New line of responsibility between the marketing and engineering teams

Summary

MarTech Podcast ™ — Episode Summary

Episode Title: New line of responsibility between the marketing and engineering teams
Date: October 22, 2025
Host: Benjamin Shapiro
Guest: Dave Steer, CMO of Webflow

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Episode Overview

This episode dives into the evolving responsibilities and blurred lines between marketing and engineering teams, particularly in the context of AI, no-code, and "vibe coding" trends. Benjamin Shapiro and guest Dave Steer, CMO of Webflow, discuss how marketers are adopting increasingly technical functions, the importance of reliable engineering, and the interconnectedness of modern digital teams.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Blurring the Lines: Marketing vs Engineering

[01:46]

• Dave Steer observes that the boundary between marketing and engineering "is blurry, but it still exists. Marketing owns the vision, engineering owns the reliability."
• The rise of "vibe coding" and no-code tools empower marketers to realize visions independently but emphasize the ongoing need for robust engineering, especially in enterprise contexts requiring trust, safety, and security.

Quote:

"Marketing owns the vision, engineering owns the reliability... you need a great engineering team and a great infrastructure team to make sure what it is we are building and the visions that we're setting are 100% reliable to customers."
— Dave Steer, [01:46]

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2. Marketers as Engineers: The Disappearing Divide

[02:24]

• Benjamin Shapiro suggests the line is "disappearing," pointing out the increasing technical nature of marketing roles.
• Ben describes spending time on scripting, coding, error handling, reviewing logs—traditionally engineering tasks—as opposed to classic marketing deliverables like billboards or slogans.
• He notes the evolution of marketers: from creatives, then data scientists, and now engineers as well.

Quote:

“I'm not creating billboards and slogans anymore. This is not marketing. I am 100% building engineering workflows for the marketing department… The evolution of marketers is we touch every part. We are the cog in the middle of the wheel.”
— Benjamin Shapiro, [02:24]

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3. Mission-Driven Convergence and Interdependence

[03:29]

• Dave frames Webflow's mission as "to give everybody developer superpowers," aligning with the blurring roles.
• He adds a new descriptor, beyond blurred or disappeared: interconnected and interdependent. Marketers and engineers, historically siloed with product management in between, are now converging into a collaborative ecosystem.

Quote:

“I said blurred, you said non existent, but I'll give another word. I think marketing teams and marketers and engineering teams and engineers, we're now more interconnected and interdependent than we ever have been... everything is converging together and it's really great to see the poor PMs.”
— Dave Steer, [03:29]

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4. Lighthearted Acknowledgement of Team Convergence

[04:08]

• Ben humorously notes how marketers have "digested [product managers'] turf" and are now taking an active seat in traditionally non-marketing domains.

Memorable Moment:

“We're just basically we've digested their turf. We're sitting on their lap.”
— Benjamin Shapiro, [04:08]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Dave Steer: "Marketing owns the vision, engineering owns the reliability." [01:46]
• Benjamin Shapiro: “I am 100% building engineering workflows for the marketing department.” [02:24]
• Dave Steer: “We're now more interconnected and interdependent than we ever have been.” [03:29]
• Benjamin Shapiro: “We've digested their turf. We're sitting on their lap.” [04:08]

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Timestamps for Major Segments

• [01:15] — Introduction of Dave Steer and episode focus on AI and digital experiences
• [01:46] — Dave on brand responsibility lines: "blurry, but still exists"
• [02:24] — Ben on marketing as engineering and the "disappearing" line
• [03:29] — Dave on interconnected, interdependent teams; Webflow’s mission
• [04:08] — Ben’s humor on marketers absorbing product management

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Conclusion

The conversation spotlights a pivotal shift in marketing: from creation and storytelling to deep technical integration, enabled by no-code tools and changing team dynamics. Both speakers agree the future is collaborative and cross-disciplinary. Marketers are increasingly expected to wield technical tools, while engineers enable creative visions—demonstrating a true merging of business growth disciplines in the digital age.

Transcript

[A]

The Martech Podcast is a proud member of the I Hear Everything Podcast Network. Looking to launch or scale your podcast, I Hear Everything delivers podcast production, growth and monetization solutions that transform your words into profit. Ready to give your brand a voice? Then visit iheareverything.com.

[B]

From advertising to software as a service to data across all of our programs and clients, we've seen a 55 to 65% open rate. Getting brands authentically integrated into content performs better than TV advertising.

[C]

Typical lifespan of an article is about 24 to 36 hours.

[B]

We're reaching out to the right person with the right message and a clear call to action. Then it's just a matter of timing.

[A]

Welcome to the Martech Podcast, a member of the I Hear Everything Podcast Network. In this podcast, you'll hear the stories of world class marketers that used technology to drive business results and achieve career success. Here's a host of the Martech Podcast, Benjamin Shapiro.

[C]

I'm Benjamin Shapiro and joining me today is Dave Steer, the CMO of webflow, which is a platform helping marketing teams build and optimize websites with enterprise grade performance and AI driven personalization. And today Dave is going to show us how to navigate the AI boom and deliver digital experiences that move the needle. Moving on to our next question. With the rise of vibe coding and no code tools, where is the line of responsibility between the marketing teams and the engineering teams?

[B]

It's blurry, but it still exists. Marketing owns the vision, engineering owns the reliability. It's one of the things that I think a lot of people are missing right now. I think vibe coding is hugely important. Vibe coding, vibe marketing as well. It helps with vision creation. But ultimately, especially as you move up market and brands rely on, you know, trust and reliability and safety and security, you need a great engineering team and a great infrastructure team to make sure what it is we are building and the visions that we're setting are 100% reliable to customers.

[C]

Maybe I should have changed this question. Maybe it should have been what's the word that you would describe the relationship? And yours would have been blurry. My word would be disappearing, right? I actually think that marketers are becoming engineers and maybe it's just my personal experience, but I'm spending more time vibe coding, writing Python scripts, writing JavaScript, figuring out error handling, look at log reports, figuring out what's broken. And I'm like, I'm not creating billboards and slogans anymore. This is not marketing. I am 100% building engineering workflows for the marketing department. But the more that it's the same way that marketing We've gone through this phase where marketers were data scientists. Now we are data scientists and engineers and strategists and creatives and designers and, and, and, and it just seems like it's a never ending prospect of the evolution of marketers is we touch every part. We are the cog in the middle of the wheel.

[B]

One of the reasons why I love the webflow brand, which I'm still learning today, is it is a mission driven brand and our mission is to give everybody developer superpowers. And I think that is the way to express some of what you just brought up. I said blurred, you said non existent, but I'll give another word. I think marketing teams and marketers and engineering teams and engineers, we're now more interconnected and interdependent than we ever have been. It used to be marketers are over here, engineers are over here, and maybe you've got product management in the middle. Now everything is converging together and it's really great to see the poor PMs.

[C]

We're just basically we've digested their turf. We're sitting on their lap. That wraps up this episode of the Martech Podcast. Thanks for listening to my conversation with Dave Steer, the CMO of webflow. If you'd like to get in touch with Dave, you can find a link to his LinkedIn profile in our show notes or on martechpod.com or you could visit his company's website, which is webflow.com and if you haven't subscribed yet and you want a daily stream of marketing and technology knowledge in your podcast feed, hit the subscribe button in your podcast app or Visit us on YouTube, where we'll be back in your feed next week. All right, that's it for today, but until next time, my advice is to just focus on keeping your customers happy.

[A]

Thanks for listening to the Martech podcast and I hear everything. Production Looking to launch or scale a podcast like this one for your brand? Then visit iheareverything. Com.