How to Balance Being a Mom and Taking Care of Your Mental Health

Summary

Podcast Summary: Mind If We Talk? Episode: How to Balance Being a Mom and Taking Care of Your Mental Health
Host: BetterHelp (Hosted by Licensed Therapist Hesi Jo)
Release Date: August 14, 2025

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Introduction

In the episode titled "How to Balance Being a Mom and Taking Care of Your Mental Health," BetterHelp delves deep into the challenges faced by mothers in maintaining their mental well-being while navigating the demanding role of parenthood. Hosted by licensed therapist Hesi Jo, the conversation features Kristin Gallant and Dina Margolin, co-founders of Big Little Feelings, a parenting advice platform. The episode offers raw, relatable insights into mental health struggles such as postpartum anxiety, ADHD, and autism, providing practical strategies for mothers seeking balance and support.

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Personal Journeys and the Reality of Postpartum Mental Health

Kristin Gallant and Dina Margolin openly share their personal experiences with postpartum mental health challenges, setting the stage for a heartfelt discussion.

• Kristin's Struggle with Postpartum Anxiety:

  • Kristin Gallant reflects on her first two pregnancies, stating, “I had postpartum anxiety with my first two, and I didn't think I was debriefed enough on what that really looked like” (04:55). She describes experiencing intense fear, such as visualizing her baby dying, which led her to seek therapy and eventually undergo EMDR—a breakthrough that significantly improved her mental health.
  • Kristin emphasizes the importance of early intervention: “My only regret was not starting sooner. ... it wasn't negotiable” (10:59).

• Dina's Experience with Postpartum Depression and ADHD:

  • Cameron Oakes Rogers shares her postpartum struggles, highlighting the physical exhaustion and strain on her marriage. She recounts how the imbalance in childcare responsibilities led to years of therapy and growth within her relationship (06:14).
  • Dina adds, “I was completely underwater and really resentful” (06:14), illustrating the profound impact of postpartum challenges on personal relationships.

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The Role of Medication in Mental Health Management

The conversation addresses the stigma and hesitations surrounding medication for mental health, particularly for postpartum mothers.

• Kristin on Starting SSRIs:

  • Kristin candidly discusses her decision to start an SSRI, stating, “I should have started sooner” (10:59). She acknowledges common fears such as weight gain and emotional numbness but underscores the necessity of medication in her recovery.
  • She shares, “This medication has been a game changer for me” (16:03), highlighting the positive impact it had on her ability to manage anxiety and engage more fully with her family.

• Dina on Medication and Therapeutic Tools:

  • Dina emphasizes that medication doesn’t eliminate trauma but helps regulate emotions, enabling the use of therapeutic tools effectively: “These meds don't make your trauma disappear, but they allow you to be regulated enough” (17:29).
  • She also discusses the importance of a supportive care team, recommending having a therapist and prescriber in place before entering the postpartum period (44:25).

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Navigating Neurodivergence in Motherhood

Dina Margolin shares her journey as a neurodivergent mother diagnosed with ADHD and autism later in life, offering valuable insights into how these conditions intersect with parenting.

• Impact of Late Diagnosis:

  • Dina explains how her diagnoses provided clarity and self-awareness: “It's been a game changer for me in so many ways” (18:59). Understanding her neurodivergence helped her embrace her unique challenges instead of feeling inadequate.
  • She describes managing sensory overwhelm: “I simply can't do battery-operated toys” (26:43), illustrating practical adjustments made to create a supportive environment for herself and her children.

• Parenting Strategies for Neurodivergent Moms:

  • Dina highlights the importance of structured routines and recognizing personal triggers: “Having systems in place to know when you're overwhelmed” (38:37).
  • She discusses teaching her children about her ADHD in age-appropriate ways, fostering mutual understanding and empathy: “We're allowed to have feelings” (41:35).

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Building Support Systems and Effective Communication

A key theme of the episode is the necessity of robust support systems and open communication between partners.

• Kristin and Dina's Partnership:

  • The duo discusses how their long-term friendship and complementary strengths have been pivotal in their business and personal lives: “We are complete opposite people, actually, and we have always embraced that about each other” (27:05).
  • They emphasize the importance of showing up authentically and respecting each other's unique needs within both their relationship and parenting roles.

• Strategies for Partners:

  • Dina advises partners to take on as many physical tasks as possible postpartum and maintain open dialogues about emotions: “How can we prioritize Joy? Just paying attention to your partner” (57:28).
  • She recommends practical tools like Eve Rodsky's "Fair Play" method to divide mental and physical labor effectively (47:26).

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Practical Tips for Mothers

The episode concludes with actionable advice for mothers seeking to balance their mental health and parenting responsibilities.

• Personal Care and Self-Awareness:

  • Dina offers three key actions for overwhelmed mothers:
    1. Remember It's Temporary: “It's all temporary. None of this is permanent” (59:03).
    2. Engage in Enjoyable Activities: Even brief moments for self-care can make a significant difference.
    3. Ask for Help: Dina stresses the importance of not walking the path alone and reaching out to friends, family, or professionals for support (30:29).

• Creating Community Support:

  • Kristin shares her viral text message to a friend as a model for offering support without imposing: “I'm coming to help you” (52:14). This approach allows new mothers to choose the type of support they need without feeling pressured.

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Conclusion

"How to Balance Being a Mom and Taking Care of Your Mental Health" serves as a compassionate guide for mothers navigating the intricate balance between parenting and personal well-being. Through heartfelt personal stories, expert insights, and practical advice, Hesi Jo, Kristin Gallant, and Dina Margolin illuminate the path toward a healthier, more balanced motherhood. The episode underscores the importance of self-awareness, support systems, and open communication in fostering both maternal and familial well-being.

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Notable Quotes:

• Kristin Gallant (04:55): “I had postpartum anxiety with my first two, and I didn't think I was debriefed enough on what that really looked like.”
• Dina Margolin (38:37): “I simply can't do battery-operated toys.”
• Kristin Gallant (10:59): “My only regret was not starting sooner.”
• Dina Margolin (59:03): “It's all temporary. None of this is permanent.”

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For more insights and support on balancing motherhood and mental health, visit BetterHelp.

Transcript

[Hesi Jo]

This episode contains mentions of suicide. Please take caution while listening.

[Kristin Gallant]

I think there were a lot of child therapy resources out there, but they all made me feel terrible about myself. It was really clinical, it was really high level and I was the mom who was just like crying in the shower after a long hard day with a 3 year old and a 1 year old.

[Dina Margolin]

How do I stop overthinking?

[Hesi Jo]

How do I be happy again?

[Dina Margolin]

How can I overcome imposter syndrome?

[Hesi Jo]

How can I keep myself from freaking out at the news?

[Kristin Gallant]

How can I deal with feeling lonely?

[Cameron Oakes Rogers]

How can I cope with this grief?

[Dina Margolin]

How do I stop feeling like I'm failing at parenting?

[Hesi Jo]

Welcome back to Mind if We Talk where you get to be a fly on the wall for mini therapy sessions and learn some mental health tips in the process. I'm your host Hesi Jo. I'm a licensed therapist with over 10 years of experience providing individual and family therapy. This week's question how do I balance being a mom and taking care of my mental health? You can prepare all you want for parenthood, but it still has a way of humbling you. As a therapist. I see this all the time. Parents who are exhausted and blaming themselves, moms who think they're failing when really they're just unsupported. And for neurodivergent moms, parenting can feel like moving through a world that simply wasn't built for your brain. Research shows that around 61% of women with ADHD receive their diagnosis as adults, often after becoming mothers, when the demands of caregiving overwhelm the coping strategies they've relied on for years. That late diagnosis can bring clarity, but also grief. Grief for the years spent masking, overcompensating or wondering why it all felt harder than it should add in common mental health challenges of early motherhood, things like postpartum anxiety and depression. And that weight only deepens. And yet there's pressure to push through to address mental health challenges via meditation, movement, deep breaths. And while those things can help, sometimes they aren't enough on their own. In today's episode, we'll talk about what to do when it all feels like too much. You'll learn practical ways to prepare for the postpartum period, how to build systems that support your reality, and what it looks like to truly share the load with a partner. To start, I sat down with Dina Margolin and Kristin Gallant, moms longtime best friends and co founders of Big Little Feelings, a parenting advice platform and community. In our conversation, they open up about their own mental health journeys, what it's like to parent while navigating adhd, postpartum anxiety and autism and the pressure to always keep it together. We talk about what it means to show up for your kids when you're still learning how to show up for yourself. Let's get into it. So to start us off, for people that may not be familiar with Big Little Feelings would love to hear a bit more about what that is.

[Cameron Oakes Rogers]

I'll kick us off.

[Kristin Gallant]

So.

[Cameron Oakes Rogers]

So Big Little Feelings is really this community appearance where we are here to give you tips. We're here to support you after a long, hard day. We're here to cheer you on. And honestly, this whole thing just started from something that Kristen and I both felt was missing, that we as moms just needed. We've been best friends since we were 14, so we been besties forever. I had a full clinical practice in Los Angeles where I was seeing tons of families, and Kristen was in the thick of toddlerhood. She had two toddlers at the time.

[Kristin Gallant]

I think there were a lot of child therapy resources out there, but they all, for me, made me feel terrible about myself. It was really clinical, it was really high level. And I was the mom who was just like crying in the shower after a long, hard day with a three year old and a one year old. And I wanted to create this based community that was actually made for parents talking to real parents in real ways. Like, we mess up. How do we do this when we're this busy? And we wanted to really combine the two. So how do you take clinical science backed, you know, strategies and how do we make it realistic and approachable for real parents like me? That's not going to make you feel bad about yourself. And so it was really just an organic need. And it just took off. It really took off quickly because I think there was nothing like it.

[Hesi Jo]

Kristen, I understand you have three kids. Dina, I understand you have a third on the way very, very soon. And I, I wanted to hear more about your experiences specifically with that postpartum period. What that time of life was like for you. Were there things you wish the people in your life understood a little bit better about you about that time?

[Kristin Gallant]

Oh, girl. Postpartum? Um, yeah, sure. I had postpartum anxiety with my first two, and I don't think I was debriefed enough on what that really looked like. I think I was looking out for the baby blues that were more than just the baby blues. I think we were screened a little bit more for, you know, postpartum depression. And I just did not realize that sort of my very strong need for control, my visualizing, you know, my baby dying over and over, being terrified she was going to die in her sleep. I didn't have a word for that. It didn't. It wasn't that commonplace at the time. And it was only through, luckily, going to therapy I did emdr. And it just. It was such a game changer. Um, but that was my postpartum experience with my first two. And then not having postpartum anxiety with my third was like, oh, my. Is this what it's like when you don't have postpartum anxiety? You know, I remember he got one of the worst things you can possibly get at six weeks old and his little baby is struggling to breathe. And I handled it. You know, I was just handling it. And I remember that being a moment of like, wow, this is really different. If my first two even, you know, coughed, I was going to the emergency room and. And spiraling. And I just didn't have a name for it then.

[Cameron Oakes Rogers]

Yeah. I also found postpartum really hard in a few different ways, actually, when I reflect back on my first two experiences. And I had two kids back to back. My kids are 16 months apart. So by the time I was six and a half months postpartum with my first, I was already pregnant again with my first one. Especially as a new mom, I felt like people made jokes about never sleeping again, and people made jokes about wearing diapers. But when you're really in it and your body has just gone through so much trauma getting this baby out and having to recover, that's the part I feel like I really had no warning for and just not enough preparation. Like, I was so physically exhausted. Like, how am I ever going to recover if I'm not sleeping and I'm in so much pain these first few weeks? Like, how does someone recover? It just felt mind blowing to me that we don't talk about this part enough. Like, I just didn't feel prepared. I felt pretty blindsided by that. And I think the other big struggle for me postpartum was really with my marriage, honestly. You know, my husband and I love each other so much. We went into parenthood just with, like, hopes and good vibes and, like, we love each other, we're a team. We're gonna figure this out. And what ended up happening was a lot of the childcare, the home stuff fell on my shoulders while I was working. And before I knew it, I was just completely underwater and really resentful. And it took, honestly, years of Therapy of learning new tools, new ways to communicate, and a lot of unhappy times before we finally grew and figured out how to be a team together in this brand new life of being parents.

[Hesi Jo]

And I'm hearing a lot of work has gone into this, a lot of recalibrating, a lot of syncing up with my partner, with my family. And Dean, I'm wondering, how are you thinking about managing your postpartum period this time around, knowing what you know now and the people around you knowing a little bit more hopefully too.

[Cameron Oakes Rogers]

I'm about to be right back in it in about three weeks from now, which is wild to think about, but I really think my husband and I are almost like different versions of ourself now. It feels like a completely different marriage, almost that we're in compared to the last time we did this. And frankly, you know, an important piece of my puzzle was I'm a therapist. I've gone to therapy. I know lots of tools. I obsessively read about this stuff like it's my whole world. And yet my husband just hadn't gone to therapy and we were at completely different places. Step number one was him starting his own therapy so that by the time we got to couples therapy, he had insights about himself. He understood how to notice and name his own emotions. And then in couples therapy, it took me a while, honestly, to get both of my feet back in the relationship because for a while there, I was so hurt. I was so angry that I had one foot out the door. And you can't really grow together without being fully back in. And I think the biggest thing that we have now going into this postpartum period is this brand new understanding that for our marriage to really succeed and work, we have to show up as a hundred percent ourselves each. And I think really we've created these systems where he's going to take care of himself. I know what my priorities and my needs are, and I'm going to make sure that those get taken care of. And now we know how to do it as a team.

[Hesi Jo]

Thank you, Dina. It sounds like it's really important for both of you or both parents in any relationship to make sure they're taking care of themselves so they can show up as the best versions of themselves, not just as parents, but partners to each other. Before turning to Kristen, I just want to pause here to let listeners know that the conversation we're about to get into does include a personal story about starting medication. It's not medical advice if you're considering medication. It's Best to talk to a licensed professional. Now, Kristen, you've been transparent about starting to take anti anxiety medication. I was just wondering about your journey, starting to take an ssri. What else ultimately led to that point? How do you feel about that decision? Looking back on it now?

[Kristin Gallant]

Looking back, my only regret was not starting sooner. The problem is when you have anxiety, you are afraid of everything and, and you can't see it because it's true anxiety. And so I was terrified that this medication was going to cause, you know, all of those symptoms that might be the worst case scenario. There's all the things like, you're gonna gain weight, you're never gonna sleep again. It's scary. Especially if you've never done it before. It takes four to six weeks to even see improvement. And that's probably the hardest part. And for me, it got to a point where it wasn't negotiable. And I so wish that I would have started it before it got to a point where many of us get to where we are backed against a wall. And I remember talking to my psychiatrist and just sobbing. It was somewhere I. My dad died of suicide. And so the moment that something got to a darker or a little bit, a place that I've never been before, luckily I had the wherewithal to know. Okay, red flag. Call the psychiatrist today. Which is good. I think sometimes people can let that linger and that it becomes the new normal. So I'm very grateful that the moment something became like, whoa, this is not me. It was, call the psychiatrist and try anything I can try. Because you have to be able to show up for your family, you have to be able to show up for your kids, you have to be able to show up for yourself. And my God, within four to six weeks, it was. I just, I should have come out of the womb on Lexapro. I just remember being like, this is what everyone feels like they can handle a setback or something that's a little bit scary or gone awry, and you kind of bounce back from it. I couldn't believe it. I'm telling you, even the smallest, simplest things, like my child's, let's say, sleep routine, when you have debilitating anxiety, it can sort of take over. So the difference in perhaps the last four to five hours of my entire day, repeatedly. Okay, and then this time, and then that this time, and then that this time and then this time to simply enjoying it or one moment that comes to my mind is shortly after I took my daughter to London and we went to the Taylor Swift show. And I, I could have never imagined doing something so spontaneous and things that were gonna throw off our sleep and we're gonna sleep on an airplane and God only knows if she'll sleep. We just wouldn't have never done it. It changed absolutely everything, granularly and large scale too, for me. It really did.

[Hesi Jo]

Yeah. When they say it takes a village, the village is not just your mom and your aunts. It's including healthcare providers, coordinated care teams, people that are there to support you. Kristin, what would you say to moms or about to be moms that are listening now, that are struggling with their mental health, they're starting to notice some of these things. They haven't yet spoken to a doctor. They don't know how to access a psychiatrist. What would you share with them?

[Kristin Gallant]

I think the first thing I would say is don't walk this path alone. My first step, my first bridge to a psychiatrist was actually reaching out to other moms that I knew. And I didn't even know them that well, but as soon as I uttered the words, I'm not doing okay, I'm. I'm thinking I might need medication. And seeing the perfect Sylvia with her blowout and her perfect life and her to say, oh, I'm on Zoloft. And I'm like, sylvia, you're on Zoloft. What do you mean your life is perfect? In my mind, and opening up to then this mom and the other mom, they're like, oh, yeah, I did that for two years. And then, you know, I sort of don't need it anymore and I'm okay. And the more I started talking to these women that I admired, that I, that I loved, that I, That I knew that was then the bridge to be like, okay, I can do this. And that was my first step. So my biggest advice is talk to someone sooner, whether that is your therapist or your healthcare professional or it's just some friends and family, because you are so not alone. And those people can act, actually give you the story of where they were, exactly where you are today. That was the part that bridged it for me, that no mental health provider necessarily could. Where they said to me, I'm exactly where you were. I felt exactly what you felt. And this medication was a game changer for me.

[Cameron Oakes Rogers]

I'm so proud of you, too. I remember at that time, you were. You were working so hard to try every single thing. You'd be like, hold on, be right back. I gotta go meditate for 30 minutes. Like, you tried everything in the book And I'm just so glad that you were able to, like, move past the stigma of it and to see you thrive is just amazing.

[Kristin Gallant]

Thank you. Yeah, I think that that is the other thing that we as a society, especially in, in the culture of wellness. And I'm so grateful for wellness because I feel great. I actually love working out for my mental health. I really need to work out from a mental health. And I also need medication. I actually am somebody who needs both, and not everyone needs both. But I, like Dean is. I was a bit stubborn like a lot of us are in. I am strong, I am resilient. I have been through so much. I can strong my way out of this. And so I did. I mean, I. Rigorous exercise, five, six days a week, the meditation every single day, low level sunlight, you know, like literally anything somebody said that would help your mental health, according to research, which are all very valid things. And I also needed medication.

[Cameron Oakes Rogers]

And from a therapist standpoint, I mean, you've seen it time and time again, I'm sure, in your practice too, where somebody starts the medication and suddenly it unlocks other brain pathways where all the other tools, you can start actually using them. And then there's this positive upward spiral that ends up happening for your well being.

[Hesi Jo]

You're right. I see this in my practice quite often. I also see my practice, a lot of clients that have been prescribed something and they haven't filled it yet because of the apprehensions around everything that we're talking about, plus other things that was me.

[Cameron Oakes Rogers]

Yes.

[Hesi Jo]

What I have observed to be true for many people and what I share with my clients that are asking the questions, exploring whether that this is a good option for them or not. It's not that it makes the underlying issue go away overnight. What it allows for you to do is to get regulated enough to absorb some of the tools and the skills and the increased insight to address the underlying things. Folks, these meds don't make your trauma disappear, but it allows you to be regulated enough to talk about the trauma in a way that makes sense for you, or to go through emdr, where you talk about it to whatever extent that you need to.

[Cameron Oakes Rogers]

Exactly. Because so much of the trauma, the anxiety that we have from just going through hard stuff in life, like your brain ends up kind of going on overdrive to try and protect you even when you're not in true danger. And so a lot of times the medication can kind of subside that so that you can have a nervous system that is not constantly in that fight or flight. And that's where the real magic happens for growth.

[Hesi Jo]

And Dina, thank you for that. I know as an adult, you've received an autism diagnosis. And for a lot of people out there, getting a diagnosis later in life can bring two things among many others, which is clarity, but also complexity. I'm wondering what this journey has been like for you, especially when it comes to parenting and being a mom.

[Cameron Oakes Rogers]

Well, okay. It's been a game changer for me in so many ways. I think the clarity, the self awareness, now that I have the deeper understanding of just who I am and how my whole life has unfolded, everything in my childhood now makes a lot more sense to me. The things that I even in my own kind of therapeutic journey of, you know, growth and healing, I've struggled to put certain pieces and make them fit into this puzzle of just kind of trauma and childhood experiences. But now the autism piece makes so much sense to me. There's that. And then I'll admit too, like, I think the scariest part of it has been putting it out in public in a lot of ways and, and facing things that people may say about, well, you don't look autistic. What do you mean? You, you are so high functioning, you have a job. Like, those parts have been a bit scary, but I think the part that has allowed me to share it has been just this deep truth and knowing of like, yep, it's been here all along. Like, this is who I am. And, and now it makes sense. And as a parent, I think it's actually been such a game changer to have this fuller understanding of myself, of my challenges in particular, which really are, you know, sensory overwhelm is something I have always struggled with. And once you become a parent, it is loud, let me tell you. It is loud, it is chaotic, it is non stop. And before having kids, I was able to have these very kind of rigid routines and tools in place to try and combat situations that would put me into that kind of position of overwhelm and meltdown. And then once you have kids, you, you just, you're in it, right? And so now that I've have this understanding of, okay, this is part of the autism is this sensory overwhelm is the cognitive processes that I go through is the way I communicate. I'm able to really embrace all of it instead of fighting it. Before that, I was trying to kind of make it all stop and just like be normal, be like the other parents. Other parents can do it, why can't I do it? And I would have these hard Times and really just kick myself, shame myself. And the more I've been able to embrace what my challenges really are, have the self awareness, sometimes even build systems where, okay, I see it escalating for me. I'm hitting my point of being not okay. Let me take a break. Let me put in my earplugs, you know, let me use my tools that I now have. And sometimes it doesn't work, and then we recover after that too.

[Kristin Gallant]

But I.

[Cameron Oakes Rogers]

It's been just, I think, a. A game changer for me as a parent. And part of that too, is being able to help my kids make sense of what's happening for me during my hard times. So it doesn't feel like it's their fault. It's part of how mommy's brain and body works.

[Hesi Jo]

I have to draw this connection between something you just said now and something you said a little earlier. You know, this. This feeling that I could put myself in the shoes of. When you said, like, just be normal. Why can't you do it the way these other parents are doing? I was like, oh, that doesn't sound like this great life lesson that you've learned, navigating new parenthood with your husband. We have to show up on 100% authentically as ourselves. And folks, if you're out there comparing yourself to other parents and putting expectations on yourself that you need to do it the other way or do it the way that that mom is doing it, where's the authenticity in that? So it sounds like once you have figured out how to show up authentically as yourself, as mom, it also helped as wife, but also help Dina.

[Cameron Oakes Rogers]

Exactly. And I'm happy you bring it up because I do feel like there is this kind of myth out there, these last few years of having to always have it together and you have zero emotions and you never get flustered, and you always speak to your kids in this angelic voice like, no, no, we.

[Kristin Gallant]

We are people.

[Cameron Oakes Rogers]

It is okay to have feelings. It's okay to have emotions and have your hard moments. And really, when it comes to our kids, what it all comes down to is repair and helping them make sense of what's going on so it doesn't feel like their fault. When kids can make sense of their experience, it doesn't turn into trauma. It doesn't get stored as them being bad or they cause this. Right? We can all show up authentically, and I want my kids to show up authentically as themselves, and we learn how to work together and support each other well.

[Kristin Gallant]

And I think that Sometimes we talk a lot about repair and yelling, and that's really common on Instagram now, thank God, and on social media. And I'm so happy that parents now talk about this and making mistakes, because I don't think that was always the case. We all thought everyone was perfect, but I do still think those smaller, more granular things, we all do still shame ourselves, you know, especially when you are neurodivergent. So the really tiny things that you say, what is wrong with me that I can't even do this? And such a great example of this that Dina did recently that I was just so proud of is I'm not the birthday party parent. And for so long, it's this thing of like, well, everybody else does it. It's a birthday party. Come on. I mean, how hard is this?

[Cameron Oakes Rogers]

No, we have a family system now where dad does all the birthday parties with. With whichever kid is invited, and I stay home with the other kid, because it really would. I. I did it recently, and it took me five days to recover, honestly. Which, again, like, it speaks to that thing of, like, well, everyone's a little autistic, or this is, you know, blown out of proportion these days, when really, we have a deeper understanding of autism. And it can look so many different ways for each individual person. But in my case, too, with my autism, it's a very internal thing. On the outside, you're probably not noticing what's happening for me, but on the inside, at that birthday party, I can hear the noises echoing off the walls. Because it was an indoor party. I hear all the overlapping sounds happening at the same time. When somebody I don't know that well asks me, how's your summer going? It is. It is not a natural conversation for my mind to have. And it's almost like I feel like I'm. I'm in manual gear here. I'm, like, trying to come up with, like, okay, so don't go too deep, but answer the question. And it takes so much energy out of me to do that the 10 times at the birthday party that by the end, I'm just so drained. And I'm. I remember looking around there I was like, I don't think the other parents are having this experience that I'm having. It's just they're conversing very naturally, and I am just wired different. I've always been this way, even as a child. This is exactly how it felt that certain conversations, if they're not my specific area of interest, which is this, by the way, healing, growing psychology. Child development. It feels very much like a manual kind of effort that's happening.

[Hesi Jo]

I can very much hear and feel the synergy between you two. When you said you've been friends since you were 14, it touched me in a. In a very deep way, because I am very, very, very good friends with someone that I met when I was 12. How do you support each other with deep personal struggles as friends, but at the same time being business partners needing to show up in this different way? What does this look like, practically?

[Kristin Gallant]

It is very similar to what she was saying earlier with her husband, where we are complete opposite people, actually, and we have always embraced that about each other. So when Dena is giving a home birth and a lacy bra, I am there right next to the doula, you know, doing whatever she needs. And when I am in the hospital and she knows the only thing I want is an epidural, she is racing down that hallway demanding that I get my epidural. And that is true in business and in everything else where we really had to get to a point and have been at a point for so long. How you operate, how you respond to setbacks, how you respond to wins, how you respond when you work, how you work, that's all okay. And it's not necessarily how I work, and it's probably the exact opposite. So how can you show up 100% you? Me. Show up 100% me? And how can we get a system that's actually gonna work for both of us? And the only thing I think that Dina that's ongoing is, like, sometimes that system has to be adjusted a little bit if something goes one way or too far the other way. But the goal is always to make sure that dena can be 100% Dina and work the best way. Dina can work with 100%, and I can be 100% me, because, again, Dena has been diagnosed late in life with autism. I was diagnosed late in life, and adhd. And so we're very different brains. And I think the amazing thing about the diagnoses is that we have learned about each other how different we really are and how all our lives, we've only wanted to be accepted. And we can give that to each other in business and in life, saying, you deserve to live and work exactly the way that works for your brain and your nervous system and vice versa. And let's find a way continually to make that work for each other.

[Cameron Oakes Rogers]

Yeah. I think that's partly why we became founders together and started our own thing, is that we really do need very specific processes to thrive in life and to be well. And I think knowing each other since we were 14 is a really special thing because both of us can look back and go, go, oh, yeah, girl, you've always been this way and I've always been this way.

[Hesi Jo]

Yes.

[Dina Margolin]

Yep.

[Cameron Oakes Rogers]

Like, we know what our showing 100% ourselves really looks like, but that really is the key to it, because in healthy relationships of all sorts, we have to have space for difference, for us to respect and support each other's unique needs, but also find ways of connecting that really supports the relationship. And so I feel like that's been our journey and we've grown so much in it and learning both about just who we are, what we need, how we thrive.

[Kristin Gallant]

There's nobody else we could really do this with because. Because, yeah, I don't think so. We really understand and accept each other. Yeah.

[Hesi Jo]

Love it. Well, as we're really wrapping up now, I'm wondering if there's anything else that you would really want. Want a struggling mom to know or perhaps what's a first small step that somebody can take today if they're starting to notice that they're feeling like they're not doing well.

[Kristin Gallant]

If you're starting to notice that you're not doing well, ask for help. Now, that would be the biggest piece of advice that I have. Do not wait, because it often will start to cycle and life is busy and life is fast and you don't really want to get to the point where you're backed against a wall. So my biggest regret is not asking for help sooner because you're not alone. It is so, so, so many of us. It's most of the people you admire and watch on TV or on social media. We've all struggled. And getting that help early on, it would be such a game changer.

[Cameron Oakes Rogers]

I agree. And I think too, when you are in that struggling space, it's hard to prioritize yourself. It's hard to have the energy or the motivation to even take that. That step. So I think just noticing it, embracing it, and then knowing that you deserve to feel better, you can feel better. You will feel better. I think that's important.

[Hesi Jo]

Thank you so much for your time today, both of you. This is an ad for BetterHelp. Moms and dads all deserve an award. Daily. Building community and defining what support looks like to you is important. Like I said earlier, maybe the goal of motherhood isn't to push through, but to recalibrate, to build systems that support your nervous system and Your healing therapy is a great way to do that, and if you haven't given it a try during your parenting journey, I recommend that you do visit betterhelp.com mindifwetalk for 10% off your first month. That's betterhelp.com mind if we talk? That conversation with Dina and Kristin was a powerful reminder of how much strength it takes up to show up as your full self in motherhood. They named experiences that many parents quietly carry postpartum anxiety. No one prepared them for overstimulation and the guilt of feeling like they're somehow falling short as parents. What stayed with me most was how both of them found their way forward by learning to show up more honestly. For Kristen, that meant recognizing she couldn't keep muscling through and that medication was part of the support she needed to get better. For Deena, it meant rethinking what equity and partnership looked like in her marriage, as well as embracing her sensory needs. So what if the goal of motherhood isn't to push through, but to recalibrate, to build systems that support your nervous system, your healing, and your truth instead of someone else's ideal? To explore this further, I sat down with Cameron Oakes Rogers, a mental health advocate and host of the podcast Conor Conversations with Cam, where she has shared her own struggles with postpartum depression and adhd. In her conversation, Cameron explains why she doesn't believe in the idea of the perfect mother and offers some tangible ways that family, friends and partners can show up for new moms. Plus, Cameron offers her top advice for how to prepare for the postpartum period. If you're the one giving birth, let's jump in.

[Dina Margolin]

Foreign.

[Hesi Jo]

It'S very nice to meet you, Cameron. My name is Jesu. Today we're going to be talking about navigating parenting as a neurodivergent mom. Just to love hear more about you.

[Dina Margolin]

I can speak for my lived experience as a mom of two kids who are one and a half and four and someone who struggles with anxiety and their general mental health. And in terms of neurodivergency has adhd.

[Hesi Jo]

I know all parents are thinking about parenting most of the day for you. You're a public figure in this space, a role model. Even. So, I wonder if you ever feel pressure to be a perfect parent.

[Dina Margolin]

I mean, I don't believe in any concept around a quote unquote perfect mom because even just looking at it from the perspective of I could be the perfect mom for my one kid and that is not the same perfect mom for my other kid. And even more so I could be the perfect mom for my children and not at all be the perfect mom for my friend's kids. And I think that there's so much bio individuality around parenting, which is why I'm hesitant to ever give or receive blanket statement parenting advice. Because every kid is so different. I have two boys. They could not be more opposite. And it's nothing to do with the way I have parented them thus far. They are just different people. And navigating how to parent each of them best has been very eye opening in reaffirming that there's no one size fits all when it comes to parenting.

[Hesi Jo]

Right? Right.

[Dina Margolin]

I also think that we're humans, we're gonna mess up. It's completely unrealistic and you're just setting yourself up to fail. If you're following a narrative of I can never make a mistake or I'm going to do everything perfectly, that's not. And I think the most important thing which we've seen from professionals in this parenting space is the repair after a rupture. It's not the fact that you maybe snapped or you said something you didn't mean or you didn't want to, or you reacted a different way. It's how are you then having the conversation with your child after the fact. That's what's the most important.

[Hesi Jo]

So how does that, that myth of needing to be a perfect parent and other cultural expectations of motherhood contribute to the stigma or shame around seeking mental health services?

[Dina Margolin]

I think it creates this concept that you're supposed to love it all because you're supposed to be amazing at it. And I think that's tied into mental health because a lot of motherhood is ambivalence and the realization that two conflicting emotions can coexist at once. And if you are refusing to allow yourself to accept that with this whole concept of the perfect mother and we have to love everything and everything has to be smiley and happy, then when you experience those emotions of oh, wow, this is really hard, or I feel like I'm losing it, or my gosh, I actually don't like this stage that much. If you don't allow yourself to accept those things, a, you're just like pushing down emotions that will eventually. It's like a pressure valve, like eventually it's gonna burst. But also it can lead to a lot of self criticism and doubt and potential, like self loathing. And I think that that is deeply tied into mental health.

[Hesi Jo]

Do you think the stigma around mental Health support, especially for moms, is getting better. If not, or it is like, where do you still see some gaps?

[Dina Margolin]

I. There are many, many gaps. I mean, we're in a maternal mental health crisis in this country. What I'm personally seeing in friends, what I'm seeing in my DMs, what I'm seeing in social media is that the expectations for parents, and specifically moms, are incredibly high. I think we've shifted to a place where more moms are working and the support to keep up with women in the workforce has not risen at the same rate. And so they're trying to navigate the 20,000 things to make it work. Sure, I think it's manageable for some who have certain privileges, me being one of them, but it's really a steep, steep hill without support for many.

[Hesi Jo]

I'm also seeing another generational shift of grandparents not being as involved. And of course, we can't expect for grandparents to do this and take on that load. But this is something I'm hearing a little bit more, at least through my work. Our society is kind of turning away from living like villages, so I could see that also contributing to the crisis here. So now I kind of want to move into a different topic here, neurodivergence, especially as a. And, you know, teaching kids as neurodivergent parents, what that's gonna look like. So how do you maintain necessary structure and routines while also allowing for the chaos that comes with raising kids?

[Dina Margolin]

For me, with my adhd, I mean, something that has been more recent is starting medication to really help me there as a baseline. And then also I think having systems in place to know where are the moments that you're getting really overwhelmed and where are the moments where it's just. Just too many stimuli happening at once and how do we try to best avoid those or set ourselves up for success? So for me, I am much happier and capable of taking on the day and less overwhelmed when I have time to myself before my kids wake up. Obviously, it's not always going to be perfect, as we've talked about, but I'm at least trying because I know for me, that sets me up for success. Similarly, like I know battery operated toys throw my over simulation off the deep end. I simply can't do it. I get extremely overwhelmed. I'm unable to then have a conversation with my kids. If I hear this toy going off in the background, or it's like I'm trying to talk to my husband, the toy's going off, the kid's asking me Something my dog barks. And that's my breaking point. So we simply just do not have battery operated toys in our house. From the get go, it's been something. It's just been like, nope, not for us. Not a thing that comes into the house. But I think it's figuring out what your triggers are and creating these types of systems to keep everything in as much balance as possible.

[Hesi Jo]

For kids of a parent that is navigating something, the kid doesn't have anything to compare it to because mom has always been navigating this thing. So it's like, how do we instruct a very, very small child about what ADHD is if they don't even understand quite yet the concept of not having adhd?

[Dina Margolin]

Yeah, with my four year old, we've talked about it in the sense of I'll say sometimes like, hey, mommy's on the verge of like there's potential frustration and I feel myself getting to this place. So can you help me by putting on your listening ears or can you help me by stop banging whatever it is that you're banging or something of that manner and try to also relate it back to, to my child. And so I'll say like, hey, you know how you feel when you're trying to do something and your younger brother's yelling and you're trying to get my attention? Like, that frustration is how I'm starting to feel. So I could really use your help. I also talk to him a lot about our emotions and how we can work through them. And that anger is like an okay emotion to have. It's just how do we react to it? So there are times where we will yell into a pillow together and he now I, I've watched when he gets angry, will walk over to his like really comfy cozy chair and put his head in it and scream. And I'm like, that's great, that's amazing. Like we're allowed to feel angry, but how are we reacting and like working that emotion through us in a healthier manner?

[Hesi Jo]

You sharing what's going on with you modeling. There's a sense of self awareness, how that has maybe helped him manage his own feelings.

[Dina Margolin]

Yeah, I watch him all the time. Tell me. Like, I'm really frustrated because my younger brother, his younger brother, he'll say like, he's not giving me the space alone. I want to play with my toys. And I'm like, that's great, great. Thank you so much for telling me. Now I can take your younger brother and we can go do something. And you can have time alone. Or similarly, if we're having a conversation and he's upset about something and I try to butt in and say, whoa. This is why he'll very often be like, mom, you are not listening to me. You're speaking over me. And I don't like that. I'm like, great. That's right. You're right. I shouldn't do that. I don't want you to do that to me, so I shouldn't be doing it to you. So I think it's very important to have these conversations with your kids, starting at a young age, of how you're feeling and how you're working through those emotions so that they can then see that as a guideline.

[Hesi Jo]

I mean, a lot of my adult clients are here because they didn't get what you're talking about when they were kids. Most of us didn't.

[Cameron Oakes Rogers]

Yeah.

[Dina Margolin]

I think our generation was like, you're. Don't be sad. Don't be sad. We're allowed to have feelings.

[Hesi Jo]

Yeah. So now we're gonna be talking about postpartum. That period. I think people are starting to talk about a little bit more some of the things that come up. We've all heard postpartum depression, but now people are starting to talk about postpartum anxiety, postpartum OCD psychosis. So how can someone differentiate between normal new parent stress, which everybody's gonna have. I've. I've never met somebody that has zero stress after having a baby. And when professional support is needed, I.

[Dina Margolin]

Think that that's something that. That a psychiatrist should be answering more. I will say that we just recorded a podcast episode for my show Conversations with Cam, with a professional around this topic of what is the difference between postpartum blues or, you know, baby blues and postpartum depression? And her response was more around the length that it's lasting. But as she said, and I'll echo, I think one of the most important things is setting up your care team before you enter postpartum. So that means a therapist. That means a prescriber. In my opinion, that also includes a lactation consultant. So when you then enter postpartum, you aren't scrambling. Because I was fortunate enough my first go round when I experienced postpartum depression. I already had a therapist and I already had a prescriber, so it was easy to get on the phone with them, changing my dosage, you know, all of those things. So I highly recommend finding that keratin beforehand. And I throw in the lactation consultant as well, because even if you're too choosing to go straight to formula, it's still helpful to have that support of how do you stop your milk from even coming in? How do you navigate that decision? I think with those professionals, they will then be able to walk through, okay, is what you're feeling normal stress around new motherhood because it's intense, or is this something that we need to take a closer look at and potentially diagnose and work through?

[Hesi Jo]

And that does include medication for a lot of people that can help with mood and with regulating emotion. I did want to talk a little bit specifically about SSRIs, with the disclaimer that while I am a therapist, I do not prescribe medication. I can't necessarily recommend to my clients that they take them. I'm certainly there to support them in exploring what these things are, talking through potential side effects, talking about potential benefits, research behind these things. So I'm very familiar, very familiar through the clients that I see what some of the common hesitations around these medications might be. It's gonna numb me. It's gonna make me feel nothing. It's gonna change who I am. Am I gonna be who I am? Am I who I am? I mean, I have clients that are starting to take these medications, starting to feel the benefits, but then starting to feel uncomfortable because they're having that thought of. I'm not sure if I'm myself right now. The fact that I'm not anxious makes me feel a different kind of concern because that's what I'm so used to. So from your perspective, what would you say to somebody who's considering medication but hold concerns or other concerns?

[Dina Margolin]

Yeah, so I've been on an SSRI Sertraline, which is the generic Zoloft, for four and a half years now. I began during my first pregnancy and then stayed on through pregnancy, postpartum, the time in between my second pregnancy and postpartum, and now. And I can confidently say that it has helped me drastically and allowed me to be a much happier and healthier version of myself. And I know there are a lot of concerns around medication during pregnancy. And again, I am by no means a doctor, so speak with your doctor. But from my experience, I know, like, where I was beforehand was not a place I could have spent nine months. And I think that many people have concerns, and I get it. It can be scary. But I also think that this stigma exists because it's a invisible sickness of sorts or injury. You know, if you had a broken leg or a broken arm, you would never say, oh, well, I'm just gonna walk it off and it'll. It'll figure it out. You would get a cast or you would go on crutches. And some of us have a legitimate biological difference that needs assistance. I've had people message me, oh, I'm scared about gaining weight, for instance. And I said, if you really think about the fact that you're scared about gaining weight and you're caring about that more than potentially not having this anxiety, like, really sit with that, weigh it in. The sense of this could allow me to have a baseline of no anxiety potentially. And, like, how important is that to you? And to me, that was the number one most important thing.

[Kristin Gallant]

Thing.

[Hesi Jo]

In addition to having the care team in place already, would love to hear more of your thoughts on what realistic postpartum preparation looks like.

[Dina Margolin]

Having a conversation with your partner before baby arrives of, hey, these are kind of tasks that I think I'll want to own. These are tasks that I think you should own. And obviously there can be a revisit in the conversation after the fact because it may be different than what you expected. But I think that's very important so that it doesn't fall on the birthing person, which happens often. Division of labor is huge and a really large factor in a successful relationship and also a marriage with children that does not lead to resentment. It's something that we deeply prioritize in our household. I definitely grew up in a house that had stereotypical, like, gendered roles. I think our generation is really changing that narrative based on necessity because many of us are now in, like, dual working households in terms of actually putting it into place. I highly recommend Eve Rodsky's work. She's incredible. She wrote a book called Fair Play the Method. There's also a card game where you legitimately sit down and go through this deck of cards and pick out which cards apply to your family. So there might be some cards about a pet. If you don't have a pet, you just discard those cards. Or if you, you know, there might be some cards for two kids or multiple children. So you create the deck that's actually applicable to your family, and then you're going through and deciding who is actually responsible for which task. And the reason I really recommend this activity and why it's been so successful, in my opinion, is because it creates cards that are a physical thing. You can see for a lot of the mental load around parenting that just goes overlooked. Like diapers, for instance, if you're not the person in charge of ordering the Diapers. The other person just assumes the diapers are always gonna be there. And it's really easy to just overlook the fact that someone is constantly thinking about what size the kid is in diapers. When are they gonna be the next size? How many diapers do we actually need of this size? And when will we run out? And are we traveling? Do we have enough diapers to travel with us? There's a lot more that goes into it than just the diapers appearing in the closet. It's the same thing for the groceries just appearing in, in the fridge. So Eve does an incredible job with her work on really itemizing and showing the mental load of these tasks. And then once you have the cards, the concept is that you own that card. The other person doesn't have to think about it. The person who does not have it also has to let go a little bit of their quote unquote standards in the sense that, like, if they're owning it, then the way they do it is okay as long as you're in agreement with, you know, what is the baseline for equating it to actually being done.

[Hesi Jo]

Mentioned earlier a couple examples of where our current systems may be failing us for new mothers.

[Dina Margolin]

Well, I think the number one would be paid parental leave. It should be mandated, no question. And what we are currently offering specifically mothers is a joke. There was a stat recently that was released that said nearly 25% of mothers go back to work within two weeks after delivering.

[Hesi Jo]

I didn't know.

[Dina Margolin]

And that is just sickening, quite honestly. And I'll just speak from my experience, you know, as a business owner, there was no real option for paid parental leave. And my husband got, I want to say it was one and a half weeks off, maybe two weeks the first go round. Like, that's nothing in my opinion. Sure, it's better than some people are receiving, but that doesn't mean it's what we should be accepting. And I think that that's where it needs to start. We need to acknowledge what just happened, right, to these people, specifically the birthing person. From a physical, hormonal, emotional, mental standpoint, they need time to recover and also spend time with their child who they're caring for. I think there needs to be way more support in the terms of affordable child care. The costs of child care have become astronomical that many families in this country can no longer afford and make ends meet. And I think that that's a huge gap and should be a massive focus for our government. I also think this is like in a dreamland I believe insurance should be covering postpartum support. Whether that's a doula, whether that's a night nurse, like, I think that that's something that should be covered in our insurance programs.

[Hesi Jo]

You also mentioned a few different ways that we can proactively create community around new moms in our lives, what we can do to help them. For example, you've also shared a text online that you sent to a friend of yours who just had a baby offering help.

[Dina Margolin]

You know, that text went viral in a way that I could have never expected. I found after having a kid, I realized I had not shown up for my few friends that had children before me in the best way. And that's to no fault of anyone's. I simply didn't know what postpartum was like until I experienced it. And we all go on these apology tours when we come to terms with, wow, this was a lot different than I thought it was, and I'm sorry for thinking that I was showing up for you. So for me, I think it comes down to a few things. One, a lot of the times we struggle asking for help. If someone offers, sometimes we'll accept or we'll just say, you know, if someone's like, oh, what can I do for you? I'm not gonna ask my friend. If they say, what can I do for you? I mean, maybe I would with my close friends, hey, can you come do my laundry? I'm flooding in, like, postpartum, I have not done our kids laundry in weeks. You know, that's a really hard ask to ask someone. But I remember my older sister came over when I was postpartum, and she just started doing the laundry in our apartment. She just started putting dishes in the dishwasher. She started putting our bottles away. And I that goes to show my sister as a person. But also the sister dynamic of it doesn't need to be an ask. I don't need to feel guilty that she's doing it. I can just accept the help. And it's so hard for some reason for many of us to accept help and ask for help. And so the reason why I think that text performs so well with my community and for many people on the Internet, is because it took ownership on the friend of being like, hey, I am coming to help you. So it's not even a question. And of course, this was sent after she had, like, told me she was accepting visitors, but I'm coming to help you, so you don't even have to ask me. And I'm gonna put the ball in your court to decide how you want me to help you. But I'm gonna give you options to take that mental load off so that you can just simply pick from this list. I can either come to your apartment and sit with your baby while you go and sleep.

[Cameron Oakes Rogers]

Sleep.

[Dina Margolin]

Or you go out to eat with your husband, or you go for a walk, or you do whatever the heck you want to do. Or I can come to the apartment because many people want help with the baby and many people want help with the housework. So I can also come to the apartment and you can sit on the couch with the baby or go take a nap with a baby, or do whatever you want to do. And I will cook for you, I will clean for you. I will grocery shop. I will do your laundry. Like all of those options were listed out. Or we can just come and take the baby out for a walk together. Or we can sit on the couch and order in food and watch a movie and just laugh and have fun. So I think creating that list of options is so beneficial because then it's already said that you're helping no matter what. And the person who is in postpartum gets to decide of this is in this moment, what would be the most helpful. Because that's gonna change day to day.

[Hesi Jo]

I wish I had had this conversation with you before all the babysit came into my life. Cause it would have been, I'm sure, helpful.

[Dina Margolin]

I think also talking with your village beforehand about what you think will be the most helpful. And again, you won't know for sure. But I know for me, my second go around, you know, I didn't need a baby shower or sprinkle or any of those things. I didn't need baby blankets or onesies. I had everything. What I really wanted from my village, if they were in a place to give and wanted to, was food. So my sister set up a meal train, and they were like, cam does not want any gifts or anything. But if you want to support her, here is the link to her meal train. Feeding the family is the most beneficial thing. Because right now in postpartum, it's so easy to forget to feed yourself and to forget to care for yourself. And personally, I find that is the best way to show up and support someone in postpartum or one of the best ways. And it was the way that I wanted to be supported, especially because we had another kid at that time, so we also were feeding him. It was just a lot going on. So I think having that conversation with your village, similarly, around like, hey, I don't know when I'm gonna want visitors. I think I'll maybe be open to them right away. Or I think I'm gonna want a few weeks for it to be just family in the house and setting that precedent.

[Hesi Jo]

So similar to what friends can do. I'd love to hear some tangible examples on how you can show up as a partner of somebody struggling post broken.

[Dina Margolin]

By doing literally every physical task you can do. If you were a partner who did not just go through the physical aspect of delivering a baby, whether it be vaginal or C section, it doesn't matter. You should be on top of every single bottle wash, every pump wash, every diaper change, every single thing that you can do outside of the birthing person being the feeding source. If they're choosing to breastfeed, you can own those tasks. And I don't think we give enough credit to what the physical body just did to create and deliver a human and the recovery that is actually needed in many cultures. They're not leaving their bed or their house for days on end. And I just think in America we have a completely different expectation of how that should look in postpartum.

[Hesi Jo]

Yeah.

[Dina Margolin]

And so I think that's huge. B, I think continuously checking in. How are you feeling in this moment? How has this change been for you? Is there something that I could do today that would make you really happy? How can we prioritize Joy? Just paying attention to your partner. You are probably the person that knows your partner the best and you are seeing them the most in this experience. And being hyper aware of. I don't think they seen themselves or that was pretty off character. You know, I had my husband in contact with my care team to notify them if anything was like off kilter or if there were any moments where he felt I wasn't being myself and that he wanted to like have that conversation with my care team. And I think wanting there to be very open dialogue around the emotions you're experiencing. I find that if you let emotions fester, that's where resentment comes in. That's where the fight fights happen. And being able to have that open two way street of communication of like, hey, I don't like when you do this, or hey, can you actually maybe handle it this way? I would have appreciated it if this was your reaction having those conversations so that it isn't a situation where you end up resenting your partner because as the birthing person, honestly, it's very easy. Like their life changed, but not at all as drastically as Yours just did.

[Hesi Jo]

Did another thing that I'd love to hear you complete this sentence for if you're a new mom feeling overwhelmed, here are three things you can do right now for yourself, for your mental health.

[Dina Margolin]

I would say the number one thing that I would tell people is actually a mantra of just it's all temporary. None of this is permanent. I also think finding something that you can do for yourself, and I'm not saying it has to be elaborate, especially in the beginning. It can be 10 minutes, minutes on a couch to meditate. It could be watching your favorite reality TV show or 20 minutes of reading your favorite book or stepping outside to talk to a friend on the phone. Something outside of motherhood for yourself that you enjoyed before having kids that you know actually makes you happy. The third would be don't be afraid to ask for help. Like we are not meant to do this alone by any means and you're no less than anyone else for needing help whatsoever.

[Hesi Jo]

Loved all of those tips, especially. The second one is reminding me it's important to anchor ourselves in an identity that we always had because I think identity gets really, really messed up and lost if we're not being really intentional about maintaining some kind of connection to who we are before becoming mothers.

[Dina Margolin]

You're doing the best that you can and you're not losing your mind. There is a lot going on on. Like this isn't something that you're just making up. There are really so many stimuli being thrown at you and finding a safe space for yourself, whether that's under the water in your shower like cocooning yourself or laying on a carpet with noise canceling headphones on listening to a song you like. Finding that space where you can just be with yourself is really important to anchor and to come back to.

[Hesi Jo]

Well, thank you so much Cameron for your time.

[Dina Margolin]

Thank you.

[Hesi Jo]

I want to give a big thank you to Better Help for their passion behind this project and for giving us a platform to champion the well being in all of us. Mind if We Talk is produced by Acast Creative Studios in collaboration with Better Help and hosted by me, Jesu Do. If you like what you just heard, drop us a review on Spotify or Apple Podcasts and share with your friends. Maybe one of our topics will help someone in your life and remember your happiness matters. Mind if We Talk is intended for entertainment and education, not for mental health diagnosis or medical advice.