Dare to start with an audience of one - Malika Favre & George Wu

Summary

Daring Creativity – Episode Summary

Episode Title: Dare to start with an audience of one – Malika Favre & George Wu
Podcast: Daring Creativity
Host: Radim Malinic
Guests: Malika Favre & George Wu
Release Date: May 4, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this engaging episode, Radim Malinic sits down with celebrated illustrator Malika Favre and designer George Wu to explore the origins, philosophy, and evolution of their collaborative passion project: "I Can't Afford This But Maybe She Can." This candid conversation unpacks how a joke between friends became an unexpected, 350,000-strong Instagram community—and eventually an online curated shop, all without compromise or commercial intent. Together, they discuss the joys and challenges of modern curation, the pitfalls and potentials of social media algorithms, and the value of creating for an “audience of one.” The discussion is lively, authentic, and deeply insightful, relevant to anyone daring to create with purpose and care.

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Meet The Guests [05:01–06:41]

• Malika Favre:
  • French illustrator with 15+ years’ experience; based in Barcelona.
  • Known for reducing the complex to the essential, “paid to draw.”
  • Shared her childhood drawing of a dominatrix—kept by her mother as a symbol of creative encouragement.
• George Wu:
  • English graphic designer and self-confessed “jack of all trades,” with work spanning events, product design, and direction.
  • Describes herself as a “reluctant influencer,” using creativity to explore across disciplines.

Notable Quote [06:10] – Malika Favre:
"My mom was like the harshest art director you could think of—she would keep just ten drawings a year and throw the rest. But she kept that one [of a dominatrix with a whip]."

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The Origin Story: From Private Joke to Public Phenomenon [07:41–13:14]

Early Friendship

• Malika and George's friendship began over a decade ago, serendipitously meeting in 2008 while being signed by the same production company.
• Their careers started to intertwine through shared social circles and admiration for each other's work and style.

Birth of the Instagram Account

• It began as a playful interaction where George, “shopping in real time,” would send Malika items she longed for but couldn’t buy, only to find them appear in Malika's home later.
• George started an Instagram account, “I can’t afford this, but maybe she can,” meant for an “audience of one”—Malika.
• The feed grew during the COVID lockdowns as both were separated geographically and seeking creative connection.

Notable Quote [12:10] – George Wu:
"I made an Instagram account for literally an audience of one... and started posting genuinely things that I really loved. Then Malika would comment, 'I'm buying this one.'"

• The project evolved from private banter to a community of hundreds of thousands, growing organically without a strategy or intent for virality.

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Philosophies & Values: Curating for Joy, Not the Algorithm [14:41–19:16]

• Started with design objects, but quickly expanded into anything delightful: cakes, trips, crafts, and unexpected finds—sky was the limit.
• Intentionally broke platform "rules": no faces, no original content, no videos or reels, purely image curation out of love.
• The old-school Tumblr spirit infused their feed—community over trend, curation as an act of generosity.

Notable Quote [15:52] – Radim Malinic:
"When algorithms will never beat someone who genuinely cares."

• They refused to commodify the feed; never sold out to sponsorships, sharing for the “beauty of it.”

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Sourcing & The Art of Discovery [16:43–22:55]

How Do They Curate?

• George’s process: Outside social media walls, follows creative rabbit holes via projects and hobbies—“total freedom, anything goes.”
• Malika’s process: Strategic with the algorithm—curates her explore page carefully to discover rare and compelling creators; mindful that one wrong click (i.e. on dog photos) can “break” her feed.
• Both invest considerable time and energy in “stalking” creative networks—deep dives into who inspiring designers follow, chasing obscure craftspeople, and fighting homogeneity.

Notable Quote [19:16] – Malika Favre:
"The algorithm... will give you what you want, but if you start looking at pictures of dogs for a bit too long, it's gone."

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Curation vs. Commerce: Ethics & Challenges [22:55–31:13]

• Recognized that their “outsider” role (not amplifying big brands or trends) provided crucial exposure to overlooked makers.
• Deliberate refusal to do paid/sponsored posts, to avoid the commodified, transactional feel of most social feeds.
• The curation process is "exhausting"—hours of work daily—but rewarding in bringing attention to craftspeople who “need it most.”
• Sought to monetize only when the labor grew unsustainable, experimenting carefully with a curated shop and select collaborations (e.g. with Paris auction house Drouot).
• Their shop operates with fairness: free for brands to join, commission-based on sales only.

Notable Quote [24:29] – George Wu:
"We were giving more exposure to someone doing something very cool for the past 30 years and getting very little recognition from it at the other corner of the world."

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Building the Shop: Technical & Emotional Realities [42:25–49:36]

• The shop launch was a major undertaking: over 8 months, contacting 80–90 brands, hand-picking and uploading 300+ unique products.
• Built on Shopify, using custom plug-ins to avoid big affiliate networks and preserve uniqueness.
• Emphasized inclusivity in product and price range—“everything from dildos to bongs, kids stuff to homeware, £10 to £10,000.”

Memorable Moment [44:41] – George Wu & Malika Favre:
"We were meant to have 30 brands... and then it exploded. Because when you ask, and most say yes, you can’t tell them no."

• Learned hard lessons: affiliate sales are financially tough; real value is in their eye for undervalued, soulful objects.

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Community & Impact: Beyond Social Metrics [54:42–57:08]

• Their ethos is visible in tone and care, not declared in manifestos.
• The audience is global, highly engaged (notably, 70% newsletter open rate).
• The pair see their “community” as the real driver behind what they curate and create; feedback and support shape the next steps.

Notable Quote [54:42] – Malika Favre:
"We decided not to put a manifesto on our site. What we are about is there. It's in the tone, it's in the way we talk about people."

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Navigating the Future: Care, Collaboration, and Authenticity [55:50–58:02]

Where Next?

• Plans to expand editorial efforts (newsletter, interviews, highlighting stories and objects).
• Exploring exclusive products and deeper community connections; open to further collaborations but unwilling to compromise vision or care.
• “We'll go where it takes us”—staying open, agile, and committed to doing meaningful, joyful work on their terms.

Notable Quote [58:02] – Radim Malinic:
"If you've got values and a willingness to pursue them and explore them, that eats any business plan for breakfast."

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Standout Quotes & Moments

• On starting with an audience of one:
  [00:31] George Wu: "I made an Instagram account for literally an audience of one."
• On care and curation:
  [24:29] George Wu: "We were outside of trends, because we were finding things that maybe someone had never seen before."
• On the meaning of generosity in the creative world:
  [25:48] Malika Favre: "Maybe it's a bit of a lost battle, but proving that you can still be generous in this space and that creatives should be more generous with each other."
• On community over commerce:
  [54:42] Malika Favre: "What we are about is there. It's in the tone, it's in the way we talk about people."

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Key Takeaways

• Creativity thrives not through perfection or appeasing algorithms, but through authentic connection, curiosity, and generosity.
• Courage and care, not strategy or metrics, turn small acts into movements.
• Curation can be an act of community-building—celebrating creativity, not just consuming it.
• Building something with “an audience of one” can unexpectedly resonate with thousands, if the intent is pure.
• Monetization and growth need not come at the expense of values or vision.
• Being willing to “go where it takes us” is as valid a strategy as any business plan.

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Important Timestamps

• [05:01] – Guest introductions, creative backgrounds
• [07:41] – Friendship origins and serendipity
• [12:10] – The inception of the Instagram project
• [15:52] – Philosophy of curation and platform “rules”
• [16:43] – Sourcing and discovery: methods and challenges
• [22:55] – Ethical stance on commerce and exposure
• [42:25] – Building the online shop: practical realities
• [54:42] – On not needing a manifesto, ethos being visible
• [55:50] – Plans for the future: editorial, curation, and collaborations
• [58:02] – Final thoughts on values vs. business plans

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This episode is a masterclass in care, creative endurance, and building something lasting—starting small, but with heart.

Transcript

[George Wood]

I would see all these things that I'd sent you almost. I was shopping in real time. It was literally every week.

[Malika Favreau]

I literally had a free personal shopper as a joke.

[George Wood]

As you can imagine, I was torn between insane jealousy and also curiosity of what I could get Malika to buy. I made a Instagram account for literally

[Malika Favreau]

an audience of one.

[George Wood]

I called it I can't afford this, but maybe she can, me being the one that I can't afford this and started like posting genuinely things that I really loved. And then Malik would comment on the bottom saying, I'm buying this one, I'm buying this one and then we'll appear in her house. I left it open to the public because I didn't know anything about Instagram and who's going to follow this account anyway? It was just a really silly ide. Foreign.

[Radim Malinage]

Welcome to the Daring Creativity Podcast, a show about daring to forever explore creativity that isn't about chasing shiny perfection. It's about showing up with all your doubts and imperfections and making them count. It's about becoming more of who you already are. My name is Ryan Malinich. I'm a designer, author and eternally curious human being. I am talking to a broad range of guests who share their stories of small actions that spark lifetime discoveries, taking one step towards the thing that made them feel most alive. Let me begin this episode with a Are you ready to discover what happens when you dare to create? What happens when a shared joke between two friends become a 350,000 strong community and nobody planned any of it. My guest today, Malika Favreau, is one of the most celebrated illustrators known for work that reduces the complex to the essential and makes you look twice. George Wu is a graphic designer, maker and self described reluctant influencer. Together they created I Can't afford this, but maybe she can. A curation feed built on friendship, taste and a fierce refusal to sell out. In our conversation, we talk about building with love and no budget. Curating is an act of generosity and what it means to post to an audience of one when algorithms will never beat someone who genuinely cares. This episode is full of joys and it's my pleasure to share with you my conversation with Malika Favreau and George Wood. Hey, Malika. Hey, George. How are you doing today?

[George Wood]

Good, thank you. Yeah, it's pretty sunny down here. I'm in Hove near Brighton and Malika is always in the sun.

[Malika Favreau]

It's literally been raining for two days and we're on high alert of winds, so that's wrong. But I'm in Barcelona, so usually it is, but it's been pretty dreadful these past few days.

[George Wood]

I love it how you're wearing the biggest scarf in the world. Yeah.

[Radim Malinage]

This is the fact. Based in England. You're in Barcelona, but you've got the scarf. And we donned.

[Malika Favreau]

Exactly. Which is actually part of a process I call tropicalization. It's like when I moved here after 16 years in London, I thought, oh, my God, I'm going to be warm all the time. It's going to be heaven. Truth is, like, after one year, you start being cold on 20 degrees. It's insane.

[Radim Malinage]

This is the thing. I've got a friend who moved from London to Barcelona. I went to off and I saw him for dinner just before off Barcelona, and he's 18 degrees, 20 degrees, and he's like wearing a winter jacket. And I'm like, you know when people say, you've changed? Definitely, he's changed. Years ago, he'd be walking around London in shorts and t shirt at 20 degrees.

[Malika Favreau]

Exactly. And that's how you see the locals around here.

[Radim Malinage]

We've given our listeners a crash course on where you were, where everyone's based, which is amazing. And, Malika, we will need to put up a picture of your big scarf somewhere because this is. It's quite impressive. Is that that sort of a Lenny Kravitz moment? I think when you get papped outside, when you go for your groceries, it'll be Lenny Kravitz 2.0. But thanks for both of you to actually be here today, because I've seen your talk at Birmingham Design Festival and I was just impressed with what you guys do, how you do it, how you've created your own version of daring creativity in a way of inventing your future. Because you both have careers, respective careers, that are doing so well for you. But there is something in your project, I can't afford this, but maybe she can. Which turned into something of its own. And the story behind it and the energy behind it is something that I really wanted to share here today because it's something that I wish that a lot more people would be encouraged by your story. So, as I normally say on the show, for those who may have never heard of you, how would you introduce yourself? Malika, we'll start with you.

[Malika Favreau]

So I'm French. You can probably hear that by the accent. And basically my, let's say, my real life career and job is I'm an illustrator. So I've been an illustrator for the past 15 years, started my career in London. And I have the luxury of working for myself, not having anyone telling me what to do, which is brilliant and I love it. Literally, I'm paid to draw.

[Radim Malinage]

And what about you, George? Who are you? What you do?

[George Wood]

I'm George. I am English, as you can hear. What do I do? I'm probably one of those annoying creative people that are being a bit vague with when they say what they do. Right now I'm a graphic designer, but I would say that maybe I'm. I like to dabble in a lot of different things, so I've done events directing, product designing to a certain extent. So I'm a bit of Jack of all trades.

[Radim Malinage]

Monica, I've been aware of your career for at least 50 years, but I feel like it's been even longer. But I remember in your talk, one of your first ever illustrations, was it a stripper that you draw? Was that.

[Malika Favreau]

Ah, no, it was the first ever. Like the one, let's say a key drawing from my childhood was a dominatrix with a whip when I was 9, which my mom very carefully kept in a drawer, which I think is actually a really funny bit because she was. My mom was like the harshest art director you could think of. So I was drawing every day and let's say every year she would keep 10 drawings and throw the rest to the bin. And somehow she kept that one. She thought it was very interesting.

[Radim Malinage]

That is very interesting indeed. George, have you got a hidden draw of paintings that questionable nature?

[George Wood]

No, I'm just thinking because my son is nearly three and he's only just started drawing, but almost. I thought he would pick it up sooner, obviously. Very much tiger mom here. And he has just managed to do a face, his first circle with eyes. And I was so proud that I've decided to keep this in the drawer. It's got a long week to go before his dominatrix was whip.

[Malika Favreau]

Oh, you can just send him over to me, George. Just send him over for a little month holiday.

[George Wood]

Got six more years to reach the same level. So my goals.

[Radim Malinage]

So Moby, I think will be great for the podcast to establish why are you two here? How did you meet and actually what is it that you do together? Because there's a story because it was the early separate careers and now you do work together. So how did it happen?

[Malika Favreau]

We're even actually in separate countries now, which is funny, but I think, which is also one of the reasons why this project happened. George and I have been very good friends for, I'd say more than a Decade? No, George.

[George Wood]

We met in, I want to say, 2008, was it? Maybe later.

[Malika Favreau]

Yeah. So I think it was just when I left Airside, the design studio I was working at, and started my illustration career. And it was a serendipity moment where we both got signed by the same production company in London exactly the same week. So we were part of this new onboarding of directors. I was directing animation. George was making a lot of music videos now and TVI dance and things like that. And London being the small world that it is, I actually knew of George work from a show, a final show at the rca and I remember having like a massive crush on her graduation film. And my flatmate knew her, so I knew of her. I didn't know her personally. And I think we met that week and I basically jumped at her like

[George Wood]

a little fangirl, which is hilarious because by this point, Malik, who was very famous, so I'm quite surprised.

[Malika Favreau]

I just wanted George to be my friend. I was literally trying to bully her into becoming my friend and it worked.

[George Wood]

But the funny thing is, I think I'd been to your house many times. I was friends with your flatmate. I've been to house parties in your bedroom. And like, years before, yeah, I used

[Malika Favreau]

to live on Brick Lane, so we used to have these massive house parties where like, literally people were coming from the streets. Imagine 200 people in your house. So that's probably why we did not meet each other at those parties. We'll be back after a quick break.

[Radim Malinage]

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[George Wood]

I'd like to also say I'm not a random person from the street. Street going into random parties.

[Malika Favreau]

Now. We had a lot of friends in Commons. Yeah, designers. I also had friends even from Paris who went to the RCA and were in George's class. So I think we were bound to meet. And, yeah, we got on really well. I left. I think I left the animation Altogether and production company. After one year, I would say to just focus on illustration because I realized I didn't like it that much. But we stayed friends. So literally this is what happened. And we were friends for a decade. Very close friends. And so what happened with this project is it started as like a joke. No. So you can tell the story of that project.

[George Wood]

We were sending each other things that you would dream of buying, as any normal friends do. Your hopes, I want to go here on holiday, or one day when I have my own place, I'll buy this chair. And actually started with. I think it's when hey was quite new and they released a gold side table that was almost too small to be properly functional. You couldn't have it as your coffee table and too pretty to want to use it every day. So it was definitely like a luxury dream. I sent this to Malik saying, oh, look at this thing. Gorgeous. And then we went. I think for a week later we went for a drink. And then Malik was like, oh, by the way, my new. My new table is arriving. And I was like, what table? My table. And then it became this weird pattern where I'd go to your house and I would see all these things that I'd sent you almost. I was shopping in real time. It was literally every week.

[Malika Favreau]

I literally had a free personal shopper as a joke.

[George Wood]

As you can imagine, I was torn between insane jealousy and also curiosity of what I could get Malika to buy. I made a Instagram account for literally an audience of one. I called it, I can't afford this, but maybe she can. Me being the one that I can't afford this. And started, like, posting genuinely things that I really loved. And then Malik will comment on the bottom. I'm saying, hey, I'm buying this one, I'm buying this one. And then they would appear in our house. I left it open to the public because I didn't know anything about Instagram and who's going to follow this account anyway? It was just a really silly idea. And yeah. And then slowly, friends started following. And then members of the public started following. And then Covid hit. Malika, you moved to Barcelona and then the rise of online shopping happened, right? Everyone was stuck indoors, so we were all just constantly whatsapping each other loads of things. And also we were bored. I remember I was doing upholstery courses in my living room. I was like, we were all doing

[Malika Favreau]

those Zoom pub quizzes.

[George Wood]

We had a lot of time. And I remember Malika say, oh, you know that Instagram thing That you do. By this point, I've been doing it on my own for about three or four years with no. With no plan. Like, I. I almost posting once every quarter, like, literally wasn't really populating it. And she was like, oh, maybe we do this together. We both post things that we like, we sign them from ourselves. And that's how it grew. And we don't consult each other and what we post. So sometimes the feed looks very harmonious and then sometimes the feed looks insane. Like it's really schizophrenic. But that's the beauty of it. Yeah. And it grew. I can't remember. I think in his first year, it grew to like 50,000 followers in one year. And currently now on correct me if I'm wrong. 338. 350. 350.

[Radim Malinage]

Oh, sorry, I'm actually, I'm going to correct you on three, five, eight. Yeah, it's growing.

[George Wood]

Yeah. And I think the first year, because Maliki, you've already got a massive following as well. So I think a lot of your audience kind of was like, oh, I'm really interested to see what you're doing. And then. But then after that, we noticed that the kind of uptake had plateaued from your account and we'd started reaching people organically through our own feed and it just snowballed. So definitely no plan, definitely no vision at that point. No.

[Malika Favreau]

But I think there is one thing we had clear when we started was let's share people doing amazing things. Let's share beautiful objects. And it's true, it started from a very simple, this is our dream list. I want this. I can't afford it. So it started very much with like, shopping and objects, but because we had no limits, it was a love project. No one was paying us to do it. We can post anything we want. So we started posting anything from cakes to beautiful trips, places, hotels. It could literally, it could be anything. Like, sky was the limit. And I think in a way, at that point, the algorithm was already being pretty unkind to a lot of people. And what we did shouldn't have worked because we did not put our faces, we did not create our own content. We were literally grabbing images left and right and resharing, putting carousels. We didn't do reels, we didn't do videos, we didn't play the game. But somehow I think there is, especially in our. In the design community, a lot of people were missing that, that kind of old school almost Tumblr blogging and sharing things just for the Beauty of it.

[Radim Malinage]

Yeah, you're absolutely right because I'm a lover of color. And everything that you post out there, it's just, it makes you happy, it makes you feel something. George, when you say, hey, this has been slightly bit chaotic to the feed. This is only what designer can say, okay, we need to organize this, we need to make list. Because if someone scrolls, it doesn't matter how it looks on the side by side. I'm not trying to cheapen this because obviously we all put carry on in that grid. And then you're like, some people were like, oh, is that what you did? It didn't come across. Thank you. But George, what I want to find out obviously from you, you're the head curator, at least at the beginning, where do you go to find these things? Because obviously you said you were running this for three to four years on your own, right? Because initially you've been providing the shopping links to Malika and she was buying and buying. But your curiosity, where does it take you and where do you find the stuff in the first place?

[George Wood]

I definitely wouldn't give myself a title of head curator knowing that Malika posts five posts to one a day. So definitely that head career can go over there. But at the beginning, it is interesting because even when we look at the kind of things that we posted at the start, it's really different to what we post now. So at the beginning, I was literally finding your classic design pieces, right? So like things that you would see in places like Conrad store brands, like, hey, your proper graphic design loss. And then I guess naturally I have a really big love of folk art. I really love craft. So that's really fed into it. But what I think is really interesting over the course of the years that we've done this account is actually how much you can let go of your ego. So when it was only an audience of one with Malika, I didn't really care. I'm just putting stuff that I like, right? And then as soon as our friends started joining, of which there are some very like hipster people and quite judgy people in that room, they might be like, I'm not sure about that thing or that thing. And that kind of paranoia might sink in. And then when we started doing the Instagram together, I almost had the safety of Malika and her giant followings. I was like, okay, I'll go back to posting what I like and feeling quite cure. But now, because it's grown so dramatically and I've seen posts from. I remember Malika posting A dish of onions in the shape of fish. Or I'd post what was another crazy one, a textile designer that does amazing kind of reveals when you cut the threads of, like, different illustrations. It's almost like now it's total freedom. Anything goes, anything, as long as it makes us smile and we find it interesting, then it goes on. So thinking about where we get it from. We've talked about this before, but, yeah, I am a very reluctant influencer. I find social media really difficult. Doesn't take long for me to be like, someone's on holiday. Oh, that's nice for them. Someone's doing an extension on the house. So I actually have to go out of social media to find stuff. And that generally comes from projects that I happen to be working on in my day job or things that I'm interested in terms of my hobbies. And I go a bit around the houses and then bring that back in. Whereas I know that, Malika, you go about in a really different way.

[Malika Favreau]

Yeah, I'm on a constant fight with the algorithm, so trying to tame it so that it gives me what I want. And I would say that sometimes the algorithm has given me, like, really interesting things. And when you look at our Explore page, like, a lot of it is extremely good because I think literally that's the job of the algorithm, is to keep you there and to give you what you want. And if you are very careful about what you look at and what you click on and everything, it will follow you in a way. The problem is that all that job can be gone if you start looking at pictures of dogs for a bit too long.

[Radim Malinage]

So this is an interesting thing about the algorithm, because if you're a creative, if you're a creator, you want the algorithm to work for you and present your work to other people, whereas what you. Monika, quite beautifully described, and I do this with Spotify, my Discover Weekly is highly curated to my taste because I'm very careful about what I save. It's a bit of a musical salad because it's. I'm listening to the same thing in a different colors, different tones, and if that makes sense. But when it comes to the visual algorithm, especially on Instagram, you get people who celebrate it and people who hate it because you want to be seen. But maybe, like, people are not finding you because they're not looking for your rest at that time, because they haven't potentially made as much effort as you have made, because you say it works for you because you're really careful. You mold it in a way how you want it to behave. I think there's a juxtaposition because we see algorithm as a negative word. No one's ever said, hey, algorithms are here. This is great because it's technically a decision made by something else. But I want to go to one point, George, you said, I wasn't confident at the beginning of doing this on my own. And I've learned this beautiful sentence just the other day about courage. And it said, courage is not a solo sport. It takes a village for people to be courageous. Because it's. When we do something on our own, we don't have that validation. We don't know exactly. Especially if you're hurling yourself into the unknown, like, what's happening? What am I doing? I like it that you had Malika, who's the behemoth of illustration, like, hey, I can validate this for you. Even though you. What you do. And it's obviously, it's exceptionally amazing. So it's interesting to hear that we have these different levels of confidence or anxieties, insecurities, even when it comes to our own work or even just Instagram feeds. Just, is this worthy? Is it good enough? Because ultimately what I'm getting from this is the point of care of creating something for people that get value out of this. And I'm glad you didn't give in to your trendy hipster friends just to

[George Wood]

put you off going back to how we find things. I would say also that there is quite a big stalking element to it as well. So it's not. Yes, the Explore feed does give us some stuff, but I think to also curate that. And I know you do this too many care. You end up, like, going first, like designer, oh, who are they following? And who are then they following? And then you just go into that. This weird wormhole and of literally going through people's followers to try and find interesting things. So that's still quite an intense mining situation. And then we inject that, obviously you'll. You start following these, like, people that are quite outside your network. And that kind of refreshes the explore thing for a bit. But after a while, because it's just starts repeating itself, then you have to go out again and give it, like, fresh inspiration to then go, okay, here's a new set of parameters of things I'm interested in now. Go off and find me those things. So you do have to really feed the algorithm. It's an ongoing thing.

[Malika Favreau]

It is exhausting, and you feel a little bit like a hamster in a wheel that's how I feel as well about it. But. And it is more about going down, as George was saying, going down kind of rabbit holes and then doing little jumps left and right. And then you enter in that hole and then you get out another door and then you find someone else who is doing kites in Japan and he's fourth generation craftsperson. And then you start looking into that person and translating their website and it's so much work. But at the same time, I think we all see the same thing. And that's, for me, that's an issue with Instagram today. It's if there is a cool product coming out, you're going to see it on 50 different feeds literally in the space of a week. This comes down with marketing budgets. A lot of people are investing a lot of money in getting this scene. And I think for us, it's like we used to post these things as well because sometimes they were great or. But very quickly we also realized that people were following us and sticking around because we were outside of trends, because we were finding things that maybe someone had never seen before. And at the same time, we were not feeding this kind of big brand, doing cool collaboration and underpaying the designer. We were suddenly giving more exposure to someone doing something very cool for the past 30 years and getting very little recognition from it at the other corner of the world. And I think this is when we started really getting a kick out of it as well and feeling that we were being good actors in that space, which also means we were being very poor.

[George Wood]

But yeah,

[Radim Malinage]

I have to say it goes to that one to death phrase from Simon Sinek. People don't care what you do. People care why you do what you do. And when you said you look being, you meant, you said exhausting. In a way, it shows the true curiosity of, of how far you prepare to go to find information, to celebrate someone, to actually to appreciate what someone creates rather than going, this is the, this is the press release. This is going to be okay for us. This is, I think people can see beyond the bullshit, the surface level promotion, especially if it's a puff of a no PR in a week or two, it surface people can see through it. But what I can see from what you guys been doing, you care about what goes on, you care where it appears in the feed, you care who's there. And then you go deeper again. I've used this phrase on a podcast for a long time, but the phrase is the last mile is hardly ever crowded because not many people are prepared to go that far. And you don't have to tell people about how much you care about craft because you show it to them. They can see that what you're creating and what makes you happy, what makes you feel something is presented on this. And you know, and that was, I'm sure, one of the reasons why it's grown so far and so fast now.

[Malika Favreau]

And I think there is something also that I think is important to say is, for example, Instagram has changed a lot, Social media have changed a lot over the past decade. And I know that for example, for my illustration career, social media did a lot for me. A lot of people re shared my work. That's how I became who I am. A lot of magazines reshared my work the likes of Creative Review. It's nice that all this back then you could send a cool project to a magazine and they would literally make a full blown article about you. Today that does not exist anymore. Everything is commodified, Nothing is for free anymore. And social media, the feeds are also like this. Everything is sponsored. And that's also something we agreed on very early on with George. We don't want to be these guys. Maybe we can give exposure to these people and, and we don't even tell them we're going to post them. We just post them, which is a little bit illegal. But then my thing was always like, if they want us to take it down, we'll take it down. But why would they? It's like we're literally celebrating them in a feed. And so I think in a way it's also a little bit about, for me, about giving back and proving maybe it's a bit of a loss battle, but proving that you can still be generous in this space and that creatives should be more generous with each other. We decided very early on that we were not going to do sponsored post, for example, so that if a brand contacted us, we were not going to post on the feed, we were not going to use our feed in that way. So that was something that was very clear early on, but also meant that we were never going to make money that way. And what started at the beginning as something that was taking an hour a day or something slowly grew into something. I think it's taking me like four or five hours a day now. So it's a bit insane. I have to admit that I did put my illustration career a little bit on hold for the past year. I did. I had to. It's like at some point I couldn't do everything But I was lucky enough that I had a very good first decade of work. I'm lucky that I can take fewer projects and I still can live. And for me, that was a necessary sacrifice. But also after, I think it was after four years, we started talking with George about how do we somehow make this viable? Because this is insane. There is a moment where it's just becoming a bit mad. And so that's when we started to think about making a shop almost like a curated concept store. We asked our audience, we did a survey. We really bounced around a lot of ideas, like doing an archive of all our curation, maybe doing subscription. We really talked about all these options and landed on this idea of a shop. And also we were lucky enough last year to get commissioned by an auction house in Paris to curate for them. So for us, even though we were sharing that on the feed, the fact we accepted, we said yes and there was a budget for it. We said yes because we had complete carte blanche and it was about curating. So we didn't feel it was someone buying our audience to push a product. They were literally not telling us what to put. We were selecting seven objects a month and we did that for six months. I think it was really amazing. And I think without Francois and Drouot that that client, we could never have built a shop. So we used that budget to literally build the whole shop and get it kicking off. So we didn't take external investment. We paid ourselves very little last year from that. So this is like a drop in the ocean. And now we are trying this format where we have a curated bazaar, we partner with brands, it's completely free for them to join, and when they sell something through us, we get a commission. So we tried also we really wanted to have a model that was fair on both sides. It's not sustainable yet, so we'll see. But that's our best attempt of making it a little bit viable and allowing us to continue.

[George Wood]

I just wanted to add, we don't do the classic sponsored posts, as in they send us some pictures and we just post those. But we have done like, almost like more collaborations. If we really like a product, then we'll create some content for them. And that has been really fun as well. However, I think even, I guess our whole thing with this feed and the way that we're going about the shop and how do we monetize it is very much about experimentation, see which one works, what works with the audience. So we have done maybe slightly more classic sponsored posts in the past. Where. And this is why we decided they don't work. Because if the product isn't something, something that the audience would really resonate with, then it just doesn't work. However, when we get to do our own take on it and it does better, the Druide stuff has been amazing because it's what we do already, where just instead of curating things that we find, we get to go into this crazy antiques world and find incredible old masters. We were never allowed to show Picasso paintings, but they were there all the way to Fornazetti cat bins, for example. And it was like a such different place for us to go on. Personally as well, I've never really delved into the world of antiques before. Super interesting. So I guess it's now we're really interested in collaborations, meeting new partners that would like to try something else. Not your classic sponsored post, if that makes sense.

[Malika Favreau]

Yeah. And let us curate. I think curation for us is the backbone of this, is you have to let us dig and choose and build a story around it. And also what we did is we started a newsletter, which in a way is old school, but I think that also came at a moment where that's when we had the idea for the shop. And that's also when we had this feeling of we don't know where Meta is going, we don't know where Instagram is going. We need to start having a presence outside, not be dependent on these big companies. And that's when we start doing newsletters, interviewing people and having our quirky tone. And so we've got this really fun interview now. We've got a new format where we dive into the story of an object from, like first sketches and everything. And the brilliant thing is, like, the newsletter is growing slowly because we're not pushing it like, like crazy. And also we don't have anything to offer, really, apart from content. We don't have big discounts or things like this. But yeah, I think we're like on 7,000 people now. And what's great is that the response is amazing. So literally we have like more than 70% open rate on each issue. And I know that usually a bit mad, but I think it's also, in a way, it's like a continuation of the feed. It's a space where we can have our tone, we can highlight products that are a little bit mad. I don't know. And it's. I think it's interesting. We're trying to develop other editorial formats.

[Radim Malinage]

Malika, I can tell you that there's a lot of marketeers running a newsletter who would kill for 70% open rate.

[Malika Favreau]

I know this is.

[Radim Malinage]

This is where the true metric really lies, because the number of subscribers doesn't really matter. It's like how many people actually open it. Yeah, that's a true metric. Again, it just goes back to why you do this and how much you care. Because, George, am I right that this project also led you to developing your own product that you've created?

[George Wood]

Yeah, I guess it's the inspiration behind it. I think when Covid hit. I have a lot of friends already that are illustrators or they're makers. And I don't know if. And you remember there was like this boom of everyone, like, okay, let's just make something ourselves. I'm obviously from a design background. I always have to work with someone else's brief, someone else's product. And I just thought, oh, that'd be quite fun to make something myself and try and be one of those brands. And I actually remember talking to you, Malika. I made like a little deck of all the ideas that I had, was thinking about at the time and said, okay, as a business person, which one of these is actually going to make any kind of money? And she chose the umbrellas. I think that's the other thing that the feed is really amazing for, is taking us on slightly different tangents. I would have never done the Birmingham Talk before doing that feed, before doing it with Malik. She literally bullied me into doing that talk. I would have never really considered doing this podcast or even potentially creating my own version of interviews. I didn't really see myself in that way. And I think now it's okay. We have a following where we are curators, where people are interested in the kind of things that we're interested in. That's just a whole other space for me and Malika. I'm sure the same for you too. Even the idea, like something else that we're talking to people about is creatively collaborating with people's products, coming together in terms of. In our own artistic way, rather than just curating. So there's a lot of different avenues that we can go down, which is super exciting.

[Radim Malinage]

I discovered your para world and I love it. Insights bringing joy to bad weather. Because I worked with Timo Kilda on my last two. On my last two books. Timo is amazing. And I think soon after we released these two books, I saw the Umbrella did you guys do together? I was like, oh, this is everything about Timo, right? Dogs, yellow, color, happiness. It's just. Yeah, it was one of these things that I didn't know it was your project at that time and later joined the dots. And that makes so much sense because your statement, bringing joy to bad weather, it's bringing joy through everything that you do to any kind of situation. What I like about you, that you say, I wouldn't do this because I needed Malika to push me into doing things, because you got very modest generosity, in a way, I'm doing this because I care, but let's not make it about me. That makes sense.

[George Wood]

I think we're, as a couple, like, now we're going to psychoanalyze ourselves. Malika's obviously come from incredible success. She's an very successful creative. And I've come from a slightly different world where I can't remember what it's called, like the portfolio career. I've tried this. Maybe it hasn't worked out, tried that, hasn't worked out. So I haven't. I had definitely a creative that's come from a background of more anxiety, uncertainty of what it's like to be a major success. And so I think, yeah, it's been amazing to partner with someone that is just, come on, what's the matter with you? Just do it. And I think I used to be like that, maybe in my 20s, as I'm older, needing more security, I've gotten a bit more of the kind of fear to be brave. And I think when you do it as a two, it definitely helps because one of you can then go, no, it's great. Come on, let's keep going. And that it feels like you're in it together when you have your own demons. I think I have more demons than Malika, for sure.

[Malika Favreau]

That's also why we get along so well. We have a lot in common and then we're very different. And in a way, I've always felt that it's much harder for people who are very curid, disciplinary and want to touch. Like, you've got this breed of people like George, who want to touch everything. And when they do something, then they want to move on to something else. And so they keep trying techniques and mediums and formats. And so it's amazing creatively, commercially, it's very difficult. For example, we all know that as frustrating as it is for some people, being a successful illustrator also means having a very strong, recognizable style. And how do you not get bored by yourself? So I think there is that thing when my nature is I'm a compulsive, addictive. I have an addictive personality. And I'm someone who is going to do the same thing for 10 years and still find joy in it. But if that's not your nature, then that's hell. That situation is hell for me. I love pushing something by little incremental pivots. And I remember we had that conversation with George, and that's when I think it really defines us. It's such a brilliant definition of who we are. George wants to do things that are innovative and new. I want to make the thing that already exist perfect or better. And I think these are two ways of being creative and approaching. My entire work is playing with cliches, with almost images you have in your subconscious, the collective mind, but making them so striking that you feel like you're seeing them for the first time. My work, my illustration work is not innovative. It's trying to reach that perfection. How perfect is that line?

[Radim Malinage]

That is beautifully said. I remember seeing more of your talks ages ago, where as a successful illustrator with a very distinctive style, you find yourself a little bit caged in. Some people can't stomach it, because I remember, I think you said the number of times that people asked me to do something different to what I do, it was maybe three or four times, because. Because you create the thing that makes money and is very successful. But then that is. That is your identity, that is your craft, that is your style. And people come to you because that's. They were Malika. But what I love what you said is that you're trying to make it perfect. You're trying to find perfection in it, so you never find an endpoint to it. Because I have personally had so many incarnations of my career because I always find the end point. I was like, this was 10 years of this. Let's do something else. Just 10 years of that. Let's do something else. You overlap these things and you go where the curious to take to. Because would you say in your case that doing this thing with George gave you a bit of a catalyst to not run out or burn out what you do, even though you might one day find a perfection in what you do in your illustration style? But did you find that working with George gave you extra energy and a view on creativity and expression of what you can do for the benefit of others?

[Malika Favreau]

I think the biggest thing I learned as well is that the same as my work, my taste, I think, was much more confined and was much more in line with my work when we started this project. So I was curating very graphic, very geometric, color blocking Stripes. All the things that you would expect for me to curate. And I think curating with George and seeing her post, it's absolutely bonkers. Things sometimes was in a way opened me up as well. And I think I embraced the whole spectrum of marion taste and George was already doing that. And in a way that's also when the account really took off. It's also when we were really like, we all have guilty pleasures. I don't know why I find this beautiful, but it is. But it's not beautiful in the sense that some people might say, ooh, that's on the line. We call it the line. Actually, did we cross the line on this? And I think this is what really made it in a way made it popular with people because I think we all have guilty pleasures and we all have things that we find utterly beautiful that maybe not everyone would agree. And this is part of being human.

[Radim Malinage]

I have decoded this since we're doing a couples counseling here. When you see the link between the work. So what you said was that you said about George that she's about a new the innovation. And you see your God of perfection. When I look at the products and the things that you curate and put together on your store, it's innovation and perfection. Because some of these things are classics and they just tend taken to 11. Some of these things are just a perfection of this. I think I found this link between the two because where your worlds have overlapped and met, it's just. Oh, incredible stuff happened and keeps happening. That's how I see it. Would you agree with.

[George Wood]

Yeah, for sure. That's very nicely put. And I think we should change our about on our website now because that makes way more sense.

[Malika Favreau]

Okay, so we're getting ready to rewrite our bio and concept.

[Radim Malinage]

Absolutely.

[Malika Favreau]

Manifesto. The manifesto.

[Radim Malinage]

But first I have to appreciate your ticket that says everything, everything, everything, everything. I mean, absolutely love it. Because I can when I read those words. I hate. Underworld, cowgirl, Everything, everything.

[Malika Favreau]

Oh, really?

[Radim Malinage]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Malika Favreau]

I remember the day we put that on the website. And George, she does. She just did it actually today, screenshotting something I wrote for the newsletter as like lol, it's me. It was me making like a really bad pun. That ticket on the website was the same. Joel screenshot it and sent it to me and said lol. And somehow we left it because it's funny.

[Radim Malinage]

It's perfect. Absolute. Never change it. We can work on your buyer but never change the ticket. But actually speaking of the shop you guys mentioned obviously having some fund to create it, obviously, putting the tech stuff together. So what have you learned about putting an online store together? Let's talk about technical headaches.

[George Wood]

Oh, God.

[Malika Favreau]

So that was intense. That was an intense year because we funded it, but literally we did it ourselves. So we had very little help. My husband helped us a lot with putting the products up. Like we're talking, we launched with like more than 300 products and I think there was like 80 brands. And we had to contact every single brand individually. So we're not dropshipping for a start. We're really leading people to the shops. So we don't hold customer data, we don't take orders. We almost like linking, almost in between women, like a directory, almost of beautiful objects. But that's meant that we didn't want to use like Amazon, of course, obviously, or existing affiliate platform, because that would mean we would have the same things as anybody else. And anyone can take our curation and put it on their website. So we actually found a model, a plugin, the technical setup to do something privately with all these brands. So we had to partner in email, video calls, explain the concept with all these 90 brands, and then curate their products, put them up on the shop. It was a good, I would say eight months of work. So that was really intense. And then we had a developer who helped us. But again, like, I had to learn coding, so I ended up learning Shopify Liquid coding a little bit just to tweak the little things and make was a hell of a lot of work. And it still is to run it. But what it means is that at least we now we have a setup where it's pretty lean in terms of the monthly cost to keep it up because we do everything ourselves. So it's like a few apps, Shopify, Store, the right plugin, and then we can just put new products up very easily.

[Radim Malinage]

When it says everything, everything. When you said 300 products, that ticker is right, it's everything, everything.

[Malika Favreau]

It's like everything, everything.

[George Wood]

We were meant to have 30 brands. I remember we had this original brainstorming meeting of. Okay, we'll start with. We'll start small. Yeah, we'll start small. And then it exploded.

[Malika Favreau]

But because again, I think it's also because when you do an outreach to brands and you ask them, do you want to be on this? And if you sell, you give us 20% commission, blah, blah, blah. It's like we expected that one brand out of 10 would say yes. So we actually started the outreach pretty late, like in July, which is the worst Time to do it end of July and we knew we wanted to launch maximum by October, so we really, we went wide. But the truth is that 60% of the brand said yes. So we did not expect that. We were like, oh shit. And then once you've proposed, you've offered them to join, you can't tell them no.

[George Wood]

Yeah.

[Malika Favreau]

So the last months were mad and I had to go on a one month break now in the winter because I was just like, I need a rest. That, that ride since end of July till the launch in October was insane.

[Radim Malinage]

So would you say that it sounds insane but again it shows the love and care that you guys put into it. But would you say that everything that you've put into work on curating the feed on Instagram help you to pre select the brands, actually go after the products that you loved already or did you search for new products? Because I feel like there was a quite a lot on your feet already.

[George Wood]

Yeah, I think it started a lot with everyone, a lot of people that we already knew about. Right. And then I think it's recently we've started like maybe this year we've started looking at new brands. I think the thing we're learning about the most is what is selling what kind of things, what price point and where in the world? Because that's the other problem. Not problem, but the thing that we have is the global directory. So sadly in the UK we're bound by EU and also the American tariffs, like got so many restrictions of who actually UK brands can sell to. And the same for anyone selling in Europe trying to. Oh no, specifically like in Asia trying to sell to America. That's a whole problem as well. So it was like making sure that we had a good spread for our audience. Our audience is correct. If I'm wrong, Malika. One third US, one third Europe and then.

[Malika Favreau]

Yeah, 50 Europe if we. I always include you guys in Europe.

[George Wood]

Oh, thank you. We're still there. Thank you.

[Malika Favreau]

You're still there.

[George Wood]

30 US, 50 Europe and then the rest of the world. So we had to make sure that people in the US had something to buy, people in Europe had something to buy. And then obviously like we've got really lovely like people customers in Japan and Australia, but they were smaller. So it's all again things that we're learning. I know Malik is so into the analytics. I love it. Like again making it perfect so she knows where everyone's clicking and what people are clicking on. And I think it's just constantly trying to optimize this thing.

[Malika Favreau]

But it's hard, we have to admit. It's a very tough financial model. It always was. I knew that from the start. Affiliate linking is very tough. And the truth is that we don't know if it's going to work. We can only try our best. The only thing I would say that anyone landing on the shop loves it. All we got was compliments, was like, oh my God, what is that crazy selection? But there is also. We didn't want to limit ourselves to start with. So that's also why we had like kids stuff. And then we also have like outliers. We've got dildos and bongs. It's a statement. We needed dildos on that shop. And then we also have a lot of homeware, then arts. We've got price point going from 10 pounds to 10,000. So we almost went a little bit nuts on the launch. But I always find in general that it's better to go with everything and then you refine. And it might be a case that we, at some point we realize actually we're more of a homeware concept store. And as much we would love to keep all of that in, but also we need to see what works and not to confuse people too much. And I think also what's hard with what we curate is that every piece is so special. How do you choose? It's literally if you put a really bold orange thing in the middle of gray stuff, everyone will go buy that orange thing. Now, if everything is gorgeous and everything is intense, how do you choose? And I think people love looking at our store, but I think we can definitely improve on the buying and we want to do well by our brands. But the great thing is that because it's risk free for them, they don't have anything to lose.

[Radim Malinage]

This is what I wanted to say because when you think about if you follow a fashion brand or any retail brand, their website changes three times a year. There's. It's a constant evolution of understanding of the eye tracking, user experience. What, where, how? Because you describe if something's orange in the middle of gray. Of course people will go there. Because that leads me to a question, Malika, since you are over the analytics and understanding, because you guys have a potentially very clear idea of what sells in a vast number of products. Do you get approached for consultancy data or questions about product development from these brands?

[George Wood]

We had actually a brainstorming session with a good friend of ours who was trying to help us what our future is. And when we did the survey that did come up Remember, it's like trend forecasting. Yeah. There's lots of different avenue. This is again where I'm going to get into trouble and get unstuck because, yeah, I like the new thing. So I try not to think about it. Just concentrate on the show, be a bit more blinkered.

[Radim Malinage]

Because when you think about innovation and perfection, like so many ideas, so many people create products because they believe in them, because they care. And the difference between being successful or not sometimes is patience, sometimes it's algorithm, sometimes there's the trend. Sometimes if we were to only create because it would work, we will create very few things and they will look all shit because they'll be just made for the mass market. But the quirky things, the amazing things, the products filled with souls. Sometimes you can potentially help someone's career by just saying, hey, hey, you just need this or this works or that works. That's the size, that's the thing. Because I think with your insights, it potentially can help because you've created this amazing platform where, you know, the passion meets the reality.

[Malika Favreau]

For me, that's one of my biggest contradiction. I struggle with that as well because I think the people who need our help the most can't pay us. And for me that's. I think sometimes I really wish I won the lottery or I inherited millions from a long lost uncle from somewhere and could focus on doing this and helping the people who really need it, the craftspeople. And I think what we're very good at is how to present a product visually, tell the story behind it, all this content as well. And I almost think that it's a tough moment for retail, it's a tough moment for makers. You have all these people who were selling incredibly well through Instagram and now nothing is coming their way because the algorithm cut it. And for example, one thing I saw that was not. It's when we started posting in December, there was no way to reach our audience, no way, because the landscape was filled with ads. So literally we, everything we did was organic. So we rely on, yeah, that Explore, feed, the algorithm pushing us. And literally it's like the algorithm is pushing us when it's a low moment for ads and brands are not investing that much. As soon as brands are putting the money in, we disappear. We go behind the curtain and no one shows what we have to offer. And that's what I'm struggling with. We live in a world where money wins and the more investment wins and our biggest challenge is going to be how can we make these smaller people win who do amazing things and still win ourselves. It's going to be very difficult.

[Radim Malinage]

When you said the people who need our help potentially under people who can afford us. I'm going to badly paraphrase Debbie Millman, who said, money is never about money. When you realize there's a help, what you guys potentially can do, or when you put yourself in the position of a creative, and I know it from writing books and trying to solve people's problems, because it's not meant to do it. People will only admit when they've got a problem, when it clicks, when you realize, you know what? I've tried every single way of taking my own path. And some people are taking shortcuts or some people are getting help to get there. The penny drops at some point. Sometimes the penny drops very late, but it drops at some point in the future. It does. Because we are here to help each other to thrive. We mostly survive, but we're here to survive and thrive. And I think to be able to look into what can make business successful. You started your illustration career by you want to be in yourself, but obviously you also validated that there's a space in the market for someone. There's this in order to create something that's somebody else. So I think that generosity that you put into everything that you do, I think is going to unlock some people's amazing features and successes. Because as I said, as we said throughout this conversation, you do it from the point of care, from the point of curiosity, and you can't never fake this. This is the beautiful part. Because why would you spend a year building a bazaar? Why would you spend years doing this? Because you care. Because it's there. So when people try. Sometimes when people are trying to introduce themselves and say, this is what I do and this is why I do it, you don't always believe them. Whereas people can open your feet, open your store and go, yep, that makes perfect sense.

[Malika Favreau]

What's interesting as well is I remember when we were doing the website with George, we talked about, do we put a manifesto? Do we talk about why we do what we do? And then we decided not to. We shouldn't be saying anything. We both felt what we are about is there. If someone wants to look, it's very obvious. It's in the tone, it's in the way we talk about people. And I think, yeah, no one, in the end, it wasn't needed. It wasn't needed to. And maybe one day we will explain it, but I always find it more interesting to explain it on podcast or interviews or. But to not brag about things because I think a lot, everyone brags a lot and a lot of it is a lot of bullshit.

[Radim Malinage]

That's exactly one of the reasons why I wanted to have you guys on a podcast. After seeing your talk, beautifully, eloquently describing what you do with so much passion, I was, let's keep. Let's bring it to more people. That reason why I do it. But before I let you go, where do you see the not so distant future of what you guys do? I know. Is there? Do you. Would you see anything in the way of trends, in the way of your work? Yeah. What can we find out?

[George Wood]

I think we both have a desire to explore the editorial side of things at the immediate future. Malik has already mentioned the evolution of the newsletter, which is you're being quite modest, by the way, about the newsletter. I think 7000 is quite a lot considering you've not been doing it for crazy long time. But yeah, again, like expanding on when you have a post, it's so visual. Most people don't really read the caption sometimes. What I do love about post is that you can have a bit more of a dialogue with the audience themselves. So I think expanding a bit more of that kind of interaction is where we're going right now. More with the brands, I would like to say, like individuals that are behind these brands, behind the stories of what makes them tick. Also the audience themselves. Again, doing things like this podcast, doing the newsletter, doing more interviews, longer formats. Just to see it almost feels like the community is the thing. And I know a lot of brands talk about our community, but we have quite an engaged one. So we just want to learn more about them and have that more like, because everyone seems very positive at the moment on our feed and it's nice to engage with them and see, like, why do they come and what are they into? Not just ourselves. Sorry, I'm rambling there.

[Malika Favreau]

And potentially maybe we're already talking about doing some exclusive products, maybe some limited edition runs with some of our favorite makers and brands. I think we're taking it one month at a time and trying to not run five things at once. Also because it's only three of us with Vladi, but I think we'll go where it takes us and where it makes the most sense. And I think the goal is to not be forced into something, a space we don't want to be in. So I think so many things that are possible. Yeah, pop ups, curating for brands, consulting. I think we could even be social media consultants today. But all these things, it's organic. I think we'll take any opportunities as they come, but trying to stay very strong to our ethos and not forget why we started it and why we're doing it.

[Radim Malinage]

You just summarized it beautifully. We'll go where it takes us. I wrote it on a piece of paper because the thing is you can have a strategy, you can have plans, but if you got values and a willingness to pursue them and explore them, that eats any business plan for breakfast. So I'm so happy we got to make this happen and to recreate almost your talk and yeah, celebrate what you guys do because it's incredible. I can't wait to see what happens next. So thank you for being here.

[George Wood]

Thank you.

[Malika Favreau]

Thank you so much for inviting us.

[Radim Malinage]

Thank you for listening to this episode of Daring Creativity Podcast Podcast. I'd love to know your thoughts, questions and suggestions, so please get in touch via the email in the show notes or social channels. This episode was produced and presented by me, Radim Malinage. The audio production was done by Neil Mackay from 7 Million Bikes Podcast. Thank you and I hope to see you on the next episode. If you enjoyed this episode and would like more accessible resources to help you discover your daring creativity, you can pick up one of my books on themes of mindful creativity, creative business, branding, and graphic design. Every physical book purchase comes with a free digital bundle, including an ebook and audiobook to make the content accessible wherever you are and whatever you do. To get 10% off your order, visit novemberuniverse.co.uk and use the code Podcast. Have a look around and start living daringly.