B
Yeah, it was, it's a really good question. I think one of the things, and we always talk about this, we are truly in an attention economy and you don't need to have structure and resources to go and get attention. You know, if you know how to build a social media presence, you can do that in, in your pajamas every morning. So it is interesting in terms of how people can interact with, how do we build messages, how do we distribute messages, and therefore how do we influence what we need to influence, whether that's a message, whether it's a selling message, whether it's commerce, what have you. So I think it's the first thing just in terms of the message generation and when we think about influence and attention, how is that generated? That's number one. Number two, just the digital revolution and how that is made much more efficient and how we hopefully can get better measurement off of that. Because you've been in this game for a long time, you know that, okay, look, I can probably measure some things, but I really can't measure the entire impact. And so I think our ability to measure, to put analytics against it, to build algorithms that give us a little bit more understanding with precision around how our messages are landing. While that has been building, I think we're getting to a world now where that precision is going to be more precise than we've ever had. And the question is, what do you do with it? What I always sort of say is in a perfect world, if you could build the perfect message and you can actually measure it, the difference maker is creativity. So the whole idea around creativity cannot leave you because I think it's going to be a difference maker. I can have perfect targeting, I can have a perfect audience, I can have a perfect message. But if I can't build a message that is compelling and differentiating and draws consumers or customers into me, I'm dead in the Water. So I still think the foundation of consumer marketing, you know, is still around how do you help creativity drive a message against an audience? I don't think those foundations are going to leave us.
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A
Yeah, no, that makes perfect sense. One of the things I talk to clients about in particular is everyone's got their marketing model, they're optimizing their resource allocation and things like that. And I always say that's great, you need that, you have to have that, you need that to guide the ship, if you will. But to your point around creativity, the thing that breaks it the most is when you dramatically change a lever. Right. And creativity has the power to do that as well as thinking about new, new ways to market.
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B
Absolutely.
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A
That are not in the model. Right.
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B
And yeah, I think the wonderful thing about, about this space is, you know, it is constantly changing and we have a consumer base that is constantly changing in terms of what they want, their needs, their aspirations, how we message to them, how they accept those messages or not, how they co create with us. I just think that whole world continues to change. And so I just think the idea around agility as a marketer, as a marketing leader is just something you just can' lose against you. That's something you have to stay resident with, be comfortable in, hopefully excited by. Because there's one thing, you know about consumers is they will change.
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A
Yes, yes.
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B
One concept about consumers, they will change. And if you don't have an a marketing ecosystem that can acknowledge it and leverage it, you're going to be behind, you won't be able to grow your brands.
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A
Yeah, makes sense. And for a company like Mars, I mean, you guys, literally every person almost in the world is a potential customer or a customer of yours. Yeah. You've got to really adapt to the changing dynamics.
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B
No, we really do, because, you know, particularly, you know, it literally goes back to the construction of our business. Like I said, we got a big great consumer business on the CPG side. But also once you start talking about pet parents and things, you start to expose yourself to a very differentiated, highly locked in consumer base. So the attention, the attention is high. The messages have to be very, very crisp. And again, you're dealing with someone who is going to accept what you're feeding them or not accept what you're feeding, if they're going to accept the service or not. So we get very sophisticated on our pet side in terms of how we message to primarily what we call the pet parent and how do we build that ecosystem around their entire animal ownership experience.
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A
Yeah, yeah, well, I'VE got two. I call them two knucklehead mutts in my house as well. So. But. And, and they, they are treated like babies, so.
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B
Yes, they are.
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A
They are part of the family.
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B
They really are.
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A
I wouldn't say I love them more than my daughter, but they're. They're definitely on equal footing, you know.
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B
From day to day. Yes. We call ours the most spoiled animal in the world. Right.
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A
So, yes, because that sounds right.
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B
Kind of man.
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A
Awesome. Yeah. Well, what is there, Is there any recent work that you're really excited about, something you, you know, the company's put out in the market that just kind of lit you up, if you will.
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B
I'm generally excited about all the work that we're doing, but I'll. I'll try to pick something from each side on my side, on the confectionary side, you know, we just have some wonderful brands. A lot of work that we're doing on the Skittles brand. I think it's just incredible. Skittles as a global platform reached a billion dollars last year. We continue to break records on these iconic brands. It's a very irreverent brand, so we give it a lot of latitude from a marketing strategy perspective, but consumers accept that and then they expect it. So I think the creative expectation around what's next is always sort of palpable. I think from that front as well. I look at a brand like Snickers, you know, Snickers growing in double digits. And this whole idea around satiation on a campaign idea we were running for a while, but we found new ways to make it relevant as well. And of course, we have the connection with the NFL. We've been big sponsors of the NFL. And so I think that brand is just expertly positioned. And I think we're inserting it inside of people's lives in very natural, inorganic ways. And in some cases, we're using sports as a leverage mechanism to make sure we open ourselves up to younger audiences as well. So that's why I think of those two things. But I'll think of something like your favorite brand, Hubba Bubba. You know, Hubba Bubba is one of our smaller gum brands, but trust me, when we, when we hit Hubba Bubba, it has massive impact in terms of how we do it. That's typically a socially driven brand for us these days. But we do a great job in targeting. We do a great job in making sure, again, is contextual to people's experiences. And so those are examples of big brands and small brands that are doing things in ways that are relevant, that are impactful, that are inspiring, and that are driving business growth.
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A
I love it. I love those examples. Well, one of the things we like to do, Anton, on the show is get to know you even a little bit better. And my. My favorite question to ask everyone that comes on is, has there been an experience of your past that defines or makes up who you are today?
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B
Wow. Boy, there have been so many. Mostly because, you know, like any of us, by the time you get to this point in your career, you made a fair amount of mistakes. So I have no problems in admitting those. But, no, I think there's several. I think that one I think of. I'll just keep it in the brand world. I used to be the marketing director on Pop Secret Popcorn. And this is back when General Mills owned them as well. And we had come across what we call the holy grail. And that holy grail meant that I could actually create popcorn with a caramel corn with caramel on the outing. Now, if you know anything about science and caramel and heat, you know that they don't really belong together. And so when you put something in a microwave that gets up to 420 degrees and you know in 20 seconds, that's combustion, the potential for combustion. So we found a way to help that scientific process crystallize such that it was safe. So you could put it into a microwave popcorn, you could cook, pop it, and you come out and you have a very nice sheen of caramel around. Very, very, very hard to do. From a technology and a science perspective. We figured it out. So, long story short, we had to execute a Class 1 recall to pull out a marketplace. It was insanely successful. We just got a big order in the Walmart, they were about to re up. And like most reputable food companies, we sell things from a quality perspective that we didn't like. It didn't quite hit. You're in trouble. We just say we have zero tolerance. We don't want to let it get to a low we can remotely hurt us. And so we made a decision to go in and recall the product. It was only the second class one recall in the history of General Mills at that time. I don't think they've had one since. So I might have been the last one to had a recall. But, you know, what was interesting to me was, you can imagine that was expensive, but I think that was my first real adult experience where, boy, a company said, we have this incredible product that we know we can see years of growth down the line. But we're not going to compromise our quality or consumer safety, so we're going to make the hard decision to remove it. And so I think for me, as a young leader at the time, it just really taught me a lesson around the responsibility, particularly that large companies who impact millions of consumers have to the consuming public. It just imprinted me from a safety and quality perspective in terms of how to think about these businesses and just the impact that we have with people both in there enjoying the product, but also in keeping them safe. It was one of those things where a big company did the right thing and we were right at the epicenter of it as well. So not that I didn't have an orientation towards it. I just saw it in action in a very, very powerful way because we could make a case to keep it on the, on the market. We could make the case that the experience rating around safety was okay. Right. Math would have told you that. But, you know, you don't want to be in a position where you're going to remotely hurt a consumer. And so seeing a company step up and make the right decision, a costly decision, I think was just imprinting on me as a young leader.
- [25:17]
A
Yeah, no, I really like that example of making the right decision, even if it's the hardest. The hard path. Right. Yes, that's, that's, that's, that's when you, you really have to have the fortitude behind making the right call. No, you do.
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B
No. And honestly, I thought I was gonna get fired. Just like, you know, this could be my last go round and, you know, I didn't have a word without or understand, like there's bigger things at play here. But, but, you know, you know, made it. Made a tough, expensive, but right decision for consumers. And so your people, you can stand up and, and feel good about that over time. Yeah, absolutely.
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A
Well, what advice would you give young Anton if you're starting this journey all over again?
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B
Oh, I would give you. I get ton so much advice. No, it's interesting because I laugh, and I'm sure most people laugh at their younger selves and they sort of have, have some perspective now. But I think there's a couple things, you know, and I think I don't, I don't think I was unique in this, but, you know, you come into a CPG system, especially a large company, all about getting to the next level as fast as possible. And I think, I think during my time, I just think I was. I think I overindulged that too much. I had Great experiences. I had a lot of very differentiated experiences in a very short period of time, which is the value of going to a big brand company. I can experience different targets, different categories, different business models with a fair amount of intensity in a short period of time. So you learn a lot. Your learning agility is very high and as a result of that, I, I want to be rewarded and get to the next place as fast as possible.
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A
Right.
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B
My, my, my advice to myself is just slow down. Like enjoy the experiences that you're getting because they're so valuable. They're so valuable. I mean even today when I run a big enterprise, I, I lean back onto some of those early experiences, some of those early learnings, being able to be in the trenches and understand sometimes at a very tactical level how things get done because that actually helps to build your enterprise thinking because you can reduce strategy to action and being able to appreciate that, particularly once you get into broader enterprise types roles, it's just a beautiful thing. So I think my first thing would just be to slow down, enjoy the journey, which I've, which I've tried to do. I will sort of say over the arc of my, of my profession, I'd say the second thing, and I've been very public about this, is I don't think I had a very good relationship with feedback during my younger leadership days. I was, I was a bit too focused on being right versus wrong versus understanding the developmental part that would make me better over time. And I think once I started to appreciate the value of what really good, well intentioned feedback means to me in my development and once I got off my ego a little bit on that, I just started to flourish. I stopped being resistant to things, I stopped being resistant to certain people. I started to listen to feedback for feedback's sake and for development and try to find the value in it. And then I try to incorporate the things I thought were valuable, if you would, from that perspective. And I think once I changed my mindset, I just think my, my perspective changed clearly. But I believe my ability to lead escalated. Right. And I wish I'd have had some of that earlier in my career. That's great. It's great advice.
- [28:26]
A
Is there anything you think marketers need to be learning more about right now or anything you're trying to learn more about personally?
- [28:35]
B
Yeah, you know, I mean, it goes without saying, obviously technology is a part of our life. Kenley has always been a part of a marketer's life. I just think with the, with the recent advances, it's Called the recent with AI and AI as a concept, as you know, is not a new thing. Our ability to really interact with it and for it to be highly usable for us is fairly new color last four or five years. So this whole idea around, you know, how do you connect creativity in a rapidly growing technology environment? Right. I think that is the issue and opportunity of our day because at the end of the day we need to have precision. Technology allows us to do that. We need to map that with creativity and inspiration. Right. I still don't think technology in its best form is going to allow you to reach into someone's heart and tug at it like really good creative folks can do. So I just think that whole exercise of technology, intellect, of creativity and inspiration, how do you manage those levers in a way that gives you something differential in the marketplace? I think markets have to really, really, really get comfortable with that. That's number one. Number two, I just think the agility around changing techniques, marketplaces, you know, social commerce, you name it. I just think our routes to market, our ability to land messages, our ability to co create messages, our ability to have influences, help us with our brands even though they're not, they didn't build the DNA of the brands, but we got to incorporate those audiences that influence office as well. So just the whole idea around agility for marketers is going to continue to just be something that we have to practice over and over and over again and get more efficient at it. I always say the world is changing, but the world is also changing at an increasingly rapid rate. So the speed of change is continuous. And so if you can't be agile in the context of a high speed of change world, you're going to be left out. And so it's just really, really important around that agility and the speed of your agility.
- [30:29]
A
Yeah, yeah, no, I a hundred percent double down on the agility comment and I like the other pieces too. But to your point, the world is continuing to move faster, not slower. And yeah, you know, your ability to learn as well and the capacity of learning I think has to go hand in hand with the agility piece.
- [30:48]
B
I agree. I think, you know, one of the things I always say, I was like, there is no steady state, right? No, we don't go from one thing, go there for a while, go to another thing. It's just only constant change. And then that is, that is a hard mindset that I think all leaders, not just market, all leaders have to figure out. And so in a world of, in a world of constant change. What does leadership look like? What does agility look like? And then how do you, how do you set it in your environment? And then how do you develop it, particularly in your marketers as well? Because they, they're typically the first ones to touch it, feel it, see it.
- [31:18]
A
Right.
- [31:18]
B
Yeah.
- [31:19]
A
Well, I got two more questions for you. Are there any trends or subcultures that you follow or you think other people should take notice of?
- [31:27]
B
No. You know, I'm, I'm a big. I always like to say I'm a big observer up top of politics. I'm not a participant other than doing my civic duty and voting, you know, for voting, my interest. But I. People always ask me, anton, what's the typical day? I give them the typical answer. There is no typical day. But the one thing I'm spending more and more time on is how do geopolitics impact how I think about how to insert brands into a consuming marketplace? Because we always thought of those things as very separate. There is no separation of anything these days. Everything is connected. Your brand, particularly big iconic ones that can get messages out there, have a point of view, and how do they assert that point of view in a world with very complex views? Very complex views. I can name two or three things that happened in the last week that is very much representative of that. So that, that's, that's just a, that's, that's a new world that we're in. But I think that's information that is activity that while we think is tangential to the brand exercise, it has impact because it is, it is a part of the attention economy. And how do we start coexisting this? So, so how do we think about those things in the context of trying to build a DNA for a brand to have consistency around that brand, to advance the brand, to grow it, to make it relevant, so on and so forth. I think it's one thing. The second thing I think is what we touched on earlier. I just think it's the connection of man and machine. And how do we do that in a way that's thoughtful, that's deliberate, that's safe, where we're leveraging the best of technology and the best of humanity. What does that look like? And that's a big question for all of us to consider as well. But it's only going to get. We only moving more in that direction, not less than that direction. And I think the thing that I see is I still think the basics around understanding who your true consumer is. How do you build Insight, how do you build strategy? How do you get to them in very creative way that is contextual in the way that they live? And how do you build loyalty, repeat usage around a consumer? So the foundations and the goals and objectives don't, don't change the how and in some cases the algorithms you use to build that do. Right. And so I think it's that whole man humanity versus or working with technology is something that's going to be with us for a very long time.
- [33:43]
A
Well, last question for you. What do you see as the largest opportunity or threat to marketers today?
- [33:49]
B
I think marketers are going to always be valuable, but I do think that if you're not constantly learning and you're not constantly improving, you can lose it, you know, because it goes back to what we said. The world is moving faster, not slower. And so I think your pace of learning, your pace of observation, your pace of having like really locked into the zeitgeist and still having a point of view with all your brands is going to be critical. There is not a piece of information I can't integrate today that doesn't allow me to have a better understanding of how my brand can grow. Not a piece from any discipline, from any industry, from any country. So that whole idea around just, we live in a highly integrated world. And as a marketer, as a marketer who's marketing to the masses, you got to be able to integrate that information in a way that's going to be able to help your brand. So I just think our, our level of consciousness around what's out there have to stay very high. At the same time, we got to build a brand or portfolio of brands that are true to who they are, that we understand who we're talking to, and that authenticity can transcend what's happening in society. That's really, really important. And brand building, that's really, really important. Because even in the midst of all that, someone wants to know who you are. Am I down with you? And you know, will you deliver what I think you should deliver over time? Because that's how we build audiences, that's how we build consumers. That's how we build loyalty over time as well. So even in the midst of the chaos and all the stuff we talked about, someone wants to lock in to who you are and who your brand is all about. And I think we got to make sure we understand how to stay true to that in the context of everything that's going on.
- [35:27]
A
That's awesome. Well, Anton, thank you for coming on the show. It's been enlightening just to hear about your stories, what you've learned along the way, and what you guys are trying to do over at Mars. So thank you.
- [35:39]
B
No, thank you. It's been a great conversation and really looking forward to it. Foreign.
- [35:47]
A
Hi, it's Alan again. Marketing beyond is a Deloitte Digital Podcast. It's created and hosted by me, Alan Hart, and produced by Sam Robertson. We have even more cutting edge marketing insights headed your way. Be sure to subscribe to our channel to stay up to date with our latest episodes. I love hearing from listeners. Share your thoughts about the episode, the topic covered, or the show by commenting on this video or emailing me@marketingbeyondeloitte.com if you're interested in more conversations with industry visionaries, we invite you to explore other Deloitte Digital podcasts@deloitte digital.com US podcast. There you'll find the Marketing beyond webpage with complete show notes and links to what we discussed in the episode today. Hello, I'm Alan Hart and this is Marketing Beyond. The views, thoughts and opinions expressed are the speaker's own and do not represent the views, thoughts and opinions of Deloitte. The material and information presented here is for general information purposes only and does not imply endorsement or opposition to any specific company, product or service.