How to Cope With a Tough Diagnosis

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Mind If We Talk?" - Episode: How to Cope With a Tough Diagnosis

Podcast Information

• Title: Mind If We Talk?
• Host: BetterHelp (Hosted by licensed therapist Haesue Jo)
• Description: “Mind If We Talk?” is an 8-episode podcast that delves into real conversations about life’s challenging moments and explores how therapy can aid in overcoming them. Each episode features personal stories followed by expert insights to provide practical mental health tools.

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Episode Overview

Title: How to Cope With a Tough Diagnosis
Release Date: July 17, 2025
Guest: Ryan Sickler, Comedian and Host of the Honeydew Podcast

In this poignant episode, Ryan Sickler shares his harrowing journey of living with Factor V Leiden, a genetic blood clotting disorder. Hosted by licensed therapist Haesue Jo, the conversation delves deep into the emotional and psychological challenges of receiving a life-altering medical diagnosis, advocating for oneself in medical settings, and navigating grief associated with familial medical histories.

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Key Sections

1. Introduction to Ryan's Story

Haesue Jo sets the stage by highlighting the mental toll of health complications and the often feeling of being unheard in medical settings. She introduces Ryan Sickler, who was diagnosed with Factor V Leiden at age 42, inherited from his father. This diagnosis led to a near-death experience following a back surgery, profoundly impacting his life and career.

2. The Day of Diagnosis

Ryan recounts the unexpected onset of symptoms and the subsequent diagnosis process:

• Initial Symptoms and Hospital Visit (00:11 - 05:24): Ryan describes experiencing itchy legs and visible veins while watching Star Wars, leading him to seek medical help. Initially attributed to kidney stones, further tests revealed severe clotting issues. A primary care physician suspected Factor V Leiden, sending Ryan to an oncologist under the fear of potential cancer diagnoses.

  Ryan Sickler (05:24): “I'm freaking out for two weeks. Do I have cancer? Am I going to die? Like, what is going on?”

• Communication with Healthcare Providers: Ryan emphasizes the anxiety of waiting for two weeks without clear answers, compounded by personal life challenges, including a split with his daughter's mother.

3. Near-Death Experience Post-Surgery

Ryan details a life-threatening incident during a back surgery:

• Surgical Complications (09:50 - 16:24): Despite extensive pre-op paperwork highlighting his Factor V Leiden, unexpected complications led to severe clotting during surgery. Ryan had to advocate fiercely to receive proper care, resulting in multiple surgeries and a daunting recovery period.

  Ryan Sickler (16:23): “That's the last thing I hear. That's it for me. And thank God I wake up.”

• Emotional Turmoil and Hospital Stay: The ordeal left Ryan feeling isolated, angry at the medical negligence, and terrified of his precarious health state.

4. Grieving Familial Losses

Ryan shares the deep-seated grief tied to his family's history with heart disease:

• Realization of Genetic Impact (22:21 - 24:19): Discovering that his father and grandmother likely succumbed to undiagnosed Factor V Leiden deepened his grief, intertwining survivor's guilt with memories of losing his loved ones.

  Ryan Sickler (23:10): “If my dad would have just been on some blood thinners, he'd probably still be here today.”

5. Coping Mechanisms and Therapy

Ryan discusses the strategies he employed to manage his mental health post-diagnosis:

• Gratitude Journal (25:39 - 27:54): Implementing a daily gratitude journal helped shift his focus from negativity to positive reinforcement.

  Ryan Sickler (25:51): “I wake up every morning and it asks you to write three things you're grateful for.”

• EMDR Therapy vs. Talk Therapy (27:54 - 31:01): Ryan explains how Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing (EMDR) provided a more structured approach to processing trauma compared to traditional talk therapy.

  Ryan Sickler (29:02): “It's about rewiring connections in your brain.”

6. Empowerment Through Self-Advocacy

Haesue and Dr. Srila Roy Greene delve into the importance of advocating for oneself in medical settings:

• Strategies for Effective Advocacy (37:53 - 38:37): Dr. Greene advises clear communication and assertiveness in medical environments to ensure one's concerns are addressed.

  Dr. Srila Roy Greene: “Asking questions doesn't make one a difficult patient. It makes you an advocate for you.”

7. Processing Retroactive Grief and Survivor's Guilt

The conversation touches upon the complex emotions tied to understanding past losses through the lens of new medical knowledge:

• Understanding Survivor's Guilt (39:24 - 40:47): Dr. Greene explains how realizing a loved one's death was due to an undiagnosed condition can lead to feelings of guilt and intensified grief.

  Dr. Srila Roy Greene: “Survivor's guilt is when we survive a really difficult experience... almost a guilt over the fact that I survived but somebody else didn't.”

8. Reframing a Diagnosis for Empowerment

Haesue and Dr. Greene discuss transforming a diagnosis from a limiting factor to a catalyst for positive change:

• Mindset Shift (45:22 - 46:59): Emphasizing mindfulness and self-care, they highlight how individuals can take control of aspects within their reach to foster resilience.

  Dr. Srila Roy Greene: “It's about being more present, being more mindful, being more cognizant of the things that you do have control over.”

9. The Power of Gratitude

The episode concludes with a focus on gratitude as a tool for mental well-being:

• Benefits of Gratitude Journals (48:02 - 49:15): Practicing gratitude helps rewire the brain towards positivity, enhancing overall mental health.

  Dr. Srila Roy Greene: “It can be simple gratitude. So I think that it's very powerful to practice gratitude in whatever ways you can.”

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Ryan Sickler (00:11): “You grow up your whole life thinking, dad died of a heart attack... you don’t ever consider that there’s this genetic marker in there that’s killing us if we don’t know about it.”

• Ryan Sickler (05:24): “I'm freaking out for two weeks. Do I have cancer? Am I going to die?”

• Ryan Sickler (16:23): “That's it for me. And thank God I wake up.”

• Ryan Sickler (23:10): “If my dad would have just been on some blood thinners, he'd probably still be here today.”

• Dr. Srila Roy Greene (37:23): “Asking questions doesn't make one a difficult patient. It makes you an advocate for you.”

• Dr. Srila Roy Greene (39:24): “Survivor's guilt is when we survive a really difficult experience...”

• Ryan Sickler (25:51): “I wake up every morning and it asks you to write three things you're grateful for.”

• Ryan Sickler (29:02): “It's about rewiring connections in your brain.”

• Dr. Srila Roy Greene (48:02): “It can be simple gratitude. So I think that it's very powerful to practice gratitude in whatever ways you can.”

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Conclusions and Takeaways

This episode of "Mind If We Talk?" offers a raw and insightful exploration into the intersection of physical health challenges and mental well-being. Ryan Sickler's story underscores the importance of self-advocacy in medical settings, the profound impact of genetic conditions on familial relationships, and the vital role of therapeutic interventions like gratitude journaling and EMDR in coping with trauma. Dr. Srila Roy Greene complements Ryan's narrative by providing expert advice on navigating medical diagnoses, processing complex grief, and fostering mental resilience.

Key Lessons:

• Advocate for Yourself: Clear and assertive communication in medical settings can significantly impact the quality of care received.
• Embrace Therapeutic Tools: Practices like gratitude journaling and EMDR therapy can aid in processing trauma and shifting towards a positive mindset.
• Acknowledge Complex Emotions: Understanding and addressing feelings like survivor's guilt and retroactive grief are essential for healing.
• Live Mindfully: Taking control of aspects within your reach and fostering daily mindfulness can transform a life-altering diagnosis into a pathway for personal growth and resilience.

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Note: This summary focuses solely on the content-rich segments of the episode, excluding advertisements, introductions, and outros, to provide a comprehensive and engaging overview for listeners and non-listeners alike.

Transcript

[He Soo Jo]

A quick heads up that this episode covers topics that may be upsetting to some listeners, including medical trauma and sudden death. Please take care while listening.

[Ryan Sickler]

You grow up your whole life thinking, dad died of a heart attack, grandma died of a heart attack, we have heart disease in the family. You don't ever consider that there's this genetic marker in there that's killing us if we don't know about it. And then I start getting like really upset. Like man, if my dad would have just been on some blood thinners, he'd probably still be here today.

[Dr. Srila Roy Greene]

How do I stop overthinking?

[Ryan Sickler]

How can I stop doom scrolling in the morning?

[He Soo Jo]

How do I set boundaries with my parents?

[Dr. Srila Roy Greene]

How can I cope with this grief?

[He Soo Jo]

How can I keep myself from freaking out at the news?

[Ryan Sickler]

How do I be happy again?

[He Soo Jo]

How can I cope with a life changing diagnosis? Welcome back to Mind if We Talk where you get to be a fly on the wall for many therapy sessions and learn some mental health tips in the process. I'm your host He Soo Jo. I'm a licensed therapist with over 10 years of experience providing individual and family therapy. This week's question how to Cope with a life Changing Diagnosis at some point in our lives, we all receive challenging news and hard truths, whether that be for yourself or your loved ones. Sometimes this comes in the form of a medical diagnosis. Health complications can take a major toll on one's mental health. Dealing with these situations is even more difficult when the people experiencing them feel disregarded. One study found that 64% of adults in America wish healthcare providers took more time to understand them, and 73% say that the healthcare system is failing to meet their needs. When you feel like you're forced to advocate for yourself with limited support from care providers, it's easy to feel isolated and powerless. In this episode, we're going to talk about processing health challenges and empowering yourself as a patient with someone who has firsthand experience. Ryan Sickler is a comedian and host of the Honeydew Podcast, a show focused on highlighting and laughing at the low lights of Life. At age 42, Ryan was diagnosed with something called Factor 5 Leiden, a genetic blood clotting disorder that he is inherited from his father. A decade after his diagnosis, this condition and a supposedly simple surgery resulted in a near death experience for Ryan that changed the course of his life. Since then, Ryan has learned a lot about what it means to advocate for himself and pursue self care. He opened up about his journey with Factor 5 Leiden and the coping mechanisms he's used to process his Experience. After we talk with Ryan, I'll debrief our conversation and get some practical advice from Dr. Sri La Roy Greene, clinical operations manager at BetterHelp. Let's get talking. How's your morning been going, Ryan?

[Ryan Sickler]

It's been great, actually. I got up this morning, got some belly rubs with the dog, and I came here to talk to you. It's been a great start.

[He Soo Jo]

I didn't know you were going to say with the dog. I was like, oh, belly rubs. That's a thing I can invite into my life.

[Ryan Sickler]

You know what? Why don't I incorporate that into my world? Yeah, I should. I should.

[Dr. Srila Roy Greene]

Yeah.

[He Soo Jo]

We can learn from the dogs. There's one here. She may say something throughout, but what's her name? She is Sesame.

[Ryan Sickler]

Sesame, yeah.

[He Soo Jo]

Then there's another one, which is Oyster.

[Ryan Sickler]

Oyster, I see. I love it.

[He Soo Jo]

How about your dog? What is your dog's name?

[Ryan Sickler]

My dog's name is Princess Lily Rose. Oh, yeah. My daughter was six and that was the name we had to go with. So that's the name.

[He Soo Jo]

Love it. Thank you for being here today. I really appreciate you coming to share about your experience. And today we're going to be talking about something that is deeply personal. It affects so many people out there, and that is living with a serious medical condition. And your story with Factor 5 Leiden is both harrowing and inspiring. So I was hoping to start us off. We could go back to the day that you found out about this, the day that you were diagnosed. What happened? How did it lead to this? What was that like for you?

[Ryan Sickler]

It's a wild turn of events. The first thing I ever noticed, I was watching the Star wars film where, spoiler alert, what's his name? Kylo Ren kills his dad, Han Solo. And my legs were, like, itchy, and I had jeans on. And I just remember taking my hands and just. Just gently, like, rubbing my thighs over my jeans. Like, gosh, they're itchy. And I could feel my veins through the jeans. So I called the hospital and they said, you're clotting. And I had never experienced anything like this. They said, you need to get here now. So I went and what? The initial cause was kidney stones. So I started with kidney stone trouble. And I was in and out of the hospital because they kept saying, you know, you don't have anything. And I'm like, I'm in excruciating pain. Something's going on now. It's, let's pass the kidney stone. So then I passed the kidney stone, but my legs were still Clotted. So my primary care physician said, I'm going to run some tests for this genetic disease I've heard about before just for the hell of it. And he nailed it.

[He Soo Jo]

Genetic disease.

[Ryan Sickler]

It's a genetic blood disease. And from what I've learned over the years here, that 10 years I've known about it, the only way you know you have this is if it rears its ugly head and something happens to you. So my doctor figures this out and says, I'm gonna send you to an oncologist. Don't freak out. I'm freaking out. I'm hearing oncologists. The only thing I know about. Yeah, thank you. The C word. So I go in, and he says to me, it's rare that he's seen both legs clot like that. And he says, I'm going to do a blood test on you for a few things, but I want you to know that we are testing you for leukemia and lymphoma, and I have to wait two weeks for these results. And he gives me his personal cell phone number. And I was like, this does not make me feel good.

[He Soo Jo]

Mm.

[Ryan Sickler]

You know what I mean? I don't want my oncologist personal cell phone number.

[He Soo Jo]

Right. Right.

[Ryan Sickler]

So I'm freaking out for two weeks. I'm also in the middle of. My daughter's mom and I were splitting at the time, so I'm just being bombarded with, like, the lowest of the low in life at the time, and I'm freaking out. Do I have cancer? Am I going to die? Like, what is going on? And the whole time, I'm still, you know, being a dad and going to work and trying to make people laugh and be present on stage and push all this other stuff away. And I go back for my results. I'll never, ever forget this. And I pass this forward. One of the nurses came in, and she said, how do you feel? And I said, I'm terrified. I'm terrified. What you have in that piece of paper right there with you. And she said, well, I'm not supposed to tell you this, but I want to tell you, you do not have cancer. She goes, listen to me. It's very important that you go celebrate this. And I was like, I just feel like I just want to go home. I'm exhausted. She's like, my job every single day is telling people that they have cancer, and today I got to tell someone they didn't. And I'm getting chills about it now. And I was like, me, too. I hear where you're coming from. So that's when he came in, told me I have factor five light in. And now I have to tell my family, the rest of them that are left because my father's dead. He died when we were 16 and he was 42, very young, which we're all starting to put together now. They, they ruled it a heart attack back then. Back in the 80s, if you were young and you died, it was just heart attack, you know. Now with the advancement of modern medicine, these things, they're starting to realize that clots are a big thing that take people out healthy or whatever. Young, they don't care. So I tell my mother, my two brothers to get tested. They don't have it. So my father gives this thing to me. So now we know. And even the doctors have said, like, we can't for certain say that what your father died of. But he did get out of the hospital from a heart attack with clots. And then we found him dead in his bed in the morning one day, my brothers and I, and all this time we're thinking heart attack. Well, I'm the exact same age, 42. When he dies, I'm experiencing this. I'm laying on my bed crying and saying, if this is it, just, I'm in so much pain. I'm like, just go ahead, take me and I make it through. So now I'm armed with the knowledge that I have factor 5 light and I wear compression pants on my flights, I long drives. I'm the dude, I'm the dude that slows the road trip down. Now I'm like, we gotta stop, guys. I gotta walk around. Let's get a drink or a coffee. Let's stretch our legs a little bit. We're not gonna make it in record time with me. So that was 2015 when that all started happening, 2016, the beginning of the year. Now I'm armed with the knowledge that I have this disease and I just gotta keep my body moving and stay healthy.

[He Soo Jo]

That is such a frightening and challenging experience. So thank you so much for sharing that. And I'm under understanding that you found out about your diagnosis around 2016. And you've also spoken about a near death experience you had sometime after that. Can you talk about what happened there?

[Ryan Sickler]

So I go in for a back surgery at this point. I've had this chronic back injury since I'm 16, and I've been living with this for, you know, 30, 35 years at the time. Back pain, back pain, left leg numb. Every day, all day long, shooting pain down My leg and I've just been tolerating it. And so I had a show at the Troubadour here in Los Angeles and I couldn't feel my legs. Either of them were at the point where now I can't even do my job. So I go in for a surgery and they make you fill out extensive pre op paperwork. And in that pre op paperwork with my primary care physician who they make sign off on 800 sheets, we extensively put. This patient has factor five light in. This patient has already clotted from it. This patient knows we have this issue. Please be aware. And I tell every person over and over again that I have this and I'm concerned about any sort of bed rest, but I'm assured this is a simple three hour outpatient procedure.

[He Soo Jo]

He'll be in and out, in and out.

[Ryan Sickler]

But the day I go is in January. And back in January 2023, we had torrential downpours here and there happened to be a hole in the ceiling of one of the operating rooms. So now they can't use it and they only can use one. So my 10am appointment, I don't go now until 7pm I'm just sitting there all day. They, they take me back. I wake up and nobody's there but these two nurses that want to rush me out and go home, but I'm like, I'm not leaving. They're like, you have to pee before you go. And I'm like, yeah. And I was supposed to be here at 10am not closing time. So I'm going to let my body adjust and I'm going to pee regular. They say, no, we're going to stick a catheter in you. And I said, no, you're not. Just because you guys want to go home. No, you're not. So I end up, thank God, doing what I need to do without a catheter. And I go home. And during the weekend, the surgical area continues to swell like, you know, like a bump. And the doctor had given me his number because he wasn't there when I woke up. And he said, call me and we'll talk. Hit me up if you have any issues. So I do. And I'm like, hey. The surgical area seems to be like still full. And he's like, okay, you could be bleeding back there. So he wants me to come back in. Now, the surgery was on a Friday, wants me to come back in on a Monday to fix whatever's going on back there. And I do, I go back, they open me up again, they fix this tear, they say it could have been from, I guess, when I was coming out of anesthesia. They said I was coughing violently. But, you know, I don't remember any of that. And that could have done it. Now we're good. Two surgeries, I'm all fixed up. The problem comes in the care and keeping of me when I tell every single person. So much so that that surgeon said, man, you're really worried about this factor V liden, huh? And I said, yes, I am. I've clotted before, and I know that if I do this again, it's probably the end of me. So he got me these little calf pumps. I don't know if you've ever seen these. They're little like, you know, the blood pressure cuff, you put your arm in it, like cvs. They're kind of like that. So he said, put on your calves while you're laying still. They'll massage and give you blood flow. But I recover slowly. And day after day, I'm not seeing the same nurses every day, it's a new person that I have to again tell, hey, I've got this thing.

[He Soo Jo]

I have this thing. Which some of them, I'm guessing, have never even heard of this condition.

[Ryan Sickler]

Exactly. They're like, what? So I'm being the biggest advocate for myself that I can. I'm laying still day after day, and I'm telling them, please, I gotta get up. You have to move me around. And I think six days I laid there straight. They come to finally get me up on one day, and they say, listen, you've been laying so long that you might not be able to walk. So what we're first gonna do is sit you up and just sit on the end of the bed. And if you feel dizzy or nauseous, we cannot do this. I was like, okay. And I sit up on the end of the bed, and I feel like I'm gonna pass out. And they're like, nope, not today. And I'm like, just give me a minute. Like, you don't understand. This is like, you gotta lay down. So now I lay back down. It's Sunday. And they move me to my own room finally. And I'm watching the Ravens playoff game. They lose in a heartbreaking fashion. I'll never forget any of this. Thank you. Sunday night, I go to bed. When I wake up Monday, the OT occupational therapist comes to me and she says, okay, today's the day that you're finally going to get the heck out of this hospital. It's been almost a week Now. And she goes, you just have to pass a couple of tests for me. She brings a little step, and it's like three little stairs. And she goes, I need you to go up and down this thing 10 times and show me you can do this. You can do this. You can go home right now. I'm like, awesome. So I do all my little stares, and then when I'm done, she literally says, Mr. Sickler, you have successfully passed your test. As your occupational therapist, I'm telling you that you are free to go home today. And immediately, I grab my chest, I collapse on the bed, and I say, I'm clotting. And she's like, what? And I said, I'm clotting. And she runs out, and she gets a surgeon. He sprints in, and he says, what's going on? And I said, I'm clotting. I've been telling you guys I'm clotting. He said, how do you know? And I said, I've clotted before. He said, what does it feel like? Does it feel like there's an elephant on your chest? I said, it feels like there's five of them on my chest. And he said, do you. Are you having a heart attack? And I said, I'm grab. You know, we're going back. I'm like, I don't feel any heart attack symptoms. And he goes, wait a second. And I breathe, and boom. The jaw, the sharp pain down the arm, you hear about. I said, oh, my God. Now I feel it. And he said, sir, you might be clotting and having a heart attack.

[Dr. Srila Roy Greene]

Oh, my God.

[Ryan Sickler]

That's the last thing I hear. That's it for me. And thank God I wake up. When I wake up, they come in Left and right. Mr. Sickler, you are lucky to be alive. Someone's watching over you in this room. You have massive pulmonary embolisms. They went through your heart. Your heart is twice its size. And because of the genetic blood disease, the factor 5, there is a procedure where they can go through your groin with some tubes and they can suck the clots out.

[He Soo Jo]

And, Ryan, I wonder if, before we get into that part of the journey, if I can ask you a question here?

[Ryan Sickler]

Yeah, please.

[He Soo Jo]

Because as you're describing, all these things happening, having a massive heart attack, plus the clotting at the same time, I couldn't help but continue to recall, you know, you told so many people about the factor five, you had to almost figuratively shout at everybody so that they would be aware that you have this condition that you need to be moving around that you can't be lying in bed for a week. You really had to advocate for yourself in the hospital. And yet this happened. It could be that somebody was listening to you and it got lost in the shuffle of so many nurses coming in and out and all this paperwork and everything like that. But my experience hearing it is that they wouldn't listen. What was that like for you emotionally now to be going through this, grabbing your chest, telling a doctor, I don't know what's happening, but I tried to warn you all. What was that like for you?

[Ryan Sickler]

Infuriating. I was so angry. So angry that I'm not in a hospital because I'm not taking care of myself. I'm not in there because I'm drinking too much, I'm not exercising, I'm smoking too much. I'm, you know, living carelessly. I'm not in there for any reason other than their fault. Because what they tell me, and this is what made me even more angry, is because of the blood disease, they can't do the procedure. If they do that procedure, there's a risk that I could become a vegetable. And I said, well, we're not doing that. And they said, well, then you need to lay in this bed the old school way where we put blood thinners in your IV and slowly work you off of them into a shot and then medication. So now I'm in the hospital for three weeks for no fault of my own. I'm going from a three hour outpatient procedure where you're supposed to go home and literally walk and blood flow to help the surgery and recovery, to laying completely flat.

[He Soo Jo]

And in fact, you were trying to prevent this?

[Ryan Sickler]

Yes, this is what I was worried about. So there's a lot of emotion going on. I'm furious that I'm now stuck, what ends up being three weeks in this bed. I don't get to see my daughter. I made. They tell me this is the scary part. So when they tell me they can't do the procedure and they have to do it the old school way, they tell me that the next 48 hours is touch and go. And they tell me to call people and let them know that I may not make.

[He Soo Jo]

Oh, my goodness.

[Ryan Sickler]

So I have to make some of those calls. And that wasn't easy. And I'm on top of panicking and being terrified. I'm also high on Dilaudid. You know what? I'm out of it. And I'm trying to tell people, like, hey, so I finally called my. My friend and business manager. I was like, I need you to make these calls, dude, I'm so sorry I got at you. But just, you know, can you please. I'm out of it and I'm freaking.

[He Soo Jo]

Out and you're out of it and you're needing to have end of life conversations. Goodness gracious.

[Ryan Sickler]

So it takes three days or so for my heart, the swelling to come down. And one of the surgeons, this also is funny, and it's not funny, but it's also terrifying. He came in crying, and I said, oh, my God. I go, why are you crying right now? He's like, you're not supposed to be in this situation. I'm so sorry. Someone's looking out for you, Ryan. You really should be dead.

[He Soo Jo]

I.

[Ryan Sickler]

You got to stop crying, bro. Freaking me out here right now. So, you know, I then have to stay in there for three weeks. And yeah, I'm angry. I'm so angry about this. I'm also scared. I have conversations with like, hey, can I ever fly again? Like, is my standup career over? Like, do I have to. Driving is going to be a problem. If I have to drive eight hours, I'm going to have to stop all the time. And they tell me, no. They tell me that the human body is pretty amazing, that these clots are going to take probably about a year, but they will dissipate themselves. And I go right back on the road in May. This happened to me in January, and I start the tour. And I've been on that tour for two years, and now I'm on blood thinners for life. I finally had to fight to get my daughter. They wouldn't let her visit. They said she was too young. And I was like, no more of this. I said, listen, that's her mom and I'm her dad. Like, this isn't a babysitter bringing her in. We are fine with it. So they finally said fine and let her come in. And that, you know, that made me feel better. You know, my dad dying at 42, I'm that age. And I wouldn't facetime her. I kept it all to back surgery for her. She now knows what happened. But at the time, I wasn't telling her, like, hey, this serious thing happened. But then I get out and I am on a walker for a while.

[He Soo Jo]

Can I ask you another question, Ryan? You know, you. You mentioned that you were around the same age, if not the same age of your father when he died from potentially this. When you found out that you had this condition too. What thoughts, feelings do you remember coming up for you at that time, because of that, as you were beginning to connect those dots, everything.

[Ryan Sickler]

Everything is coming to me, you know, like. So it gets even worse with that. So after my dad dies, my mom had already split from our family. So my. My two brothers and I, we live on our own, we raise ourselves, we go to school, we're good kids. 3.0 grade average. I probably could add a 4.0 if I got some hugs. But 3.0 is not bad. You know what I'm saying? So we end up living with my grandmother after this, which is my dad's mom. And a year and a half later, we're 20, she's 69. She comes out of her room, her last words are, somebody help me. And she collapses in front of us. And I'm giving her mouth to mouth and cpr, et cetera, et cetera. Turns out, guess who gave this to my dad, who gave this to me?

[He Soo Jo]

Grandma.

[Ryan Sickler]

So now we're. This is. What's crazy is you grow up your whole life thinking, dad died of a heart attack, grandma died of a heart attack, we have heart disease in the family. You don't ever consider that there's this genetic marker in there that's killing us if we don't know about it. So. And then I start getting like, really upset. Like, man, if my dad would have just been on some blood thinners, he'd probably still be here today. And just the advancement in medicine, he would be here today. Like, this is a man I could talk to as a father and, and have insight as a dad. And with this condition, etc. Etc. So so many things are going on about that. And it's not lost on me that I'm 42. He was 42. This is happening. And in my bed laying, there is exactly. I mean, I know I laid on that bed with one leg off that bed, like he died. It was wild to me, and it was all happening. And I not ashamed or embarrassed to say I was talking out loud to anyone and everyone that would listen.

[He Soo Jo]

Well, you know, I heard an interesting thing here. We grieve, obviously, we all are familiar with grief when somebody dies. But I also hear a specific type of grief. When you potentially made this connection of finally figuring out what potentially what it was that killed your father. That's a different kind of grief. Mourning what could have been. And at that age, when you found out this was what it was, thinking back to your dad, it all, I'm guessing, must have come rushing back of if we could have Just done this.

[Ryan Sickler]

I'm 52 now and at 42, I'm in his skin, I'm in his age. And I'm like, oh my God, I'm so young still. How sad and tragic also that this I step outside that I'm like, this man died and didn't even get to enjoy his three kids. And you know, all because people just didn't know what was going on at the time. And yeah, I think about that stuff a lot.

[He Soo Jo]

Yeah, I imagine you think about a lot of stuff. And I would really love to hear how you've moved through that. You're living now, working, sharing things that make people laugh and laughter is a great coping mechanism. But I'd love to hear about your coping mechanism. What have you done in these past 10 years since the diagnosis to cope?

[Ryan Sickler]

One of the things I do and have done every day and continue to do is called the Gratitude Journal. Are you familiar with the Gratitude Journal?

[He Soo Jo]

But please let us know about what that is in case people don't know.

[Ryan Sickler]

Sure. So something you can get this on Amazon. It's something that, you know, growing up like that and also being a comedian and being cynical a lot of times my immediate thought is a smart ass thought or something, you know, cynical or whatever. And honestly, what that really is is it's a negative thought. So I started trying little things like, hey, before you say something, your first thought about anything, try to say two things positive and then you can crap on it. So Gratitude Journal is I wake up every morning and it asks you to write three things you're grateful for. And then it asks you to write three things that you're going to accomplish today that will make you feel good to get done. And then you write a statement, I am happy, I am leveling up, I am taking control, whatever that is for you. So that's just for your day. And then the evening, it is reflection on, did we knock these three things out today? And then the last thing at the bottom is something you learned that was new today to you. And I started doing that. I don't know, I've done five or six of these books now. And I can't tell you how much that's helped with just not going to the negative first. Sometimes not just even saying, just giving a negative comment puts you in that negative mindset. And then I see myself. I also went and did EMDR therapy. So I've done a lot of talk therapy. You know, I guess this anxiety had just been chilling in a hammock down there waiting to get its call. And then boom, it was like, we're up.

[He Soo Jo]

And next thing, it's different when it's our kids.

[Ryan Sickler]

I'm terrified to fly all of a sudden. I'm terrified of hike heights. I love to fly. I'm. I'm not scared of heights. And I'm. I can't get on a plane. Every little bump is now making me think, we're gonna crash. And here comes death. Death. It's all that spiraling and darkness. So I go to EMDR therapy and I do that for a few months.

[He Soo Jo]

I love emdr, but I would love to hear from you, somebody that's gone through it as a client in therapy. What are the differences that you notice between EMDR and talk therapy?

[Ryan Sickler]

Well, EMDR definitely has an end to it, which I love. Like, let me take the tools I've learned here and get out into the real world and implement them and work on myself. But nothing I did was shaking. My fear of heights and flying, all of a sudden, those are the only two things affecting me too.

[He Soo Jo]

You know, emdr, for those that don't know, stands for eye movement, desensitization, reprocessing. It is very different than talk therapy. There is talking involved, but there's something else involved. So can you tell us what your experience was?

[Ryan Sickler]

That I've done both. I've done zoom, where we do eye movement. But in person, I had little buzzers in my hand and she would tell me, like, it's not easy. EMDR is we're going and looking at your darkest, ugliest stuff. And I would go back to the moment where I found my father in his bed. And I would think quietly. I'd get a. I think it was a minute or so. And these things would buzz in my hands.

[He Soo Jo]

Bilateral stimulation.

[Ryan Sickler]

Thank you. I don't know all the terms yet. And then she would stop and I'd set them down. She'd tell me where you went, and we would talk and she would take notes and she would say, okay, I heard this three times. And whatever that was, we'd start working on and unpacking what's really going on. And what I'm learning through EMDR is that I'm living in the past. And I'm living in this anxiety that I'm feeling from finding my. I didn't just find my dad in his bed. That's 16 year old Ryan. But I'm in that mindset. I'm living that feeling in my body, and I'm trying to understand why this has control over me. And how I can get control over it. And we're going through every ugly thing in life. And it was about four months, and during that time, I'm flying and everything, and I'm coming back and I'm telling her, oh, I did not do good on this one. And now I sleep on every flight. I live on the top floor of my building. It's gone through EMDR 100% through EMDR.

[He Soo Jo]

And the idea behind EMDR is that when you're doing this bilateral simulation, whether you're using buzzers or using eye movement or use following a light, something like that, it's about rewiring connections in your brain. There's associations we make between trauma and our identity and beliefs about ourselves. And through emdr, you work towards unlearning that.

[Ryan Sickler]

And the mantras, you know, I'm good enough, I love myself. You know, all these things. Be kind to yourself. And that's another thing. I'm just beating myself up a bunch, too. Like, another thing I've tried to do is if I'm gonna go in the mirror and look at myself and have a negative thought about my. I'm trying to put a positive one in there, too, you know, and that's.

[He Soo Jo]

A lot of what's behind EMDR is unlearning something, which I think people hear associated with therapy a lot, and relearning something to be healthier, hopefully happier. You know, Ryan, I really feel like I could talk to you all day about all kinds of things. You have such an incredible story, and I'm. I'm so appreciative of you having shared it. And I'm wondering, as we're wrapping up here, what's one thing you wish someone would have told you right after you got your diagnosis or even after one of your hospital stays?

[Ryan Sickler]

It's a great question. Something I want to tell everybody out there first is be your own advocate. I tell everybody that comes on my show that they don't talk to their family anymore. Whatever, that's fine. I'm not going to get into your business. But you better find out your family genetics, because that's your blueprint and that's your DNA. And if they have it, you have it. And if they're likely to get it, you're likely to get it. Protect yourself. I wish someone would have told me that. God, I feel like I did everything that I could have in there, but I do wish someone would have told me that. It's going to be a long road and. And if you just take it day by day you're going to be so much better in the long run and you're going to want to feel better and you're going to be mad and you're going to want to blah, blah, blah, but just take it day by day. I wish somebody would have said.

[Dr. Srila Roy Greene]

You.

[Ryan Sickler]

Got to grab somebody by the chest and say, listen to me, I need help. That's what I said. Should have said, yeah, day by day. And stay as positive as you can about it.

[He Soo Jo]

Day by day. Great advice. Thanks so much, Ryan. So much came up in that conversation with Ryan. His diagnosis brought up some complicated feelings of grief and anger related to the death of his father and the lack of advocacy he received as a patient. He survived a near death experience and after faced an uncertain future, especially as he thought about his career, career and family life. A situation like this is something that we hope will never happen to ourselves and our loved ones. But life is unpredictable and I think there's a lot in Ryan's story that everyone can learn from. So let's explore some key takeaways from the conversation and bring in another therapist. Joining us again here on the show is Dr. Srila Roy Green, Clinical Operations Manager at BetterHelp. Srila is a personal friend of mine and she's been a therapist for years. Both of us have experience helping clients feel empowered to advocate for themselves and work through health challenges and anxiety. Like Ryan said, the road ahead might be difficult, but it's important to take things day by day. And in the process, there are lots of tools you can use to improve your mental health in the present and start living life to its fullest. Let's dive in. Hi Srila, it's great to see you.

[Dr. Srila Roy Greene]

You as well. Always a pleasure.

[He Soo Jo]

Today we're going to be talking about this discussion that I had not too long ago with Ryan Sickler. He came on here open, willing to explore his past experiences with learning of a diagnosis of a rare blood condition and then kind of what life looked like after that. And in addition to that, processing the fact that his father, who passed away quite young, may have passed away from this condition and they just didn't know that the family didn't have that history previously. Health complications are often unexpected and whether you experience them yourself or, you know, someone dealing with that, it's hard to know where to turn. I think there is not really a standard order of processes that everybody is used to. And so what would you say to someone who's newly experiencing this? Where do you start?

[Dr. Srila Roy Greene]

I, I think that's the question like, where does one even begin? I think it's important to recognize it's actually a very common experience because you're almost primed and set up to feel invalidated or unheard or dismissed. When you're also going through something like this, you're already dealing with the feelings of being blindsided. You know, again, to your point, you didn't wake up one morning and say, I think today is the day I'm going to get a life changing diagnosis around my health. And I think that it's okay to acknowledge just that. Like, I just got blindsided. I had no idea this was coming. I don't know what the right way to go about dealing with this is. And the reality is, and I think it's important for people who are listening to recognize there is no perfect way to handle something like this. But that said, it is important to move forward and then be able to create a plan. Recognize like there might be healthy ways for me to go through this and what are the healthiest ways for me. And recognizing a couple of things. Like, first off, you're the one that's going through it. The individual who just got diagnosed is in fact the one that this is impacting, not necessarily the provider. They may be the expert on what you're going through from a medical standpoint and from a professional clinical standpoint, but they're not the expert on you and your body and your experience and your condition. And so I think it's important to write down your concerns or make notes of it and making sure that you have a sounding board or someone that you trust to the best of your ability that you can acknowledge and recognize. Like there may be unasked questions you haven't thought of yet. So for writing it down and then doing your own research, and I'm not saying go down the rabbit hole, you know, we often do. I mean, according to WebMD or any of, or Google, frankly speaking, I should have died like 10 times over, right? Because that's what they tell you. But being, being able to have a balance, like it's okay to research and it's okay to ask questions, be prepared to ask those questions, even the difficult ones. And I think one thing that resonated for me in the conversation with Ryan is that asking questions doesn't make one a difficult patient. It makes you an advocate for you. My favorite thing to ask always is if it was your loved one that you were advocating for. And I think that's the angle to maybe look at it from. Is that, is it making you Difficult, or is it making you an advocate? And wouldn't you do that for someone you care about?

[He Soo Jo]

Yeah, you're kind of touching on the distinction here. At least for some people, I think it's easier to advocate for someone you really care about. But in the conversation I had with Ryan, he did talk about feeling really angry, super frustrated that he felt like he was constantly needing to repeat himself. And in that moment, perhaps he could have used some of this advice here. But how can somebody in this kind of situation effectively advocate for themselves in medical settings, especially when they're feeling like they're not being heard?

[Dr. Srila Roy Greene]

I think being able to say, I feel like I'm repeating myself. I'd really prefer if you read my chart prior to seeing me and be informed of my condition. I was just thinking back to when I was expecting, and when you're at certain stages of pregnancy, they have you go and get 500 tests and blood draws and things like that. And I would just go in and I'd be polite, but I'd be like, listen, don't do this. Just do this. This is the arm. This is what you want to do, and that's it. And what I found was it made their jobs a lot easier, too, when I was more direct and upfront and saying, listen, this is me. This is what I have. This is what I want you to do. Those are the areas that it's important to advocate for yourself in whatever ways you can control.

[He Soo Jo]

In addition to needing to navigate now his own blood clotting condition, being aware of the ways in which he's going to have to advocate for himself in various settings. He also described experiencing a very specific type of grief when he realized that his father likely died from the same genetic condition that he has and that his father might be still alive today if the doctors had just known at that time. So how do you help somebody process this kind of retroactive understanding of a family member's death?

[Dr. Srila Roy Greene]

That broke my heart, you know, to hear that. And I think it's a very real feeling, like, if only, you know, it's almost a form of survivor's guilt.

[He Soo Jo]

Before you go on, can you explain what survivor's guilt is?

[Dr. Srila Roy Greene]

Yeah, absolutely. It's a great question. You know, survivor's guilt is when we survive a really difficult experience. For example, what comes to mind is, you know, when there's an accident and the people, you know, might be very hurt or pass away from that accident, but you live with maybe minimal injuries, and there's almost a guilt of that could have been Me, I should have been that one. Right. Not wishing it, but almost feeling a guilt over the fact that I survived but somebody else didn't. Almost like a derivative of that occurs when we learn that somebody we love or cared about could have survived if only they had known. And so the reality is, yeah, you know, Ryan's probably right. Their father probably could have lived longer if the doctors had known. And that's not necessarily anybody's fault. Like, who's really to blame in that situation? You know, his father couldn't have known. He, as a child could not have known. And so it's really not anyone's fault. But it's still a loss, it's still grief.

[He Soo Jo]

So ultimately, what I'm hearing is moving forward is the direction to go. And thinking about the past, whether you're blaming something or trying to figure out what to blame, it sounds like the focus being in that past space is not what's going to propel you forward.

[Dr. Srila Roy Greene]

Yep, I agree.

[He Soo Jo]

So I know as people, we hear the what if questions fairly often as therapists. I have a feeling we're kind of invited into that headspace a little bit more than the average person. A lot of anxiety is very much centered around that concept of what if, what if this thing happens? What if that thing doesn't happen? What if she says this, what if he freaks out this way? What if they respond in this kind of thing, thing, what if I'm gonna die? So how do you approach the what if fears and anxiety that come with living with a life threatening or high risk diagnosis? And I ask this because this is what Ryan, I think, had to figure out how to live with and how to move forward.

[Dr. Srila Roy Greene]

Yeah, again, the what if we hear it a lot. I think that's like 99% of my sessions, like, what if this happens? Right. You know, I hear that it's perfectly normal. Especially when you're facing a medical diagnosis of any kind, it's okay to have those what if questions. It's going to create feelings of fear, anxiety, angst, all of the above. And I think the best thing that any individual can do is acknowledge it in that moment, like, these are real for me. And then talking through them actually, like saying it out loud, I think also takes a little bit of that power away from those what if questions. Because if you put it out there, it's not just sitting and stewing, just being able to acknowledge like, okay, there are a lot of what if? And I cannot plan for each and every one of them perfectly because there is no perfect it hasn't happened yet. But having a best case scenario plan, a worst case scenario plan, and my favorite, which is the most realistic scenario plan. One of my favorite quotes that I think I heard very early on in my career, somebody said, worrying is like sitting in a rocking chair. It's something to do, but it doesn't take you any longer anywhere.

[He Soo Jo]

I like that one. I know.

[Dr. Srila Roy Greene]

And it's stuck. It's one of those ones that just got in there and it's stuck with me ever since.

[He Soo Jo]

Yeah. I also like what you said about talking about stuff, how that kind of changes the way a thought can even affect us. I'm sure you've heard this too, with your clients. I've heard this so many times from clients. They're saying something and then they add the little thing under their breath pretty audibly. Oh, it doesn't sound as bad now that I said it out loud.

[Dr. Srila Roy Greene]

Yes, yes.

[He Soo Jo]

So often that I've heard this. All right. Ryan found EMDR particularly helpful in addressing his trauma. He even said that it fixed the problem rather than just making him feel better temporarily. Can you tell us a bit about EMDR and how it differs from talk therapy?

[Dr. Srila Roy Greene]

Well, first off, EMDR is one of many therapeutic interventions and it does have a pretty significant impact on managing symptoms of a lot of different mental health conditions. PTSD is actually where EMDR got its first real foundation and it's been able to get applied into, like, other therapeutic avenues, depression, anxiety, so on. And there is significant benefit to it because it is a mind body connection experience. And it actually does help to connect the symptoms that we are experiencing and being able to, I guess, divert it. However, in addition to emdr, there are a lot of other strategies that I think people can find helpful from a therapeutic standpoint. You know, whether that's cognitive behavioral therapy. Somatic therapy is another therapeutic intervention that has gained a lot more of an uptick and following in the last few years. And then in similar vein, you know, for other people, it's just traditional talk therapy. So I think it's really about figuring out what works best for you.

[He Soo Jo]

Yeah. So I'm hearing then that there isn't necessarily a specific therapeutic approach that's going to be the most effective to help people heal from medical trauma specifically. And, you know, a lot of people aren't always aware that their therapist is probably drawing from these different kinds of therapy. But, you know, I think a prudent and well prepared client can certainly do some research on the different types of therapy or even if they're in therapy, asking their therapist about what other kinds of approaches might exist out there. Because a therapist probably knows a little bit about these things. Okay, so Ryan framed his condition as though it's not something that impacts him on a daily basis. He doesn't live with chronic pain. There are just some things that he has to keep in mind. And so basically despite this serious condition, he shared that he feels healthier than ever. He's learned to take things day by day. How might someone reframe a life changing diagnosis from something that limits them to something that empowers better self care and mindfulness? The way it sounds like Ryan has been able to do.

[Dr. Srila Roy Greene]

Yeah, I loved hearing this and acknowledging like, yeah, that's the experience for a lot of people. I think it is is pretty common for individuals who get life changing news to reevaluate life and their behaviors that accompany what they've known as their up until now life. And looking at, well, maybe that worked for a little while, maybe it's not working anymore. I think people realize like, oh, I can't go back in time but I can't move forward again. There's that theme of like moving forward and it means being more present, being more mindful, being more cognizant of the things that you do have control over versus focusing on the things you don't. Like. I can't control the fact that I have this condition, but I can control the fact that like I eat a little bit better or that I exercise a little bit more or I finally decided I'm going to take that class in X, Y or Z to feel good about myself in other ways. Right. Whatever that might be. I think the other piece is that it can force a person to reevaluate how they take care of themselves and how maybe they haven't been. You know, I think again you brought this up earlier. Husu is, you know, sometimes we don't prioritize ourselves. Some people are really good at prioritizing themselves and taking care of themselves and then others may not, you know. And when you get a life altering diagnosis or life changing news, it does change that a little bit in your mind to say, you know, maybe it's time for me to take care of myself a little bit better and whatever that looks like. Not that I wish a diagnosis on anyone, but it does sometimes force an individual to look at what can I start doing better from me not taking again life for granted and being able to say I'm going to enjoy each moment.

[He Soo Jo]

Yeah, sometimes getting this life changing news is what gets us to realize or kind of wake up to the fact that we're living a life, that we're taking something for granted. And we don't necessarily need a medical condition to teach us to not take life for granted. But sometimes that's what happens. So instead maybe it's something about, about fostering a life, starting to live a life starting today. When and if you do receive this kind of news, you don't feel like you have to radically change your life because you've been living a life that is good thinking of like the difference between being on autopilot and being mindfully attuned to the road and how it's a little bit different there. How in there's subtle differences between somebody that's passively letting life happen to them, them and somebody that's actively participating in life. Like, one thing that Ryan mentioned that he does is that he writes in his gratitude journal every day. I'm wondering what you think are the benefits of listing things that you're grateful for on a regular basis.

[Dr. Srila Roy Greene]

I love gratitude journals. I'm a huge proponent of them. It's very much in line with positive psychology, but also something that going back to my own work in a hospital for many years, we actually had a group that we did. It was just about gratitude and it was all about the different ways of finding the littlest things to be grateful for. My personal favorite was when somebody said, I'm grateful for my toes. And everybody kind of looked at them a little bit like what? Like, okay. And they said no, because that's what helps me walk. And I, you know, whatever, wherever that may have come from, for them, I don't remember exactly. But for me it was like, like how often do we take that for granted? You know? And that's the piece. I think that when it comes down to gratitude, it doesn't have to be like mind boggling gratitude. It can be simple gratitude. So I think that it's very powerful to practice gratitude in whatever ways you can, you know, one thing a day, not five, not 10, not 20, just one. And when we do that, it does actually rewire our brain chemistry and our neural pathways and it helps us to start to have a little bit more of a different approach and attitude, including in our behaviors. So it's definitely something that does work work. You just need the buy in.

[He Soo Jo]

Right, Right, absolutely. And I think that is a good place to end on. So thank you so much, Shreyla, for your time and your wisdom today.

[Dr. Srila Roy Greene]

Oh, thank you.

[He Soo Jo]

This is an ad by BetterHelp we covered a lot in this episode surrounding the mental health challenges that come with physical health complications. When we're dealt life changing scenarios, it can be hard to know how to cope, especially without a good support system. Therapy can provide that. It can also give you the tools to be there for your loved ones who might be on their own journeys. Visit betterhelp.com mindifwetalk for 10% off your first month. That's betterhelp.com mind if we talk? I want to give a big thank you to Better Help for their passion behind this project and for giving us a platform to champion the well being in all of us. Mind if We Talk is produced by Acast Creative Studios in collaboration with BetterHelp and hosted by me, Jesu Jo. If you like what you just heard, drop us a review on Spotify or Apple podcasts and share with your friends. Maybe one of our topics will help someone in your life and remember your happiness matters. Mind if We Talk is intended for entertainment and education, not for mental health diagnosis or medical advice.