Maxwell Leadership Executive Podcast

Episode #333: The Recipe for Retention
Host: John Maxwell
Co-hosts: Chris Goede & Perry Holley
Date: February 27, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode dives into the critical issue of employee retention and turnover, unpacking why people leave organizations and what leaders can do to retain their best talent. Chris Goede and Perry Holley draw from real-world leadership experience, statistics across industries, and Maxwell Leadership principles to deliver a practical "recipe for retention." The conversation is rooted in influence, intentionality, and the power of meaningful connections between leaders and team members.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Business Challenge: Turnover & Retention

• Statistical Reality
  Chris Goede opens with industry-specific turnover rates:

  • Hospitality: 79%
  • Professional services: 57%
  • Construction: 24%
  • Manufacturing: 37%
  • Government: 18%
    (03:00) "The reports of great detachment tell us your teammates are more inclined than ever to detach from what they're doing—and maybe even from you." – Chris Goede

• The Great Detachment & Engagement

  • Engagement levels are declining, which directly ties to retention issues.
  • People often join companies for reputation but leave because of leadership.

The Leader’s Role in Retention

• It Starts with Influence, Not Position
  (04:26) Perry Holley emphasizes:

  "Leadership is not about my position—it's about influence. Your very next question should be, how do I get more of that?"

  • Draws on Maxwell’s “Five Levels of Leadership,” highlighting the move from Level 1 (people follow because they have to) to Level 2 (people follow because they want to).

• Taking Responsibility for Relationships

  • Building influence is anchored in intentional, initiated relationships—not just waiting for connections to happen.

  • (07:07) Perry Holley:

    "Leaders initiate—leaders initiate. It is so strong… There may be a power dynamic, but if you want to connect, you have to take responsibility for it."

  • Example: Management By Walking Around (MBWA) and using personality assessments to make connection easier in organizations.

The Recipe for Retention: Six Ingredients

1. Initiate Relationships and Connection

• Don’t wait—reach out intentionally regardless of your position.
• Tailor approach according to individual preferences (e.g., how people like to be recognized or connected with).

2. Conduct Honest Exit Interviews

• Always seek feedback when someone leaves.
• (11:00) Perry Holley:

  "If I’m really good at leading, I’ll already know why… Most people don’t leave for money. They leave because they don’t feel valued."

• Use third-party exit interviews, as people may not be fully honest with direct supervisors.

3. Place High Value on Team Members

• Show value in ways that resonate with individuals.
• Provide feedback in the way they best receive it.
• (14:11) Chris Goede:

  "Providing feedback shows value… I realized when I was getting that candid feedback, my leader was valuing me as a person enough to give me that feedback in the right way."

4. Promote Status and Respect

• Give public recognition and respect contributions.
• (17:06) Perry Holley:

  "Everyone wants to feel that they have status… John Maxwell did it to me a few weeks ago—he gave me status and respect in front of others. That’s what keeps people."

• Accidental disrespect or overlooking someone’s input damages retention.

5. Demonstrate Consistency (Especially in Emotion)

• Set a reliable organizational and emotional tone.
• (19:06) Perry Holley:

  "That inconsistency of emotion where you might blow up… people think, 'I don’t feel psychologically safe around you.'"

• Consistency breeds predictability and trust.

6. Exemplify and Encourage Teachability

• Model a teachable spirit—be open to feedback and learning from others.
• Value personal and team growth.
• (20:05) Perry Holley:

  "I keep learning so I can keep leading… I want to lift the lid on me, that lifts the lid on my team."

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• (03:10) Chris Goede:

  "While people join your amazing company for obvious reasons, they're quitting the leaders inside your organization—or maybe even you. That's the hard part."

• (05:11) Perry Holley:

  "What would make somebody go from 'I follow you because I have to' to 'I follow you because I want to'? Influence."

• (17:06) Perry Holley (about John Maxwell):

  "He put his arm around me and told somebody about me—he instantly gave me status… it made me feel like I was a value."

• (20:25) Chris Goede:

  "A rising tide raises all boats. The key to the recipe for retention is: do your team members feel valued? ...Do your people feel seen, valued, and heard?"

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Industry Turnover Stats & The Great Detachment: 01:10–03:30
• Influence Over Position & Five Levels: 04:26–05:35
• Initiating Relationships & MBWA Examples: 06:35–09:12
• Exit Interviews & The Real Reasons People Leave: 10:03–12:52
• Valuing People (Recognition, Feedback, Inclusion): 13:06–16:05
• Status & Respect Example from John Maxwell: 17:06–17:29
• Consistency and Psychological Safety: 18:11–19:06
• Teachability and Growth Culture: 19:54–20:25
• Final Thoughts on Value & Tailored Leadership: 20:25–22:21

Closing Takeaway

The real "recipe for retention" is not a single policy or perk, but a holistic, intentional culture where leaders initiate meaningful relationships, value individual contributions, provide safety and consistency, and remain teachable themselves. When team members feel seen, valued, and heard—not just as workers but as people—turnover drops, engagement rises, and organizations thrive.

For more resources and the learner's guide for this episode, visit maxwellleadership.com/podcast.