MarTech Podcast™: Which Frontier Model Will Win the AI-Platform Battle?

Host: Benjamin Shapiro
Guest: Dave Steer, CMO of Webflow
Date: October 25, 2025

Episode Overview

In this episode, Benjamin Shapiro interviews Dave Steer, Chief Marketing Officer at Webflow, on the fast-evolving landscape of AI frontier models. Together, they explore which major AI platforms (like GPT, Claude, and Gemini) could win the long-term enterprise battle in marketing technology, and discuss what actually matters for marketers: the models themselves, or the contextual use cases built on top of them.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Shifting Landscape of Frontier AI Models

[01:15 – 01:44]

• Dave Steer on the state of AI:

  • The question of which AI model will emerge as the frontrunner remains open and unsettled.

  • Dave highlights his own experience using ChatGPT, Claude (Anthropic), and notes that the industry is still "in the early innings" of a long game.

    "I can't make that call because things are changing all the time. I've really enjoyed using ChatGPT ... In my last job we were an Anthropic shop so I used Claude all the time ... I think the game—I said early innings earlier. I'm committing to early innings."
    — Dave Steer [01:44]

• Benjamin Shapiro presses Dave for an answer, prompting an amiable back-and-forth on personal preferences and the fast pace of advances in the space.

2. Evaluating The "Big Three": GPT, Claude, Gemini

[02:11 – 03:02]

• Benjamin Shapiro shares his own usage patterns and evolving opinions:

  • Admits to using Claude most often, but considers Google’s Gemini as a potential winner due to Google's unique contextual data.

  • Casts skepticism on the idea that GPT-5 has “maxed out.”

  • Balances Gemini’s data advantages with GPT’s first-mover status, expressing hesitancy but betting on the power of underlying data sources.

    "I use mostly Claude right now ... I do think that the rumor is we've hit max frontier model with GPT-5 and it's just not getting incrementally better. I don't believe that for one possible second ... I think that, the more I think about it—and I haven't been bullish on them before—but I think Gemini, because of the context that Google has and the access to the underlying data source, I would probably put my chips into that stack. But I am very hesitant. I think GPT has the first mover advantage. I use Claude and think that right now it's the best model."
    — Benjamin Shapiro [02:11]

• The hosts underscore the rapid evolution in model quality, user experience, and data integrations—with no clear dominant player yet.

3. Platforms, Context, and The Real Battleground

[03:02 – 03:50]

• Dave Steer reframes the debate:

  • Suggests the real question is less about the underlying model and more about the context added by the platforms that integrate AI into marketing workflows.

  • Notes that as models themselves become commoditized, competitive advantage will shift to those who build the best layers and interfaces atop these models.

  • Cites the competition across industries, with platforms like GitHub and GitLab for developers, and names Webflow’s ambition in marketing.

    "It might even be the wrong question to ask, because the frontier model is the commodity or it will increasingly become the commodity. It's the context that's added on top of it. So for me, the interesting questions ... which platforms that sit on top of these models have the best context available? ... I think in the marketing world, Webflow is—a, you know, it's going."
    — Dave Steer [03:02]

4. Personal Moments & Wrap-Up

[03:50 – 04:13]

• Benjamin ends with a light-hearted off-topic question:

  "Who's your favorite Red Sox player?"
  — Benjamin Shapiro [03:50]

• Dave reminisces about attending games with his daughter to watch "Big Papi" (David Ortiz).

  "Big Papi. When you said Big Papi, I remember taking my daughter to Red Sox games and we'd always go just to see Big Papi." — Dave Steer [04:04]

• Benjamin jokes about pronouncing "Mark Pedroia" with a Boston accent.

Memorable Quotes

• "I can't make that call because things are changing all the time. ... I think the game—I said early innings earlier. I'm committing to early innings."
  — Dave Steer [01:44]

• "I do think that, the more I think about it ... Gemini, because of the context that Google has and the access to the underlying data source, I would probably put my chips into that stack. But I am very hesitant."
  — Benjamin Shapiro [02:11]

• "It might even be the wrong question to ask, because the frontier model is the commodity or it will increasingly become the commodity. It's the context that's added on top of it."
  — Dave Steer [03:02]

Notable Timestamps

• [01:15] – Introduction to Dave Steer and the business context.
• [01:44] – Dave's take on making predictions about AI models.
• [02:11] – Benjamin evaluates GPT, Claude, and Gemini.
• [03:02] – Dave's perspective on platforms vs. AI models.
• [03:50] – Closing with a personal Red Sox anecdote.

Takeaways for Marketers

• The "battle" between AI models (GPT, Claude, Gemini) is far from decided.
• Model quality matters, but real differentiation is moving toward the contextual layers built on top.
• As commoditization of foundational models grows, brands should focus on platforms that best integrate these models into their existing workflows.

For further information, connect with Dave Steer on LinkedIn or visit webflow.com.