209. Jorma Taccone Returns: This Episode Sucks

Summary

Podcast Summary: Mike Birbiglia's Working It Out

Episode 209: Jorma Taccone Returns – This Episode Sucks
Date: April 20, 2026
Guest: Jorma Taccone (Lonely Island, director of “Over Your Dead Body”)
Host: Mike Birbiglia

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Episode Overview

This episode features a lively, irreverent, and often profound conversation between Mike Birbiglia and filmmaker/comedian Jorma Taccone. The focus: deconstructing the realities of filmmaking—especially indie production and stunts—plus personal stories, including Jorma’s harrowing ladder accident and the creative lessons that emerged from it. The pair also riff on the role of pain in comedy, working relationships, jealousy in showbiz, and favorite films that define their artistic sensibilities.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Realities of Movie Stunt Work

• Stuntmen and Risk: The conversation opens with behind-the-scenes stories about stunt performers from Jorma’s days directing “Hot Rod” and Mike’s experience with stuntmen on “Sleepwalk with Me.”
  • Quote: “What they don’t tell you before you make a movie is stuntmen… they do the thing.” – Mike (00:00, 22:55)
  • Jorma tells of a stuntman who completed a car hit scene after having broken his ankle earlier that day, exposing the toughness and sometimes overlooked dangers:
    “Don’t tell anyone, but he broke his ankle earlier today… but he gets $1,500 a pop.” (00:06, 24:13)

2. Directing & Writing Process

• Tone Management in “Over Your Dead Body”:
  Jorma describes the new film as a mashup—comedy, thriller, home invasion, and action. He talks through the challenges of making a couple attempting to kill each other believable and emotionally relatable.
  • Quote: “It’s that trick of liking these people enough to go on this journey and wanting to see them suffer through it, to then have some kind of catharsis at the end.” (05:42)
• Casting & Spent ‘Goodwill’:
  Casting Jason Segel was key: his natural warmth allowed them to “spend” his likability in exploring dark material (06:51).

3. Jorma’s Accident and Recovery

• 15-Foot Ladder Fall:
  Jorma recounts, with both humor and gravity, falling 15 feet from a barn ladder while hanging lights alone, resulting in serious injuries:
  • “I was hanging lights on a barn, and I fell 15ft off of a ladder. …I hit the ground, exploded my pelvis on my left side, fractured the pelvis on the right. My sacrum pretty shattered…” (11:09)
• Pain & Perspective:
  While writhing in pain, Jorma had a moment of clarity after ketamine in the ambulance, finding a “global shift” in perspective:
  • “I have a…definitely a new appreciation for life in general. It's more of, like, an internal quietness…a global shift... I just feel beyond lucky.” (16:48, 17:13)

4. Filmmaking: The Grind & the Joy

• Day in the Life:
  Jorma gives a realistic account of daily directing, emphasizing prep work, shot lists, flexibility, and improvise-on-set moments—especially with indie budgets.
  “There’s moments you always want to be nimble enough…to throw it out or move if something’s going to need to change. Sometimes that's because the car's not working…” (20:52)
• Favorite Films & Their Rewatchability:
  Jorma’s “Film University” syllabus:
  • Goonies, Die Hard, Pee Wee’s Big Adventure, Shawshank Redemption, The Ice Storm
  • Criteria for rewatchability: “I do really appreciate when any filmmaker is trying to make something that has a repeatable watch factor.” (27:34)
  • Quote on Goonies: “It’s really hard to make a movie that is respectful to kids, like doesn’t feel like it’s talking down to kids. There’s death and dead bodies in that movie…” (29:39)
• Most-Hated & Favorite Filmmaking Stages:
  Both commiserate that pre-production is the hardest due to constant changes; filming is the joy.
  • Jorma: “Pre production is really hard. Everything falls apart in front of your eyes..." (31:46)

5. Showbiz Life – Jealousy, Niceness, and Surviving Meltdowns

• On Jealousy in Entertainment:
  “A difficulty that I have with the industry in general is that the whole thing makes you kind of jealous…it’s part of the reason I think I live in New York, so I can be slightly removed from it.” (34:57)
• Niceness as Professional Strategy:
  Jorma argues it helps in the long run: impressed that actress Juliette Lewis wanted to work with him again because he’s both good and kind to work with.
  • “I think that it helps you when you get the job. It may not help you get the job, but after you have the job…” (36:05)

6. Memorable Rapid-Fire Stories:

• Physical Comedy and Injury:
  They both riff on the comedic value of slapstick pain and direct stunts for maximum “ouch” effect:
  “The funny thing is when it looks like it’s wrong. And so that usually involves your legs coming out in a weird way…because painful is fucking funny.” – Jorma (25:36)
• Jorma’s Old Fights and Punched-in-the-Face Stories:
  Growing up in Berkeley, he recounts fights with friends and standing up to a bully by punching him on the bus (38:45)
• Parenting and Perspective:
  After his accident, Jorma’s daughter joked about him dying at her birthday party, making him reflect on comedy’s roots in tragedy and time:
  “Tragedy plus time equals comedy. You got it.” (14:43)
• Massage Parlor Story:
  Mike recounts a bizarre sports massage at a stranger’s house in Texas, only to hear an unsolicited soap-opera-style confession about infidelity in a Taco Bell parking lot (48:11–49:19).

7. Collaborative Comedy & Material Development

• “Working It Out” Bit in Real Time:
  Mike shares a new joke about marriage and feeling ridiculous in the eyes of loved ones; Jorma helps tag the core insight:
  • Jorma: “She gets you so…she finds you ridiculous.” (44:57)
• Jorma’s Self-Deprecation Around His Accident:
  Even in pain, he couldn’t help but aim for a joke:
  • “It is ridiculous how often while I was in wild pain…how I was just trying to think of the joke I was gonna say to the doctors.” (45:59)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “If you’re lucky in life, you find a person who understands you the most in the world. And if you’re really lucky, that person wants to spend any meaningful amount of time with you at all.” – Mike (44:13)
• “The training of the actor is you do it so many years, so many times that when there’s two takes, both takes are usable.” – Mike (33:28)
• On comedy after trauma:
  “Tragedy plus time equals comedy. You got it. It’s hilarious.” – Jorma, relaying his daughter’s story (14:43)
• “Painful is fucking funny.” – Jorma, on directing slapstick (25:36)
• New appreciation post-accident:
  “It’s more of an internal quietness…a global shift. I just feel beyond lucky.” – Jorma (16:54)
• “Whenever I go to LA, it’s like a million fucking billboards of everybody making shit…am I doing the right thing? Do I know what I’m doing?” – Jorma (35:08)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Stuntman Life & Hot Rod Stories: 00:00 / 22:55 / 24:13
• On “Over Your Dead Body”’s Tone: 04:42–06:43
• Discussing Jorma’s Accident & Aftermath: 07:48–18:11
• Day in the Life of a Director: 20:52–22:32
• Painful Comedy / Stunt Directing: 25:36
• Jorma's Top 5 Films & Rewatchability: 27:34–29:39
• Hatred for Pre-Production: 31:46
• Jealousy in Showbiz: 34:57
• Niceness as a Director: 36:05
• Bus Fights and Punching Bullies: 38:45
• Marriage & Comedy Bit Development: 44:08–45:12
• Physical Therapy & Massage Parlor Story: 45:14–50:30
• Working it Out for a Cause: 53:19
• Berkeley Schools Fund Shout-out: 53:28

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Charitable Highlight

• Berkeley Unified School District / Berkeley Public Schools Fund
  Jorma’s selected cause: “Equitable Public Schools for the well-being of Berkeley.”
  • Donate: berkeleypublicschoolsfund.org (53:28)

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Tone & Style

True to both guests, the conversation is self-deprecating, uproarious, and candid. They veer from slapstick (and literal) pain to the existential anxieties of creative work, always punctuated by jokes, impressions, and genuine affection for the creative process, even at its hardest.

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This episode is packed with practical and philosophical insights for filmmakers and comedy fans, plus enough physical pain anecdotes to remind you: don’t do your own stunts, and always respect the ladder.

Transcript

[Mike Birbiglia]

This is what they don't tell you before you make a movie is stuntmen. They do the thing.

[Jorma Taccone]

They do the thing. Did I tell you this right? I probably told it on our podcast, but when we were doing Hot Rod, there was a scene where it's a montage of Andy's character Rod, getting hit by different. He was doing stunt tests, and then he just gets hit by this car. And you're like, this is incredibly stupid. And so I'm sitting next to the stuntman and we're just waiting to drive into a human. Oh, my God. And then the guy leans over to me and he's like, don't tell anyone, but he broke his ankle earlier. Earlier today.

[Mike Birbiglia]

That is the voice of the great Jorma Taccone Jorma, one of my favorite writers, actors, directors, sketch comedians, wrote for SNL for many years. He's part of the Lonely Island. They made a movie called Pops Star. Never Stop. Never Stopping. They made Hot Rod, which he was talking about there. He made MacGruber. His new movie that is just coming out is called over your dead body with Jason Segel and Samara Weaving. It is so funny. It is in theaters now. I think it's a great episode today. I've known Yerma for a long time. We're good friends. I'm a huge fan of his work. We really get in the weeds on writing and directing movies today. Super, super fun. By the way, thanks to everyone who signed up for Working It Out Premium on Apple Podcasts. It's become this super interesting experiment where I work out even in like a more raw way, like new material, listeners, jokes. I answer questions. We've had Pete Holmes over there. We've had my wife Jenny. When you subscribe on Apple Podcasts to Working it out Premium, you just basically go in the app of Apple Podcasts, you go to Working it out, it'll give you an option. It's $4.99 a month. And for that you get these bonus episodes about once a month. And then you also, on every episode, you get no ads and you support the show, which we work very hard on. It's an independent production. We really appreciate it. By the way, are you in Los Angeles?

[Jorma Taccone]

Are you in Los Angeles?

[Mike Birbiglia]

Because I'm going to be there May 6, one night only, as part of the Netflix is a Joke Festival festival at the Wilshire Ebell Theater. I'll also be in Montreal this summer. I'm hosting a gala for the Just for Laughs Festival. Really sentimental thing for me. I got my start there in new faces in 2001. What? 2001? That can't be right. I think it's right 25 years ago. I'm just making this connection now to 25 years ago I was a new face. 25 years later, I'm hosting a gala for Canadian television. I'm very excited. Also in May, I will be touring in support of John Mulaney's tour along with Fred Armisen in Colorado Springs. Cool town. Eugene, Oregon, another cool town. Bend, Oregon, another cool town. And in August, I'll be in Moorhead, Minnesota with him. I will also be they just announced I'll be in Nantucket. I'm doing two shows in Nantucket at like a beautiful little Nantucket Arts Center. So if you're near there, that's great. Tickets for all these [e-mail] I'm not sure the Nantucket one's on sale yet, but the other ones are [e-mail] Sign up for the mailing list. Oh, also, to be the first to know about everything. In addition to signing up for the mailing list. Text BURBIGS to 917-444-7150 to be the first to know about upcoming shows and make sure it doesn't go to your spam. Love this chat with Jorma Tacone. We talk directing movies. We talk about his recovery from falling 15ft off of a ladder last year. I apologize for laughing. It is not funny. What's funny is that he's okay and it's uplifting and actually gets pretty deep on that. It's it's intense. But really, this is a great episode. If you're interested in making movies and deconstructing the making of movies, he has a lot of valuable insights into that process. Enjoy my conversation with the great Jorma Taccone. Your movie, I would describe it as comedy and then also like thriller, like murder horror thriller.

[Jorma Taccone]

I've been describing it as like, throw three movies in one. It kind of goes from like suspense thriller to like kind of home invasion to like an action movie.

[Mike Birbiglia]

How did you mention to your wife that you're considering directing a film about a protagonist murdering his wife?

[Jorma Taccone]

Well, you know Marielle Heller, who's my wife, who had done a movie called Night Bitch, which is sort of about difficulty in a marriage as well.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Sure.

[Jorma Taccone]

And you know, when she was making that, there were moments where I was like, you didn't have to put our conversations in verbatim. Like you didn't like.

[Mike Birbiglia]

But the point being, point being that

[Jorma Taccone]

she just made a movie.

[Mike Birbiglia]

She made a movie.

[Jorma Taccone]

Some difficulties in relationships. And then I made a movie about two people trying to kill each other. So we're even.

[Mike Birbiglia]

What's the guiding principle for the reality of the movie? Because I was like, I completely bought that they were a couple and that they were doing this outrageous thing which is trying to essentially kill each other.

[Jorma Taccone]

I mean, I think that's one of the tricks and the challenges for me directing, was trying to make sure that all the tones lined up, but also that that premise, which is, you know, it's a big buy in the beginning to have your protagonist have made this horrible decision to, like, kill his wife. It's unbelievable for you to be on his side somewhat. And what I like about the movie is that you're with him, and then that perspective sort of keeps changing based on the conversation, right? Like, you, like, you get to a point with Sam where you're like, oh, fuck. Like, she has her own grievances. And I kind of agree with her now, right? But they're both making a horrible decision to want to, like, murder their partner, right? So. But it's that trick of, like. Of, like, liking these people enough to go on this journey and wanting to see them suffer through it, to then have some kind of catharsis at the end. So it's a lot of threading of needles, which I found extremely challenging and awesome.

[Mike Birbiglia]

And it's also like. It's also like, it doesn't hurt that you cast the guy who's. Is it a man or a Muppet?

[Jorma Taccone]

I think that. I mean, as. As for a man who's. Who's cast and brilliantly cast, I think a lot of your movies, I think that. That it's a huge part of it. Of just, like, so much. The casting is massive. And, like. And as you said, he's so fucking charming. Siegel is so good at his job. He's such a good actor. But then also, like, obviously a hilarious comedian, but there's things that he does in it that are so dark and. And we had discussions where we were like, there's goodwill towards him as a performer, right? And you kind of need to spend it in certain parts and be like, okay, like. Like, we can't go darker than this, but, like, we can get away with just this much, right? Of. Of horrible shit that he's doing. You're with him in the beginning of the movie. He's fucked up by, like, wanting to murder his wife, right? And then you want to see him get, like, broken down physically and Mentally to his core so that he can build himself back up. And that's.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Do you want this to happen to you?

[Jorma Taccone]

I did. That's what happened to me. I fell off a fucking ladder.

[Mike Birbiglia]

That brings us.

[Jorma Taccone]

I was dying.

[Mike Birbiglia]

To the latter incident. Yes. By the way, of the questions we have. Last summer, you fell off a ladder and were nearly paralyzed. Yeah. Of the members of Lonely island, who would be the most sad if they died?

[Jorma Taccone]

Who would be the most sad if they died?

[Mike Birbiglia]

That person in Lonely island died. Yeah. We're gonna get back to that. I'm just giving you a preview.

[Jorma Taccone]

Andy. It's gonna be this, like, would Andy be the most sad if Andy died? Is that what you're saying?

[Mike Birbiglia]

No, no, no. America. Oh, who would have. For sure. Yeah.

[Jorma Taccone]

But Andy would also be the most sad if Andy died.

[Mike Birbiglia]

When we wrote these questions, my prediction was,

[Jorma Taccone]

well, people would be most sad about.

[Mike Birbiglia]

This is my Yarmouth. People be most sad about Andy dying. And then Ty for second, me and Akiva.

[Jorma Taccone]

Your impression of me is so similar to Seth's impression of me. That's so sad.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah. Seth Meyers has a good impression of you.

[Jorma Taccone]

I think that, weirdly, we were talking about this a little bit yesterday. I don't know how detailed I got with the ladder fall, but just to give some backstory to listeners who might

[Mike Birbiglia]

not know this, and people can hear you talk about this also on your Lonely island podcast with Seth Meyers, where you break essentially, this podcast, if you haven't heard it, is very good. It's like you break down the history of all the Lonely island sketches.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yeah.

[Mike Birbiglia]

And there's a lot of them on that. That's where they broke news that you had fallen off of a ladder in. At your home in Connecticut.

[Jorma Taccone]

I did it at. I broke the news from my hospital bed.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Oh, my God.

[Jorma Taccone]

At Yale. I got surgery at Yale. It was, I think, a day after my surgery that I was, like, in bed talking to these guys about. But I was really doing it to just show how brave I was.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yes.

[Jorma Taccone]

You know.

[Mike Birbiglia]

No, you are brave. That's always the word that comes to mind.

[Jorma Taccone]

Very dedicated podcast host. But, yes. So I fell. I fell 50. I was hanging lights on a barn, and I fell 15ft off of a ladder. What had actually happened, which is very embarrassing, is that I had pulled the ladder out because it goes up so high that you. You can't unclick it with just one person. And I was. Happened to be alone because my friend who was holding the ladder had gone inside for a second. So I thought it'd be smart to, like, just pull it out and have it more at an angle so that I. So I didn't have to, like, unclick it.

[Mike Birbiglia]

I hate this story.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yeah. And my neighbor had also, who had loaned me the. The ladder, had told me, don't use this ladder because one of the legs is also a problem.

[Mike Birbiglia]

God.

[Jorma Taccone]

And so I. But I kicked it out a little bit. And then. And I was. I was almost thinking it was funny to be, like, on this ladder that was like, at a. I don't know what degree angle, but not the correct one.

[Mike Birbiglia]

By the way, ladder jokes are great.

[Jorma Taccone]

Oh, you have no idea how many of fans have sent me such mean about ladders.

[Mike Birbiglia]

But even you saying, like, it would be funny if I was at some weird angle on the ladder. No, it's not funny.

[Jorma Taccone]

It's not anymore.

[Mike Birbiglia]

No, not anymore.

[Jorma Taccone]

But so, like, so I. I was hanging these lights and then it gave a little bit, so it, like, it maybe it dropped like six inches. And I was. I had this visceral, like, oh, fuck, yeah. I'm so high up in the air, I'm going to die. And then a second later, I'm falling, and I had a whole thought in the air of, like, this is it. Like, I'm. I'm dead. So I hit the ground, exploded my pelvis on my left side, I fractured the pelvis on the right. My sacrum pretty shattered my pelvis on my left side detached from my spine, broke my lower lumbar. And so the minute I hit the ground, I never lost consciousness. But, like, pain beyond pain. Like, I can only imagine that, like, you pass out after that level of pain, which would have been nice, maybe, but, like, but so I'm writhing on the ground, screaming for an ambulance for, like 10 minutes, like, cursing.

[Mike Birbiglia]

I'm sorry to be laughing.

[Jorma Taccone]

No, no, please, please. I'm for your entertainment, Mike.

[Mike Birbiglia]

I like, what is it?

[Jorma Taccone]

What does the pain feel like? Oh, I felt like a bag of bones. Like, I felt like a. Like this whole lower part just felt like my bones were floating around. And then when I described that to my surgeon, they were like, oh, yeah, that's what it was. That's what it is.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Like, so, like, in other words, I

[Jorma Taccone]

felt like a war movie. Like, like, like. And I don't mean to compare that to, like, anybody who's actually been to war.

[Mike Birbiglia]

You are a war hero.

[Jorma Taccone]

But it was.

[Mike Birbiglia]

That is one of the things that we're going to talk about later.

[Jorma Taccone]

No, but like, but like, but. But it felt like just. I Honestly compared it to, like, when I saw my wife giving birth. And I also don't want to compare it to that either.

[Mike Birbiglia]

No, that is a good comparison. And you're dead on.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yeah, yeah. You are a hero. I'm a hero. You're a hero, and I'm a mom. Exactly. What pregnancy is like.

[Mike Birbiglia]

We got you. We got you, dude.

[Jorma Taccone]

That's the name of the show, right? It's called we got you.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Here's what I'm worried about. You still fucking.

[Jorma Taccone]

By the way. By the way, it's a 5050 whether you're impotent or incognito.

[Mike Birbiglia]

It's a 5050 when people have your interest.

[Jorma Taccone]

So I'm gonna let you guys guess. Am I incontinent? Am I impetus?

[Mike Birbiglia]

Is he a man or a muppet?

[Jorma Taccone]

How did we get on it?

[Mike Birbiglia]

Am I a man or am I impotent?

[Jorma Taccone]

That's not bad. No, it's fine, you guys, it's fine.

[Mike Birbiglia]

I'm.

[Jorma Taccone]

I'm good.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I. Yeah, I'm sure. I'm sure it's fine. Yeah.

[Jorma Taccone]

No, by the way, this was the morning of my daughter's fifth birthday.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Unbelievable.

[Jorma Taccone]

So while this was happening.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Overcompensating, of course, you're probably like, I just wanted.

[Jorma Taccone]

All eyes on me.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Hey, guys, I put up lies over here really high in the air up in the barn.

[Jorma Taccone]

God, I wish I had an impression of you.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Whoa, whoa. Now you're Aziz.

[Jorma Taccone]

That was. That was Andy's question. It was his question. What was. Did you make a funny noise when you fell here? I. Hello, ground. Hello, ground.

[Mike Birbiglia]

That's too fast towards the ground.

[Jorma Taccone]

That's definitely what was going through my. This is too fast.

[Mike Birbiglia]

This is too high. I'm too high.

[Jorma Taccone]

That's too fast.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Oh, my God. Oh, God. I haven't laughed this hard on the podcast a long time. This is, like, killing me.

[Jorma Taccone]

All you need is, like, near death experiences.

[Mike Birbiglia]

No, I know.

[Jorma Taccone]

I was trying to explain it to my. My daughter, who was sang recently, that she was like. It was so funny because at my birthday party, I was yelling, dad's going to die. Dad's going to die. And then I was like. And then I was like, zadie, that's exactly it. Tragedy plus time equals comedy. You got it. It's hilarious.

[Mike Birbiglia]

And there hasn't been enough time, but I'm going to let. Let it go on this time because you're my daughter. Yeah, yeah. Oh, I mean, that is.

[Jorma Taccone]

Here's the other thing. Wiley, my. My son said it was right after this had happened. But he was like, dad, if it had been filmed, do you think it would have been funny? And I was like, yes, of course it would be 1,000%.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Oh, of course.

[Jorma Taccone]

My God. Guy falling off a ladder. That's hilarious.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Wait, so did you have. When you thought you were gonna die.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yes.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Did you have any regrets?

[Jorma Taccone]

Just the latter thing, clearly. Clearly. No, weirdly. So my legs are pinned in the rungs of the ladder, so I know it's about to be the craziest for how crazy the pain is.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Can you describe what you mean by pin?

[Jorma Taccone]

My legs are in the rungs of the ladder. So you have video on this podcast, which is great. So my legs are, like, entwined in the rungs of the ladder, and anytime anybody tries to move me at all, like, even touch me, I'm like, oh, my God, Give me fucking ambulance. Just give me a fucking ambulance. I just said, get me a fucking ambulance for, like, 10 minutes. But the EMTs arrive, and I know it's about to be the craziest pain in my life.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah, this store.

[Jorma Taccone]

This part of the story has a point. So I get pulled out, just wild again. Anytime I moved, it's like, the wildest pain in my life. I get put into the. The ambulance. They're like, how are the pain meds? I'm, like, not working. And they were like. They're like, do you want ketamine? And I was like, yeah, of course I want ketamine.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Of course you do.

[Jorma Taccone]

So once I had taken ketamine, I was like. I was like, you know what? This is all part of my journey. Yeah, of course, man. Like, it is part of your. Like, you know, I'm going to learn from this. And, yeah, I'm very. I'm very lucky. And honestly, like, like.

[Mike Birbiglia]

And what did you learn?

[Jorma Taccone]

I have a. Definitely a new appreciation for life in general.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah.

[Jorma Taccone]

Like, it's more of, like, an internal quietness, but with that. That feeling, obviously, like, it's a. It's a global shift, is how I would describe it. It's not always. It's not all the time. I still have, like, anxiety. I feel like I still have, like, there's a ton of. It's not like it fixed everything in my life.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah.

[Jorma Taccone]

But I. I. As an example, when, you know, that sort of almost like, obligatory for New Year's, when people are like, oh, this year was so tough. Like, you must be so happy that this, like, crummy year is over. And I was like. My first thought was like, I'm beyond lucky. I, like, I have no dark feelings about this, right, Whatsoever. I mean, like, I have pain and I have like really deep moments of like, fuck, this isn't going away. Or like I'm sore. Like, like, is this gonna be forever? Like, is this, you know, like I'm, I look fine when you see me on the street and like, but it, like it's, it's painful and I really, I have moments where I'm like, am I gonna feel like I'm 80 for the next till I'm 80 something. But like, but, but no. I just like, overall, I just feel like beyond lucky. Yeah, beyond lucky.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Support for working out comes from Mint Mobile. I don't know about you, I like keeping my money where I can see it. Just like tons of cash pouring out of my pockets. Unfortunately, traditional big wireless carriers also seem to like keeping my money too. After years of overpaying for wireless, I finally got fed up with crazy high wireless bills as well as bogus fees and free perks that actually cost more in the long run. I switched to Mint Mobile. Mint Mobile is here to rescue you with premium wireless plans starting at 15 bucks a month. All plans come with high speed data and unlimited talk and text delivered on the nation's largest 5G network. Ditch overpriced wireless and get three months of premium wireless service from Mint Mobile for 15 bucks a month. If you like your money, Mint Mobile is for you. Now that's a sell. Shop [e-mail] burbigs that's mintmobile.com burbigs upfront payment of $45 for a 3 month 5 gigabyte plan required equivalent to $15 a month. New customer offer for first 3 months only. Then full price plan options available, taxes and fees extra. See Mint Mobile for details. Support for working it out comes from Quints. I love quints. Quince has all the wardrobe staples for spring. Think 100% European linen shorts, linen shirts from $34. Lightweight, breathable, comfortable. 100% Pima cotton tees with a softness that has to be felt to be believed. I just got myself a three pack of Alpaca crew socks from Quince. You know how soft they are? Exactly how soft you imagine. Everything is priced 50 to 80% less than what you'd find at similar brands. Quince works directly with ethical factories and cuts out the metal men so you're getting premium materials without the markup. Refresh your everyday with luxury you'll actually use. Head to quince.com burbigs for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns now available in Canada too. Hello, Canadian listeners. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com Burbigs for free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com Burbiggs. For people who don't know what directing a movie is, like, what would you be your day. Day in the life? You know, those videos are like, I'm a. I am a film director. I wake up in the morning, I go to the set. Yeah, they asked me this question. They asked me this question, like, what's the day in the life of a film director for people who don't know.

[Jorma Taccone]

I mean, I think it depends on what your. What your process is. For me, I always like to do a shot list with my, like the. Either the night before or usually honestly weeks before I get into it. But like. But like with my dp, sit down, walk through the location with my dp. So this can either be. It's usually that I've done it in pre pro and then on the day of, I would redo our sort of our shot list in the morning with my dp, figure out the shot list. And then once I'm actually working with the actors, you block the scene. Once I've blocked the scene, then I go off screen. I do not pay attention to the shot list at that point because I'm actually watching the scene and then seeing what in addition, I sort of need. And like. And if camera angles aren't quite working the way we thought they were going to be once, like, people are on camera. So I'm always trying to find enhancements to the scenes, whether that's like, additional lines, whether that's a moment that could happen. So, you know, there's just moments that you always want to be nimble enough to me to like, get the shot list, know what you're doing, but then also potentially throw it out or move if something is. Is gonna need to change. And sometimes that's because the car is not working. Or that, like, you know, it's like, especially in indie film, there's. We didn't have a lot of money for things. Yeah. Like, our car wasn't skidding the way we needed to. We literally had to make. I had to call an audible on the day and be like, hey, I know we didn't prep for this, but can you get hit by a car that tore a stuntman and then he had to get hit by a car like seven times. We weren't gonna do it. Like that. But it's like, we.

[Mike Birbiglia]

What do you mean you were gonna. Can you get hit by a car?

[Jorma Taccone]

Well, we were gonna do this thing in plate shots where you get this. Then you get another pass. Then you get another pass and you comp it all together so that your actors aren't in danger.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Right, right.

[Jorma Taccone]

But then our car is, like, falling apart, and it can't do the skid and did us. You have to, like, make audibles and be like, hey, can you get hit by a car now? I mean, this is what they don't

[Mike Birbiglia]

tell you before you make a movie is stuntmen, they do the thing.

[Jorma Taccone]

They do the thing.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Like they. If they get hit by a car, they get hit by a car. There's. I.

[Jorma Taccone]

Did I tell you this right when like. Like, I probably told it on our podcast, but the. When we were doing Hot Rod, there's a. There was a scene where it's a montage of Andy's character, Rod, getting hit by different, like, he was, like, doing stunt, like. Like tests. So at one point, Danny McBride's character is driving this shitty van with a mattress on the front of it. And just. And you find, like, Andy's character, he comes out from behind the trees wearing these, like, big, stupid. Another little weird mattress wrapped around himself. And then he just gets hit by this car. And you're like, this is what they're doing to, like, prep. This is like. It's incredibly stupid. But they, for whatever reason, allowed me to be in the car with. With a stuntman because. Because I'm supposed to be, like, the videographer of the crew. So I'm literally filming this thing happening where we're just going to hit a guy. And so I'm sitting next to the stuntman and we're just waiting to, like, drive into a human. And then the guy leans over to me and he's like, don't tell anyone, but he broke his ankle earlier. Earlier today, because we. We had done another set, because when you're a stuntman, you get paid per. Per death defying fee.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Oh, my God.

[Jorma Taccone]

So the other stunt that the guy who we were about to hit had done was that he's going down the hill on this, like, skateboard thing and then, like, smashes into this Winnebago. And when he did the stunt, he broke his ankle, and so he wrapped it up like, these guys are just so badass that, like. And I was like, wait, what? We're gonna hit him? And he's like, yeah, yeah. But he gets fifteen hundred dollars A pop. So, like, don't tell anyone. I was like, oh, no, I won't, man. I won't.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Oh, my God. No.

[Jorma Taccone]

So they're. But they're so. They're so rugged.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Oh, my God.

[Jorma Taccone]

What the. Like. Yeah. And then the same thing. This guy was like, yeah, sure. And then he got hit by the car.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Like, hit by the car.

[Jorma Taccone]

Well, because, you know, we hadn't really planned it, so we had to roll off in a certain type of way and land in a kind of this position. It was. And it's based on my blocking. I need him to. We'd already done the blocking, so he needs to land.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Oh, my God.

[Jorma Taccone]

Close enough to the blocking. I mean, it's brutal. It's. It's like. Like. I mean, like, to those stuntmen.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Stuntman. Stunt women. Unbelievable. The stuntman on Sleepwalk with me jumped through a plate glass window in a stage and.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yeah.

[Mike Birbiglia]

You know, in my outfit or whatever. And I was just like. So when you do that, are you. Are you. You. You're not gonna get injured because this. And you're not actually doing it. They're like, no, no, we do it. Yeah, we are doing it. Yeah. And we get injured.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yeah.

[Mike Birbiglia]

All right.

[Jorma Taccone]

We. I. There's a stunt on when we were doing Pop Star where, you know, my character is a dj. I have this ridiculous helmet on. I can't see anything. And then the joke we wanted to do was, like, Andy's character is naked on stage, and I'm rushing to help him, and I fall downstairs. And it tends to always be my direction is like, can you do it more painfully? Like, it's like. The funny thing is when it looks like it's wrong. And so that usually involves, like, your legs coming out in a weird way, the helmet going first, the falling downstairs in a way that, like, looks painful. Because painful is fucking funny.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah, I know. What's the thing that you most commonly say as a direction when you're directing?

[Jorma Taccone]

I will tell you what. What? I say when things are going well, and I'm excited that things are going well. When I say something sucks.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah.

[Jorma Taccone]

I usually mean that. I really like it.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah.

[Jorma Taccone]

Like, either that's so lame or that sucks. And it's hard when you're just getting to know a crew, because one of the weird. One of the weird things about this job is that you're constantly. It's like starting a new camp every time.

[Mike Birbiglia]

That's right.

[Jorma Taccone]

You do a production.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah.

[Jorma Taccone]

And so you have to be like, oh, by the way, when I'm like, oh, my God, that sucks.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Right?

[Jorma Taccone]

I usually mean it as, like. I think it's, you know, and that maybe is that when it's like an awkward moment or it's like a really stupid moment or, you know, like. But I love that. I love when something is sucky, I guess.

[Mike Birbiglia]

No, totally.

[Jorma Taccone]

I didn't really answer your question, though. Like, what do I most often say on set?

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah.

[Jorma Taccone]

My wife has started to say something before shield's action occasionally, which was, here we go, baseball.

[Mike Birbiglia]

I like that.

[Jorma Taccone]

And I've started to say that I love that because I go baseball.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah.

[Jorma Taccone]

And action.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Here we go, baseball. Yeah. If there were a Jorma Tacone Film University, what would be five films in the curriculum?

[Jorma Taccone]

Oh, God. I think my favorite films would be. I would say Goonies.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah.

[Jorma Taccone]

Die Hard, Pee Wee's Big Adventure, Shawshank Redemption and the Ice Storm. Real variety there.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Those are good ones.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yeah.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah. I love all five of those.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yeah, all those are ones that I would watch multiple times. I think that there's. I do really appreciate when of any film or any filmmaker is trying to make something that has a repeatable watch factor.

[Mike Birbiglia]

I completely agree to it.

[Jorma Taccone]

And it's hard to do.

[Mike Birbiglia]

What do you think the key to rewatch ability is? Like, those five movies are a great example of. Yeah, I've probably seen all five of those multiple times. It's like, what about those five movies makes them rewatchable?

[Jorma Taccone]

Well, they all kind of have different really appealing aspects to them. I think Pee Wee being like the road trip movie, like, you know, like the point A to point B vibe of just like, the journey thing is really fun. And then there's just fucking amazing jokes in it. And I love the character, obviously, Die Hard. I think there's like a. The claustrophobia thing. I think there's almost like a thing ingrained on us from, like, being little kids of like, I'm trapped in the thing and the guy's gonna get me. Yeah, there's a lot of that in action movies. Like, when you start around with making action stuff, you're like, this is like being five years old, where you're like, right. The guy comes up and then there's lasers. You can't get there. You're like, oh, my God. This is like playing, like, what you did when you're.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah.

[Jorma Taccone]

Five years old. Shawshank. I think that there's something about movies that go, like, have. Have a multiple year thing that, like, that, like, that feel. They just feel really satisfying. You're like, you're watching a lifetime, right.

[Mike Birbiglia]

You're watching someone's life.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yeah. Like, transpire. The ice storm, I think, has also this, like, cozy sadness to it. So there's like, a romance to it.

[Mike Birbiglia]

I think part of it sometimes is the photography, sometimes the photography itself. You're like, oh, this is. This is a painting. It's a series of paintings.

[Jorma Taccone]

Goonies. To me, I think it's really hard to make a movie that is respectful to kids. Like, doesn't feel like it's talking down to kids. There's like, death and dead bodies in that movie. The first line of Goonies, I think, is Chunk, like, getting his pizza on the window and going, shit. And like, the moment. Moment. You hear that as a kid, you're like, they're not lying to me. This is incredible.

[Mike Birbiglia]

This is kids.

[Jorma Taccone]

Like, this is like us. Yeah, I had that.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Recently. It went back. I've been going back to, like, movies that I watched as a teenager when I fell in love with movies and being like, what? How do I see this now? It's like I went back to say anything. Oh, Cameron Crow.

[Jorma Taccone]

I referenced the end of that movie all the time.

[Mike Birbiglia]

It's just such a classic because.

[Jorma Taccone]

Because the end in that movie and. And that's. That was what I was actually referencing for. For over your dead body. Because there's a feeling that you get the end of say anything just to ruin it for those of you.

[Mike Birbiglia]

You're good.

[Jorma Taccone]

You're good. It's about a relationship you like. It's like. It's not like it's Romeo and Juliet, but it's like a relationship that you don't know if it's going to work between these two people. And at the very end of the movie, they're on a plane together and she says, like. Like she's nervous to take the plane flight. And he says, like, it's going to be okay. The minute that seatbelt sign goes off, it's going to be okay. And you're looking at the seatbelt sign and you're looking at the seatbelt sign, and then it cuts the black and it goes ding. And you're like, they're gonna be okay. They're gonna be okay forever into infinity. I don't know what's gonna happen, but I trust that. And there's something. So I get, like, chills being like, oh, fuck, that's amazing.

[Mike Birbiglia]

I like the five films on your syllabus. Those are good.

[Jorma Taccone]

What are yours? Or is it not about you right now?

[Mike Birbiglia]

It's not about me.

[Jorma Taccone]

Fuck.

[Mike Birbiglia]

For another Day.

[Jorma Taccone]

Fuck, I wish they were all your films. Sleepwalk with me don't think twice. Where are the other posters?

[Mike Birbiglia]

That's it. That's it.

[Jorma Taccone]

Oh yeah. Well, I mean, until soon.

[Mike Birbiglia]

This is pretty much. I know, I know, I know. It's exciting. It's also just like scary.

[Jorma Taccone]

Oh God. Terrifying.

[Mike Birbiglia]

It's more work than you could ever wish upon anyone.

[Jorma Taccone]

Which stage of the process do you hate the most?

[Mike Birbiglia]

Because production I love.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yeah.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Filming I love.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yes.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Pre production is really hard.

[Jorma Taccone]

Like it's just a not.

[Mike Birbiglia]

You're on anything, you're on location, you're doing shot lists, you're figuring out what everything is. And then everything falls apart in front of your eyes. They'll go like, we're actually. We lost this location. We lost this actor. This person dropped out. You don't have a customer anymore. And it's just like, you're like, okay, yeah. So. Well, that's how you act.

[Jorma Taccone]

That's how you act.

[Mike Birbiglia]

That's how you act. But it's me doing you as a movie falls apart. No, but it really is like, unless. Unless, look. Unless you're making a 200 million dollar movie. Yeah. Which we neither of us have done. But like, I don't know. When you're making a low budget movie, every day seems like a crisis.

[Jorma Taccone]

Crisis. And like there's never enough money time ever, ever, ever, ever. Yeah. No, it's brutal even.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah. Even to me it's even big filmmakers we know who have. Who feel this way.

[Jorma Taccone]

Oh yeah. When, when we were shooting Land of which I received a Razzie nomination for my, my role as Chaka. That was pretty funny.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Okay, okay.

[Jorma Taccone]

But like, but you know, that's a hundred million plus dollar movie.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Wow.

[Jorma Taccone]

They had sets that were three million dollars. Like did like. And, and then I'd watch Brad Silverling, who directed the movie, like very good friend of mine, like now and. And he, he would get two takes. I'd watch him get like two fucking takes.

[Mike Birbiglia]

That's wild.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yeah, you're like, this is like indie film. It's not even like indie film. Indie. You still probably get four. I mean it's like, it's. But you like skin tight suits, that's passing out and like you're like, yeah, it's all just crazy. Like so it's crazy because it's like

[Mike Birbiglia]

they, you know, you talk about like, like how do you train to be an actor? How do you train to be a director? All these things. And it's like a lot of it is you're saying like, you're on this $100 million movie, Land of the Lost, and it's like you get two takes and like, that's the training of the actor. The actor. The training of the actor is you do it so many years, so many times that when there's two takes, both takes are usable.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yeah, yeah. And it's like. And as a director and you've. I'm sure you've had this, because I've done this many times before and I feel so bad about it. But when you have a ringer, like somebody who you're like, oh, I know this is all going to be gold, and I shoot that person last because I'm just like, spending the time that I need to spend with other people or whatever. And then, you know, one take. You got a one take Tony on there. And you're like, holy. Like, you'll just watch somebody who's like, thank you. Yeah. Like, it's like. Like Kristen Wiig. Is that like Will Forte's like, we're just like. We were so on time for, like, the. The both of my grouper movie and the. The TV show, but there was like, takes where it's. It's raining, the set audio is bad. Like, it's in between, like a thunderstorm, lightning strikes always, like, make you, like, all the flags have to come out, down everything. And wig is like, knocking it out of the park. You're just like, I wouldn't be able to do this without. Wow. Like, just unreal.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah. I'm going to go to slow round. Who are you jealous of?

[Jorma Taccone]

Who am I jealous of? God.

[Mike Birbiglia]

And then who. Who are you jealous of that you thought of but didn't say?

[Jorma Taccone]

If I'm being completely honest, I think that a difficulty that I have with the industry in general is that the whole thing makes you kind of jealous.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Oh, interesting.

[Jorma Taccone]

You know, I mean, like, it's like. And it's. It's part of the reason I think I live in New York too, so I can be slightly removed from it. I like making what I like. I'm really proud of what I like. But it's also like, whenever I go to la, it's like a million fucking billboards of, like, everybody making shit. And we're really lucky. I'm happy for everybody. But it also makes you be like, am I doing the right thing? Do I know what I'm doing? I don't know. And I don't want to really have that feeling. I want to just sort of be, you know, like, make what I like and so I don't know. Do you feel like that or. No. Are you just kind of.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah. I mean, I was thinking about you when we were prepping these questions yesterday, and I was like. I was like, you're one of the nicest people I've ever encountered, period. But also just in show business, I'm like. And I was like, I don't know if it's a question, but it's like, do you ever feel like being nice holds you back in show business,

[Jorma Taccone]

or

[Mike Birbiglia]

does it help you?

[Jorma Taccone]

I think that it helps you when you get the job. You know what I mean? Like, it may not help you get the job, but, like. But after you. After you have the job, like, working with Juliette Lewis was fucking amazing on this movie. Like, she's a legend.

[Mike Birbiglia]

She's great.

[Jorma Taccone]

She's worked with every fucking huge director ever. And the fact that she was like, let's make another one. I was like, that's the biggest compliment I could ever get. Is that, like, I'm nice enough and also potentially good enough at my job to warrant somebody like that.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah.

[Jorma Taccone]

To want to work with me again.

[Mike Birbiglia]

It's true what you're saying. Like, I think when. If you're an actor or. Or a cinematographer or a designer and you hear jormaticones making a movie, I think the niceness factor actually does push

[Jorma Taccone]

you towards it, maybe.

[Mike Birbiglia]

I think because you're like.

[Jorma Taccone]

It's like.

[Mike Birbiglia]

It's like saying, like, he's nice. It's not going to be a nightmare. He's not going to yell at me.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yeah, you're like, that plus shooting in Hawaii, you know? Yeah, those two things.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah. Pretty good. Finland. It's like, Finland was Finland.

[Jorma Taccone]

It was great. It was like a destination wedding.

[Mike Birbiglia]

No, totally.

[Jorma Taccone]

It was rad.

[Mike Birbiglia]

It's got to be pretty. Oh, gorgeous there, right?

[Jorma Taccone]

Well, the choice. The choices were between that and no shade, but it was Winnipeg. And just seeing the pictures of Winnipeg, I was like, oh, God.

[Mike Birbiglia]

It's like, is it Finland for Hudson Valley?

[Jorma Taccone]

Yes. So, by the way, driving from Helsinki to this. This little town. It's not a little town. It's like their second biggest city, which is Tampere. And. Thank you. Thank you. But as we're driving up, I was like, this looks like upstate New York. It has birch trees. That's the main difference.

[Mike Birbiglia]

I was totally tricked. Yeah, it was great. Has. Have you ever been punched in the face?

[Jorma Taccone]

Yes.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Who punched you?

[Jorma Taccone]

I got punched in. I've been punched many times in the face.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Really? Yeah.

[Jorma Taccone]

Oh, yeah.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Name 1. Name one first time I got punched

[Jorma Taccone]

in the face was by like not like a. My brother or whatever. Like you're not counting like, like wrestling with your brother and. Actually no, I got punched in sixth grade. I went to sort of a. It was kind of a rough middle school in Berkeley, California. It was, it was called Malcolm X and I, I was, for whatever reason it was after school and my. I was charged with keeping the classroom safe. Nobody was in it. And I was opening the door to talk to some of my friends and then this kid was trying to get into it, trying to like force his way into the. I don't know why he was trying to force his way into the class. And I was shutting the door and he punched me in the face. And this is the first time I got punched by like a stranger. I've had multiple fights with like friends of mine just like being mad and like punched like really? Yeah, my friend Mark Shotland and I like punch each other so many times in the face. Yeah. Over and over. Like teenagers.

[Mike Birbiglia]

As teenagers.

[Jorma Taccone]

We were. Yeah. 13 or whatever.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Wow.

[Jorma Taccone]

And my friend Toby, who I, you know, I love all these guys. Yeah. First guy, not so much.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah.

[Jorma Taccone]

Didn't like like him too much, but I've also like punched other people too, which I still feel bad about. Yeah. Can I tell you the one I'm the most proud of though? Yeah, sure. So I was, I was riding the bus to Sam to go to go to Malcolm X. I was riding 36 bus that Wolfer used to drive. And this kid Reza was always messing with people. He was an actual bullying.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Okay.

[Jorma Taccone]

And at one point he was sitting behind me and he put, he took off his shoe and put it on my head.

[Mike Birbiglia]

I like this story already.

[Jorma Taccone]

And I just turned around and clocked him right in the face.

[Mike Birbiglia]

No way.

[Jorma Taccone]

Like without thinking at all, just like turned around, punched him and then never got messed with again. So it's the prison that's the lesson. Yeah. You gotta stab a guy in the yard.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah, yeah. What

[Jorma Taccone]

you gotta shank Reza.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Why do we all know that? Why do we all know that?

[Jorma Taccone]

That is a fucking great question.

[Mike Birbiglia]

No, no. And that' by the way, that's like a premise. I've been doing a lot of premises lately on stage of what do we all know that we kind of know that actually could drop into that run of like why do we all know that's prison?

[Jorma Taccone]

But everybody uses like, you know, like, like first day, first day at camp, first day on a. Some film set. There's like, aren't there. Like people who have we heard stories about like on film sets like that somebody gets fired the first day because you're trying to like assert dominance. Basically. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I do that third day.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Oh, I keep on guessing.

[Jorma Taccone]

Just kidding. I've never fired any.

[Mike Birbiglia]

I should have fired some people. I didn't.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yes, that's correct. Like a flood of people went through my mind, like, why am I so nice?

[Mike Birbiglia]

Oh God.

[Jorma Taccone]

It is a hindrance.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Support for Working out comes from Shopify Shopify is the commerce platform behind millions of businesses around the world and 10% of all e commerce in the US get ready with your own design studio. With hundreds of ready to use templates, Shopify helps you build a beautiful online store that matches your brand's style. Get the word out like you have a marketing team behind you. Easily create email and social media campaigns wherever customers are scrolling and strolling. Best yet, Shopify is your commerce expert. With world class expertise in everything from managing inventory to international shipping to processing returns and beyond, Shopify helps you find your customers with easy to run email and social media campaigns. And what if I get stuck? Shopify is always around to share advice with their award winning 24. 7 customer support. Shopify is here to help you move confidently into the e commerce space. It's time to turn those what ifs into with Shopify today. Sign up for your $1 per month trial today at shopify.comwio go to shopify.comwio that's shopify.comwio support for working it out comes from Helix. I love my Helix mattress. I've had it for, wait a minute, six years. My sleep has improved since I've gotten Helix mattress. I never jump out of windows anymore. I love it. It's springtime. Time for spring cleaning. Time for a new mattress. Ooh, perfect for this ad. If you're a listener to this podcast, you know how much we love Helix mattresses. Everyone on staff here at Working it out has a Helix mattress. We are never going back. Helix makes award winning sleep products tested and reviewed by experts like Forbes and Wired. You can also rest easy with seamless returns and exchanges. The Happy with Helix guarantee offers a risk free customer first experience designed to ensure you're completely satisfied with your new mattress. Helix offers a 120 night sleep trial and limited lifetime warranty. 120 nights. Go to helixsleep.com burbigs for 27% off site wide exclusive for Working it out listeners. That's helixsleep.com burbigs for 27% off site wide support for working it out comes from Aura Frames. Mother's Day is right around the corner. Take it from me, an Aura frame is the perfect Mother's Day gift. Make Mother's Day special with Aura Frames. It's like a WI fi connected digital picture frame. Jenny and I have these at our apartment. We love them. Super easy to upload and share photos via the Aura app. And if you're giving Aura as a gift, you can even personalize the frame with preloaded photos and memories. It's just a really pleasant, super personal thing that it's a perfect gift because it's one of those things you wouldn't think to buy for yourself. Named number one by Wirecutter, you can save on the gifts moms love by visiting auraframes.com for a limited time listeners. You can get $25 off their best selling Carver mat frame with code WIO. That's a U R A frames.com promo code WIO for working it out. Support the show by mentioning us at checkout. We really appreciate it. Terms and conditions apply. Okay, I have material.

[Jorma Taccone]

Oh, good. Okay.

[Mike Birbiglia]

I feel like if you're lucky in life, you find a person who understands you the most in the world. And if you're really lucky, that person wants to spend any meaningful amount of time with you at all. That being said, about once a week, my wife will stare at me while I'm doing an activity and she'll sort of wince. And then she'll say, what are you doing? And I'll explain the activity. And then she'll start laughing. Not with me, at me. With no one. And I'll say, what are you laughing at? And she'll say, no reason. And that's the end of the conversation. That's the person who understands me the most. Yeah.

[Jorma Taccone]

But I think that at the end of that.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah.

[Jorma Taccone]

You actually feel even closer to her.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Oh, that's interesting.

[Jorma Taccone]

Based on that.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Oh, that's very interesting.

[Jorma Taccone]

Oh, you do get me. Oh, that's like she goes, gets you so in the entirety of you that she finds you ridiculous.

[Mike Birbiglia]

That's right.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yeah.

[Mike Birbiglia]

I think that's correct. And I think that that's probably where the bit should go.

[Jorma Taccone]

Okay. Sweet.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Probably.

[Jorma Taccone]

I'm glad we worked it out.

[Mike Birbiglia]

I broke my shoulder, like a decade ago. My shoulder. My arm was in a sling. And they sent me to a physical therapist. And I'm lying. I bring this up only because maybe you have a similar incident. I'm lying on this physical therapy table, man. And this Guy is doing stuff to my shoulder that made me think, this is definitely making it worse. And at a certain point I started to wonder if my arm was just going to fall off. And then I started to think, if my arm falls off and it's just hanging by the skin and the muscles and the tendons, what will I say to this man? And I came up with, well, it was on when I walked in.

[Jorma Taccone]

It is ridiculous how often while I was in wild pain or about to be in wild pain, how I was just trying to think of what that joke I was gonna say. Oh, that's interesting to the doctors. Yeah, yeah. Like, like, like at one point we kept. I have this thing on our podcast where I keep talking about how I'm trying to look like Jeremy Allen White, like from his Calvin Klein.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah, I can see that for sure.

[Jorma Taccone]

No, not anymore. Like, I can't. I. Oh, no, I don't see it now. I'm trying.

[Mike Birbiglia]

I used to see it.

[Jorma Taccone]

Well, now I'm trying to look like Jeremy Allen White's dad.

[Mike Birbiglia]

So.

[Jorma Taccone]

But, but, but one of the things, like, because me and my wife have a bet that I was in a year, I was gonna try to look like Jeremy Allen White from his Calvin Klein spread. Look it up. Talk about sex pot. Wow. And. But talk about what a sex pot.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Okay, sure.

[Jorma Taccone]

He's a sex pot.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah. Good looking guy.

[Jorma Taccone]

You can still say that, right? Yeah, I think so. Anyway, so don't distract me.

[Mike Birbiglia]

No, no, no.

[Jorma Taccone]

So when the doctor came in, I'm laid out. I'm getting. I got traction. So I'm getting a pin drilled through my femur. Two pins drilled through my femur. And we were. I was trying to have conversations with the doctor and the nurses, like just being like, can I still look like Jeremy Allen? It did make it confusing because then when I would like shriek in pain, they'd be like, oh, Jesus. He was like, two seconds ago you were like talking about Jeremy.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I literally said, I wrote, if my arm was falling off my body in physical therapy, I would definitely apologize to them.

[Jorma Taccone]

Oh, yeah.

[Mike Birbiglia]

You know what I mean? Because my default is always to apologize. Like, I'm so sorry. My arms on the floor. Usually it's attached to my body. Sorry. There's so much blood. Whenever I have a gaping wound, there's always a lot of blood.

[Jorma Taccone]

Excuse me.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah, yeah.

[Jorma Taccone]

Oh, yeah, that's great.

[Mike Birbiglia]

But I, I don't know, I think there's something there. And then, and then this was a true story is I would go to physical therapy. I went for years for my shoulder and when I would travel, I wouldn't. I couldn't get physical therapy, so I'd go for a sports massage. And I was in Texas and I went on Yelp and I found this place and I show up, I'm in an Uber and I. And. And I get at someone's house and I'm like, this can't be it. Like, there's no business here. And it. And I get it. I walk up and it's like this just guy's house. And I'm like, this could really go any which way. And he had me fill out a personal form and I intake form. He goes, don't worry, I'm not going to put this in the cloud. And I wanted to be like, I'm really not worried about the cloud. I trust the cloud so much more than I trust you. I'm worried about you on the ground. So I'm getting a massage from a gentleman at a home in Texas. And he says to me, I just started this job and I thought, oh, no. And he goes, I had another job for 20 years and I had to make a radical life change. And I thought, he's trying to bait me, right? Like, so I'll ask what the radical life change was. And so I said, what's the. What was the radical life change? And he goes, one day I found my wife with her head in the lap of a guy in a Taco Bell parking lot. And now I'm in.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yeah, well, yeah, yeah, now I am, too.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Now I'm like, this is no longer a massage in a Texan man's home. Now I'm in a Showtime miniseries. And I had a lot of questions. And the one I went with was, how did you know she was in a Taco Bell parking lot? And he said, there's an app on My phone called Life360 where you can track your family. And he goes, but listen, this is all true story. He goes, listen, the good news is. And I thought, this isn't going to be good news. He said, the good news is that she and I have talked about it and we may get back together in our golden years. And I didn't say this, but I thought, I'm not optimistic about that plan because it's just going to happen again, but at this time, it'll be in a cracker barrel because life comes at you fast. 360.

[Jorma Taccone]

I've been to many of those, by the way. I like, like, like a. It ends up being Someone's house.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Someone's house.

[Jorma Taccone]

Massage.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Massage at someone's house.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yeah. What are we doing? And then you're like, well, I. Like, I paid for this, so, like, I guess I have to do it. But, like, I'm not, like, psyched on it.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Sometimes you're in a situation, this will hurt this person's feelings if I leave here.

[Jorma Taccone]

I. I was once riding in a cab. We were going down the west side highway, and the dude was going, like, like, 100 miles an hour.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah.

[Jorma Taccone]

Like, just like, we're gonna die.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Yeah.

[Jorma Taccone]

And my solution to it was to close my eyes so that. So that when the accident happened, I would be relaxed. I was like, I think I could survive more rather than just be like, hey, don't kill us. You know, just like, I'm just gonna relax and hopefully not die.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Like, two New Year's Eves ago, Jen and I got a yellow With Oona. Got a yellow cab, and it was like, oh, we're gonna die.

[Jorma Taccone]

This is.

[Mike Birbiglia]

This is like, he's veering this way. There's cars beeping. Like, it's just like, this person's not well.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yeah.

[Mike Birbiglia]

And I think it's because of Una being there.

[Jorma Taccone]

Oh, yeah.

[Mike Birbiglia]

That we were like, we're gonna go. Actually, we're gonna get out at 71st. Yeah, we just remembered.

[Jorma Taccone]

We forgot. But you also just didn't tell him to slow down. You were like, we gotta get out of here.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Well, no, you can't tell a man how to do his job.

[Jorma Taccone]

Well, Mari, occasionally, and I think this is a good hack. Is to be like, sir, I'm pregnant. Can you just please hold on? Because I'm gonna get nauseous.

[Mike Birbiglia]

I'm pregnant's good. Sometimes it'll be like, I'm gonna throw up.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yeah, that's a good one.

[Mike Birbiglia]

As long as they know their skin in the game.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yeah. Throwing up is like. Nobody wants that.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Nobody wants to know you throw up in the car.

[Jorma Taccone]

Yeah. Right in with your suggestions on how to.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Wow. You're such a good podcast person.

[Jorma Taccone]

We talk a lot about the interaction between our. Our listeners.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Do you have any tips for supplements? Because that's a big audience.

[Jorma Taccone]

Your. Your audience talks about supplements.

[Mike Birbiglia]

I'm kidding.

[Jorma Taccone]

Okay. I was really excited if you had, like, Verbiglia supplements. You should totally do that.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Oh, God.

[Jorma Taccone]

Get swole for bigs.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Bur.

[Jorma Taccone]

Big it up. And then you just typing. Oh, yeah. Oh, the third act is way better. Now

[Mike Birbiglia]

this.

[Jorma Taccone]

That's my impression of Mike. Mike. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, that's. So all the threads Come back in the end. Oh, this kicks ass. Done. You break a lot of laptops. Done with that one. That would be so rad. Every time you're done.

[Mike Birbiglia]

This game, this babe.

[Jorma Taccone]

You wanna have sex, don't look. This one is so fucking personal. Oh, make a bunch of people cry on this one. Fuck yeah. Broadway here we come.

[Mike Birbiglia]

The last thing we do is working at for a cause. Is there a nonprofit? I know you contribute to a lot of nonprofits. Is there one you want to highlight? We will contribute to them them and link to them in the show notes.

[Jorma Taccone]

The Berkeley Unified School District is the one I would like to hold on.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Donate money to berkeley public schools fund.org Equitable Public Schools for the well being of Berkeley. We're going to contribute to them. We're going to link to them in the show notes. Thank you. Great movie. Thank you Mike Banger.

[Jorma Taccone]

Thank you.

[Mike Birbiglia]

Working it out because it's not done. Working it out because there's no that's gonna do it. For another episode of Working it Out, you can follow my buddy Jorma on Instagram at yourmaticone. His movie over your dead Body is in theaters now. Super funny. Check out his podcast, which is called the Lonely island and Seth Meyers podcast where they break down all the Lonely island sketches. As a matter of fact, last time he was on the podcast. If you want to go back and listen to the first time Yarmo was on, we literally just break apart a bunch of Lonely island sketches and then they stole the idea and made it its own podcast. I don't begrudge them that parallel thinking. They deconstruct their own sketches and in my version, I guess I'm asking him. Anyway, they didn't steal it, but there's a lot of parallel thinking. Check out birdbags.com decided for the mailing list to be the first to know about my upcoming shows. The full video of this episode's on YouTube. Just search Mike Birbiglia and subscribe. We're posting more and more videos. Our producers of Working it out are myself along with Peter Salamone, Joseph Birbiglia, Mabel Lewis and Gary Simon. Sound mix by Ben Cruz Supervising engineer Kate Belinski. Special thanks to Jack Antonoff and Bleachers for their music. I believe they have three new songs out now from their forthcoming album. I love the new songs. There's one called the Van that just came out. Fantastic. Follow Jack on Instagram. Special thanks to my wife, the poet J. Hope Stein and our daughter Una, who built the original radio fort made of pillows. That made this all happen and made this crystal clear sound. Thanks most of all to you who are listening. If you enjoy the show, rate us and review us on Apple podcasts. It really does help. Tell your friends. Tell your enemies. Tell the paramedics who are rescuing you after you fell off a ladder. I hope you don't fall off a ladder, but if you do as they're giving you painkillers in the ambulance on the way to the hospital, you can say, hey EMTs, does this ambulance have Apple carplay? Before I fell off the ladder, I was listening to Mike Birbiglia. It's working out. It's a podcast where Mike Birbiglia talks about the creative process with other comedians and filmmakers. I'd love to finish this episode before we get to the emergency room. Thanks everybody. We're working it out. We'll see you next time.