2519: Dumbbell Flys vs. Cable Flys... The Better Chest Builder Revealed (Listener Live Coaching)

Summary

Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth

Episode 2519: Dumbbell Flys vs. Cable Flys... The Better Chest Builder Revealed (Listener Live Coaching)

Release Date: January 25, 2025
Hosts: Sal Di Stefano, Adam Schafer, Justin Andrews, Doug Egge
Produced by: Doug Egge

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1. Introduction

At the [01:30] mark, Sal DiStefano introduces the episode, emphasizing the focus on answering live callers' questions. He highlights the importance of debunking fitness myths and providing science-backed solutions to enhance muscular development and performance.

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2. Dumbbell Flys vs. Cable Flys: The Ultimate Chest Exercise Showdown

The core discussion begins at [03:34], where the hosts delve into the effectiveness of dumbbell flys versus cable flys for chest development.

a. Cable Flys: Advantages and Considerations

• Adam Schafer champions cable flys, citing [03:34]:

  "With cables, you have consistent tension from the fullest open range of motion all the way to the closed."

• Key Points:

  • Time Under Tension: Cables maintain consistent resistance throughout the movement, enhancing muscle engagement.
  • Strength Curve: The resistance doesn't drop at the top of the movement, allowing for sustained muscle strain.
  • Versatility: Cables offer various angles and setups, accommodating different exercise variations.

b. Dumbbell Flys: Strengths and Limitations

• Adam Schafer contrasts dumbbells with cables, explaining [04:06]:

  "With dumbbells, there's only a small portion where the greatest tension is on the chest. As you get closer to the top of the movement, very little tension is put on the chest."

• Sal DiStefano adds insights at [05:57]:

  "Now we have these studies showing that the portion of the rep that contributes the most to hypertrophy is the deepest stretch."

• Key Points:

  • Muscle Stretch: Dumbbells emphasize the stretch position more effectively, potentially triggering greater hypertrophy.
  • Time Under Maximum Tension: The ability to load the stretch position heavier may compensate for reduced tension at the top.
  • Shoulder Stability: Dumbbells require more balance, enhancing shoulder stability and mobility.

c. Comparative Studies and Scientific Backing

• Sal DiStefano references research indicating [05:57]:

  "Studies show that loading the stretch is where a lot of the hypertrophy tends to happen."

• Discussion Highlights:

  • Hypertrophy Focus: Both exercises contribute differently to muscle growth, with dumbbells targeting the stretch phase and cables maintaining constant tension.
  • Fatigue Patterns: Cables may induce quicker fatigue due to consistent tension, whereas dumbbells allow for heavier loads during the stretch.

d. Practical Recommendations and Programming

• Sal DiStefano emphasizes a balanced approach [09:37]:

  "Obviously, we always say both. It depends."

• Strategic Integration:

  • Variety: Incorporating both dumbbell and cable flys in a workout regimen can capitalize on their unique benefits.
  • Client-Specific Programming: Tailoring exercise choice based on individual goals, such as focusing on cables for consistent tension or dumbbells for stretch-induced growth.
  • Supplementary Exercises: Utilizing kettlebells and other tools to enhance time under tension and muscle engagement.

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3. Listener Live Coaching

The latter part of the episode transitions into live coaching sessions, where listeners pose questions related to fitness and health. Two notable interactions stand out:

a. Optimizing Client Progress with Limited Interaction

• Caller: Amelia from Michigan [59:27]

• Question:

  "I work with patients every four to eight weeks and want to offer optimal guidance despite limited interactions. How can I ensure their progress?"

• Hosts' Advice:

  • Sal DiStefano [63:14]:

    "Fight the temptation to give them all the information at once. Focus on one or two key actions they can consistently implement."

  • Adam Schafer [66:06]:

    "Implement an FAQ page and consider creating a support community where clients can interact and support each other."

  • Justin Andrews [63:30]:

    "Develop a structured approach with clear, manageable steps to maintain client adherence and progress."

b. Managing Caloric Intake on GLP1 Therapies

• Caller: Ben from North Carolina [70:23]

• Question:

  "How do I know if I'm eating too low on calories while on GLP1 therapy without losing muscle mass?"

• Hosts' Guidance:

  • Sal DiStefano [71:12]:

    "Avoid dropping below 1500 calories to prevent muscle loss and metabolic slowdown."

  • Adam Schafer [73:28]:

    "Prioritize protein intake and consider reverse dieting once a plateau is reached to maintain muscle mass."

  • Justin Andrews [75:40]:

    "Ensure adequate hydration and incorporate carbohydrates to support cortisol regulation and overall energy levels."

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4. Personal Anecdotes and Host Banter

Throughout the episode, the hosts engage in light-hearted conversations and share personal stories, fostering a relatable and engaging atmosphere. Notable moments include:

• Family Interactions:

  • Adam Schafer narrates a humorous incident involving his child's misunderstanding of parental instructions, highlighting the challenges of parenting alongside fitness coaching.

• Footwear Discussions:

  • The hosts joke about wearing Crocs and other footwear, adding a playful element to the conversation and emphasizing the importance of comfort and practicality in training gear.

• Crypto and Technology Talk:

  • Brief discussions touch upon topics like elderberry benefits, mouthwash's impact on insulin sensitivity, and the ever-evolving landscape of social media platforms, showcasing the hosts' diverse interests beyond fitness.

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5. Conclusion

In wrapping up, Sal DiStefano reiterates the importance of practical application over sheer knowledge in training and coaching. The hosts encourage listeners to focus on what clients can realistically implement, ensuring sustained progress and adherence.

Notable Closing Quote:

Sal DiStefano at [71:07]:
"The information doesn't matter. Regardless of how effective and accurate it is, if nobody applies it, there's no adherence."

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Takeaways

• Balanced Approach: Incorporate both dumbbell and cable flys to maximize chest development through varied muscle engagement.
• Client-Centric Programming: Tailor workout plans to individual needs, emphasizing consistency and manageable steps.
• Effective Communication: Utilize resources like FAQs and support communities to maintain client engagement and progress in limited interaction scenarios.
• Holistic Health Considerations: Address both physical and psychological aspects of training, ensuring clients feel supported and informed throughout their fitness journey.

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Further Resources

• Maps Fitness Programs: Access expertly designed training protocols tailored to various fitness goals at mapsfitnessproducts.com.
• Mind Pump Community: Engage with hosts and fellow fitness enthusiasts on Instagram @mindpumpmedia, @mindpumpsal, @mindpumpadam, @mindpumpjustin & @mindpumpdoug, and join discussions at mindpumppodcast.com.

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Remember: Effective training is not just about knowing the right exercises but ensuring consistent application and personalized adjustments to meet individual client needs.

Transcript

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[Sal DiStefano]

If you want to pump your body and expand your mind, there's only one place to go. Mind Pump Mind Pump with your hosts Sal Destefano, Adam Schaefer and Justin Andrews, you just found the most downloaded fitness, health and entertainment podcast in the world. This is Mind Pump. In today's episode we answered live callers question. People called in and we got to help them on air. But this was after an intro portion. Now in the intro we talk about current events, fitness studies, family life. It's a good time by the way, if you want to be on an episode like this where you call in, we help you out. Email us your [e-mail] now this episode is brought to you by some sponsors. The first one is Seed. This is the world's best probiotic. Go check them out. Get yourself a discount. Go to seed.com mindpump use the code 25mindpump and get 25% off. This episode is also brought to you by Organifi. Today we talked about their green juice. It's the best green juice you'll find anywhere with an efficacious dose of ashwagandha in the green juice itself. Go check them out. Go to Organifi.com, that's O R-A N-I F I.com mindpump. Use the code mindpump. Get 20% off. We also have a workout program bundle sale. So here's where we take multiple programs. We put them together in a bundle, but here's what we did for this month. Each bundle is $300 off or more. Okay. Huge. It's one of the biggest discounted times of the year. So check this out. Here's the bundles. We have the new to Weightlifting bundle. We have the Body Transformation bundle. We have the New Year Extreme Intensity bundle, and the body transformation bundle 2.0. You can find all of them at maps january.com all right, here comes the show. One of the best exercises you could do to develop your chest are flies. Flies are a staple in every chest workout. But what is more effective? Cables or dumbbells? In other words, what should you pick for your flies for your chest to get the most development? Correct. With the cable, go with the dumbbells. Let's talk about it.

[Adam Schaefer]

Cables, flies through the gate. Cables all the way.

[Sal DiStefano]

Well, let's talk. Let's talk about it. Why, why, why do you pick cables right out the gates?

[Adam Schaefer]

Well, beginner or advanced, too, I still would. The. It's the time under tension. You have the strength curve. It's the entire time through the consistent tension. Yeah, consistent tension from the fullest open range of motion all the way to the closed. And with dumbbells, although, by the way, I mean, I'm wearing. I always advocate for free weights and dumbbells. There is only a small portion where the greatest tension is on the chest. And then as you get closer and closer to the top of the movement, very little tension is put on the chest. Even the. Now, the most advanced lifter can do a good job of keeping that by squeezing and choosing to intrinsically do that, which is what I do. But the beginner, I'd say, would have a harder time doing that.

[Sal DiStefano]

Okay, so for people, you know, kind of not understand that, right when you're on a. A bench, let's do a flat fly with dumbbells. Right when the dumbbells are up here at the top, there's no tension really on my chest because the, the, the dumbbells aren't fighting gravity or, or at least my chest isn't fighting gravity. As I bring the dumbbells out, now I'm opposing gravity. So the 50 pound dumbbells or whatever I'm using are heaviest at the bottom. At the top, there's almost no tension. And so I'm glad you went where you went, Adam, because I used to agree with you. I used to agree with you because with cables, 50 pounds at the bottom is 50 pounds in the center, whereas with the dumbbells, it's really. The tension is mostly at the bottom. Now here's why I disagree. Now, now, anecdotally, I've always, I've heard the argument objectively. I'm like, well, cables have tension all the way through. They should be better. But with my clients and with myself, I've always noticed that dumbbells might be a little better. And I just couldn't explain it. It didn't make any sense because the tension is the same all the way through. Well, now we have these studies showing that the portion of the rep that contributes the most to hypertrophy, it's the deepest stretch. It's the stretch. And so because the dumbbells essentially are training the stretch position the hardest and the heaviest you are, you might be triggering the most hypertrophy because of that stretch. Now, you can get a stretch with a cable too, but the fatigue might set in a little more because the tension.

[Adam Schaefer]

I was just going to say if I, if I'm, if I was trying to make an argument for your case, although I disagree with you, but if I were going to agree with you, the, the argument that I would make is that because of the fact that you don't have the tension on the pack at the top, you're not going to fatigue out as early as you will. With cables, I mean, cables, let's say, whatever, however much you load it, you know, you, you, you're, you're only going to be able to do so much weight. Let's say you're trying to, let's say you're trying to complete 10 reps. I got to choose a weight with cables that I can complete all the full range of motion, 10 reps. And I'm more likely to only be able to do a weight that is less than the stress that the heaviest load of dumbbell I could do, because the dumbbell, as long as I can get it out of that hole, I almost get a little bit of a Breather and a break before I go right back down again. And then I get to. Then it's hard and then easy. And so those. In the course of 10 reps, I get a little bit more rest, let's say, on the pack. Therefore I can load it a little bit heavier in the stretch. In the, in the stretch position. Yeah, that's not a. I mean, you can make that argument.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah. And I wouldn't have necessarily said that before except for anecdote like, again, I've had clients do both and you know, it's like, it's minor, by the way. I don't think it's a huge difference, but I do think it's a difference. And I know.

[Adam Schaefer]

Do we have any studies, Sal, that compare a. And I know this depends on even the machine and the pulley system that that individual machine has, because I'm like, what we would like to see is £50 on the cable is equated to X amount. Like, you know what I'm saying? Do you have. But it's too hard because every, every cable, like a free motion is different than a standard.

[Sal DiStefano]

You could have two pulley setups and 50 pounds. Now it's 20, 20 pounds or something like that. Yeah, I don't know. I don't, I don't know of any studies like that. But I think because the tensions in the stretch, most of the resistance is there. That's what you're stressing the most. And now we have studies showing that loading the stretch is where a lot of the hypertrophy tends to happen. Now, by the way, this is a plus, but it can also be a minus because if you have trouble connecting to your chest, right where you're going to want to focus is the squeeze. Anytime you have trouble connecting to a muscle, it's the shortened position that allows you to contract and squeeze in that position. So for someone who like they bench, they incline, like, I don't feel my chest at all. Cable would probably be better because you can squeeze and oh, I can start to feel the chest now.

[Adam Schaefer]

You does, does 10% loading the muscle in the stretch outweigh, though, the total time under attention benefits that you're getting from the cable?

[Sal DiStefano]

Great question.

[Justin Andrews]

Because also those angles in between, in terms of. So I have the, the full stretched out, like, angle where I'm stressing it the most. But then all those angles preceding that leading up into the squeeze, you know, to challenge that, I just know that from breaking it down isometrically, when you start to kind of really focus on these different angles where a lot of the momentum carries you through those moments versus the cable itself will actually challenge those moments, I think, a little bit further.

[Adam Schaefer]

Well, that's what I'm saying right now, the time. So you have to make your argument. Would also be arguing that the ability to load the pack by 10% more in the stretch position. And I'm just using a round number, 10%. Let's. For argument's sake, loading it by 10% more outweighs the total amount of time and attention that you're getting in the cable because you're going to get a significant amount more of time and retention.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yes.

[Adam Schaefer]

Now it's at a lighter weight, hence your argument.

[Sal DiStefano]

Better.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah. So which one is better? And obviously what we always say is both. Right.

[Justin Andrews]

And it depends, I think too, on acceleration. So if you're going for more of an explosive, fast twitch, obviously cables are going to be preferable. I would say.

[Sal DiStefano]

I would think it's safer, for sure.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

Well, just more consistent fluid.

[Sal DiStefano]

Now, there's two. There's two other points that I like to make with this, which is for shoulder. If you're working on shoulder stability, you know, free weights are free weights. I like them because you have to balance them. I mean, the potential for the dumbbell to go anywhere is higher than with a cable. So when it comes to working on shoulder health and mobility, then the dumbbell probably edges out the cable and then on the other side, cables. I can do it from any position. Any dumbbells, it's. I'm working with gravity, but with cables, I mean, I could stand and do flies. I can lay down and do flies. I could do cable crossover type flies. I mean, any angle I want. The versatility with cables is amazing because the pulley can be attached at many different positions. So, you know, you have again, a plus and a minus.

[Justin Andrews]

You know, I actually really like kettlebells for. For how they're loaded. Oh, you know, the back, behind the arms. Yeah. And just the downward forces with gravity. It's great.

[Sal DiStefano]

You know, what you get with kettlebells is you get more time under tension than with dumbbells. Because as I'm coming up with a kettlebell, it, it's. It lags behind my hand.

[Justin Andrews]

Right.

[Sal DiStefano]

So it's actually harder towards the top than a dumbbell would be. Same weight. I've done flies with kettlebells.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. Not a lot of people do that.

[Adam Schaefer]

No.

[Justin Andrews]

It's interesting.

[Sal DiStefano]

I'm so glad you said you did.

[Adam Schaefer]

That in kettlebells for aesthetics.

[Justin Andrews]

We did.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yes. Not a program we talk a lot about, but we did that.

[Sal DiStefano]

No, however much weight you use with dumbbells and flies, you can't do that with kettlebells. You'll find real quick it's harder because the weight lags behind the hand. So, you know, when I'm up here with a dumbbell, that's it. I'm done with kettlebell. It's already still behind me. There's still tension there. You know, you might get the best world.

[Adam Schaefer]

My favorite part about this discussion, Sal, more than who's more right in this is this is just a classic example of why I don't think anybody who speaks in absolutes around fitness. I think that's just a silly thing to do because you could put me in a position with a lot of different things like that, and I feel like I can argue either side really well. And so when we get into this, like, in our space is notorious for this, right? We're a new influencer or a fitness science nerd. Guy comes out and says, this is the best based off of these studies. And it's just like, okay, yeah, based off that study. That's a good argument for that. But you can totally take a whole nother approach and make an argument for why that's not. And something else is. And the truth is, this is, this is why it's important that we want to understand this too, that we, we reap the benefits of both. And this just shows you how unique the two. Even though you, let's say you were doing both of them in the like, say, lying down position and you're doing the cable flies that way and you're doing dumbbells, even though it may seem like it's the same exercise, it's almost like a completely different exercise because they each carry different benefits.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yes. And the reason why I like these discussions is if you're listening and you start to understand the pros and cons, strengths and weaknesses of each, it gives you a little insight on how to program for yourself. Because again, if you're somebody that finds it difficult to connect to your chest when you do a bench press, and so let's say you think to yourself, like, well, maybe I'll do an isolation exercise first, get a little pump on my chest. So when I bench press, I know how to position my elbows, move the bar to feel it more on my chest. A fly might be best with the cable in that case, because cables, because of the tension at the center where you squeeze, that helps you connect. Right? You may be listening to this and Being like, well, you know, at the bench. When I bench and I want my bench to go up, I have a sticking point at the bottom. The bottom is really hard. Well, a fly might actually convert better to a bench if we're thinking of it as an exercise to support another exercise because the fly's heaviest at the bottom. If you're tight in the shoulders, you need to work on shoulder mobility. Well, you may want to use dumbbells a little bit again for the stretch and a, you know, the, the mobility perspective. And then from a, from an angle, you know, situation, you're. Let's say you're experienced, you want to add variety. You want to try all kinds of different varieties of flies and have a good time with them. You can't do that necessarily with dumbbells, but yet you're. You're dumb. If you look at your toolbox and you start throwing tools out because one tool is better for a job than another. No, no, save that tool. You know, it reminds like my dad's tool. I know you're. All of our dads are all, you know, blue collar guys or whatever. I go in my dad's tool box and he's got stuff in there that he almost never uses, but when he needs that tool, it's there.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah.

[Sal DiStefano]

You know, it's not like he just has a hammer.

[Justin Andrews]

Still buy tools every year for Christmas, at least something. Yes. He gets so excited. Yeah, yeah. Because you're never going to use it.

[Sal DiStefano]

My dad even has like, like sweat certain screws and things that he never, you know, that's like. But like 10 years later, he's like, oh, I got that. He'll go pull it out.

[Justin Andrews]

It's kind of like a digital ruler.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schaefer]

Now, can. Can you guys. Do you remember the last workout where you were contemplating, oh, I'm gonna do. I'm gonna do some flies. I might do cable. I might do dumbbell. What you decided and why do you remember?

[Sal DiStefano]

I was.

[Adam Schaefer]

That's what I was trying to. While you were talking. I'm like, when was the last time I made that decision?

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schaefer]

And. And why did I make that decision?

[Sal DiStefano]

You know what's funny? Here's how I make my decision based on these two. It isn't necessarily. Well, one. Number one, which one have I been doing more of? And then I'll sometimes switch. Oh, I've been doing flies with dumbbells for a while. Let me go to cables and vice versa. But I do notice that dumbbells seem to hammer my body a little more than the Cables do. So if I'm like. I'm a little bit teetering on maybe doing too much, but I want to do another exercise, I'll go to cables. If I'm feeling strong and I want to go hard and heavy and I feel fully recovered and I haven't done dumbbells in a while, then I'll choose dumbbells. And that's just a personal choice. I just noticed the dumbbells tend to take a little more out of me.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah. How about you? Nothing.

[Adam Schaefer]

I know I was. I. What I. All I could come up with is when I'm feeling lazy. I'd be being honest, right? I was like. I was like, what was the last? And I'm like, it was accessible.

[Justin Andrews]

I'm like, I'll jump.

[Adam Schaefer]

Well, the cable. The cables are easy. They are just like. I don't got to take them off the rack and carry them over, you know, rock them back up.

[Justin Andrews]

It is a bit of a setup.

[Adam Schaefer]

With there's a little bit more grinding F. I feel of a grind with the dumbbells where the cables I can get in there just. I'm releasing light, you know, I don't got to move very much. So I think the last time I decided it was based off, but okay. Very similar to kind of your point, though. It's probably because I didn't get the greatest of sleep and this workout or I didn't need that much intensity. And so for me, that's probably when that now I'm in the flow. I'm like, I'm killing my workouts. Good sleep, and I'm like, ooh, I want to. I want to increase the intent. I want to do something different. Then I would. I probably would switch over and undone dumbbells. That's probably how I've decided the last couple times. If I couldn't recall of a better reason other than that.

[Justin Andrews]

A lot of times for me, it's like, if it's the hex dumbbells that are all big and clunky, I'm not doing flies with those stupid things, you know?

[Adam Schaefer]

But I'll do. I'll do it. A reason. Just like, these look goofy. I don't want to.

[Justin Andrews]

They're just awkward, you know, and, like, big and annoying. And they'll pinch my hands. Whatever.

[Sal DiStefano]

You gotta watch out your little hands. I still prefer, till this day dumbbells with plates on them more than solid dumbbells. You know what I mean?

[Adam Schaefer]

Is it because you like the clanking sound?

[Sal DiStefano]

It might be a. Yeah, like, they're set. I'm not talking about like, I like.

[Adam Schaefer]

I know you're talking about, but they still kind of. They rattle. They tend to get loose. They tend to get loose and rattle.

[Sal DiStefano]

They just have a different feel. Is it nostalgia?

[Adam Schaefer]

I don't like it.

[Justin Andrews]

Well, it's thinner too.

[Adam Schaefer]

I actually like, I like that they went to the, the kind of hex, you know, the 24 hour fitness vibe ones. Yeah, those don't bother me. Not for that. I. Because I do stuff too where I like pinch them together. Like, I love, like one of my favorite things to do is overhead extensions with independent dumbbells. So I like to take independent dumbbells, pinch them when the hex, and then do over overhead. Oh, instead of doing one like this, instead of doing one with the triangle hold, I like to pinch two together and I like to hold another. Just. I mean, personal preference. Something that you can't really do with the round ones. The round ones, it's. It'll slide all over the place. And you can't do that. You would, you would do the, the diamond hold.

[Sal DiStefano]

Interesting.

[Adam Schaefer]

I mean, stupid.

[Sal DiStefano]

I got an interesting study to bring up for you guys on a compound that we know to be beneficial to help during flu and cold season. Right. So if I were to tell you guys what's one of the, you know, what's a something you can take that's natural, that's been shown to help with influenza and you were to make a list, elderberry would probably be. Yeah, but elderberry is like, it's got studies backing it up. Like it reduces the severity and the potential of actually getting infected. It's actually one of the few things that shows efficaciousness against viral infection, especially influenza. Well, anyway, another study, a new study came out at Washington State University that shows that elderberry juice may be a tool for weight management and enhancing metabolic health. So critical trial found that drinking 12 ounces of elderberry juice a day for a week caused positive changes in the gut microbiome and improvements in glucose tolerance and fat oxidation. So through benefits, through the microbiome, they have some improvements in glucose tolerance.

[Adam Schaefer]

Isn't that interesting?

[Sal DiStefano]

Elderberry? So, yes. So not only does it help with, you know, not getting sick, it helps with insulin sensitivity.

[Adam Schaefer]

So when a study says, you know, improved microbiome, what are they measuring? Just, it's more diverse. And if that's the, if that's the case, doesn't almost introducing anything different makes it more diverse?

[Sal DiStefano]

No, not necessarily. But yes, diversity tends to be.

[Adam Schaefer]

We tend to attach diversity to the better.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah, you're right, you're right.

[Justin Andrews]

But are they parsing out beneficial versus non beneficial?

[Sal DiStefano]

No, they're not looking that deep. What they're noticing is changes in the microbiome and then these changes are affecting improvements in glucose metabolism. And then they go back and look at other studies showing do these changes contribute to glucose metabolism improvements and they think, yes. When it comes to microbiome, the science is still.

[Adam Schaefer]

So that's why, that's why like I.

[Sal DiStefano]

Bro, literally we're gonna need AI, you know, super computer, super computers to figure this all out because of its, the diversity, how it interacts.

[Adam Schaefer]

I feel like, I feel like the, the, the gut microbiome has become in, in the last decade or less even a very popular conversation that we're getting. I wouldn't know. I don't know about the average person, but more people are aware of it. That's important. And I think the easy, low hanging fruit is to say that this thing diversifies it. And we know that gut diversity is good, therefore this thing is good. I feel like everything, everybody's trying to attach that to it. It's just like, is, is it really anything or is it really that amazing that it's done that? Because it's, I feel, feels like almost anything that you introduce to the gut that's new would make it, change it. Yeah, we'll change it and create diversity.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah. And the more varied your diet, the more diverse it tends to be. Yeah. I think the, the best thing we know right now is that certain, there are certain beneficial bacteria that we do know have positive effects on overall health through the gut microbiome. So like we work with seed, right. Seed does a good job with this. They have the best scientists on this and they've come up with the, you know, the most beneficial bacteria. They've also created a way to deliver it where it needs to go. And by improving the gut microbiome, you tend to improve glucose metabolism. In fact, I don't know if you guys knew this. Mouthwash, mouthwash has been connected to reduced insulin sensitivity. Yeah, maybe Doug, you pull it up or type in the, type it in mouthwash and insulin sensitivity because it wipes out the bacteria in your mouth and that seems to have a measurable effect.

[Justin Andrews]

Now I, this is kind of like hand sanitizer, right? Like there's beneficial bacteria on the skin that gets reduced.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah, but that's like washing your hands, isn't it?

[Adam Schaefer]

Isn't it widely accepted and known that like mouthwash is not a good idea for us? Isn't that true?

[Sal DiStefano]

Not widely accepted.

[Adam Schaefer]

It's not. Well, obviously not, because we still sell it at grocery stores like crazy and people buy it all the time. But it is not a good thing to. To rinse with mouthwash, especially on a regular basis.

[Sal DiStefano]

Not unless you have a specific reason to use it. Like you have a mouth sore or something that you. Yeah, yeah. But no, you're right. 100. Look at this. Some studies have found that mouthwash use may be linked to insulin resistance and diabetes.

[Adam Schaefer]

What?

[Sal DiStefano]

Huh? Oh. Oh. That's why it eliminates oral bacteria that help produce nitric oxide, which is, you know, also helps regulate insulin levels. By the way, I can say this, that a good probiotic will probably improve your body's ability to produce nitric oxide. This may be one of the reasons why probiotics have been somewhat connected loosely. But I think we'll see get better science later to improve cardiovascular health as well. So it's become one of those supplements. I'll tell you what, unless you have like, Sibo or some gut issue where you have functional medicine practitioners telling you specifically not to take a probiotic, Probiotics, one of those supplements that are up there, everybody should probably take. Like, it probably benefits everybody, regardless of what your goal is, your health or whatever, probably a good idea to supplement with a good probiotic.

[Adam Schaefer]

I mean, what are the cases when you wouldn't.

[Sal DiStefano]

Well, if you have Sibo, for example, a functional medicine practitioner might say, I don't want you to take any bacteria at the moment.

[Adam Schaefer]

Grow it.

[Sal DiStefano]

Well, it could grow. It could cause problems, or it could slow down, whatever we're trying to do, type of deal. So there are times in the functional medicine.

[Adam Schaefer]

I mean, that's it, though, pretty much. I mean, that's the only. Wow.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah. So if you don't, or if it bothers your gut. I've taken some probiotics. That's. That gave me the opposite of seeds, the one I've taken the most consistent. Always, always, always. And it's never other probiotics I'll take and then over time start to bother me. But the seeds, the one. How long we've been working with them, it's been like three years.

[Adam Schaefer]

Way more now, bro. That goes back before Taylor does it. Yes, Taylor.

[Sal DiStefano]

Oh, I've been taking them the whole time.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah, Taylor. Taylor was actually the one that put. Put me on to seed. So giving him his. Give him his credit where it's due, like, I didn't know who they were. And he introduced us and then. Then once it passed You. Because then I sent it over to you, like, hey, look into the science. You looked it all into it. Then you were like, oh, yeah, this is legit. And then we got. Remember we brought the. Was it the founder or one of the one. I can't remember the founder.

[Sal DiStefano]

A long time now. Yeah.

[Adam Schaefer]

Oh, yeah, bro.

[Sal DiStefano]

I've been taking it for at least six years.

[Adam Schaefer]

Oh, yeah. This is six, seven years we've been with them.

[Sal DiStefano]

Wow.

[Adam Schaefer]

Maybe more.

[Sal DiStefano]

Wow.

[Adam Schaefer]

I mean, they were. They're part of.

[Sal DiStefano]

I'm telling you, before that I used to have to cycle them because it would start to bother me.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah. I mean, everybody that's like in fam. That's close to me, that's family and friends that. That we've got on seed. I've nothing but, like, positive. Yeah. And these are people that. By the way, these are people that like, already took probiotics and then they switched over and then they go like, they notice the difference, which. That. I find that even more impressive. It's like, well, obviously if someone never takes any probiotics whatsoever, then you introduce it to them and they see positive, like, okay, that makes easy sense. Right? But for somebody who's like, consistently used, you know, probiotics and then to switch over and notice a profound difference is pretty cool.

[Sal DiStefano]

Dude. I gotta tell you guys about a conversation my 4 year old had with my wife. And then she came back to me. She's like, we gotta be careful how we talk around the kids. They were talking. I don't know what happened. I don't know how this conversation come up about, like, bad guys, Right? Like bad villains and bad guys sometimes exist in the real world type of deal. And he's like, mom, so if there's ever a bad guy, you take Dahlia and you guys run. And me and dad will stay behind because we're the men. No, you're a kid.

[Adam Schaefer]

So.

[Sal DiStefano]

And I know where this came from. It came from. So we came home the other day and I had forgotten to close the garage.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah.

[Sal DiStefano]

So we come home, the garage is open. So it was late at night. So I told Jessica, I said, hey, wait here with the kids in the car. Let me go inside. Probably nothing, but let me go inside, look around, right? And I go inside and, you know, one minute later, Jessica walks in. So I also. And I'm like. And I get out and I tell her, if this ever happens, you. Yeah, if. If I don't respond or you hear something, you take the kids and run, right? My job is like, I'm stay There and make sure you guys are okay. But don't ever follow me. Right? So I think you overheard that. So I'm like, I'm the man. I'm. I. Stay back. I'm the one to get killed. I don't care what happens to me. Take the kids and run.

[Adam Schaefer]

Oh, my God.

[Sal DiStefano]

So he must have heard that. He's like, we're the men.

[Adam Schaefer]

Isn't it wild how like. Like one situation, one scenario like that, and then it makes an imprint so much that they. They keep saying it or keep repeating it and you can't get it? Yeah, I know.

[Sal DiStefano]

I think that's so funny.

[Adam Schaefer]

I'm still in trouble about the beaver thing with Katrina.

[Sal DiStefano]

Oh, did you tell. You didn't say that on the podcast.

[Adam Schaefer]

Oh, I didn't talk about. On the podcast. I told you guys off air about it. But it's like he has to bring it up now all the time. Like, Katrina's like. She just gives me this look all the time. I'm like, fuck. Okay, so I made a m. I thought that was funny because you.

[Sal DiStefano]

Well, I know what you do. You say a sentence that you said something.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah, yeah, I said something to her, like, in front of him, like, that was, you know, referring to her, you know, private area as her. A beaver. Right. But I did it in a way that only her and I got it. But he would use that word anymore. He. He picked up on, like, mommy has a beaver. You know? And now it's like all he wants to do is see her beaver. You know what I'm saying? Wants to know why Daddy loves her beaver so much. And it's just like.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh, God.

[Adam Schaefer]

I'd say like, one time thinking it's funny, and then it's like, bob, you never showed me. Yeah, yeah. It's like. And he just randomly will bring it up now out of nowhere, like, around other people. Yeah, just all the time now. So it's just like, my mom won't show me her beer.

[Sal DiStefano]

I don't know what's wrong.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah, so Daddy's in trouble for that one right now. I thought it was funny and cute when I first did it, you know, and then it's just like. But they just hang on to it. It's like, yeah, there's a million things I've said to him, probably around him that's been okay. But, you know, something spark, maybe, because.

[Sal DiStefano]

He'S all the reaction.

[Adam Schaefer]

Maybe. You know, I think. No, I think what it was. Maybe. Maybe he saw mom and dad smirking about it or something. Like that. But he definitely. And I think maybe it has something to do too, with, like, maybe that is not a common animal. Animal that we talk about or whatever. So now he's, like, super curious to see it or whatever. So. Yeah. Yeah. Katrina's been off. Cool.

[Sal DiStefano]

I got to show you guys. I sent a video. Doug, I want to show you. So my. You guys, my daughter's 2, and I don't know where she gets this sass, this sassy little attitude from. She suddenly developed.

[Adam Schaefer]

You're sassy.

[Sal DiStefano]

So.

[Adam Schaefer]

Only when you were sassy this morning with our. With our YouTube sassy.

[Sal DiStefano]

We're at.

[Justin Andrews]

We're at.

[Sal DiStefano]

We're going out. She's about to run. I'll describe to people. And this girl took her space. Look what she does, dude. I don't know why. She starts. She's stomping her foot, and then right here, we're asking. We're like, why are you stomping your foot? And so she's. She's like, that girl took my spot.

[Adam Schaefer]

Oh, that's funny.

[Sal DiStefano]

And then look what she does. What are you doing, little girl?

[Adam Schaefer]

Oh, my God. Just.

[Sal DiStefano]

Just pissed off.

[Adam Schaefer]

Oh, my God.

[Sal DiStefano]

She just does this thing now. She crosses her arms and she stomps when she's angry. See, she keeps doing.

[Adam Schaefer]

I want you to know, Dad. I want you to know what she did.

[Sal DiStefano]

So cute, though.

[Adam Schaefer]

Oh, that is so cute.

[Sal DiStefano]

But I. You know, when she's a teenager, I'd hate that.

[Adam Schaefer]

My. My best friend, we were all together up in Truckee. My. And my best friend has their two kids, and they have a daughter, and she is now, what is she, two and a half, three now? Just like. And she. And so funny. You shared this video because one of the things I was looking at my. My boy, I'm like, oh, damn, bro. We're like. We're in the living room doing something, and I can't. I don't know what. His mom told her, no, like, no, no, don't do that. Like that. And she did the. Cross her arms. And she did the dirtiest looking.

[Sal DiStefano]

Stomped her foot.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yes, stop. Stop her. And she makes this little grunt. I'm like, oh, bro, dude. I'm like, already right now you get that? Oh, my God.

[Sal DiStefano]

You know, I don't know where they learn. I think it's natural. Like, I don't. Where'd she get that from? I don't stomp my foot like that and cross.

[Adam Schaefer]

It is interesting. That's the same thing, too. It's like, I don't think my buddies Ever do anything.

[Justin Andrews]

So that's like, you know, the go to, I guess.

[Sal DiStefano]

Dude. Yeah. Let me tell you, when they're teenagers.

[Adam Schaefer]

It'S not so cute. No, no, it's not so cute.

[Sal DiStefano]

No. You want to be like, oh, you want to see who stomps harder. I got a way harder stump than you do. Let me show. Speaking of kids, are you guys. Did you guys see the comments under the. I don't know if you guys did or not.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh, yeah, I did not.

[Sal DiStefano]

Under Erica. Commissars. Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

I knew it was going to be controversial at. At best.

[Sal DiStefano]

You know, it's, of course, because we're. We're fathers. Okay.

[Adam Schaefer]

That's why it's controversial. Because we're fathers?

[Sal DiStefano]

No, no.

[Adam Schaefer]

Oh. Oh.

[Sal DiStefano]

I'm saying we're parents, okay.

[Justin Andrews]

It was triggering.

[Sal DiStefano]

If you're a parent and. And you really care about your kid, one of the most challenging things and easiest things that happen is to look back or look at you yourself. Cause you care so much about your kid, you love your kid more than anything, and you just. It's easy to break yourself down. It's so easy. Nobody's perfect. So it's easy to be like, oh, my God, I yell too much. I'm not present enough. I have to work too much, or whatever. And so here we have an expert. Come on and talk about the data. Talk about what's ideal for little kids. And for sure you're a parent, especially a mom. I think moms in particular can be susceptible to this. And you can hear all the things you're not doing. And so what it'll make you want to do is defend yourself fiercely.

[Adam Schaefer]

So I don't think that's why people get upset.

[Sal DiStefano]

I do.

[Adam Schaefer]

I don't think so. Okay, let me ask you this, because I thought about this. Who did you share that interview with? Anybody?

[Sal DiStefano]

A couple people? Because you did. I did.

[Adam Schaefer]

Okay, So I didn't. The reason why I didn't. No, I tell you why I didn't was because even though I thought it was an awesome interview, I. It was enlightening for me. I enjoyed it because I like to be challenged that way. Right. So I. I embrace the. What I could have done better, what I'm not doing, what that. I mean, and for. The audience knows, Katrina works full time, has worked full time with Max. So, like, I'm an example of what is not ideal. Now, we've done a lot of things to, I think her pretty much still be with him and works from home, yada, yada. But point is I have, like, friends that I wanted to listen to it, but I didn't want to share it.

[Sal DiStefano]

They'll be. You'll be attacking.

[Adam Schaefer]

That's right. Because I feel like if I sent it to them, it's going to come off. Like me saying, you guys are doing all this stuff, which is so understand our audience receives it like that. Because our audience is here. We are sharing it with them, even though we selfishly wanted that interview. That interview. So. So the audience understands we pursue guests like this for personal growth. Not because we think you all need to hear this. This is like, we reach out for guests like these because we like to. To hear this stuff, good or bad, about ourselves as parents. And so when we do an interview like that, this is not, and I think the way some people receive it, which is the people that got upset, it's like us on a pedestal trying to tell everybody else, like, you should raise your kids like that. Like, no, it's not how this is. The way this is, is this is us sharing with you the things that we're learning about and we're reading or we're watching, therefore we're sharing. But I could totally see how you would interpret that as us telling you just, like, why I didn't share it with some of my friends. Because I'm like, man, if I share this with them, even though I thought it was a great episode and it gave me a lot of value, it's going to come off as me telling.

[Sal DiStefano]

The couple people I sent it to.

[Adam Schaefer]

I thought that's my.

[Sal DiStefano]

Thought I knew wouldn't take it that way. There's a lot of people I didn't send it to.

[Adam Schaefer]

Okay.

[Sal DiStefano]

Because that's more personal. Right. Because I'm sending it to you.

[Adam Schaefer]

Right. But thinking about that's how the audience is probably receiving it.

[Sal DiStefano]

Maybe.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah. If you're. If you're their audience and we're. I mean, we present our fitness knowledge and information from that. That place. We're. We're coming from a place of experience, science, knowledge, wisdom, and here we are.

[Justin Andrews]

We do that with fitness and with business as well. Like, there's a lot of times we're, like, super humbled because, oh, man, we should have started off like that. Why didn't we use that formula? Why didn't we go in that direction? There's a lot of things to reflect on. So, yeah, it's. It's a. It's a tough one when it's like, it feels like, oh, my God, it's. You know, especially when it's your kids, you're focusing on my, my deficit.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah, but look, I feel bad. First of all, being a parent today is so hard. But I'll speak specifically to moms. It's really hard because you're a stay at home mom. Oh, you're wasting your talents. Why aren't you getting a job and contributing? Oh, you work. Oh, you're not there for your kid. You're not whatever you criticize, no matter what. Or should I say you can look at yourself and feel inadequate. This happens to fathers too. It's very, very easy. And the world doesn't make raising your kid any easier because you're countering everything else the world is doing and oh, if you let the world raise your kids now you're doing a bad job. But if you counter the world, well, now you're isolating your kid. There is no, I don't. Nothing's ever going to be perfect. So when you look at it, you take the information, you go, okay, how can I apply this to myself? Are there things I can change? How can I make my situation, which is challenging, as good as possible? But I will say this. Arthur Brooks shared this with us. If you're thinking about how you can become or be the best parent, you're better than. You're already 90% of the way there. Because you care.

[Justin Andrews]

Exactly.

[Sal DiStefano]

Because a lot of people, you have.

[Justin Andrews]

To rest on that fact.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yes, A lot of people don't even think about that kind of stuff. But when it comes to raising kids, it's tough because, I mean, I thought.

[Adam Schaefer]

It was, I thought it was awesome.

[Sal DiStefano]

I loved it.

[Adam Schaefer]

It was lightning, for sure. I like being called out on stuff like that. Like, I'll tell you something that, that really hit home for me that I, you know, if I'm being honest with myself, when I really think about those conversations that Katrina and I have had, are they really coming from a place? Am I really trying to put my, myself in my child's situation and, and think about the landscape? Or am I actually thinking from a parent's perspective and what I want for my life or our life?

[Sal DiStefano]

Right.

[Adam Schaefer]

And the truth is I, you know what, it's selfishly motivated as much as I think, although it's cloaked in we're do I'm doing this for my son. It's like, wait a second, my son doesn't know that. He doesn't know any of those things like that. And if he had to choose, you know, that the, you know, the vacations that we get to take and the things that I love to do and stuff like that, or the bigger home, the more things or just dad being around him more. What do I think and did I really think from that perspective when I have that comment, being honest with myself, I could be better about that. I could have been better about, about that. I think Katrina and I thought about ourselves or our family unit, but from our perspective, not really trying to put ourselves in a 2 year old or 3 year old's shoes and go like, you know, if they had a voice, what would they say at this, at this time? And to me, so I think that's really good and powerful and hey, it stings when, you know, when you look back and you go like, yeah, I guess that's, yeah, you know what I'm saying. So, But I think that's the reason why the audience gets so defensive sometimes is because it's like, it's as if we're sending it to them directly.

[Justin Andrews]

That wasn't the intention.

[Adam Schaefer]

Of course not. Of course not. We have, it feels that way though. It's been like, you know, so it's not like we're targeting on each other individual. I mean this is us sharing and, and, and learning as, as, as we go through this process. One of my favorite things sometimes, man, I mean, I, I, I, it almost.

[Sal DiStefano]

Always, I mean always when is the truth not right?

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, the most right, because then it's like we want to encounter it, but you're like, oh, but there's truth there.

[Sal DiStefano]

One of the biggest lies that I, I, I'm really beginning to understand fully around parenthood and marriage in particular. But parenthood specifically, is that what the culture sells you? And I say culture. Culture is largely driven by markets and media because that's what makes money. So that's what you're seeing a lot of. And what the culture will tell you is you can have it all. So, oh, you're going to get married, but you don't need to sacrifice any of your personal time and your needs and it's a great time. Or you can have kids, but you could still do it all. You could still have fun with your friends and go out all the time. You're not going to lose any intimacy with your spouse. You're not going to lose any. Here's how you can lose nothing and gain everything. That is not how it works. When you get married, things change. You throw some stuff away, but you gain new things. When you have children, you throw some things away, but you gain new things. You're not going to have it all you know, fellas, you're not going to be able to go out with your buddies all the time and hang out now that you're married like you did before, even though the culture will tell you you're not going to be able to.

[Justin Andrews]

This was so countercultural 100. That's why it was like, such, like a left field experience.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yes.

[Adam Schaefer]

Well, don't you. I remember people telling me, like, that what a mistake is, is for you to build your life around your child. I was told that that's a mistake. That's a mistake. What you should. What you should do is you bring that. I mean, Katrina. I remember that conversation with Katrina and I, and like, we agreed, like, that's right. You know, we're gonna travel still. We're gonna do this. And it's like. And because you were told that that's a. That's a mistake. It's like, you don't. You know, so many people, they completely change their lives because they have a kid and they disappear and they don't do all these things. And it's like, that's right. We're not going to lose our. We're not going to lose that. It's like. No, it's. Maybe you do. I mean, or maybe you don't, but sacrifice. It's literally like, that's how society has spoken.

[Sal DiStefano]

Totally.

[Adam Schaefer]

And so, yeah, you get someone like that who comes on and kind of just completely shatters that paradigm. Yeah. It's frustrating. And then, you know, the people. I think the ones that bother me the most are the ones that, like, that still haven't figured out that we named Mind Pump. Mind Pump for a reason, and we didn't name it Barbell Fitness. You know, guys, stay in your lane.

[Justin Andrews]

Fitness.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah. Podcast. You stay in your lane, like Mind Pump. It's about growing your mind. Right. And there's a lot that's encompassed in that, a lot that's not related to just lifting dumbbells and barbells. And we intentionally did that because that was something that we selfishly wanted. We wanted to pursue something that was more interesting than. Than barbells and dumbbells. Yeah, we could talk about that.

[Sal DiStefano]

That's our expertise. That's where we're going to go.

[Adam Schaefer]

That's right. So when. So I tell you what. When you hear us talk about that, you bet your ass I'm talking to you. I bet your ass I'm talking to you. That I know better, because I do. And that's it. And come at me for that stuff. But, hey, when we're getting these other guests that are coming on that they're the experts are marriage and relationship stuff and raising kids. And this is an economics.

[Justin Andrews]

Go argue with them.

[Adam Schaefer]

This is all of our. This is our. This is part of why we wanted to do this is so that we could bring these people on. And. And this is us sharing it with you. Our journey of going through that. It's not us telling you this is how we think per se because there's times there's guests come on too, by the way, that are talking to us. Doesn't necessarily. I agree with 100% of what they're saying, but we're listening and we're trying to learn and be better ourselves. So was a reason why we called it mind pump.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah, 100%. So, Justin, I'm gonna switch gears here. You. I sent you some clips of the UFO disclosures that are coming out. Did you. Have you seen. So they just released.

[Adam Schaefer]

So not.

[Sal DiStefano]

They just released the first authentic, quote unquote authentic video of a UFO retrieval.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, that was weird.

[Sal DiStefano]

Where they actually got a. And they said, no, this is a. A unidentified flying object that is not man made. It looks like an egg. And it's not a very compelling video.

[Justin Andrews]

No, it's not. It's.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah, but it's. But it's authentic. And then there are interviews with these people who said that they interacted with it. And. And what's weird is they're all talking about how it's like a spiritual experience. Yes, dude, I could communicate. It was communicating with me and I could communicate with it. What through our minds. And I felt this incredible spiritual presence. And then we all got really sick and it's all these weird stuff that is starting to strengthen my theory that we're probably not dealing with aliens. It's demons.

[Justin Andrews]

I think it's you and Tucker Carlson are on that tree. He's all about that.

[Sal DiStefano]

But I'm like spirit. What do you mean? You know, talks with your mind. It makes you feel like this wonderful spiritual presence or whatever. That sounds weird.

[Justin Andrews]

It sounds weird. Yeah, it sounds. Sounds like magic.

[Sal DiStefano]

But they're gonna. Apparently they're be releasing more and more of these disclosures. Yeah, I mean, you think they're building up to something.

[Justin Andrews]

We're about to see quite a weird shift. There's going to be a lot of things that I hope all these disclosures really do happen and we, we can, you know, gain a little bit of insight with a lot of the shenanigans going around. But yeah, the. I guess the that's what's funny, though. I'm more interested in actually the, the fabric underlying our government of like, all the bad actors that we're going to finally, like, get the, the real story.

[Sal DiStefano]

Of, like, apparently they're going to release it.

[Adam Schaefer]

I'm so, I'm so not like that'.

[Justin Andrews]

Interested in the, the, the UAP stuff is like, ancillary.

[Sal DiStefano]

What a weird time, though. If they had released any of that.

[Justin Andrews]

UFO, I would have been so much.

[Sal DiStefano]

More into that 20 years ago. It would have made national news. Now it's like everybody, Nobody cares.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. I just want vindication that, you know, this meddling, you know, can be out in the surface now.

[Sal DiStefano]

Speaking of, like, you know, politics, did you. Trump, I think, did one of the most smart political moves and I don't necessarily agree with, but did you see what he did with, with TikTok? What he's doing with TikTok?

[Adam Schaefer]

Didn't you let it back on?

[Justin Andrews]

Well, that's the thing. Yeah. All of a sudden it's like, we don't have it.

[Adam Schaefer]

Oh, catch me up on this. So the last, we had discussed this just last week, Supreme Court upheld that.

[Sal DiStefano]

It could get banned.

[Adam Schaefer]

That it was going to get banned. Right. It was like there was a deadline, it was going to get shut down.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam Schaefer]

And then I think that lasted for 24 hours and then it's back on. What happened?

[Sal DiStefano]

Trump said he's going, he said he's going to try and work out a deal if it's 50% owned by the US government to be able to keep it. Not US government, US companies, they'll be able to keep it on. I think he also guaranteed companies who continued to host it that they won't get sued. But now why is he doing this? Is it for the economy? Is it? No, I'll tell you why he's doing it. He just crushed Gen Z votes.

[Justin Andrews]

That's it. And he even mentioned that helped elevate him in votes more so than most of the other platforms.

[Sal DiStefano]

You should see the TikTok, like all these TikTok influencers right afterwards. Trump's the best, bro. This guy knows how to play politics so well.

[Justin Andrews]

Getting that next generation already, man.

[Sal DiStefano]

100. Why he did it.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah, that's weird to me. That's 100 and I don't understand how, how does a, how does a company get 50 control? So let's say.

[Sal DiStefano]

So they'd have to sell half of it to an American company is what they would have to.

[Adam Schaefer]

Oh, they would literally have to give up half of Their company.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah, I think that's what he said. They'd have to sell it. I think they'd have to put it up for sale.

[Adam Schaefer]

I mean, imagine someone approached us that way. In order for Mind Pump to be played in China, we have to give up half of our company.

[Sal DiStefano]

Sell half of our company.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah. You're not doing that.

[Sal DiStefano]

Well, I mean. Well, we're not in the market. They might.

[Justin Andrews]

I don't know. A lot of companies have sacrificed that, you know, and then they end up. Well, there's been a lot of takeovers of corporations in China back in the day, so. Yeah. Do you hear about all those?

[Sal DiStefano]

No.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh, yeah. So there was. There's been a few. Or like the state, like they finally, like, they brought people in.

[Adam Schaefer]

Oh, yeah. I've heard this happen. And then I thought they tried to do that with Tesla.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam Schaefer]

Where they bring them in and they pretend like they're going to be a part of it and then they basically cut ties. They just take all their technology around.

[Justin Andrews]

Literally flip it.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

But, you know, that's the thing. It's like, I don't know.

[Sal DiStefano]

As the father of two teenage kids, I was happy. They're going to take, take, take them all off, man. Let's do this. A little selfish, right? Yeah, whatever.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah. It's an interesting move for sure, though. I was, I was kind of looking forward to a lot of the, the influencers crying about it for a while.

[Sal DiStefano]

Dude. Some people. That was their entire businesses. Yeah. And they were, they would. They were making a great living on TikTok and then it suddenly gone.

[Justin Andrews]

Well.

[Adam Schaefer]

And I heard that Real or Instagram had like released all this stuff that was supposed to be identical to Tick Tock to pick up. Right. Like literally the next day.

[Justin Andrews]

That was my conspiracy. I'm like, oh, yeah, that was interesting. Zuckerberg's shifting gears. All this stuff. I'm like, that's a little suspect. And then like. But there's no Tick Tock. Like, where are they all gonna go? I'm like, meta's just gonna.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah. So I wonder what happened. I would love to be a fly on the wall and behind closed doors on all this stuff. Because it's interesting one that Instagram was ready to go. So the day, the day TikTok was shutting down, Instagram was releasing all these features that basically make it identify everybody over. Yeah. To capture that. And then 24 hours after that, then it's released. That must have been the curveball. That must have, like, I imagine, like, because it makes Sense that Instagram is like, oh, wow, TikTok is getting shut down for sure. All hands on deck. Let's, let's do whatever we gotta do, tech guys. And let's build the software or whatever the capabilities to capture all these tick tock kids now. So they can still tick tock away on Instagram, right?

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Sal DiStefano]

Is that the word?

[Adam Schaefer]

I don't even know.

[Sal DiStefano]

That's like, who's tick tocking right now? It's like that Morbius movie.

[Justin Andrews]

It's morbid time when you used to.

[Adam Schaefer]

Call our YouTubers or whatever.

[Sal DiStefano]

Hey, what about, what about bitcoin and all the, all the, all the blockchains crushing.

[Adam Schaefer]

Where is bit right now? Where is it?

[Sal DiStefano]

Dude, one bitcoin is. What is it worth right now?

[Adam Schaefer]

Is it over 60? Where is it at?

[Sal DiStefano]

No, $3,000.

[Adam Schaefer]

Whoa, really?

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah, dude, because, because they think that he's going to, that they're going to make it like a legit thing that they're going to, they're going to add regulation around it and make it like something that. So bitcoin is taking off.

[Adam Schaefer]

Oh, we're going to regret that one. Well, at least you grab some I.

[Sal DiStefano]

A little bit. Listen, I'm going to tell you guys a story right now that hurts my heart when I tell it. It's a true. This is. Guys, this is a true story, okay? It hurts my heart. I swear to God. This is true. I had Martin, you know, Martin, when I, you know, my client Martin, years ago, this was probably, this has to be 13, 14 years ago. My client Martin, who's a hardcore libertarian. It might even be longer than that. Doug, he's a hardcore libertarian. The libertarians were free market people, right? They knew about blockchain and bitcoin well before anybody else. And I'll never forget, he came to me, I was training him, and we would talk about economics. And he's the guy that showed me, you know, introduced me to Milton Friedman, all that stuff. And this was kind of like my introduction to economics was through. Was through Martin. Great, great guy, love him. And he said, hey, there's this, this coin that came out. It's. It's called blockchain technology. It's digital money. And I remember explaining it to me and I remember it just going right over my head. I'm like, what? I don't get it. What is it? How does it work? He goes, sal, he goes, listen, trust me. He goes, just buy a few of them.

[Adam Schaefer]

He's like, I'd like to pay for my next session in 50 bitcoins. I don't want 50 bitcoins in imaginary coins.

[Sal DiStefano]

He literally. I swear to God, that's what he said to me. Because back then, to buy it, you had to buy a separate wallet. Wallet. He goes, I'll help you set it up. This is a true story, Sal. I'll help you set it up.

[Justin Andrews]

You couldn't even buy real things.

[Sal DiStefano]

Buy a few of them. I think it would have cost me a hundred bucks to buy, like, four or five of them back then or something like that. Okay, okay, maybe. Maybe even less. I think I would have bought, like, 10 or 15. It was a lot.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah.

[Sal DiStefano]

And he goes, just buy some of them. Put like, 500 bucks on it. Leave it. And I remember thinking, like, ah, sounds so weird. I didn't make any. Nah, I'm cool. And we were gonna do it. I was gonna do it so I could right now be worth, like, $50 million. But I never did it.

[Adam Schaefer]

Probably more than that. So what. Did you guys see that? Did you guys see that Netflix documentary on the couple?

[Sal DiStefano]

No.

[Adam Schaefer]

Oh, God. What's. Did you. Dylan, did you see it? You know what I'm talking about.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh, man.

[Adam Schaefer]

There's a couple that did this that were stealing bitcoin, and they stole. They stole.

[Sal DiStefano]

How do you steal it?

[Adam Schaefer]

So I don't know, bro. Come on. Ask me. If I asked me a question like that, you'll be, like, this super hacker, you know? It's exactly what they are. Yeah, they were. They were. They were hackers, and they. They hacked in. And they hacked in early. So they were like. They were like.

[Justin Andrews]

That's my fear.

[Adam Schaefer]

They were skimming it early when, like, a half of one was gone. And so this was, like, over the course of I don't know how many years, but the reason why it blew up was because they couldn't get it out. So they could mine it and steal it.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Adam Schaefer]

But it ended up being worth so much money that it would be. And you can trace it.

[Justin Andrews]

So obvious.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah. So it would be obvious where it was coming from. And it finally caught up to them. But.

[Sal DiStefano]

Biggest heist ever.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yes. You guys have to go.

[Sal DiStefano]

Oh, my God. 4.5 billion.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yes. Yes.

[Sal DiStefano]

Out of here.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yes.

[Sal DiStefano]

You're too successful. Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

You did too good a job.

[Adam Schaefer]

Guys haven't watched it. You got to watch it because it's entertaining as. Because the two people that do it were. Part of why they also got caught up was because they were building Instagram personalities at the same time, and they were weird and over the top, and they're so it's a hilarious, like, story. And even when the feds caught on to who they were, they didn't believe it was. They didn't believe it was true because there was no way these two knuckleheads were sophisticated enough to have stolen this much Bitcoin. It's a hilarious. It's a great. It's a great little series. Yeah, that's a. The shout out for that. You guys will like that one.

[Sal DiStefano]

What a terrible problem to run into. Hey, we stole billions of dollars. It's too much.

[Justin Andrews]

Too much.

[Sal DiStefano]

No way we could get it out.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah.

[Justin Andrews]

Too far.

[Sal DiStefano]

So technically, I'm a billionaire, you know.

[Adam Schaefer]

Because that's what I get. Okay, so that makes. So bragging. That is what makes it so difficult. To completely steal is like hacking. It's one thing, but then to get it out.

[Sal DiStefano]

Impossible. Because they trace everything.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yes. And that much money would be easy. I remember you could sneak away a couple grand worth of stuff, but not billions or hundreds of millions. And that's how they ended up. It was wild. The. The way they figured it all out. It's really interesting. It's an interesting story.

[Justin Andrews]

Is it true that John F. Kennedy, like, one of the other reasons they speculated that he got assassinated was because he was creating a natural note that was removed from the federal U.S. coin. Reserve. Yeah, U.S. coin.

[Sal DiStefano]

He was the guy.

[Justin Andrews]

Why can't we do that? Let's get back to that and do something tangible.

[Sal DiStefano]

Time.

[Justin Andrews]

Every change.

[Sal DiStefano]

Every time something happens in that direction, somebody gets assassinated. I know.

[Justin Andrews]

That's why, like. But now they're doing all these crazy changes. Let's go.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah, Well, I don't know. Yeah. Look, if. If you ever want to learn about this, read the Jekyll. Excuse me. From Jekyll island and the Fed. That's a book by Ron Paul. Kind of break it down to you. It is crazy that we don't make our own money.

[Justin Andrews]

We don't make our own money. It's not even part of this country.

[Sal DiStefano]

No, the Federal Reserve.

[Justin Andrews]

World Bank.

[Sal DiStefano]

The Federal Reserve. Not a federal agency. It's like FedEx just has a name. It's a private bank.

[Justin Andrews]

I'm always, like, baffled that more people don't know that.

[Sal DiStefano]

It's a private bank that we have said is the only bank that we could borrow official government, like, official currency from. That's what we did. We took a bank. It would be like Mind Pump becoming the official fitness program creator for everybody. And nobody else could create it. But in order to use it, the government has to borrow Them. And then we always get interest, no matter what.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah, sweetheart.

[Justin Andrews]

Deal, dude.

[Sal DiStefano]

What a deal. They get that deal.

[Adam Schaefer]

It is a sweetheart.

[Sal DiStefano]

It's wild.

[Adam Schaefer]

You know, I. You were talking about partners earlier and I meant to bring this up because. So Katrina manages the partners for us. Right. So I, I, every once in a while I'll be sitting there and hearing emails and she'll be putting notes together for us when we have the ads and stuff like that. And I overheard her talking about the organifi had sent over that it's national Green Juice. And I'm like, I don't know, National Green Juice weekend. So I go, I go, that's bullshit.

[Justin Andrews]

My birthday is green juice day.

[Adam Schaefer]

So. So it's a real thing.

[Justin Andrews]

Want this?

[Adam Schaefer]

So it's a real thing. I thought it was fake. I thought it was something that you.

[Sal DiStefano]

Petition for a national.

[Adam Schaefer]

I don't know.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, I gotta find that out because I don't know.

[Adam Schaefer]

But I, I actually was, I really thought I was like, oh, that's brilliant. Come up with it. Like, we're gonna have a maps of National Day. We're gonna bring up too and do a bunch of sales that day or whatever.

[Justin Andrews]

But by the way, didn't you say it was Starbucks?

[Sal DiStefano]

Starbucks was involved with it in 2016.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah.

[Sal DiStefano]

National Green Juice Day. Yeah.

[Adam Schaefer]

Interesting.

[Justin Andrews]

How interesting is that?

[Sal DiStefano]

Is there a National Deadlift Day or something like that? We can start that probably is.

[Adam Schaefer]

I feel like they're kind of is. They've become. There's days for almost. I know there's a donut day. I know that. So I'm sure they won't forget what.

[Sal DiStefano]

You call Valentine's Day. Don't say it. Yeah. So the green juice from Organifi has ashwagandha, by the way, for people wondering why theirs is so popular. Ashwagandha lowers cortisol. Also helps with cravings. You guys know that? Yeah, helps with.

[Justin Andrews]

I notice that.

[Sal DiStefano]

So it could. It has great. Has beneficial effects for appetite control from a craving standpoint.

[Adam Schaefer]

Now is that. Because that's all. So we've talked about this before. You get a bad night of sleep and.

[Sal DiStefano]

Correct.

[Adam Schaefer]

And cortisol. Yes, you are right. And so it's the cortisol spike probably that is most likely responsible for those ravenous cravings that you have.

[Justin Andrews]

Tamps that down a bit.

[Adam Schaefer]

And so taking that. Interesting. You know, I don't know if I've ever intentionally taking the green juice after a bad night of sleep to see if it would do that. That actually would be a really cool. I Love the audience. Okay. The next time you have a really bad night's sleep, hopefully the audience has figured this out because we've talked about it so many times, Right. Like, I remember this was a big. Unlocking my. My habits around diet. There's something to be said about just becoming aware of why you feel a certain way, how it becomes easier to resist that.

[Sal DiStefano]

Of course. Especially when you know it's about to happen.

[Adam Schaefer]

Right. So when I know, like when I. If I have a terrible night's sleep, right. Like, really bad, I know right away that day I'm going to crave weird foods. Foods that, like, it'll just that I don't normally eat, that are just greasy bad for me. And so because I know that it's easier for me to resist that now in my 20s, I allowed it to steer me. It's like, oh, and just that. Just normal. But when you know it, I feel like that's a big deal. So hopefully the audience knows that because we've talked about it. It'd be interesting people that have. That do know it and aware of it to intentionally try and use the green juice to try and mitigate that and see if they notice the difference.

[Sal DiStefano]

Speaking of aware and this and that, I saw you. Now, are you. I'm gonna guess that you're trying to offset your sex appeal because it's so high. Because today I saw you wearing. I saw you wearing Crocs. I'm like, is Adam getting too much flirting?

[Adam Schaefer]

There's no.

[Sal DiStefano]

No proof what happened, dude. And there were white crops.

[Adam Schaefer]

There's no proof. There's no proof.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schaefer]

So listen, this is.

[Justin Andrews]

You're our fashion guy.

[Adam Schaefer]

So I'm fighting a cold right now from the weekend. And. And so I'm taking all the things, right? And this morning. And you know, the mornings are the worst when you. Because you all dry. Yeah. Yeah. So this morning, I. I woke up, and we're up a little bit early because it's the day Vicki cuts her hair. So I'm up. I'm like, you know, the. Katrina and Max are still asleep. I'm being quiet and put all my stuff on. I've taken all the. All the meds, all the glutath, everything, right? So I'm taking all my stuff. And our house right now is. I turn the heater off at night, so it drops all the way down, like, 60 degrees. So it's like freezing cold in the house. And it's kind of my routine. I get to get. I'm trying. And I think you're like this, too, because you get up early. Like, you know, I keep the lights dark. I kind of do my thing, try to be as quiet as I can before I sneak out the house. So when I first get out of the shower, the house is cold. Cold. And so as soon as I get dressed, I slide my Crocs on. My Crocs are my house slippers, basically. And they keep my feet warm before I. And then my downstairs is where I keep all my J's and all my shoes. I have a separate closet for those. And then that's right before I head out the door. So I'm cloudy and foggy. I'm doing all my thing. And I don't even realize. I never forgot. I never changed my shoes. I don't even know until I get out of the car here. I literally, I. I opened my door and I kicked my foot out. And I looked down.

[Sal DiStefano]

I went, this must be a nightmare for you.

[Adam Schaefer]

Oh, it was. I called. It was emergency call Katrina. She got down here. I said, you can't. I said, you got to get down.

[Sal DiStefano]

This is like those bad dreams. You go to school. Yeah.

[Adam Schaefer]

You naked. This is like mine. So I call her and I go find out. You'll never guess what I did. And she's just like, what would you do? And I was like, honey, I'm wearing my Crocs. And she's like, what? And I'm like, I never put my shoes on this morning. And she's like, oh, my gosh. She starts laughing. I said, you're coming down here, right? She's like, yeah, I'm going to be down a little bit. I need you to get down here now. I said, give me that. Bring me a pair of my jays. Something that has red in them. Just bring them down. I said, whatever. Whatever pair. Just anything else but what I got on right now. So can't go. Can't go on there and have my Crocs and just. You sold me out.

[Sal DiStefano]

But that's a.

[Adam Schaefer]

Such a. I mean, I didn't. I drove the whole way here. Never. That's how cloudy I was, though, you know? And then it wasn't until I got out.

[Sal DiStefano]

Oh, man. And I was like, I wish today was one of those days where we had, like. Like an important guest or something.

[Adam Schaefer]

Oh, it would have been embarrassing.

[Sal DiStefano]

That would have been amazing.

[Adam Schaefer]

That would have been embarrassing. Yeah, I would have been embarrassed.

[Justin Andrews]

High profile.

[Sal DiStefano]

I thought you did it on purpose. No, you always. Your shoes.

[Adam Schaefer]

This is a deal. This is a deal I made. Even with My wife. Right, because she hates them too. And I remember if those have been listening to podcasts long enough. I talked a lot of about crocs back in the days and then I. I'll never forget my nephew had him up at the Truckee house and I slid my feet in those little furry crocs and I went, oh my God, this is just pure crocs. But I vowed, I said this, listen, new balance coming next in the house, walking around. I can wear them, but I'm not dressing them and going out in public and them stuff like that. Like, like a 16 year old. I'm not doing that.

[Sal DiStefano]

Dude, people wear crocs at the gym everywhere.

[Justin Andrews]

Oh no, everywhere.

[Sal DiStefano]

Kids wear them all the time.

[Adam Schaefer]

That's why I don't. That's why I refuse to wear them like that.

[Sal DiStefano]

Now did you put yours in sport mode or did you have the.

[Adam Schaefer]

They're all hurting. I've never worn sport. I've never worn them in sport mode because they're only slippers for me. They are literally walk around the house. The furthest I get outside is to take the trash. Trash cans.

[Justin Andrews]

Really? Cause little accessories you put in with the little charms.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah, little charms.

[Justin Andrews]

I'm gonna start buying you some of those.

[Sal DiStefano]

I have a couple of mine at home. Yeah. Because my son liked them. So I have like Lightning McQueen 1 or something else.

[Justin Andrews]

I got moccasins, so I can't really talk.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah bro, you and your moccasins.

[Adam Schaefer]

I mean I got some. I definitely have some shoes that for a shoe person. I would be embarrassed that people knew I had them for around the house situation.

[Sal DiStefano]

My favorite shoes that I see anybody in here wear is when Doug wears his expensive cowboy boots, his alligator skins.

[Adam Schaefer]

Oh yeah, his gay.

[Sal DiStefano]

He's got a different walk.

[Adam Schaefer]

He's got a little hip shift.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah, dude. Oh, Doug's trying to like.

[Adam Schaefer]

He's almost like he's that holster in a gun.

[Justin Andrews]

He's flexing on us for sure. I need to get some spurs.

[Sal DiStefano]

We let him walk around the block, you know, he's got his little boots on. Like look at Doug, man. Look at all fly double holsters. Mass zymes by bio optimizers are digestive enzymes that will supercharge your protein digestion. In fact, some studies show that taking the digestive enzymes and mass zymes will increase amino acid absorption by 1200%, make your protein much more effective, but also help break down your fat and fatty acids and your carbohydrates into more digestible forms of sugars. Things that your body needs for energy anyway, Go check them out. Get yourself a discount. Go to buyoptimizers.com that's B I O P T I M I z e r s.com mindpump. Then use the code mindpump10. Get 10% off. All right, back to the show. This segment is brought to you by trainerwebinar.com where you can watch free webinars from Adam and I. By the way, our trainer course now is accredited. You get continued education units from nasm. Check it out.

[Justin Andrews]

Our first caller is Amelia from Michigan.

[Adam Schaefer]

Amelia, how you doing?

[Sal DiStefano]

How are you?

[Justin Andrews]

Marian, hello.

[Tiffany]

How are you guys?

[Sal DiStefano]

We're great. How can we help you?

[Tiffany]

All right, well, I will read my question just so I don't get off topic. So I will just kick it off. As I mentioned, I've been working in the health and fitness space for a while. I started back in 2019 and I am currently an online coach working for another business and then an in person health coach at a functional medicine doctor's office. And I'm really comfortable as an online coach. But in my role as a functional medicine health coach, I'm working with patients, you know, up to 30 patients at a time throughout the week with nutrition and lifestyle. And about a third to half of these patients, especially since I submitted my question, are on GLP1 peptides. So either semaglutide or tirzepatide. And we do offer a host of other peptide therapies as well. But when I'm working with patients, I predominantly see GLP1s and then BPC157. And a majority of the patients that do come to see me are also seeing me for weight loss in some capacity. I would say 90% of my patients are looking for weight loss whether they're on peptides or not. So it's really neat. I get to meet a lot of different people in a lot of different places, but I only get to see these patients every four to eight weeks. Sometimes that's longer because there's no, you know, sessions that they're buying. They're just by appointment. And so some people I see twice a year. And that's obviously an adjustment to working with clients on a weekly basis, getting to chat with them throughout the week, like as an online coach or even when I was doing in person personal training. And so in our appointments we get 20 to 60 minutes to chat. We go through an in body, we'll go over nutrition, sleep, exercise, stress. But I want to be able to offer them as much guidance and at, like, an optimal level, since I'm only seeing them once every few months before I may get to see them again if they decide to come back. And so I usually give reference materials, podcast episodes. I'll make handouts. I have recommended books. I often recommend maps, programs. And I'm just wondering, you know, how you guys might approach this kind of situation to optimize their progress when it's a lot more hands off this.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah. You would have been a great trainer to have been in our group that we just did. I mean, we had coaches and trainers that watched US coach GLP1 patients every week. You know, that was. And there was a lot we learned with those patients. And I can imagine if I only got to see them once a month or every other month, what a challenge that would be to. To keep them on target pace. I know from our experience, the number one challenge and the hardest thing is them hitting their protein targets and, and, and doing that consistently. And in the inevitable will happen, which is almost all, if not all will end up having to reverse diet at some point. And so that's probably the greatest challenge that we had, was communicating that. And I think it's. If I had. If I. Could you imagine if we only had one time to talk to them for every every two months?

[Sal DiStefano]

I mean, she's saying even less than that once every four months or twice a year. You know, I would say, Amelia, you have to fight the temptation to want to give them all the information all at once because you're not going to see them again for a while. Yeah, that's a good point, because that's probably. I know that's what I would be tempted to do, like, okay, I'm not going to see you. So here's all. So here's a workout plan, here's diet advice, here's sleep advice, here's stress advice, here's 10 podcasts, here's all these reference.

[Adam Schaefer]

Great point.

[Sal DiStefano]

And what ends up happening is they end up doing none of it because it's too much all at once. So the best strategy, in my opinion, is to find what they'll do and focus just on that. The less the better, because you're meeting with them so infrequently.

[Adam Schaefer]

I mean, would you agree then the. The point I was making about the protein would be like the main thing that you're probably hammering. Probably.

[Sal DiStefano]

I mean, it depends on the person. Right? But I think what I would do, because again, ideal is not. I wouldn't go with what's ideal. I would go with what you believe they're gonna do and adhere to. Okay? So it's gonna be less than ideal advice because you only have 30 minutes or maybe an hour if you're lucky. So what I would do is I would say, here's a good protein powder. Okay. Ideal would be whole natural foods. But you're not gonna be coaching them. If you coach them on a regular basis, totally different. But you're gonna meet with them once. Here's a protein powder that I like. Can you tolerate dairy? Yes, I can. No, I can't. Okay, get this protein powder. I want you to take it twice a day. So there's one very prescriptive. Take this twice a day. They'll probably do it because it's very basic, very simple. Here are three exercises I want you to do every day. And I would show them bodyweight squats, wall pushups, and some band rows. That's it. So the entire 30 minute period is gonna be coaching them on technique of the exercise, protein intake, when to take it, and then, hey, by the way, if you're finding it difficult to even drink this protein shake because GLP1s can be really, really powerful. You can also try amino acids, essential amino acids. It's a lot thinner and easier to process. And then maybe creatine. And then, you know, when it comes to. And then here's some of the challenges you may encounter. And you bring up the challenge. If you encounter these challenges and come up with the most common ones, here are some references and resources I think you can point to. So here's a podcast about reverse dieting. Here's a podcast about, I think I'm getting weaker, I don't have enough energy. And that's it.

[Adam Schaefer]

That's a sal. That's a really good idea. If she put together. I don't know if you've already done this. Maybe you've already done this because you did say you reference a lot. Like I would have like a, you know, faq. You know, like here's the top five challenges people have. This, this, this.

[Sal DiStefano]

If this happens to you, go, yeah.

[Adam Schaefer]

And if, and if you are challenged with this, this, you need to listen to this episode of Mind Pump. If you're challenged with this and we've, I mean, flowchart. Yeah, we've probably covered it most these points in, in a, in a topic or at least if you go to askmindpump.com you could probably get a more specific answer. But yeah, something like that where it's like I'm picking in that one session, obviously the individual, they're, they're going to vary. Although I think the most common will be the protein thing. But it'll vary because they're going to be some people that they, we found that can hardly even work out at all. And then others were like, man, they were training, they were wanting to do more because they had the energy. So knowing what you can prescribe, focusing on that one or two things and then having a FAQ thing.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah. In my opinion, the 30 to 60 minute session would be, would start like this. Asking questions, get to know them, make the case for what you're about to recommend. Keep it simple. So I need to kind of make the case. Okay, well, here's what people experience going on a GLP1. The data shows people can often lose a lot of muscle. Now I wanna Let you know, GLP1s don't cause muscle loss. Here's what's happening and why people lose muscle. So now I'm making the case. And here's what happens when you lose muscle. Your metabolism can slow down the low calories you're eating now, stop working, stop losing body fat. So here, so this. Now I'm painting the, I'm painting the picture. I'm making the case now. Here's what you should do. Take this protein shake twice a day. Can you tolerate dairy? Yes. Okay, here's the ones I recommend. Twice a day, every day, I want you to take this and then I'm gonna show you two exercises or three exercises that I want you to practice. Try to do them at least a few days a week. But if you do them every day, that's great as well. And then the rest of the session is teaching them how to do those exercises and getting them comfortable to do them if they leave. Think about it this way. If they leave that session with you and all they do is take a protein shake and do two or three exercises a day, it's a big win.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Sal DiStefano]

Because you don't again, you don't get to meet with them very often. Then if you meet with them again in four months. Hey, how was that shake? How are those three exercises? Oh, I didn't do it. Scale back or. Yeah, I did it. It was great. Cool. I'm gonna add one more thing to that. So it's, it's just like coaching. The difference is you only get to meet with them once and what you want to fight is the urge to fire hose them with tons of information. Because what will happen with that guaranteed is they'll do nothing yeah, they'll leave and do.

[Adam Schaefer]

They'll try and do all of it and realize they can't stick to all of it and they give up on all of it versus hitting the one or two big rocks. That is probably going to make the biggest difference.

[Sal DiStefano]

Totally. 100% okay.

[Tiffany]

No. Awesome. I definitely think that's a mistake I made when I first started was let me give you everything until I see you next time.

[Adam Schaefer]

And.

[Tiffany]

And then I saw that that was not, not productive.

[Adam Schaefer]

I mean, it would be hard not to do that. Right. Because I get. I mean, I'd have the answers. Yeah. Because you know the answers. You know what, it's coming and you only get that one time with them. So. But yeah, I like, I like that. I like the idea of one, two big things. But then you can have the faq, you know, if this go to here. Watch these resources. Do you guys. Do you guys not have like a forum or a community where these people can at least.

[Sal DiStefano]

Great idea.

[Adam Schaefer]

Meet and talk like on online emails?

[Tiffany]

So it's like a primary care office. So. Yeah, they might for different patients. We have different levels of, of patients, like concierge versus just our primary care patients. They might, but I don't see as many of the like top tier patients. I see more of the primary care.

[Adam Schaefer]

Who are now a million. Would you be overstepping them by creating your own Facebook group or something that you like and it's more like a support. So you're not committing to. I'm going to coach everybody individually. But hey, here's a support community where all my GLP1 clients that I've created on Facebook, you could join and, and we can help each other out and I'll dip in there and share articles. I mean, that would probably be really valuable in maybe not a huge commit. I mean, and a very good, really good look on you for the company that you thought of something.

[Sal DiStefano]

Oh, yeah. If I own the clinic and you said that to me, I would be like, oh my God, that would be an incredible service to offer. And then for you, you're probably going to get clients out of that who eventually want to work. Work with you as well, which I'm sure isn't an issue as well. Right. But I think that's a great idea, Adam.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah.

[Tiffany]

Yeah. I can definitely bring up to the. My supervisor and see how she feels about that. For sure.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah, I would hope they would do that. I think you could really help a lot more just having a community.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah. The way I would bring it up is I'd say, you know, it's really challenging because I don't get an opportunity to work with these people or communicate with them and answer questions. Would it be okay if I created a free forum? They have them. You know, you can create one on Facebook and then they just go in there, and then if they have a question, or I could post some information in there just to help them stay consistent or provide a way for them to get better resources. That would only help the clinic, because the more successful these clients are, the more successful the clinic is.

[Adam Schaefer]

We got to get you in our course, Amelia.

[Tiffany]

I know. I've been watching it. I just. I am. I am going to be bringing a tiny human into the world in April. So we have been really tight. Thank you. We've been really tight on things so that when I take maternity leave, we don't have anything to worry about.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah. That's great. Congratulations.

[Adam Schaefer]

Congrats.

[Tiffany]

Thank you. Thank you.

[Sal DiStefano]

Does that help you? Do you have any other questions?

[Tiffany]

No, no, I think that's it. I think. I just. I'm sure you hear this a lot. Well, I know you hear it a lot, because I hear it. I kind of knew what answers were going to be, but I do think an FAQ page would be super, super helpful. I think a group forum would be really good for our clinic. And then just piecing those pieces together and dialing it back a little bit, probably on my end, would be super beneficial for our patients.

[Sal DiStefano]

Totally.

[Adam Schaefer]

Awesome.

[Sal DiStefano]

Well, thank you.

[Adam Schaefer]

All right.

[Tiffany]

Yeah. Thank you, guys.

[Sal DiStefano]

Thank you. Yeah. You know, for anybody who's listening right now, who's a coach or a trainer or even somebody who wants to pursue fitness themselves, it doesn't. The information doesn't matter. Regardless of how effective and accurate it is, if nobody applies it, there's no adherence. And so, as a trainer or a coach or somebody who wants to pursue health and fitness for yourself, you always have to ask yourself, is this going to happen? Am I going to be able to do this consistently? Or as a coach or trainer? Are they all going to do all this? Are they going to be able to do this forever? If it's a no, then it's not only a waste of time, you're actually setting them back. So always the number one consideration is what will actually be done. Let me start there.

[Adam Schaefer]

I feel like I wouldn't even ask permission. I would just do this, I think.

[Sal DiStefano]

Forums.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah.

[Adam Schaefer]

Just to be a good look. It'd be a good for the boss to find that out that you did that.

[Sal DiStefano]

Totally.

[Adam Schaefer]

Like, yeah. And Come from a place of just. I'm building a community of support. I don't see how that would be a conflict and it would be a shame if someone stopped her from doing that. And the value that I think that community would get considering they don't get any contact with her. But every other month, I mean, for sure.

[Sal DiStefano]

Agreed. Our next caller is Jeff from Connecticut. What's up, Jeff? So, Jeff, how can we help you?

[Justin Andrews]

Happening.

[Sal DiStefano]

Hello.

[Adam Schaefer]

Thank you so much for taking the time to answer my question.

[Sal DiStefano]

You got it.

[Adam Schaefer]

So I keep hearing you guys talk about needing to hit protein every day because there's no reserve of it. It's got me wondering about the timing of consuming it throughout the day though. If there's no reserve, it seems it'd be best to space it out into a lot of small meals throughout the day or to consume it surrounding activity. For example, I have two kids that are competitive gymnasts and they have practices that are three and four hours long. I'm curious, it would be best to consume a lot of protein before or right after or just. Just looking for your opinions on the best way to time it. That is true. And that would be. That would be ideal. Although nothing trumps the total. Right. So if a client came to me and they were trying to time it optimally like you're asking right now, and I'd say yes, but then they go like, I just have such a hard time. I keep missing my approach intake. It's easier for me to get more in the morning or late at night. Then I would say, listen, hitting it total is far more important than the timing of it. But if I've got an athlete that's going to do whatever I tell them to do and they have a three hour practice like that. Absolutely. Loading it before and after would be an ideal situation.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah. I mean there's two scenarios here. Two ways to answer this. Number one, the number one thing to consider with protein throughout the day is digestion. The second thing to consider is you probably don't want to eat it in a way that interferes with your sleep. Like right before bed, everything else starts to become splitting hairs except for when you're talking about high level athletes. When you're training for three to six hours at a time, you want to have some carbohydrates and some protein, probably before, during and after just to continue fueling the body. Now most people don't work out for three to six hours, so you'll rarely ever hear us make a big deal about this. Like most people go to the gym and they'll work out for an hour. And it's like, okay, it's not that big of a deal. You probably don't need carbohydrates and protein during your workout or before your workout or after. It doesn't make that big of a difference. But when you're talking about training for that long, it starts to make a difference with performance. It does. But if you're not doing that yourself, consider digestion. In other words, I'm hitting 200 grams of protein a day. Should I eat it in four meals or should I eat it in one meal? Well, probably four, because 200 grams at once isn't going to feel very good. And so it's really a digestion issue. It's like, what can my body break down and what's going to cause me gastric distress or what's going to feel good? That would be the top thing.

[Adam Schaefer]

Okay, that makes sense. That makes sense. And it gets difficult because they actually don't get home from practice until 9:00 at night. So they kind of, they have to eat dinner after that generally. Right. And that's, that's why I say number one is the hitting it. Right. So that's like the top priority is whatever the number is, which I'm sure you've heard us talk about, you know, their goal weight and in grams or whatever, that's the main goal. Then comes timing. Right. With an athlete like that, it's like I want to make. So I would never tell her when she gets back from practice and it's nine o'clock at night and she's under her protein intake. Oh, just because it's late at night, don't do it. Even though Sal brings up the point that it's not the most ideal time for digestion, but it's also she needs it. So it's like I'm gonna tell her to get it at that time.

[Sal DiStefano]

And you know, in a scenario like that, I would make sure that they ate something an hour or two before. And then during training I would have some kind of a. Yeah. Liquid ready to drink. Protein. Yeah. So, you know, maybe some like a, a protein shake that they could have halfway through.

[Justin Andrews]

That's what I did with my kids. Same situation exactly with the gymnastics in that long. It, it is taxing and they do need that to replenish that, you know, throughout the, in the middle of the practice. So. And they would eat late. And honestly, it. As long as they can digest it, it doesn't impede on their sleep. Like, it's. It's just something that they can kind of. They're pretty resilient with it, so.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah. And then maybe carbohydrates.

[Adam Schaefer]

Did you have ready to drink shakes? Is that what you did?

[Justin Andrews]

We did shakes or we did like, you know, like beef jerky and. Yes, you know, stuff like that. Just for snacks and nuts and. Yeah, yeah.

[Sal DiStefano]

But you know, and you can have some like carbohydrate in their drinks, little electrolytes, just through the practice, and that would all work out great. And you base it off of how they feel. Some athletes consuming too much during training starts to take. Take away from the performance. Other people need a little bit more. So I would start low and then just take it from there. Okay.

[Adam Schaefer]

Can I ask something a little bit more specific about it?

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah, sure.

[Adam Schaefer]

Okay, so if. Let's just throw a nice round number out there. Say the, the number was 100 grams of protein they needed in a day. Is there a certain percentage of that you would want to group around the.

[Sal DiStefano]

Practice or, I mean, you were starting to get into the hair splitting, you know, territory. If you're eating 100 grams of protein in a day, I would make sure to have about 35 grams of protein for breakfast. Maybe another 30 before practice and then after the other 30 or something like that, or 35. And then I try to load up.

[Justin Andrews]

A lot in the morning.

[Sal DiStefano]

And the carbohydrates should probably be in there before the practice and after as well, especially if you're going to bed, because it can help with cortisol when you. When you have some carbohydrates. So if you find that they have trouble sleeping after hard practice, some. Some starchy carbohydrates with their, with their dinner can probably help.

[Adam Schaefer]

I'll tell you this though, Jeff. If you are getting your kids to consistently hit their protein and take target at any time of day, you're. You're winning compared to most people, for sure. That's. It's really hard to get kids to be consistent with hitting their protein intake or to even care about it much less. And so as a dad, if you were accomplishing that already, you're. You're definitely winning.

[Sal DiStefano]

You know, Jeff, let me give you something easy. Are your kids okay with dairy?

[Adam Schaefer]

Yes.

[Sal DiStefano]

Oh, milk. Bring some whole milk. Done.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah.

[Sal DiStefano]

Here you go.

[Tiffany]

Yeah.

[Adam Schaefer]

So for my, my daughter, that's gonna work. My son doesn't like it, but. But he's okay with it, you know?

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah. Literally, like, you bring a whole milk, juice, milk box, and hey, halfway through Drink this. And literally there's, there's actual studies on this comparing milk to protein powder sport drink similar. And it does just as well because.

[Adam Schaefer]

It'S pretty much the same thing. Just a little bit of boosted protein.

[Sal DiStefano]

You got some sugars in there, some fat, some great protein.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah.

[Sal DiStefano]

There you go. Okay, sounds good. You got it. Thank you.

[Adam Schaefer]

Thank you so much.

[Sal DiStefano]

Milk has got to be one of the most overlooked, you know, performance drinks.

[Justin Andrews]

We've watered it down so much over the years. It's like, if you just get like whole milk, it has all the nutrients, it's got everything.

[Adam Schaefer]

I don't know if you guys remember this. I think I mentioned it to you a couple years back. This was almost, I want to say like four years ago. Chocolate milk, I remember. Yeah. Was reaching out to us because they were trying to make a big comeback in sports.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah. Because there was a study, it was an actual study that compared chocolate milk to like expensive, you know, protein performance drinks. And it was the same.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, totally.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah. I mean I could get behind it. Totally. I, I think it's just, I think dairy got such a bad rap that we started. Yeah. So we just started saying that was not, it's not a great choice for that. But it really is. And really that's the only difference between chocolate milk and then a protein shake is the protein shake's got an extra 10, 15 grams.

[Justin Andrews]

You know, this almost makes me angry, this conversation though, because I. This is the kind of stuff I'll stress like on my kids and like all this and the buy ins, everything. So if he's getting the buy in from his kids. Yeah. I don't think he realizes what a win that is.

[Adam Schaefer]

I mean, that's what that was. My point was just like, dude, if, if you're a dad and you got your kids caring about trying to hit their protein intake, like, all right, yeah. When. And then, and then we might play with, oh, let's try 25 today and let's do it this. I mean, if they're bought in like that, then, then have some fun with it, then mess with the different. Because the truth is it's. We are splitting hairs at this point. So long as they're hitting that. And so then I go back to what kind of Sal said it becomes. What convenient in digestion. Like what's easy for them, what can they do consistently? What do they like I'm going to be playing with those things versus what do the studies say is the most optimal time for this one?

[Sal DiStefano]

Increases muscle proteins.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah. It's like, dude, my kids, my kids care.

[Justin Andrews]

Lmnt, you know, we'd be doing all the things right.

[Sal DiStefano]

Our next caller is Tiffany from Canada. Hi, Tiffany. Hello.

[Justin Andrews]

Hello.

[Sal DiStefano]

How can we help you?

[Ben]

Hi, everyone. Hi, gentlemen. I've just begun taking a GLP1. 40 years old, 170 pounds. My maintenance calories are about 2000 as part of my protocol. You know, I've been drinking 2 liters of water a day, walking. I've been training with Maps 15 using light weights, hitting 140 grams of protein daily. And I really started the GLP1 to just help curb my cravings a bit. But I don't want to eat too low of calories, like where it makes me sick. I lose weight too quickly. It hinders my ability to maintain muscle. So my question is, how do I know if I'm eating too low of calories While on the GLP1?

[Sal DiStefano]

So before going in the GLP1, you re, you calculated that your maintenance was at 2000?

[Ben]

Yeah, that's what I was eating. And my weight really didn't change based on my level of activity.

[Sal DiStefano]

Okay. Now, ideally, so I'm just going to be straight with you. I wouldn't cut your calories until reverse dieting you. Nonetheless, we're here. You're on the GLP1. It's going to reduce your caloric intake. I wouldn't want you to go below 1500. I would want to continue to strength train, hit your protein targets. Once you plateau, you're going to want to fight the urge to go lower with your calories. So once the plateau hits, what I would try to do is reverse diet. Get stronger. That's what you want to focus on. Get your calories back up to 2000 or a bit higher and then cut again. I don't like seeing anybody below 1500 calories. And on a GLP1, it could be real easy to get below a thousand.

[Adam Schaefer]

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

[Sal DiStefano]

And that's when the muscle loss happens. And what you don't want to do is plateau at a thousand calories a day.

[Adam Schaefer]

Well, the truth is. The truth is you're going to. Right. So I'm with Sal. Like in this situation, if you were my client, the first thing we would have done would have been reverse diet first before we did the GLP one. But since we're here, I mean, I'd put you down to 1500, get a little bit of weight loss because you will get some from that and then you're going to hit a plateau. And then when you do, we got to go back the other direction. And then I'd love Doug to give you our GLP1 program. Even though I think Maps 15 is a great program and works for this. We have other things that we talk about in there, like related to nutrition and diet and stuff. Kind of like you're alluding to and asking so that if you are, you know, having challenge with it, you can refer to what we recommend inside there.

[Sal DiStefano]

How. How long have you been on the GOP one?

[Adam Schaefer]

She just started, right.

[Ben]

I only just began, so it's only been like a, like maybe a month.

[Sal DiStefano]

And have you noticed any effects yet with the appetite?

[Ben]

Yeah, it's definitely curbed. Curbed it. So, like, there are like some digestion issues and it just like you don't feel hungry. That being said is I've still been able to hit like my protein targets and if like I needed to eat 1700, I could make it work.

[Sal DiStefano]

But do you know what you're eating now just on the GLP1, what you're averaging?

[Ben]

Yeah, I'm still tracking and it's been like about 1700.

[Sal DiStefano]

Okay.

[Ben]

I've been way too scared to go below because I don't want to eat. Like, I don't want to lose the muscle that I've already built on my body and.

[Sal DiStefano]

Good job.

[Adam Schaefer]

Good girl.

[Sal DiStefano]

Good job.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah.

[Sal DiStefano]

Slow is better. With this track your strength. Your strength is going to tell you a lot. With weight loss and a reduction in calories, a little bit of strength loss is often happens regardless. But if you start to notice, like, energy really dips, strength really go down, then. Then you know you're going a little too low. You're probably taking a multivitamin. Right. Make sure you're not hitting. You're. You're not missing any essential nutrients. Creatine is a great supplement regardless. But I really like it for people on a GLP1, you know, make sure you're drinking enough water because with the reduced hunger signal, what we're seeing now is actually a reduced signal for, for water as well. And some of the lean mass loss might be just a little bit of water loss.

[Adam Schaefer]

You're Tiffany. Did you. So we've been on for 30 days and you've been down to 1700. Have you seen the scale move at all or has it been maintaining the same?

[Ben]

It was a. It was very minimal, which I wasn't worried about yet because I don't want to lose too quickly either. It was maybe like point like a quarter of a pound, like a week or something. So there's no swoosh yet or anything?

[Adam Schaefer]

No, that's. I mean, it's actually considering where we're at calories and what you're doing, it's probably the best case scenario that you're going through now because you're hitting. If you're hitting your protein intake and your strength training and you're a little bit lower calories worries. The scale might not move very much.

[Sal DiStefano]

Or it just might be a slow.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah, real, real slow. Because what might happen is you might have a nice little exchange every now and then you build a little bit of muscle because you're able to hit that protein intake. And then other times, like, you'll lean out a little bit. So you're probably in the. In the best spot you can be right now. The hardest part will probably be the psychological part of doing this for such a long period of time and maybe not seeing that drop that much. But if. If strength is holding or even potentially gaining. We've seen some clients that saw some of that. That's an awesome place where you're.

[Sal DiStefano]

How's your performance in the gym been during this process?

[Ben]

It's been steady. I mean, I. I purposely switched to, like, much lighter weights so that I wasn't really, like, push pushing myself at all.

[Sal DiStefano]

Good.

[Ben]

So it'll be interesting. Like, I really appreciate the. The GLP1 program and I'll see, like, if I can, like, maintain that as well. I'm not sure what the trainings entailed in that, but if it's similar to ma.

[Sal DiStefano]

Tiffany, I'll be straight with you. Of all the people we've had here on GLP1s, your approach is the most sound intuitively.

[Justin Andrews]

Yeah, you're really.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah, you're really. You're really.

[Ben]

Cause I listened to you guys.

[Sal DiStefano]

Hey, so did they. But they didn't really.

[Justin Andrews]

Do you actually listened to us?

[Sal DiStefano]

No. Great job. I mean, here's another strategy, Tiffany, is you could cycle Your calories between 1200 up to 1800 on a weekly basis. In other words, some days, a couple 1200 calorie days. Oh, let me bring it back up to 1800 for a day or two. Now let me go down to 15. You can cycle your calories and we don't have a ton of data to support this, but in our experience, this tends to result in better results rather than a kind of a consistent 1500 or something.

[Adam Schaefer]

I mean, I would rather see that if possible because obviously, I'm sure there's days where you're like, man, I don't really that hungry. On those days when you're not feeling it, I would allow those to be a little bit lower. And then days when maybe the appetite kicks up or maybe you strength trained or you had a little bit more activity, then feed it a little more. And I, I would like that. I would like to see kind of you undulating.

[Sal DiStefano]

But what might just happen is if you stay around 15 to 1700, you might see progress for a while. It might just be slow, but you might not hit a pro a plateau for a while, so long as your, your strength training and sleep are all in check and you're hitting the protein targets.

[Ben]

Okay. I like that approach. Like the undulating throughout the week.

[Tiffany]

There are, there are.

[Ben]

I know, Adam, you went on it. There's some days where you're like, oh, I could definitely hit like everything. And there are other days where you're like, I'm not hungry.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yes, like, totally.

[Ben]

But you know, you need to hit your protein. I know you'd mentioned the reverse dieting and ideally I maybe would have done that first, but is there an calorie number that you would have, you would have felt more comfortable with me starting at before?

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah, I would've liked you to be more like 25, 2600 before we came back down. Yeah.

[Sal DiStefano]

Okay.

[Ben]

Because I know in, in a past episode, like when you were going through the Geo with the GLP1 crew coaching, that there were some people you mentioned that you tried to reverse diet, like while they were going.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yep.

[Ben]

Through the process too, just because they got too low and I'm assuming maybe they plateaued.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah, I mean, some, there was, there were some people that plateaued for six months. Yeah. At like a thousand or twelve hundred calories. Yeah. So at some point, probably almost everybody in there was going to have to reverse diet.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah.

[Sal DiStefano]

That was the most, that was the most, you know, compelling thing that we.

[Adam Schaefer]

Now the cool thing about using the GLP1 while you do that is, I mean, and it sounds like it's affected you like this. It definitely affected me this way. And I've seen this with most people is the desire to, you know, eat the foods that were, you know, more hedonistic or that you had attachments to. Wasn't there, like, I didn't have the craving for ice cream or can't, none of that stuff. And, and so when you do tend to reverse diet, the, you know, if, if you can stomach in eating the food, you don't really have the desire to binge or eat on the other ones that are, you know, you're Going to put a bunch of extra calories. So, you know, the clients that we did reverse diet were. Were successful doing it in that obviously, we only had them for a short period of time. So it'd be neat to see where they're at six months from now. But it seemed that most people at one point would have to reverse a little bit because they would get to a point where they're down into the low thousands, and it's like in a. And at a plateau, and the inevitable. They got to go the other way.

[Ben]

And is that like a month or a couple months? They usually reverse diet.

[Sal DiStefano]

It depends. Yeah, it depends. But you. You. You could do it slow. You would add, like, 100 or 200 calories a week and see how you feel. Typically, what happens is you don't see any changes except for more energy and strength, and you can slowly do that process. If you start to see the scale go up too quick or whatever, you just pause the reverse and focus on getting stronger. If you're getting stronger in the gym, that is one of the best signs.

[Adam Schaefer]

That the reverse diet even maintaining. Right. With that low calorie, if you're maintaining strength, it's a really good sign.

[Sal DiStefano]

Well, I mean, when she reverses.

[Adam Schaefer]

Oh, yeah. Tiffany, are you in our private form yet?

[Ben]

I'm not.

[Adam Schaefer]

I'll have. I'll have Doug put you inside the private form so we have access to.

[Ben]

I super appreciate.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah.

[Ben]

This is the first time I've called in. It's amazing. I'm so happy I'm talking to you guys.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah, thank you.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah, no, we're gonna send you the GLP one so you have access to that, and then also the private forum. And so as you go through this process, just let us know. Keep in touch with us. Maybe every 30 days or so, give us an update on what you're noticing. If you have any questions, reach out, and hopefully we can give you some guidance as you go through this.

[Ben]

Amazing. Thank you so much. Yeah. I'm so glad I talked to you at the beginning of this journey.

[Adam Schaefer]

So, yeah.

[Sal DiStefano]

Awesome. Great job.

[Adam Schaefer]

You're doing great, tif.

[Ben]

Thanks. Have a good day.

[Adam Schaefer]

You, too.

[Sal DiStefano]

Bye. Yeah, let that be a lesson. Anybody starting a GLP1, it's first off rare that people have her approach.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah.

[Sal DiStefano]

But it is. It is the right approach. If you do it right, you will not hit the inevitable pitfalls or challenges or plateaus that will occur from a rapid cut in calories. Where, you know what you don't want to do is, like, imagine this. Imagine the Scenario I need to lose £60. I go into GLP1. I start to lose weight. Oh, my God. I've lost 35 pounds. And I have, you know, whatever left 25 pounds, left 30. And I'm plateauing, and I'm only eating 1200 calories a day. Yeah. What do I do? Eat 1200 calories for the rest of my life? Stay on GLP1 forever? Because there are other effects from eating low calories. You don't just get less, you know, you don't just lose weight. You'll have less energy, you'll have less nutrients, and you don't want to live on 1200 calories for the rest of your life. So it's not just about getting better results. It's also just you don't feel good.

[Justin Andrews]

Our next caller is Ben from North Carolina.

[Adam Schaefer]

What's up, Ben?

[Sal DiStefano]

How you doing, man?

[Justin Andrews]

What's up?

[Adam Schaefer]

Hey, guys.

[Amelia]

How are y'all doing today?

[Sal DiStefano]

Good. How can we help you?

[Amelia]

Good. So I will just get right into it. My question's a little complicated, so you're welcome. I've got a little bit of a pelvic asymmetry that I've been trying to get to the bottom of. So I have what I was told is basically pelvic torsion. So basically, on my pelvis, my right ilium is a little bit flexed forward, and my left one is a little bit posteriorly tilted the opposite direction. I know this because I had it measured by calipers that measured the degree of tilt from the ASIS to the psis. And then when I look at myself in the mirror, I can see that I have. When I put my fingers on the two bony parts, they're in different spots. And so on my left side, where the pelvis goes backwards, there's a bit of a hip height. So my rib cage is closer to my pelvis on that side. And this also is evident in a little bit of a muscle imbalance that I've developed. So basically, on the side where the pelvis goes forward, my right side, the quads and thighs are a little bit more pronounced, whereas the glute on that side is a little bit more atrophied and weak. And the opposite is true on the other side. So the pelvis on the left side goes backwards, so I have a little bit more glute, but less thigh and quad on that side. And I've also noticed that, like, if I do, like, a single leg deadlift, the side on the left where there's a hip hike, I'm A little bit more imbalanced as opposed to on the right. So I ran. I've tried a bunch of different things to try and correct this. I ran map symmetry all the way through recently, which, as a bit of an aside, was awesome. It didn't. So it didn't really do anything for my pelvis, but it completely fixed the shoulder problem I was having. It was almost. It was. I couldn't do any overhead press or benching, and I ran map symmetry, and now the shoulder pain is almost completely gone. So props to y'all for that. But I'm still dealing with this weird pelvic thing and. What. And I've just recently started reintroducing barbell work back into my routine, and everything's going okay so far, but I'm just kind of wondering, like, should I be worried about this? And if so, how do I address it?

[Adam Schaefer]

Did you play sports? Martial arts. Did you do something? Oh, interesting.

[Sal DiStefano]

What's your background, by the way? Because you seem to be knowledgeable on. On communicating anatomy. Are you a trainer?

[Amelia]

Yeah, I'm a. I'm a personal trainer, and I. I was trained initially through the Czech Institute, so I'm about a level two.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yep, that's right.

[Amelia]

I haven't done much with them in a while. I've just been kind of learning on my own since then. But that was, like, kind of where I learned how to, like, even address these sorts of issues.

[Sal DiStefano]

And you're pretty sure that it's torsion, Right? It's not like a lateral, you know, flexion or extension issue. Right. It's. It's just. It's actual torsion. Yeah, yeah.

[Amelia]

Because, I mean, like, I. If I put my fingers on my asis and I look down, I can.

[Sal DiStefano]

See that the ones forward and one's back.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah.

[Sal DiStefano]

Now, here's the challenge with something like that. It's such. It. It's so insidious. Right. Unilateral work won't even work because you're going to compensate on one side or the other. Bilateral work won't work because it's already compensated. You. You wanna. Okay, now I'm gonna give you the obvious. You know, look at the tight muscles, the psoas, the internal external obliques are probably contributing. Maybe the ql is contributing, but this is a. A muscle recruitment pattern issue. And you gotta go way down to the root of what's going on. So, you know, pelvic work is. Is. Is where I'd focus. Like, you know, pelvic clocks, pelvic tilts, side bends. But honestly, Ben, I. I think you need to work with someone who can watch you and do this correctional exercise with you. Maybe even pelvic floor exercises might be something that you. You want to look into. Because it's gonna be really hard to self assess. It's gonna be really hard to not.

[Adam Schaefer]

Even just self assess. It's like what I did with Kyle where it's like, I need another pair of eyes.

[Sal DiStefano]

That's what I mean.

[Adam Schaefer]

Look at the movement and tell me.

[Justin Andrews]

Like, last little inch.

[Adam Schaefer]

Cause even though I knew, Even though I knew the corrective stuff that I needed to be working on, I knew that I couldn't see it very well. And he'd give me little details like, oh, no, you need to drive the hip in more. And then I would feel it. I'm like, oh, there it is.

[Sal DiStefano]

Here's the problem. You're going to do unilateral work and your form's going to look good on both sides. You're going to do bilateral work, and unless you have a really good eye, it's going to be really hard to pick up unless somebody's kind of watching you. So really, I would boil it all the way back down to pelvic articulation, like just movements that I. That move the pelvis, you know, anterior, posterior, lateral rotation, and try to articulate the pelvis in different ways and see if we can identify, you know, any discrepancies. But I really do think you're probably going to want to work with someone who understands, who can watch you and identify. Because once you identify and then you have someone kind of pointing things out, it could be corrected. Otherwise, all your workouts and stuff, it's just gonna. It's just gonna strengthen.

[Adam Schaefer]

Do you think, do you think Dr. Brink could help him virtually?

[Justin Andrews]

Yes, potentially.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah, definitely. Especially because. Ben.

[Adam Schaefer]

Ben, are you in it because he knows? Because he's knowledgeable?

[Sal DiStefano]

Because he knows.

[Adam Schaefer]

Right. Are you in our private forum, Ben?

[Amelia]

I am not.

[Adam Schaefer]

I'm gonna put you in the private forum. Doug will do that.

[Sal DiStefano]

Tag. Tag Justin Brink.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah, Dr. Justin Brink is in there. If anybody could help you virtually, obviously getting someone like him in person would be great. But finding someone who is more knowled you are, who can watch and assess you and teach you through this process is going to be difficult. I know if there's anyone that can do it, it's him. And he may even be able to look at you while you do it on a video and give you those cues on what he sees. And so tag him, reach out to him. And maybe you guys can connect. That would be my best advice.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah. And the muscles to look at would be soaz. Internal external obliques. I would look at quadratus, lumborum, iliacus. I would look at all those muscles and see if you can articulate each of them on either side. And if you notice any differences in how they feel, it's really hard to see on yourself. But see if they feel different. You would also press on them with a little myofascial release, maybe a lacrosse ball, and say, oh, that's tender. That's tight. I would also look at piriformis, basically everything that can. That can, you know, stabilize or articulate the pelvis. But if I were in your shoes, as knowledgeable as you are, I would hire somebody, and I'd say, okay, I.

[Adam Schaefer]

Would defer to Dr. Brink here. This is where I. This is above my pay grade as far as being able to even help myself. I'm going over to somebody who's got an eye for this to see me, and then tell me what they see that I don't even notice. Gotcha.

[Amelia]

Okay, cool. Yeah, that would be helpful because, you know, trying to find.

[Justin Andrews]

I can't really afford a whole lot.

[Amelia]

Of, like, specialized physical therapists, so trying to find people that are. That take insurance, that don't just do this by the book stuff has been like. There's such a divide as to whether or not, like, it's even possible to have, like, motion at the si joint.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah.

[Amelia]

You know, like, I say, like, that's not real. Don't worry about it. Then other people, you know, say, like, oh, you have to fix this, or else you're gonna die, so.

[Sal DiStefano]

No, Brink is the best.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah.

[Sal DiStefano]

That we found.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And you're gonna need somebody like that for it to be worth your time, so. And honestly, Brink might be able to help you with just some things in the forum, so. And you may not even have to invest in him and. Or actually spend time, but if you were going to. That's the guy.

[Sal DiStefano]

At the very least point in the right direction.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah, that's the guy that I'm going to. To help me with something like this.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah.

[Amelia]

I mean, I use plenty of his stuff from Prime Pro on my clients, so, you know, I'm already. I'm already, like, on his team, so that's good.

[Sal DiStefano]

Awesome.

[Adam Schaefer]

Right on.

[Sal DiStefano]

Awesome.

[Amelia]

All right, so I. More super quick question, hopefully, is that all right?

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah, let's do it.

[Amelia]

Yeah.

[Adam Schaefer]

So hopefully less.

[Amelia]

It's a training question. It's a Trainer question. So basically, as you guys probably know, a lot of most of my clients that I see, I can only see are only really able to come in roughly about twice a week, sometimes three times a week, but usually it's twice a week. And I want to be able to use maps programs with them. But almost all of the programs are three days a week. Do you have any quick tips on like, ways to condense those into a two day a week format to try and fit these clients schedules?

[Sal DiStefano]

I mean, with your exp. How long you been training people?

[Amelia]

Like almost two years.

[Sal DiStefano]

Two years. Okay, so you're relatively new, but you sound quite intelligent. I would use them, the maps programs as a scaffolding essentially, and then individualize the program yourself. But if I'm training someone once or twice a week, it's almost always full body each time.

[Adam Schaefer]

Well, yeah, because I say most our programs are base full body. So you could just drop a day anabolic.

[Justin Andrews]

You already have that.

[Adam Schaefer]

You could drop a day on a lot of them because they're full body like that. Or pick and choose like the exercise. Like. Okay, I really like the day three. So I'm gonna drop day two this week and do it that way based off the client.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah, I mean, just two general ideas. Right. One is kind of full body strength training. The other is one day of strength training full body. I'm doing maybe four exercises. Then the other day is correctional exercise where I'm focusing on movement pattern issues. Correctional exercise, pain. That was generally speaking, what my clients did with me.

[Adam Schaefer]

You could, we could also take maps 15 and put them up together.

[Justin Andrews]

Stack two together.

[Adam Schaefer]

So yeah, stack two, that's so maps 15. You could stack the days together so that. Because there's only two exercises each day. So you could take the, the format of Mass 15 and go, oh, I want you to do all of Mondays and Tuesday's workout today, and then on Thursday when you come into the gym again, I want you to do the. The other two workouts and you can combine them like that.

[Amelia]

Okay, got it.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah.

[Amelia]

Let's just kind of figure out where the muscle groups are that are being worked by each workout and just kind of pick and choose the exercise.

[Adam Schaefer]

Well, you could, because the way we laid out Mass 15, it could literally be that simple. You don't even have to pick a choose. You literally could just smash the two days ago.

[Sal DiStefano]

So Maps Resistance would be a good program for him. Doug, why don't we send that to him? That was a two day week routine that I set up for probably a Majority of your clients.

[Amelia]

This and maps resistance. That's kind of in between starter and anabolics.

[Sal DiStefano]

Exactly correct.

[Amelia]

Yeah, that would be super helpful, thank you.

[Sal DiStefano]

You got it, man.

[Adam Schaefer]

Can't wait to hear. Yeah, good luck. Ben, I'd like to hear back from you how it goes with. Yeah. When you tag Brink, tag us too. Cool.

[Amelia]

Yeah, we'll do. Appreciate the advice, guys.

[Adam Schaefer]

All right.

[Sal DiStefano]

Yeah, it's. You know, as a trainer, when I would get stuff like this is why, this is why I always tell trainers you want to have a network of people you can refer to because you will not have all the answers. But what you need are the people who have the answers that you can send your clients to in this scenario.

[Justin Andrews]

Like, well, such a hands on thing. You need to visually see.

[Sal DiStefano]

I wouldn't be able to do this as well as.

[Adam Schaefer]

No, I know. I, I know better for sure. And not only that, though, like, even when you, you have the knowledge and you do know, this is a point of like somebody's like, I knew, I knew what to do with my rehab, but having even Kyle watch me go through it. And as I think I'm doing the movement perfect, he's looking at little details and I'm telling you your body compensates unconsciously. Yes. And he would tell me a cue, like, oh, no, Adam, your hips coming up, you know, like drop or put your right side in a little bit. And then I would do it and be, oh, whoa. I feel like it was that big of a difference yet I'm going through it. I'm doing the right movements. I think I'm looking, I'm like, okay.

[Sal DiStefano]

And you're experienced.

[Adam Schaefer]

Yeah. So I mean, because there's a lot.

[Justin Andrews]

Of kin stretches you could point them to, but if you're not going to apply it with those like very specific cues and get the maximal effort out of it, like, it's not. You're, you're just barely scratching the surface.

[Adam Schaefer]

Well, especially with something like this. Yeah, that's very, yeah, so very. It's so nuanced. So many, ever so many things that are incorporated in this. So. Yeah, no, this is like above. I tell you what though, as a trainer, there's nothing more frustrating than like having the anatomy knowledge and not being able to solve.

[Justin Andrews]

Like, it's like you can't unlock your eyes.

[Adam Schaefer]

Anything that drives me more crazy, it's like having a problem, knowing the problem and like not being able to fix.

[Sal DiStefano]

It is like, I've had clients with pelvic torsion. I've had clients with pelvic floor muscle issues. Yeah, and it is frustrating to identify. And once you identify, it's hard to work on. Oh my God, so hard. Look, if you like the show, come find us on Instagram. Justin is mindpumpjustin I'm mindpump distefano Adam's mindpump Thank you for listening to Mind Pump. If your goal is to build and.

[Justin Andrews]

Shape your body, dramatically improve your health.

[Sal DiStefano]

And energy and maximize your overall performance, check out our discounted RGB super [e-mail] the RGB Super Bundle includes Maps, Anabolic Maps, Performance and Maps Aesthetic nine months of phased expert exercise programming designed by Sal, Adam and Justin to systematically transform the way your body looks, feels and performs. With detailed workout blueprints and over 200 videos. The RGB Super Bundle is like having Sal, Adam and Justin as your own personal trainers, but at a fraction of the price. The RGB Super Bundle has a full 30 day money back guarantee and you can get it now. Plus other valuable free [e-mail] if you enjoy this show, please share the love by leaving us a five star rating and review on itunes and by introducing.

[Justin Andrews]

Mind Pump to your friends and family.

[Sal DiStefano]

We thank you for your support and until next time, this is Mind Pump.

[Adam Schaefer]

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