How insecurity can worsen inequality

Summary

Marketplace Morning Report: How Insecurity Can Worsen Inequality

Release Date: February 17, 2025
Host: David Brancaccio
Published by: Marketplace

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Introduction

In the February 17, 2025 episode of Marketplace Morning Report, host David Brancaccio delves into a pressing societal issue: the interplay between insecurity and inequality. Featuring insights from Alyssa Quart, Executive Director at the Economic Hardship Reporting Project, the episode explores how pervasive uncertainty in various facets of American life is not merely a byproduct of economic fluctuations but a catalyst that exacerbates existing inequalities.

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The Landscape of Uncertainty in America

Nova Safo opens the discussion by highlighting the current climate of uncertainty affecting Americans across the ideological spectrum. Factors contributing to this sentiment include the rising cost of living, administrative policy shifts, and the impact of natural disasters. According to a recent University of Michigan survey mentioned by Safo, consumer sentiment has dipped significantly, underscoring a national unease that transcends partisan lines.

Notable Quote:
"A key theme in American life right now is uncertainty. Whether that has to do with the rising cost of living, the flurry of actions by the Trump administration, or even costly natural disasters. All of this adds up to uncertainty, and it has Americans on edge."
— Nova Safo [00:31]

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Insecurity as a Driver of Inequality

David Brancaccio engages Alyssa Quart in a discussion about how insecurity contributes to widening economic disparities. Quart emphasizes that insecurity doesn't only impact the traditionally disadvantaged but is also permeating the middle class. This dual impact threatens to blur the lines between different socioeconomic groups, leading to a more fragmented society.

Key Points:

• Broader Impact of Insecurity: Quart points out that insecurity affects not just the "haves" and "have-nots" but extends to middle-class individuals who struggle to keep up with inflation and rising prices due to tariffs.

• Middle-Class Precarity: Building on her previous work, including her book Squeezed, Quart introduces the concept of the "middle precariat." This term describes middle-class individuals experiencing job instability and economic uncertainty, similar to the lower-income proletariat.

Notable Quote:
"It's not just a gap between haves and have nots, but it's those who can't absorb the blows of things like the LA fires or the mudslides in Kentucky and so on and so forth. And middle class people who can't keep up with inflation."
— Alyssa Quart [02:37]

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Insecurity as an Indicator of Societal Well-being

Brancaccio and Quart discuss the role of insecurity as a reverse indicator of societal well-being. Higher levels of insecurity signal underlying issues within the economy and social structures that can lead to deeper inequalities if left unaddressed.

Key Points:

• Economic Policy Uncertainty Index: Quart references this index to illustrate how spikes in uncertainty can lead to economic disorder, drawing parallels to events like Brexit.

• Solidarity Through Insecurity: Quart suggests that shared experiences of insecurity across different classes could foster solidarity, potentially serving as a foundation for addressing broader societal issues.

Notable Quote:
"Insecurity has become an indicator that scholars now assess societal well being."
— Alyssa Quart [03:18]

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The Consequences of Precarity

Quart elaborates on how abrupt precarity, such as that experienced during the COVID-19 pandemic, has long-lasting effects on individuals across the economic spectrum. While policies like the American Rescue Plan temporarily alleviated some hardships, the underlying insecurity persists, leading to sustained economic instability.

Notable Quote:
"We had the American rescue plan, expanded child tax credit that reduced child poverty tremendously. Then you also had this growing middle class precarity."
— Alyssa Quart [03:49]

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Potential Paths Forward

Drawing inspiration from Astra Taylor's Age of Insecurity, Quart envisions a future where recognizing shared insecurity can lead to collective action and societal reform. By understanding insecurity as a common experience, there is potential to bridge gaps between different socioeconomic groups and address inequality more effectively.

Notable Quote:
"We could start thinking of ourselves in those terms [insecurity], which is something that was mentioned by Astra Taylor in a great book called Age of Insecurity."
— Alyssa Quart [03:59]

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Supporting Data and Market Insights

Beyond the main discussion, the episode provides a snapshot of the current economic landscape:

• Stock Market Performance: Major indexes are up between 3% and 5% for the year, despite Wall Street's closure for President's Day.
• Treasury Yields: The 10-year treasury yield remains around 4.5%, impacting consumer interest rates and the real estate market, where mortgage rates are between 6% and 7%.

Notable Quote:
"The benchmark 10 year treasury yield, which helps set consumer interest rates, is back to where it was at the beginning of the year, hovering around 4.5%."
— Nova Safo [04:49]

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Conclusion

The episode "How Insecurity Can Worsen Inequality" offers a comprehensive examination of how uncertainty serves as a fundamental driver of economic disparity in contemporary America. By highlighting the experiences of both lower and middle-class individuals, Alyssa Quart underscores the pervasive nature of insecurity and its potential to deepen societal divides. The conversation calls for a nuanced understanding of precarity and encourages collective efforts to mitigate its impact, fostering a more equitable society.

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Additional Segments: While the primary focus was on insecurity and inequality, the episode also touched on other relevant topics, including deep-sea mining for critical minerals and advancements in battery technology, reflecting the interconnectedness of economic policies, environmental concerns, and technological progress.

Transcript

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[Nova Safo]

How insecurity can Worsen Inequality For Marketplace, I'm Novosafo and for D. David Brancaccio A key theme in American life right now is uncertainty. Whether that has to do with the rising cost of living, the flurry of actions by the Trump administration, or even costly natural disasters. All of this adds up to uncertainty, and it has Americans on edge. In fact, the latest University of Michigan survey of consumers finds sentiment down significantly across ideological lines. And Alyssa Quart, executive director at the nonprofit Economic Hardship Reporting Project, says pervasive uncertainty can pave the way for deeper inequality. She has a new piece in Time magazine titled How Insecurity Became the New Inequality. She spoke with David Brancaccio.

[David Brancaccio]

People in, for instance, North Carolina or California out searching for rentals because their house was destroyed in a in a disaster, they don't feel less secure. They are in terrible ways, actually less secure. When policies change with this new presidential administration, some may feel more secure, others less. But you, Alyssa, you think insecurity like this leads to inequality, widening the gap between rich and poor.

[Alyssa Quart]

It's not just a gap between haves and have nots, but it's those who can't absorb the blows of things like the LA fires or the mudslides in Kentucky and so on and so forth. And middle class people who can't keep up with inflation. Inflation or the tariffs that will rise our prices. So this is insecurity as much as it is an inequality. And they're inextricably linked.

[David Brancaccio]

No, I mean, I think there's a lot of logic in this. Insecurity can be seen as like a reverse indicator for well being. Right. You can track insecurity and when it goes up, it's not something that you want or that society wants.

[Alyssa Quart]

Right. Insecurity has become an indicator that scholars now assess societal well being. There's the Economic Policy Uncertainty Index. They talk about uncertainty shocks that create economic disorder. So the example they used was Brexit. So this preceded our current period when.

[David Brancaccio]

The lowest income people feel insecurity is a terrible thing. But part of the point that you're trying to make is that this, I mean, I don't never like the word precarity, but this insecurity is being felt not just among the lowest income people.

[Alyssa Quart]

Yeah, it was an abrupt precarity in relation to the pandemic for a lot of the poor Americans. Remember, we had the American rescue plan, expanded child tax credit that reduced child poverty tremendously. Then you also had this growing middle class precarity, which I actually have been writing about since 2018. You know, I wrote a book called Squeezed, where I called it the middle precariat. That's middle class plus precarious plus proletariat. So I see this as kind of a form potentially of solidarity between people who are upper middle class, middle class and lower income, this insecurity. And it's something that was mentioned by Astra Taylor in a great book called Age of Insecurity, where she saw that not just as a bane, but a potential way forward if we could start thinking of ourselves in those terms.

[David Brancaccio]

Alyssa Quart, executive director at the Economic Hardship Reporting Project. She has a piece in Time magazine entitled How Insecurity Became the New Inequality. Alyssa, thank you.

[Alyssa Quart]

Oh, thank you, David.

[Nova Safo]

And that was David Brancaccio with that interview. Numbers. Wall street is closed in observance of President's Day. So far this year, though, stocks in positive territory with the major indexes up somewhere between 3 and 5%. A different story for the benchmark 10 year treasury yield, which helps set consumer interest rates. It's back to where it was at the beginning of the year, hovering around 4.5%. This has been especially consequential for the real estate market where mortgage rates are averaging between 6 and 7% foreign.

[VantageScore Representative]

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[Kai Rysdal]

I'm Kai Rysdal, the host of How We Survive. This season is all about the institution that shaped me, the US Military, and how it could shape the future of climate tech. You've probably heard that 2024 was the hottest year on record, that wildfires devastated Los Angeles and that the US Withdrew from the Paris Agreement. And again. And while all that might feel pretty terrible, the climate crisis is not an inevitable reality. From simulated climate emergencies to micro grids and sustainable aviation fuel, we look at how the military is investing part of its $850 billion budget in a greener, more resilient future. Listen to how we survive. Wherever you get your podcasts.

[Alyssa Quart]

This is.

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[Nova Safo]

The last two presidents made it a priority to secure a sufficient supply of critical minerals which come from the ground you walk on. But the Trump administration is considering a different source the ocean floor. Deep sea mining remains controversial and has yet to be approved in either federal waters or international ones. But as Marketplace's Daniel Ackerman reports, the mining industry sees opportunity as President Joe.

[Daniel Ackerman]

Biden pushed the US to get its minerals from places other than China. But when it came to the bottom of the ocean, the Biden administration was.

[Nova Safo]

Officially on the fence, but really not wanting to do anything with deep sea mining.

[Daniel Ackerman]

Oliver Gunasekira is CEO of Impossible Metals, which hopes to harvest potato shaped hunks of metal from the Pacific. And he says the Trump administration views the Department of Interior as like a.

[Nova Safo]

Balance sheet and an opportunity to extract.

[Kai Rysdal]

Oil and gas and critical minerals.

[Nova Safo]

And they've been talking very much about the seabed.

[Daniel Ackerman]

The shift in policy is a welcome one for the fledgling industry, which aims to start mining the sea floor in the coming years.

[Kai Rysdal]

For us, America first is good news.

[Daniel Ackerman]

Jared Barron is CEO of the metals company, which is also eyeing the Pacific.

[Kai Rysdal]

As America became energy independent with the advent of shale. It can become mineral independent with this resource a thousand miles southwest of San.

[Daniel Ackerman]

Diego, but that could pose a risk to the health of the ocean, says Beth Orcutt, VP for research at Bigelow Laboratory for Ocean Sciences. While mining companies have developed some ways to clean up after themselves on land, like reforestation or water treatment, there's no.

[VantageScore Representative]

Evidence that you can do that in the deep sea, so the disruption may.

[Alyssa Quart]

Be permanent, at least on human life scales.

[Daniel Ackerman]

There are also financial concerns. Two of the main metals available on the ocean floor are nickel and cobalt. Those have been key parts of electric car batteries, says Victor Vescovo, CEO of Caladan Capital.

[Kai Rysdal]

But today there's been some major advancements in battery technology, the biggest being lithium iron phosphate.

[Daniel Ackerman]

Those materials now make up most EV batteries sold in China, the world's largest market, and Vescovo says, you can't really find them on the ocean floor.

[Kai Rysdal]

So deep sea mining is an extremely difficult solution to a battery metal problem that existed 10 years ago.

[Daniel Ackerman]

Still, the U.S. geological Survey deems nickel, cobalt and other potential seabed resources as critical to the economy and national security. And the mining industry sees the next four years as its chance to go to sea and get them. I'm Daniel Ackerman for Marketplace.

[Nova Safo]

And I'm Nova Safo with a Marketplace morning report from 8pm American Public Media.

[Daniel Ackerman]

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